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United Channel 9 - Why Never Used?  
User currently offlineDesertFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 515 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 15519 times:

So perhaps never is an overstatement, but with SFO as my home airport, United is currently my airline of choice. One of the best things I like about flying with UA is Channel 9. However I have literally yet to be on a flight in 2012 where it is enabled. I finally asked the crew on my flight JFK-SFO if they would mind asking the captain about it, and after asking, they said he doesn't want it enabled on this flight. Why are UA pilots doing this? It's one of the things that make their airline unique and add to the passenger experience.

44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineN766UA From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 8269 posts, RR: 23
Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 15522 times:

Quoting DesertFlyer (Thread starter):
Why are UA pilots doing this?

Because it's an easy way to get in trouble if there's a company officer or FSDO guy in the back. It exposes them unduly.

I do like having it, though.



This Website Censors Me
User currently offlinekaitakfan From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 1588 posts, RR: 6
Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 15506 times:

A few reasons. CH 9 is at pilots discretion and being deep in contracted negotiations there is no need to go above and beyond the required job duties. No channel 9 is a common complaint that is being reported and its just a small tactic of the pilot group to show unity. And another reason is CH 9 has caused issues with passengers complaining about safety concerns when they really had no idea what was going on. So, for those that are all about CYA... off CH 9 goes. I imagine you will be hearing alot more live ATC when the new JCBA is voted in.

User currently offlineDesertFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 15375 times:

It's times like this that remind me why I stopped training to be a commercial pilot after my PPL. Too many old, burnt out pilots in the industry. Especially at UA, AA, and US East.

User currently offlinefrosty328 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 15106 times:

Quoting kaitakfan (Reply 2):
Because it's an easy way to get in trouble if there's a company officer or FSDO guy in the back. It exposes them unduly.

Company officer? I don't know what you mean by that. ALPA and the pilots would have never agreed to have Ch 9 if there weren't some protections for the crew.


User currently offlinefanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1608 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 14940 times:

Well you could always fly Delta, connect to the Wifi and listen to any air traffic control station with the LiveATC app. And even though DL says Gogo doesn't work under 10,000 feet, it works just fine all the way to landing   The only time gogo doesn't work is right after takeoff to 10,000 ft. It's a good secondary option. And WiFi is on every domestic plane with F class and soon to be on the international fleet.


"FLY DELTA JETS"
User currently offlineCoairman From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 117 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 14843 times:

I flew UA969 from CLE to FLL on last Monday on a 757-2 which had channel 9 turned on. The pilots were most professional and had a great attitude. In fact the captain even mentioned it in his initially PA announcement about that channel 9 is available for listening.

I flew last spring from LAX to CLE on an Airbus which had channel 9 turned on.


All the flights on PMUA metal had channel 9 turned on.



Patience Can Be A Virtue.
User currently offlinehhslax2 From Bahrain, joined Jan 2012, 127 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 14620 times:

Lots of them don't turn it on, since they can't lie to passengers about delays (if they happen). I've had 2 occasions where pilots have said times they thought it would take to get through sorting out minor issues encountered on taxi to ATC, then told passengers over the intercom a time that was less than half what they told ATC. Both occasions, the times told to ATC were correct.

User currently offlinegaystudpilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 453 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 14450 times:

I keep it turned on.

User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5822 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 14237 times:

Quoting gaystudpilot (Reply 9):

I keep it turned on.

I can't help but look at your user name, then look at your comment, and chuckle a little bit!  


Anyhow, I've found channel 9 to be active on about 50% of my UA flights this year. Granted, the last time I flew a legacyUA aircraft was in May. Since then, UAX and sCO.


User currently offlineyowza From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 4892 posts, RR: 15
Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 13979 times:

I'm told that UA pilots often turn C9 off over Latin America to avoid alarming the passengers with some of the ATC exchanges they might hear in that particular airspace.

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
User currently offlinefloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2015 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 13814 times:

It's so interesting to read on here that people find Ch 9 shut off a lot. I've flown 32 flights on UA in the past year, so not a ton, but not too little either and it has been turned on on every sUA mainline aircraft I've been on.


Good goes around!
User currently offlineRICBWI From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 86 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 13662 times:

From my experience from a lot of flying on UA this year it is on about 2/3 of the time. Perhaps conicidently, it seems to be on most often on my Airbus flights and off on the 757/767 flights.

User currently offlinefutureualpilot From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2602 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 13000 times:

Quoting hhslax2 (Reply 8):


Lying does nothing, but we don't always give you the full story because its unnecessary information. An average passenger that hears "there's an issue with the fuel totalizer" translates that I to we're gonna run out of fuel and plummet to fiery death. If we just say "it's a gauge malfunction" we're still keeping pax informed but without raising false alarm. Let the pros do their job, as a paying passenger you deserve my utmost attention to safety and professionalism but that does not entitle you to know every detail of some issue that pops up. Occasionally ATC requires additional details for their own purposes. As far as projected wait times, you don't have the information available to you that the pilots do, so give the, the benefit of the doubt. Between their ATC interaction and the cabin address, things could've changed. I've had it happen. Perhaps there was a range (I.e. 5-10min) and they gave ATC a worst case scenario for planning purposes while remaining optimistic for the passengers. I wasn't there, and you weren't in the flight deck so jumping straight to the crew lying to you does you, or them no favors.

As far as channel 9 goes, it's Captain's discretion and in today's litigious society where people overreact to all things aviation and airlines happily sell their pilots down river I don't blame crews for keeping it turned off. I don't know UA's policy or protections on Ch 9 usage but if I were given the option to make ATC comms available for my passengers, I would do so happily as long as I had solid protection in the event things went south. My career isn't worth Ma or Pa Kettle suing me because I said something to ATC they misunderstood, misinterpreted or blow out of proportion.

[Edited 2012-09-27 09:15:41]

[Edited 2012-09-27 09:16:33]

[Edited 2012-09-27 09:19:04]


Life is better when you surf.
User currently offlineNorcal773 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 1447 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12504 times:

I agree, I've had it turned on on ONE UA flight in 2012 and I've flown them at least once a month. Disappointing but ooh well!

Quoting yowza (Reply 11):

I'm told that UA pilots often turn C9 off over Latin America to avoid alarming the passengers with some of the ATC exchanges they might hear in that particular airspace.

This actually brings up a good point. Earlier in the year, I flew a UA 747 HKG-SFO and where it was turned on from time we started taxiing but the pilot got into an argument with ground control in HKG after they asked UA to let an LH 744 go around us and take off then ATC tried to change take-off runway on UA which made the pilot very un-happy. Channel 9 was turned off for a few minutes while the argument continued (I assumed) because we sat there for 20 minutes while other planes went around us but they turned it back on right before take-off roll began. On the long flight to SFO, channel 9 was turned off over Japan Airspace but other than that it was on throughout. Good stuff, especially when we lined up to land on 28L at SFO with a company 757 lined up for 28R and ATC's warning not to pass the 757 and eventually had to do a go-around after the 747 couldn't slow down enough to stay behind the 757. LOVE Channel 9.



If you're going through hell, keep going
User currently offlinevgnatl747 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 1513 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12377 times:

Channel 9 has been turned on for approximately 80% of my sUA flights. I've also found that politely asking the FA if it's available when they come around during boarding typically results in it being turned on. Obviously it's pilot discretion, but I've never had a problem on any of the A320 flights I've done with sUA. There's a female captain (older lady, her name slips me), that frequently does IAD-RDU... and she's always turned it on upon request if it wasn't on.

I doubt it's part of the flight deck checklist to look to see if it's turned on. My assumption is that if a pilot earlier in the day turns it off and nobody checks it, the ones who normally would have it on may just assume it is. Some pilots (especially those who announce it as part of their welcome) may check it when they get board, but I'm sure most don't.



Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
User currently offlineNorcal773 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 1447 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12250 times:

It's also worth noting that Legacy UA pilots turn it on more than CO pilots do so the A320s have a higher chance of it being on than the 737s.


If you're going through hell, keep going
User currently offlinevgnatl747 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 1513 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 12224 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 17):
It's also worth noting that Legacy UA pilots turn it on more than CO pilots do so the A320s have a higher chance of it being on than the 737s.

How many of the 737s even have the system installed?



Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5822 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 11460 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 17):

It's also worth noting that Legacy UA pilots turn it on more than CO pilots do so the A320s have a higher chance of it being on than the 737s.

What??? NONE of the 737's are yet equipped with this feature, so you're correct in saying that more UA pilots use it, but you're NOT correct in your reasoning behind it.... nice try, though.


User currently offlinetommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 11344 times:

EWR-LAX on a ex-CO 764 had channel 9 on, PMUA 757 LAX-EWR also did as well. This was earlier this month.

Having said that, my other UA flights this year didn't have it on.



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently onlineDualQual From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 769 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 11190 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 16):
It's also worth noting that Legacy UA pilots turn it on more than CO pilots do so the A320s have a higher chance of it being on than the 737s.

There are only like 1-3 L-CAL airplanes that have channel 9 and they are all 764's. Not one 737 has the system installed.

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 19):
EWR-LAX on a ex-CO 764 had channel 9 on


User currently offlinefrosty328 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 10497 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 14):
Lying does nothing, but we don't always give you the full story because its unnecessary information. An average passenger that hears "there's an issue with the fuel totalizer" translates that I to we're gonna run out of fuel and plummet to fiery death. If we just say "it's a gauge malfunction" we're still keeping pax informed but without raising false alarm. Let the pros do their job, as a paying passenger you deserve my utmost attention to safety and professionalism but that does not entitle you to know every detail of some issue that pops up. Occasionally ATC requires additional details for their own purposes. As far as projected wait times, you don't have the information available to you that the pilots do, so give the, the benefit of the doubt. Between their ATC interaction and the cabin address, things could've changed. I've had it happen. Perhaps there was a range (I.e. 5-10min) and they gave ATC a worst case scenario for planning purposes while remaining optimistic for the passengers. I wasn't there, and you weren't in the flight deck so jumping straight to the crew lying to you does you, or them no favors.

As far as channel 9 goes, it's Captain's discretion and in today's litigious society where people overreact to all things aviation and airlines happily sell their pilots down river I don't blame crews for keeping it turned off. I don't know UA's policy or protections on Ch 9 usage but if I were given the option to make ATC comms available for my passengers, I would do so happily as long as I had solid protection in the event things went south. My career isn't worth Ma or Pa Kettle suing me because I said something to ATC they misunderstood, misinterpreted or blow out of proportion.

GREAT POST! I couldn't agree with you more.


User currently offlinefrosty328 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 10453 times:

Quoting vgnatl747 (Reply 15):
This actually brings up a good point. Earlier in the year, I flew a UA 747 HKG-SFO and where it was turned on from time we started taxiing but the pilot got into an argument with ground control in HKG after they asked UA to let an LH 744 go around us and take off then ATC tried to change take-off runway on UA which made the pilot very un-happy. Channel 9 was turned off for a few minutes while the argument continued (I assumed) because we sat there for 20 minutes while other planes went around us but they turned it back on right before take-off roll began. On the long flight to SFO, channel 9 was turned off over Japan Airspace but other than that it was on throughout. Good stuff, especially when we lined up to land on 28L at SFO with a company 757 lined up for 28R and ATC's warning not to pass the 757 and eventually had to do a go-around after the 747 couldn't slow down enough to stay behind the 757. LOVE Channel 9.

Channel 9 is tied into VHF #1. That's it. When you're overwater, the crew is communicating over HF, not VHF. Thats why you never heard anything for a long time.


User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 949 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 10138 times:

PEK-ORD two weeks ago had it on...great way to pass the time 'though I couldn't understand much of what PEK's departure control was saying!


Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlineadxmatt From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 951 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 9372 times:

United does have a facebook page for Channel 9 buffs...

https://www.facebook.com/pages/United-Airlines-Channel-9/122279311177994?ref=stream


25 adxmatt : The Facebook page is NOT run by United but someone who enjoys CH9
26 Coairman : I flew a CO 737-8 from TPA to CLE today equipped with Direct TV. There is no channel 9 available yet. Channel 9 will probably will have to be integrat
27 Post contains links dnguyen7078 : Way too many times that I fly to Asia and channel 9 did not get turn on so I bought one of the passive Airband monitor from Ramsey electronic and asse
28 Viscount724 : I'm not aware of any airlines that permit use or personal radio receivers while inflight, assuming you are implying that you use it during flight rat
29 Post contains images Norcal773 : Easy now, that I didn't know.. I assumed it is installed because it is an option on the CO's 737 when scrolling down the menu. Not sure why I got quo
30 Antoniemey : I listened to Channel 9 for the first time on Wednesday night/Thursday Morning on UA315 from SFO to IAH. It was interesting. The Captain actually made
31 VC10er : I fly United metal a lot, 55 flights this year so far, (mostly heavy international) and not once was Ch9 on. Yesterday I was on a lovable old 767 clun
32 Post contains images SonomaFlyer : Looking at the pic on Amazon with the transistors showing, I can see TSA misunderstanding what that thing is and giving someone an up close and perso
33 Norcal773 : So I just got off a UA A320 IAH-SMF and no channel 9. looking at the United Magazine, the menu says channel 9 'from the flight deck' is available on U
34 adxmatt : Ch9 is installed on sCO B767-400's when they get the modification to lie flat seats and AVOD. I'm not sure if the pilot group has approved it's use ye
35 United1 : It was on on my A320 flight from EWR-MCO last week....I haven't heard it on any of my P.S. flights in a while. Wonder when they will roll it out to th
36 CONTACREW : One A.netter here, Tommy767 I believe mentioned CH9 being turned on his recent EWR - LAX, or was it LAX - EWR (I forget which) 764 flight.
37 dnguyen7078 : It's a passive band so there is no frequency tuning. Therefore it pass for use in flight. I've been using it for 4 months now through SFO and LAX. Ha
38 turk0167 : I've had 10 United flights this year. Channel 9 was turned on 0 times!
39 DesertFlyer : First I would like to apologize for starting this thread in a bit of an angry mood. UA have always safely delivered me where I need to go. It's too ba
40 calpilot : You are correct that it is tied to VHF1. However, we use that radio for air to air communications; and written policy is to turn off Chnl9 during tha
41 tommy767 : You are correct sir. A reconfigured 764 on EWR-LAX indeed had channel 9 on when I switched the AVOD to the moving map screen. However these are likel
42 calpilot : Yes, we in the -400 community can use it as is comes online. It has been told to us that in future aircraft MX overhauls, it will be addressed.
43 CONTACREW : Correct so far only the reconfigured 764s have CH9.
44 tozairport : After my second FAA investigation regarding what a passenger thought they heard on channel 9 versus what actually happened, for me it is off forever.
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