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VS Wins All LHR Slots For Short-Haul Ops  
User currently offlineAA94 From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 602 posts, RR: 2
Posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3697 times:

A UK regulatory board awarded VS all LHR landing slots that were vacated by the merger of BMI and BA.

Multiple news sources:

http://www.ausbt.com.au/virgin-atlan...-scotland-flights-start-march-2013

http://www.usatoday.com/story/todayi...n-atlantic-heathrow-slots/1712857/

Looks like things are about to get mighty interesting.

[Edited 2012-11-18 17:14:29]


Choose a challenge over competence / Eleanor Roosevelt
59 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7639 posts, RR: 18
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3709 times:

Quoting AA94 (Thread starter):
Looks like things are about to get mighty interesting.

What about the current BA short haul slots, if any? This does sound a bit surprising. For VS, what is considered "short-haul" though?



我思うゆえに我あり。(Jap. 'I think, therefore I am.')
User currently offlineAA94 From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 602 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3707 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 1):
What about the current BA short haul slots, if any? This does sound a bit surprising. For VS, what is considered "short-haul" though?

VS is planning to launch intra-UK flights in 2013, and these slots were a major step in finalizing that plan.

Previously, VS announced the start of LHR-MAN service to begin 31MAR13. According to news outlets, they are also planning to launch service to Aberdeen and Edinburgh. A timetable is expected to come forward in the next few days.

All short-haul ops will be flown by leased A319 aircraft.



Choose a challenge over competence / Eleanor Roosevelt
User currently offlineNWADTWE16 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 242 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

Great news for VS and for their long-haul connections =)

User currently offlineRyanairGuru From Australia, joined Oct 2006, 5624 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3711 times:

I know that they missed out on the Russia slots, but did they end up applying for Egypt or Saudi Arabia in the end?

(did any airline apply for those authorities?)



Worked Hard, Flew Right
User currently offlinespiritair97 From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 1231 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

Quoting AA94 (Reply 2):

I assume these a319s will be in VS colors?


User currently offlinevincewy From Taiwan, joined Oct 2005, 767 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

Are there conditions attached to this deal for VS? Such as maintaining those slots for domestic routes rather than switching to other international routes.

User currently offlinetoltommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3295 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3711 times:

Who will actually operate the short haul flights? VS flying their own metal, or will they contract out the flying?

User currently offlineAA94 From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 602 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3709 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 5):
I assume these a319s will be in VS colors?

That is the impression I get. I'm not completely sure on that, though.

Quoting vincewy (Reply 6):
Are there conditions attached to this deal for VS? Such as maintaining those slots for domestic routes rather than switching to other international routes.

I don't know for sure. I don't believe there are strings attached, but again, I am not sure.

Quoting toltommy (Reply 7):
Who will actually operate the short haul flights? VS flying their own metal, or will they contract out the flying?

Virgin Atlantic operates the flights. VS flying leased A319s. Lessor undetermined as of yet.

To all: We will be hearing more details tomorrow I am told. VS has only really sketched out their plans as of yet, but now that they have slots available to them I believe we will be hearing more on this topic come tomorrow. Unfortunately, specific information has been generally spotty.



Choose a challenge over competence / Eleanor Roosevelt
User currently offlinemel From Canada, joined Oct 1999, 1098 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

wonder where they will gate these A319 flights @ LHR?


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User currently offlineAndy33 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2009, 301 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

A good question. It will probably have to be T1 for now as T3 and T4 are not equipped to handle Domestic flights (no way of segregating arrivals so they bypass Immigration and Customs). In 2013-14 the first phase of new T2 will open and T1 will close. At this point your guess is as good as mine as there might have been time to modify an existing terminal.
It's not a huge problem to connect between T1 and T3 - walkable landside and transfer buses airside.


User currently offlineanstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 3709 times:

Quoting AA94 (Reply 2):

All short-haul ops will be flown by leased A319 aircraft.

I believe it will end up being a A319/A320 mix.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 4):
I know that they missed out on the Russia slots, but did they end up applying for Egypt or Saudi Arabia in the end?

They applied for all the available slots - so that included Riyadh, Nice and Cairo.

Quoting mel (Reply 9):
wonder where they will gate these A319 flights @ LHR?

Presumably T1 as that is where bmi operated from and these slots relate to that.


User currently offlineBongodog1964 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 3602 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3707 times:

Is there a link to any official announcement on this ?

VS don't mention it on their website, nor does the CAA


User currently offlineanstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3708 times:

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 12):
Is there a link to any official announcement on this ?

VS don't mention it on their website, nor does the CAA

There is a quote from wridgeway here

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-20384801

And its being reported in most online press now.


User currently offlineEagleBoy From Niue, joined Dec 2009, 1842 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3707 times:
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Quoting toltommy (Reply 7):
Who will actually operate the short haul flights?

No news on that so far....assume 2-3 A319 to start with?

Quoting vincewy (Reply 6):
Are there conditions attached to this deal for VS?

I believe they have to serve the designated airports for 2-3 years. I have a memory of reading this when the issue first came up, but can't find the reference since.


User currently offlineLHRFlyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2010, 816 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3710 times:

Quoting vincewy (Reply 6):
Are there conditions attached to this deal for VS? Such as maintaining those slots for domestic routes rather than switching to other international routes.

Yes. They can eventually use the slots for other short-haul European services but they can't just convert them to long-haul.


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4928 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3711 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 5):

Quoting AA94 (Reply 2):

I assume these a319s will be in VS colors?

I believe these birds will come from their American off shoot VX considering they have cancelled 20 of the 30 frames on order...?

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineCometOrbit From United Kingdom, joined May 2008, 13 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3714 times:

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 12):
Is there a link to any official announcement on this ?
VS don't mention it on their website, nor does the CAA

From the Virgin Group web site:
http://www.virgin.com/travel/news/vi...ic-wins-uk-short-haul-flying-slots


User currently offlineDano1977 From British Indian Ocean Territory, joined Jun 2008, 499 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3714 times:

::::Looking into the very near future:::::::

Virgin launch domestic flights with a lot of razzmatazz - along with Sir Richard pictured with scantily clad actress/model/celebrity

Initial press conference Virgin Good - BA the spawn of the devil evil evil evil evil - brings competitiveness to UK domestic market blah blah blah, BA evil devil evil etc

Price War


Sir Richard, then in some highbrow paper, complaining that BA is abusing its position and forcing uneconomical prices on domestic market - But despite losing £££ we will stay in the fight and be the true consumer champion - BA Evil

Virgin Quietly drops domestic services



Children should only be allowed on aircraft if 1. Muzzled and heavily sedated 2. Go as freight
User currently offlineGCT64 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 1399 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3709 times:

Quoting Andy33 (Reply 10):
In 2013-14 the first phase of new T2 will open and T1 will close. At this point your guess is as good as mine as there might have been time to modify an existing terminal.

Given that we have also seen VS express a strong interest in moving to the new T2 and multiple mentions of VS joining Star (whose LHR base will be in T2), it appears that this will pan out as: VS joins Star, VS moves to the new T2, domestic gates are provided at the new T2 for simple connections on Star airlines to/from MAN, ABZ, EDI.



Flown in: A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A388,BA11,BU31,B190, B461,B462,(..51 types..),VC10,WESX
User currently offlineual777uk From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2005, 3356 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3707 times:

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 5):
I assume these a319s will be in VS colors?

For the reasons stated by Dano1977 there is no way SRB will not make a splash with this, assuming it really does come to fruition and so we are sure to see the aircraft in full VS livery and i think they will look grand.

Interesting times


User currently offline747438 From UK - England, joined Jan 2007, 838 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3713 times:

Quoting mel (Reply 9):
wonder where they will gate these A319 flights @ LHR?
Quoting Andy33 (Reply 10):
It will probably have to be T1 for now
Quoting anstar (Reply 11):
Presumably T1 as that is where bmi operated from and these slots relate to that.

They will operate out of T3.

Quoting Dano1977 (Reply 18):
Virgin Quietly drops domestic services

I hope so


User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3718 times:

They've already mocked up their livery on an A320:

facebook.com/virginatlantic

"G-VMAN"

[Edited 2012-11-19 02:25:27]

User currently offlineanstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5252 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3716 times:

Quoting Dano1977 (Reply 18):
Virgin Quietly drops domestic services

Hardly - They are not just getting domestic pax - the main point is to get pax onto their long haul flights ex LHR.

Quoting 747438 (Reply 21):
They will operate out of T3.

How? There is no domestic ability at T3.... MAN is already announced as being out of T1.


User currently offlineAA94 From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 602 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3717 times:

LHR-MAN flights operate out of T1, and arrive into MAN T3.

http://virginatlantic.custhelp.com/a...MTM1MzMyMTk1NS9zaWQvVlBTVmVGYmw%3D



Choose a challenge over competence / Eleanor Roosevelt
25 Dano1977 : It was a tongue in cheek reply. But you didn't disagree with the rest of it, so I will assume it will follow the same Virgin/Sir Richard script for l
26 Post contains images 747438 : Read my profile I think I know what I'm on about
27 visualapproach : You can just about see the mood lighting and live Sky TV through one of those windows.
28 shankly : Perfectly described Dano Already Steve Ridgeway has stated "We have fought hard for the right to fly short-haul and take a strong challenge to Britis
29 MACDADDY : Looks like the aircraft will be coming from Avion Express (LY registered carrier). They have A320 and A319 and operate on wet lease basis, so it all m
30 virginblue4 : Looking forward to seeing A319/A320's in VS colours! Why do you hope they stop services? Competition is a good thing....
31 skidmarque : When Virgin eventually pull off of these domestic services, what happens to the slots ? Would VS keep them or would they returned to BA / allocated to
32 Dano1977 : To be fair, it's the standard virgin play book. Anybody going to open a book on which actress/model/celeb is going to be scantily dressed for the pho
33 Post contains images sevenheavy : I guess time will tell....... Why on earth would you hope for something like that? Even if you arent a fan of VS, choice is a good thing. It always a
34 flywrite : I wonder if they're considering introducing any domestic flights into Gatwick? Given that BA is cancelling all LGW-MAN flights soon, it'd be a nice st
35 skipness1E : Doubt it, only the first wave would feed long haul, unlike LHR where they have mulitple flights out per day spread across til evening.
36 Dano1977 : Don't think LGW domestics Ops is a go for Virgin. Especially on price sensitive bucket and spade flights. Anyway, they got LHR slots.
37 Post contains links VV701 : The actual wording is that the slots applied for must be used on the designated routes for "six (6) consecutive IATA Seasons". So that means from the
38 GCT64 : It will be interesting to see what pricing, and what impact on pricing, VS has on LHR-EDI. Today (19 Nov), I believe that BA has operated 12 flights L
39 downtown273 : If VS join Star Alliance then it would be good news for pax in Scandinavia, SK mainly fly to LHR and very little more, so it would give access to more
40 Richard28 : interesting... thought it was odd that MAN was announced from T1 when that was launched... good for Star connections but not for VS.... T3 would also
41 fcogafa : If the route is indeed operated by a Lithuanian carrier Virgin will have to be careful that their reputation is not dragged down by any associated pro
42 Post contains images lightsaber : How many slot pairs were awarded? I recall a small number, but I'd like a verification. My thought before I read about the wet lease. Besides, VS will
43 by738 : Leased Lithuanian carrier....? aaaargh !
44 Post contains images ZSOFN : My own attempt at a mockup:
45 skipness1E : I would imagine cabin crew and branding will be VS with aircraft and flight deck from Lithuania. Given they will have ABZ/EDI/MAN, I imagine they will
46 clydenairways : Maybe they will employ local crews and engineers for this operation.
47 sevenheavy : The flights will be from T1, not T3. The wet lease is purely because VS really couldn't order aircraft until they knew they would get the routes, and
48 LHRFlyer : Once again, Virgin is prohibited from just converting the slots to long-haul after three years. They can only use them for another European short-hau
49 by738 : Can't see GLA. I expect the short haul operation to be a token gesture by 2016.
50 aamd11 : Ridgeway: "We have fought hard for the right to fly short haul" Someone help me, I'm confused... what exactly was stopping a UK based carrier operatin
51 AA94 : I believe it was the fact that there were no (or very little) short haul slots available at LHR. Once BA acquired BMI, those slots freed up because o
52 ChrisM001 : Do Virgin get the slots for free from BA, or do they have to pay a pre-agreed amount? Does the EU set this amount?
53 jumpjets : Plus 2 slot pairs that were pre-allocated to Transaero for Moscow services.
54 Post contains links fcogafa : Found the relevant section of the agreement regarding the grandfathering of the slots: http://ec.europa.eu/competition/merg...6447_20120330_20212_2452
55 capri : How about CMN, BA abandoned this route acquired from BMI and AT load factor is over 80%, and this route needs a competitor
56 Post contains links Hywel : A Lithuanian carrier, Avion Express will be operating the flights. http://flyavex.com/carrier-oppurtunities
57 Vasu : ...why?
58 anstar : I'd say because it is an EU carrier that specialises in wet leasing and has the available capacity! But thats just my guess!
59 skipness1E : Really? Larger market than Aberdeen by far with an existing Virgin operation? I suspect entry into STAR will see VS resume the old BD LHR-GLA route g
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