B747forever From United States of America, joined May 2007, 16575 posts, RR: 11 Reply 1, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 7320 times:
FlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 6520 posts, RR: 11 Reply 2, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7309 times:
widget1580 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 338 posts, RR: 16 Reply 5, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7240 times:
Quoting hooverman (Reply 4): Nice. Years ago DL sometimes used the 777 to AMS but that was from ATL or JFK I guess.
CrimsonNL From Netherlands, joined Dec 2007, 1618 posts, RR: 42 Reply 7, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7179 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW CHAT OPERATOR
Very nice! I don't recall seeing a DL 777 at AMS before. Summer loads sometimes even call for a 747, but I wouldn't have expected a capacity upgrade in winter season!
DTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 537 posts, RR: 2 Reply 10, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7091 times:
Quoting hooverman (Reply 6): Sounds like a lot of plane for such a small market. Interesting though.
It's not a small market--DL operates 4 A330's a day plus a 757 during some seasons DTW-AMS. Some seasons there is a 744 thrown in the mix, too. Remember, DL has a HUGE hub in AMS with worldwide connections. AMS flights are normally totally packed with many connections to eastern Europe, the Middle East and Africa and most cities within Europe in conjunction with KL.
MaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 15730 posts, RR: 48 Reply 11, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 7047 times:
Quoting timf (Reply 8): It's good to see DL optimizing the number of seats on DTW-AMS. The 777 provides an intermediate upgauge over the A332 compared to using the A333.
It's probably just a place to stick the DTWHKG 777 shell until they find another place to put it.
widget1580 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 338 posts, RR: 16 Reply 13, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 6976 times:
Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 10): It's not a small market--DL operates 4 A330's a day plus a 757 during some seasons DTW-AMS.
panamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4584 posts, RR: 26 Reply 14, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6819 times:
Quoting CrimsonNL (Reply 7): but I wouldn't have expected a capacity upgrade in winter season!
Both CDG and AMS can sometimes get upgauges during the winter due to the pulldown in the other European flying from ATL and JFK. For example, JFK-AMS on Delta metal will be an A333 this winter (whereas it is usually a 763ER or A332 during the summer); JFK-CDG will be a 764ER starting December, whereas it has been a 763ER during the summer.
During the summer, with all the seasonal nonstops out of the US gateways, there are many more options for the traveler to reach those secondary European destinations, whereas in the winter, because of the seasonal cutbacks, many of those same destinations can only be reached via AMS and/or CDG, so they often upgauge AMS and CDG....
dtwpilot225 From United States of America, joined Dec 2011, 98 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6790 times:
for a brief time, KLM as part of Skyteam was flying AMS-DTW on a 777. Its great to see Delta doing this! How about DTW-DXB??!!
hooverman From Netherlands, joined Oct 2011, 52 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6724 times:
Quoting panamair (Reply 14): Both CDG and AMS can sometimes get upgauges during the winter due to the pulldown in the other European flying from ATL and JFK. For example, JFK-AMS on Delta metal will be an A333 this winter (whereas it is usually a 763ER or A332 during the summer); JFK-CDG will be a 764ER starting December, whereas it has been a 763ER during the summer.
But them using a 777 is a surprise. Apparently they have not used the 777 to Europe in some time.
spiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6712 times:
FlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 6520 posts, RR: 11 Reply 18, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6637 times:
Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 17): DL so used the 777s on ATL-FRA in the beginning,
ATL-FRA, ATL-CDG, ATL-LGW, to name a few. DL only had 8 for the longest. ATL-NRT required 2 T7s. The rest only offered a limited amount of routes.
CAM2:"Lightning coming out of that one." CAM1: "What?"
gigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16215 posts, RR: 88 Reply 19, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5933 times:
Just to be clear - it isn't a capacity upgrade. The A330-300 in DL config seats a good many more people.
I am confused by this unless they're expecting a surge in premium demand - or if this plane continues to India and they need it there.
questions From Australia, joined Sep 2011, 310 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5884 times:
Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 10): Remember, DL has a HUGE hub in AMS with worldwide connections.
Really??
I thought AMS was a HUGE hub for KL, not DL. Excluding US destinations, how many worldwide destinations are served by DL ex AMS? And what are the destinations?
gigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16215 posts, RR: 88 Reply 21, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5853 times:
Well KL and DL are basically the same company across the Atlantic, so everywhere KL flies DL flies.
Also, they fly to at least BLR and BOM, if not more.
FlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 6520 posts, RR: 11 Reply 22, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 5833 times:
Quoting gigneil (Reply 21): Well KL and DL are basically the same company across the Atlantic, so everywhere KL flies DL flies.
Also, they fly to at least BLR and BOM, if not more.
AMS-BOM is the only route on DL metal ex AMS. Inherited from NW.
CAM2:"Lightning coming out of that one." CAM1: "What?"
FlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 6520 posts, RR: 11 Reply 24, posted (9 months 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5726 times:
Onward connections on DL metal, no. But AMS is still a pretty sizable hub for DL and in the context of the other posters, yes it does offer worldwide connections. DL's code is on a HUGE chunk of KL's flights out of Schiphol. Also, DL enjoys JV/ATI on every single KL flight across the Atlantic; even to non DL hubs (ie. AMS-DFW/ORD, etc.). It's pretty much as if it's DL.
DL's schedule from AMS on 8/10 (DL metal not counting KL metal)
That's approximately 3,998 seats one way and that's not even counting the KL flights to which DL enjoys ATI on
CAM2:"Lightning coming out of that one." CAM1: "What?"
25 B747forever: It really is a hub for DL as they use KLM as onward transporter for their PAX. Basically, KLMs European network is indirectly DLs also. Furthermore,
26 MH017: DTWAMS - capacity increase from 332 to 777 (also with lie-flat seats) from 14 Dec 12 to 28 Feb 13 on the DL 248/9 rotation. This will be the first fli
27 FlyASAGuy2005: It is in fact an increase in seats. It's replacing the 332. DL 252 and 619 remain as 333s. 332 - 32J 207Y 777 - 45J 224Y Just looking at the schedule
28 DeltaL1011man: Kind of. The LR's are getting into some MX work over the winter. Its a hub for KLM. For some reason if an airline has a JV with someone, people start
29 PSU.DTW.SCE: It's part capacity upgrade, but it also works out better to use a 77E than an A330. They can utilize the 77E that arrives in DTW from ICN and PVG for
30 hooverman: But why only for 3 months as the poster from reply 26 suggests?
31 BoeingGuy: Actually it was CVG-CDG on a 777. I flew that flight on the way from BOM-CDG-CVG-SEA. I would have to say that CDG-CVG 777 flight in B-class was argu
32 factsonly: The Delta hub at Amsterdam Schiphol Airport offers more capacity and movements than any other DL European operation. The hub makes a huge contributio
33 BoeingGuy: You do know that the vast majority of those flights are code share flights, not operated by DL themselves, right?
34 B747forever: At the end of the day, does it really matter?Metal neutrality is the keyword.
35 syncmaster: I'm not sure the JV and SkyTeam are the same thing, they just happen to be members of SkyTeam as well. The JV applies only to AF, DL, KL and Alitalia
36 DALCE: I would say this is quite a hub for DL.....
37 gigneil: To be factual, not all of skyteam is a JV. KL-AF-DL, is. NS
38 usdcaguy: Yes, it does matter. You shouldn't say that DL has a hub in AMS but that DL offers connections to many places worldwide through its partner KLM from
39 PSU.DTW.SCE: There are many variables that factor into equipment choice on a given route. One of which is aircraft routing/availability, maintaining minimum hours
40 FlyASAGuy2005: They fly a/c (including KL metal) across the Atlantic and dump the pax; either being local traffic or onward connections on KL. By today's standards,
41 DeltaL1011man: JV is for TATL and India flights only. I don't remember AMS-LHR being TATL or in India. 18 flights? lol if that is a hub then so is damn near every c
42 ZK-NBT: Why lol? 18 flights to a city on the other side of the atlantic connecting to KL's network is hubbing, sure DL fly to multiple cities in Europe but A
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