Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 119  
User currently offlinePA515 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2007, 875 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 20010 times:

Welcome to Part 119 of the New Zealand Aviation Thread. In New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 118 (by 777ER 1 Aug 2012 in Civil Aviation) we discussed:

  • - Beech 1900D replacement
  • - CI Daily via SYD/BNE eff. 29 Oct
  • - Air NZ 789 configuration/deployment
  • - Air NZ PVG/KIX/SFO Mar-Jun 2013 schedule
  • - ZK-OKQ AKL-HKG-LHR Nov 1-2
  • - Air NZ Black livery
  • - Fedex MD11 visit
  • - Tongariro Ash Cloud
  • - 1900D grounding/inspection
  • - VA ceases HLZ eff. 27 Oct
  • - New FJ colours
  • - Air NZ 77E refit
  • - Air NZ 2012 Annual Results
  • - Implications of QF/EK Agreement
  • - QF Antarctic flight ex AKL


204 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25049 posts, RR: 46
Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 20020 times:

I was reading the September issue of Airports International which dedicated the issue to Asia/Pacific airports including several pages covering Auckland and Wellington.

I found it interesting to note since it comes up here is the importance AKL airport and NZ tourism board is placing on China travel.

Story mentions that today China is the 5th most frequent overseas visitor, but the dynamics are changing fast and in a few years, Chinese arrivals are expected to double and become the 2nd most frequent visitor to NZ after Australians. Also the Chinese visitors to NZ already have the highest average daily spending only second to Japanese visitors.

Article mentions as part of a broader “Ambition 2020” the airport and NZ tourism authorities will strongly focus on Asia – markets like China, India, Korea to drive increased visitors and trade. Story also mentions that traditional historic markets such as the UK continue to see a downturn as part of broader global market realignment from the West to East.

Story also mentions, that as part of expanded China bilateral in April, Air NZ will be allotted 21 weekly frequencies, and how NZ airports are courting additional Chinese carrier service as well.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently onlinemotorhussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3179 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 19902 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 1):
Story also mentions, that as part of expanded China bilateral in April, Air NZ will be allotted 21 weekly frequencies, and how NZ airports are courting additional Chinese carrier service as well.

I'm assuming this is exclusive of HKG rights/flights? So, eventually (projected) daily PEK, PVG plus CAN (although CZ serves that well)? And where?



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25049 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 19866 times:

Yes HK has separate bilateral agreements than China proper.

What I found interesting was the keen focus AKL and NZ tourism authorities had on China as being the premier market to attend to in the future, which I suppose will go to benefit Air NZ and reinforces its efforts to make China flying a success.

I even note the recent QF-EK deal which will see realignment of Qantas Asian service with greater focus on local demand as further affirmation that China and the Far East economies are of growing importance to carriers in the Asia Pacific region.

I suppose over time if traffic from UK continues to see declines, and US stagnates, Air NZ could be seen shifting towards an ever greater Asian focus itself.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently onlinemercure1 From French Polynesia, joined Jul 2008, 1351 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 19790 times:

In many ways China is the market of the future for the region. The other day was reading mere 2% of the Chinese population fly at the moment. This compared to 30-50% in more industrial nations.

As China continues to awaken, and the Chinese consumer desires to travel the world and spend their new found wealth, I think many companies and nations will fight hard to earn this business.

I applaud New Zealand, which seems to have the foresight to make a concerted effort and sharp focus staying ahead of global demand trend.


User currently offlineZKOJH From China, joined Sep 2004, 1674 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 19734 times:

If NZ returned to PEK it wouldn't happen till after 2015 until the new airport is built in the south of the city, then they will say that 8 runways is too many for them to obtain slots!

All the focus at the moment is on PVG which going to daily by next year could help, they just need to fill the front of the plane! which is not happening.

Would they approach CAN ? could be a tricky one to go for, without hurting the HKG market

NZ tend to go for long haul routes where there the only carrier with the exception of HNL,

Where else would they likely pop up in China? I would say maybe Chengdu, Kumming - Just had a new International airport built, and maybe Xian but would be a BIG MAYBE! all theses could be done with the 787's after the 2017 time frame.

Again it's just a waiting game the next several years,



NZ 787-9 flying between PVG - AKL ! CAN'T WAIT!!
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25049 posts, RR: 46
Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 19673 times:

So if ANZ is not going to be carrying this projected doubling of Chinese arrivals who will ?? Chinese carriers along with 3rd nation airlines?


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinekoruman From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 19644 times:

LAXintl, I'd urge caution about the Chinese visitor influx.

The visitors are currently almost entirely Discount Economy tourists on package holidays. Outbound travel is over 90% VFR and students by ethnically Chinese residents of New Zealand.

The Beijing route has already failed, and the Shanghai one has just had to be downguaged from a 77E to a 763 due to a lack of demand for lie-flat Business and Premium Economy cabins. There are two Hong Kong routes operated by New Zealand, for a market which is several decades ahead of mainland China in its economic development, and one of those two Hong Kong routes is also failing.

Meanwhile other key Air New Zealand routes to Oriental markets several decades of economic development ahead of China have also failed, including Singapore, Taipei and 3 out of 4 Japanese ports.

Daily spend by Chinese visitors is high, but much of it is restricted to a narrow-range of Chinese-owned shops and restaurants to which they are funnelled by the monopoly tour operators, who also have high margins for their tours. Actual patronage of non-approved shops and restaurants is minimal because independent time on their tours is minimal.

The NZ government has a strategic investment in Air NZ, and that is in theory why the airline persists with Shanghai in spite of an inability to sell high-yield tickets. My own opinions are well-known: I consider the FASCO staffing arrangements to be suspiciously expensive as well as opaque and I wonder whether any impropriety is involved.

I have lived in Australia for some time but have friends who own businesses in central Auckland and Queenstown who report minimal patronage by Chinese visitors compared with other nationalities. They do report significant patronage by visitors from Hong Kong and Singapore, but virtually nothing by visitors from the PRC.


User currently offlineMillwallSean From Singapore, joined Apr 2008, 1241 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 19594 times:

Quoting koruman (Reply 7):
I have lived in Australia for some time but have friends who own businesses in central Auckland and Queenstown who report minimal patronage by Chinese visitors compared with other nationalities. They do report significant patronage by visitors from Hong Kong and Singapore, but virtually nothing by visitors from the PRC.

First I agree with what you say. the Chinese market is very different and often controlled by the tour operators. And tour operators dont bring much wealth into New Zealand nor do we see much spread on the spending.

But the VFR, "father of student" market is very different to the tour-operators. It contributes a lot to the local economy both directly and indirectly.
Ive seen figures from one well known European carbrand in Auckland showing that over 40% of the 100.000 NZ dollar plus category cars are bought by Chinese residents. In many cases its student on visas spending daddys cash. Money that goes straight into New Zealand and really contributes to the economy. Ive also seen ethnic estimations from Skycity in Auckland. the PRC nationals aren't scared to spend cash there thats for sure and SkyCity is part of the main society here. These are just examples.

While quite a few kiwis might dislike the sight of rich Chinese shopping in Parnell and Newmarket its very clear that luxury shops are depedant upon PRC customers. An associates wife manages a luxury boutique in Newmarket and she sees more than 75% of her high end sales to Chinese visitors. (Herself being HongKong Hokkien so we can say she knows the difference between PRC, Overseas Chinese and Cantonese HongKong customers.)
The money many of the VFR:s and students fathers spend in Auckland makes any finance minister wet his pants from joy. China will only become more and more important for New Zealand. if nothing else China's government will ensure that we see sizeable investments here so that they when needed will have some influence to balance the direct line where apparently the US can order the New Zealand PM and judiciary to do anything (hello illegal actions taken on direct order from the US against the fat German lad behind megaupload)

For NZ the challenge is to make these more wealthy PRC choose Air New Zealand.
At the moment they aren't, most come in on other Asian airlines. I know a diamond merchant in Auckland. he flies fortnightly to different Asian ports, always first or business class. He flat out refuses to fly NZ. This is a big issue and when I attend the European business communities gatherings in Auckland and we discuss travel hardly anyone flies NZ. Same goes for kiwi fliers heading to Asia on a regular basis.
NZ doesn't have a monopoly going to Asia thus we tend to choose the airline providing us the best benefits. Airpoints and loyalty doesnt work when there is competition and the flier has a choice...

As far as I can see, being in China is important for NZ. Its a strategic market that's growing. The key is if NZ can persuade this growing market to choose NZ and if they can attract other segments besides tour-groups and cheapest fares from Flightcentre.
If they loose the Chinese markets there is virtually nothing left in Asia.
Japan isn't a growing market nor does Japanese tourists flock to New Zealand.
Destinations such as DPS is more of the tourgroup flights just this time originating in New Zealand instead.

To be honest I think NZ has done pretty well lately in regards to their route map.
Airpoints has been devalued and turned into a shopping card. But NZ still get as many paying passengers so while some fliers will complain (and rightfully so), the bottomline doesnt. Where there is competition NZ has already lost most fliers and if your mainly flying east, TT or domestic you are likely to stick with NZ as it stands now. Sad but true.



No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
User currently offlineZKOJH From China, joined Sep 2004, 1674 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 19431 times:

The China market is slowing down like the rest of the world is, but the key is to advertise the route to start with , that was part of the reason PEK didn't work!

My partner works in a tour company here in Beijing and last year she was dealing with lots of groups and company's from New Zealand, however most were flying in on CA via SYD because no-one knew there was a direct AKL-PEK route!

Only yesterday I got the email from NZ China with special deals on, rtn to AKL from PVG for 5490 RMB + Tax only catch is that you have to book by the 16 Sep and Depart before the 23 Sep haha who's going go for that offer when all the schools and office people have gone back! SILLY!



NZ 787-9 flying between PVG - AKL ! CAN'T WAIT!!
User currently offlinecchan From New Zealand, joined May 2003, 1759 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 19307 times:

Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 9):
who's going go for that offer when all the schools and office people have gone back! SILLY!

Most Chinese tourists would be on group tours anyway, and those who are traveling independently would have bought their tickets.




Perhaps it would be a bit early to ask: would the black 77W be doing the one-time NZ35 AKL-HKG-LHR on the 1st of Nov?


User currently onlinemercure1 From French Polynesia, joined Jul 2008, 1351 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 19270 times:

You might term them as “discount tourist on package holidays” but net result is still growing arrivals in NZ from China, with them providing record spending second only to Japanese.

So volumes are growing and they are putting money into the NZ economy one way or the other. Sounds like fruitful situation to me.

If you don’t want them. Send them to French Polynesia  


User currently onlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4932 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 19248 times:

Quoting cchan (Reply 10):
Perhaps it would be a bit early to ask: would the black 77W be doing the one-time NZ35 AKL-HKG-LHR on the 1st of Nov?

I believe this was established as a positive a few threads ago.


User currently offlinePA515 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2007, 875 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 19154 times:

Air NZ's 2012 Analyst Presentation contains the FY16 787-9 delivery info.

Page 18, Aircraft Captital Commitments
Boeing 787-9: FY13 (0), FY14 (1), FY15 (2), FY16 (3)
The first 789 is now expected in Jun 2014, so six 789's within the 25 months 01 Jun 2014 - 30 Jun 2016.

The 2011 Analyst Presentation was as follows.
Page 15, Aircraft Capital Commitments
Boeing 787-9: FY13 (0), FY14 (5), FY15 (0)

In 2011 the first 789 was expected in Dec 2013, so five 789's within the seven months 01 Dec 2013 - 30 Jun 2014.

A six month delay to the 2011 delivery schedule for the fourth and fifth 789's would have seen them delivered in the first six months of FY15 at the latest, 01 Jul - 31 Dec 2014. Now it's FY16, 01 Jul 2015 - 30 Jun 2016.

This means the fourth and fifth 789's have been deferred by at least 12 months beyond the six month delay.

Given that the two 744's will be retired when the first 789's arrive, that leaves only one 789 for expansion or 763 retirement before late 2015.

www.airnewzealand.co.nz/assets/PDFs/...12-annual-analyst-presentation.pdf
www.airnewzealand.co.nz/assets/PDFs/...l-results-analyst-presentation.pdf

PA515


User currently offlineNZ107 From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 6413 posts, RR: 38
Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 19137 times:

Quoting cchan (Reply 10):

The fact that the All Blacks should be on it should give some indication..



It's all about the destination AND the journey.
User currently offlineZKOJH From China, joined Sep 2004, 1674 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 19027 times:

If were going by the number of 787's in 2014 (1) this would mean that the 763's are staying longer ? they just don't want to part with them!
I think the 744's could be staying too? but with QF just cancelled 35 frames would that have not pushed up the delivery time to early slots?



NZ 787-9 flying between PVG - AKL ! CAN'T WAIT!!
User currently offlinenzrich From New Zealand, joined Dec 2005, 1522 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 19007 times:

Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 9):
Only yesterday I got the email from NZ China with special deals on, rtn to AKL from PVG for 5490 RMB + Tax only catch is that you have to book by the 16 Sep and Depart before the 23 Sep haha who's going go for that offer when all the schools and office people have gone back! SILLY!

What would be silly is selling really discounted tickets during the peak times . One would assume the reason for the cheap seats is because there are vacant seats during an off peak time . That is called marketing and trying to fill up a seat that would otherwise go empty .



"Pride of the pacific"
User currently offlinePA515 From New Zealand, joined Nov 2007, 875 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 18957 times:

Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 15):
If were going by the number of 787's in 2014 (1) this would mean that the 763's are staying longer ? they just don't want to part with them!

That's one 789 in FY14 (01 Jul 2013 - 30 Jun 2014) likely to be June 2014, and the two for FY15 (01 Jul 2014 - 30 Jun 2015) will probably arrive within a few months of the first making three for the 2014 calendar year.

The 763's would be close to fully depreciated and paid for, probably cheaper to hang on to them for a bit longer.

Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 15):
I think the 744's could be staying too? but with QF just cancelled 35 frames would that have not pushed up the delivery time to early slots?

It seems Air NZ doesn't want 789's earlier. Will be interesting to see who gets QF's slots though.

Perhaps Air NZ will look at getting some used 777's. SQ's 1999 777-212(ER) 9V-SQG, now N321LF and owned by ILFC, has been in storage at Goodyear, Arizona since 01 April. I thought someone would have taken it by now.

PA515


User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 18
Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 18885 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting PA515 (Reply 17):

Maybe a B772LR would be better? Is AI still selling theirs?


User currently offlineZK-NBT From New Zealand, joined Oct 2000, 5310 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 18764 times:

Quoting 777ER (Reply 18):
Maybe a B772LR would be better? Is AI still selling theirs?

For NZ?! Management called it a flying fuel tank so not at all likely.




Quoting PA515 (Reply 17):
Perhaps Air NZ will look at getting some used 777's. SQ's 1999 777-212(ER) 9V-SQG, now N321LF and owned by ILFC, has been in storage at Goodyear, Arizona since 01 April. I thought someone would have taken it by now.

I wouldn't think this is likely now, they may have considered it pre GFC. I think they have enough aircraft to get by until the 787s arrive.


User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 18
Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 18755 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 19):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 18):Maybe a B772LR would be better? Is AI still selling theirs?
For NZ?! Management called it a flying fuel tank so not at all likely.

Enable ORD/IAH/JFK/EWR to open sooner


User currently offlineZKOJH From China, joined Sep 2004, 1674 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 18660 times:

Interesting story;

Steve Ridgeway CEO of Virgin Atlantic is leaving the role because he is not happy with his pay! he told the GBO that he will stay on till the end of the year to help find a successor.

Names mentioned are

Julie Southern,the current Chief commercial officer.
Rob Fyfe CEO of Air New Zealand !! = VS becomes an LCC . . . ?



NZ 787-9 flying between PVG - AKL ! CAN'T WAIT!!
User currently onlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4932 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 18651 times:

Quoting 777ER (Reply 18):
Maybe a B772LR would be better? Is AI still selling theirs?
Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 19):
For NZ?! Management called it a flying fuel tank so not at all likely.
Quoting 777ER (Reply 20):
Enable ORD/IAH/JFK/EWR to open sooner

It depends what payload they are looking for . If NZ's longest anticipated sector is about 16hrs the 789 is good for 30 to 32t . If they want 45t or better then the 77L is the way to go.


User currently offlineaerorobnz From Rwanda, joined Feb 2001, 7184 posts, RR: 13
Reply 23, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 18615 times:

As much as I have been a proponent of the 777 fleet being expanded - their window of opportunity has now closed for all except maybe the option to standardise on the 77W fleet.(outside chance - but still my personal preferred option c2011-12). I think don't expect to see any new or old 777s of any sort until the 77X - and I think there is a real chance that NZ will not order them to replace the 77Ws unless they have a real use for the capabilities by thenand if the 78-10 is confirmed the odds will increase. The time for 77L orders was ideally when they elected to order 77E instead, but even up until the middle of last year I think they may have been useful within the fleet as a means of getting to South America in particular or as a means of standardising on the GE90-115B engine/retiring the 744 fleet sooner.

The fact is in general for airlines the AKL/NZL market currently is too small to maintain continuous year round payloads of the magnitude mentioned by sunrisevalley for 77L to be worthwhile over the 789 on many markets, and those that are can are comfortably be covered by existing fleets. By the time the 789s are introduced it will be time for an entirely new product that can then be retrofitted to 77W as and when required. You can bet your bottom dollar that the 789 is still the aircraft they will get better use out of at this point in time, not the 77L

Given that the 763s are effectively redesignated as longhaul aircraft again I would not be surprised to see a short term refit to lieflat seats and some form of premium economy for NRT/PVG. They could quite comfortably function like this well after any 787 deliveries as they are 100% owned and unlike the 744 able to perform well on the routes they fly.


User currently offlineDavidByrne From New Zealand, joined Sep 2007, 1644 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (1 year 11 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 18403 times:

From the West Australian:

Quote:
Qantas is expected to launch a daily non-stop service between Perth and Auckland as benefits of last week's alliance deal with Emirates start to emerge.

Source: http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-...tas-touts-benefits-of-partnership/

No indication of start date or aircraft type, or even what the source of the info was, however.



This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
25 xiaotung : Interesting. Seats to Suit vs QF/EK. With forever decreasing Airpoints benefits, NZ can really only compete in the bottom of the market.
26 koruman : It's fascinating, because the much-vaunted rollout of Seats To Suit has now turned to cr@p on both the Honolulu and Perth routes, hasn't it? Both rou
27 alangirvan : Just wondering - on the effects of EK/QF on Trans Tasman. If AirNZ is buying some freight capacity on the EK operated flights, will this continue when
28 Post contains links mariner : Quoting koruman (Reply 26):Luxon really does need to take control of this airline. He has two major tasks above all: don't deploy S2S against full-ser
29 xiaotung : To be fair, the new CEO is inheriting an airline where most of its routes have no or very little competition. I can't think of another country whose
30 Mr AirNZ : I'm sorry but again you spin facts that simply aren't true. The 777 to HNL was always only for a few months and the return to the 763 has been in the
31 mariner : Hmmmm? Mainline domestic has competition but with fuel at these prices, I can't imagine that the (no-compete) puddle jumpers make tens of millions. I
32 Post contains links NZ107 : http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalk...-wont-end-trans-tasman-fare-fight/ The link above also mentions AKL-ADL.. Both routes would provide more option
33 DavidByrne : You can't make such a sweeping generalisation. NZ must be an amazingly "poorly run" airline to make a profit when so many other carriers are making b
34 aerorobnz : Exactly. Like it or lump it for all of us critics, NZ made a profit in a year that has them $45mill ahead of VA & $320 million or thereabouts ahe
35 mariner : I think the more important point is that Air NZ has pretty much maintained profitability through some of the most horrendous years in civil aviation
36 Kiwinlondon : Does anyone know how CI are doing in AKL? Presumably well given they are now going daily. I do wonder how China Southern are doing, does anyone have a
37 cchan : Not sure about CI, but CZ should be doing well, they have increased their frequency. I was searching for a AKL-HKG-PEK ticket on NZ's website, and no
38 aerorobnz : CI will also start 4x a week via SYD in addition to the 3xBNE. It is obviously part of both their current strategies to the market to operate daily s
39 alangirvan : sorry for askiing what I should be able to look up - which days are the All Black charters operating? Will the plane fly over Dunedin? If anyone from
40 Post contains images ZKSUJ : Ah by that you mean steak, and more steak
41 PA515 : AKL-EZE Sat 22 Sep 1940/1640 EZE-AKL Sun 30 Sep 1100/1700+1 NPE might get a look, but not Dunedin. AR used to head out over the Southern Ocean from b
42 sunrisevalley : Will the aircraft be on the ground for a week in EZE.? Is there a web site that will show the flight plan?
43 PA515 : ZK-OKQ will be away nine days. A 744 is used on NZ6/NZ5 and a 772 on NZ8/NZ7. Sa 22 Sep NZ6/NZ5 744, NZ8/NZ7 772 Su 23 Sep NZ6/NZ5 77W, NZ8/NZ7 744 M
44 NZ107 : With VS switching their LHR-NRT flights to HND, might this be a cue for NZ to start thinking about the switch to HND itself?
45 cchan : This would be great for NZ, especially for connection to NH domestic flights and regional flights. But would NZ want to pay for the cost of switching
46 777ER : Spotted AR flying east of WLG frequently
47 Post contains links PA515 : So, could be a few of us watching www.flightradar24.com on Sat evening then? ZK-OKQ was NZ2 Sunday returning as NZ1 Wednesday, then NZ2 Wednesday ret
48 sunrisevalley : do you know the flight numbers?
49 aerokiwi : Yes, but doesn't it all come from domestic operations, where NZ has (including its monopoly on regional flights) something in the order of 80 per cen
50 Post contains links mercure1 : I was looking for something else but ran across this August story about Chinese tourism to NZ. According to new statistics released by the government
51 KiwiRob : Better not tell a certain Brit living in Queensland that, it's contrary to what he's been preaching for a long time.
52 aerorobnz : LOL.. The Chinese are the only ones that go into Louis Vuitton at the airport and actually buy something. They have no hesitation dropping $4000 on a
53 koruman : I don't dispute that the Chinese visitors spend large sums, especially when funnelled into Chinese-owned shops. The problem is that Air NZ brings most
54 KiwiRob : Do you know this for a fact or are you just guessing, unless you can quote a source all that you have to say on this subject is pure speculation.
55 aerorobnz : On any given night PVG has a very healthy mix of everything, not dominated by groups at all. No more so than any other of the longhaul destinations..
56 Post contains links PA515 : No, but charters have four digit NZ19xx numbers. 24 hrs before departure or arrival the flight number should be on www.aucklandairport.co.nz/FlightIn
57 nascarnut : Flt1934 will operate AKL-EZE on 22sep. I imagine return will be either 1935 or 1933
58 NZ1 : Confirmation of the upgrades to the 777-200ER's from communications sent out to staff. Should be on the news sites shortly. Unable to provide a link a
59 alangirvan : It may be a bit early to be asking but since Boeing are making noises about their 777-X, I wonder if AirNZ and Virgin Australia could develop a common
60 cchan : Thank you for the info. I am glad that NZ has chosen of continue flying the 77E. IMHO, this suggests that all 8x 77E will likely to remain in the fle
61 KiwiRob : So this means 10 abreast in economy in the 772?
62 ZKSUJ : It didn't specify in the email but I remember someone saying that the 772 was unable to accomodate a 3-4-3 layout. Could someone else clarify.
63 aerorobnz : That to me indicates that C will be upgraded to match 77W C, and PE & Y will be completely replaced (similar but not identical to 77W)...otherwis
64 NZ1 : I can confirm that Economy will indeed go to 10 abreast NZ1
65 cchan : Oh no. Considering that the 77E's cabin is narrower than the 77W, it will be worse.[Edited 2012-09-19 00:40:31]
66 afterburner33 : Does anyone else have 3-4-3 in their 777-200ER's?
67 WSTAKL : I'm sorry, but if this is indeed the case then the wording in that NZ staff comms is very mis-leading. Air New Zealand is investing more than $100 mi
68 Post contains links ZKOJH : Jetstar NZ changes New Zealand ops, ''New plane to boost Jetstar's services'' Jetstar says it will provide more services, seats and create jobs when i
69 LoveNZ : Interesting developments with the 777-200ER upgrades. I thinks its great for improving product consistency. I do have some questions/thoughts.... Sure
70 cchan : Sadly, the majority of passengers only care about the technology products and food on board these days. My guess is next to none, as long as the conf
71 ZK-NBT : All 777s are the same width, I'm not sure where this comes from. They are due to announce the 789 configuration soon, I'm guessing since they will re
72 KiwiRob : Will that mean an overall increase in seats or will it just mean a more spacious premium end and a more cosy cattle class?
73 anstar : I believe Scoot do as do Emirates on the 772.
74 cchan : In one of the earlier threads, someone suggested a conversion to 3-4-3 won't happen on the 77E because the cabin is not wide enough. Obviously that's
75 sunrisevalley : I assume the Y+ style seat of the 77W requires more physical space than does the type in the 77E. If NZ are going to hold the Y+ count I guess it is
76 motorhussy : I don't understand why the new Y+ isn't 2-3-2 for the 777 cabins and 2-2-2 for the 787's. Any reason it would not fit/work? Can still have the 'Love S
77 Post contains images ZKOJH : Well as NZ1 put it there going 3/4/3 on the 772's it kinda hints to which way the 789's are going ? oh my
78 Post contains images aerorobnz : They will likely be 3-3-3 as per UA, ET, LA and a number of other 787 operators.. the 787 is not as wide as the 777 nor does it cost as much to opera
79 alangirvan : Talking about high density - has anyone on the NZ forum flown AirTransat? See the review in Airliner World (with bmi on cover) the new interior for Ai
80 aerorobnz : Given that there is a saving of 600-800 dollars flying Air Transat vs AC/DL/UA/AF perhaps there is more saving to be made for the suffering than JQ c
81 sunrisevalley : we paid extra for seat selection and grabbed the bulkhead seats but it cost us $140 extra but with that extra in the fare YYZ-LGW was about $750. I b
82 Blueshamu330s : There was much chatter on here a few months ago about the performance of AKL- HKG- LHR and of its long term viability and longevity. Without me trawli
83 cchan : The only suggestions were that the HKG-LHR leg had a frequency reduction from daily to 5x weekly, and the route is now getting the smaller capacity a
84 sunrisevalley : The seat width in 3-3-3 will be slightly wider than the 3-4-3 of the 77W. Assuming 18" ailses the seat cushion will be ~17.2"
85 ZKOJH : how long ago did it change that NZ would not be the 1st A320 operator with the new sharklet wings? Air Asia will start receiving them in December of t
86 sunrisevalley : I thought NZ was the first to order them , not necessarily the first to operate them.
87 Post contains links ZKSUJ : http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crim...re-laser-prank-endangered-hundreds A guy finally gets caught shining lasers into the aircraft flight decks and
88 cchan : If I remember correctly, NZ is supposed to receive them in Dec as well. Btw, could someone update on upcoming aircraft deliveries and retirements for
89 ZKOJH : ATr 72-600's are due towards the end of Oct, and into Nov, didn't think there was an A320 showing up till around June next year, that was meant to be
90 alangirvan : I suppose now that Qantas has dropped HKG-LHR that would help loads on the AirNZ flight? One of the rumours that has not happened so far - when QF an
91 aerorobnz : HKG-LHR improved markedly once it was right-sized for frequency,the 789 and even the 77E refit will help.
92 PA515 : And the Northern Winter schedule has a later NZ35 HKG-LHR time of 0905/1445, close to the BA and CX morning departures. Last year NZ39 HKG-LHR was 08
93 NZ1 : New arrivals as follows: ATR72-600 - Nov 2012 (MVA), Jan 2013 (MVB), Mar 2013 (MVC), Sep 2013 (MVD). A320 Sharklet - Jun 2013 (OXA), Jul 2013 (OXB).
94 PA515 : Just checked and the morning 3 weekly BA HKG-LHR replacing the daily QF HKG-LHR has been dropped for the Northern Winter. The morning CX flight will
95 Post contains links and images zkojq : A few bits of News: There is currently a Boeing E-4 (747-200) of the USAF in Auckland. This is because US defense secretary Leon Panetta has come for
96 777ER : Does anyone know if the BBJ is currently outside a hanger or inside?
97 Post contains links PA515 : NZ1934 AKL-EZE is now scheduled to depart at 1810 Sat 22 Sep. www.aucklandairport.co.nz/FlightInfo...nationalArrivalsAndDepartures.aspx PA515
98 777ER : Whats HA9981 arriving at 3am on Sunday? Another B763 for MX?
99 haggis73 : Yeah, sure is. N588HA left this morning back to HNL as HA9982.
100 NZ6 : This is why I know number a good number of airline enthusiasts who do not value or read these forums any more. Given businesses have been tightening t
101 mariner : Air NZ made a $71 million profit. If, as you claim, the majority of that was on domestic - with a population of four million and and on which there i
102 aerorobnz : As I thought they would, they took a far more northerly route than LA/AR, using IPC has the alternate, rather than the usual AR alternates of MDZ,BRC
103 cchan : Thanks for the info. If I remember correctly, when NZ ordered the 320, the announcement said the first sharklet 320 would be delivered in Dec 2012. S
104 aerokiwi : Someone, hand me a hanky. Seriously if it's so painful, why do you bother? I enjoy most of the conversation here - hence my participation. Hell I've
105 Zkpilot : I would say that the 77E would be the more likely choice for 3 reasons... 1: 777 crews in LHR (both pilots and cabin crew), 2: 777 parts/mx in LHR 3:
106 mariner : I know airlines in other countries which own 100% of particular markets, but who are not, proportionately, making that kind of money. Within my exper
107 sunrisevalley : I think the seat layouts will have a large bearing on the outcome.We don't know what the revision of the 77E will mean and weather the 789 is going t
108 xiaotung : Have you considered the possibility that in another country, you are probably not just competing with airlines but also high speed trains? New Zealan
109 mariner : Yes, I've considered that. Trains provide very little genuine competition in the US or Australia - or quite a lot of Asia and Africa - and I wasn't t
110 ZKSUJ : Hit the nail on the head there I think. NZ's transportation infrastructure is not up to par and aviation is pretty much the only way to link the coun
111 aerokiwi : Well run, sure, on domestic. But "astonishingly"? Again, with 80% marketshare and monopoly on regional routes, I'm not astonished. And in Australia,
112 mariner : The main routes are not monopoly and there is a considerable difference between the Qantas domestic fleet and the Beech 1900 - not to mention populat
113 alangirvan : Domestic is not a monopoly - people can and do drive themselves. This is the competition of regional routes. Do I drive three hours from a small city,
114 aerorobnz : Yes exactly. Actually the latest meeting I went to was more focused on the Transtasman/South Pacific growth and profits than domestic. Furthermore as
115 NZ6 : I read the majority of other "threads" on these forums. For NZ I like many people use flyertalk more frequently as the level of conversation is bette
116 NZ107 : There is no conversation anymore seeing NZ watered down the FF programme so much that everyone left...
117 777ER : That comments strikes me as being bit arragant considering your an NZ staff member. How was loosing some of your best customers a good move when they
118 Kaiarahi : Does anyone know if/how you can select a different fare class on the NZ website? The only fares it is displaying for YVR-AKL are S class, which does n
119 cchan : I tried to do that but no luck, it seems the site would only give me the lowest available booking class.
120 PA515 : Do you expect a similar routing for the return flight? PA515
121 aerorobnz : Yes, this keeps it within EDTO 240 requirements and under 6500nm...
122 Post contains links Kaiarahi : A couple of suggestions for improving NZ's on-line booking: 1. Display / allow selection of different fare classes, so that pax can select the class w
123 PA515 : That makes sense. EDTO 240 was achieved in Dec 2011 and under the NZCAA rules EDTO 330 isn't possible until 12 months later. Strangely Boeing's 12 De
124 777ER : I remember this being discussed ages ago and IIRC the reasons why pax can't see what spare seats are still open is because NZ uses an older booking s
125 Kaiarahi : OK, but we're 12 years into the 21st century.
126 alangirvan : Increase seats between Australia and Christchurch? They could persuade Emirates to turn DXB-BKK-SYD-CHC into an A380 flight - that will happen eventua
127 777ER : I thought CHC was New Zealand's first A380 ready airport?
128 LoveNZ : Just been reading today's Tabs on Travel which has some interesting comments on the future of Air New Zealand (sorry, don't know how to share the sour
129 NZ6 : Am I still a staff member? Because you can't please them all and if you're not operating as an airline any more you wont please any! the Tasman is no
130 xiaotung : Was it about 3-4 years ago when NZ started to allow all Smart Saver fares to earn at least Status Points? And not long ago they also started to allow
131 Post contains links ZKOJH : It seems that apart from VA , NZ are not happy with the new QF-EK deal! HAHA ''Virgin Australia and its international alliance partners have asked the
132 Post contains links ZKOJH : ''Jetstar staff get a makeover'' Qantas' low-cost subsidiary, Jetstar has announced a makeover for its staff, unveiling new uniforms for employees wor
133 NZ6 : You can't become a GE on your credit card and you would need to do a LOT of flying on Domestic Smart Savers to be GE on them. I think that argument i
134 Kaiarahi : You've always claimed you work for NZ and have access to inside information. If your status has changed, please enlighten us.
135 NZ6 : I shouldn't need to explain myself, this has always been my personal opinion. I know a lot of people within NZ regardless if I still work there still
136 xiaotung : I assume when you say premium members you also include Gold or even Silver. I know flying purely domestically is hard but it's not that hard if you f
137 BlackLabel : I used to make Gold solely from domestic flying. This was even before the earning of status points on smart savers (which pushed me to fly QF trans t
138 NZ6 : Well I meant just GE but Silver and Gold numbers are up also I believe. I can't be 100% sure on that without checking with my friend though. Brillian
139 BlackLabel : Well it certainly isn't because NZ's fare offerings and Airpoints represent value for money. I would wager that a substantial amount of increase in p
140 mariner : It is in my case. I've been won over by Air NZ, largely because of Works Deluxe fares. mariner
141 NZ6 : You're looking at this the wrong way, not everyone reads the "fine print" of the loyalty programme before deciding their airline of preference. Some
142 xiaotung : I don't quite understand this statement. If you are a premium customer, you will get all the perks a Works Deluxe fare offers anyway. So you pay all
143 xiaotung : I note that you don't need to fly NZ to bank Gold Elite years. While you need 810 Airpoints Dollars earned on NZ flights to qualify for Gold Elite, y
144 mariner : How can you know how often I fly or what my status (with any of several airlines) is? I don't feel the need to broadcast every flight I make on this
145 xiaotung : It's quite simple. It you had status, you would not buy Works Deluxe fares, because you would get anything apart from an empty seat next to you with
146 ZKOJH : What has happened to the big fan fare of the 'New US route' from NZ? when could we hear anything solid. I was looking at the ZQN site the other day, a
147 mariner : I wanted to try out Works deluxe. I wanted to make a comparison with Virgin's Premium Economy. Do you never do that - or do you just jump to conclusi
148 Mr AirNZ : What an arrogant little upstart you are coming across as. Value perception means different things to different people.
149 MillwallSean : Ah, needed to be back in Asia for works. Schoolholiday just started to hard to gets eats on my usual airlines. I booked jetstar to Singapore. I know b
150 Post contains links and images zkojq : Those who have recently been looking at 3new's website might have noted the interesting choice of file photo from the following article. Because who d
151 xiaotung : It has nothing to do with arrogance. I simply questioned that paying nearly $150 extra over Works to just get a neighbour free guarantee was good val
152 mariner : We all do it differently. I once flew MEL-LAX - up the front - going with Air Nauru via BNE, NOU, INU, to GUM and then Continental to HNL and LAX. I
153 aerorobnz : Due to the increasing numbers of Elites (and yes I know the exact number) there are fewer and fewer 'perks' extended to them onboard. On certain flig
154 xiaotung : Then you are not a typical frequent flyer, are you? And your perception of value is apparently different from most regular flyers. You book Works Del
155 xiaotung : If it's true that people see value in newspapers ($2), water bottles ($5 at best), etc, I admit I am surprised.
156 mariner : I don't know what your "typical frequent flyer" is, but I am almost ordinary compared with some of my chums. I have one mate, retired, not rich but n
157 koruman : I'm sure that I'm going to regret asking, but which of my comments? Anyway, while a few recent posts in this thread are sailing a bit close to the wi
158 Post contains images mariner : No need to "regret" anything - or I don't think so. You had made a comment that Works De Luxe should be sold as Premium Economy, Since I had just flo
159 koruman : OK, I see. Well I don't have strong views on that matter, although I think there should be an Airpoints / Status premium for buying a dearer fare typ
160 mariner : Indeed. I don't think the profit was that "little" - it's only a very small airline - and yes, I'd love to see them use their beyond rights, too. But
161 Mr AirNZ : Which would have necessitated acquiring extra capacity to use on routes that would at this point in time be looking rather shaky with the drop in com
162 BlackLabel : Of course. However I was always highly intrigued by the number of native New Zealanders I lived or worked with who would actively avoid NZ, preferrin
163 koruman : I'm not sure that that is actually the case at all. If I remember correctly, there were 8 firm orders for the 777-200ER, five for the 777-300ER, sixt
164 NZ6 : A BBQ conversation you had with a few friends or work colleagues does not speak on behalf of ALL members. My point still stands, there more active me
165 ZKSUJ : Ah so you guys are at the Holiday Inn. I walked into the lobby and saw the sign with the words 'Jetstar' and 'Delay'. Had a small smile on my face. I
166 Mr AirNZ : The 9th and 10th 787 are the compensation. Snap! A very good point from an angle I had not considered. I'll give you that one.
167 aerokiwi : I think you're bang on here. It's still amazing how Qantas can turn its FF programme into a highly valuable profit centre that is still comparatively
168 Zkpilot : Yes....and.....no, QF does have a highly profitable and useful FF scheme in place....however part of the reason why it is so profitable is that its c
169 Kaiarahi : What's the source of your assurance?
170 xiaotung : Your assurance is meaningless. Let's get some facts, shall we? The Airpoints co-branded cards have grown from just BNZ's GlobalPlus to now include 3
171 Kaiarahi : He's playing semantic games - "full increase". So if even a single person who joined is not credit-card related, he's right. Of course, it adds nothi
172 Kaiarahi : I've just been checking YYZ-AKL mid-November. PE is almost 250% of the Y fare, and that includes 1/3 of the total flight time (transcon) alongside Y
173 BlackLabel : While we're talking about increases, there are definitely also more unhappy members. Others have spoken for this comment already, but without actual
174 BlackLabel : This, for what it is worth, is part of my problem with the current NZ value-proposition: the fares are definitely increasing (especially ex-North Ame
175 MillwallSean : To be honest, they took care of in just the same way most full service airlines would. Half of AKL airlines use Holiday Inn so no issues there. We go
176 DavidByrne : And what exactly is a "typical" frequent flyer? I'm with Mariner - I have often taken flights and routings that satisfied my eccentric nature, rather
177 airnewzealand : Is it Menzies that handles Jetstar, if so, i am not suprised. However not all Kiwis are lazy and abandon their passengers in such cases it comes down
178 aerorobnz : No, it is SkyCare. Currently the only airline they serve is JQ. I'm sorry we've lost you after such a long time. Really I am - and I know how long yo
179 ZKOJH : Well looks like any service from AKL to MAN is slowly fading - JAL and its ''JSA'' with BA are in the early stages of opening up direct MAN-JAPAN flig
180 koruman : This sums up the problem with the current regime. They talk a great game about being nimble. They really do. Then when an opportunity comes along (Au
181 mariner : I'm not sure that MAN is such a good idea. Perhaps if they were able to do something interesting with it, such as through PVG, but even then, I think
182 ZKOJH : Some more moving around by NZ, ''Air New Zealand Revises Planned Shanghai NS13 Operaton'' From 01JUL13, Boeing 777-200ER aircraft operates this route
183 NZ6 : Internal source within NZ. Because there are more relationships it does not mean there are more premium members because of the status points assioate
184 xiaotung : Of course it does. For those who used to be unable to ahieve Gold or Gold Elite now they can with the help of credit card spend, even if it means jus
185 koruman : A lot of nonsense has been spoken about two sector flights by current management, which completely contradicts what I was told personally by a previo
186 cchan : I would be a bit worried if NZ ties up with one of those larger middle east airlines. They have a very large network, but also the potential and the
187 Kaiarahi : That's called hearsay. No different than BBQ conversations.
188 Post contains links macilree : Parliamentary Select Committee is looking at New Zealand competition law as it affects the international airline industry. See the report: http://www.
189 Post contains links mariner : My opinion is not based on anything said by Air NZ management, other than in general terms. I am less and less enthused about very long haul flying -
190 BlackLabel : From a reasonable representation of frequent travelers. I don't hear many with positive things to say about NZ, and the previously especially fanatic
191 aerorobnz : I would argue that CZ in the NZ market are well down that path, Their hard product exceeds the current CX product to AKL on the 343. Now that they ha
192 mariner : That may well be, and I'm pleased to hear it if it is so. mariner
193 Kaiarahi : Believe me, I'm sorry too, having started with my first flight on the Coral Route in 1958. I'll really miss the cabin crew whom I've come to know ove
194 mercure1 : Seems to me the future of ANZ is the Pacific basin, not running multi-leg flights to Europe. Like it or not, Europe is the past, and Asia is the futur
195 Post contains links ZKOJH : ''Waikato's trans-Tasman hopes fade'' Waikato's chances of luring a trans-Tasman airline to replace Virgin Australia are almost zero, travel and airli
196 aerorobnz : Good. come bak when there is a population to sustain these provincial airports. what HLZ needs is a railway link direct to AKL...
197 HLZCPH : That will never happen, best to hurry up and get the 4 lane road completed. The shuttle van guys do well to and from Hamilton, see plenty of them on
198 aerorobnz : Agreed, but only because the half-wits who supposedly run this country have no vision, no ambition to improve this country from a third rate island n
199 Post contains links ZKOJH : interesting the QR are talking to Airbus about an order for 24 x Airbus A330's for the delay in there 787's with delivers as early as the 2Q of 2013 !
200 aerorobnz : Yes probably they would have fit very well given the appropriate foresight, especially if negotiated with the 320 domestic fleet - Given that the pac
201 DavidByrne : . . . but without the capacity increase that the City Rail Link would bring to the network, any Hamilton service, even if it was remotely passably ec
202 Post contains links rjm717 : In response to 'strong demand', HA has now announced that AKL will be operated by A332 aircraft when the service starts next March, instead of the pre
203 aerorobnz : HLZ maybe should be trying to attract SQ Cargo, Atlas/QF, DHL, Fedex and try growing themselves as a cargo hub/destination first - there is plenty of
204 Post contains links ZKOJH : MODs (inc NZ1) please LOCK now number 120 is up, thanks New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 120 (by ZKOJH Oct 2 2012 in Civil Aviation)
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 117 posted Sat Jul 7 2012 23:32:50 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 113 posted Sun Apr 1 2012 20:04:42 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 112 posted Mon Mar 5 2012 01:43:47 by PA515
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 111 posted Thu Feb 23 2012 01:11:57 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 109 posted Wed Jan 25 2012 20:47:36 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 108 posted Sat Dec 31 2011 15:27:47 by NZ1
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 107 posted Tue Dec 6 2011 11:53:44 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 106 posted Tue Nov 15 2011 16:40:03 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 105 posted Tue Nov 1 2011 21:37:35 by NZ1
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 104 posted Fri Oct 21 2011 05:28:19 by cchan
New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 105 posted Tue Nov 1 2011 21:37:35 by NZ1