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Likely New United Routes Over The Next Year Or So?  
User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2911 posts, RR: 10
Posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3113 times:
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With United's flexibility (although I don't know the extent of their ability to send the right ac to match demand) what are their best new options given their already comprehensive network? Will we be seeing more long thin routes to Asia with their upcoming 787 fleet? Are there holes in Europe, Africa, Middle East and deep South America? Which routes will help them compete with either Delta or even Star Alliance partners? I often use their 757's to secondary cities in Europe. Or 3 class 767's out of EWR (like Zurich)

I saw the thread about Cape Verde and wondered with their capital to capital leadership if Brasilia would be high on the list. Or to better compete better with AA and Delta from EWR. I also "could" see more paid First on 3 class birds from NY to big premium and ULH destinations- example: Wall St to HK, FRA, BOM or GRU.

United service today is worth reconsidering, it is surprisingly better and more consistent in recent months.


The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
152 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineflylku From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 810 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3145 times:

The 787 may also provide the opportunity to add frequency to existing routes.


...are we there yet?
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6153 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3145 times:

Quoting VC10er (Thread starter):

Look for more International from SFO



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3142 times:

I'd like to see some New Zealand service. Considering that NZ has a monopoly (why?!) on those routes to the U.S; I'm not holding my breath.


A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineallegiantflyer From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 178 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3140 times:

I think Africa is the biggest hole in the UA route map. Maybe they can think about Capetown or Johannesburg

User currently offlineaznmadsci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3674 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 3143 times:

Quoting allegiantflyer (Reply 4):
I think Africa is the biggest hole in the UA route map. Maybe they can think about Capetown or Johannesburg

I think there's some North or West African cities UA could look into. Does anyone know how IAH-LOS is now doing?



The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6153 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 3):
I'd like to see some New Zealand service. Considering that NZ has a monopoly (why?!) on those routes to the U.S; I'm not holding my breath.

Yeah, this route is well covered by partner NZ. I'd look for more markets that are not already connected.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineRyanairGuru From Australia, joined Oct 2006, 5613 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3141 times:

Long-term I would like to see them de-link MEL. I think that a 787 LAX-MEL would be doable for them, but I certainly am not holding my breath. If that happens at all, it is certainly a long way off.


More realistically, I think we will see greater "optimization" of the current network before organic growth. I simply do not believe that ORD can support F on every route while EWR can only support it on a handful. Once the joint pilot contract comes into force I could see some more sUA heavies going to EWR and IAH and sCO metal moving to ORD and IAD. Routes such as LHR, FRA, ZRH and HKG can probably support F from all of the hubs, while secondary European cities are possibly better served by sCO frames with J only. Eventually I think we will see more of a 50-50 split of the long haul fleet systemwide, rather than all the 2 class frames in sCO hubs and all the 3 class frames in sUA hubs.

With regards to new routes, I think that LatAm should be the focus going forward. The region is growing rapidly, with significant inflows of investment from North America and a newly-mobile middle class driving demand. More secondary cities in Brazil are probably the best place to start.



Worked Hard, Flew Right
User currently offlineManekS From Singapore, joined Oct 2008, 241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3141 times:

I would like to see UA do a nonstop SFO-SIN service with their 787's. While EWR-SIN might be a better bet, the 787-8 lacks the range needed to operate the route. Besides, UA seem to prefer expanding their Asian operations out of SFO.

With SIA pulling the plug on the EWR and LAX nonstops due to the A340-500's poor economics, UA has an opportunity to woo the bankers and corporate clients who are now looking at one stop options. UA would have no problems filling up a premium cabin to SIN, especially since J is configured with just 36 seats. After all, the 787 was designed to give airlines a chance fly long, thin routes profitably.


User currently onlineANA787 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3141 times:

Restarting PDX-NRT, SEA/PDX-HNL.
Starting NRT-CGK/KUL.


User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1621 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3145 times:

SFO-MNL would be a no brainer..PR has to fuel stop in GUM UA really needs to step it up agianst DL in the MNL market..

User currently onlinemhkansan From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 685 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3141 times:

I know it won't happen until we get a new terminal building constructed, but I'm holding out for at least an announcement for DEN-MHK and/or ORD-FOE on UAX.

MHK proved everybody wrong with its Eagle service.

Quoting allegiantflyer (Reply 4):

I think Africa is the biggest hole in the UA route map. Maybe they can think about Capetown or Johannesburg
AA to announce MIA-JNB 77W next year? Lots of speculation, but where would UA do S. Africa from? IAD?? They already have South African!

Quoting as739x (Reply 2):
Look for more International from SFO

What's next for UA @ SFO to Asia? TPE was a good add.

[Edited 2012-11-10 22:52:00]

User currently offlinelegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2080 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3140 times:

Quoting mhkansan (Reply 11):
What's next for UA @ SFO to Asia? TPE was a good add.

Maybe finally starting the Canton route.



John@SFO
User currently offline777ord From United States of America, joined May 2010, 501 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3142 times:

in addition to further expansion of SFO as stated before. ORD will receive a variety of new service.

752 service to SNN, and the POSSIBILITY of upgrades to 777 to Europe.

Further UA/CO integration will occur. Such as NRT-SIN on CO 777 due in March if I recall.

Right now on the CO side, we've taken over a lot of predominently UA ops in compared to recent months. They have as well of our operations. Such as IAH-ORD on the 763 which comes in from IAH.

So for some the integration looks like a nightmare, but it has a purpose and an ultimate objective. And I am excited for it!


User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Perhaps restarting RDU-DEN and adding a second RDU-SFO?


Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineaznmadsci From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 3674 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3134 times:

Quoting ManekS (Reply 8):
I would like to see UA do a nonstop SFO-SIN service with their 787's.

If UA was to step into nonstop SIN territory, LAX or EWR seem ideal ahead of SFO. Would the economics of the 788 or possible 789 route work in UA's favor.

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 9):
Restarting PDX-NRT, SEA/PDX-HNL

UA would have competition on all 3 routes. UA would compete against DL on PDX-NRT and to HNL they would be competing with AS, DL, and HA.

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 9):
Starting NRT-CGK/KUL

This might work with GUM based 738s.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 7):
Eventually I think we will see more of a 50-50 split of the long haul fleet systemwide, rather than all the 2 class frames in sCO hubs and all the 3 class frames in sUA hubs.

I don't see UA expanding Global First to CLE, DEN, or IAH to do a 50/50 split. While a.net perceived IAH-GIG/LHR/NRT flights could offer F, UA planners haven't been in a rush to send a 3-class plane to those cities as they did EWR-BRU/ZRH. They did upgauge IAH-GIG to a sCO 772, added a 3rd LHR flight on a 2-class sUA 763, and have downgauged the EWR-BRU flight to a sCO 764. Yet, the lone 3-class 772 that does visit IAH is the IAH-HNL flight.

Quoting COSPN (Reply 10):
SFO-MNL would be a no brainer..PR has to fuel stop in GUM UA really needs to step it up agianst DL in the MNL market.

Would the Philippine government allow UA to start a LAX/SFO-MNL nonstop flight with the 788 if PR and 5J are not allowed to start new US services because of Cat II? The government could use UA as a ploy in the help to achieve Cat I status.



The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
User currently offlinequiet1 From Thailand, joined Apr 2010, 357 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3142 times:

Quoting ANA787 (Reply 9):
Starting NRT-CGK/KUL.

And/or adding CGK or KUL as a tag to SFO-TPE. A long time ago UA flew SFO-TPE-BKK. Perhaps a SFO-TPE-KUL or SFO-TPE-CGK flight could help maintain the SFO-TPE flight on a more permanent basis by keeping the loads up?


User currently offlineusdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 974 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

I would say that RDU-SFO is very likely, although RDU-SJC may be more popular with tech firms. How about LAX-GRU/EZE or SFO-GRU/EZE? The West Coast remains poorly served to South America to this day, but I know how challenging it would be to fill planes with enough revenue for those markets. Would LAX-GRU be more feasible for UA than for DL with its West Coast network?

User currently offlinecapri From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 450 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3133 times:

CMN is crying for a competitor the monopoly and high prices from AT

User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1817 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3138 times:
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While there may be a few new domestic routes started, its likely UA's new routes for a while will be on the international front. Though China's economy has cooled somewhat, I expect they will add service to some secondary China markets before long. As for Africa, though South Africa has the largest economy but its unlikely that route will make much $$ for UA given the existing competition unless its was a 788/89 route.

South America - UA can and should increase service from EWR and IAH to South America to take on AA, LAN and DL. There isn't as large of a west coast market but service from either LAX or SFO to Brazil wouldn't be a bad idea.

Given STAR, don't expect new service to AUK anytime soon.


User currently offlineDTWLAX From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 797 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3137 times:

Quoting ManekS (Reply 8):
With SIA pulling the plug on the EWR and LAX nonstops due to the A340-500's poor economics, UA has an opportunity to woo the bankers and corporate clients who are now looking at one stop options. UA would have no problems filling up a premium cabin to SIN, especially since J is configured with just 36 seats.

SQ still offers the 1-stop option to LAX and JFK.
Cannot say about NY, but people who flew nonstop from LAX will switch over to the SQ 1-stop instead of UA. SQ flies the A380 on the route that offers a much better hard and soft product compared to UA.


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6184 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

I suspect we will see a good bit of weekend stuff out of IAD with 73s....Like IAD-Caribbean/Central America


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25452 posts, RR: 22
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3141 times:

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 3):
Considering that NZ has a monopoly (why?!) on those routes to the U.S

How much service does a country with a population about the same as metro PHX need? If it was considered a profitable market by other carriers, I'm sure they would be operating. The fact that they aren't seems to indicate they have more profitable ways to use their aircraft.


User currently offlineVC10er From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 2911 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3137 times:
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A few thoughts:
Wow, I didn't know that IAH to GIG went to an sCO 777. That is a lot of capacity! I have always prayed for the old SA)">CO route (EWR/GIG) to come back as I live in both cities. With TAM going away, a 2 class 767 (or 787) would be perfect to fly it. I think GRU needs GF, almost every international airline into GRU has an F cabin, even TAM. GRU is a behemouth "MAJOR" business and even a luxury destination (great shopping and hotels) - and always at least 10+ hours. Brazil's 2013 growth I believe is projected at about 4.5%. As for LAX to GRU, I did the VARIG flight once. For United to connect GRU to SFO then onto Asia (or west coast USA) I wonder why it doesn't work- especially with the size of Brazilians of Japanese roots. The largest pop of Japanese outside Japan.

Why did United pull Moscow? Does anyone know why? A great capital to capital route. From a BRICS standpoint, that is a painful loss.

Last, sure it is great to have a Star partner cover a destination like South African, or New Zealand. But if you book a United flight from JFK to JNB but it's operated by SA, how much of that ticket price goes to UA? Also, for those who are eagerly seeking Global Services status...you MUST be on United metal.



The world is missing love, let's use our flights to spread it!
User currently offlineevanbu From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 377 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3138 times:

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw DSM/OMA-IAD...

25 as739x : That what were hoping. UA is running into one problem thought, International gate capacity during the morning peak. I'm curious if we may see a shift
26 rising : What ever happened to CAN?
27 Andie007 : Perhaps EWR-VIE would be an option.
28 TWA772LR : I hope to see more Africa and Brazil. Can 757s do IAH to Fortaleza, Recfife, or Manaus? Would also love to see IAH-Johannesburg. I can see IAD and/or
29 fxramper : EWR-PRG? Didn't DL dump their flight from JFK? 3rd daily to TLV or split their 2 now -one 777 one 747. 3rd daily to India. Newark-S.Africa?
30 RyanairGuru : I think this has more to do with operations efficiency and the fact that the status quo works, rather than because it is the most optimal strategy. I
31 HUYfan : There must be room for UA on ORD-MAN!? The AA service, by all accounts, has a fantastic yield. Kind regards Mike
32 neveragain : I don't believe the 787 has the range to fly this route (or SIN-LAX or EWR).
33 avi8 : I think UA could re-launch LAX-GUA and add more EWR-GUA frequencies. They recently announced IAD-SAL which foreshadows where they are pointing at in m
34 Post contains images gemuser : There already is, called "Air New Zealand"! - a member of Star Alliance. UA even code share with them already. Gemuser
35 AwysBSB : That route does really deserve a better regard. Transbrasil used to operate BSB-IAD, a route that currently has a regular o/d traffic which other UA'
36 Post contains images UnitedTristar : I would not be surprised DEN-LHR 788 LAX-MEL 788 LAX-AKL 788 ORD-MAN 752 IAH-SCL 767 SFO-TLV 777 SFO-BLR 788 BOS-LHR 752 BOS-BRU 752 CLE-FRA 752 NRT-K
37 neveragain : 4,141mi may be a bit too far for a 757. I believe EWR-TXL is the longest TATL 757 route that has been flown by UA, and it is 3,980mi. CLE-CDG, also f
38 fun2fly : Would the E+ configuration installed on the 752's make this work due to lighter weight? Or perhaps w/a few person penalty. I bet there is enough traf
39 2travel2know2 : B757 doesn't have the range for IAH-FOR/REC. Interesting would be for UA to fly to South Africa via Brazil as PanAm once did. Make it EWR-REC-JNB dai
40 AA94 : The 787 has a listed range of 7650 - 8200 nm depending on seating config. According to Great Circle, here is the distances for the three routes: SFO-
41 Post contains images Tdan : Issue is that UA will see little to no F/J traffic and pass, even though it's a short-sighted view imho My personal international top 10 list (no par
42 RyanairGuru : At 7,560 nm the 787 might be able to push BLR. If it could that would be an awesome route! I could see it working very well, both in terms of J deman
43 FWAERJ : Not much talk of United Express routes, so here's one that I see very soon: FWA-IAD. And for very good reason, moreso than FWA-DEN or FWA-EWR: -Very s
44 neveragain : Not my area of expertise, but someone here should know. And someone should know a definitive answer to this as well. I believe SIN-LAX was the longes
45 CALPSAFltSkeds : Let's take a look at available international widebodies. -5 762s (going away) +4 788 (2012 aircraft) +8 763ER (right now 3 in mod, 3 in domestic confi
46 cle757 : My wish list! CLE-FRA 767-200/300 CLE-LHR 757 CLE-HNL 767-300/400 CLE-EYW ERJ/CRJ CLE-COS 737/Airbus
47 COSPN : Most Likely yes...; because Its about bringing in more $$$ to the Philippines also PR and 5J will get approved as soon as they pass the FAA Audit (fa
48 TWA772LR : Does UA do IAD-PEK? If not, it seems like it'd be a good 777 route; being a star hub to star hub and capital to capital flight.
49 gemuser : Well it adds BNE, which is a plus, but it does nothing for MEL, which is approximately twice the size of BNE. It doesn't make the connection any easi
50 Post contains images VC10er : I am aware of Air New Zealand in Star, and code sharing, but if I book UA, but it's operated by NZ, then the revenue goes to NZ. In whole or in part.
51 legacyins : UA does IAD-PEK on a 777. UA 897/898
52 legacyins : When EI pulled out of SFO, local groups in Ireland and the Bay Area were lobbying UA to start a SFO-DUB route after EI passed the second time. Could b
53 eaglefarm4 : I have no doubt that BNE will be linked in to the USA once they get a considerable fleet of 787's.
54 shamrock604 : The Irish transport minister has also requested UA to look at SFODUB - it is a route sought after by the tech industry, who have commited to the purc
55 RyanairGuru : I guess that up until now UA haven't had the best fleet to operate this route. It will be interesting to see if it happens now that they have 2 class
56 shamrock604 : Indeed. UA have shown a renewed interest in serving Europe from SFO lately too, having added CDG (which is not exactly a high yield route). The tech
57 flyhossd : Interesting post. And I hate to rain on everyone's upbeat parade, but I see the opposite happening. That is, other than what's already been announced
58 VC10er : 767's can handle west coast to Europe? Whithere think there are only 2 767-400's, is their range similar to a 767-300ER?
59 RyanairGuru : I'm not sure about mainland Europe, but BA used to fly the 767 LAX-MAN, so I assume it's doable. Does anyone know what thrust rating BA have on their
60 Cubsrule : I don't know the thrust rating, but I think you'll find that LAX-CDG is the longest route a UA 763ER has ever operated.
61 mogandoCI : I'd say SFO-MEL before LAX-MEL. SFO-CAN before NGO. SFO-BKK with 788. EWR-DME with 763. Do a single plane IAH-IAD-RUH-JED to serve both govt and oil
62 MJBATC12 : I'd like to see BDL-SFO or BDL-IAH. IAH makes more sense though.
63 Post contains images RAGAZZO777 : IAD-LIM and IAH-SCL are on my wish list.
64 RDH3E : Not. Going. To. Happen. You'll see "one-stop" routing Mainland-GUM-MNL before you'll see that, which in itself is highly unlikely. Russia is a huge p
65 MasseyBrown : A piece in today's WSJ says a looming pilot shortage owing to both retirements and tightened experience levels will start to pinch by next summer and
66 Post contains images Tdan : SFO-SYD was on the ropes until QF dropped it. LAX-OZ is massive and despite the TBIT issues, the majority of connecting traffic chooses LAX over SFO
67 RyanairGuru : Guangzhou is a fast growing economic centre. While its growth as a financial centre will always be somewhat constrained since it is right next to Hon
68 Tdan : Oh there's definitely business traffic going to CAN, but my point was that most of it flies in and out of HKG (especially from the US). Reasons for t
69 RyanairGuru : Got you. I have only been to China for vacation, but my mother operates on a schedule similar to yours so I know what you mean. Sunday to PVG, Monday
70 legacyins : SFO - SYD is a quite strong route for UA and was never in danger of being dropped. The main reason UA started NGO originally was because they picked
71 icanfly : Surprised SYD-IAH hasn't been mentioned. My signature says it all!
72 BD338 : probably has a fantastic yield precisely because UA aren't on the route! Is there enough demand for 2 services and still make money? Off the wall tho
73 mogandoCI : The majority of connecting traffic is through LAX is because that's where QF VA and DL are, not because LAX airport is any superior to SFO. UA is enj
74 Tdan : It is now, but I heard it was a dumpster-fire post-GFC with QF competing on the route. Again, I wish! But range is the issue as well as beyond SYD co
75 RyanairGuru : I would love to see that, but I think that adding MEL, and then back-filling SYD with the lost MEL capacity would be there first priority. To be hone
76 B2443 : Chinese press has been all about CTU-SFO lately. Any truth to this?
77 neveragain : Does UA even have an aircraft that can fly the route? I don't think a 787-8 can. Perhaps the A350-900?
78 LAXdude1023 : Dont know that IAH-FOR/REC/MAO would work on any plane. Not much local market and the connections are almost all from the East Coast. Thats why ATL-B
79 Post contains images TWA772LR : I'd love to see IAH-SYD, but if IAH couldn't even get AKL, which is way more feasible, then IAH-SYD, is very slim to none . But I would settle for IAH
80 david_itl : granted that it was BD's longest standing profitable long-haul route out of MAN whilst competing with AA's service (remembering the distinctly odd si
81 LAXdude1023 : I dont think the target market is going to be South America. South American is much better accessable through SCL. The only major destination in Cent
82 TWA772LR : The 762s are going away, unfortunately. The 763 is the best bet, but unlike the 762, the 2-class config. will be more dense, as compared to the 762.
83 Viscount724 : Mexico is part of North America, not Central America.
84 Post contains images neveragain : Why "way more feasible"? Because the aircraft can actually get there before flaming out over the Pacific Ocean? If so, I'd say the chances of IAH-SYD
85 Viscount724 : 763s have operated quite a few routes longer than LAX-CDG. For example, Aeroflot used the 763 on LAX-SVO for several years before changing to the A33
86 RDH3E : They are signatory to NAFTA... But seriously, does anyone think UA actually has enough aircraft for expansion? I'm going to keep asking until I get a
87 mogandoCI : LAX is larger, but also more entrenched with oneworld on both ends (versus SFO where at least UA has an edge one side). SFO-MEL would require a small
88 Post contains images TWA772LR : Star hub to star hub, AKL is pretty much Stars gateway to almost all of Australia and Oceana if you are flying from the Americas, and the fact that A
89 RAGAZZO777 : Mexico City is most definitely NOT in Central America. On the other hand, Cancún is, geographically, in Central America.
90 miaskies : Eh.... the return of SFO-MIA? no reason why UA cannot fly 2 daily (319/73G/738/739ER) on this route. AA has such a monopoly on this route with 3 daily
91 BD338 : ah, yes, I'd forgotten about BD on that route. Maybe there is something in it for 2.
92 RyanairGuru : This is a seemingly never ending discussion on the Australian Aviation threads. There isn't a consensus on whether the 787 can fly DFW-SYD or not (in
93 neveragain : Damn. I like things to be black-and-white!!
94 kordcj : Isn't all of "Central America" considered to be part of North America? That's what I was taught in grade school.
95 neveragain : There's actually disagreement according to where you are from, which I wasn't aware of until recently. I believe Europeans generally think of North A
96 RyanairGuru : When I was at school in the UK I was taught that North America was everything from Panama north, while South America was everything south of the cana
97 mah4546 : ATLMAO doesn't work and isn't flown. Not only are these secondary markets East Coast-centric, they are Florida-centric outside of BSB/CNF. MAO has th
98 Post contains images TWA772LR : In the US, we are taught that everything from Panama, from its Colombian border, all the way up to northern Canada, including the Caribbean, is North
99 PHX Flyer : I would also like to see EWR-CGN return in a year or two.
100 Post contains images Tdan : Being the only nonstop is great, but when the local market is only 40 PDEW vs. a 200 PDEW market in LAX-MEL, it's a little hard to justify, especiall
101 dsuairptman : Will the Q400's be returning to IAH? If so it would be nice to see upgrades to GPT It would also be nice to see UA expand it's route map form GPT by a
102 VC10er : Well the Russian VISA problem is sad to read, but all too true. I am sitting on my sofa this morning because the Russian consulate (who used to requi
103 RDH3E : That's what I've been led to believe, although the VISA issues are really just a contributing factor. The market ran over 80% YTD before it was cance
104 mogandoCI : This is purely anecdotal, but i'm booked on LAX-SYD-MEL outbound and SYD-SFO inbound around thanksgiving, and judging from the seatmaps, both look eq
105 neveragain : It's hard to believe UA would reenter DME in the near future, even from EWR, after just cancelling the route. One would've thought that UA would've j
106 Tdan : 'Outperform' does not mean more full than the other. I was referring to profitability based on what I've heard.
107 LAXdude1023 : Ive heard the same thing. Despite having no competition in SFO-SYD, LAX-SYD still does better.
108 yellowtail : Did DL drop MAO? Living in Central America....the above is correct. Everything north of the canal is on the North American continent. Where the line
109 LAXdude1023 : Yes, I mispoke. I meant only BSB. My point is still the same. ATL would have an easier time supported routes that are heavy O&D from the East Coa
110 speedbird0125 : What about IAH-PEK, IAH-HKG, IAH-ICN?
111 LAXdude1023 : IAH-HKG is a measly 20 PDEW and IAH is not in a good geographic position to serve connections from it. Its a non-starter. IAH-China is a market that
112 tommy767 : IAH-SCL 788 SFO-CAN 788 EWR-VIE 763 We don't know for sure if IAD-DME was profitable or not. As said, EWR doesn't have a firm population of Russians e
113 CODC10 : Considering how poorly (in relative terms) the Atlantic is performing lately, it is hard to believe that UA would axe a profitable route. We can't kn
114 tommy767 : True. Although I'm sure the verdict is still out there if DME was to be better served from EWR. My guess is probably not. DME is just a tough market
115 neveragain : Axing a route! My favorite figure of speech on a.net! Must have special significance when it happens at PDX! But of course I agree. Both flown before
116 gigneil : There are a lot of suggested routes that I think are far beyond the capabilities of the airframe.... certainly SIN or MEL aren't likely to do well wit
117 klwright69 : How about some routes that are interesting, but not as sexy as some long haul routes: SFO and LAX to ATL. COS-EWR (like CO did in the olden-olden days
118 PMUA787 : Unless I didn't get the memo..RDU-SFO nonstop service started in August.
119 mbm3 : Indeed, my informed sources tell me that the using the 752 in this route is sadly not a practical option and that is why UA is still shipping PAX and
120 MasseyBrown : During the last year they operated, CLE-LHR got loads in the 70's and 80's; CLE-CDG got loads about 5 points higher. The loads were competitive with
121 tommy767 : I didn't really have a reason of putting 738 over 320, I was just stating that it would be great to see these routes come to fruition. Although SFO i
122 klwright69 : Well, there is no more CLE to Europe service so I guess it didn't work out.
123 RDH3E : Load Factor =/= Profit Load Factor + Good Yield = Profit I'll leave it to you which part you think was missing.[Edited 2012-11-15 12:55:33]
124 AirframeAS : This is what we were taught in school, so this is correct.
125 Post contains images LAXdude1023 : Me too. Regardless, I cant figure out why everyone was freaking out when I refered to Mexico as part of Central America.
126 VC10er : This got WAY off topic. MEXICO IS PART OF NORTH AMERICA. As for new routes for United, if I fly NY (EWR) to GRU the fair is about $6500 in business r
127 Post contains images delta2ual : As always, things could change, but everything I have seen from leadership says that growth will be slowed for the next few years. I think most of th
128 MasseyBrown : According to unofficial comments from CO staff, the CLE TATL routes were profitable during most of the summer season; but, with the merger coming up,
129 LAXdude1023 : The CLE-Europe market is surprisingly tiny. CVG-Europe is also small but its larger than CLE-Europe. The entire CLE-Europe O&D market couldnt fil
130 izbtmnhd : I'm not arguing your point, Cleveland is the smaller of the four UA hub markets you mention, but is there any real data that the NE Ohio-Europe marke
131 MasseyBrown : According to the equivalent of Chamber of Commerce data, in 2008 CLE TATL was about 250 originations a day, with a surprisingly large percentage head
132 LAXdude1023 : In 2011, the number was not that high. The largest CLE-Atlantic market was LHR and its only 32 PDEW. The second was CDG at 14 PDEW then FCO at 12 PDE
133 BoeingGuy : How about restarting: SJC-ORD SJC-EWR SJC-IAD
134 COSPN : We learned this form the car makers "made in America" does not mean the USA many are made in Canada and Mexico.. the Ford Crown Victoria "americas co
135 Post contains images Antoniemey : The fact that it has antiquated production techniques required to build it and that Ford has been developing a dedicated vehicle for the fleet market
136 klwright69 : Yes, and EWR-SMF and EWR-Oakland.
137 STT757 : UA was planning on launching SFO-HND, with those plans now changed I guess UA will have some extra International capacity. EWR-ICN?..
138 Post contains images United_fan : A ROC-DEN would be nice on a 752. One can dream
139 MasseyBrown : Thanks for the update. Even allowing for the bleed-off of passengers typically associated with a loss of non-stop service, those are pretty small num
140 Post contains images UnitedTristar : 'twas I who first suggested it, not the most profitable of routes but would definitely be an effective loss leader for corporate business in Boston!
141 N766UA : I do too, but I also don't think CLE should ever focus on TATL service. Cleveland's lucky to still have the hub (though it does seem to be earning it
142 Post contains images MasseyBrown : "Right-sized" being a little bigger than it is currently??? The thing about a TATL route is that many cities feel it is essential for bragging purpos
143 tommy767 : Is this seasonal? I know they fly a 757 occasionally on CLE-PHX. Would be cool to see a 757 on CLE-SAN.
144 N766UA : Of course. I'd like to see CLE back where it was 10 years ago, ~250 flights a day, not 180. I believe this was already announced as a new seasonal se
145 CALPSAFltSkeds : Occasionally CLE-SAN is flown over the Christmas Holiday, but the yields are probably a bit low. This route was flown years ago evening westbound, re
146 Post contains images HermansCVR580 : How about mainline service back to MKE maybe to IAH or SFO? We used to have mainline up until 2001. 727's and 757's to ORD Did a missed approach on a
147 MasseyBrown : Fares used to be dirt cheap, thanks to WN; but WN has been raising them along with everybody else. Looking at non-peak days between Christmas and New
148 Kiwinlondon : Quoting: Viscount724 How much service does a country with a population about the same as metro PHX need? If it was considered a profitable market by o
149 bartond : Yep, Air New Zealand has this one well covered but also, if you fly them one time you'll be hooked and wouldn't dream of flying UA on an LAX/SFO-AKL
150 mbm3 : According to my sources, as you mentioned earlier in the thread, the routes did pretty well for themselves but did not make a lot of sense with the c
151 capitalflyer : Far less glamorous than all these international options is the probable continued shift of regional flying from EWR to IAD (although this will create
152 Post contains images gigneil : I always said that I thought that would happen... reduce a crush-packed EWR and reroute connecting flows over IAD. Then I promptly forgot about the Ea
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