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Central American Aviation Thread. Part 51  
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4339 posts, RR: 4
Posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 13660 times:



THE CENTRAL AMERICAN AVIATION THREAD
PART LI

"Tribute to SAM COLOMBIA in Central America"

SAM was the acronym of "Sociedad Aeronautica de Medellin" and it sustained a close commercial relationship with Avianca.
I found information since the 60s concerning to their former operations in the isthmus.
Confirmed destinations: Guatemala City, Tegucigalpa, Panama City, San Jose.
Confirmed equipments: Lockheed L-188 Electra, Boeing 720, Boeing 727 series, BAe 146





Any expansion in the forum would be appreciated.

Edited on December 09th, 2012


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
204 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 13654 times:

Talking about SAM Colombian airlines, not sure if they also flew to SAL (when it was Ilopango MSSS), scheduled or charters..
After SAM was gone, so was the scheduled SJO-ADZ, haven't heard of any other airline flying that route again.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4339 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 13596 times:

From the top of my head: I can almost remember SAM flying BOG-ADZ-SJO-GUA with 727 series in the late 80s. IATA designator: MM.
They also served the SJO-TGU segment for a little while in the 80s.
LACSA flew the SJO-ADZ segment in the 70s and prior to the 727 era. SAM flew the same route with Electra turbo-props.
Speaking about SJO, the BAe 146 was utilized sometimes in the 90s. During the early years of this century, AV operated the BOG-SJO sector using the MM designator for their flights.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineaer From Guatemala, joined Mar 2004, 1044 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 13558 times:

Yeah I remember seeing them at GUA in the old terminal config. They usually used gate 1


nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 13404 times:

Gotta love those Electras!


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 13381 times:

Panama government orders Tocumen INC to stop bid From www.prensa.com in Spanish
The Panamanian government ordered government owned Tocumen INC to stop the bid for the improvement and re-furnishing of the airport immigration and customs area.
As it's, even as the number of arriving passengers is no-where near the connecting ones, Tocumen immigration and customs is a shame, tight, small and really overcrowded several times per day.
Sadly, it looks like it's going to remain the same until the South Terminal is completed and hopefully all immigration and customs procedures will take place there.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4339 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 13298 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 4):
Gotta love those Electras


You gave material for the name of future threads: "Electras in Central America" We can speak about those local airlines who owned this kind of turbo-props: COPA, LACSA, SAHSA, the former TACA and so on.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 1):
After SAM was gone, so was the scheduled SJO-ADZ, haven't heard of any other airline flying that route again


TACA has barely operated the SJO-ADZ sector twice a week as charter flights attending the Decameron Resorts from the island. These flights are usually deploying the 100-seater E-90.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 13182 times:

according to another thread AV/TA just ordered some ATRs

http://atwonline.com/aircraft-engine...ncataca-orders-15-atr-72-600s-1212



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineav757 From Colombia, joined Apr 2004, 658 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 13162 times:
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SAM Colombia never had BAE-146, They operated 10 Avro RJ100's.

User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4339 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 13017 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 7):
AV/TA just ordered some ATRs


TACA REGIONAL has utilized second-handed ATR-42s.
I understood AV/TA has opted for 15 brand-new ATR 72-600 series based on the experience of their regional planes utilized in Central America.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineavi8 From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 614 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 12988 times:
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Where will they use them? Perhaps they will be used to create smaller banks in SAL and SJO? Maybe add a regional turboprop hub at GUA?


avi8
User currently onlinejuanchito From Guatemala, joined Nov 2000, 1148 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 12949 times:

Quoting avi8 (Reply 10):
Where will they use them? Perhaps they will be used to create smaller banks in SAL and SJO? Maybe add a regional turboprop hub at GUA?

They will retire the ATR42 and bring the ATR72 to Guatemala, so routes GUA-FRS, GUA-SAP, GUA-TGU will be on the new ones.

Juanchito



Chapin de corazon.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days ago) and read 12681 times:

Does anyone know if CO (now UA) are bringing their usual widebodies to SAL, GUA etc over the holidays?


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently onlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 896 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12670 times:
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I read today Copa is increasing Cancun to 5X daily, all 737operation... looks like a good route for Copa.

I assume most of that traffic to Cancun is from South America?


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12659 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 13):

I read today Copa is increasing Cancun to 5X daily, all 737operation... looks like a good route for Copa.

I assume most of that traffic to Cancun is from South America?

Maybe the odd person off of KLs AMS flight....



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 12635 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 13):
I read today Copa is increasing Cancun to 5X daily, all 737operation... looks like a good route for Copa.

Even worse scenario to see CM in MID.
In southern Mexico CM E190 PTY-VSA.HUX-PTY route may look interesting some day soon.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 12610 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 15):
Even worse scenario to see CM in MID.

MID would work. How about a PTY-BZE-MID-BZE-PTY....there is MID-BZE traffic.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently onlineMGASJO From Nicaragua, joined Feb 2005, 463 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 12435 times:

For all of us pilots and aviation lovers alike in Central America, there is an Air Rally scheduled in 2013 in our mid continent.
More information:
http://airrally.com/2/rally.htm



C208B
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 12423 times:

UA has added IAD-GUA/SJO and ORD-SJO

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/united...nal-domestic-routes-153000543.html



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 12376 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 16):
MID would work. How about a PTY-BZE-MID-BZE-PTY....there is MID-BZE traffic.

So much wishful thinking.
I really doubt México would allow CM traffic between BZE and MID or anywhere in Mexico.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 12373 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 19):
I really doubt México would allow CM traffic between BZE and MID or anywhere in Mexico.

That is not mexico's to give. as the midpoint it would be Belize's rights....and CM can have those anytime it wants.
Dont forget CO used to operate IAH-MID-BZE-MID-IAH with full traffic rights (I know cause I used to fly it BZE-MID). It believe it was in the 90's they used to do that.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 12352 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 20):
That is not mexico's to give. as the midpoint it would be Belize's rights....and CM can have those anytime it wants.

I don't think CM has any Mexican frequencies left to use for MID.
Last Mexico gave CM MTY, PVR and SJC.
If CM could get Mexico to allow it to fly to other Mexican cities than PVR and SJC, surely CM would ask for TLC way before MID if none the frequencies can be used for extra flights to MEX.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (1 year 4 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 12307 times:

IF CM wants to fly to MID, the Yucatan Gov't will make it happen.....


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 5885 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (1 year 4 months 23 hours ago) and read 12251 times:

Any guesses on which "Americas" carrier is behind the undisclosed C-Series order yesterday. The quantities involved strike me as latin and it would be a perfect "smaller aircraft" for CM. Would be ideal for Caribbean and smaller mexican / latin destinations


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2428 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (1 year 4 months 22 hours ago) and read 12226 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 23):
it would be a perfect "smaller aircraft" for CM

After all that investment in adding the Embraer aircraft to an all Boeing 737 fleet, CM would drop the Brazilians and go Canadian?
Would look like the kind of order Latam or Aeroméxico would place..



I'm not on CM's payroll.
25 g500 : Mexico wouldn't grant that, Aeromexico's management would go insane if that happnes... AM's management knows people in some high-up places Several ye
26 yellowtail : Don't be so sure...times are changing in Mexico.
27 yellowtail : December has almost come and gone and Tropic Air is still waiting on it Mexican approvals to start BZE-CUN. This was promised in Oct from the Governme
28 andrefranca : Hello guys, someone here can tell me if these rumors are circulating there too? According to CM staff here in MAO, CM is searching the potential marke
29 g500 : "December has almost come and gone and Tropic Air is still waiting on it Mexican approvals to start BZE-CUN. This was promised in Oct from the Governm
30 SJOtoLIR : Confirmed new flights in Central America next year: United. Washington Dulles - Guatemala City UA 1606.....IAD 09:00.......GUA 11:33.......Sa.......73
31 aer : Another Saturday only flight... well better than nothing, right?
32 SJOtoLIR : UA IAD-SAL 7x weekly is hitting stronger than UA IAD-GUA 1x weekly and UA IAD-SJO 1x weekly, in terms of their weekly frequencies. TA SAL-IAD usually
33 g500 : I'm based at IAD. You can see the IAD-SAL United banners everywhere around the airport. UA wants a piece of this market
34 SHAQ : I think it would be perfect for UA if they fly SFO-PTY-SFO overnighting at PTY and leaving at 6AM to arrive in the morning bank. A schedule like that
35 SJOtoLIR : The former UA was code-sharing with TA SAL-IAD for years, but it seems that the schedule and frequencies never satisfied completely to the airline, g
36 yellowtail : could the 73G make this? I think it would have to be a 752 Expect to see lots more IAD stuff over the next 18 months....IAD-SAP/BZE/MGA are all in th
37 2travel2know2 : How about CM/P5 MAO-LET-IQT? That wouldn't work for CM hub. CM's hub 1st departures are around 0715, however a SFO-PTY 0600 arrival may suit CM, albe
38 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : PTY expected to break 6million passenger mark before years end from www.prensa.com in Spanish Until October 5.7 million passengers used PTY, a one mil
39 SJOtoLIR : Air Transat is operating these season some unusual charter flights routed as Panama City - Liberia - Edmonton. . CM PTY-LAX is already operating up to
40 Post contains links yellowtail : Did Easy Sky have another accident? I am told that they ceased operations and that CMairlines is assuming their routes and pax Wait, I just found the
41 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : Here's the summary of the main topics related to the Central American aviation landscape throughout the 2012. Sorry for the delay due to New Year's da
42 yellowtail : Never started, but will this year along with CUN
43 yellowtail : Seems like CM will be starting PTY-BOS. Is it me or those this seem like a way to discourage B6 from Starting PTY.
44 aer : As long as it gives GUA more possibilities with B6, they should start right away hehehe. Seriously, it's a great addition, but I'm a bit skeptical on
45 yellowtail : Im with you on both statements!
46 2travel2know2 : That's on JUL10 according to sources. I'd not underestimate PTY (hub) - BOS. I'd have liked a different schedule not those 14 hours between PTY-BOS a
47 SJOtoLIR : CM 718..........PTY 11:46............BOS 18:16..........Daily...........73G CM 719..........BOS 09:54............PTY 14:28..........Daily...........7
48 Post contains images copa330200 : This is a nice surprise for me however it seems to be a well though move (as all of the CM moves) any idea on how ORD and YYZ loads are doing ? thanks
49 2travel2know2 : I'd guess CM is wishing the bilateral didn't restrict CM to 4 weekly scheduled frequencies to Canada.
50 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : Copa Airlines in Chicago. Filter period........Seats..........Passengers..........Occupancy .April 2012..........7440.................4834...........
51 2travel2know2 : PTY-ORD-PTY is more ORD O/D than connections with UA flights. Pretty sure if CM schedules would allow more connecting possibilities @ ORD loads would
52 Post contains images andrefranca : Mini trip repoooooort, mini trip repoooort!!!! Right guys this will be a quick one! First time flying TA bussiness class! I had to book C cause the sy
53 yellowtail : Cant wait for your Tropic Trip report.....
54 SJOtoLIR : CM PTY-ORD 7x weekly began in December 2011 and their services are not plenty consolidated at this time. This could be only the first step for their
55 SJOtoLIR : The dedicated TA/LR SJO-MDE non-stop service is no longer available since TA SAL-MDE 4x weekly started on January 02nd. TA/LR SJO-PTY-MDE 7x weekly co
56 2travel2know2 : If I'm not mistaken last time AV flew MDE-PTY it was thru SAM w/BOG-MDE-PTY-ADZ route.
57 2travel2know2 : A couple of days ago I was checking availability to connect TA PTY-SJO with US SJO-PHX and it seems US PHX-SJO-PHX isn't timed to make immediate conne
58 yellowtail : having to fly via MIA to get to CTG in Feb. Arrrrrrr! I guess the good news is that I get to fly the AV babybus!
59 SJOtoLIR : The former code-share agreement called TA-UA as well as the current US-TA are mostly oriented for connections originated at airports placed in the Un
60 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : CM passenger movement grew 24% in DEC2012 from www.prensa.com in Spanish In a release to its stock-holders, CM announced that compared to DEC2011, pas
61 SJOtoLIR : TA/LR SJO-SDQ is no longer in service whereas TA/LR SJO-HAV is barely operating as 3x weekly. Poor management for their Caribbean routes out of SJO. .
62 yellowtail : IIRC, there was a thread some months ago in which someone posted a link to an article in which CM said REC, LIR, IQT were not doing so well and so th
63 Post contains images andrefranca : Mini trip repoooooorrrrt! Okay, now the second TA leg! SJO PTY, as sjotolir said, tax not included which is a hassle, Costa Rica charge foreigners ent
64 2travel2know2 : I'm going to think that CM knew what they were getting into w/LIR and IQT. REC yields may have been a disappointment but I could foresee the route pi
65 Post contains images yellowtail : The reason why LIR does not work for Lat Americans is you cannot market rainforest to people that have rainforest in their back yards.....how can you
66 2travel2know2 : I Totally agree! Question remains, what is CM going to do w/LIR not to drop the destination and make lots of people in Costa Rica quite upset as they
67 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : CM PTY-REC: Inaugurated on June 23rd 2012. CM PTY-LIR: Inaugurated on June 24th 2012. CM PTY-IQT: Inaugurated on July 14th 2012. More than five years
68 Post contains images yellowtail : Yes, but those were "legacy" routes with a very high yield......esp PAP. LIR is not high yielding. Have you seen the beach at LIR No offence but it i
69 2travel2know2 : Years ago, PAP and KIN were flown almost only because of O/D traffic, perhaps thrice weekly would have been better than twice weekly, but those condi
70 yellowtail : IMHO....you even see some of the N. American carriers pulling back a little in LIR. Demand has to catch up to the airlift which seems to have gotten
71 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : No worries. I got the point. LIR as well as any other leisure station in Central America is not popular for South Americans and this fact is being re
72 2travel2know2 : I don't agree when it comes to PTY-LIR-GUA, why? Some of those North Americans in Guanacaste may find attractive to combine their holidays (or stays
73 SJOtoLIR : Few demand of passengers, even for the E90. They can already fly TA GUA-SAL and then TACA REGIONAL [SAL-LIR]. This last flight is being operated with
74 aer : For some reason this is sounding like we're coming back to the hypothetical CM GUA mini hub. hehe
75 Post contains links SJOtoLIR : JetBlue will start Ft. Lauderdale - San Jose service in June. Dedicated thread: JetBlue Announces FLL-SJO (by mah4546 Jan 16 2013 in Civil Aviation) .
76 yellowtail : I really doubt that CUN-LIR would be successful I don't understand this. I always thought that TGU-PTY was doing worse than SAP-PTY
77 2travel2know2 : Where are those E170/175 when CM really need them for those routes not able to support E190 as CM wanted? I'm not sure if it's that same case in Ecua
78 yellowtail : I have flown PTY-SAP three times...plane was pretty full all times. A colleague of mine in travelling the route next week, only could get business cl
79 SJOtoLIR : Agreed. Same with GUA-LIR-PTY. . Perhaps a huge percentage of the plane is rather loaded with passengers traveling the SAP-SJO segment whose numbers
80 yellowtail : Actually the time I have flown it I would 25% got off in SJO
81 SJOtoLIR : Copa Airlines consolidates their services in Punta Cana, Dominican Republic as their frequencies will rise from 21x to 25x weekly from June 18th. As a
82 Post contains images viaggiare : Which one? There are well over seventy of them accesible from Liberia.. rent a 4x4 at the airport and off you go. I would agree.. Sint Maarten/Saint
83 yellowtail : So here is a prediction guys........AV will make the "we will leave *A" announcement within the next 12 months. IMHO Richard Anderson is working hard
84 aer : How come? Would it be a either they go or I go situation?
85 2travel2know2 : In other words, lets guess AV is to join Sky Team soon as Sky is desperate for a South American based partner in South America.
86 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : CM BOS News from Boston Globe today in English
87 yellowtail : So CM will be targeting S. America bound pax.....apart from those going to Colombia...most americans I know would rather connect in a US city (wherev
88 Post contains links yellowtail : So check this out guys..... Sounds like B6 wants in in GUA and PTY among others.... http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...-america-and-the-caribbean-
89 adamh8297 : Going South America-PTY-BOS is a lot less stressful than South America-MIA-BOS. Would you rather have to claim your baggage once or twice on your jou
90 SJOtoLIR : United. Washington Dulles - Guatemala City UA 1606.....IAD 09:00.......GUA 11:33.......Sa.......738 UA 1658.....GUA 12:40.....IAD 19:26.........Sa...
91 yellowtail : Base on the link in an earlier post I would say FLL/JFK-GUA/PTY are definitely in the cards.
92 Post contains links and images copa330200 : from today's Prensa : http://www.prensa.com/impreso/economia/copa-creceria-14/152508 CM will grow 14% by adding 5 new destinations , new frequencies t
93 2travel2know2 : Maybe CM planning department calls for the retirement of 2 "old" B737 (I presume -700) but anyhow CM has such a tight fleet use that probably it's ti
94 SJOtoLIR : From the attached press release: "El 51.1% de los aviones que utiliza Copa son del fabricante estadounidense Boeing y el resto de la empresa brasileñ
95 2travel2know2 : Sooner or later CM will be facing the serious dilemma of how to increase seat capacity to frequency restricted destinations... I could only guess tha
96 Post contains images yellowtail : Well 5 new destinations....once again I would like to put my pitch in for my home base Having to go thru MIA to get to S. America from BZE is just rid
97 2travel2know2 : Here is my guess for most possible new destinations: BOS (well this one is already announced) BZE TPA SSA AQP Others possible: DAV (return to CM netw
98 yellowtail : Here are my guesses.... TPA MSY BZE BGI (I say this based on the success of POS and BGI is pushing hard there). A surprise may be CLT
99 Post contains images copa330200 : 100% agree !!! CCS and MEX will be at the top good choices !! I will add PMV (to get further CCS frequencies) and SFO
100 Post contains images point2point : Maybe we can add DEN to the list...... you never know, and a few years ago the airport management at DEN stated they were in talks with CM to PTY, an
101 2travel2know2 : If CM is going to send any surplus MCO traffic to TPA to fill the PTY hub - TPA O/D, TPA could perform well. MSY is desperate for a link with Latin A
102 yellowtail : Don't forget msy is a big shipping town so a link with pty could work. Maybe pty-sap-msy
103 2travel2know2 : The only one-stop CM service to the U.S.A. I can imagine would be PTY-XXX-SEA (XXX most likely GUA) as PTY-XXX-SFO may not be a product CM want on it
104 juanchito : According to GCmap GUA-SEA is 2526 nm, I think that Boeing 737-700 or 737-800 airplane could be weight restricted remember GUA is at 5000 feet above
105 yellowtail : Didn't we establish some threads ago that a cm 73g would also be weight restricted on a hypothetical pty - sfo?
106 Post contains images 2travel2know2 : As CM is decreasing the number of B737-700 on its fleet, it's quite doubtful when CM decides to fly to SEA it'll have lots of those to fly the route
107 juanchito : Something that should be consider is that SFO airspace is a lot more congested than MVD, this could affect this operation. Juanchito
108 2travel2know2 : We agree that we're aware of that. I could imagine the area around SJC could provide interesting Latin America O/D traffic due to Silicon valley, plu
109 SJOtoLIR : In terms of distance, the PTY-SFO sector is practically the same compared to the current PTY-EZE which is currently served with the modern 738 every
110 Post contains images copa330200 : that's my point before about CM getting the 737-900 to add capacity within the same frequencies as per airfleets, in late 2012 CM transfered out a fa
111 2travel2know2 : It's very likely CM is more desperate to add seats to YYZ and EZE than to MEX. Was the 1st B737-800 CM got (before Sky interior)? If it was that one,
112 SJOtoLIR : I think so. The new expansion of United Airlines in Central America is rather aiming for flights departing out of both IAD and ORD: UA IAD-SAL, UA IA
113 2travel2know2 : Surprisingly there's no UA interest in flying SFO-GUA/SAL.
114 SJOtoLIR : The former United Airlines rather discontinued UA LAX-GUA and UA LAX-SAL some years backward.
115 Post contains images copa330200 : 29670 was not really the first one .. there are several older 738 from airfleets, CM got 2 different Embraer 190 "types "; 190IGW (7 units) & 190
116 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : www.embraer.com.br shows that there's difference between the range of an E190AR and an E190LR, probably has to do with fuel tanks and/or weight. What
117 SJOtoLIR : Copa Airlines does operate their E90s in cities out of Panama City as far as Guadalajara and Manaus. The autonomy of each plane depends on the version
118 Post contains images 2travel2know2 : Range circle 2300nm out of PTY, with some CM current routes know to be flown w/E190 That's a big chunk of the western hemisphere.
119 SJOtoLIR : Are you sure with this statement related to the expansion of jetBlue in Central America ? I would say Spirit Airlines is struggling into Guatemala Ci
120 Post contains links yellowtail : It is not my statement it is B6s (John Checketts). He specifically mentions GUA and PTY, You can read it here. http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art..
121 SJOtoLIR : Point taken. However, I even found strange the incursion of any B6 FLL-PTY and B6 FLL-GUA. Regards.
122 2travel2know2 : I'd think a possible CM PTY-FLL (specially if E190) would outperform any B6 FLL-PTY.
123 SHAQ : Are you sure? If B6 have lower fares than CM or AA, VFR O/D will fly with them and not with CM and AA. Premium customers will continue flying CM or A
124 2travel2know2 : Premium CM customers around FLL (read Aventura) would jump at the chance of flying out of FLL to PTY and anywhere CM may connect them. One could alwa
125 SJOtoLIR : Agreed. The same reason about the low possibility of the incursion of any B6 MCO-PTY, taking into account CM PTY-MCO 28x weekly from July 02nd. I thi
126 2travel2know2 : Unless B6 is to offer a product or destination not already offered by CM and best if Mileage Plus members are to earn miles on those flights. So ther
127 yellowtail : B6 would do just fine against CM
128 2travel2know2 : B6 Schedule will play a big part on its success in PTY.
129 SJOtoLIR : I keep on repeating: what would it be the innovation for any B6 FLL-PTY? NK FLL-PTY 3x weekly already flies following the red-eye schedule allocation
130 yellowtail : NK's failure /success in the market has zero bearing on any possible B6 success / failure. They draw two different kinds of clientele
131 yellowtail : Looks like CM and AA might get some (token) competition on PTY-MIA. Boliviana has applied for VVI-PTY-MIA daily using 733s
132 2travel2know2 : That looks more like competition for NK FLL-PTY, specially if Boliviana is to fly the route with the same former Lloyd Aereo Boliviano schedule.
133 yellowtail : BZE airport authority have said that they are adding 10K sq feet of departure area inside security plus an additional departure gate......this will me
134 mah4546 : Bolivian airlines don't have traffic rights U.S.-Panama.
135 2travel2know2 : If the only wanted the tech-stop why then don't look elsewhere, like an airport on VVI-MIA route with no Bolivia traffic?
136 mah4546 : Look at a map. It's almost exactly on the direct MIAVVI routing. BOG is the only airport on a more direct routing, but why bother with that airport's
137 Post contains images copa330200 : given the political relations between Bolivia and Venezuela I'm quite surprise they didn't stop there.. anyway, PTY will be very happy to take their
138 2travel2know2 : As far as I know AeroSur never made it to PTY. Boliviana has far greater chance of getting 5th freedom rights from CCS to MIA. than G3 which applied
139 LAXLocal : Wouldn't that just about double the size of it? LALocal
140 yellowtail : Currently it is 6 departure gates.
141 SJOtoLIR : That's why G3 opted for SDQ instead.
142 2travel2know2 : And for what I read on the Caribbean tread, G# isn't doing that good. Talking about Brazil, an American charter company, Vision Air, will be operatin
143 PlunaCRJ : Once, on a Lloyd flight MIA-VVI, because of an equipment change (to a 727) we had to make an unscheduled fuel stop at CCS. I don´t know why CCS was
144 LAXLocal : I mean almost double the sqft , of the existing size of the international lounge. LAXLocal
145 yellowtail : So I am taking bets on the first new route for 2012 announcement involving Central America.....
146 SJOtoLIR : AeroMexico by means of AeroMexico Connect is serving some Central American cities: Guatemala City, San Salvador and San Pedro Sula whilst AeroMexico m
147 yellowtail : SAL-MEX was downgraded from an E-jet to an ERJ-145 because of low loads..so clearly AV/TA is winning that battle
148 juanchito : In GUA Taca has now just 2 weekly flights I think this flight will disappear. Juanchito
149 Post contains images viaggiare : 2013.. AS LAX–LIR, WN HOU–SJO. [Edited 2013-02-14 15:54:45]
150 Tomassjc : A lot of us at AS would love to see that. Costa Rica has been on the AS rumor mill for some time, along with BZE. Now that the 737-900ERs are arrivin
151 SJOtoLIR : Confirmed announcements for 2013: January 02: TA SAL-MDE E90. 3x weekly April 13: UA IAD-SJO 738. 1x weekly April 13: UA IAD-GUA 738. 1x weekly April
152 yellowtail : Airport FIS will not be ready until early 2015 now.
153 Post contains images 2travel2know2 : Maybe WN is so desperate to fly to SJO that it'll start AUS-SJO and move the flight to HOU as soon as HOU's F.I.S. opens.
154 yellowtail : Don't think southwest is desperate to fly to SJO.....BOG, LIM and SAL...yes.....SJO....they want it, but not desperately.
155 2travel2know2 : SAL and maybe BOG could work out of AUS.
156 SJOtoLIR : Keep in mind UA is currently operating a huge amount of weekly frequencies into the Houston-Central America market. Analyzing the San Salvador case: U
157 MAH4546 : Neither can work out of AUS. AUSBOG couldn't even fill a bi-weekly Beech 1900D.
158 yellowtail : Would like to welcome our a.net friend Andre Franca to Belize. Looking forward to your trip report and don't drink too many Belikins!
159 yellowtail : I am going to go out on a limb and say DL LAX-SJO to start in Dec.
160 2travel2know2 : Those news may raise some eyebrows now, but by Dec many things can change. IMHO, SJO is such a market that probably DL SLC-SJO may even work and that
161 yellowtail : Word is that Tropic Air FINALLY got its mexican license today (friday) and will commence BZE-CUN daily (except Sat) on March 25th. I am told to expect
162 SJOtoLIR : The Los Angeles - San Jose sector has never been as profitable as other Central American cities with larger O&D demand from California such as Sa
163 belizexp : I would love to see DL give it another try as a daily flight. Over the last few years DL has done a good job of marketing it BZE service but one dail
164 yellowtail : THose did not fail because of pax numbers. DL jsut pulled the plug on the whole LAX experiment.
165 juanchito : Taca cancelled direct flights from GUA to MEX This route is now served 3 daily with Aeromexico (all flights with E190) and 1 daily by Interjet (A320)
166 aer : Another GU legacy route gone. I guess one of AM's flights might be upgraded to mainline or the one covered with a EM145 to be upgraded to a E190 and/
167 SJOtoLIR : Other missed routes supplied by mainline carriers from the US in the last 10 years which are no longer in service: US FLL-PTY US FLL-SJO US FLL-SAL N
168 2travel2know2 : IMO The schedule worked against the success of the route. Now that AV/TA has lost some interest in GUA, that route could work, even ONT-GUA possibly w
169 yellowtail : As per another thread...looks like it is loaded "LAX-SJO flight beginning Dec 20th? DL465 red-eye southbound/DL466 morning return on a 757" Per delta
170 SJOtoLIR : That means more pressure for TA/LR SJO-LAX 4x weekly. TA/LR must analyze carefully how the foreign carriers are taking advantage lately at some of th
171 Post contains images viaggiare : Might be a little late for that analysis.. rivals seem to be stepping up the pace and going in for the kill.
172 viaggiare : Someone beat you guys to it.. although when TA/LR (or remnants thereof) drops the route altogether (by all indications not a matter of if but when) t
173 Post contains images yellowtail : Analyze what? Foriegn carriers see opportunity. THis is just the beginning and not just for DL. Everybody is busy trying to seize markets before the
174 Post contains images AeroWesty : Go ahead, lay it on us.
175 Post contains images yellowtail : Gotta wait till I know the schedule is loaded....don't want to look like a mayan prophecy here
176 aer : Paging B6 hehe. How long will it take for CentAm to become completely up for grabs?
177 yellowtail : I think most of it (except maybe Panama) already is. CM seems to have much better control of its turf than TA
178 SJOtoLIR : Absolutely. Just taking a look into CM PTY-MIA which is 38x weekly with 738 nowadays, CM leads by far the amount of weekly frequencies in such route.
179 2travel2know2 : Morning FLL-PTY, afternoon PTY-FLL wasn't attractive for the PTY O/D market. US FLL-PTY 1900h and PTY-FLL 0600h would have been another story. Proof
180 viaggiare : Do you also foresee a dismantling of the SAL fortress in favor of a centralized operation out of BOG (and to a lesser extent LIM) in the coming years
181 2travel2know2 : I can think of routes that will disappear faster from SJO than from SAL. Destinations like SFO, DFW, IAH (w/AV/TA own metal), MSY (if ever re-starts)
182 juanchito : jaja at least tell us what Central American city is it? Juanchito
183 SCL767 : TA does operate between LIM and HAV, MEX and MIA. I doubt that UA would want TA to operate IAH-LIM. T0: LIM-HAV 4x weekly A-319 T0: LIM-MEX 4x weekly
184 Post contains images AeroWesty : Even though I'm neither Mayan nor a prophet, I'm going to guess either BZE or SAL from LAX. Both are cities served by DL nonstop from ATL, but either
185 SJOtoLIR : NK FLL-PTY 3x weekly is purely operating as "red-eye" for the time being. It doesn't seem to be a big smash. . I would take this statement: the usage
186 RCS763AV : I would agree here. SJO has a number of things going against it: 1. Very small infrastructure with little expansion plans for the future 2. Much, muc
187 2travel2know2 : True, most big Colombian cities could support some kind of non-stop service to MIA/FLL. SMR, CUC, ADZ maybe even VVC and MTR too. However I find it s
188 Post contains images yellowtail : Tropic Air's release on CUN-BZE is up on their FB page. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Tropic-Air-Belize/340653164591 Start date is march 25th. Federi
189 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : . I would keep my statement as neutral as possible. From the technical point of view, both SAL and SJO haven't expanded as faster as PTY in the last
190 mah4546 : What's ridiculous? The fares in this market are astronomical and TACA and American enjoy an unchallenged duopoly. They successfuly constrain supply t
191 Post contains images yellowtail : C'mon MAH you want a challenge again? I know of at least one C. America-MIA market that AV/TA is actively considering dropping right now. Yes, but th
192 SJOtoLIR : Let me put the full schedule: BZE 11:30............CUN 13:15........Ex Sa CUN 14:15............BZE 16:00........Ex Sa Source: Tropic Air; FB page Isn
193 mah4546 : And I would not be entirely shocked if MIATGU is suspended, again. The rest? Not going. Better chance of DL starting LAXPTY, which itself is close to
194 yellowtail : Hmmmmm...just like DL starting SJO-LAX was close to zero. Dl is looking at all of C. America right now from LAX, Time will tell. The 208s are nice..b
195 SJOtoLIR : From my perspective, the launch of DL LAX-SJO 7x weekly on December 19th doesn't necessarily mean the spread of DL in all Central America out of LAX
196 mt99 : SJO only had 5 gates used at 8AM!! Sad indeed ...
197 viaggiare : Anecdotal yet illustrative.. drove past SJO earlier this morning.. 8am ramp lineup: 2xAA, 3xCM.. no TA/LR/AV in sight. The beast is out of the cage n
198 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : Economic growth attracts airlines from www.prensa.com in Spanish Today La Prensa brings us news that "UA has 9 hubs in the U.S. and there's a possibil
199 RCS763AV : I don't know if apart from Santa Marta the others you mention would be able to support MIA service, probably not. There was some interest from NK in
200 Post contains images viaggiare : I do believe CM will start FLL this year in anticipation of B6 doing the same. Agree 100%.
201 mah4546 : No. I said the chance of Delta succeeding is weak and it's a dumb move. I stand by that; Delta will discover such on its own.
202 2travel2know2 : As I wrote on these forums before, there are days CM could well get a sizeable number of passengers from Port Everglades cruises alone. Broward Count
203 yellowtail : And that is why they work in route planning and you don't. They have access to more current and predictive data, than we can possible imagine.
204 Post contains links SJOtoLIR : A fresh thread is running: Central American Aviation Thread. Part 52 (by SJOtoLIR Feb 28 2013 in Civil Aviation) Mods, please file this extinct editio
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