traveladdict From Malaysia, joined Feb 2009, 45 posts, RR: 0 Posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 6020 times:
I was just wondering how airlines decide on which terminal they fly to at LHR. Do they pay different prices for different terminals? So would an airline specifically choose a "cheaper" terminal if they were trying to spend less money? Or would they simply get assigned to a terminal without a choice? I tried googling this but it's pretty hard to find a direct answer, so I hope someone could answer this for me. Thanks.
SKAirbus From Norway, joined Oct 2007, 1526 posts, RR: 2 Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5961 times:
Terminals are generally operated as such and I don't think price has too much to do with it:
- Terminal 1 - Star Alliance + British Airways (ex-Bmi), Icelandair and some others.
- Terminal 3 - One World + Virgin Atlantic + Emirates + Singapore Airlines + Air Canada and some others.
- Terminal 4 - Sky Team + Non-alined airlines (middle eastern carriers etc).
- Terminal 5 - IAG (British Airways & Iberia)
Basically the terminals are loosely arranged by alliance with quite a few exceptions. Terminal 4 only has two A380 ready gates whilst Terminal 3 has 4 so it couldn't cope with Emirates for example who has multiple A380 departures a day.
The new Terminal 2 will be a Star Alliance hub when it opens in 2014 and will be built with a number of A380 ready stands so I imagine there will be further consolidation.
I also expect that British Airways will try and consolidate operations from Terminal 1 (it shuts in 2014) to either T5 and/or T3 and will probably move long haul flights to SIN/BKK/SYD to Terminal 5 when the JSA with QF finishes next year or wait for T5D to be constructed (if it happens).
Still a lot of change to come!
Next Flights: LGW-GVA (734-BA), GVA-LHR (319-BA), LHR-OSL (320-BA), OSL-LHR (320-BA)
skipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 2841 posts, RR: 1 Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 5655 times:
BA, pre IAG negotiated with BAA for exclusive use of T5. Years ago, they were originally supposed to have T4 all to themselves but BAA screwed them over on that one, BA do pay more for T5 as the facilities are much better.
The new T2 will cost more for airlines to use than the old T2, as the old T2 was due to make an appearnce with Tony Robinson on Time Team. Given the soon to be tennants, the STAR carriers are not Ryanair, this was negotiated and agreed that charges would be higher.
skipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 2841 posts, RR: 1 Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 5514 times:
It's simple market economics and BA does not have a monopoly at LHR. It has less in % terms off slots than AF at CDG, KLM at AMS or LH at FRA. Terminal 2 will be just as good as Terminal 5 once it is completed, and you must realise that BAA must get a return on it's multi billion pound investment in new facilities.
qf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2776 posts, RR: 2 Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 5388 times:
BA has their own terminal because it:
- Facilitates smoother connections, which has long been a major issue for BA at LHR (ie I did a domestic-international transfer in January that took all of 12 minutes -- I would have missed my connection had I needed to transfer terminals and would likely have been stuck there for 24 hours).
- Allows greater control over the customer experience on the ground.
- Allows the airline to save a lot in operational costs -- having a single centralised operation (and a smaller secondary one) is far cheaper than have 3-4 small operations (I'm referring to things like lounges, baggage systems, check-in facilities/staff etc).
- Allows BA to offer a far nicer facility to their customers than other airlines -- that's an advantage.
BA isn't paying to keep the competition away, they are paying for the advantages of the new facility. If other airlines had been prepared to pay more then they could have had the space instead.
You also have to remember that there is a significant beneift to BAA in BA being centralised. It was a good thing for the airport as a whole to take BA out of the smaller terminals and put them in one spot.
My bet is that BA only pays as much as Star carriers will pay for T2 once that is finished. Those facilities will be as good, if not better than T5 is.
LH might not have a dedicated terminal at FRA, but BA is hardly unique in having a dedicated space. SQ has SIN T3 to themselves, the US airlines all have dedicated terminals all over the place, EK has T3 at DXB, QF has T3 domestic at SYD. There are countless further examples. It makes sense for the large/dominant airline to consolidate their operations where they can and BA is no different.
Only if BA agree to it (there have been constant rumours of a QF or JL move, for example). Of course, there will also be an expiry date on the contract for the terminal, at which stage the conditions could be renegotiated. I doubt anybody else will want to use T5 by that time though, once T2 is finished and a potential rework of T3 is underway.
Jean Leloup From Canada, joined Apr 2001, 2110 posts, RR: 21 Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 5279 times:
When Terminal 2 is done, will there be room for Air Canada there, to join the other Star carriers? Seems odd now having them in Terminal 3 instead. Having said that, I know almost all AC traffic to LHR would be O&D, so proximity to other Star carriers for connections is less important...
VV701 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 7069 posts, RR: 17 Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 5205 times:
Heathrow Airport Ltd charges are standard.
There is a Landing Charge which varies with the registered MTOW of the aircraft.
There is a parking charge for each 15 minutes or part thereof that varies with the size and position of the stand (remote or airbridge).
There is a per passenger handling charge.
Parking charges apply to all parts of the airport excepting the BA Maintenance area at the east end of the airport that belongs to BA (leased or owned? - I am not sure). So airlines (like QF and SA) park their aircraft that spend a long time on the ground at LHR in the BA maintenance area as they are charged less than Heathrow Airport Ltd would charge them to park on a remote stand.
Quoting qf002 (Reply 11): - Allows the airline to save a lot in operational costs -- having a single centralised operation (and a smaller secondary one) is far cheaper than have 3-4 small operations (I'm referring to things like lounges, baggage systems, check-in facilities/staff etc).
BA has never had the luxury of operating from a single LHR terminal.
Before T5 opened they operated out of T!, T3 and T4 (but not T2).
After T5 opened they "centralised" operations out of T3 and T5 (but not T1 or T4).
After the formation of IAG IB moved all their flights to T5.
With the take over of BD, BA now operates out of T1, T3 and T5 (but not T4). There is little if any possibility of BA ceasing to operate out of any of these three terminals in the forseeable future. T5 is too small for them to even contemplate moving all their flights into it. Indeed without significant internal changes T5 does not have large enough facilities to handle the combined domestic passenger volume of BA and BD that will become the domestic passenger volume of BA alone 28 October.
On the plus side (for BA) it sits on the users committees of three of the four current LHR terminals. It can therefore "keep an eye" on what its competitors are doing or planning at LHR excepting only the Sky Team and independent carriers operating from T4.
Wingtips56 From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 274 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 months 21 hours ago) and read 4827 times:
Quoting finnishway (Reply 12): I still would like to know is it possible that other airlines would move their operations to T5 at some point?
Not likely. T5 is full, and even BA can't get all of their flights there. They still have to use T1 and T3 for some operations. I have to transfer BA to BA, T5 to T3 next month, which takes a fair amount of time.
[Edited 2012-09-19 17:00:14]
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines
skipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 2841 posts, RR: 1 Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 months 21 hours ago) and read 4816 times:
Quoting VV701 (Reply 15): So airlines (like QF and SA) park their aircraft that spend a long time on the ground at LHR in the BA maintenance area as they are charged less than Heathrow Airport Ltd would charge them to park on a remote stand.
QANTAS used to daystop a single B744 at the #1 Maintenance Base but that stopped once the A380s came. They are just parked up on 596 / 595 most days. The daystopping Cathay no longer gets towed across but the new daystopping SQ B77W does park on the old BeaLine base. I imagine BA charge a fee but it would be less than BAA.
Quoting VV701 (Reply 15): Heathrow Airport Ltd charges are standard.
Are you absolutely sure? I was told that airlines in the older terminals paid less as facilities were much more basic than the newer ones.
Yeah it's busy, not sure it's "full". Last few flights I have taken, on departure there was evidently enough room at T5 to take three more B744s at certain times of the day, i.e. the ex JSA Australian flights would fit into T5 at the relevant times of the day.