jetMarc From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 537 posts, RR: 2 Reply 1, posted (1 year 1 month 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4642 times:
This tag route has been rumoured for years and I feel its coincidental. One redeye is hardly reactionary when AS has depatures every 30 min. UA and CO have the same route too. A friend of mine commutes and says these flights are so full, she once spent 48 hours at the airport trying to nonrev. #72 on the standby list was her record. She would have just bought a ticket but walk up fare was almost $1400 one way. Im sure our flights will be priced well to be full and profitable.
"Sucka, I'm gonna send you out on Knuckle Airlines. Fist Class!!" ~ Mr. T
woodsboy From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 1023 posts, RR: 3 Reply 5, posted (1 year 1 month 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4640 times:
ZZZZZZZZ, I almost fell asleep.......just another summer seasonal route. The real news would have been if they committed to year round service that we can actually use. And yes, the SEA-ANC corridor is busy and full which I know comes as a surprise to most who have no expeirence on that route. I speak for those of us who have had to nonrev ANC-SEA-ANC, good lord, its a nightmare and YES you can get stuck for days at one end or the other.
wedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5766 posts, RR: 5 Reply 6, posted (1 year 1 month 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4638 times:
Quoting woodsboy (Reply 6): I speak for those of us who have had to nonrev ANC-SEA-ANC, good lord, its a nightmare and YES you can get stuck for days at one end or the other.
Which leads people to believe that there's plenty of traffic to go around on the SEA-ANC route. It probably will have minimal impact on Alaska's traffic, just like UA's flights. UA has two flights between SEA and ANC during the summer.
mtnwest1979 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 2290 posts, RR: 1 Reply 7, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4640 times:
I heard this when I was picking up a pass at B6 today in SEA, along with a couple other new locations.
I wish there was another multi-flight player on the SEA-ANC route. But, unlike the others above, I have not had troubles non-revving between the two. Although, I go on dead days and 11 out of 13 times not in summer lol.
Spot on!! Go year round and then I'll jump up and click my heels but it's seasonal. Who doesn't fly into ANC from SEA? Almost everybody except WN and Allegiant. Im trying to figure why Jetblue can't offer year-round service. I'm sure the lift is there is enough lift. Ideas?
Because it is doubtful they would have the traffic. Something ridicules like 80% (I don't know what the actual number is but it is insanely high) of Anchorage residents are Alaska frequent fliers. UA has year round flights and they are often my ticket out of ANC. In the wintertime when nearly 100% of the traffic are Alaska residents, Alaskas' flights can all be oversold and I can get out with my own row on United. Additionally, Alaska has "Club 49" which gives Alaska residents two free bags and 30% off airfares when traveling to/from Alaska which is what the other airlines are competing against when they are not flying in the summer.
As an Alaska employee I welcome the competition, I think often, increased competition makes you better and often has the effect of making the"pie" bigger which is a good thing for everyone.
Jetblue chose a 1am departure from ANC, which is interesting because Alaska has a 0030, 0100, 0130, and a 0230 flight around that time period. Not that there are really any holes worth filling in the schedule, but I guess it makes the flight pretty low risk since they are probably just filling dead time anyway.
PlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5068 posts, RR: 29 Reply 15, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 4634 times:
The late night/early morning flight pattern is very common on SEA-ANC-SEA. Even as a kid in the 70's we would always fly SEA-ANC leaving around 9pm, and then ANC-SEA leaving around 1am. It's a great use for an aircraft - ideal, really. I just hated getting to the airport up there at that hour.
For one additional flight? I seriously doubt that.
Quoting jetMarc (Reply 1): A friend of mine commutes and says these flights are so full, she once spent 48 hours at the airport trying to nonrev. #72 on the standby list was her record.
Getting to ANC as a non-rev is not really a problem, but getting out of ANC is a whole 'nuther ball game, a royal pain in the butt!!!! Having said that, B6 did not add that flight for non-rev's. That would be obviously silly to do.
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5011 posts, RR: 15 Reply 19, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4635 times:
B6 jumped into SEA-SAN back in May of 2008 and the route was gone by Sept of the following year. A single daily r/t. I don't remember any kind of retaliatory move by AS -- the "owner" of the market -- as they just waited for the itch to go away. This was part of a bit of experimentation by Blue back then with some intra-west coast growth, little or none of which stuck.
Even though this SEA-ANC move seems to have at least been triggered by AS's entry into the BOS-SAN market, I think Blue's new route will be gone soon. It just has the same feel as the above-mentioned scenario and doesn't seem very "serious" to me.
The one thing I am noticing however, is that along with their newly-announced ABQ-JFK service, Blue does seem to again be stirring just a little out west; like someone in Blue's Route Planning department just realized there is some of the U.S. west of the the Ol' Mississippi! Interesting to see where this goes...
wedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5766 posts, RR: 5 Reply 21, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4635 times:
Quoting SANFan (Reply 19): B6 jumped into SEA-SAN back in May of 2008 and the route was gone by Sept of the following year.
That was another B6 flight that was intended on being seasonal. They just never brought it back. I guess that's B6's way of trying a market out here. If it works out well and the bookings are solid, the flight may go year-round.
Quoting rotating14 (Reply 8): Who doesn't fly into ANC from SEA? Almost everybody except WN and Allegiant.
Only AS and UA and next summer B6, are the only airlines that serve SEA-ANC. No...WN and B6 do not serve ANC...yet.
Quoting mtnwest1979 (Reply 7): I wish there was another multi-flight player on the SEA-ANC route.
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5011 posts, RR: 15 Reply 22, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 4635 times:
Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 21): That was another B6 flight that was intended on being seasonal. They just never brought it back. I guess that's B6's way of trying a market out here. If it works out well and the bookings are solid, the flight may go year-round
Not quite D. Although the flight was announced as seasonal, it operated year-round (including thru the winter of 2008/9) for the year plus. (And given the year-round market that SAN-SEA is, it seemed very odd to me for Blue to think about flying it seasonally.) There was some question when the route was suspended in Sept of 2009 whether it would come back or not but of course it never did.
While I'm at it, I will revise a statement I made:
Quoting SANFan (Reply 19): This was part of a bit of experimentation by Blue back then with some intra-west coast growth, little or none of which stuck.
Some of the experimentation DID stick, such as some new LGB routes that were added at that same time. What I meant was that none of the added SAN stuff lasted -- SEA nor SLC. (That was also the time when B6 opened LAX.)
PlanesNTrains From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 5068 posts, RR: 29 Reply 23, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 4634 times:
Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 18): Getting to ANC as a non-rev is not really a problem, but getting out of ANC is a whole 'nuther ball game, a royal pain in the butt!!!!
Why only one-way? It would seem logical that for every person going one direction that there would be a person going the other direction - in an overall way? Maybe it was the times you flew one way versus the other? I'm just trying to figure out this statement.
Quoting SANFan (Reply 19): B6 jumped into SEA-SAN back in May of 2008 and the route was gone by Sept of the following year. A single daily r/t. I don't remember any kind of retaliatory move by AS -- the "owner" of the market -- as they just waited for the itch to go away. This was part of a bit of experimentation by Blue back then with some intra-west coast growth, little or none of which stuck.
One thing to add to that is that this period had to have been the toughest period to try out new routes since 9/11. The economy hit the skids in Sept 08 and certainly through 2009 was struggling quite a bit. I'm not saying the route would work now, but I'm saying that it would be a better time to try than when they did before.
SANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5011 posts, RR: 15 Reply 24, posted (1 year 1 month 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4638 times:
Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 23): One thing to add to that is that this period had to have been the toughest period to try out new routes since 9/11. The economy hit the skids in Sept 08 and certainly through 2009 was struggling quite a bit. I'm not saying the route would work now, but I'm saying that it would be a better time to try than when they did before.
Absolutely. But since some of the routes they tried then have stuck around (LGB), I just don't think Blue gave it long enough, gave the route enough capacity, or, perhaps, cared enough about trying to make it work. Or it just really wasn't a viable route for them and they saw that after a year...
I do still find it interesting, especially given the history that Blue has in the SAN-SEA market, and IF this SEA-ANC announcement is a shot at AS, that Blue didn't dust off the SAN-SEA route and jump in there instead of what they have done? I know that SEA-ANC IS Alaska Airlines (as has been pointed out several times in this thread) and that's perhaps why B6 (sort of) chose it to try to strike at AS close to home.
And of course there is the theory that these 2 announcements are all just a big, juicy coincidence and have absolutely nothing to do with each other...
Isn't A.net great?
25 AirframeAS: It's pretty isolated up there, not much to do other than enjoying the scenery. It's like everyone in town is trying to get back to civilization. (Thi
26 PlanesNTrains: SEA-ANC has several things going for it: 1. It can be marketed as a seasonal route, but stick around if the need is there. 2. It's almost like a "sur
27 wedgetail737: Not to mention the tonnage of freight that is transported back and forth between SEA and ANC. B6 could make quite a bit of money just on freight alon
28 PlanesNTrains: I'm hopeful it will be successful, but the one thing that UA has that B6 doesn't is the amount of feed/connections at SEA. They can stick it out year
29 N737AA: If nothing else its another non-rev "escape route". N737AA
30 AirframeAS: Not really. The non-rev issue is still there with B6 adding this one flight. Sure, it helps with the yields, but the change is only a very tiny fract
31 UA735WL: B6 should tread carefully......AS is VERY good at defending its turf....
32 CalebWilliams: I think one of the reasons for this is because AS offers Alaska residents various way to earn Alaska Airlines miles. For instance, when customers hav
33 doug_Or: And never come back? Doesn't really answer the question.
34 AirframeAS: I don't know, as I said before. You'd have to ask AS that question. I'm only speaking from experience. I'd go back to ANC anytime, but not as a non-r
35 Viscount724: At least during the summer I think there's a lot of Alaska cruise traffic that flies one way and cruises the other when they don't have time for the
36 Roseflyer: SEA-ANC is one of the busiest routes in the nation. There are about 20 daily flights in the summer (19 AS and 1 UA). There is enough demand for JetBlu
37 wedgetail737: UA now has 2X daily SEA-ANC flights. I don't know if that's completely accurate. AS may have had an impact, but it was bad management at Mark Air and
38 RWA380: You are so right Wedge, both BF & WC's demise came when they tried to get into the lower 48 flying, and very quickly at that. Here are a few exam
39 BoeingGuy: AS didn't drive QQ out of the market. QQ was still serving SEA-ANC at the time of the AA gutting. AA continued SEA-ANC with an MD-80 for awhile after
40 GentFromAlaska: The ANC-SEA also allows allows for better connecting to most if not all SEA bank of flights flying to the East coast. AS use to run a seasonal JNU (J
41 BoeingGuy: Yeah, I looked at that once too. It was a heck of a red-eye. I recall it left JNU at 1:00am and arrived in SEA at 4:00am, local times. Last time I lo
42 flyby519: How about aircraft rotations? I havent researched but is this just another case of sending an a/c somewhere instead of letting it sit idle somewhere l
43 wnflyguy: I think this market will stay year round at B6. With one free checked bag this will be a hit with Hunters and fisher men. This is a Market that my bel
44 GentFromAlaska: I have a hunch moose wouldn't qualify for the free piece of checked baggage!
45 BoeingGuy: As much as I'm a big fan of AS, the charge for first checked bag infuriates me. I was really hoping that B6 and WN would really stick it to them by o
46 wnflyguy: Funny. But a extra bag of gear is a savings of almost $50 dollars round trip. wnfg
47 atct: UA stopped flying back in 06 I believe. With the CO merger, they picked up CO's SEA-ANC runs (and since expanded alot!). As a local of Anchorage I ca
48 klwright69: I have no doubt this route will work, even if it's just seasonal. During the summer there is a lot of traffic as everyone else indicated. Premerger, C
49 klwright69: I think UA added a 2nd year round nonstop because they decided that if they were going to serve the market at all, it was worth it to be more competit
50 EA CO AS: Not a factor; Alaskans who are members of Club 49 (and most are!) get their bags free on AS already.
51 RWA380: It is up here in the Pacific Northwest, unlike AS which is a household name.
52 klwright69: True. But B6 can build awareness over time.
53 EA CO AS: Unlikely; in the PNW, "buy local" actually means something. I don't know that I see this route working out for B6.
54 alaska737: I think this will be great for jumpeseaters. AS is always full and you're lucky if you can get a middle seat in the back or one of the jumpseats. UA i
55 wingnutmn: I don't understand why they would fly SEA-ANC, even if it is only a redeye, but won't fly a MSP-BOS or MSP-JFK because DL is too strong on the route.
56 GentFromAlaska: Business travelers yes. I might argue many Alaskans and tourist who fly once or twice a year and there are many who are not members of AS Club 49
57 AirframeAS: I think you have to be in CASS to jumpseat.
58 alaska737: Are you referring to me? I am in CASS.
59 AirframeAS: Not every airline employee is qualified to be in CASS. Just thought I'd point that out before anyone here gets confused.
60 RWA380: B6 has been in the Northwest for many years, yet there is no public recognition still, it won't happen here, below is the answer why B6 won't take mu
61 alaska737: Right just flight crew on airlines that are members of CASS. I was just saying its a great deal for me really to have another option because I fly ba
62 klwright69: Before the CO merger didn't UA do DEN-ANC?
63 santi319: Lol! I love all these a-netters that everytime an airline that dominates a market, like AA or AS or WN, gets competition of a lcc like NK or B6, they
64 mtnwest1979: Yes, as well as SFO and ORD, but it was all seasonal IIRC. Last DC-10 trip I had was UA SEA-ANC in 2000(?) they had stubbed a 733. Very wide open lol
65 ASFlyer: Yes, in a very regulated industry and by offering low fares that nobody else offered at the time with extraordinarily low costs. Fast forward to 2012
66 AirframeAS: You forgot mechanics and dispatchers.
67 RWA380: 1 seasonal flight vs 18 daily flights is not even close to "competition". AS itself, on it's website touts themselves as an LCC. In NK's case, that i
68 atct: This ended in 2006 I believe. United was gone for 3 or 4 years before the merger brought "them" back again via pmCO flights. All the current (since 2
69 EA CO AS: My information says your argument is horribly flawed.
70 yeelep: Why on earth would an Alaskan want to travel outside the state to hunt or fish? I would assume that most Business travelers that fly AS ANC-SEA-ANC ar
71 tdscanuck: Does Alaska have year-round hunting & fishing (both legal season and weather)? I'm pretty sure a lot of tasty birds get the heck out of Alaska fo
72 HiFlyerAS: Very true...AS is most definitely the hometown airline, as is Boeing is the hometown aircraft (AS will never buy Airbus...never), Nordstrom the homet