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Delta To Increase CDG/AMS Services In 2013  
User currently offlinepanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4974 posts, RR: 25
Posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 15259 times:
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http://news.delta.com/index.php?s=43&item=1724

Highlights:

- Resumption of EWR-CDG nonstop (previously operated by AF and did not run in 2012)
- Resumption of seasonal BOS-CDG on DL metal (in addition to regular 2x AF metal)
- 2nd ATL-CDG on DL metal; total four daily (2x AF; 2x DL)
- 2nd JFK-AMS (seasonal) on DL metal
- DTW-CDG on DL metal extended to year-round from seasonal; from 763ER to A333

Flat-bed product to be available on CDG-JFK; CDG-EWR; CDG-CVG, and CDG-SEA.

75 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16907 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 15059 times:

Nice to see EWR-CDG, would still prefer Air France back but this is still an improvement.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineCoronado From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 1213 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14963 times:
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To me it Iooks like they have been busy prioritizing fleet enhancements to dedicate the updated 763's from EWR to Europe so they can offer same level of service to their clients as on the 764's from JFK to LHR. I think there are enough business people in the NY metro area that may actually book an outbound flight from JFK after a day at the office and then choose to return intoto EWR on a Sat because they live on that side of the Hudson river, or alternatively choosing to take the PATH to EWR on a Wed evening and fly into JFK on Saturday because you live out on the Island.

[Edited 2012-10-05 06:42:12]

[Edited 2012-10-05 06:43:21]


The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14981 times:

EWR-CDG----Better product and better f/a than AirFrance   Can't wait to work it.
I'm looking forward to showing our new customers on this route Delta's legendary service!


User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 3258 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14895 times:

I appears that DL is committed to CVG-CDG long-term. I haven't heard yet if MEM-AMS will in fact resume seasonally in 2013.

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26150 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14657 times:

Interesting comment from Glen Hauenstein, EVP Network and revenue.

“This expansion will have little effect on overall trans-Atlantic capacity discipline as Delta continues to reallocate seats into high-demand business travel markets.”

So sounds like DL will reshape its Atlantic network to refocus on these partner hubs, and reduce direct service to secondary markets as it appears the overall planned capacity will remain tapered.

Good move imo. Stick to your strengths



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6789 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14614 times:

Arrrgh!! And still no RDU-CDG service! Ohh.. the humanity..


Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineTWA1985 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 651 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 14619 times:

I wonder what will happen at ORD? I know there was speculation that Air France will soon announce full withdrawal from Chicago, with Delta taking the ORD-CDG route over, perhaps year-round.

User currently offlineclrd4t8koff From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 225 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14547 times:

Quoting panamair (Thread starter):
- Resumption of seasonal BOS-CDG on DL metal (in addition to regular 2x AF metal)

Funny, there's another thread going on right now regarding DL's next focus now that NYC is well covered, and in that thread someone mentioned BOS which was QUICKLY diminished and regarded as nonsense. Now, before anyone starts to dash my hopes that my hometown airport IS seeing a growth spurt by DL, I understand this is only seasonal. However, it's still growth and with the state of AA (the other domestic operator with CDG service from BOS), I think this is a great move and one that could lead to perhaps either an upgauge of equipment or even year round service.

Looking back just 4-5 years ago Delta had a very slim international presence @ BOS - Halifax, Toronto, Bermuda, Cancun to now a decent European mix as well (AMS, LHR, CDG), which isn't too shabby. I doubt it'd be much more growth, but I'm hopeful to what the future holds for DL @ BOS.


User currently offlinethegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2311 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14256 times:

Any news about RDU-CDG?


Our Returning Champion
User currently offlinefactsonly From Montserrat, joined Aug 2012, 1005 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14258 times:

Delta's reference to adding DL #70 in Summer 2013 on JFK-AMS surprises me. This flight is already operating JFK-AMS in Summer 2012 and will operate in Winter 2012/2013:

SUMMER 2012:
- dep. 1800 JFK - arr. *0725 AMS KL0642 777 daily
- dep. 1805 EWR - arr. *0750 AMS DL604 767 daily
- dep. 2040 JFK - arr. *1025 AMS DL70 767 daily
- dep. 2255 JFK - arr. *1210 AMS KL0644 74M daily

WINTER 2012/2013:
- dep. 16:25 JFK - arr. 05:55 AMS DL 70 A333 daily
- dep. 17:45 JFK - arr. 07:10 AMS KL 0642 B777 daily
- dep. 19:05 EWR - arr. 07:50 AMS DL 34 B767 Tue, Wed, Thu, Fri, Sun
- dep. 23:50 JFK - arr. 12:00 AMS KL 0644 B74M daily

What are we missing here?

I assume a new flight number will operate at 20.40 and Flight 70 will depart at 16.10.

[Edited 2012-10-05 08:24:52]

User currently offlineROSWELL41 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 803 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14223 times:

Any word on resuming BDL-AMS?

User currently offlinecessna2 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 350 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 14218 times:

Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 9):
Any news about RDU-CDG?

Other than I think its the first time DL has thrown darts at a dartboard and pulled one out before starting the route, no.


User currently offlineJohnJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1689 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14138 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 4):
I haven't heard yet if MEM-AMS will in fact resume seasonally in 2013.

Delta.com shows MEM-AMS returning May 1, 2013. I know the online schedules are often placeholders, particularly this far out - is that the case here?


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7968 posts, RR: 19
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14097 times:

Quoting panamair (Thread starter):
Flat-bed product to be available on CDG-JFK; CDG-EWR; CDG-CVG, and CDG-SEA.

I wonder, is this going to be a B764 operating the CVG flight then? Or an A330/772 or something larger than they are using now?

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 4):
I appears that DL is committed to CVG-CDG long-term

Well as per a contract with P&G they kinda have to. I stated previously that if DL stops this route another carrier (AF most likely) would take this route. P&G has some sort of contract in order to shuttle people between europe and their headquarters in Cincy.



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently onlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6535 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14037 times:

[

Quoting clrd4t8koff (Reply 8):
nd in that thread someone mentioned BOS which was QUICKLY diminished and regarded as nonsense.

I was the someone who mentioned BOS and you are right that the idea was quickly diminishwd as nonsense


User currently offlineANA787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 342 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 14004 times:

Hope the rumored PDX-CDG service will be announced soon!

User currently offlineCoronado From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 1213 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 13869 times:
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Quoting bobnwa (Reply 15):
I wonder, is this going to be a B764 operating the CVG flight then? Or an A330/772 or something larger than they are using now?

Elsewhere I believe I read that up to 9 763's have completed mods into the flat bed international configuration. I think this is part of the announced plant to update all 150 aircraft used to international flying to full flat bed in J. The last ones that will get this update will be the A330's.



The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 13648 times:

Quoting clrd4t8koff (Reply 8):
Now, before anyone starts to dash my hopes that my hometown airport IS seeing a growth spurt by DL, I understand this is only seasonal.

Unfortunately, I think this is more of DL expanding CDG rather than them expanding BOS. I think after B6 moved in, DL's days at BOS were numbered. I'd love to see DL build up BOS, however!



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 13592 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 18):
Unfortunately, I think this is more of DL expanding CDG rather than them expanding BOS. I think after B6 moved in, DL's days at BOS were numbered. I'd love to see DL build up BOS, however!

Exactly...

Is Delta "focusing" on PIT or ORD or EWR? Just because they have an international flight there to a JV HUB doesn't mean much.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineHVNandrew From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 13132 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 18):
Unfortunately, I think this is more of DL expanding CDG rather than them expanding BOS. I think after B6 moved in, DL's days at BOS were numbered. I'd love to see DL build up BOS, however!
Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 19):
Is Delta "focusing" on PIT or ORD or EWR? Just because they have an international flight there to a JV HUB doesn't mean much.

DL certainly is not as strong as they used to be at BOS, but it's still a very strong station for them, especially considering that DL basically shut down its focus city operations over the past few years. I think it is DL's largest non-hub station (depending on how one would clasify LAX), and one of a very few cities one could still call a focus city in any US legacy network. There's international service to AMS, CDG, BDA, and YUL; mainline to all the hubs (sans MEM) and MCO; the Shuttle to LGA; and still some P2P routes left over on DL Connection. Probably the biggest change at BOS for DL over the last few years has been the elimination of a glut of Connection P2P routes and the hacking of the mainline leisure routes to Florida, LAS, etc. Florida especially is where one sees the biggest B6 impact.


User currently offlinefloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2018 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 13018 times:

Quoting HVNandrew (Reply 20):
There's international service to AMS, CDG, BDA, and YUL

Don't forget LHR  



Good goes around!
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12849 times:

Quoting HVNandrew (Reply 20):
but it's still a very strong station for them, especially considering that DL basically shut down its focus city operations over the past few years. I think it is DL's largest non-hub station (depending on how one would clasify LAX),



That you are right it is still a very strong and important station for Delta. And we don't have to tip toe around the classifications   LAX is not a hub for DL as they don't even call it a hub. It's just a gateway at the end of the day. As far as non-hub stations I think you're right. It's LAX then BOS if i'm not mistaken as far as departures.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineIrishAyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2241 posts, RR: 15
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12746 times:

Quoting ROSWELL41 (Reply 11):

Any word on resuming BDL-AMS?
Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 9):
Any news about RDU-CDG?

Don't think there will be, unfortunately. I know that BDLAMS was a pmNW experiment that Delta didn't care to continue. Definitely a worthy effort, but I suppose that Delta would rather concentrate on BOS and JFK rather than include O&D from BDL in the mix.

RDUCDG never left the ground (no pun intended). Given that several years have lapsed since both of these sectors were announced, I don't think the signs look promising for their resumptions.

Kind of similar to PDX, I would imagine that a single flight to Europe is about as much as a RDU can support.

This...

Quoting TWA1985 (Reply 7):
I wonder what will happen at ORD? I know there was speculation that Air France will soon announce full withdrawal from Chicago, with Delta taking the ORD-CDG route over, perhaps year-round.

....on the other hand, I am curious to know about!



next flights: jfk-icn, icn-hkg-bkk-cdg, cdg-phl-msp
User currently offlinerafflesking From Singapore, joined Mar 2007, 314 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12743 times:

Does anybody know the specific AF changes mentioned in the release? PHL hasn't had any Skyteam transatlantic service in a little while (I can't remember if discontinued a year or two years ago). AF ran the route for years (most recently with A330s) but service was transitioned to Delta 757s a few years ago.

User currently offlinedelta764 From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 44 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 12578 times:

In response to rafflesking-

Delta ran a 763 on the PHL-CDG a few times. I flew a return from CDG on the 763. I think basically it operates with a 752 though. Glad to see DL increasing service to CDG and AMS for 2013. Even though I love to see DL in all the secondary European markets, I think its a wise decision to shift that responsiblity to the skyteam members. I bet SEA will eventually go to a 332 or 333. I assume DL will still operate the 2nd daily AMS service from SEA with a 763.

On another note, I wonder if DL will try and build NRT with any new service from the US. I could see the SCL service returning. Would a 2nd JFK or LAX service work?


User currently offlinepanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4974 posts, RR: 25
Reply 26, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12191 times:
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Quoting factsonly (Reply 10):
I assume a new flight number will operate at 20.40 and Flight 70 will depart at 16.10.

Yes...in this way, they will have flights for JFK-AMS pretty much every two hours between 1600 and 2300...

Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 9):
Any news about RDU-CDG?
Quoting ROSWELL41 (Reply 11):
Any word on resuming BDL-AMS?
Quoting ANA787 (Reply 16):
Hope the rumored PDX-CDG service will be announced soon!

None of these will be happening next year...otherwise they would have included them in this press release. Some of these CDG routes (e.g., PHL, PIT) are already thin enough, they'd do better to focus getting those right first before taking up more thin routes....

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
I wonder, is this going to be a B764 operating the CVG flight then? Or an A330/772 or something larger than they are using now?

No, I believe CVG-CDG will remain a 763ER, just that by next summer, they will have many more of them converted to flat-beds and nose-to-tail AVOD.


User currently offlineIrishAyes From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2241 posts, RR: 15
Reply 27, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12346 times:

Quoting delta764 (Reply 25):
Even though I love to see DL in all the secondary European markets, I think its a wise decision to shift that responsiblity to the skyteam members.

Ha ha ha. I wonder how the nAAsayers are reacting to this given that this has become AA's tactic over the years. I'd argue that connecting on BA at LHR is still probably better than ANY connection via Charles de Gaulle.



next flights: jfk-icn, icn-hkg-bkk-cdg, cdg-phl-msp
User currently offlinealitalia744 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 4763 posts, RR: 44
Reply 28, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12086 times:

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 27):
Ha ha ha. I wonder how the nAAsayers are reacting to this given that this has become AA's tactic over the years. I'd argue that connecting on BA at LHR is still probably better than ANY connection via Charles de Gaulle.

With the concentration of all AF flights now in 2E/2F/2G connections should be much smoother/efficient than in years past. CDG is hellbent on improving their pax experience as is AF.



Some see lines, others see between the lines.
User currently onlinetommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6933 posts, RR: 9
Reply 29, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 11377 times:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 19):

Well in the case of EWR: CDG was a long time AF spoke destination. NW operated the AMS services for years, and DL grandfathered it into the merged network as a 763. The EWR-CDG is quite welcomed, and stoked to see it available on Delta.

PIT has a good amount of DL presence, ORD is definitely more than both PIT and EWR. DL has over 50 flights a day from O'Hare.

That makes two euro routes from EWR on DL: AMS and CDG on 763s respectively.

Not sure if EWR would become a focus city for DL (can't see them doing it like they do currently from say RDU) but if CDG is successful I wouldn't put it past DL to take over EWR-FCO from Alitalia at least seasonally.

Now if DL could ever try out again EWR-LAX...



"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 30, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 11332 times:

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 27):
Ha ha ha. I wonder how the nAAsayers are reacting to this given that this has become AA's tactic over the years. I'd argue that connecting on BA at LHR is still probably better than ANY connection via Charles de Gaulle.

Um I wouldn't call this DL's strategy based off one route announcement (this one.) DL still has a huge TATL network, they're merely adding flights to ST partners. When you see them start slashing a whole slew of ATL and JFK routes and replace them with flights to AMS/CDG, you may have a point. (And yes, I know DL has downsized some TATL flying lately but that is mostly due to Europe's economy)



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineFlyASAguy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 31, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 11035 times:

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 29):
Now if DL could ever try out again EWR-LAX...

If they refuse to run RJs on DEN-LAX which is a huge hole for them, I don't see EWR-LAX.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 32, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 10982 times:

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 29):
EWR-FCO

I highly doubt it, AZ really isn't too involved in the JV. I'd see DL adding flights to FCO from other cities before I'd see them add it from one of UA's largest hubs

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 29):
EWR-LAX

Maybe, but I think it would mostly be a flight for LAX than a flight for EWR

I don't see why DL would go head to head with UA @ EWR when they have a very large and good operation at LGA and JFK



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineusdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1010 posts, RR: 2
Reply 33, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 10759 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90:
(And yes, I know DL has downsized some TATL flying lately but that is mostly due to Europe's economy

I won't list all that's gone, but I will say much of has to do with the price of fuel (making ATH/ZRH seasonal, eliminating BUD/LYS/CPT), American fear of the Middle East in a time of crisis (CAI/AMM), passenger and crew safety (ABV) and too few business travelers in certain markets (IEV/OTP/possibly BUD as well). The issue at hand is filling big planes out of JFK to non-connect markets on the other side of the pond. You need very good fares and strong demand to make that work.


User currently offlinejporterfi From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 447 posts, RR: 0
Reply 34, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 10739 times:

I'm glad DL is starting this service. Before this, the only service that truly warranted DL classifying CDG as a hub (other than AF service) was its service to SEA and seasonal service to BOS, ORD, PHL, and PIT. I'm really glad to see new service from EWR to CDG on DL, and am curious how successful that route will be. Are all of the new routes going to be operated with 763s, or will they upgauge to a 764, 330, or 77L for some of them?

User currently offlinegoldorak From France, joined Sep 2006, 1872 posts, RR: 4
Reply 35, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10040 times:

Excellent news for EWR-CDG. Altough, I will regret AF on this route, DL option is better than no Skyteam option at all.

Quoting TWA1985 (Reply 7):
I wonder what will happen at ORD? I know there was speculation that Air France will soon announce full withdrawal from Chicago, with Delta taking the ORD-CDG route over, perhaps year-round.

The last rumors are that AF will be back for the summer season (as this year), but who knows...See one of the last post in this thread
AF 787s Future Routes (by LY777 Sep 30 2012 in Civil Aviation)


User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9700 posts, RR: 14
Reply 36, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 9987 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 5):

So sounds like DL will reshape its Atlantic network to refocus on these partner hubs, and reduce direct service to secondary markets as it appears the overall planned capacity will remain tapered.

not really. For the summer Delta plans on most of its ATL/JFK-Europe to be back. The only add is EWR-CDG which can be canceled out by ORD-CDG going back to AF. Glenn was just saying they wont be doing any (much) TATL growth for S13. Something I expect to be pretty much across the board unless some Oneworld carriers are looking to add capacity again.....for whatever reason.  
I think you will see Delta keep a nice network to Europe in the summer, with a nice chunk going away in the winter. I think the cuts will be thinner when the Euro economy gets better.

Quoting factsonly (Reply 10):

yes.

Quoting clrd4t8koff (Reply 8):

how is adding a seasonal flight they had last year back growth?

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 29):

Now if DL could ever try out again EWR-LAX...

would be nice, but i think they are focused on JFK-LAX.

Quoting FlyASAguy2005 (Reply 31):

If they refuse to run RJs on DEN-LAX which is a huge hole for them, I don't see EWR-LAX.

FWIW i think that was more due to lack of 70 seat capacity with the shift to all 70 seaters and LGA build up. I truly expect it to be given a true shot once they get more 76-seater capacity in the system.



yep.
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 7
Reply 37, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9705 times:

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 36):
FWIW i think that was more due to lack of 70 seat capacity with the shift to all 70 seaters and LGA build up. I truly expect it to be given a true shot once they get more 76-seater capacity in the system.

I hope so. It's a huge hole for the LAX network. 3-4 CR7s/CR9s would be just fine to start with a gradual build up. Just like they did with LAS. Plenty of options to get the snow birds to HI or onward connections to SYD (granted IDK what the local market is) and Asia. DEN is a fairly sizeable station for DL albeit to hubs but plenty of flights so I know there's some sort of following.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9700 posts, RR: 14
Reply 38, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8936 times:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 37):

I hope so. It's a huge hole for the LAX network. 3-4 CR7s/CR9s would be just fine to start with a gradual build up. Just like they did with LAS. Plenty of options to get the snow birds to HI or onward connections to SYD (granted IDK what the local market is) and Asia. DEN is a fairly sizeable station for DL albeit to hubs but plenty of flights so I know there's some sort of following.

agreed. IMO DEN is the biggest hole now. (next up would be that city that Delta use to love but now hates....it'd be in Texas)
I do think we will see a few 700s sooner or later.



yep.
User currently offlineB777ER From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 548 posts, RR: 0
Reply 39, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 8742 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 30):
Um I wouldn't call this DL's strategy based off one route announcement (this one.) DL still has a huge TATL network, they're merely adding flights to ST partners. When you see them start slashing a whole slew of ATL and JFK routes and replace them with flights to AMS/CDG, you may have a point. (And yes, I know DL has downsized some TATL flying lately but that is mostly due to Europe's economy)

Ask any NYC 7ER DL pilot

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 36):
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 5):

So sounds like DL will reshape its Atlantic network to refocus on these partner hubs, and reduce direct service to secondary markets as it appears the overall planned capacity will remain tapered.

not really.

LAXintl has it right. Ask any Delta NYC 7ER pilot and they will agree as well. Due to the European economy DL is starting the process of retrenching to the big hubs, AMS and CDG (exception being FRA/LHR) with onwards connections via AF/KL. The NYC 7ER based guys would agree very much with LAXintl. That is the downside of the new contract they signed...outsourcing of more flights to codeshare partners.


User currently offlineFFlyerCDg From France, joined May 2010, 32 posts, RR: 0
Reply 40, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 8396 times:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 3):
EWR-CDG----Better product and better f/a than AirFrance   Can't wait to work it.
I'm looking forward to showing our new customers on this route Delta's legendary service!

Would be really curious to know why DL product is better than AF...
Maybe I missed something and you're now offering a wide choice of newspapers in Y class ?
Or complementary cocktails ?
Or a wide choice of movies... ?
And I don't want to be rude and won't mention anything about the so friendly DL f/a  ))


User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 41, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8017 times:

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
you're now offering a wide choice of newspapers in Y class ?

Depends on your definition of "wide". We usually offer a choice of three.

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
Or complementary cocktails ?

Yes in BE and EC. Free Beer/wine in YC

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
Or a wide choice of movies... ?

over 50 movies/tv

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
why DL product is better than AF...

True layflat seats with all aisle access in BE and AVOD in Y/C .

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
And I don't want to be rude and won't mention anything about the so friendly DL f/a &nbsp Wink)

but you did.  
Tell you what, give the flight a chance and then tell us your experience. I hope to change your mind.
There is a great group of F/A's who can't wait to work this flight and know how important it is.


User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1790 posts, RR: 7
Reply 42, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 7992 times:

IMHO DL is hoarding cash in the event AA has assets for sale or the creditors force them into Chapter 7. A MIA or DFW turnkey operation would be a godsend. If history is any hint, many AA people would still have jobs which would be great. That's the way they did it at Pan Am.


Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlineDelimit From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 1513 posts, RR: 2
Reply 43, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7573 times:

1. Is someone really bringing up the pilots as if they have special knowledge of the company's strategic direction? Don't we all know better by now?

2. LHR vs CDG: so I fly Ito LHR on AA. How easy is that transfer for me?

3. The DL FA's are way better than their being given credit for. They are the equals of AF. Easily.


User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 44, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7545 times:

Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
And I don't want to be rude and won't mention anything about the so friendly DL f/a &nbsp Wink)
Quoting cokepopper (Reply 3):
Better product and better f/a than AirFrance  

My original comment was just light hearted competitive fun. Nothing more.


User currently onlinetommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6933 posts, RR: 9
Reply 45, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7513 times:

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 42):

That's a theory but if AA went chapter 7 I'm sure DL is more than willing to snatch up 30-40 738s from AA over the MIA hub.



"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 46, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7432 times:

Quoting B777ER (Reply 39):
Ask any NYC 7ER DL pilot

Um pilots are probably the worst source of information, this site kinda proves it. Not saying that I'm right and they're wrong, but I wouldn't call what "pilots say" as fact



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently onlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6535 posts, RR: 9
Reply 47, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7425 times:

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 45):
That's a theory but if AA went chapter 7 I'm sure DL is more than willing to snatch up 30-40 738s from AA over the MIA hub.

If that were true,why doesn't Delta just buy 30-40 738s from Boeing


User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 48, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7429 times:

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 47):
Quoting tommy767 (Reply 45):
That's a theory but if AA went chapter 7 I'm sure DL is more than willing to snatch up 30-40 738s from AA over the MIA hub.

If that were true,why doesn't Delta just buy 30-40 738s from Boeing

I'm sure Delta could get a better deal from AA than Boeing. Probably not as good and creative deal ala Southwest for their 717's, but probably a good one. Think " liquidator sale " lol


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 26005 posts, RR: 22
Reply 49, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7400 times:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 41):
Quoting FFlyerCDg (Reply 40):
Or complimentary cocktails ?

Yes in BE and EC. Free Beer/wine in YC

But on AF it's not limited to beer and wine in Y class. That's true for almost all major non-US carriers on longhaul flights.


User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 50, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 7390 times:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 48):
I'm sure Delta could get a better deal from AA than Boeing.

I don't think so. The reason DL was snatching up MD-90s and 717s is because no one really wanted these airframes that are still relatively new. A 738 on the other hand could go to dozens of airlines, increasing the price. Maybe it would still be worth it, but it would be an apples to oranges comparison to the MD-90s and 717s



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1190 posts, RR: 10
Reply 51, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7345 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 50):
but it would be an apples to oranges comparison to the MD-90s and 717s

I understand, but thats why I stated:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 48):
Probably not as good and creative deal ala Southwest for their 717's,


User currently offlinePIEAvantiP180 From United States of America, joined Sep 2009, 558 posts, RR: 0
Reply 52, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 7267 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 50):
Quoting cokepopper (Reply 51):

Well the 64 million $ question is does AA even own 30-40 737-800 any more. I believe all the recent deliveries were done with sale lease back and not sure about the earlier ones, and how many are held as security deposit for all the cash loans AA took out in the last few years. So in this case DL would probably not even get to negotiate with AA and the courts but the leasers to whom the planes belong to. Does anybody have this info, how many 737 in AA fleet are leased and mortgaged and how many do they actually own?


User currently offlineNYCAAer From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 693 posts, RR: 3
Reply 53, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 7013 times:

Only 50 channels of movies and TV on DL? Is that the new video system? People always complain about the lack of selection of IFE on AA, but the new system on AA will have 270 channels.

User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7968 posts, RR: 19
Reply 54, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6951 times:

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 53):
Only 50 channels of movies and TV on DL? Is that the new video system? People always complain about the lack of selection of IFE on AA, but the new system on AA will have 270 channels.

Ok let me just chime in on this one: I have directv complimentary for my apartment with like, 400 channels and other assorted benefits, but I believe I only watch about 10 of them.

When I'm in Japan at the hotels, I have 8 channels, and I watch 4 of those.

Maybe it's just me, but are people a bit spoiled with tv these days? And i'm only 21 too   



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9700 posts, RR: 14
Reply 55, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 6766 times:

Quoting B777ER (Reply 39):
Ask any Delta NYC 7ER pilot

Sorry...i could careless what pilots have to say unless its about flying an airplane. (even then...)
All I can tell you is Delta will still have pretty much the same network to Europe that they had last year....they just cut back in the winter.

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 48):

I'm sure Delta could get a better deal from AA than Boeing. Probably not as good and creative deal ala Southwest for their 717's, but probably a good one. Think " liquidator sale " lol

ehh problem with this is I don't think AA has any 737s they own. Delta may be able to get a heck of a delta from the leasing companies though.



yep.
User currently offlineusdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1010 posts, RR: 2
Reply 56, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6455 times:

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 53):
Only 50 channels of movies and TV on DL? Is that the new video system? People always complain about the lack of selection of IFE on AA, but the new system on AA will have 270 channels.

50 channels or 270 channels, it doesn't matter. What does is the selection. I think AF has some of the best movies; many are from the Middle East, Africa or France, where they have great films. I only watch 1-2 films per flight regardless and listen to music most of the time. Would be more interested in the music selection. That said, IFE never makes or breaks my choice of carrier; what does is price, schedule and equipment age/type.


User currently offlineFFlyerCDg From France, joined May 2010, 32 posts, RR: 0
Reply 57, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 6307 times:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 41):
but you did.  
Tell you what, give the flight a chance and then tell us your experience. I hope to change your mind.
There is a great group of F/A's who can't wait to work this flight and know how important it is.

Terribly sorry if I was rude !
And you're perfectly right... Things might have changed and J seat are better on DL than AF.

But I was talking about the poor 169 Y pax versus the lucky 36 J pax  


User currently offlineneveragain From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 58, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 6263 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
Well as per a contract with P&G they kinda have to.

So you assert this without qualifications, then start another post asking for the details of the contract?

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
I stated previously that if DL stops this route another carrier (AF most likely) would take this route.

So DL is going to agree with its JV partner AF to stop the CVG-CDG route only for AF to restart it (which presumably requires Delta's consent)?


User currently onlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6535 posts, RR: 9
Reply 59, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 6213 times:

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 48):
I'm sure Delta could get a better deal from AA than Boeing

I believe that Boeing thru financing already owns the AA 738s in question.


User currently offlinechrisnh From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4164 posts, RR: 2
Reply 60, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 6188 times:

Quoting clrd4t8koff (Reply 8):
Funny, there's another thread going on right now regarding DL's next focus now that NYC is well covered, and in that thread someone mentioned BOS which was QUICKLY diminished and regarded as nonsense. Now, before anyone starts to dash my hopes that my hometown airport IS seeing a growth spurt by DL, I understand this is only seasonal. However, it's still growth and with the state of AA (the other domestic operator with CDG service from BOS), I think this is a great move and one that could lead to perhaps either an upgauge of equipment or even year round service.

Looking back just 4-5 years ago Delta had a very slim international presence @ BOS - Halifax, Toronto, Bermuda, Cancun to now a decent European mix as well (AMS, LHR, CDG), which isn't too shabby. I doubt it'd be much more growth, but I'm hopeful to what the future holds for DL @ BOS.

I would stamp the seal of approval on DL's renaissance at BOS if they started service to Asia. Everyone knows that, aside from the JAL 787 we have, the demand for BOS-Asia service trumps service to 2nd and 3rd level European cities.

Sadly (to a degree), new international routes for BOS are MUCH more likely to be launched by international flag carriers than our own. Next up for BOS, if rumors are correct, is Qatar.


User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 2010 posts, RR: 21
Reply 61, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 6016 times:

Quoting neveragain (Reply 58):
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
Well as per a contract with P&G they kinda have to.

So you assert this without qualifications, then start another post asking for the details of the contract?

If anyone is the least bit familiar with the Cincinnati market, this is common knowledge. Qualifications? What qualifications do you need? I know dozens of people who work for P&G who fly DL almost exclusively (occasionally UA), it's not really all that surprising that the largest airline in town would have one of the largest corporate travel accounts in town. Additionally I've taken the flight a couple times myself and the Business Elite cabin is always near full with mostly P&G employees, there are even a couple nicknames used by both the flight crew and the passengers for the flight such as the P&G Express or P&G Happy Hour. And is there something wrong with wanting to know the details on the contract?


User currently offlineneveragain From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 62, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5971 times:

Flyguy--I'm not disputing that P&G has a large contract with Delta, nor that many P&Gers fly CVG-CDG and probably pay good fares. What I was commenting on was that PHX787 asserted that DL couldn't end the CDG route per the terms of the P&G contract, then starts a post asking what exactly was in the contract. To me, that means he doesn't know anything about the contract, so I'm wondering why he would make such a claim.

But, since you bring it up, and no CVG post can be made without implying that DL can't cut back service, almost solely because of that high-yielding P&G traffic, I'd like to know just how many P&Gers are flying into and out of CVG a day on average. 50? 100? 500? 1000? Even if it's 1000, we're talking about filling 7-8 narrowbodies a day. I'd find it hard to believe it was anywhere near that much, but I'm not going to assert as much without having actual data to back my claim.


User currently offlinepanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4974 posts, RR: 25
Reply 63, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5896 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

So the new flights have been loaded over the weekend:

The CDG flight times were already detailed in the press release. Basically, 752s for CDG-PHL/PIT/BOS; the second ATL-CDG will be a 764ER:

DL28 ATL 3:20pm CDG 6:10am+ 763ER
DL42 ATL 11:35pm CDG 2:15pm+ 764ER

CDG-ATL:

DL43 CDG 8:20am ATL 12:05pm 763ER
DL29 CDG 4:10pm ATL 8:00pm 764ER


For JFK-AMS:

DL70 JFK 4:15pm AMS 6:00am+ 763ER
DL205 JFK 8:15pm AMS 10:00am+ A332

AMS-JFK:

DL204 AMS 9:10am JFK 11:30am 763ER
DL 71 AMS 10:30am JFK 1250pm A332

Also, the flat-bed seatmaps have been loaded for CVG-CDG (76T); EWR-CDG (76L), and SEA-CDG (76T)



Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 53):
Only 50 channels of movies and TV on DL? Is that the new video system? People always complain about the lack of selection of IFE on AA, but the new system on AA will have 270 channels.

THe old 763ER J PTVs have about 25 movies; the 764ER / 76Ts have about 100 movie choices, the 777s have about 200 selections, while the 744s and the one redone 76L have about 300 titles....

[Edited 2012-10-07 10:03:10]

User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7968 posts, RR: 19
Reply 64, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 5704 times:

Quoting neveragain (Reply 58):
So DL is going to agree with its JV partner AF to stop the CVG-CDG route only for AF to restart it (which presumably requires Delta's consent)?

Well I don't see why DL wouldn't give consent for AF to come in and take over such a route should DL pull it.

Quoting neveragain (Reply 62):
I'd like to know just how many P&Gers are flying into and out of CVG a day on average. 50? 100? 500? 1000?

I took the flight twice. First time was when there was still service to LGW and FRA, and it was also on a Wednesday. The flight had 70 people on it. Other time I flew it, it was jammed packed, overbooked actually. One person was bumped to a flight to ATL (In Biz Elite, apparently). So from those experiences and the fact that people have said that it's packed, I'd say there's quite a few P&G employees on board.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 61):
And is there something wrong with wanting to know the details on the contract?
Procter And Gamble's CVG Contract (by PHX787 Oct 5 2012 in Civil Aviation) Let's discuss this here, as we have been  
Quoting panamair (Reply 63):
DL43 CDG 8:20am ATL 12:05pm 763ER

Hm They changed the numbers around. DL43 used to be CDG-CVG. It's now some DL2XX number, but DL44 is still CVG-CDG..hmm



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 65, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 5676 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 64):
Quoting neveragain (Reply 58):
So DL is going to agree with its JV partner AF to stop the CVG-CDG route only for AF to restart it (which presumably requires Delta's consent)?

Well I don't see why DL wouldn't give consent for AF to come in and take over such a route should DL pull it.

There is a lot that goes into it. I don't see DL dropping it for AF and this is why (keep in mind, I'm no expert on this but this is what I've heard: all things equal, DL is cheaper to operate than AF. If you had a DL 330 on the route and a AF 330 on the route, DL would make more with their lower labor costs. I'm sure DL's 763s are still cheaper than a AF 330. Now, AF is able to operate cheaper on DL on some routes with aircraft like the A380, that's why you see a lot of the AF metal on JFK-CDG flights. Even with the higher costs, AF's A380 is cheaper than a couple or 3 DL 767s. The reason you see random DL flights (like PHL-CDG) is because it's not cost effective or not quite cost effective to put an AF aircraft on the route. Obviously, putting a A380 on the route would be too much capacity.

Keep in mind, however, there needs to be about an even number number of seats flown by DL and by AF/KL. Maybe AF would need to fly more so they'd take over the CVG-CDG route, but the trend I've seen is having fewer AF/KL flights on large aircraft (to combat the higher labor costs) while DL flies a lot more smaller aircraft (making the routes flown actually viable.)

BUT, I could be completely wrong, so if I am, someone please correct me  



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 2010 posts, RR: 21
Reply 66, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5609 times:

Quoting neveragain (Reply 62):
What I was commenting on was that PHX787 asserted that DL couldn't end the CDG route per the terms of the P&G contract, then starts a post asking what exactly was in the contract. To me, that means he doesn't know anything about the contract, so I'm wondering why he would make such a claim.

I don't, or didn't want to come across as crass, but I just thought harping on that point was unnecessary since he didn't unequivocally state that DL was 100% obligated to fly the route, "kinda have to" and "contractually obligated to" are two different things.


Quoting neveragain (Reply 62):
I'd like to know just how many P&Gers are flying into and out of CVG a day on average. 50? 100? 500? 1000? Even if it's 1000, we're talking about filling 7-8 narrowbodies a day. I'd find it hard to believe it was anywhere near that much, but I'm not going to assert as much without having actual data to back my claim.

It doesn't even need to be that much, they just need to fill the 12-36 premium class seats (depending on the aircraft) to make any of the flights profitable.


User currently offlinejbmitt From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 549 posts, RR: 2
Reply 67, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5552 times:

CVG- CDG used to operate double daily split between DL and AF. I've flown both the DL 777 and AF 340

User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7968 posts, RR: 19
Reply 68, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5457 times:

Quoting jbmitt (Reply 67):
CVG- CDG used to operate double daily split between DL and AF. I've flown both the DL 777 and AF 340

The aviation enthusiasts in CVG greatly miss the AF A340   
When that thing landed at CVG the viewing areas and the parking garage would just fill up with people.



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlinePITrules From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 3255 posts, RR: 6
Reply 69, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 5401 times:

Quoting panamair (Reply 63):
So the new flights have been loaded over the weekend:

While it was not stated in the press release, Delta.com shows the seasonal PIT-CDG flight increased to daily right from the start, which is up from the 4x weekly then 5x weekly summer service. Also it shows a start date of March 30, 2013 which is quite a bit earlier than this year's start.



FLYi
User currently offlinesteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9268 posts, RR: 21
Reply 70, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 5300 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 65):
The reason you see random DL flights (like PHL-CDG) is because it's not cost effective or not quite cost effective to put an AF aircraft on the route. Obviously, putting a A380 on the route would be too much capacity.

Didn't Delta discontinue PHL-CDG all together according to one of the recent OAG threads? US flies A333s and/or 767s if I recall from their transatlantic fortress that is PHL...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7978 posts, RR: 51
Reply 71, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 5272 times:

Quoting steeler83 (Reply 70):

They might have. I think they may have PIT-CDG or something. Even if it did get discontinued, the fact that it went to AF > DL in the first place is telling



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineneveragain From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 72, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5217 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 64):
Well I don't see why DL wouldn't give consent for AF to come in and take over such a route should DL pull it.

The point is--as far as I understand how a joint venture is supposed to work--that the decision to cancel the route would be made jointly to begin with. (At least that's the conventional wisdom--whether joint ventures are as advertised, I don't know. There's plenty of talk about "metal neutrality," but as DeltaMD90 points out, there really can't be such a thing, or at least it's not that "clean.") Why would AF turn around and open the route after deciding with Delta to close it?

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 64):
I took the flight twice. First time was when there was still service to LGW and FRA, and it was also on a Wednesday. The flight had 70 people on it. Other time I flew it, it was jammed packed, overbooked actually. One person was bumped to a flight to ATL (In Biz Elite, apparently). So from those experiences and the fact that people have said that it's packed, I'd say there's quite a few P&G employees on board.

I'm sure you mean well, but this is the logic I can pull together from your post:

-I flew the route twice.

-Once I flew it and there weren't many people on in it. (The implication is because nonstop flights from CVG to LGW and FRA were operating at the same time.)

-I flew it again, and it was overbooked. (Oh, and BTW, someone was rerouted via ATL in BusinessElite.)

-So therefore there were plenty of P&G employees on board?

What am I missing?


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7968 posts, RR: 19
Reply 73, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5156 times:

Quoting neveragain (Reply 72):
-So therefore there were plenty of P&G employees on board?

That's an implication based off of the facts that previous members brought up. Again this discussion belongs in the P&G thread, as we are discussing this in 3 different threads now.



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlineANA787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 342 posts, RR: 0
Reply 74, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4789 times:

Is the 2nd daily SEA-AMS operated as a 767 being upgraded to the new product or is the 2nd daily being cut?

[Edited 2012-10-08 14:05:01]

User currently offlinepanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4974 posts, RR: 25
Reply 75, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4743 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting PITrules (Reply 69):
Delta.com shows the seasonal PIT-CDG flight increased to daily right from the start, which is up from the 4x weekly then 5x weekly summer service

Delta usually defaults many of these seasonal to daily in the beginning, and then starts to trim them depending on how advance bookings look. PIT-CDG is now scheduled to resume on May 11, 2013.

Quoting steeler83 (Reply 70):
Didn't Delta discontinue PHL-CDG all together according to one of the recent OAG threads?

PHL-CDG with a DL 75E is seasonal to begin with; it was originally supposed to return March 30, 2013, but has since been postponed for a May 4, 2013 re-start.


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