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Turkish Aviation December 2012  
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4475 posts, RR: 12
Posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19436 times:

Happy 6th anniversary to our "Turkish Aviation" threads!
Thank you everyone for making these threads informative, fun and free of political or personal attacks over the years.


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Photo © Szabo Gabor



I know we talk a lot about TK, but there is always exciting news about TK. But here I start with Pegasus;
-Pegasus order appearantly a done deal, probably an announcement will be made for 70+30 aircraft, A320NEOs.
-TK order of 15+5 77Ws, could very well be already decided at 20.
-TK 333s starting to arrive next year. ( 2 frames)
-TK to order 100 narrow bodies soon. Split??
-New Istanbul airports first phase might not be ready till after 2016.
-AC to start IST 3 x weekly with 763s, and AC and TK to codeshare.
-Hamdi Topcu of TK said TK would fly to 35 destinations in Africa by the end of the year back in January. Fack check; he is pretty close.
-TK to open 33 new routes in 2013; and here is a wish list from TK (thanks to Leftyboarder) please correct if wrong!


Abha
Abuja
Al-Qassim
Asmara
Aswan
Atlanta
Boston
Buenos Aires
Caracas
Colombo
Constanta
Douala
Esfahan
Havana
Houston
Kano
Kermanshah
Kharkiv
Kilimanjaro
Krakow
Libreville
Luanda
Luxembourg
Luxor
Malta
Manila
Marseille
Mexico City
Mombasa
Montreal
Niamey
Ouagadougou
Salzburg
San Francisco
Santiago de Compostela
Tallinn
Vilnius
Yaunde

Please take it from here and welcome everyone!
TK787

[Edited 2012-11-30 11:21:35]

[Edited 2012-11-30 11:22:49]

237 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSCQ83 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1152 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19430 times:

A Coruña (LCG) has been discarded and switched to Santiago de Compostela (SCQ). Time schedules are already official and tickets for sale:

http://airlineroute.net/2012/11/30/tk-scq-s13/

Quote:
Turkish Airlines starting 21MAY13 will launch Istanbul Ataturk – Santiago de Compostela service, on board Airbus A319 aircraft. Service operates 3 times a week.

Schedule:

TK1319 IST0900 – 1245SCQ 319 257
TK1320 SCQ1350 – 1915IST 319 257

SCQ is TK’s 6th destination in Spain.


User currently offlinekaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12593 posts, RR: 34
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19399 times:

Congratulations on six terrific years; it's always been interesting to read the Turkish threads, and great to see how fast TK is expanding (and that DUB is part of that network!).

Looks like 2013 is going to be another exciting year for TK, with lots of new destinations - looks like it will be more than EK, EY and QR put together - and good to see that the airline is solidly in profit.

Just two questions I have, in relation to the airline's fleet choices. The airline's recent WB order has been split pretty much fifty/fifty - in numbers, if not necessarily in dollar value. I think we all expect a split between the Neo and the Max for the new WB order, but to what extent does government "guidance" come in here? Is TK still required/"encouraged" to split orders between Boeing and Airbus? I ask this principally because compared to a few years ago, Turkey's geopolitical importance has increased very much; ok, it was always important, but with the collapse of the Syrian regime (imminent), the isolation of Iran and the confusion over Egypt's direction, Turkey is pretty much the regional powerhouse ... why does Turkey still need to please both the US and Europe when it comes to aircraft orders?

The second question is: with TK building its widebody fleet for the next few years on the 77W and A330, does it not risk falling behind regional competitors who have ordered the A350 and 787; I realise that the question of a possible 787/A350 order has been discussed here at length, but does the recent A330/777 order mean that the "next generation" order has fallen down the priority list?

[Edited 2012-11-30 11:05:42]

User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4475 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19388 times:

Quoting kaitak (Reply 2):
why does Turkey still need to please both the US and Europe when it comes to aircraft orders?

My humble opinion, it is a matter of getting better pricing and better delivery dates.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 2):
but does the recent A330/777 order mean that the "next generation" order has fallen down the priority list?

TK said 787 is too small for them. We will see a 350 order in the future, I think.
Reminder, TK to go from 36 WB aircraft this year to 69 WB aircraft in the next 5 years.


User currently offlineLCYFlyer From Germany, joined Oct 2007, 23 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19382 times:

What surprises me is the (planned) addition to Havana. What will the frequency be? Is there even a demand for that route?


Cheers, Pierre
User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 522 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19367 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 3):
TK said 787 is too small for them. We will see a 350 order in the future, I think.

As Kotil said in an interview they initially could order 5 A350s. And this means i won my inofficial bet against you, TK787  


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4475 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 19359 times:

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 1):
A Coruña (LCG) has been discarded and switched to Santiago de Compostela (SCQ). Time schedules are already official and tickets for sale:

Thanks, made changes above.

Quoting LCYFlyer (Reply 4):
What surprises me is the (planned) addition to Havana. What will the frequency be? Is there even a demand for that route?

This is just a wish list. Last months thread there were talks about joining HVN with MEX. Who knows? I was talking to friends in Istanbul. Lots of Havana vacationers amongst them.
This could be seasonal and 2-3 x weekly at best I imagine, if ever.

Were there ever Havana charters by TK?


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4475 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 19341 times:

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 5):
i won my inofficial bet against you, TK787

We had a bet??? Still yet to be determined
 
I would like to remind you, I have a very close friend who is a member, but likes to keep it quiet; "TK350", joined a.net Nov 2007


User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 522 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 19322 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 7):
We had a bet??? Still yet to be determined

I would like to remind you, I have a very close friend who is a member, but likes to keep it quiet; "TK350", joined a.net Nov 2007

Yes, look at our names. This is why i said inofficial.

Most probably he is the reason why i have my current name.


User currently offlinestylo777 From Germany, joined Feb 2006, 3022 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 19264 times:

In last month thread pilotaydin highlighted the importance of the 330 family in TKs fleet. I can only acknowledge that. The two passenger versions as well as the freighter are the real backbone of the longhaul fleet; in my oppinion even more suitable than the 77W. This will get even better when Airbus is able to realise the 242t MTOW version of the 333. Far-East, Africa and the most important parts of Northamerica can be operated very easily and more important economically. As far as I remember they have 15 on order?!?

User currently offlineJU068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2773 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 19213 times:
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Wasn't there talk about Pegasus opening a base at Tymvou in northern Cyprus?

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26145 posts, RR: 50
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 19215 times:

Happy December. Hopefully those in colder climates stay warm.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 2):
but to what extent does government "guidance" come in here? Is TK still required/"encouraged" to split orders between Boeing and Airbus?

The Turkish state still owns 49% of the airline, it appoints both the CEO and Chairman, and various ministries have their fingers in the airline as well.
I can go into deeper details, but ultimately such major fleeting decisions are not made without blessing of parties in Ankara.


Quoting JU068 (Reply 12):
Wasn't there talk about Pegasus opening a base at Tymvou in northern Cyprus?

A bit back Pegasus was asked by the Turkish Cypriot government about looking into setting up something now that Cyprus Turkish Airlines is long gone. Who knows what will come of this.
Atlasjet similarly looked at such a venture after CTA shutdown, but opted against it.

Btw - the name is Ercan airport located in Lefkosa.

Speaking of Pegasus, I understand they are in talks about possibly buying into, or taking over MyTechnic at SAW.
With a growing fleet, Pegasus wants a hangar and maintenance base, and buying into MyTechnic might be quicker and cheaper than developing the infrastructure organically.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineJU068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2773 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 19171 times:
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Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
Btw - the name is Ercan airport located in Lefkosa.

Actually the airport is located in the village of Tymvou, but the airport is also referred to it by that name. From Wikipedia : ' Location Tymvou, Cyprus' . Funnily enough, even flight radar 24 uses Tymvou and not Ercan for flights departing from the north.

Lefkosa is the Turkish name for the city. In English it is Nicosia.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26145 posts, RR: 50
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 19173 times:

And not to get into politics, but since the airport is in Turkish side of Cyprus it has a Turkish name.

As they say, when in Rome....



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTK1244 From Netherlands, joined May 2007, 330 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 19109 times:

A quick summary of the situation in Izmir following the comment of LAXintl in the previous thread ("As I recall the the commercial airport at Izmir prior to ADB opening was Cigli"):
Cumaovasi (IZM) was the main airport of Izmir, but became too small to serve Izmir. So all commercial flights were moved to Cigli Air Base (IGL). For a very short period, the commercial flights were shifted from IGL to IZM (1974-1975) and back to IGL (not later than 1977). IZM got demolished and the current Adnan Menderes Airport (ADB) was built instead. I can't really say where IZM was located, but it should be somewhere near or at the current location of ADB.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
A bit back Pegasus was asked by the Turkish Cypriot government about looking into setting up something now that Cyprus Turkish Airlines is long gone. Who knows what will come of this.

What happened to the "North Cyprus Airlines" project?



"The future is in the skies. For any nation that cannot defend its skies will never be confident of its future." Atatürk
User currently offlineJU068 From Vanuatu, joined Aug 2009, 2773 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 18977 times:
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Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):

Yes, but we do not speak Turkish on this website but English, hence why it makes little sense to use any name other than Nicosia.

Quoting TK1244 (Reply 14):
What happened to the "North Cyprus Airlines" project?

I think after they were left with no other choice but to close down KTHY, they realized that they do not have the necessary funds to run an airline. On top of it all, the fact that it could not fly directly to any airport beyond Turkey made it even more difficult, especially after increased competition from mainland Turkey.


User currently offlineFreshSide3 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 327 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 18701 times:
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How about Sochi? Many Russians like to go to Turkey for holiday. Also, there is practically nothing that doesn't involve Moscow, that connects North America to Sochi. It would certainly be a natural for TK to do.

User currently offlineSCQ83 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1152 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 18686 times:

Quoting FreshSide3 (Reply 16):

TK already flies to Sochi.


User currently offlineFreshSide3 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 327 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 18414 times:
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Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 17):
TK already flies to Sochi.

Thanks for pointing this out......had to look again. The midnight departure from IST prevents people from pulling it up as a "connection" from the JFK flight. The flights from the states either miss it by a few hours, or there is an extremely long layover. Plus it is non-daily, too. Which is why I had troubles pulling it up in the schedules.

But it is welcome, without question. Hopefully, TK will increase the frequency, in the future, especially with the Olympics coming up in 2014.


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 696 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 18320 times:

And two more destinations from the wish list become real: TK begins Esfahan and Kermnshah; both 2 weekly. Reported by airlineroute.net. Can't paste details as I am posting on my phone...

User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4475 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 18302 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 19):
http://airlineroute.net/2012/12/03/tk-iran-dec12/

also this, TK to base 15 planes at SAW next summer, from "tozbek";
http://kokpit.aero/thy-sabiha-gokcen-ucak-base


User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 6061 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 18179 times:

Airblue plan to resume Istanbul but no date given, the A340 that tech stopped at Ankara was due to crew rest issue according to the airlines unofficial facebook page.

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 26145 posts, RR: 50
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 18162 times:

Hello all,

Last month in another thread there was a brief discussion about how some airline network routes can have very high reliance on transfer traffic for their existence.

Following this thread, I was asked my a member if I could share information and provide a bigger network picture for TK to display how routes can be interdependent.

Accordingly here is a long haul route profile for TK that shows how virtually all its longhaul routes rely on huge numbers of hub feed connections. The posted data is looking back 12-months as of June 2012.


Legend is:

Destination / 12-month load factor % / Percent of IST vs Transfer / Top 5 Intl transfer cities

Bangkok / 78% / 41 vs 58% / ARN, CPH, GOT, TLV, HEL
Beijing / 73% / 29% vs 71% / ODS, TLV, OTP, ATH, CDG
Bombay / 82% / 24 vs 76% / TLV, ARN, LHR, IAD, ORD
Chicago / 82% / 47 vs 53% / TLV, BOM, ADD, NBO, IKA
Delhi / 75% / 23 vs 77% / TLV, BCN, IAD, TXL, CPH
Dhaka / 79% / 11 vs 88% / MXP, TIP, IAD, ARN, TLV, ODS, OTP, ALG, KBP
Hong Kong / 75% / 50 vs 50% / TLV, OTP, ATH, VCE, ODS
Johannesburg / 79% / 33 vs 67% / SOF, CPH, ARN, MXP, TXL
Lagos / 77% / 27 vs 73% / LHR, TLV, MXP, DUB, ATH
Los Angeles / 77% / 45 vs 53% / IKA, BEY, TLV, BOM, AMM
New York / 78% / 58 vs 41% / TLV, IKA, NBO, BEY, GYD
Osaka / 71% / 50 vs 50% / BCN, CDG, FCO, TLV, MUC
Sao Paulo / 71% / 36 vs 64% / BEY, ATH, TLV, DEL, PVG
Seoul / 78% / 34 vs 66% / ATH, FCO, BCN, CDG, TLV
Shanghai / 80% / 37 vs 62% / TLV, OTP, MXP, ODS, BCN
Singapore / 86% / 31 vs 68% / ODS, FCO, TLV, OTP, KBP
Tokyo / 74% / 68 vs 32% / CAI, TLV, BCN, ATH, MXP
Toronto/ 83% / 34 vs 66% / IKA, AMM, JED, MHD, CAI
Washington / 74% / 39 vs 61% / BOM, DEL, IKA, ADD, DAC


So as you can see virtually the entire TK longhaul widebody network is heavily reliant in transfer traffic.

The only markets that are primarily IST O&D are New York and Tokyo - not ironically two of TKs first longhaul markets ever with the arrival of the A310 back in 1988 and 1989.

If anyone is curious about other individual markets, I might be able to get the information for those as well.

Quoting TK1244 (Reply 14):
A quick summary of the situation in Izmir following the comment of LAXintl in the previous thread ("As I recall the the commercial airport at Izmir prior to ADB opening was Cigli"):

Thanks for the Izmir history.
As far back as I can remember (into the 1970s) I always flew into Cigli. Never experienced Cumaovasi.

[Edited 2012-12-03 08:28:59]


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineFreshSide3 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 327 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 18088 times:
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Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):
Accordingly here is a long haul route profile for TK that shows how virtually all its longhaul routes rely on hub feed connections for support. The posted data is looking back 12-months as of June 2012.

I really like this chart a lot!! Wish there were more displays of this kind, showing these statistics.

Some make sense right out of the box..........others are really surprising.


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 696 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 18056 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):

Amazing data, thanks a lot! Would love to see more. It seems that TLV feeds a lot of the long haul network, even more than IKA or BEY... And what's up with ODS being on top for PEK?


25 JU068 : Wow... thanks a lot for this data, really impressive!! Why is there so much demand between Turkey and Japan? Business or leisure? Do you have the num
26 LAXintl : Something seems to have gone wrong with the formatting with Dhaka and we lost the Guangzhou entry. Here they are again. Dhaka / 79% / 11 vs 88% / MXP,
27 ankaraflyjet : Great information really. Is it possible to have the information for domestic feed in Turkey for TK's long haul ex IST operation if possible?
28 LAXintl : Yes TLV is big for TK, although Iran is bigger - but traffic in Iran is split up with multiple service points of Tehran, Shiraz, Tabriz, Mashad.. Not
29 JU068 : Thanks for the information. Interesting that Dubai still ranks as number one since flydubai operates between the two. Another interesting is Doha, I
30 FreshSide3 : There is less TLV out of the USA. No service on LY out of ORD or MIA anymore, so that forces people to use other gateways/hubs. In turn, with the Ame
31 Post contains images TurkishWings : Does anyone have any more info / link on this? I can not find much online... I need to take a weekend trip to YYZ next October and TK prices are very
32 FreshSide3 : Didn't KHTY have a flight to Skopje, at one time??
33 JU068 : They used to fly to various places around Europe but with one stop in Turkey.
34 Post contains images SCQ83 : Thanks a lot for the info, LAXintl! I am very curious about the connecting traffic to and from Spain. Gotham City? (I know it is too easy...)[Edited 2
35 Post contains links LAXintl : Sometimes just because someone enters the market does not mean a shift of traffic. Especially with an LCC they can generate all new demand with low f
36 SCQ83 : Thanks. It seems to be a good mix of Middle East, India and East Asia there. I am surprised to see IKA is on the Top 5 in all of them (1st from AGP!)
37 777way : Nothing on KHI nd ISB?
38 JU068 : Well, the reason why I mentioned it is because flydubai has become extremely popular in Serbia. Now during the holidays they intend on flying almost
39 Turkish350XWB : Mathematically difficult as these destinations are served with lower capacity (aircraft and frequencywise). So the total number of pax is smaller as
40 777way : I'm surprised TK have not won over Pakistani travellers since they have been f;ying here since before the ME3 existed, infact they went down from wide
41 Tupolev160 : Very interesting data. Appreciate the effort. Would be great to see the numbers and destinations for ZAG, SKP, SJJ, PRN and SIP as well. For ZAG woul
42 Tupolev160 : So we can conclude that most of inter-continental passengers to Asia, North America and others are taken away by SU and other European carriers? Woul
43 LAXintl : Per your request Karachi / 89% / 41 vs 59% / ORD, IAD, YYZ, LAX, DUB Islamabad / 73% / 25 vs 75% / IAD, OSL, ARN, DUB, YYZ Eventually SIN and CGK wil
44 Tupolev160 : What i am impressed about is that TK's footprint in Iran isn't higher than that, given the blockades that IR faces. Does IR has code-share agreements
45 Tupolev160 : Now that's also astonishing, IKA especially. ICN and CAI for the tourists (Korean and Croatian respectively), DXB/DOH for the expats but IKA i really
46 LAXintl : The now 5 Iran markets represented almost 700,000 enplanements. I believe TK is the largest foreign airline in Iran these days. They can't codeshare
47 Tupolev160 : What's surprising is that IR still remains the dominant carrier in Iran, despite all the sanctions put upon them. A bit off-topic but anyone would kn
48 JU068 : There is a lot of O&D demand between Iran and Croatia. A lot of Croats have been living there even during the time of Yugoslavia.
49 Northstar80 : TK online checkin is not working again. Also, the Miles and Smiles log in does not work. They have been having huge problems with these systems lately
50 Yakamoz : So the plan for destination starts are now: 05.12.12 IST-Kilimanjaro-Mombasa 11.12.12 IST - Sao Paulo-Buenos Aires 15.12.12 IST- Niamey-Ouagadougou 1
51 LAXintl : Turkish Cargo will add Chengdu China in early 2013 with its A330Fs. Chengdu is a growing inland manufacturing hub. Also apparently they have applied f
52 Post contains images ASA : Just flew JFK-IST-DAC yesterday ... am writing from Dhaka now. My experience was so bizzarre... a superb Comfort Class experience on JFK-IST compared
53 caliatenza : Any update on TK's India plans?
54 leftyboarder : End of November figures for Turkish airports are out on DHMI website. IST has reached 41,454,675 passengers for the 11 months so far, clocking in near
55 OA260 : Thats certainly interesting. Although TK will offer the better product IMHO .
56 FreshSide3 : Yes indeed. I am presuming that AC will use single-cabin 767 planes, like they do for YYZ-ATH. But correct me if I'm wrong on this.
57 OA260 : No its a two cabin service to IST.
58 gokmengs : Thanks for the interesting and very needed info as always. Excellent post. Just looking at this table shows you the importance of TLV to TK, one woul
59 LAXintl : Here some other random stats for THY. Largest County Markets in pax Germany Italy USA France UK Saudi Arabia China Spain Switzerland Iran Top 10 forei
60 ankaraflyjet : ESB also reached 8,518,624 pax until end of November 2012. International pax average 12% increase and domestic 10% increase overall. The airport is r
61 FreshSide3 : Thanks for clarifying this. Still, like you, I still think TK will fare better on this route, as opposed to AC, regardless.
62 tkfan : WOW, amazing data LaxIntl, do you have the same numbers (O&D vs. transfer, and top destinations) for the German Airports. As Everybody else, I thi
63 SCQ83 : It is interesting to note that the only two Middle Eastern destinations on the Top 10 are TLV and JED, where for European/US traffic the big 3 Gulf c
64 LAXintl : Yes TLV would likely be much bigger even if politics did not get in the way. Sadly Israeli tourism to Turkey is down significantly. Here is the detai
65 tkfan : Interesting numbers, I would have thought BKK would rank very high from Germany. Nevertheless nice LF out of Germany and other European cities.
66 Post contains links TK787 : Remember the news that TK might get rid of Comfort Class? How about this? LH Confirms Premium Eco (by bavair Dec 5 2012 in Civil Aviation) With the po
67 Turkish350XWB : And what about NUE? That is my home airport...
68 777way : According to a Pakistani Urdu newspaper not online, TK have been granted permission to fly four times weekly to Lahore from January.
69 Post contains links tozbek : New THY advertisement with Kobe and Messi: http://kokpit.aero/index.php?route=video/video&video_id=380
70 Turkish350XWB : Wonderful...
71 JU068 : Wow this is kind of strange, isn't it a bit of a detour to fly to Lagos via Istanbul?
72 FreshSide3 : I didn't notice MNL the first time I read the list, but this should help things in Greece, oddly enough, should TK put IST-MNL on the schedule. Curren
73 Giancavia : I see Turkish Cargo has started operating the A310F into Luton 2x a week recently. Any chance of seeing LTN flights with PAX services.
74 LAXintl : Here some more of the requested cities. Dubai / 82% / 36 vs 64% / PRN, SKP, HEL, ARN, CDG Vienna / 71% / 56 vs 44% / BEY, JED, TBS, PVG, IKA Zurich /
75 Post contains images TurkishWings : Someone please stop me. I am now holding 15 domestic and 2 intl. tickets on TK, KK and PC using the latest and TRL 78 and EUR 99 promotions etc. It's
76 TurkishWings : For those who are wondering the loads on the new MLE flights: It just took off with 85 pax in total. That is 29% LF. It has been operating with simila
77 boun : I am thrilled to see TK has become a major player in connecting traffic. I am sure with the third airport, things will get even better. On a different
78 TK1244 : Finally! Good news if it is true. I like it!
79 FreshSide3 : TK needs to promote this in America more. There are people here that go to the Maldives, but it seems like an IST connection would be much easier tha
80 TK787 : That is low, I wonder if the 739 can do this? If not how to fix this come summer.
81 leftyboarder : In summer MLE goes down to 3w since it is low season in Maldives. I'd expect loads to improve by Jan but 5w is too much for a holiday spot.
82 TurkishWings : I think high frequency is important to catch connecting traffic but I think the 330 is a wrong choice here. I initially thought MLE would be a 739 de
83 tkfan : Thanks for your efforts LAXintl. very interesting data. I guess the high share of O&D of BRE is due to the short period compared to other German s
84 Turkish350XWB : Put on the destinations wish list: Kuala Lumpur (Malaysia) Ndjamena (Tschad) Kathmandu (Nepal) Mezar-i-Sarif (Afghanistan) Juba (South Sudan) Lenkaran
85 leftyboarder : TK is on a roll... Not long after their last announcements, they have added 7 more destinations to their wishlist... Add those to: Abha Abuja Al-Qassi
86 TK787 : I really think Canary Islands, Reykjavik can't be that long after some of these cities... What happened to Lima, Peru? or Miami, Detroit? How about Se
87 OA260 : Indeed having flown the TK product YYZ-IST last year in J it will be hard to compete , I like AC but I certainly would not choose them over TK on thi
88 Post contains links LAXintl : Good news for THY. Iberia confirms is cutting Istanbul effective "mid-January" Says it was unprofitable with "tourist component mainly" http://grupo.i
89 JU068 : According to the statistics you provided us with, a bit more than half of all passengers on board Turkish Airlines' flights from Madrid have been O&a
90 SCQ83 : TK has already required slots for a 3rd daily frequency in the IST-MAD flight, in addition to more frequencies to BIO, SCQ and VLC.
91 LAXintl : Primary target market for Maldives is Europe - and Northern Europe and UK specifically. TK has much larger markets to peddle connections to in North
92 leftyboarder : Good for TK but bad for us... All IST will be left with is AF/KL/BA/LH/EK/QR very soon.
93 LAXintl : Its called market forces. The strong survive, the weak die. But anyhow - per TAV, IST has almost 130 tenant airlines. Add in activity over at SAW, th
94 bilguun : If TK announces Yangon, Taipei, Pyongyang, Yerevan, Vientiane, Phnom Penh and Manila then it pretty much covers all over asia.
95 leftyboarder : Pyongyang - not possible for now. That would not go down well with the US. Yerevan, not until Turkey achieves a solid accord with Armenia. Vientiane
96 Tupolev160 : The Kobe ad is completely idiotic.
97 Post contains links TK787 : In another thread I mentioned that TK is grabbing market share from others and I was corrected by someone that ALL airlines are doing well, since the
98 tkfan : Do you have any data of LGW, since it is quickly increased to double daily and mostly operated by A321.
99 JU068 : Does someone know what will happen with the slots Iberia used? Can they sell them to Turkish Airlines or is there some regulatory body that needs to a
100 boun : I don't know the procedure but have a hunch that Lufthansa might be interested in acquiring them.
101 777way : I dont think the so, airlines are not flying to North Korea bcause there isnt a market except for China and some seasonal tour groups, also I dont th
102 TurkishWings : To give you an idea: The average load factor of this week between IST and LGW TK 1981: 34% TK 1997: 64% The aircraft are almost always Airbus 321.
103 JU068 : Are they interested in adding flights from Munich, Frankfurt or some other German city? What could be the reason there is such a big difference betwe
104 SCQ83 : This is insane... do they have open skies with Germany? Otherwise how many destinations are already serving there? I think Turkey-Spain has a maximum
105 Turkish350XWB : Pyongyang makes economically no sense, and Yerevan is difficult... I know that they are going 12w from dec and 14w from summer to NUE. No idea about o
106 LAXintl : Well its true the pie is growing. Look at the huge increase in travel by Turks and the growth of the middle class in Turkey. Related on the A.net fro
107 boun : I remember reading an article about their intentions to send wide body aircraft to IST or open flights to SAW if they were not able to secure additio
108 leftyboarder : I don't think LH is in a hurry to add flights to IST - if the partnership talks that have been circulating lately ends in a JV, they will be sharing
109 JU068 : Well, the market is definitely there, I guess soon we will know what will happen. Currently there are no flights to Frankfurt at around that time, th
110 LatinThug : Can I have the TK stats from LIS please ?
111 TurkishWings : The in-bounds are a little better but then it is the low season now... Even LHR traffic id slow (up to 5 times daily and 2 of which are wide body air
112 FreshSide3 : Curious how many of these LH code-shares on. Yes, it is.....without question...... Certainly quite a few of these. Iran, especially, with connections
113 debonair : I need help from our Turkish Community, regarding SKY AIRLINES. Any idea what's going on- are the close to end operations? German Sky Airlines, there
114 Post contains images TK787 : -I was in TK1 IST-JFK yesterday. Our plane was -JJJ "Erzurum", in great shape. -Business and Economy were full. 25 out of 68 Comfort seats were sold w
115 Post contains images TurkishWings : Until Comfort disappears that is I know TK has its own problems but having flown both DL and TK (in Y) there really is no comparison in hard product
116 LAXintl : Per request. Gatwick / 75% / 63 vs 37% / IKA, BOM, ISU, KRT, EBL Lisbon / 72% / 49 vs 51% / DXB, BEY, IKA, TLV, PVG
117 boun : What about the United product? The route has been there for almost 6 months now. Are they happy with their LF, more importantly the yields?
118 Post contains images Steelyman : Hi dear friend, I want to challenge and ask you what about BCN/MAD
119 JU068 :
120 Steelyman : Thanks for the reply. May I ask source of it? I can confirm all these are potential selling destinations from Spain, however most of them are not eve
121 777way : No Pakistani city connecting to BCN with TK, strange.
122 cuban8 : Well, with Sky you never know. For years people have said that Sky Airlines will fold, but until now they have always survived. The company seems to
123 Post contains links TK787 : Thanks to "tozbek" site, TK inks the 15+5 77W deal; http://kokpit.aero/thy-anlasma-kesinlestirdi
124 dancrane : LAX, can You kindly post data from/to italian market please? Would be interesting to see them. Thanks a lot!
125 MeCe : I am curious,is this misinformation/typo or true. If it is true we may see a 10 abreast 777 which will be pain for me...
126 LAXintl : Its a 12-month data dump of network flow connections. From markets pairs that generate 1,000's of annual connections down to ones that generate barel
127 stylo777 : refering to TurkishWings, TK787 and Leftyborder's posts to the recently started MLE ops I just read in Ugus Cebeci's article (thanks tozbek!) that the
128 dancrane : Thanks once again LAX
129 Post contains images thijs1984 : Think we can add Rotterdam as the 34th destination then. Turkish airlines has allocated slots for RTM for the forthcomming summer. According to info
130 JU068 : What kind of market are they after in Rotterdam?
131 TK1244 : I'm praying for this one since the last announcement few years ago (^_^') The same market Lufthansa and British Airways are aiming at? To attract bus
132 debonair : Seems indeed very dramatic- btw. I thought one B737 or A320 is wet-lsd to another Turkish operator?
133 thijs1984 : some correct answers are already given by TK1244. The combined Rotterdam - the Hague metro area is home approx 5 million people. That is a lot of pot
134 tkfan : It seems AMS will get additional frequencies to SAW in SFP13
135 Post contains images thijs1984 : Good news. HV has announced they will start a 4 x weekly service RTM-SAW SFP13 maybe due to the fact that TK also had intentions of starting this rou
136 Post contains images debonair : I have one big problem with TK and need your help guys... I am looking for a flight to IST on TK and found this: 30. Januar 2013 11:40 Frankfurt 15:4
137 Post contains links TK787 : TK, together with Do&Co, to open its own lounge in Moscow May 2013 http://kokpit.aero/thy-ozel-yolcu-salonu (in Turkish)
138 Turkish350XWB : IB closing route from MAD-IST from 12JAN13 (source airlineroute). I once read here that IB has a higher LF on that route than TK. I guess this is one
139 Post contains links stylo777 : TK1588 is usually operated with widebody or atleast 321 due to a high amount of pax AND cargo. Have a look here: http://www.flightradar24.com/data/fl
140 leftyboarder : About time... They need to do this at all longhaul stations (JFK, LAX, HKG, NRT, SIN, PEK to begin with) and LHR, CDG, AMS, MUC, FRA at least in the
141 Post contains links radiopolitic : http://atwonline.com/airports-routes...lines-african-network-expands-1211 A second destination in Somalia coming up?
142 Post contains links TK787 : Here is the behind the scenes video for the Kobe/Messi TK video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=_uuwbOkdzSA Looks like the
143 Post contains links LAXDESI : Cross posting from Indian Aviation thread: I was hoping that Turkish Airlines would add MAA by 2013. TK is being smart by supporting AI as it can only
144 TK787 : And I just checked, it got 36 million plus hits on youtube in 6 days. Really??
145 wingedtaurus : Common TK make IST-MEX happen!
146 Post contains links emrecan : TK787; I really liked the new ad. It is much better than the previous one. http://www.socialbakers.com/youtube-statistics/tag/airlines/[Edited 2012-12
147 leftyboarder : As is customary around this time of the month (towards the end of the second week of the month that is), TK has released monthly figures. For Jan-Nov,
148 Post contains links TK787 : Here is an in debt analysis about ME carries, including TK; http://www.ch-aviation.ch/blog/?p=169
149 TK787 : Also, I don't know about you guys, but for the first time I see TK ads (Wingo...) on this site below the banner. I meant ,"in-depth".
150 Post contains images leftyboarder : They are using IP-based advertising, hence only local ads. I see Banvit right now
151 Post contains links TK787 : I know but I've never seen this in the US before. Also, another site with the same transfer pax numbers; http://kokpit.aero/thy-transit-yolcu
152 leftyboarder : That is outright plagiarism..
153 TurkishWings : And the person who writes this article is a member here. Veeery surprising indeed !!!
154 Post contains images gokmengs : Yes, and I bet you the author of the first link is a member too He footprinted the aricle; source: kokpit.aero[Edited 2012-12-14 07:08:05]
155 Post contains links and images emrecan : He is "tozbek". Journalist with Uğur Cebeci. It is very interesting that even he mentioned that the source is www.kokpit.aero Never trust journalist
156 TK1244 : I'm seeing the Wingo ads on almost every site now... need to stop searching "Turkish Airlines" on google :P
157 Post contains images boun : good one I must thank TK787 for the information he shared with us and I am sorry about the articles with no credit given to you or to this website (i
158 Post contains links and images LAXintl : Oh well. I guess it means we must be doing something interesting here for people to so obviously copy. But the funny part for me is this info is hardl
159 ankaraflyjet : TK already serves to following destinations from ESB throughout the year; AMSTERDAM, BRUSSELS, DUSSELDORF, COLOGNE/BONN, VIENNA, TEHRAN, MOSCOW, BAGH
160 SCQ83 : Wouldn't it make sense for TK to do a (mainly) short/mid-haul secondary hub (like DUS for LH) in ESB or even SAW?. It looks like the new airport in I
161 gokmengs : I exactly know who he is Iwas talking about the first article... I know tozbek from anet and I follow him on twitter. i despise cebeci for many reaso
162 FreshSide3 : We do get a lot of business travel here in seattle, mostly related to Boeing, that originates in ESB. We have TK buying passenger planes, and also th
163 TK787 : Moon? Not in my lifetime I am afraid. On the other hand, since we are talking about far and away places (I am not including all and every city that h
164 777way : LAXintl, any data for Kabul? more so now with the A333 flying there twice weekly.
165 caliatenza : Hopefully they add BLR as well...
166 Post contains images Pe@rson : How good is it viewing the movements - I don't take photos or collect registrations - both landside and airside in IST? Thanks!
167 stylo777 : landside from the terminal rather limited, but airside much better.
168 SCQ83 : I really can't see SJU or MVD...unless they do a tag from another city (and TK likes them very much). For instance, they could do a IST-GIG-MVD the w
169 Pe@rson : Excellent! Thanks. So you can see many stands from Terminal 2? Any views of the runways?
170 Post contains images stylo777 : with terminal 2 I assume you mean the International Terminal and yes, all gates starting from 201 until 226 have a great window-view towards either t
171 LAXintl : Here you go. Kabul / 82% / 14 vs 86% / FRA, AMS, HAM, LHR, MUC
172 Post contains images leftyboarder : I don't think that is far fetched any more how about No wonder they are after a second point in Afghanistan. 82% LF with probably very high yields to
173 stylo777 : I assume that FRA and MUC are rather connection points than the real O/D of KBL flights. This cake is probably shared by UA/LH/TK.
174 LAXintl : As far as TK is concerned its O&D. Also if you look at the Kabul schedule, I doubt many people are going much anywhere beyond Europe the same day
175 ankaraflyjet : YVR and SEA can be included in a triangle flight from IST such as IST-YVR-SEA-IST whereby on YVR SEA segment both IST SEA and YVR IST pax can be flow
176 stylo777 : quite difficult due to US visa regulations. all passengers bound for Canada would be required to hold an US visa.
177 TK787 : From its original thread; it is confirmed Pegasus orders 75+25 NEOs, Wow, Congrats. TK should be next.
178 HUYfan : Any data for their new(ish) DAMMAM flights? How are they performing, and what is the make up of top connecting destinations? Kind regards Mike
179 Post contains images OA260 : Great news . Look forward to seeing those
180 vinniewinnie : @ Laxintl any data for BRU? Much appreciated thanks my friend!
181 Yakamoz : in Detail: 58 A320neo, 17 A321neo. + 25 Options. Delivery 2015 until end of 2022.
182 paparadzi : Rumors are that TK will be wet-leasing an A330F from MH soon, registration 9M-MUC.
183 DolphinAir747 : Is IST-EZE possible nonstop? Since EK and QR have to stop in Brazil having the first Middle East-EZE nonstop might be an advantage for connections.
184 stylo777 : Without knowng the exact range figures I would guess yes, it is possible, but I would also assume that there is not such a big market to support this
185 Post contains links Yakamoz : Atlasjet open new domestic routes: 11.01.13 IST-Adana 15.01.13 IST-Gaziantep 18.01.13 IST-Kayseri 22.01.13 SAW-Van 25.01.13 SAW-Kars With beginning Ap
186 LAXintl : The route is too new to have a years of data. However in general Saudi Arabia is a strong market for TK, and should generate broad connections across
187 emrecan : I think you should not share the secret of TK to public..
188 Pe@rson : It is not secret: anyone with access to MIDT data can get it and more.
189 emrecan : Everyone has an access to MIDT?
190 Pe@rson : No: it's extremely expensive. Normally airlines use it for demand analysis purposes, etc. So competitors, for example, would know all this about TK.
191 emrecan : Ok then, if it is so easy help us to see the data of EK and let's compare TK and EK on a partiicular destination.
192 Pe@rson : You'll have to ask Lax, or someone else, with access to the data because I don't.[Edited 2012-12-19 11:08:50]
193 emrecan : This is the point I was mentioning. It is not something ordinary you can find those datas very easily. Non of the airlines (or any company) would lik
194 Post contains links LAXintl : There are tons of private companies, including even trade group IATA that supply MIDT, and BSP data to subscribers. Here is the IATA one - info on som
195 Pe@rson : I deleted my text following this. And good it is too for a service that's free-of-charge, offering as it does PDEW, average one-way fares, market sha
196 Steelyman : Are you shure it is MIDT data? If so, let me tell you after checking some data randomly, I confirm all the ones I checked are 100% mistaken.
197 LAXintl : Add in BSP, QSI data as well. As far as accuracy feel free to doubt it, however I have no such concerns. Posted info is simply headline numbers with i
198 Yakamoz : THY increase ESB-Batman from 7 to 11 weekly (day 1/3/5/7 added). Departure ESB: 18:30 Arrival Batman: 19:55 After June 2013, there will be 2 daily fli
199 vinniewinnie : Thanks! Oh wow all in the middle-east and Jeddah a& Medina in the top 2! A lot of pilgrimage traffic it seems! Same for Paris & Amsterdam: ha
200 Post contains links Turkish350XWB : http://atwonline.com/airline-finance...twork-limits-300-destinations-1219 Citation from this article: CEO Temel Kotil told ATW that 300 destinations b
201 TK787 : Not too bad IMHO. There are bunch of 332s and few 333/77W on the market. It is OK to be a bit ambitious and lack five frames than ordering too many p
202 MaverickM11 : Any idea why TK's next batch of 333s will be GE powered?
203 MeCe : I'm not sure but it should be about engine reliability
204 FreshSide3 : Keep in mind that the Turkish Air Force also sends people over to Boeing all the time for training, for AWACs and other military aircraft. In fact, I
205 TK787 : What happened to PDX-AMS, or Condor's ANC flights in summers?
206 FreshSide3 : Condor is supposed to be having the ANC trip start up in the summer, from what I understand. But not now. Still we have a lot of people going ANC at
207 Post contains images TK787 : I know that is a shame, I took that 767 flights many years ago when I used to live in Seattle. I am interested since I lived many years both near ANC
208 ankaraflyjet : ALITALIA is reinstating ROME ANKARA after many years, thirce weekly A320 service. Rome – Ankara eff 25MAR13 3 weekly, service resumption AZ706 FCO22
209 leftyboarder : Awesome. Now ESB needs AF/BA/LX back. airlineroute.net reports that TK goes daily on CAN starting May 2nd, where do they get the rights, aren't they
210 Post contains images turkishsky : If we still see them around by then.....
211 debonair : Any news regarding SKY AIRLINES? Heard rumors that they will be bankrupt soon...
212 Post contains links leftyboarder : Did anyone see this before? Apparently Philippine Airlines is planning to start MNL-IST on August 5th, 2013, 3 times weekly. TK is to place its code o
213 Post contains links TK773ER : This would be on my 2013 wish list http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalk...lf-for-possible-australia-flights/ i know its a long shot but hey one day dr
214 TK787 : I am sure TK wasn't expecting this, is there even a demand for both airlines to serve this route?
215 LAXintl : Well PAL is shut out of Europe due to safety concerns so Turkey is about as close as they will get. Smart to make a deal with TK for onward carriage o
216 Yakamoz : As noticed, Atlasjet has published the flightplans; Istanbul Ataturk – Adana eff 11JAN13 3 daily KK030 IST0755 – 0925ADA 320 D KK032 IST1240 –
217 TurkishWings : Are they leasing a few extra aircraft? Or do they have enough for these new routes?
218 viasa : That could happen very soon. They returned two Airbus A320-200s and three Boeing 737-800s to the lessor and closed its german sister carrier German S
219 Yakamoz : I just know, that they have ordered 10 + 5 Bombardier CS300. At the moment, they have 15 aircraft in fleet. Maybe enough if they could anonce new rou
220 ankaraflyjet : Yes the following airlines are expected to reinstate flights from ESB to their respective hubs; BA to LHR, AF to CDG, LX to ZRH and KL to AMS. I ment
221 TK787 : Rumors or I missed the news again. Finally ESB getting some attention. How is AnadoluJet doing? I remember some European cities discontinued. What is
222 Yakamoz : This are all flights outside of Turkey by TK: Amsterdam 3 x weekly Brussels 3 x weekly Cologne 3 x weekly Dusseldorf 4 x weekly Vienna 4 x weekly Teh
223 CityAirline : Would you please be so kind and post the data for GOT? Well that's good news, although I would rather see TK on the route. /Alex
224 Yakamoz : Why there are no European Airline fly to Manila or why there is no European destination in Manila? And why Philippine Airline's choice is Istanbul?
225 leftyboarder : There is an EU ban on Philippine airlines right now, which prohibits PR from flying to any European city of significance (non-EU points probably woul
226 ankaraflyjet : Iran Air also flies to ESB from IKA with 4 weekly service and Mahana Air has two weekly service to ESB.
227 Post contains links TK1244 : A TK A330 with 278 pax came on grass with its left main landing gear just before takeoff. The aircraft departed CDG with 5 hours delay luchtvaartnieuw
228 LAXintl : GOT / 76% / 29 vs 71% / IKA, BEY, DXB, BKK, ADD KLM files to MNL daily. But anyhow - traffic to the Philippines is primarily 2 types - either cheap f
229 Yakamoz : TK add 3 new destinations to their wish list, by approval.; Bogota, Colombia Bamako, Mali Aqaba, Jordan
230 HB-IWC : That would likely be IST CCS BOG then.
231 Yakamoz : İ think too. Istanbul-Caracas-Bogota, and Havana should continue to Mexico City. Early, i thought it could be Havana-Caracas..
232 Post contains links stylo777 : According to Haberturk newspaper Turkish Civil Aviation Authorities are going to set up a new promotion system in order to increase regional direct fl
233 TK1244 : Good move by SHGM!
234 Yakamoz : These are the other routes for summer 2013 which will be supported; From SAW: Adiyaman, Agri, Amasya (Merzifon), Denizli (Cardak), Gökceada, Igdir, I
235 uzzzer : LAXintl, is there any data on Ukrainian destinations? ODS scored surprisingly high with China, and KBP oddly did well with Dhaka.
236 stylo777 : will be interesting to see which role Borajet will play in this project. some of the supported routes are already operated or had been tried in the p
237 Post contains links TK787 : Please continue here: Turkish Aviation January 2013 (by TK787 Dec 31 2012 in Civil Aviation)
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