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OAG Changes 12/7/2012: DL/F9/UA/US  
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9791 times:

INSTRUCTIONS

WHAT IS THIS REPORT?
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now (UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED).

HOW DO I READ IT?
XXX-YYY DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 ; means that the listed airline changed the frequency between the two airports to add from 4 to 5 roundtrips in December and January. No other months were changed. I only list one direction, although it is possible the listed change is only one way. It is too difficult to average the two directions. I assume the change is roundtrip and that is most often the case.

HOW ARE THE DAILY DEPARTURES CALCULATED?
This report uses total operations for the month listed, divided over the days in the month.

WHAT ARE THE FRACTIONAL FLIGHTS?
Non-daily operations create fractional weekly service. In most cases flights are rounded, but in the case of international service or markets with low frequency, fractions are shown. If a flight operated 5 days out of 7, it would show 0.8 flights.

WHY ARE THERE WEIRD FREQUENCIES IN FAR AWAY MONTHS FOR LCCs?
Most airlines publish schedules 11 months in advance. This report covers the next 9 months. That avoids seeing schedules as they are loaded. Several LCCs load their schedules less than 9 months into the future. Their schedules may also end mid-month. If B6 loads their schedule until Jan15, all flights in Janaury will show half frequency because of the way the report is created.

WHY IS A WHOLE AIRLINE'S SCHEDULE SHOWN AS CHANGING FOR A FUTURE MONTH?
Similarly to the previous question, some airlines load their schedule from nothing inside the 9 month window of this report. When their schedule is extended it will show as new service because there was no previous schedule to compare to. In some instances I will show a more valid comparison against another period.

THOSE FLIGHTS AREN'T DELTA, THEY ARE PINNACLE
This report only shows the marketing code. It is too complicated to show all the operators.

THE FREQUENCIES MAY HAVE CHANGED AS YOU SHOW, BUT THE SEATS DIDNT CHANGE BECAUSE OF EQUIPMENT SWAPS
That is a natural weakness of a frequency based report, but it provides something to discuss below.

THE FREQUENCY DOESN'T SHOW A CHANGE, E.G. 4>4
This happens as a result of rounding. There is a change in service that is large enough to be listed, but through rounding it does not appear.

I marked some of the ones I thought were interesting with an "*".

*4O LAS-TLC JAN 0>0.3 FEB 0>0.3 MAR 0>0.3 APR 0>0.3 MAY 0>0.3 JUN 0>0.3 JUL 0>0.3 AUG 0>0.3
4O MIA-MEX JAN 1.4>1.9 FEB 1.4>1.9 MAR 1.4>1.8 APR 1.4>1.9 MAY 1.5>1.9 JUN 1.4>1.8 JUL 1.4>1.9 AUG 1.5>1.8
*4O SAT-MTY JAN 0>0.2 FEB 0>0.1 MAR 0>0.1 APR 0>0.1 MAY 0>0.2 JUN 0>0.1 JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.2
4O SAT-TLC JAN 0.3>0.5 FEB 0.3>0.4 MAR 0.3>0.4 APR 0.3>0.4 MAY 0.3>0.4 JUN 0.3>0.4 JUL 0.3>0.4 AUG 0.3>0.4

9K ACK-HYA MAY 17>18
9K BOS-HYA MAY 3>1.8
9K SJU-EIS MAY 7>8 JUL 7>6 AUG 7>6
9K SJU-STT MAY 9>7 JUN 9>7 JUL 9>8 AUG 9>8
9K SJU-STX JUN 3>4 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
9K SJU-VQS JUN 7>8 JUL 7>8 AUG 7>8
9K STT-SJU MAY 9>7 JUN 9>7 JUL 9>8 AUG 9>8
9K STX-SJU JUN 3>4 JUL 3>4 AUG 3>4
9K VQS-SJU MAY 8>7

AC MIA-YUL FEB 1.0>0.9
AC PBI-YYZ FEB 2>1.8

*AM FAT-GDL JAN 0.4>0.7 FEB 0.3>0.2 MAR 0.4>0.2 APR 0.4>0 MAY 0.4>0 JUN 0.5>0 JUL 0.4>0 AUG 0.5>0

BB SJU-EIS JAN 3>1.7
BB SJU-STT JAN 5>4 FEB 5>4 MAR 5>4 APR 6>5 MAY 6>5 JUN 4>3 JUL 4>3 AUG 4>3
BB SJU-STX JAN 5>4
BB SJU-VQS JAN 0.2>0
BB STT-SJU JAN 5>4 FEB 6>5 MAR 6>5 APR 7>6 MAY 7>6 JUN 5>4 JUL 5>4 AUG 5>4
BB STX-SJU JAN 4>3
BB VQS-SJU JAN 0.2>0

DL ATL-BTR MAR 7>8
DL ATL-CAE MAR 10>9 APR 10>9 MAY 10>9
DL ATL-CHA MAR 9>10
DL ATL-CRW MAR 5>4 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4
DL ATL-ECP MAR 7>8
DL ATL-FAY MAR 9>8 APR 9>8 MAY 9>8
DL ATL-GPT MAR 6>5 APR 6>5 MAY 6>5
DL ATL-IAH MAR 8>7 APR 8>7 MAY 8>7
DL ATL-LIT MAR 7>6 APR 7>6 MAY 7>6
DL ATL-PWM MAR 1.0>1.8
DL ATL-TRI MAR 8>7 APR 8>7 MAY 8>7
DL BNA-MSP MAR 6>5 APR 6>5
DL CLE-MSP MAR 5>4 APR 5>4
CVG starts to get hit
*DL CVG-IAD MAR 1.7>0.1 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.7>0 JUL 1.7>0 AUG 1.7>0
*DL CVG-OMA MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.8>0
DL DTW-FWA MAR 5>4 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4
DL DTW-MLI MAR 4>3 APR 4>3 MAY 4>3
*DL SEA-PEK APR 1.0>0.6 MAY 1.0>0.6
DL SLC-BIL MAR 4>5
DL SLC-DTW MAR 4>5
DL SLC-PSP MAR 3>4
DL SLC-YVR MAR 1.8>1.9
DL SLC-YYC MAR 1.8>2

DY JFK-ARN JUN 0>0.3 JUL 0>0.5 AUG 0>0.4
DY JFK-OSL JUN 0>0.3 JUL 0>0.4 AUG 0>0.4

EC EWR-ORY JAN 1.7>0 FEB 1.7>0 MAR 1.7>0 APR 1.8>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.9>0 JUL 1.8>0 AUG 1.9>0

I think I earned some I told you so points. You wonder how NK is doing.
**F9 DEN-AZA APR 1.0>0.3 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0

G4 AZA-LAS JUN 0.6>0.4
G4 BLI-OGG JUN 0.1>0.3 JUL 0.2>0.3 AUG 0.1>0.3
G4 LAS-HNL JUN 0.3>0.4 JUL 0.3>0.4 AUG 0.3>0.4

IB MIA-MAD FEB 1.1>1.0

LA MIA-GIG JAN 0>0.3 FEB 0>1.0 MAR 0>0.4

LH ORD-DUS FEB 0.4>0.2

LW BRL-ORD JAN 0.4>1.7 FEB 0>1.7 MAR 0>1.7 APR 0>1.7 MAY 0>1.7 JUN 0>1.7 JUL 0>1.7 AUG 0>1.7
LW BRL-STL JAN 0.3>3 FEB 0>3 MAR 0>3 APR 0>3 MAY 0>3 JUN 0>3 JUL 0>3 AUG 0>3
LW DEC-ORD JAN 0.5>3 FEB 0>3 MAR 0>3 APR 0>3 MAY 0>3 JUN 0>3 JUL 0>3 AUG 0>3
LW DEC-STL JAN 0.5>3 FEB 0>3 MAR 0>3 APR 0>3 MAY 0>3 JUN 0>3 JUL 0>3 AUG 0>3
LW JBR-STL JAN 0.5>3 FEB 0>3 MAR 0>3 APR 0>3 MAY 0>3 JUN 0>3 JUL 0>3 AUG 0>3

MU HNL-PVG FEB 0.4>0.6

NK ACY-FLL MAR 3>2
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0
NK DEN-FLL JAN 1.0>0.5 FEB 1.0>0.5
NK FLL-ORD JUN 3>2 JUL 3>2 AUG 3>2
NK FLL-PAP MAR 0.8>1.0
*NK IAH-MCO MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>1.0 JUN 0>1.0 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

TA JFK-SAL MAR 1.6>1.7 APR 1.6>1.7 MAY 1.6>1.7 JUN 1.6>1.7 JUL 1.6>1.7 AUG 1.5>1.7

UA CLE-BTV MAR 1.0>0.7
UA DEN-FAR JAN 5>4
UA DEN-GJT JAN 6>5
UA DEN-ONT JAN 1.7>1.2
UA DEN-TUS MAR 5>6
UA EWR-YYZ MAR 10>9
UA IAH-CRP MAR 8>9
UA IAH-MEX MAR 9>8
UA LAX-HNL APR 6>5
UA LAX-KOA JUN 1.0>1.8 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>1.8
UA LAX-KOA JUN 1.0>1.8 JUL 1.0>2 AUG 1.0>1.8
UA LAX-PSP MAR 5>6
UA ORD-EWR MAR 14>15
UA ORD-OGG MAY 0.1>0
UA SFO-IAH MAR 9>10
UA SFO-KOA MAY 1.2>1.0
UA SFO-LAX MAR 12>13
UA SFO-ORD MAR 12>13
UA SFO-RDM MAR 3>2
UA SFO-SNA MAR 7>8

UN LAX-DME APR 0.3>0 MAY 0.3>0 JUN 0.3>0 JUL 0.3>0 AUG 0.3>0
UN LAX-VKO APR 0>0.2 MAY 0>0.3 JUN 0>0.3 JUL 0>0.3 AUG 0>0.3
UN MIA-VKO APR 0>0.1 MAY 0>0.1 JUN 0>0.2 JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.2

US CLT-JAX MAR 7>8
US CLT-PDX MAR 0.9>0.5
US DCA-NAS MAR 1.1>1.0
US DCA-PBI MAR 4>5
US DCA-YHZ MAR 0>0.1
US PHX-PVR AUG 3>1.8

VV JFK-KBP JUN 0.6>1.0 JUL 0.5>1.0 AUG 0.6>1.0

53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCarsAir04 From United States of America, joined Jun 2007, 162 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 9789 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I think I earned some I told you so points. You wonder how NK is doing.
**F9 DEN-AZA APR 1.0>0.3 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0

Seasonal change, why go to two airports in the hot summer months, best to keep it winter only and you then make money.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7757 posts, RR: 18
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9621 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL CVG-IAD MAR 1.7>0.1 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.7>0 JUL 1.7>0 AUG 1.7>0
*DL CVG-OMA MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.8>0

well....this sucks...I wonder if US is going to increase service then....

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
**F9 DEN-AZA APR 1.0>0.3 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0
Quoting CarsAir04 (Reply 1):
Seasonal change, why go to two airports in the hot summer months, best to keep it winter only and you then make money.

I guess that makes sense. Does F9 operate seasonal coverage at PHX?



我思うゆえに我あり。(Jap. 'I think, therefore I am.')
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9557 times:

Quoting CarsAir04 (Reply 1):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I think I earned some I told you so points. You wonder how NK is doing.
**F9 DEN-AZA APR 1.0>0.3 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0

Seasonal change, why go to two airports in the hot summer months, best to keep it winter only and you then make money.

Is it really seasonal? Is that announced? Why was it previously for sale in the Summer? They just released their Summer schedule a few weeks ago.


User currently offlineslcdeltarumd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3557 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9458 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL SLC-BIL MAR 4>5
DL SLC-DTW MAR 4>5
DL SLC-PSP MAR 3>4
DL SLC-YVR MAR 1.8>1.9
DL SLC-YYC MAR 1.8>2

I am happy to see PSP get 4 flights but at Spring Break they should fill easily


User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3770 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 9399 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL DTW-FWA MAR 5>4 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4

This puzzles me. FWA-DTW is always full (high-70%, and often higher, LFs), and has been at 5x daily (aside from January/February, where DL always cuts back everywhere) for years, dating back to PMNW. And it's funny that DL is cutting back when spring travel season starts. I know that Eagle has been stealing DL's market share at FWA as of late, but has the bleed been this bad?

And one question remains that may solve the riddle: Is FWA-DTW still all CR2s, or is DL putting a CR7, CR9, or (gasp!) mainline on the route? If they do add larger planes on FWA-DTW, I wonder if FWA-ATL is next...



"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9324 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 5):
And one question remains that may solve the riddle: Is FWA-DTW still all CR2s, or is DL putting a CR7, CR9, or (gasp!) mainline on the route? If they do add larger planes on FWA-DTW, I wonder if FWA-ATL is next...

Nope. CR2s. It's possible they did the frequency change, but didn't refleet the types yet, although that is probably wishful thinking.


User currently offlineKcrwflyer From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3830 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9281 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
DL ATL-CRW MAR 5>4 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4

Mainline back at CRW! Going to 3x CR2 and 1 D95.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 5):
This puzzles me. FWA-DTW is always full (high-70%, and often higher, LFs), and has been at 5x daily (aside from January/February, where DL always cuts back everywhere) for years, dating back to PMNW. And it's funny that DL is cutting back when spring travel season starts. I know that Eagle has been stealing DL's market share at FWA as of late, but has the bleed been this bad?

70% is far from an untouchable number. It's only one flight, I wouldn't worry too much about it.


User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7661 posts, RR: 27
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9155 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

How many times has NK been on-again/off again on this route. Fares on DTW-DEN are great for making ski trips to CO, although not good for the airlines on the route.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):*DL CVG-IAD MAR 1.7>0.1 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.7>0 JUL 1.7>0 AUG 1.7>0
*DL CVG-OMA MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.8>0
well....this sucks...I wonder if US is going to increase service then....

I'm surprised DL was still flying CVG-IAD even up to now.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 4):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):DL SLC-BIL MAR 4>5
DL SLC-DTW MAR 4>5
DL SLC-PSP MAR 3>4
DL SLC-YVR MAR 1.8>1.9
DL SLC-YYC MAR 1.8>2
I am happy to see PSP get 4 flights but at Spring Break they should fill easily

Interestingly the 5th DTW-SLC flight will operate as a red-eye. 9pm departure out of DTW with an 11pm arrival in SLC, 12:30am departure from SLC with an arrival of 6am in DTW.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 5):
This puzzles me. FWA-DTW is always full (high-70%, and often higher, LFs), and has been at 5x daily (aside from January/February, where DL always cuts back everywhere) for years, dating back to PMNW. And it's funny that DL is cutting back when spring travel season starts. I know that Eagle has been stealing DL's market share at FWA as of late, but has the bleed been this bad?

You're reading too much into this change. More or less keeping capacity at the levels flown through the winter.

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 5):
And one question remains that may solve the riddle: Is FWA-DTW still all CR2s, or is DL putting a CR7, CR9, or (gasp!) mainline on the route? If they do add larger planes on FWA-DTW, I wonder if FWA-ATL is next...

FWA is still all CRJ. It is likely to be that way for awhile. DTW-FWA is not a priority route to offer a 2-class product since it is such a short flight.

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 7):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):DL ATL-CRW MAR 5>4 APR 5>4 MAY 5>4
Mainline back at CRW! Going to 3x CR2 and 1 D95.

Wow, cool, and DC-9-50 at that too.


User currently offlinepoint2point From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 2765 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9133 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I think I earned some I told you so points. You wonder how NK is doing.
**F9 DEN-AZA APR 1.0>0.3 MAY 1.0>0 JUN 1.0>0
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

I could see F9 dumping DEN-AZA for the hot summer months, but NK will remain here.

And if F9 (per speculation here) does pull of DEN-DTW as NK moves in..... ??

And if such, would this be some beginning of some alignments going on between F9 and NK, since F9 is looking to get itself "separated" from current ownership?

Hmmmmm.......?

 


User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7661 posts, RR: 27
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9093 times:

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
And if F9 (per speculation here) does pull of DEN-DTW as NK moves in..... ??

And if such, would this be some beginning of some alignments going on between F9 and NK, since F9 is looking to get itself "separated" from current ownership?

NK has been on-again/off-again from DTW-DEN for at least 10-15 years. This is probably the 3rd restart of this route.
It has nothing to do with F9 or any "potential alignment"


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9092 times:

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 8):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

How many times has NK been on-again/off again on this route. Fares on DTW-DEN are great for making ski trips to CO, although not good for the airlines on the route.

Twice I think. Is suspect they will drop this as soon as F9 surrenders which I would expect them to do very soon. I bet the bail out before NYE.

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 8):
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):*DL CVG-IAD MAR 1.7>0.1 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.7>0 JUL 1.7>0 AUG 1.7>0
*DL CVG-OMA MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.8>0
well....this sucks...I wonder if US is going to increase service then....

I'm surprised DL was still flying CVG-IAD even up to now.

You could put really any remaining non-hub where IAD is and I would say it is still a valid statement.

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 8):
Interestingly the 5th DTW-SLC flight will operate as a red-eye. 9pm departure out of DTW with an 11pm arrival in SLC, 12:30am departure from SLC with an arrival of 6am in DTW.

"Free" plane

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
I could see F9 dumping DEN-AZA for the hot summer months, but NK will remain here.

Well, the question is why fly to two airports in Phoenix. It never made sense.

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
And if F9 (per speculation here) does pull of DEN-DTW as NK moves in..... ??

As I hinted, I think that is a given.

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
And if such, would this be some beginning of some alignments going on between F9 and NK, since F9 is looking to get itself "separated" from current ownership?

I think there are a few things going on. I think F9 would love for NK to buy them. I think that is pretty unlikely because NK has no reason to do that. I think we are seeing that if F9 croaks in DEN that NK probably will add a few more routes there. I think the other thing that is going on is that F9 is saying to Wall Street, we are the new ULCC in town and that is stealing some of the wind from NK. I think NK feels the need to show that they are successful and F9 is not. NK just kicked F9 out of AZA-DEN and now they picked a new market to do it in. I would not be surprised if NK knew about AZA when they loaded the new DEN route.


User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1605 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9064 times:

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 8):
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):*DL CVG-IAD MAR 1.7>0.1 APR 1.7>0 MAY 1.7>0 JUN 1.7>0 JUL 1.7>0 AUG 1.7>0
*DL CVG-OMA MAR 0.7>0 APR 0.7>0 MAY 0.8>0 JUN 0.8>0 JUL 0.8>0 AUG 0.8>0
well....this sucks...I wonder if US is going to increase service then....

I'm surprised DL was still flying CVG-IAD even up to now.

Indeed! I would be surprised if this moves the needle at all for US serving CVG-WAS. MAYBE DL might upgauge a bit on CVG-DCA if there is some "gotta have it" n/s demand for CVG-WAS that wouldn't just switch to UA ex-IAD and would be willing to trek all the way to DCA, but I wouldn't think US by any means.


User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9046 times:

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 4):
I am happy to see PSP get 4 flights but at Spring Break they should fill easily

PSP for spring break?? Never really thought of PSP as a spring break spot.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4607 posts, RR: 23
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 9043 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

Time for F9 to move down I-75?

Quoting enilria (Reply 3):
Is it really seasonal? Is that announced? Why was it previously for sale in the Summer? They just released their Summer schedule a few weeks ago.
http://media.frontierairlines.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=5375

Doesn't appear that it was announced to be seasonal.


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 8981 times:

Quoting as739x (Reply 13):
Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 4):
I am happy to see PSP get 4 flights but at Spring Break they should fill easily

PSP for spring break?? Never really thought of PSP as a spring break spot.

I'm not sure it is a college kid market, but that is definitely peak season for whatever reason.

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 14):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

Time for F9 to move down I-75?

Could be, but TOL is not going to do much beyond write them a check they spend in a few months. Maybe TOL-MCO.

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 14):
http://media.frontierairlines.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=5375

Doesn't appear that it was announced to be seasonal.

It wasn't. I'm just wondering whether this is F9 fanboy spin or if there is some concrete info that it will return. OTOH, F9 has said things were seasonal before and they never came back. NK pushed them out. Let's be honest.


User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3770 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8952 times:

Quoting enilria (Reply 15):

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 14):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
5 airlines now? They must expecting F9 to leave.
*NK DEN-DTW MAR 0>1.0 APR 0>1.0 MAY 0>0.7 JUN 0>0.9 JUL 0>1.0 AUG 0>1.0

Time for F9 to move down I-75?

Could be, but TOL is not going to do much beyond write them a check they spend in a few months. Maybe TOL-MCO.

TOL has a SCASD grant to bring F9 to TOL, but F9 hasn't bit like they did up I-80/90 in SBN. And G4 already flies TOL-SFB.



"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
User currently offlineFATFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2001, 5821 posts, RR: 28
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8902 times:

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*AM FAT-GDL JAN 0.4>0.7 FEB 0.3>0.2 MAR 0.4>0.2 APR 0.4>0 MAY 0.4>0 JUN 0.5>0 JUL 0.4>0 AUG 0.5>0

Perhaps the start of another season of bouncing schedule adjustments? Have your fingers warmed up in case this starts happening every week or two again.

Quoting as739x (Reply 13):
PSP for spring break?? Never really thought of PSP as a spring break spot.

PSP was a popular spot until 1986 when an alcohol-fueled rampage by spring breakers happened. The city under Sonny Bono cracked down on spring breakers in the following years and it lost its popularity. But the last few years the city has started remarketing itself to spring breakers and it seems to be working.



"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 23148 posts, RR: 20
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8884 times:

Quoting LHCVG (Reply 12):
MAYBE DL might upgauge a bit on CVG-DCA if there is some "gotta have it" n/s demand for CVG-WAS that wouldn't just switch to UA ex-IAD and would be willing to trek all the way to DCA, but I wouldn't think US by any means.

I'd think that any "gotta have it" demand on CVG-IAD needs to go somewhere out by Dulles and will switch to UA regardless of what DL or US does with DCA service.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineLHCVG From United States of America, joined May 2009, 1605 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8812 times:

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 18):
I'd think that any "gotta have it" demand on CVG-IAD needs to go somewhere out by Dulles and will switch to UA regardless of what DL or US does with DCA service.

That was my point - the only possible way this impacts CVG-DCA is if there is such demand, and I don't think there is any that wouldn't just go UA if n/s specifically on IAD-CVG is critical.


User currently offlineSuper80DFW From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 1696 posts, RR: 11
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 8790 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 5):

FWA is too small of a market to support mainline service. Losing one flight a day is far from being a big deal. Just right sizing capacity for the season. Also, just because you see a flight go out at 70% full doesn't mean that's anywhere near profitable. FWA perhaps is a low-yielding destination.



"Things change, friends leave, life doesn't stop for anybody." -- EAT'EM UP EAT'EM UP KSU!!
User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7375 posts, RR: 14
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8244 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 16):
TOL has a SCASD grant to bring F9 to TOL, but F9 hasn't bit like they did up I-80/90 in SBN. And G4 already flies TOL-SFB.

Yup, but I think F9 believes they win to MCO against SFB. Whether that is true or not is a matter of conjecture.

Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 17):
Perhaps the start of another season of bouncing schedule adjustments? Have your fingers warmed up in case this starts happening every week or two again.

Probably  
Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 17):
until 1986 when an alcohol-fueled rampage by spring breakers

Sounds like a typical Spring Break to me


User currently offlineslcdeltarumd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3557 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8184 times:

Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 17):
PSP was a popular spot until 1986 when an alcohol-fueled rampage by spring breakers happened. The city under Sonny Bono cracked down on spring breakers in the following years and it lost its popularity. But the last few years the city has started remarketing itself to spring breakers and it seems to be working.

definitely. With alot of peoples parents refusing to let them travel to Mexico you see alot of domestic cities regaining spring breakers and Palm Springs certainly is one


User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33053 posts, RR: 71
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7789 times:

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 22):
Quoting FATFlyer (Reply 17):
PSP was a popular spot until 1986 when an alcohol-fueled rampage by spring breakers happened. The city under Sonny Bono cracked down on spring breakers in the following years and it lost its popularity. But the last few years the city has started remarketing itself to spring breakers and it seems to be working.

definitely. With alot of peoples parents refusing to let them travel to Mexico you see alot of domestic cities regaining spring breakers and Palm Springs certainly is one

Palm Springs?!? Spring breakers don't visit upscale resort towns that cater to the over-40 crowd with no beaches and lacking all-inclusive resorts who's primary attraction is golf and spas. That's not spring break.



a.
User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3770 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 7525 times:

Quoting Super80DFW (Reply 20):
Also, just because you see a flight go out at 70% full doesn't mean that's anywhere near profitable. FWA perhaps is a low-yielding destination.

FWA is far from low-yielding - it's 75% business travel, often with fares to match (though FWA often comes out cheaper in the end when you add it up). Even G4's FWA-PGD flights command a fare premium over other G4 PGD routes. And last time I checked in fall 2010, FWA-DTW was 76% full (and all-airline average LFs at FWA have only gone up to the 82-84% range since).

Quoting Super80DFW (Reply 20):
FWA is too small of a market to support mainline service.

Then how come FWA saw mainline DC-9s from NW to DTW until 2003 and 732s on DL to ATL until 1997?  

Keep in mind that FWA loses 60% of potential pax to other airports, so there is potential for market stimulation. Still, I think that when DL starts the 50-seat drawdown with routes between 450 and 750 miles (FWA-ATL and FWA-MSP are two of those 50-seater routes), I could see FWA-MSP switched to 9E CR9s to feed the 9E FWA MX base. As for FWA-ATL, it's anyone's guess on who will operate it because 9E is pulling the CR9 out of ATL. But I could see the 3 daily CR2s switched out for an equal amount of CR7s, 2 CR9s, or 2 717s.



"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
25 airliner371 : Now I am not implying anything, all I am saying is that that was now about 10 years ago, things change, its not fair to compare that long ago anymore
26 slcdeltarumd11 : They are not playing golf or using the spas. Resorts like Vegas, Palm Springs, and Lake Havasu City are very popular again. They get wasted by the po
27 NWADTWE16 : Im getting so tired of NK..how many routes have they started then stopped after like 2 months. F9 has done very solid business from DTW with little ad
28 Kcrwflyer : All true, but no longer relevant. The industry and the airlines have changed quite a bit. Most that have been around know that NW was slinging mainli
29 FWAERJ : DL plans on keeping 150 or so 50-seaters around (not sure of the exact number), but I think that they will probably be used on: -High-frequency (4x+/d
30 NWADTWE16 : Alot of those inter-Michigan and inter-midwest from DTW routes were very full. DTW to all the markets showcased below often had overbooking situations
31 Post contains links FATFlyer : Check out hotel listings like the Hyatt Regency in Palm Springs. That property and others have started adding lines that specifically say "Minimum Sp
32 BA744PHX : Per F9's website AZA will be seasonal, current services ends April 8, 2013
33 rangercarp : Glad tho hear this. It gives me another option to leave the west coast in the evening and still make it to work in the morning.
34 slcdeltarumd11 : Delta has never been big on a red eye bank at SLC I think you will see some decent length layovers just by the design of the schedule. Will be intere
35 Post contains links mariner : I'm not sure where that's coming from - just speculation? - but there appears to be some discrepancies between what is posted here and what actually
36 PSU.DTW.SCE : The DTW-SLC flight in the 9pm departure bank enables better late afternoon/evening connections originating on the east coast / midwest. Passengers ca
37 FSDan : Anyone else wonder why Transaero is switching airports in Moscow? Was there some sort of announcement about this? Also, will they fly both MIA-DME an
38 enilria : They did run F9 out of DEN-AZA... If the cutback on DTW-DEN is incorrect it appears that NK also saw it and responded. If it is merely a mistake by F
39 Post contains images WA707atMSP : Remember that high school seniors and college students are not the only people travelling during spring break. A lot of families take vacations at th
40 mariner : The DEN-DTW scheduling has not changed in the booking engine since well before I went away, so I would hope that Spirit did a little more research th
41 BA744PHX : F9 current schedule is only open till July 10th. If the flight does resume it probably will be in October
42 mah4546 : No room at DME. Transaero started moving some flying to Vnukovo around October, IIRC. Yes, but it's not a service increase; one of two weekly MIA-DME
43 enilria : FYI doing a little research, it appears that F9 loaded the AZA drop into OAG on Thursday, but Spirit didn't load their change till Sunday. So there i
44 Post contains links mariner : I'd suggest coincidence, but I'm aware of your affection for Fight Club rules. Fairly obviously, DTW-DEN is a route that has been in Spirit's mind fo
45 enilria : Few airlines are eager to add back a route they have previously dropped. Usually, it goes the opposite way.
46 mariner : Obviously, Spirit is: With which you agreed: mariner
47 enilria : OP ANNOUNCEMENT: There was no update this week by OAG to the database. I don't know if that is a mistake or if no large carrier submitted a schedule a
48 MasseyBrown : Sounds as if the Christmas holiday has come early in the scheduling shops..
49 enilria : Could be. The good news is that I saved last week's data, so the next time they update the database I will show all accumulated changes.
50 MasseyBrown : As long as you've got a week off ... how difficult a process is this for you?
51 Post contains images PHX787 : There's a very good reason why E is on my respected user's list
52 Q : It should be read easier than MAR 7>8 I would like to write like this: March=7 April=8 (increased) March=8 April=7 (decreased) Thanks, Q
53 jetmatt777 : The current format is easy to read. Just don't read the > sign as "is greater than", but rather "going to". MAR 7>8 For March, going from 7 to
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