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PeoplExpress Pushes Launch Date To 2013  
User currently offlinewrldtvlr From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 38 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7711 times:

Quote:
"We are reevaluating our route network to make sure that it is the best plan for us," said Christine DeZarn, vice president and chief marketing officer.

"Although we had envisioned an earlier startup, the process is taking longer than we anticipated and we are not ready at this time to talk about specific plans or dates, but we are moving forward," DeZarn said.

Hmm. Perhaps basing a carrier out of PHF may not be the best idea.

Full article: http://www.travelweekly.com/Travel-N...ress-pushes-back-scheduled-launch/

[Edited 2012-07-19 13:31:44]

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4718 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7685 times:

I always thought the idea of launching right after the busy summer season didnt make much sense.

Maybe start with PBI to PVD PIT PHF in early 2013 then ramp up the PHF/PIT focus in Spring/Sumemr 2013

(I just noticed that the main airports with the "P" named airline are all "P" airports, coincidence?)



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7611 times:

They probably didn't help their case by getting into trouble with the DOT while in the process of getting certified. It also sounds like they're having issues getting enough financing in place to satisfy the DOT and I guess that's one of the things holding them up in getting their operating certificate. The longer they delay the starting of operations, the longer the odds of them starting up service at all.

PHF does have potential even with FL leaving and ORF being the major airport for the region. Allegiant could potentially add service to their other Florida destinations and maybe even MYR. What about Spirit as a possible new airline at PHF? I know they've been focused on building up their DFW and LAS operations, but they have a/c with the legs that G4's MD-80 family a/c lack from PHF.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7970 posts, RR: 19
Reply 3, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7548 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 2):
They probably didn't help their case by getting into trouble with the DOT while in the process of getting certified. It also sounds like they're having issues getting enough financing in place to satisfy the DOT and I guess that's one of the things holding them up in getting their operating certificate. The longer they delay the starting of operations, the longer the odds of them starting up service at all.

That's what I was thinking. PHF + delays with the DOT and other assorted junk = maybe this won't happen.

I hope it happens though, but maybe this airline needs to reconsider where they operate from.



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User currently offlineRL757PVD From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4718 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7482 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
That's what I was thinking. PHF + delays with the DOT and other assorted junk = maybe this won't happen.

I hope it happens though, but maybe this airline needs to reconsider where they operate from

My guess is they like what they see in PIT that even thouh they might be based at PHF, the focus may quickly turn to PIT.



Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlinecatiii From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 3094 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7473 times:

I do wonder how they're going to be able to make a go of it. VX is well capitalized at a major city with brand new aircraft and a unique onboard product and they're hemorrhaging. B6 was also well capitalized with brand new aircraft and a revolutionary onboard product at the time in what is probably one of the most desirable markets to be in. People wants to start up with old 737's at a secondary market. Maybe they can fill a niche, and I sure hope they do well because I think it is healthy for the industry, but I kind of wonder...

User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7087 times:

This is the most realistic thing I have heard from this group since PE 2.0's inception.   

Quoting catiii (Reply 5):
Maybe they can fill a niche, and I sure hope they do well because I think it is healthy for the industry, but I kind of wonder...

I hope some of the brain children behind this venture are studying the late Eastwind Airlines....TTN....what they did right and where they went wrong.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26168 posts, RR: 50
Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 6546 times:

Is anyone surprised ?

Even 2013 might not be doable.

Getting certified these days is a multi-year process (go ask California Pacific).

As far as specifics, the airline and DOT have been going back and forth clarifying basic information supplementing the initial March application. Most recently in June DOT received additional financial forecast, and shareholder information.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4593 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 6493 times:

From the article:

PeoplExpress did run afoul of the Tranportation Department's enforcement office in May when DOT claimed the carrier violated a ban on premature advertising by soliciting memberships for its travel club before it had received a certificate to fly.

This is absolutely nuts - the DOT is now deciding when soliciting memberships for a travel club is "premature" or not????

P.S. In perfect duplication and waste mode, I'm sure the FTC does exactly the same thing.


User currently offlinesteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9272 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 6467 times:

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 4):
My guess is they like what they see in PIT that even thouh they might be based at PHF, the focus may quickly turn to PIT.

PIT, to me, does seem to have a larger catchment area around it as opposed to PHF.

If you ask me, tho, I wish they'd stick with their model that included a business class. I know they're doing primarily point-to-point flying, or they plan on it, but wouldn't they benefit by banking at least some of those p2p flights for possible connections? Not everyone is going to be PIT or PHF-bound. PIT does have higher O&D than it had when it was a mega hub for US (not sure about O&D numbers for PHF tho), but I'd be willing to bet that they could serve even more pax if they could bank some flights instead of having just a slew of p2p flights running at random.

For the record, I'm not suggesting they have full-fledged hubs; I know banking all of your flights does have its logistical costs and what not that would seem unfeasible to any start-up. Suppose they could time a handful of their arrivals/departures that could provide some connection possibilities. Doesn't WN do that? I know they pretty much have 150 to 200 p2p flights out of their largest bases...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlinepoLOT From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 2370 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 6432 times:

Quoting N62NA (Reply 8):
This is absolutely nuts - the DOT is now deciding when soliciting memberships for a travel club is "premature" or not????

You had to pay to be a member of its travel club. So PE was basically duping money out of idiots when they technically have no clue if (or when) they will ever get certified to fly.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26168 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 6365 times:

Here is the thread about the travel club fine.
DOT Fines People Express - Before They Even Fly! (by LAXintl May 10 2012 in Civil Aviation)

Simply put, People Express holds no economic authority, and as such may not engage in advertising or make promises regarding any future travel.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4593 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 15 hours ago) and read 6207 times:

Quoting poLOT (Reply 10):
You had to pay to be a member of its travel club. So PE was basically duping money out of idiots when they technically have no clue if (or when) they will ever get certified to fly.
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 11):

Simply put, People Express holds no economic authority, and as such may not engage in advertising or make promises regarding any future travel.

Thanks, I missed that. But the DOT???? Then what is the FTC there for???


User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7545 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 6150 times:

It also states they are going to use ex-QF 734's. Hasn't QF had a bunch of trouble with them,that's why they're retiring them.


'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlineKDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 5600 times:

To me this sounds like another Skybus: Lousy catchment area, lack of connecting flight options, poorly financed, "underserved destinations", etc. I don't think it is ever going to see the light of day.

User currently offlinecanyonblue17 From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 473 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 5174 times:

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 1):
Maybe start with PBI to PVD PIT PHF in early 2013 then ramp up the PHF/PIT focus in Spring/Sumemr 2013



Southwest is scheduled to start PBI-PVD and PBI-PIT nonstop in February 2013. Don't know how well a start-up would fare again WN.


User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 5049 times:

Quoting KDAYflyer (Reply 14):

To me this sounds like another Skybus: Lousy catchment area, lack of connecting flight options, poorly financed, "underserved destinations", etc. I don't think it is ever going to see the light of day.


or Hooters Air


My idea for PeoplExpress: start w/ one aircraft and 2 cities (preferably 2 major airports) - one daily round trip flight. Stick with it (no growth) for at least 2 years. Earn a reputation first. That is my best idea for start-ups this decade.



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7970 posts, RR: 19
Reply 17, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 5014 times:

Quoting September11 (Reply 16):
My idea for PeoplExpress: start w/ one aircraft and 2 cities (preferably 2 major airports) - one daily round trip flight. Stick with it (no growth) for at least 2 years. Earn a reputation first. That is my best idea for start-ups this decade.

Sounds like my idea-
LAX-CVG-NYC on a couple of 767s.



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlinepoLOT From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 2370 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 5004 times:

Quoting September11 (Reply 16):
My idea for PeoplExpress: start w/ one aircraft and 2 cities (preferably 2 major airports) - one daily round trip flight. Stick with it (no growth) for at least 2 years. Earn a reputation first. That is my best idea for start-ups this decade.

It is also the best way to go out of business this decade. By only flying one route you are making it incredibly easy for competitors to push you out. With one aircraft you are screwed if it has a MX issue. With one daily roundtrip you are again making it easy for competitors to push you out and depending on the distance between the two cities you are getting horrible aircraft utilization.

You can't earn a reputation if you are around for less than a month.


User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 19, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 4980 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 17):

LAX-CVG-NYC 767s ?

I like your idea. I'd drop CVG. Just one 763. LAX-JFK-LAX. For 2 years and feel.

JFK to LAX on PeoplExpress 767 sounds ideal



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7970 posts, RR: 19
Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 4946 times:

Quoting September11 (Reply 19):
I like your idea. I'd drop CVG. Just one 763. LAX-JFK-LAX. For 2 years and feel.

Maybe just a 757/737 or something like that, but this is just something out of CVG (recall I flame about them a lot)

Quoting September11 (Reply 19):
JFK to LAX on PeoplExpress 767 sounds ideal

That does sound ideal too.



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User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13763 posts, RR: 61
Reply 21, posted (2 years 5 months 1 hour ago) and read 4227 times:
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Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
PHF + delays with the DOT and other assorted junk = maybe this won't happen.

MAYBE this won't happen?   

I'm guessing this one never gets one bird aloft. Ever.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7970 posts, RR: 19
Reply 22, posted (2 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4138 times:

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 21):
MAYBE this won't happen?

I think the stupidest part of this whole plan is PHF. I mean what are they going to with that?!



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User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5951 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (2 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3950 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
It also states they are going to use ex-QF 734's. Hasn't QF had a bunch of trouble with them,that's why they're retiring them.

QF is getting rid of their 734's because they're getting old. The QF 734's are being replaced by 738's and Jetstar Airbus aircraft.


User currently offline747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3758 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (2 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 3843 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 22):
I think the stupidest part of this whole plan is PHF. I mean what are they going to with that?!

But PHF need another big airline, since Air Tran merge with Southwest and left PHF.


25 xjramper : Right now, it s really a catch 22 for a start up airline. With an economy as shaky as it is now, the cost of fuel, and an industry that is extremely v
26 CIDFlyer : PHF would be better off trying to get Frontier expand, or lure Spirit or Jet Blue to counterpart SWA at ORF. Go after an established carrier than try
27 kcrwflyer : You have to understand that this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for PHF. Even if you have doubt, it's still something you should support and emb
28 steeler83 : Yeah, as seasonal service, tho. I could see PIT working tho. From an operational/competition standpoint, It's no longer a major connecting hub but it
29 AirCalSNA : Maybe they can merge with California Pacific and get a group discount on their fines ....
30 Post contains images PHX787 : Yet another useless result of a merger that wasn't needed, but that's for another thread.
31 RL757PVD : I think thats a sign that WN is taking them at least semi-seriously, even though on a seasonal basis those flights are safe-bets.
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