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737MAX Winglet -- Life-size Replica At Farnborough  
User currently offlineBreninTW From Taiwan, joined Jul 2006, 1647 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 16384 times:

According to this video Boeing has a life-size replica of the 737MAX on show at Farmborough.

The winglet is shown briefly in the video.


I'm tired of the A vs. B sniping. Neither make planes that shed wings randomly!
34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineghifty From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 891 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 16181 times:

There's a pic up on Randy Tinseth's blog, as well.

Gives you a good sense of just how *not* small winglets are.



Fly Delta Jets
User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3254 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 15974 times:

It's behind the Korean B739, looks like a normal B737 winglet with a strake beneath. Is it markedly taller than the current version? I didn't get that impression, mind you it was at ground level so could be wrong.

User currently offlineHiFlyerAS From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 956 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 15568 times:

Quoting ghifty (Reply 1):
There's a pic up on Randy Tinseth's blog, as well.
http://boeingblogs.com/randy/


User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 15360 times:

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 3):
Quoting ghifty (Reply 1):
There's a pic up on Randy Tinseth's blog, as well.
http://boeingblogs.com/randy/

Holy crap thats big! I'd compare that to the 767 winglets!


User currently offlineHiFlyerAS From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 956 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 15142 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 4):
Holy crap thats big! I'd compare that to the 767 winglets!

It also appears more of a 'sharklet'-type look as opposed to a 'winglet'....similar to what you might see on some Airbus a/c but on steriods.


User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4599 posts, RR: 22
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 14555 times:

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 5):
It also appears more of a 'sharklet'-type look as opposed to a 'winglet'....similar to what you might see on some Airbus a/c but on steriods.

More so an evolution of the MD-11 winglet IMO. The "sharklet" marketing name is just annoying. Its a winglet. :-P


User currently offlinecargolex From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1271 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 14496 times:

There's one thing that's been bugging me about this new winglet, and I hope that somebody can shed some light on this.

With the lower section of the winglet extended so far down, what happens if a situation like this develops:


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Photo © Paulo Santos - Aerospray



That's obviously a very extreme case, but with the winglet extended considerably downward, it wouldn't take as dramatic an angle for the wing to contact the ground.

Is the lower section of the winglet designed to break away?

[Edited 2012-07-11 09:56:48]

User currently offlineCM From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 14417 times:

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 6):
More so an evolution of the MD-11 winglet IMO

Not really. The MD-11 winglet has a very small lower "feather", which is little more than a VG to control flow at the tip. The MAX lower feather is an actual lifting airfoil intended to increase the effective span of the wing. It makes a significant improvement to the L/D of the wing, which is where the added performance and efficiency is gained.

MD-11 Winglet:


737 MAX Winglet


Quoting cargolex (Reply 7):
Is the lower section of the winglet designed to break away?

Yes.

[Edited 2012-07-11 10:03:34]

User currently offlineual777uk From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 14297 times:

I thought it was Farnboroough not Farnburrow  

Anyway, looking forward to seeing that winglet attached to the max in the not too distant future and of course getting on a 787!


User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12561 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 14214 times:

This site needs a "like" button!  


Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3523 posts, RR: 66
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13842 times:

Quoting ual777uk (Reply 9):
I thought it was Farnboroough

Haven't you added an extra "o"?



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5467 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13520 times:

Quoting cargolex (Reply 7):
With the lower section of the winglet extended so far down, what happens if a situation like this develops:

I would worry more about careless driving on the ramp. I think that's why the lower part of the MD-11 winglet has the red edge.


User currently offlinekdhurst380 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2010, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13391 times:

Quoting ual777uk (Reply 9):

I thought it was Farnboroough not Farnburrow  

It is indeed NOT pronounced as the latter, I was in the show yesterday and Monday and I heard all the Americans finish the word with the 'O' sound as opposed to the 'Ugh', which is incorrect. It's a name, not a word!

I'm from Farnborough so I get quite defensive! :P

Saw the winglet too, and I'm not keen, not aesthetically pleasing at all, but then making aeroplanes look pretty is not the primary goal of the manufacturers.

[Edited 2012-07-11 11:13:12]

User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13042 times:

Quoting kdhurst380 (Reply 13):
Saw the winglet too, and I'm not keen, not aesthetically pleasing at all, but then making aeroplanes look pretty is not the primary goal of the manufacturers.

I agree, it's not good looking at all. I like the shape of the top part, but the bottom part looks like the blades the Ancient Spartans had on the wheels of their chariots in battle.


User currently offlineXT6Wagon From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 3409 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 12931 times:

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 6):
More so an evolution of the MD-11 winglet IMO

yah, not even close. Most are missing that this is an extremely "3D" device instead of simply a couple new airfoil sections stuck on the end of the wing. Be really interesting to know exactly how critical the shape of that merge between the upper and lower sections are as its seems quite agressively shaped. Might be the result of the mere merge of the two sections or it might be the key to the who thing working much better than the current winglets.


User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4599 posts, RR: 22
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 12360 times:

Quoting CM (Reply 8):
Not really. The MD-11 winglet has a very small lower "feather", which is little more than a VG to control flow at the tip. The MAX lower feather is an actual lifting airfoil intended to increase the effective span of the wing. It makes a significant improvement to the L/D of the wing, which is where the added performance and efficiency is gained.

Thanks for the clarification. I was thinking the lower feather was bigger than what it actually is. It's been a few years since I've seen one.  
Quoting XT6Wagon (Reply 15):
yah, not even close.

Thanks for not being too big of a douche. :-P


User currently offlineCARST From Germany, joined Jul 2006, 820 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 12102 times:

I love the shape of the new MAX winglet. Do you think Boeing or APB might offer it in this form or in a smaller version to modify NGs and/or classics?

If this new form is a real improvement in terms of efficiency, a smaller and lighter version, optimized for the NG wing could be developed in my opinion.


User currently offlineCM From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 12012 times:

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 16):
It's been a few years since I've seen one.

LOL! Yes, something which probably still chaps the hide of any former MD sales guys who surf these sites. I remember when we were designing the 777; internally, we were worried the MD-11 would be the real competitor for the 777 (not so much the A340). In the end, neither turned out to be competitive, but the MD-11 was in fact the least of our worries. Probably symptomatic of an overall misjudging of Airbus by Boeing that only really ended when we watched the A330 eclipse the 767. Safe to say, nobody is ignoring or underestimating Airbus today!   


User currently offlinemd80fanatic From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 2660 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 11739 times:

MD-11 .... been there, done that (decades ago).

Of course they don't look the same, manufacturing processes have changed since then. However the reason for putting on the lower winglet, on both aircraft, are/were exactly the same (to keep high pressure air from slipping around the wingtip to the low pressure topside).


User currently offlineMountainFlyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 476 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 11691 times:

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 2):
Is it markedly taller than the current version?
Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 4):

Holy crap thats big! I'd compare that to the 767 winglets!

For some reason I get the idea the upper portion is actually the same or even slightly smaller than the existing winglets. I could be wrong, and I have no technical data to prove or disprove it.

I know it's difficult to tell from the pictures alone, especially with different perspectives.


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Photo © Manuel EstévezR-MaferSpotting




SA-227; B1900; Q200; Q400; CRJ-2,7,9; 717; 727-2; 737-3,4,5,7,8,9; 747-2; 757-2,3; 767-3,4; MD-90; A319, 320; DC-9; DC-1
User currently offlineER757 From Cayman Islands, joined May 2005, 2526 posts, RR: 7
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 11481 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 14):
the bottom part looks like the blades the Ancient Spartans had on the wheels of their chariots in battle.

Waiting for the jousting between the Max and the NEO on the taxiways  
Quoting CARST (Reply 17):
I love the shape of the new MAX winglet.

I like it too - at least it will be something different to watch for when spotting. The endless procession of today's 737's and A320's is getting old.


User currently offlineTrnsWrld From United States of America, joined May 1999, 931 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 11323 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 4):
Holy crap thats big! I'd compare that to the 767 winglets!

Interesting, because to me it almost looks tiny in that picture especially compared to the guy standing next to it. No way is that even close to the size of a 767 winglet. Have you seen a 767 winglet? its taller than the tail of a CRJ7 lol.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 2):
It's behind the Korean B739, looks like a normal B737 winglet with a strake beneath

I disagree with this as well. The top portion to me anyway looks very different from the current 737/757/767 style winglet. Looks raked back more and seems to be much skinnier (and pointy towards the top.


User currently offlineCM From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 11146 times:

Quoting md80fanatic (Reply 19):
Of course they don't look the same, manufacturing processes have changed since then.

The difference in appearance has nothing to do with manufacturing processes. Function drives form... the two devices have very different functions and therefore very different forms.

Quoting md80fanatic (Reply 19):
However the reason for putting on the lower winglet, on both aircraft, are/were exactly the same (to keep high pressure air from slipping around the wingtip to the low pressure topside).

Not the case at all. The 737 lower feather is all about distributing lift over a greater span to reduce induced drag from the wing. It is a L/D feature, not a tip vortex control feature.


User currently offlineJHCRJ700 From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 10720 times:

Man is that thing sweet looking! Are there any pics floating around of the BBJ that is testing them?


RUSH
25 Tbone354 : Agreed. It looks very cool. I am certain there is an aerodynamic reason behind this though. Also I learned how to pronounce Qatar. Had no idea is was
26 virgin747 : If memory serves me correctly when that Lufthansa Airbus smacked its wing on the ground, the bottom portion of the wingtip fence just bent inwards.
27 AirlineCritic : Winglet manufacturer sells more spare parts. And it has to be designed to break away. See above.
28 Post contains images clydenairways : Yeah that gave me a laugh ! Also " Cutter Airways" for Qatar
29 cal764 : K so where the lights, or has that yet to be determined?
30 817Dreamliiner : Its just a replica, I dont think it would need lights on it yet.
31 Post contains links railker : For those wondering about size, here's some numbers for everyone, courtesy of our favorite B737 site: http://www.b737.org.uk/winglets.htm 737NG Wingle
32 aeropiggot : Very true, but you cannot ignore the strength of the tip vortex, which cause the lift vector to rotate in the free stream direction, this thus result
33 Post contains images ghifty : Is it "cutter" or "cut-tar"?
34 pilotanthony : Yes Qatar - pronounced Cat-tar! and those new MAX winglets look smaller than the current ones, in height!
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