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Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?  
User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2728 posts, RR: 2
Posted (2 years 3 months 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 5624 times:

AF introduced their new livery more than 3 years ago, and I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...
Why is AF so slow at painting their a/c in new colours?


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28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineIdeekay From Switzerland, joined Jun 2012, 212 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (2 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 5539 times:

I think its something like this, that they need every aircraft. Let's say they want paint a 777 into the new livery so in this time where the aircraft can't fly they need another plane which flies the route..

User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2728 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5024 times:

A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery


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User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1857 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 4760 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 4):

A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery

Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ? Updating/improving premium cabins is way more important than changing the livery. But that's just my humble opinion.


User currently offlineSHAQ From Panama, joined Jun 2007, 381 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4713 times:

I think that the real answer is that they want to save money.
Specially, looking at their billion loss, painting and washing a/c isn't their priority right now



Studying hard, for flying right!
User currently offlinespacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3651 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4652 times:

Quoting goldorak (Reply 6):
Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ? Updating/improving premium cabins is way more important than changing the livery. But that's just my humble opinion.

Why are these things mutually exclusive?



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User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2728 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4603 times:

Quoting goldorak (Reply 3):
Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ?

My guess is that they wasted money with a new livery and a new logo with no interest. If they introduced a radically new livery, they would have spent as much, not more IMHO.



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User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3297 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4537 times:

It's a corporate refresh not a rebrand. You need to look twice to tell the difference, unless they intended to paint aircraft for the sake of painting them, like Delta did so well to have one livery, then it take's 7-8 years before the fleet cycles through the paintshop.
No one at AF thinks it was a mistake, indeed feedback seems to gave been positive about a subtle update.


User currently offlineSXDFC From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 2424 posts, RR: 22
Reply 8, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4478 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 2):
A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery

The reasoning behind this is because the water bill would have been too high..   



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2994 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4408 times:

It's just too expensive -- planes will be repainted as they need to be. The change is pretty subtle, which means it's not particularly important to rush the entire fleet through.

It's been 4 years since QF introduced their new branding, and they've also been extremely slow... It's just the nature of the industry today.


User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1328 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 4356 times:

It probably isn't too higher priority. A great feature of the new livery is that the changes from the old livery are quite subtle so most customers won't notice if the aircraft they fly in has the old livery. Because of this there is little point of actively withdrawing aircraft from the fleet for a repaint. Might as well just wait for a C or D check and do the repaint then. This will save money too.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 9):

  



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User currently offlineNASCARAirforce From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3184 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 4285 times:

In order to paint planes, they can't be dirty      

User currently offlineNWADTWE16 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3920 times:

does anyone have comparison pics of the 'sublte' difference? i wasnt aware they changed anything

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 13, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3885 times:

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 12):
does anyone have comparison pics of the 'sublte' difference? i wasnt aware they changed anything

New: different smaller font. no space between "AIR" and "FRANCE", red "swirl" added, bottom of stripes on tail curved forward, one less blue stripe on tail, red stripe is larger.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Darren Wilson



Old:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Darren Wilson



[Edited 2012-08-02 12:29:08]

User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4851 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3849 times:
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Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
AF introduced their new livery more than 3 years ago, and I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...
Why is AF so slow at painting their a/c in new colours?

With the exception of mergers where airlines want to quickly re-brand, new or modified liveries are painted according to maintenance schedules. Aircraft paint jobs typically have 7 to 10 years of life so it would make little sense to paint an aircraft if in 2 or 3 years the aircraft goes through a heavy maintenance check where it will need to be repainted again. So they wait until each aircraft goes in for heavy maintenance and add the livery at that time.

Look at how long it took Delta to get everything under one livery! At one time they had at least 3 different liveries flying around out there!

UA took a while as well, it's only since the merger with CO that things sped up, again for re-branding purposes.

It took WN almost ten years to change the entire fleet to the canyon blue scheme.



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2728 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3825 times:

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 14):

IIRC, BA changed their livery quite quickly, didn't they?



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User currently offlineNWADTWE16 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 3778 times:

i Guess i like it, really not much difference. What are the stars on the tail of AF planes for? Ive always wondered..i like them and at first thought Star Alliance but ofcourse, duh they are an anchor in SKYTEAM

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 17, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 3735 times:

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 16):
What are the stars on the tail of AF planes for?

The 12 stars of the European Union flag.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b7/Flag_of_Europe.svg/800px-Flag_of_Europe.svg.png

[Edited 2012-08-02 14:27:02]

User currently offlinedcaviation From Poland, joined Aug 2011, 222 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3636 times:
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Why the flag has 13 stars not 27?

User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3624 times:

Quoting dcaviation (Reply 18):
Why the flag has 13 stars not 27?

I miscounted. It's actually 12 stars. Corrected my other reply.

The stars aren't intended to represent the number of members.
http://europa.eu/about-eu/basic-information/symbols/flag/index_en.htm


User currently offlineFlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7422 posts, RR: 57
Reply 20, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3360 times:

Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...

Wrong.
Most of the AF fleet is now wearing the "new" livery ... and for a long time already.

When the "new" livery was unveiled it was also said that this change would be done at no extra cost, which mean that the aircraft would not be repainted before their turn comes...
Add to this that the aircraft scheduled to leave the fleet in a short term won't be repainted (some A319/A320/A340).


User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2728 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 3208 times:

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 20):
Most of the AF fleet is now wearing the "new" livery ... and for a long time already.

I am a bit surprised, but you must be right.
Anyway, I flew AF 2 weeks ago, the planes wore the old livery on both legs. And at CDG, most AF a/c I saw were still wearing the old livery.

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 20):
Add to this that the aircraft scheduled to leave the fleet in a short term won't be repainted (some A319/A320/A340).

Also, which A319s/A320s/A340s are leaving the fleet first(I know some of them are pretty old)?
The A321s I flew on 2 weeks ago were from 1998 (F-GTAE, and the other F-GTAD IIRC): the interior looked so old, the seats were ugly (old seats). Will these birds leave the fleet soon, too? I flew recently on a newer A321 (F-GTAV), and the difference was huge



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User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days ago) and read 3177 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
New: different smaller font. no space between "AIR" and "FRANCE", red "swirl" added, bottom of stripes on tail curved forward, one less blue stripe on tail, red stripe is larger.

As your list is relatively comprehensive, it's probably worth mentioning that the blue used in for the stripe and the titles is darker and less saturated. Looks smart.


User currently offlinesturmovik From India, joined May 2007, 514 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3160 times:

The changes in the 'new' livery are minor enough that no one would notice them once the customary layer of dirt covers it  


'What's it doing now?'
User currently offlineFlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7422 posts, RR: 57
Reply 24, posted (2 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3101 times:

Quoting LY777 (Reply 21):
Also, which A319s/A320s/A340s are leaving the fleet first(I know some of them are pretty old)?
The A321s I flew on 2 weeks ago were from 1998 (F-GTAE, and the other F-GTAD IIRC): the interior looked so old, the seats were ugly (old seats). Will these birds leave the fleet soon, too? I flew recently on a newer A321 (F-GTAV), and the difference was huge

2 A319LR were recently retired from service and transfered to Air Côte d'Ivoire.

The A340 fleet is reduced to 13 after after the "retirement" of F-GLZT & F-GLZL (now with Air Madagascar) and F-GNIH (now with AR). Another 4 are scheduled to leave the fleet within the next 18 months so I guess they won't be repainted before.

The 20 A321 will all remain in service. The one based at ORY are all in the new colors. Maybe a few of them at CDG are not repainted yet. All the interior are also progressively renovated and the seats changed.

The B744 fleet is now reduced to the 7 aircraft that will be kept in service until 2016/2017. They are all wearing the "new" colors and are completely refurbished with the new seats and the new IFE (except one : F-GEXB)


25 Post contains links and images CitationJet : Three different paint schemes on three different aircraft at the same time. View Large View MediumPhoto © Ryan Gaddis
26 LY777 : I thought they had 25 A321s (5 based at ORY, and 20 based at CDG. So, this summer, all the 744s (except GEXB) have now PTVs in all classes? They were
27 FlySSC : Ooops .. typo. AF has indeed a total of 25 A321 (5 A321-100 + 20 A321-200) but 9 of them are based at ORY : the 5 -100 (inherited from Air Inter and
28 LY777 : That's good news. Thanks for the info. A shame they don't operate anymore to MIA though. The new 77Ws used on the MIA route are good, the PTVs are la
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