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Aircraft Branding: Does It Make A Difference?  
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Posted (2 years 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 7415 times:
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Since I work at Landor I would say absolutely. Branding is one of the most powerful assets a company has, just look at what Ford did to get financing!

Please let's NOT turn this into A vs B thread.

IMO, Boeing are experts at branding, to the degree IMO the branding of their aircraft models makes a difference to fleet managers to CEO's to the average person. Starting 50 years ago with the 707, which set the branding / nomenclature convention of the 7X7 series. It peaked with the 747, the most famous airplane ever. If I stopped a person on the street and asked "quick, give me a name of an airplane?" a vast majority of people, anywhere, would say "747!". Yes, she was an astonishing airplane when she launched and captured the awe of millions. But the brand "747" (the asset) is probably worth billions. The same holds true to a lesser extent for a 737 or 767, but it says "Boeing" without even saying "Boeing".

I vividly recall the fanfare around the launch of the 777. Airlines made such a big deal when the got their first 777. United promoted it like crazy, UA even made their own logo for the 777 and all the FA's wore 777 pins. When VARIG got their first two, GRU and GIG were plastered with giant posters using their own 777 symbol.

The best so far is "Dreamliner" IMHO. It works for the Exec suite of airlines (look at how Smisek bangs on and on about the 787) and it works for the consumer. Boeing got "consumers" excited about this aircraft via branding it so well that I believe it has had a big impact on airline CEO's and fleet managers and people. The airlines keep the Dreamliner logo in their livery. "Dreamliner" hats off to the person that came up with such a powerful and effective name.

Airbus, IMHO has done a poor job from the start...(again IMHO) with the name "Airbus" a bus that flies? Everyone hates the bus- such a crowded and slow way to travel. I believe they again missed an opportunity to brand well their very, very fine airplanes. The A380 was a big game changer, a big leap in aviation, yet it was given such an unmemorable moniker of A380. Would something like "A400 flying Resort" (my bad name just to make a point) have made her a more exciting airplane? The excitement it deserves! One thing I find very interesting is that Lufthansa has made a much bigger deal over the 747-800 than they did over the A380?! Again, I believe a reinvented "747-800" has more traction with consumers than a hard to remember A380. (although clearly not enough or we would have seen more orders)

So, I put my opinion out there, now what is yours? I am interested in your opinion...does aircraft branding make a difference. Done well, does it sway airline purchase decisions? I know airlines have a "pure logical" approach as to what they need and what aircraft best meets their needs, but they are people too and IMHO believe they are swayed by sexy marketing as well. Not to the degree where they chuck mission specs out the window, but Back to Smisek (for one) is very "chuffed" (as the Brits say) about his new Dreamliner. Another question is how much does a "image driver" aircraft factor in at fleet planning?

Deepest thanks to all my A.net friends


The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
49 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBirdwatching From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 3823 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7317 times:

I think the most important factors when deciding on an aircraft for the fleet are economics, price, safety, support and all those things. The name and branding are hardly worth a lot. If your theory was true, airlines would all buy 747s instead of 777s and so on. 747 the most valuable brand in the world? And only a handful of airlines are interested in the 747-8? Something doesn't add up. In my opinion, as long as you don't brand your product "Crashliner" or something like that, it has little relevance. As if the customer had a choice anyway. There are enough childish people here on this board who say "if it ain't Boeing then I'm not going", what do they do if there is a last minute equipment change? Stay behind? Pretty stupid imo.

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):
Airbus, IMHO has done a poor job from the start...(again IMHO) with the name "Airbus" a bus that flies?

Airbus sounds like it's cheap and good value. In today's airline industry, probably a better selling point than Dreamliner.

Soren   



All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 7309 times:

I think branding does help with airline customer relations. EA painted a giant "757" on the tails of their B-757s, NH paints a giant "787" on the sides of their B-787s. Look how many airlines carry a smaller "Boeing 777-300ER", "Boeing 747", "Airbus A-320", etc. on the aft side panels.

User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7241 times:
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Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):

I didn't say 747 is the most valuable brand name in the world. Just that its worth billions and has highest top of mind share among the gen pop. I would assume Apple or Google would be way ahead in terms of "in the world" or perhaps "Coca-Cola". I also aknowledged mission specs are more important. But IMHO branding your product well in any catagory works, and to a "degree" even aircraft models.



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7208 times:
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Also I think the saying "if it ain't Boeing, I ain't going" is very cute. I think it's value is in the rhyme of "Boeing and Going". Perhaps before Airbus had established a good reputation it had some real meaning, but it is SO old.

Today I think people are fine on anything from the majors. And heck, tens of millions of passengers fly Embraer with no issue. It's a name that only sounds good in Portuguese (to my ear).



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlinedynamicsguy From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 873 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7196 times:

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):
The A380 was a big game changer, a big leap in aviation, yet it was given such an unmemorable moniker of A380

This is purely anecdotal, but at least with the public you may be right about the branding here. I work for Boeing, and when I mention this to almost anyone without an interest in engineering they will mention the A380 and ask whether I worked on it. But very very few actually will mention it by name, and more often than not they don't even know that there's another company building airliners which isn't Boeing. There's certainly plenty of awareness about the product, but the brand hasn't sunk in.

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):
Again, I believe a reinvented "747-800" has more traction with consumers than a hard to remember A380.

The branding can't be that good, since it's the 747-8 and not the 747-800.  


User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7126 times:
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Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 5):

Oops, my bad about the 800!

I do think the masses know of the giant double decker but given it's unworthy branding people only know of it but can't recall it. A380 is just not sticky. I am really surprised that people don't know that their are 2 major aircraft companies.

Do your friends know of the 787 Dreamliner? And if so, know what makes it different?



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7101 times:
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Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 5):

What do you do at Boeing? I'm curious, are there internal programs for employees to help them rationally and emotionally engadge with the Boeing corp brand and Boeing products?



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 3071 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7044 times:

Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 5):
There's certainly plenty of awareness about the product, but the brand hasn't sunk in.

But in this case, I would argue the product is the brand rather than the producer.

People might not be interested in flying Airbus A380, but are interested in flying the A380, and "A380" is the name that is being advertised.

Secondly, if a passenger has a good experience on the A380, they will recognize all the brands that start with "A3**", so advertising the plane as A380 could be better for the rest of their planes. People see A320 or A330 and link it to the A380. That might not have been the case if it was the "Flying Resort" or similar.

Furthermore, the A380 brings attention from simply being the largest airplane in the world. People think, "Wow what is that plane" and learn the name A380. Boeing on the other hand have a less spectacular airplane (to the general public), it is a regular sized tube with wings, while most wouldn't know about the advances it has brought forward. Therefore, when the plane itself would not turn heads like the A380 did, Boeing did well to advertise it through the name.

So, I would say both have branded their airplanes strongly, Airbus more easily as the plane practically branded itself, while Boeing have put the name "Dreamliner" out there.

-CXfirst



From Norway, live in Australia
User currently offlinedynamicsguy From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 873 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7039 times:

Quoting VC10er (Reply 6):
Do your friends know of the 787 Dreamliner?

That's usually how this starts but maybe I don't help myself there. When I say that I work on the 787, they ask whether it's the big double-deck airplane. I don't usually use the "Dreamliner" name right away because I think it's a bit naff. They do often recognise the name, but not much more. They know nothing about the size, they know nothing about it being the new airplane, they know nothing about the composites. I should stress that this is the reaction from non-technical people.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 7):
What do you do at Boeing? I'm curious, are there internal programs for employees to help them rationally and emotionally engadge with the Boeing corp brand and Boeing products?

I work as an engineer in structures. There's not really anything about promoting Boeing externally in particular. There is a fair emphasis on reinforcing company values and ethics.


User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 3071 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7003 times:

Here's something interesting regarding branding.

If you go on the Emirates website and then go to their fleet section, you'll see:

Boeing 777-300ER
Boeing 777-300
Boeing 777-200LR
Boeing 777-200
Airbus A340-500
Airbus A340-300
Airbus A330-200

and

Emirates A380

Not "Airbus A380". That says it all when it comes to A380 branding. It is the aircraft airlines want to be associated with.

-CXfirst



From Norway, live in Australia
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6973 times:
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Quoting CXfirst (Reply 8):

I agree with that. It's called the "halo effect" the A380 nomenclature will rub off on an A330 or A321. The 7x7 does the same. IMHO the 7x7 system is more catchy 737, 757, 767, 747, 777, 787 - it's simple, and has the benefit of 50 years. But I think any average person will mostly recall 747 over all others. Maybe even be able to ID a 747 due to its famous shape. Especially baby boomers who remember all the "Airport" movies  



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlinepetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3369 posts, RR: 12
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 6954 times:

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 8):
People might not be interested in flying Airbus A380, but are interested in flying the A380, and "A380" is the name that is being advertised.

Exactly. There are a lot of companies that put their product branding ahead of corporate branding.

For isntance, most people will know about Magnum and Cornetto icecream. But no one will say they want a "Ola Cornetto" or a "Ola Magnum", and let's not even get started on Unilever, the company that owns Ola. Most people will have heard about Unilever, but few people will actually realise just how much comes from them. Same for other large companies like Nestlé, or Henkel.



Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineCOEWR787 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 337 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6852 times:

Quoting VC10er (Reply 11):
I agree with that. It's called the "halo effect" the A380 nomenclature will rub off on an A330 or A321. The 7x7 does the same. IMHO the 7x7 system is more catchy 737, 757, 767, 747, 777, 787 - it's simple, and has the benefit of 50 years. But I think any average person will mostly recall 747 over all others. Maybe even be able to ID a 747 due to its famous shape. Especially baby boomers who remember all the "Airport" movies

I agree. Aditionally, for the older baby boomers I think the introduction of the 707 was a more momentous and memorable event than the introduction of the 747. The fact that the 7x7 moniker ties together everything starting from the dawn of the jet age to the most current is definitely a positive for that set of branding.


User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2912 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6822 times:
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Quoting petertenthije (Reply 12):

Companies like Unilever, Nestlé, P&G, Diageo all allow their brands to lead and don't wish to build their corporate brands with consumers unless the corp entity brings positive equity to the consumer brand. Johnson & Johnson would be the exception as their name stands for trust and safety. Mostly the only time when the giant consumer products companies develop well defined corporate brands are for B2B and the investment community. With the exception of today's need for transparency, the Internet and consumers have forced behemoth companies to be better corp citizens.

It's different in passenger airliner branding. A & B are not FMCG companies. They sell "BIG ticket products. To the point made about Emirates website and fleet list, an airline will often boast about having the A380 or 787 to boost their brand image (United and the 787) but in the end, consumers will evaluate the airline first. United may have 50 787's, but without repairing their brand, the 787's won't help at all.



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlinebreiz From France, joined Mar 2005, 1917 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6768 times:

What's in a brand? Certainly what you imagined and wanted to convey, not necessarily what the others see and understand.
"747" is a catchy name, in English, 7-4-7. In my own language it is less catchy: seven hundred and forty seven.

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):
If I stopped a person on the street and asked "quick, give me a name of an airplane?" a vast majority of people, anywhere, would say "747!".


And it is right, but because the 747 has been around for quite a long time, and a lot of toys were made representing the 747. A380 has some catch-up to do.
By the way, many know the "Jumbo Jet" but have no clue if it is a Boeing, a Mercedes or what ever.

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):
Airbus, IMHO has done a poor job from the start...(again IMHO) with the name "Airbus" a bus that flies?


That*s a typical US reaction, not a European one. Since you work at Landor, remember that we are all different and that for a brand to work, it has to relate to the local culture.
You win some, you loose some: Airbus was first to paint the type of their ac vertically on the fin. Guess what, Boeing followed suit.


User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6633 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
747 the most valuable brand in the world?

Coca-cola is the most valuable in the world, by a long shot, but that wasn't the OP's point. He was just saying that the 747 brand has value (true) and that it's the most well recognized among airlines (almost certainly true).

It's not the only one though; Concorde still has a brand despite being retired for years.

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
Airbus sounds like it's cheap and good value. In today's airline industry, probably a better selling point than Dreamliner.

Branding is all about the customers' customers (the passengers)...they want safety and security, and maybe speed. It's the airlines that want value.

Quoting VC10er (Reply 7):
are there internal programs for employees to help them rationally and emotionally engadge with the Boeing corp brand and Boeing products?

They do exist but, like dynamics guy said, they're not particular internal. Boeing has been pushing the "One Boeing" brand for several years now (basically since McNearney took over) and most of that stuff is available inside and outside the company. The Boeing video production folks are terrific and are very good at maintaining consistent messaging/look/feel across the communication products. They have a pretty good youtube page: http://www.youtube.com/boeing

These are some of my favorites:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKMsR...EDECDF6&index=5&feature=plpp_video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kRVj...6FD3CF7&index=3&feature=plpp_video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzof3...6FD3CF7&index=4&feature=plpp_video

Tom.


User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5463 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6591 times:

Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 9):
I don't usually use the "Dreamliner" name right away because I think it's a bit naff.

Calling a 787 a "Dreamliner" seems like something ridiculously out of date. Every all-too-common disappointment in travel will invite mockery of the name.



I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlinebabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6515 times:

Some airlines have given silly titles to their aircraft range like 'Big Top' or 'Mega Top 'which means nothing to me, 'Luxuryliner' to AA aircraft which means nothing especially since it isn't luxury.

Airbus have been very sensible in their naming. This is an A320. This is an A321. There's logic. Boeing have gone for the name, 'Dreamliner'. What dream? If the ride isn't comfortable, like most economy classes, it's makes a mockery of the name and the branding is silly.

I'm a fan of the sensible naming approach.


User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6483 times:

Quoting VC10er (Reply 11):
Especially baby boomers who remember all the "Airport" movies

The first one featured the iconic B-707 (Airport), and was the most realistic of all the Airport movies, and there was also one that featured the Concorde. All the rest featured the famous B-747. People equated it to a strong airframe based on some of the sillyness of some Airport movies, like surviving a mid-air collision (Airport '75), and keeping the passengers alive after one sank in the ocean (Airport '77).

The one featuring the Concorde evading air to air missiles and F-4 fighters was probibly the dumbest plots of all the Airport movies (Airport '79).

[Edited 2012-09-30 09:34:00]

User currently offlineneutrino From Singapore, joined May 2012, 611 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6479 times:

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 8):
Furthermore, the A380 brings attention from simply being the largest airplane in the world.

The A380 is the largest airliner in the world, it is NOT the largest airplane in the world.
Just being pedantic  



Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis
User currently offlinecaribb From Canada, joined Nov 1999, 1637 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6447 times:

I just spoke to a bank VP last night.. said he loved flying on the Dreamliner.. I said wow nice, which airline? He said Emirates.. I said Emirates isn't flying Dreamliners. He said: oh it was the big double decker thing.. I responded, ah the A380 yes. He said oh right,.. who makes the Dreamliner? I said Boeing.. he said ..and who makes the A380?..

Yes marketing seems to matter to the average person even if they are totally unaware...

[Edited 2012-09-30 09:38:04]

User currently offlineKC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12150 posts, RR: 51
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6408 times:

Quoting babybus (Reply 18):
Airbus have been very sensible in their naming. This is an A320. This is an A321. There's logic.

What about the A-300-600ST "Bulgua"? The A-318 (and sometimes the A-319) is also known as the "Baby Bus".


User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3362 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (2 years 22 hours ago) and read 6145 times:

Quoting babybus (Reply 18):
Some airlines have given silly titles to their aircraft range like 'Big Top' or 'Mega Top 'which means nothing to me, 'Luxuryliner' to AA aircraft which means nothing especially since it isn't luxury.

AA discontinued the use of the LuxuryLiner moniker nearly a decade ago for the exact reason you cite.

I'll agree that the A380 designation isn't as ingrained in the public consciousness as the 747. When people find out I'm a pilot, they ask if I want to fly the new double decker airplane, but not once has anyone asked for the A380 by name.


User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 24, posted (2 years 22 hours ago) and read 6082 times:

Quoting babybus (Reply 18):
Boeing have gone for the name, 'Dreamliner'. What dream?

Well, it's the first Boeing in a long time that was very explicitly designed to provide a better passenger experience than its predecessors (as the A380 was for Airbus). Whether that merits its own name is up for debate but, having actually flown them a lot, I certainly appreciate the effort that Boeing put in.

Tom.


25 iFlyLOTs : I think that if you look at branding of types of planes, Lear did the best. People who know very little or nothing about planes will be near an airpor
26 BMI727 : I don't think it makes any difference to fleet managers, since they are more concerned with other factors. And for the public, I think that it has mo
27 type-rated : I think your average person flying today doesn't even notice how many engines are on an airplane, let alone who made it. To most, an airplane is an a
28 TJCAB : LOL, settle down now. I am with you on that. Remember, it was pure entertainment for the masses. At least they used the same aircraft type for the in
29 Post contains images DocLightning : It's obvious from airlines' and OEMs' actions that what the flying public think of the aircraft matters to them, even if only a little. If it did not
30 BMI727 : Their iconography isn't even theirs. They swiped the logo from McDonnell Douglas in the merger, who swiped it from Douglas and it goes back to at lea
31 Post contains images Darksnowynight : Worked fine that company from Southern California, you know, the one with the Death Cruiser series? I'll bet they've probably financed about 70% of t
32 Post contains links dynamicsguy : The MD part of the logo certainly, but you can't argue that the logo doesn't contain their iconography. The "BOEING" in stratotype font dates back to
33 caribb : I totlly agree and I've had the exact same conversation with my friends and colleagues. the best they can do is identify the airline. Most don't know
34 Braybuddy : I agree with some of your points, and disagree with others. Boeing, IMHO, certainly picked a winner with the 7X7 designation, even if it came about by
35 Post contains images DocLightning : Well, it is now! Yes, but in that sense, Boeing is just as bad. With the 727, the -100 was the first (and smaller) aircraft and the -200 was the seco
36 Post contains images lightsaber : I'm going to disagree on the branding *except* for the 747 and 'THE Airbus.' My non-aviation friends really couldn't tell you anything, except they th
37 KC135TopBoom : Doc, you may have forgotten, but there was a B-747-500/-600/-700, but they never left the paper they were drawn on. They also had different lenght fu
38 Post contains images DocLightning : Was it not the original intention for the A300 to carry 300 passengers? I thought that's how it got its designation. As in many such arbitrary things
39 Braybuddy : You're right Doc, of course, and by the time they shrunk it the designation had stuck. Pity they didn't rename it the A200, then used A100 for the A3
40 Post contains images DocLightning : Possibly. But it should have been 747-8 and 747-8-F. OK, it REALLY should have been the 747-500 and -500-F. Why don't they listen to us in Seattle? I
41 OzarkD9S : From a purely nostalgic point of view, today's aircraft branding pales in comparison to some from yesteryear: Elizabethan Comet Electra Vanguard Visco
42 Viscount724 : Totally agree. A few people may say they want to fly on a certain aircraft type they may have heard about, but when it comes to making the purchase d
43 HNL-Jack : This is so smart. Emirates is appealing to the high end market, where service and prestige are so important. The Emirates A-380 captures the mystic o
44 Post contains images YVRLTN : Personally, I really fail to see why "747" or "737" is so much more brilliant than "A380" or "A320". If anything, the A tells folk its an Airbus witho
45 Post contains images DocLightning : -SkyCorp/SkyCo (I like it; although it's a bit hokey ) -Aerospatiale -EA or EAe (European Aerospace) -SkyShip (or at least call their models that) Bu
46 Post contains images YVRLTN : C'mon, just as tacky The Brits, Germans, Dutch, Spanish & Belgians probably didnt like that BAe (soon to be formed) probably didnt like that Airs
47 Post contains images neutrino : If that's the case, then they got it backwards...should be i747-8 instead Its Airbus cos they want to be ahead of Boeing in the pecking order, alphab
48 MasseyBrown : Initially, I was put off by the name because 1)buses are perhaps the least appealing intercity transport in the US and 2) Eastern Airlines, short of
49 BMI727 : They should have just done what American companies have done and named it like a law firm. Called it Hawker Breguet Nord or something.
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