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Unconfirmed: Austrian To Restart VIE-ORD  
User currently offlineAustrianZRH From Austria, joined Aug 2007, 1408 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 10036 times:

A usually well-informed source in the Austrian Aviation Net forum reported that OS is to restart VIE-ORD using a Boeing 767-300ER starting May 2nd, 2013. The destination should be bookable by Sept 26th, 2012.

http://austrianaviation.net/phpBB3/v...c.php?f=41&t=6505&p=190023#p190023
German forum post.

Maybe this time it lasts............


WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2796 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9857 times:
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I think it will work just fine this time around. One of Austrian's main markets are the Balkans whose citizens can travel much easier to the US at this point.
I know LOT made a lot of money by attracting Serbs to fly with them to Chicago.

Does anyone know where the aircraft will come from?


User currently offlineIrishAyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2245 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9860 times:

Fingers crossed:

However, OS doesn't strike me as a very strong/stable airline, which leads me to speculation on this one...



next flights: jfk-icn, icn-hkg-bkk-cdg, cdg-phl-msp
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2796 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9802 times:
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Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 2):

Well they are owned by Lufthansa, that is enough reassurance for me.  


User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1642 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9717 times:

It may help that OS is now technically "VO d/b/a OS" - perhaps the lower cost structure makes this work where the old legacy OS cost structure a couple years ago when they cancelled it wasn't doable. Just a thought.

User currently offlineIrishAyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2245 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9710 times:

Quoting ju068 (Reply 3):
Well they are owned by Lufthansa, that is enough reassurance for me.  

Umm. Have you been not reading the news lately? Luthansa's outlook is far from positive.

The strike activity reportedly cost the airline EUR100 million in lost revenue. Over 1,737 cancelled services that affected upwards of 180,000 people last week.

Meanwhile, OS has restructured (somewhat) but the carrier doesn't expect to be profitable before 2013. They should probably achieve that step before re-venturing on costly long-haul routes that have been tried before.



next flights: jfk-icn, icn-hkg-bkk-cdg, cdg-phl-msp
User currently offlinejcwr56 From United States of America, joined Jul 2012, 545 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9666 times:

There was an article not too long ago with the OS president stating ORD was one to be restarted with two other U.S cities for S13.

A 767 would work, anything larger and there would be gating issues. The last time OS operated ORD, they were forced downsize equipment in order to operate at the times they wanted and were gated on M20 and M21.

If this is true, then we should be seeing a press release sooner than later.


User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2796 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9625 times:
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Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 5):

Yes but the market between the Balkans and Chicago is huge and it got even bigger now that the US government eased the visa requirements. This was not the case the last time they operated this flight.

As mentioned above Austrian had taken some steps to restructure so I guess we should wait and see what happens.


User currently offlineLOWS From Austria, joined Oct 2011, 1192 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9580 times:

Great news for me, but where the aircraft are coming from is the question.

If I recall correctly, they only have one spare plane in the longhaul fleet. So, are they going to cancel somewhere else or will they acquire some 763s or 772s?


User currently offlinesweair From Sweden, joined Nov 2011, 1834 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9557 times:

Will they go for the 788 in the future? A good 763 replacement. Or maybe a 789 cold replace both 763and the 772?

User currently offlineIrishAyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2245 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9537 times:

Quoting ju068 (Reply 7):
Yes but the market between the Balkans and Chicago is huge and it got even bigger now that the US government eased the visa requirements. This was not the case the last time they operated this flight.

Just because it is huge does not mean it is high-yielding.

The other question that OS has to answer is where their value proposition lies. As is, ORD is VERY well connected to the Balkans through existing services on Star Alliance partners via hubs at FRA, MUC, DUS, ZRH, WAW, CPH, ARN etc. etc. What can the market support beyond these existing services, and is there room for OS?



next flights: jfk-icn, icn-hkg-bkk-cdg, cdg-phl-msp
User currently offlineaznmadsci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3716 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9521 times:

Quoting jcwr56 (Reply 6):
There was an article not too long ago with the OS president stating ORD was one to be restarted with two other U.S cities for S13.

Let the speculations begin! I say SFO and IAH    While SFO has a higher probability, what other airport would OS be eyeing? MIA?



The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
User currently offlinesweair From Sweden, joined Nov 2011, 1834 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9508 times:

I see one big advantage with Vienna, its not an over crowded mega hub, if I can I try to avoid the big hubs, I just don't like the chaos at FRA or CDG,LHR..

User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1642 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 9427 times:

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 10):
The other question that OS has to answer is where their value proposition lies. As is, ORD is VERY well connected to the Balkans through existing services on Star Alliance partners via hubs at FRA, MUC, DUS, ZRH, WAW, CPH, ARN etc. etc. What can the market support beyond these existing services, and is there room for OS?

Room, not necessarily, but it's location that seals the deal for VIE. WAW and VIE are ideally suited to focus on eastern and southeastern Europe traffic, which can then pull that traffic from FRA, MUC, ZRH, ARN, etc. and leave them for the stuff like USA-FRA-TXL for which VIE is less well suited. So yes VIE can (and does) provide a valuable and convenient gateway to those areas. In addition:


Quoting sweair (Reply 12):
I see one big advantage with Vienna, its not an over crowded mega hub, if I can I try to avoid the big hubs, I just don't like the chaos at FRA or CDG,LHR..
Quoting aznmadsci (Reply 11):
Let the speculations begin! I say SFO and IAH While SFO has a higher probability, what other airport would OS be eyeing? MIA?

There was some discussion a few months' back about LAX, but that boiled down to probably being a bit out of reach given OS's resources and financials. My guess would be that LAX would the strongest for O&D, but SFO and IAH would of course provide connectivity. But I would put LAX and SFO as possibilities with IAH as possible but highly unlikely.


User currently offlinekyrone From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 126 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 9198 times:

Good luck on try 3.. ( I believe its the third) I wonder if they will work locally with LH for cost management and depart out of T1

User currently offlineWROORD From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 976 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 9092 times:

Quoting kyrone (Reply 14):
Good luck on try 3.. ( I believe its the third) I wonder if they will work locally with LH for cost management and depart out of T1

As they say third time is the charm. I do hope it works for them this time especially that they have backing of LH.

Quoting LOWS (Reply 8):
If I recall correctly, they only have one spare plane in the longhaul fleet. So, are they going to cancel somewhere else or will they acquire some 763s or 772s?

They can reduce frequency somewhere else to come up with 3-4 weekly flights to ORD. Is this going to be operated by Tyrolean flight? Not sure why they do not change the name like Swiss did with crossair?

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 10):
The other question that OS has to answer is where their value proposition lies. As is, ORD is VERY well connected to the Balkans through existing services on Star Alliance partners via hubs at FRA, MUC, DUS, ZRH, WAW, CPH, ARN etc. etc. What can the market support beyond these existing services, and is there room for OS?

They are one of the few airlines serving places in Iraq, but how much demand there is to this region beyond TK via IST?
Also with LO starting a new 787 product to ORD in February 2013 - others will have to revamp their offering to stay competitive.


User currently offlinejcwr56 From United States of America, joined Jul 2012, 545 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9047 times:

Quoting kyrone (Reply 14):
Good luck on try 3.. ( I believe its the third) I wonder if they will work locally with LH for cost management and depart out of T1

Probably not, considering LH and LX don't share management locally at ORD (like AF and KL ). I'm sure OS would bring in their own management and outsource to a 3rd party like LX does for passenger service. For MX, I would say yes, they would use LH.

As for T1, it could work but will UA give up a 767 gate for their own departure at a peak time to accommodate OS? Outside of LH, there is not one * member that departs from T1 in the afternoon or evening.

I'm on a wait and see mindset with this rumor as I spoke with the former OS manager here at ORD and he was surprised OS would try again.


User currently offlineSemaex From Germany, joined Nov 2009, 833 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7110 times:

Quoting LHCVG (Reply 13):
But I would put LAX and SFO as possibilities with IAH as possible but highly unlikely.

To be honest, I don't see any of those destinations in the OS network for some time. For starters, both SFO and IAH are served via FRA by the LH A380, either full time or seasonal, and I like to think that the parent company is keen on filling up the big jet rather than opening up a new route just for the Balkan traffic.

Quoting WROORD (Reply 15):
Is this going to be operated by Tyrolean flight?

As far as I know from now on all OS flights are "operated by Tyrolean", including long-haul.
Or if you like it the other way around, all aircraft that Tyrolean/Austrian Arrows own are "operated for Austrian Airlines".



// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.
User currently offlineSemaex From Germany, joined Nov 2009, 833 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6183 times:

//edit for last post//

LH serves IAH with the 748i of course. Nonetheless the argument is still valid: Such a big aircraft needs to be filled with passengers, and I doubt OS can simply open up a route to IAH which would in fact compete with the LH mothership.



// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2796 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6168 times:
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Quoting Semaex (Reply 18):

Hence why it makes more sense to open Chicago since they have a wide network across eastern Europe and the Balkans.


User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8517 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6154 times:
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For a European Star alliance airline flying to Chicago is a natural. Why they ever stopped is a mystery.

User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1642 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5576 times:

Quoting Semaex (Reply 17):
To be honest, I don't see any of those destinations in the OS network for some time. For starters, both SFO and IAH are served via FRA by the LH A380, either full time or seasonal, and I like to think that the parent company is keen on filling up the big jet rather than opening up a new route just for the Balkan traffic.

That's why I qualified my statement - I don't think any of them is especially likely, but in relative terms, SFO and LAX are far more likely than IAH to see OS service I'd think.


User currently offlineLH422 From Germany, joined Sep 2010, 423 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5544 times:

Quoting Semaex (Reply 18):
LH serves IAH with the 748i of course.

No, you mixed that up with IAD. IAH is A388, IAD is B748.


User currently offlineclrd4t8koff From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 225 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4390 times:

What about BOS....what are the chances they'd be a contender for service, if summer only? I think a 763 would be a perfect aircraft for BOS-VIE.

User currently offlineMAV88 From United States of America, joined May 2011, 183 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 3 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4328 times:

I am surprised MIA does not have year round service to VIE at at least 4-5 times a week.

25 IrishAyes : Because this is an industry with razor thin margins. It doesn't matter if OS is affiliated with Star Alliance; that doesn't mean that a nonstop fligh
26 ju068 : But what if Lufthansa is purposely investing in Austrian Airlines and expanding their network because of the mess that is happening in Frankfurt, and
27 jcwr56 : Here's more...the marketing folks from the city weren't aware of this "rumor" and they're attending the Routes summit next week. OS isn't going to be
28 IrishAyes : Doubtful. LH's plans for Austrian have been much more focused around intense restructuring, which has led to a noteworthy turnaround. Nevertheless, t
29 AustrianZRH : VIE vs ZRH numbers from 2011: passengers: 21,106,292 vs 24,337,954 aircraft movements: 246,157 vs 279,001 cargo: 277,784 t vs 415,035 t. From the bas
30 Post contains images Ty134A : As for the aircraft, they can pick up as many LH aircraft as they want. They had a LH 343 this summer doing DXB, a LH 733 as well as an Augsburg E9? S
31 ju068 : So basically Austrian's future longhaul fleet will consist only of B777-200s? Can they fill them on all the routes?
32 os787 : jcwr56, Did you hear anything more from the city or from any of your other contacts @ ORD? In Austrian aviation circles indications are getting stron
33 LOWS : Yes, I saw that as well. It seems that when AA posts something, it is more or less confirmed. Also, in an OS email today, they confirmed they will be
34 jcwr56 : Unofficially my email to OS was answered with, please wait until 11OCT. (That's the deadline for S13 schedule submissions) so we'll know one way or a
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