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OV Sacks Tero Taskila, Appoints Jan Palmer  
User currently offlinesmws From Estonia, joined Jun 2012, 66 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2991 times:

Tero Taskila has been sacked as the CEO of Estonian Air.

Jan Palmer has been appointed in his place: http://se.linkedin.com/pub/jan-palmer/7/53/ba0

While I wish Palmer all the best in turning things around at OV, I remain rather pessimistic. Will have to wait and see what his "vision" for OV will be.

Source (in Estonian): http://www.e24.ee/1024500/riik-vallandas-estonian-airi-juhi

44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2958 times:

What I read from Estonian media, the new strategy is stop transfer traffic via TLL with immediate effect and develop traffic on "point to point" routes from/to Estonia. That is the strategy what was before 2011. But it means, that they should reduce overall traffic numbers.

User currently offlineVasu From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 3926 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2890 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 1):

Why would they do this? I would have thought that transfer traffic could boost passenger numbers significantly...


User currently offlinesmws From Estonia, joined Jun 2012, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2870 times:

Quoting Vasu (Reply 2):
Why would they do this? I would have thought that transfer traffic could boost passenger numbers significantly...

The boost to passenger numbers was indeed considerable, but most routes still operate with loss. This business model was deemed as a failure by the major shareholder (the state), and therefore Taskila and his model had to go. Also, the Minister of Economic Affairs and Communications Juhan Parts was under significant public pressure to do something with the failing company.


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2847 times:

Quoting Vasu (Reply 2):
Why would they do this? I would have thought that transfer traffic could boost passenger numbers significantly...

And it already did. Estonian Air boosted number of passengers and routes. But with this model they loose so much money. If you want to transfer passengers from, let's say, Helsinki to Amsterdam you have to beat all direct and in-direct options. All premium passengers further fly direct and all the transfer traffic you can win only on price. That's the experience both from airBaltic and Estonian Air.


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2794 times:

There were rumors that some "transfer" routs were working pretty well like St.Petersburg- Tallinn- Tbilisy. But not sure if those routs have generated any profit.

rRegards,
Sven


User currently offlinesmws From Estonia, joined Jun 2012, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2740 times:

Some new information coming in.

OV is closing routes to Tartu, Helsinki and Joensuu.

Routes to Stockholm, Copenhagen, Oslo, Brussels, Moscow and Saint Petersburg will not be closed in all likelihood.

The Tbilisi route was stopped on the 15th of October, initially only for the autumn-winter season.

Riga and Munich will also probably be closed as good service is provided by other carriers.

In addition, London OV will fly to LCY starting from Spring 2013.

Source (in Estonian): http://www.e24.ee/1024884/estonian-a...r-hakkab-liine-sulgema-ja-koondama


User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2713 times:

Quoting smws (Reply 6):
Riga and Munich will also probably be closed as good service is provided by other carriers.

In addition, London OV will fly to LCY starting from Spring 2013.

OV currently do not operate to Munich, so they cannot close that one down.

According to Delfi, the planned routes to LCY and GOT are both axed. With LCY, it's probably a good idea as the infrastructure there makes the return flight payload-restricted, which in turn results in an inherent difficulty in operating profitably.


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2633 times:

Chairman and new CEO also said, that the vision is to go to 9 to 11 routes airline flying from TLL.

6 "safe" routes to survive - ARN, OSL, CPH (all codeshare SK), BRU (codeshare SN), LED (codeshare FV) and SVO (codeshare SU).

Other routes to be decided later. IMHO, AMS (codeshare KLM), VNO (on turboprops), VIE and KBP should remain all with reduced frequencies for point to point purposes.


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2626 times:

Also it will be interesting to see what the new fleet strategy should be.

AFAIK, they are in conflict with Bombardier to return 3 CRJ900 to manufacturer. 4 E170 are on lease from Finnair and some more Embraers to come next summer, and some new orders from Embraer to deliver in 2014-2016.

With 9-11 routes it looks 4 regional jets and 2 turboprops are enough for them.


User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2691 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2619 times:
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Wasn't the new Estonian CEO sacked just recently by the Latvian government for not running RIX well?

User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2600 times:

Quoting ju068 (Reply 10):
Wasn't the new Estonian CEO sacked just recently by the Latvian government for not running RIX well?

No.

"Old" Estonian CEO Taskila was ex airBaltic Chief Commercial Officer.
Government sacked RIX management recently (Latvian persons).
"New" Estonian CEO is Swedish person, ex-CEO Skyways and Cimber Sterling (but he left those companies before they were sold to Ukrainian owners and later bankrupted).


User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2691 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 2590 times:
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Quoting smbukas (Reply 11):
Jan Palmer

Thanks for that, don't know why I confused them.


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2456 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 8):
Other routes to be decided later. IMHO, AMS (codeshare KLM), VNO (on turboprops), VIE and KBP should remain all with reduced frequencies for point to point purposes.

OV operate VIE just few times a week so do not know if they would be able to reduce it even more/ is it reasonable to reduce even more?

Quoting OV735 (Reply 7):
According to Delfi, the planned routes to LCY and GOT are both axed. With LCY, it's probably a good idea as the infrastructure there makes the return flight payload-restricted, which in turn results in an inherent difficulty in operating profitably.

If flights to LCY will allow connection to/from SVO, LED and perhaps KBP then line may be profitable.
Anyway London is a destination where point to point loads may generate profit so hope OV will fly to some London airport.

Quoting smbukas (Reply 9):
AFAIK, they are in conflict with Bombardier to return 3 CRJ900 to manufacturer. 4 E170 are on lease from Finnair and some more Embraers to come next summer, and some new orders from Embraer to deliver in 2014-2016.

With 9-11 routes it looks 4 regional jets and 2 turboprops are enough for them.

Wonder what will happen with ordered E195? They may be used for charter flights as well.
As to turboprops, should not they be they retired soon?


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 2338 times:

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 13):
OV operate VIE just few times a week so do not know if they would be able to reduce it even more/ is it reasonable to reduce even more?

I have did not notice they reduce VIE flights. In the begining of summer 2012 there was ±12x weekly flights TLL-VIE.

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 13):
Anyway London is a destination where point to point loads may generate profit so hope OV will fly to some London airport.

London is good route on paper, but you cannot win competition in such price sensitive markets in Eastern Europe. easyJet flies LGW-TLL and Ryanair operate LTN-TLL. It is already big capacity there.


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 2261 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 14):
I have did not notice they reduce VIE flights. In the begining of summer 2012 there was ±12x weekly flights TLL-VIE.

For the winter season it is just 5 flights a week

Quoting smbukas (Reply 14):
London is good route on paper, but you cannot win competition in such price sensitive markets in Eastern Europe. easyJet flies LGW-TLL and Ryanair operate LTN-TLL. It is already big capacity there.


Ryanair flies 3 times a week and EasyJet 4 times a week. Flights are operated on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays and EasyJet on Sundays, even more usually flight depart from London VERY EARLY in the morning. As you may see at least 3 days left empty and there is no evening flights at all. So there are space to compete. Another question those possibilities may generate some profit... .


User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 2241 times:
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Quoting smbukas (Reply 14):
In the begining of summer 2012 there was ±12x weekly flights TLL-VIE

How come there is so much demand for flights TLL-VIE? Business ties?

Will the CRJ900s be returned to Bombardier or another leasing company?



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2191 times:

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 16):
How come there is so much demand for flights TLL-VIE? Business ties?

OV's 'new' strategy was to provide connections via TLL. Tight schedules to Western European destinations were supposed to attract connecting traffic from VNO, RIX, LED, HEL and some small Finnish towns.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 16):
Will the CRJ900s be returned to Bombardier or another leasing company?

The CRJs are owned by Estonian Air (or rather an off-shore affiliate, as uncovered by Estonian press recently) and therefore cannot be returned. Basically, the way I see it, there are three options: a) sell them b) if that doesn't work, lease them out and c) keep them. They are good aircraft, and from what I hear, more economical than the E170.


User currently offlineMHG From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 784 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2069 times:

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 15):
Ryanair flies 3 times a week and EasyJet 4 times a week. Flights are operated on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays and EasyJet on Sundays, even more usually flight depart from London VERY EARLY in the morning. As you may see at least 3 days left empty and there is no evening flights at all. So there are space to compete. Another question those possibilities may generate some profit... .

That´s a valid point !
Also, don´t forget that business travellers want flexibility. Maybe that´s where OV might step in.

Remember that OPS into LCY are not only restricted (aircraft size/range/slots) but also very expensive.
LCY charges very high rates for parking/landing/etc. compared to the other airports serving London.

A possible airport to serve London point-to-point may be London Southend (SEN) as there are no slot restrictions and the recently extended runway would not lead to any payload/range restrictions to EMB-170 or CRJ-900.
And finally, SEN would probably be the "cheapest" airport to serve in the London area. For Passengers it´s ok, too since the train station is just outside the terminal with frequent trains to London (travel time is less than an hour)



I miss the sound of rolls royce darts and speys
User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2017 times:

Quoting MHG (Reply 18):
Also, don´t forget that business travellers want flexibility. Maybe that´s where OV might step in.

Unfortunately it looks like that at least for some future London would not be served by OV   . On the other side it allows competitors to increase frequencies.

Quoting OV735 (Reply 17):
c) keep them. They are good aircraft, and from what I hear, more economical than the E170.

Just three CRJs is not enough to serve even 11 destinations with reasonable frequencies. Also it is not reasonable to keep two types of jets in such a small fleet. One possibility is to get read of CRJ's and operate E170s until E175/195 would arrive. If I am not mistaken while E170 is less economical than CRJ900, E175/195 are more economical.


User currently offlineteme82 From Finland, joined Mar 2007, 1569 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2004 times:
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OV's issue is that HEL is too darn close to TLL. Fact is that a lot of people takes the boat to Helsinki and from there they go the HEL and take direct flights to the world. So in the end OV will bleed money and will go belly up.


Flying high and low
User currently offlineTreg From Estonia, joined Oct 2001, 537 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 1978 times:

Quoting teme82 (Reply 20):
OV's issue is that HEL is too darn close to TLL. Fact is that a lot of people takes the boat to Helsinki and from there they go the HEL and take direct flights to the world. So in the end OV will bleed money and will go belly up.

Actually, the Finnair prices starting from TLL are not much different from the HEL prices. Thus, many people (incl. me) are using HEL rather frequently. There are 6 daily flights from TLL to HEL and back giving you very good connectivity via HEL.


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1964 times:

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 19):
Just three CRJs is not enough to serve even 11 destinations with reasonable frequencies. Also it is not reasonable to keep two types of jets in such a small fleet. One possibility is to get read of CRJ's and operate E170s until E175/195 would arrive. If I am not mistaken while E170 is less economical than CRJ900, E175/195 are more economical.

I think, this that can be decided with network strategy too. AFAIK, for Estonian, CRJ900 are more economical on shorter routes (TLL-CPH, TLL-ARN), but E170 wins on longer routes (LGW, CDG, TBS). As I see, new strategy is more based on serving short routes (except BRU and AMS which are a bit longer), so CRJ900 might be better fit. And what Estonian press write, CRJ900 are "owned" so to release them means to find a new customer for them what can be a challenge.

Anyhow, I think they will definitely need props for serving VNO, LED and keep high frequency on ARN.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 16):
How come there is so much demand for flights TLL-VIE? Business ties?

They got codeshare from OS for Estonian passengers and VIE is popular flow from Russia. So I think they also believed in big flows for connecting passengers from LED and SVO to VIE.


User currently offlineLarshjort From Denmark, joined Dec 2007, 1485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1945 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 11):
"New" Estonian CEO is Swedish person, ex-CEO Skyways and Cimber Sterling (but he left those companies before they were sold to Ukrainian owners and later bankrupted).

He arrived at Cimber Sterling after the Ukranian owners bought the company, and he was the CEO until the bankcruptcy.

/Lars



139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4,
User currently offlinedebonair From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 2444 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1943 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 1):
What I read from Estonian media, the new strategy is stop transfer traffic via TLL with immediate effect and develop traffic on "point to point" routes from/to Estonia

I never understood, why OV was ERA SILVER winner 2012:

Silver winner Estonian Air was considered by the judges to be an outstanding example of a successful link between an airport and a regional carrier, using a hub and spoke model which has enabled the airline to attract a considerable amount of transfer traffic leading to impressive growth. The carrier's clear targets, innovative approach and focus on social media were also identified as major achievements.

source:http://www.eraa.org/newsroom/news-releases/953-wideroe-wins-airline-of-the-year-gold-award


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2011 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 22):
I think, this that can be decided with network strategy too. AFAIK, for Estonian, CRJ900 are more economical on shorter routes (TLL-CPH, TLL-ARN), but E170 wins on longer routes (LGW, CDG, TBS). As I see, new strategy is more based on serving short routes (except BRU and AMS which are a bit longer), so CRJ900 might be better fit. And what Estonian press write, CRJ900 are "owned" so to release them means to find a new customer for them what can be a challenge.

Hope SK may may buy them from OV? Initially it was a part of big SK order if I am not mistaken.
Anyway 3 aircraft is just not enough.

Quoting smbukas (Reply 22):
Anyhow, I think they will definitely need props for serving VNO, LED and keep high frequency on ARN.

True, as Estonian press reported a cople of times OV have left luggage partly because of weigh restrictions on SAABs.
Or there were some weather concerns... .


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 26, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1994 times:

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 25):
True, as Estonian press reported a cople of times OV have left luggage partly because of weigh restrictions on SAABs.

I remember fun coverage in Lithuanian press also - Vilnius basketball team "Lietuvos rytas" was flying to play Euroleague game to St.Peteresburg via TLL and Estonian Air decided to leave all the luggage in VNO due to weight restrictions.

Anyway, when there are no transfer traffic routes from TLL to VNO or LED are mostly business traffic for day or two-days trips and not so many issues with luggage.


User currently offlineCRJ900 From Norway, joined Jun 2004, 2205 posts, RR: 1
Reply 27, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2025 times:
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Quoting smbukas (Reply 22):
AFAIK, for Estonian, CRJ900 are more economical on shorter routes (TLL-CPH, TLL-ARN), but E170 wins on longer routes (LGW, CDG, TBS

I thought it was the other way around? A SAS CRJ900 Captain told me the CR9 has great economics on flights longer than 90 minutes and less economical on short flights.

However, more short flights a day allow more pax to be carried, hence more revenue... I see that the CR9 is scheduled on long flights to AMS, BRU, CDG and this summer it flew the 3+ hour Tblisi route at night. The CR9 has 12 more seats than the E170, allowing more revenue but may be harder to sell on every flight...

Will be interesting to see what they do with their fleet during the next 12 months. If the CR9 are owned, they may be hard to dispose of.



Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
User currently offlineju068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2691 posts, RR: 6
Reply 28, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1947 times:
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Well I know this is off topic but airBaltic has been mentioned before. Good news in neighbouring Latvia...

http://www.baltic-course.com/eng/good_for_business/?doc=65339


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 29, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1872 times:

According to E24 government will not allow OV to go bankrupt.
Sorry but Link is in Estonian only
http://www.e24.ee/1026276/ansip-riik...airi-mitte-mingil-juhul-pankrotti/

So most probably in the next 12 month period we will see some interesting developments.
Both in geography and in fleet restructuring.


User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 30, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1809 times:

Quoting debonair (Reply 24):
I never understood, why OV was ERA SILVER winner 2012:

Because of the reasons listed in your quote. Had the ladies and gents at ERAA known that it wouldn't work out, I too doubt they would have presented the award. However, at that time, the new strategy had grown per-annum pax numbers by 60-70%, which is a pretty impressive growth.

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 25):
Hope SK may may buy them from OV? Initially it was a part of big SK order if I am not mistaken.

These days, SK themselves are as deep in as they can be. I doubt they have money laying around waiting to be spent.

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 29):
According to E24 government will not allow OV to go bankrupt.

Legally, there is only so much they can do about it. The "private investor principle" can be enforced retroactively, as seen in the case of Malev. We all knew there had to be downsides to joining the EU, and this is one of them.


User currently offlinejfidler From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 368 posts, RR: 0
Reply 31, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1802 times:

Quoting traveler_7 (Reply 19):
Also it is not reasonable to keep two types of jets in such a small fleet.

In some ways, it's worse than that. If you include Estonian Air Regional (and I'm not quite sure why they made a separate company) and their 3 planes, they have:
(1) B737-500
(4) EMB-170
(3) CRJ-900
(3) Saab 340

This just seems very inefficient to me. They need a wide variety of pilots, mechanics, and spare parts to handle such a diverse fleet.

http://estonian-air.ee/en/about-us/about-company/fleet/


User currently offlinetraveler_7 From Estonia, joined May 2000, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 32, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1787 times:

Quoting jfidler (Reply 31):
In some ways, it's worse than that. If you include Estonian Air Regional (and I'm not quite sure why they made a separate company) and their 3 planes, they have:
(1) B737-500
(4) EMB-170
(3) CRJ-900
(3) Saab 340

B737 is left from the "pre CRJ" period. As far as I remember it should be phased out soon. So just two types of jets and one turboprop.

Personally I think that to operate some 11 regular routs they will need a combinations 4 -6 E175 and E190 plus some 3 -4 turboprops. This is basically what was ordered from Embraer. But the turboprop question is still open.


User currently offlineshanxz From Singapore, joined Apr 2006, 243 posts, RR: 0
Reply 33, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 1769 times:

Tero and team had a solid plan, and it's a pity that the govt. didn't back them for long enough. It seems to be a short-sighted decision. When you try to build a hub, it doesn't fill up planes overnight. The number of pax at OY had certainly grown, and their brand/service improved dramatically over the last 12 months. But you need to let a newly hired Board and executive team prove themselves, rather than going back to square one in just year. Disappointing.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 27):
Will be interesting to see what they do with their fleet during the next 12 months. If the CR9 are owned, they may be hard to dispose of.

Yeah, that's been a problem. There's not much of a market for these CRJ-900s and Estonian was in a tight spot having leased the Embraers and having to ground the CRJs and not being able to sell or lease them out.



Airlines are in the service business, not transport. Brand matters...
User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 34, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1717 times:

Quoting shanxz (Reply 33):
Tero and team had a solid plan, and it's a pity that the govt. didn't back them for long enough. It seems to be a short-sighted decision. When you try to build a hub, it doesn't fill up planes overnight. The number of pax at OY had certainly grown, and their brand/service improved dramatically over the last 12 months. But you need to let a newly hired Board and executive team prove themselves, rather than going back to square one in just year. Disappointing.

I agree that the plan should have been given more time to fold out. However, given that the loss over first three quarters was more than €20m (and we're talking about a company with an annual turnover in the region of €80m), Tero Taskila and his strategy grew increasingly unpopular among the population. Therefore the government probably had a knee-jerk reaction to the prospect of losing valuable votes by supporting a venture that was so unprofitable.

Another thing is, as seen in the case of MA's demise and bankruptcy, governments cannot subsidise airlines. If the EC deems that a government has invested more money in an airline than a private investor would, the airline would be forced to pay it back. This would lead to insolvency and shutdown in OV's case.


User currently offlinesmws From Estonia, joined Jun 2012, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 35, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1563 times:

Quoting OV735 (Reply 34):
I agree that the plan should have been given more time to fold out. However, given that the loss over first three quarters was more than €20m (and we're talking about a company with an annual turnover in the region of €80m), Tero Taskila and his strategy grew increasingly unpopular among the population. Therefore the government probably had a knee-jerk reaction to the prospect of losing valuable votes by supporting a venture that was so unprofitable.

Another sad part of the OV and Taskila "fiasco" was how the media and public reacted to his wages, so basically he and his plan were very unpopular from the start for unrelated reasons.


User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Reply 36, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 1484 times:

Really shocking that they decided to replace the CR9s with Embraers without having a deal in place to properly dispose of them. That could really be a nail in the company's coffin....

I guess this development will mean the end of Estonian Regional unless OV has some use for the Saabs for flights to Lativa and Lithuania.


User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 914 posts, RR: 3
Reply 37, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 1460 times:

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 36):
Really shocking that they decided to replace the CR9s with Embraers without having a deal in place to properly dispose of them. That could really be a nail in the company's coffin....

I believe initially when the Embraers rolled in, the CRJs were supposed to stay in the picture until the E175 deliveries in 2014, so they didn't really plan for a hasty disposal. It's the unexpectedly big losses and subsequent revision of strategy that brought on the need of speeding up the process.


User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 38, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1185 times:

Estonian Air annouced further cuts:

Estonian Air will stop flights to Joensuu, Helsinki, Jyväskylä and Tartu, and in 2013 will not start operations to London City, Tbilisi, Hannover and Gothenburg.

Estonian Air will serve the Tallinn-Paris route with less flights (it becomes 2x weekly summer-only service) and suspend flights to Vienna.


They are taking quick cut decisions before they announce a new strategy which should be in place in the beginning of December.

With these cuts they will have 11 routes from TLL:
AMS, BRU, CPH, KBP, SVO, OSL, CDG (seasonal), LED, ARN, TRD and VNO.


User currently offlineHELyes From Finland, joined Oct 2010, 961 posts, RR: 1
Reply 39, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1189 times:

Quoting smbukas (Reply 38):

Estonian Air will stop flights to Joensuu, Helsinki, Jyväskylä

So all their routes to Finland get axed. They have tried the HEL service several times, sad too loose their pretty A340 again.


User currently offlineteme82 From Finland, joined Mar 2007, 1569 posts, RR: 0
Reply 40, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1167 times:
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Quoting HELyes (Reply 39):
sad too loose their pretty A340 again.

I didn't know that OV has A340's   

You must mean Saab 340?

[Edited 2012-11-16 02:55:45]


Flying high and low
User currently offlineHELyes From Finland, joined Oct 2010, 961 posts, RR: 1
Reply 41, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1164 times:

Quoting teme82 (Reply 40):
You must mean Saab 340?

Oops yes SAAB 340... OV colors would look good on big Buses too  

Hopefully OV make it through the stormy times, Estonian government says bankruptcy is a realistic option if funding not possible by the spring.

In Estonian:
http://www.ap3.ee/?PublicationId=32903ecc-3279-49d5-a290-b62eb586e835


User currently offlinevfw614 From Germany, joined Dec 2001, 4013 posts, RR: 5
Reply 42, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 1162 times:

Interesting that they keep TRD which generally is a smallish market - is there a large Baltic expat community in the area, given that BT also flies to TRD?

User currently offlinesmbukas From Lithuania, joined Feb 2009, 211 posts, RR: 0
Reply 43, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1161 times:

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 42):
Interesting that they keep TRD which generally is a smallish market - is there a large Baltic expat community in the area, given that BT also flies to TRD?

They are flying 2x weekly.

Market from the Baltics to Norway is growing. Mostly due to people from the Baltics taking jobs in Norway (as the crisis hit Ireland and UK, some people are moving to Norway instead).

W6 successfully launched BGO and SVG from VNO this year, and next year they are going to launch TRD from VNO too. And generally, Estonians have stronger ties with Scandinavia then Lithuania.


User currently offlineTreg From Estonia, joined Oct 2001, 537 posts, RR: 0
Reply 44, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1163 times:

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 42):
Interesting that they keep TRD which generally is a smallish market - is there a large Baltic expat community in the area, given that BT also flies to TRD?

This one puzzles me as well but according to various sources there are two reasons:
1) TRD is a gateway to the central and northern parts of Norway, thus it is more than just TRD.
2) There is a significant flow of business travelers from TRD to CIS (Moscow, St. Peterburg, Kiev, etc.) who are using TLL as a transit point (faster and more convenient than OSL, ARN or CPH).


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