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SFO Aviation Thread Part 1  
User currently offlineDolphinAir747 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 331 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 3 days ago) and read 16867 times:

Hello fellow A.nutters,

I am planning to relocate to the environs of SFO next year, and with all the changes coming to SFO and the rest of the Bay Area I thought it would be best to create a full discussion thread.

So far we know:
*NH will be launching NRT-SJC on the 788 on Jan. 11.
*UA will be launching CDG, TPE, and FLL.
*TK has SFO as part of a large wishlist.
*AA will move from the 762/763 to the 321 in 2014, and DL will soon move to the 762.
*VX is interested in further expansion.
*UA to GRU has been rumored but not from a formal source.

In terms of aircraft up/downgauges, is the LH 388 here to stay? Also, will AF resend the 388, and when will CX move to all 77W? Has LA announced f they will send the 788 to SFO?

Post any thoughts here!

238 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinesouthwest737500 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (2 years 3 days ago) and read 16884 times:

What kind of expantion do you think VX wants to do

TPA,CLT,BNA,DEN,PHX maybe


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40066 posts, RR: 74
Reply 2, posted (2 years 3 days ago) and read 16879 times:

I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chen Sheng Kun




Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinemodesto2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2819 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (2 years 3 days ago) and read 16853 times:

Point of clarification regarding DL at SFO. DL no longer operates the 762 and will maintain 752 (75E subfleet) equipment on JFKSFO.

User currently offlineDolphinAir747 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 3 days ago) and read 16834 times:

Ah yes, I forgot SK. Is the DL 762 only going JFK-LAX then?

As for VX, do they feed VS's 744 to LHR from SAN, PHX etc.?


User currently offlinesouthwest737500 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 16768 times:

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 4):

Dude VX doesn't even fly to PHX and VS doesn't even fly to SAN or PHX

Also DL doesn't operate the 762 anymore


User currently offlineplanespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3539 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 16713 times:

I'm flying SFO-NRT and SYD-SFO in February and am stuck on the old 747-400 for both legs. I typically don't poo-poo any chance to fly a 744, but since I'm not in J the experience won't exactly be pleasant, especially for 11 and 13 hours at a time.

Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?



Do you like movies about gladiators?
User currently offlineshengzhurou From China, joined May 2010, 102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 16673 times:

SQ will operate A380 on the SFO-HKG flight soon, CX will is keeping the 744 for a while, since their SFO base crew are 747 only, a triple daily 77W could happen if more loads on business class. UA's 744 are mainland base out from SFO in which I tried to avoid for going NRT or HKG. No Hawaii for VX at the moment until the ETOPS A320 arrive, rumor that they have frozen the ETOPS program. we still see KLM's MD11 in the winter.


Sheng Zhu Rou
User currently offlineDolphinAir747 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 16615 times:

Southwest-I thought VX flew to PHX. Oops.
My question, which may have been phrased confusingly, is whether VS and VX codeshare on each other's flights for routings where VS operates LHR-SFO and VX operates SFO-smaller city.
Overall, is VX ex-SFO interested in any connecting traffic or only point-to-point?


User currently offlineDolphinAir747 From United States of America, joined Jun 2012, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 16601 times:

Also, is there any chance AI will launch their strange DEL-SIN-SFO flight as they suggested?

User currently offlineiowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4433 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16525 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Any one know how WN is performing in SFO? Certainly must be decent as they have added a little over the past few years since the station was opened (unlike IAD which has been cut since station opening). Is there any terminal/ramp space for them to add additional flights? I would expect any expansion by any airline will be fairly limited in SFO due to delays and limited space.

User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40066 posts, RR: 74
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16513 times:

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO

SFO will remain 747-400s to Tokyo.  
Enjoy the 747s while you can. The new interiors on UA are just fine in coach. I've done the SFO-NRT leg in the new coach and it was fine.

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

All the other UA NRT destinations will be downgraded to a 777.
LAX will downgrade to a 787.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7959 posts, RR: 19
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16476 times:

Greetings from the desert  
Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 1):
TPA,CLT,BNA,DEN,PHX maybe

I keep hearing about VX starting up at PHX from SFO but everyone I have talked to has drawn so much speculation to the profitability of it.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 11):
SFO will remain 747-400s to Tokyo.

Love it  



Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17147 posts, RR: 10
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16480 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.



Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40066 posts, RR: 74
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16452 times:

Quoting B747forever (Reply 13):
Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.

Sadly they're dropping Bangkok.
I lived in San Francisco for 15 years and SAS always 'talked' about coming to San Francisco and nothing happened. Then I move to Bangkok and now SAS is dropping Bangkok in favor of San Francisco.
SAS doesn't like me.  



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6194 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16459 times:

Welcome to SFO Dolphin

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 9):

Also, is there any chance AI will launch their strange DEL-SIN-SFO flight as they suggested?

No

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
nyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

The 747's are all being moved to SFO. There will be 2 flights operating from LAX, but rotated back when need to SFO for maintenance.



Quoting iowaman (Reply 10):
Any one know how WN is performing in SFO?

They are doing well according to an inside source. However I don't see much expansion while they merger/transition continues with AirTran. Also, they have no additional gate space available to them.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
I believe SAS will be starting service in the spring with their beautiful A340s.

Service begins April 8th with 6 weekly (X2) CPH

An addition to this, China Eastern has express they will start service April 6th SFO-PEK

http://airlineroute.net/2012/08/14/mu-sfo-s13/

On an exciting note for UA, the steel for concourse E has arrived and is starting to go up. We should see the full frame work doen in the coming months.

The new ATC tower is well underway between T-1 and T-2. I don't know the timeframe for when you will see the structure moving up. Currently the underground work is being done, but there has been a 200 ft crane in place for about 2 weeks, so could be soon for a frame to show.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlinelegacyins From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 2145 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16453 times:

Nice thread.

A couple of other notes.

MU will restart their PVG-SFO service coming April on a daily A332.

UN applied for seasonal service twice a week this coming Spring.

Non aviation but airport related. SFO will once again have an onsite Hotel. It will be located in a current overflow lot near the A- Pier of the International Terminal. It will not be connected to the Terminal but I would expect the air train to be reconfigured to allow access. No word on the operator.



John@SFO
User currently offlinePSA727LAX From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 18 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16437 times:

Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Quoting planespotting (Reply 6):
Anyone know the timeline on the 747-400s as the main TranPac metal for UA (out of SFO and LAX), and will the replacements end up as two 787s for one 744, or just shifting currently in-fleet 777s around to reduce capacity overall?

Per another thread last week on 787s out of SFO & LAX it appears UA plans on using the 787 exclusively out of LAX and will continue the 744/777 out of SFO. The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.

Per AA & VX they both are enjoyin the new T2 but not sure that VX has any firm expansion plans for Q1 of 2013. My guess is they will have a formal announcement in mid January regarding new slot pairings. I know that SMF has been courting them for the new Terminal B. AA most likely will need to sort out the issue of merge or not before they offer up any new slot pairs.


User currently offlinepanpan From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16437 times:

Quoting B747forever (Reply 13):
Yes, will be CPH-SFO 6x weekly beginning April 8.

I hope this route does well. SAS has a great product and CPH is a wonderful airport to arrive in/connect through.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40066 posts, RR: 74
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 16434 times:

Quoting as739x (Reply 15):
An addition to this, China Eastern has express they will start service April 6th SFO-PEK

Nice!
Great to see some more 4-engine aircraft coming to San Francisco.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6194 posts, RR: 24
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 16417 times:

Quoting legacyins (Reply 16):

You beat me to the correction Legs. PVG!!



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6194 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 16416 times:

Quoting legacyins (Reply 16):
Non aviation but airport related. SFO will once again have an onsite Hotel. It will be located in a current overflow lot near the A- Pier of the International Terminal. It will not be connected to the Terminal but I would expect the air train to be reconfigured to allow access. No word on the operator.

Funny you mention that. I dropped my wife of this morning at 4am to work a flight and the lot was being used with a bus operating through it. They got that lot up and running fast.



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17147 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 16404 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
Sadly they're dropping Bangkok.



In order to operate SFO SAS have to drop a long haul destination because of the limited long haul fleet.



Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineas739x From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6194 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 16384 times:

Quoting PSA727LAX (Reply 17):
The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.

Very much the opposite. The 747 will be the dominate bird T-PAC

This summer. Daily 747 across the Pacific

SFO-NRT 747
SFO-KIX 747 (as of June)
SFO-ICN 747
SFO-PVG 747
SFO-PEK 747
SFO-HKG 747
SFO-SYD 747

and

SFO-NRT 777
SFO-TPE 777

In addition to T-PAC this summer

SFO-FRA 747 (2 daily
SFO-LHR 747 daily in addition to a 777



"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17147 posts, RR: 10
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 16375 times:

Quoting as739x (Reply 23):
Quoting PSA727LAX (Reply 17):
The 777 rules the roost at SFO for long haul routes across the Pacific.


Very much the opposite. The 747 will be the dominate bird T-PAC

Isnt the whole UA 747 fleet going to be based at SFO?



Work Hard, Fly Right
25 as739x : Yes, your correct. All other flight will rotate the 747's to/back from SFO as needed. The ORD 747 pilot base is in the process of closing as well.
26 B747forever : Then the 744 will only do SFO-XXX-SFO rotations?
27 as739x : Most of the time. Most flights will return to SFO. The SYD flight could rotate back to LAX to support the LAX-SYD flight.
28 B747forever : Oh, of course, I forgot about the LAX-SYD 744. Should have known that one.
29 Post contains images DocLightning : Welcome to town! What brings you here? Woot! A340's make me so happy. SFO-LHR has a UA 744 and UA 777, two BA 744's and a VS 744.
30 legacyins : They certainly did. They have light polls and everything.
31 DolphinAir747 : @Doc—I won't move until (most likely) the fall but I'll be studying in the Bay Area. How serious is TK's desire to fly to SFO? It seems like a good
32 DocLightning : This wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that Stanford released their Early Admission decisions on Friday, would it?
33 Superfly : Why? They send two 747s daily to SFO which is just 35 miles away from SJC.
34 B747forever : Well BA and AA have together 13 daily flights to JFK, and yet BA sends another 3 daily flights to EWR. Distance between JFK and EWR, 21 miles. It mig
35 DolphinAir747 : @B747, that was my analysis as well. I fly NYC-CDG a lot and the fact that BA serves both EWR and ORY in addition to JFK and CDG is a huge plus. San J
36 Superfly : SFO is a great airport and I rarely hear of complaints about catching flights out of SFO. It's only problem is fog. SJC is much smaller and smaller t
37 BoeingGuy : AA also did SJC-CDG and SJC-TPE for about 6 monhts in 2001. 9/11 helped end that. As you noted, Asia did in fact have international service from SJC
38 DocLightning : That "only" is a big problem. If the weather isn't clear, delays of ~3h are pretty common. Leaving that aside, SFO is a great airport. SJC really isn
39 DolphinAir747 : I guess. So do you think NH's SJC flight will be able to hold?
40 BoeingGuy : A friend of mine lives near the 92/280 interchange in San Mateo. He used to fly out of SJC, over SFO, for business trips to places like NRT and BOS b
41 DolphinAir747 : Well, if every other day the NH flight gets two Silicon Valley businessmen going to Tokyo who are ready to pay a premium to have only a 10 minute driv
42 UA735WL : I think that SJC could really benefit from the proposed (controversial?) BART extension into Santa Clara county, with a similar BART arrangement as S
43 BoeingGuy : I don't see why not. AA's SJC-NRT flight used to do very well until AA gave up on SJC. The 787 is a smaller airplane and very economical to operate.
44 Post contains images DocLightning : Well, I still didn't find out where you just found out you'll be studying. Hoping it is, indeed, my alma mater. We will need to do an SFO Airport Meet
45 Post contains images warden145 : Couple that with the fact that a large percentage of the Bay Area's senior executives live in the South Bay, and many of them would love nothing more
46 Post contains images legacyins : As we all know, SQ will start service into SFO this month on SQ 1/2 using their A380. I snapped these shots at SFO of a display. Out of curiosity, how
47 legacyins : Another question is would these CEO types settle for J as the NH flight will not have an F class? IMO, the new SJC flight is not really a new market
48 PHX787 : Where is this connecting to? HKG?
49 legacyins : Yes, routing is SIN-HKG-SFO
50 9V-SPJ : @ DolphinAir747, welcome to the Bay Area in advance! @ DocLightning, an SFO meetup sounds fun! I enjoy going to the park opposite the Westin, especial
51 warden145 : That's a fair question and I'm not sure as to the answer. However, I get the impression that it's getting more and more difficult for corporate trave
52 legacyins : They may be trying a AF move and bring it in to test the market. AF brought in their A380 last summer season due to the Japan tragedy and drop off in
53 DolphinAir747 : 9V, how about via FRA so you can get the A380 and the 747-8i? However, that does require connecting at FEA
54 legacyins : Will be a A332. So only 2 engines.
55 DocLightning : At present SJC-NRT might be able to support a 787 daily. I think JL is going to give it a try (or is it NH?). I see it as being better as a domestic
56 Post contains images 9V-SPJ : @ DolphinAir747... hadn't looked at LH, but having just looked now, its about $500 more than SIA! Lets see if the price goes down! Thanks for the sugg
57 legacyins : Yes, NH will start service on the NRT-SJC route next month. The layout of NH's 787 is 46J and 112 Y. One thing that might help this flight is the con
58 BoeingGuy : One downside is that NH won't have any connections at SJC. At most there might be a UA SJC-DEN connection. AA had connections from the NRT-SJC flight
59 legacyins : This is why I believe it will primarily be O&D on the SJC side. NH can use SFO as their connection points to the rest of the US.
60 Asiaflyer : It is just a seasonal change. The SIN-HKG-SFO A380s are coming from SIN-FRA-JFK, which gets the 77W Dec 28 until Mar 23. After Mar 23 the aircrafts a
61 Post contains images Superfly : I had fun hanging out at the last meet there with HoonsAir a few years ago. I really miss the early Airliners.net meets inside the TWA terminal back
62 Irishpower : What about these airlines and destinations? Some are new (and may have been rumored) and some used to have service- SU to SVO VN to SGN JQ to SYD or B
63 B747forever : Isnt Air Berlin returning to the summer?
64 chiawei : What are you talking about? Majority of hi-tech company are much closer to SJC than SFO. Apple, Cisco, Google, FB... etc are all closer to SJC. I wou
65 chiawei : I really would hope SQ makes this permanent change. I flew on SQ1 on 12th and will return on SQ2 on 23rd. The J is pretty much full. I miss the first
66 Post contains links and images warden145 : Nope http://www.airberlingroup.com/en/pre...2013-inspired-by-efficiency-drive-
67 mikeology : I also live in San Mateo and have not once in my life taking a flight from SJC. Granted I only take about 3 international trips a years and maybe som
68 BoeingGuy : I'm flying to San Jose tomorrow afternoon for the holidays and will have some free time for a few days before the girlfriend arrives on Saturday (not
69 DocLightning : Yes, but the drinks are expensive and the food is "meh."
70 as739x : VN: No, not unless they stop enroute. The flights to long and a very low yield route JQ: QF just dropped SFO last year, why would they launch this wi
71 Post contains images mikeology : Right next to El Torrito Bayshore Highway even though its a continuation of Airport Blvd Found this when I went to dinner with some friends at a loca
72 B747forever : What a pity! Well at least they will be seen at LAX.
73 turk0167 : Not to worry. I'm sure the California senators will soon be introducing new fog control legislation.
74 DocLightning : This week is a bad week. Christmas, then New Year's. Better to wait until after the holidays.
75 Post contains images BoeingGuy : Yeah, but I won't be in town then. I'm in the Bay Area from 12/19-12/31. Then back to the lovely Pacific Northwest.
76 DocLightning : Well, poo! Anyway, both El Torito and Elephant Bar are south/east of SFO on the shore of the bay. They are both at the eastern end of the 28's. Espec
77 DolphinAir747 : Judging by their expansion rate, TK seems the most likely...however not every "announced destination has become a reality.
78 legacyins : AB averaged a 80-85% LF for the summer season so that really was not the issue. They are in an identity crisis. Am I scheduled or charter and am I fo
79 DolphinAir747 : That describes the situation well, in addition to the whole alliance problem.
80 gigneil : If we do something that is not this calendar year, I will attend it. NS
81 BoeingGuy : Send me a note please if you do. I'll be traveling back to SJC every month or two for family reasons in the upcoming months. I'd love to join you guy
82 Turkish350XWB : Citing LaxIntl from the Turkish Aviation forum: IST-LAX: 77% LF, 45% O&D vs 53% transfer, top 5 destinations IKA, BEY, TLV, BOM, AMM As loads see
83 chiawei : I fly international once a month (made UA GS every year for last 5 years- usually able to renew status about 7 months into the year). Fog is a proble
84 as739x : Your comparing Apples to Oranges. HKG is a primary Int'l airport, not exactly a lot of domestic service. The comparing USA airports vs. Asia gets old
85 BoeingGuy : Is AS the only airline that does RNP procedures into SFO? Doesn't WN do them too? That's not a bad choice. Deal with fog delays and long waits, or fl
86 legacyins : As is obvious, SJC biggest problem in the gorilla up the road called SFO. SJC courted BA,VS and EI but nothing ever developed. Will the 787 change th
87 mikeology : Funny too is SFO must not see a problem with fog. Taking on what 4 new carriers next year plus an added UA flight? On a side note is XL Airways comin
88 legacyins : I would expect XL to come back next summer. So, for S13, there will be 4 daily flights to Paris on certain days of the week.
89 gigneil : Also I will only attend an outing I can access from BART and where nobody is offended I am carrying a flask. NS
90 legacyins : Can anyone supply data to the top 3-5 International destinations not served from SFO?
91 adipasqu : If I had to guess, I'd say FCO, DME/SVO, DUB, DEL, and BKK might be on that list? Just a guess, though...
92 DocLightning : I'll only be offended if you don't share the contents of said flask.
93 mikeology : It should be noted then that whenever this meet takes place it involves a bar or one in near proximity
94 legacyins : When the new ATC Tower opens, are they planning on tearing down the old Tower? Wishful thinking but it would be nice if they opened an outdoor or even
95 chiawei : I don't think i am. The SFO international terminal is indep. of domestic operation. So i don't understand the bag issues. UA has shanghai, PEK, HKG,
96 Post contains images BoeingGuy : Yeah, and your point is? I like that plan. Liquid refreshments are always in order when engaging in our other favorite hobbies - namely watching airp
97 gigneil : Look, I can show up anywhere on the Western seaboard as long as UA flies there and there is a bar. Just not until the New Year. Cause I'm going to COS
98 BoeingGuy : SJC also courted NW to put an A330 on SJC-NRT to replace the dearly departed AA 777. Like I said, NH is an excellent carrier from my particular exper
99 legacyins : Well, this is an airline issue you are describing, not an airport issue. There are 4 high capacity baggage carousels in the G- International arrivals
100 chiawei : I think its mixture of both. Customs at SFO also quiet long- I think they are really short staffed. I was there earlier in the summer when the custom
101 as739x : Actually back when AS did the RNP program it never got launched. Even though it was approved, NorCal needed an additional controller and they wouldn'
102 as739x : All coming down. Both ATC and Shadow Tower as well as the 6 level bulding below. All non-FAA offices have already been reloacted from the building, w
103 legacyins : I have a little experience here. Yes, if the systems go down, it is all stop. It needs to go up the chain of command to go to the various backup proc
104 DolphinAir747 : Has TK announced an official start date to SFO yet?
105 legacyins : Not yet. It my understanding that they notified the financial/regulatory(?) bodies in Turkey of their proposed list of destinations they would like t
106 AADC10 : sCO is sending a large number of new hire FAs to SFO. Perhaps that will make a difference.
107 DolphinAir747 : Are SFO flight crews only pmUA? A month ago I flew a pmCO route, PHX-EWR, on a 320 in Tulip livery with a pmUA crew which was surprising.
108 as739x : sUA Pilot and FA's sCO FA's only
109 DolphinAir747 : Interesting. Also, there's a separate thread on UA making EWR-SFO 14x daily. I need to fly that route 5 times or so next year so I selfishly hope this
110 Post contains images B747forever : I am sure that UA's fare will come down. So far they have only started phase one of the war, wait for phase two to begin soon, the pricing war
111 gigneil : I am sitting in the GB next to 74 if anyone is nearby and wants to amuse me. NS
112 DolphinAir747 : My fellow 747, I will be watching this with great pleasure.
113 DocLightning : If you have a choice between flying UA and VX, go with VX. Trust me.
114 legacyins : My guess is that UA will be using more of the G- International Terminal to handle the increase of domestic flights.
115 warden145 : That wouldn't surprise me in the slightest, unfortunately. I understand the necessity of it, but it annoys me to no end! Same with UA using Terminal
116 DolphinAir747 : I would if VX were in an alliance. Domestic service on American carriers is so bad anyways, so I really care about being able to gain/redeem miles on
117 legacyins : To keep this thread going.... SFO is constrained by space. They are surrounded by either a Bay or development. If they were to expand Terminal space,
118 N782NC : I guess that's always possible. Getting United to give up the space is another matter. Let's assume that some time in the not so distant future, a ne
119 SCL767 : Nope. LAN Perú will continue to utilize the B-767-316ER on the GRU-LIM-SFO route.
120 legacyins : Speaking of LAN. They have been flying into SFO for about two years now and have not expanded from their 4-5 weekly flights. Any possibility of going
121 SCL767 : LAN is in the process of reorganizing the schedule at the LIM hub. You will notice that LAN will change its schedule into SFO in the coming months; a
122 DolphinAir747 : Does LA market their flight as the only "direct" link between SFO and Brazil?
123 Post contains links SCL767 : LAN markets the service as, "The only Non-Stop from San Francisco to South America": http://www.lan.com/files/asociados/informacion/from_sfo_to_saa.p
124 legacyins : Which is a true statement. They are the only carrier to offer non-stop service from SFO to South America. I have heard some grubblings with LANs prop
125 PHX787 : I'm surprised UA doesn't offer more service to S. America from SFO. But then again, IAH .....
126 SCL767 : The service operates as a direct service between GRU and SFO. Also, the service is geared towards connections to HKG via SFO. Perhaps LAN wants to of
127 legacyins : maybe at that time, they might increase to a daily flight. I saw their 767, with winglets, today at SFO. I always liked their sharp livery.
128 SCL767 : Next year, LIM-LAX will increase from 13x weekly to 2x daily and LIM-SFO should get an additional frequency.
129 mikeology : Correct. I believe the flight arrives at 7am. Plenty of time for the many noon time flights leaving for Asia My favorite livery for a 767. Great look
130 legacyins : Does anyone know why 19L/R was being used today for arrivals? It was a pretty nice day but who knows how strong the winds were above.
131 warden145 : I'm pretty sure it has something to do with the storm that's on its way in...supposed to hit tonight and into tomorrow morning. There were a number o
132 legacyins : I'm flying out of SFO this morning down South and pretty fierce weather out there. Delays about an hour and alternate runway use.
133 BoeingGuy : They are taking off on the 12s at SJC now, later morning 12/21. What runways are they using at SFO today, the 10s?
134 N782NC : Departures on the 10's, arrivals on the 19's.
135 PSA727LAX : Last time i looked SFO has huge #'s of T7's and yes still a large # of 47's too. I would love nothin more than for the Queen of the sky's (747) to ke
136 DolphinAir747 : On another note, if the A380 is too much plane for FRA-SFO, will LH consider sending the 747-8i to SFO? I'm also surprised that SFO-FRA is larger than
137 legacyins : LH has no problem filling their A380 into SFO. They even extended the usage through the Holiday season. As for all the FRA flights. You have two very
138 DolphinAir747 : Doesn't LAX have lots of *A feed too? Or is it split with AA also being hubbed there?
139 B747forever : Maybe UA/LH prefer to transfer their PAX through SFO, which is a bigger hub for UA compared to LAX.
140 DolphinAir747 : I still think the flights must have mostly O&D California side. Routings like FCO-FRA-LAX-DEN involve backtracking, and last I checked DEL-HNL isn
141 legacyins : A lot of Germans and Europeans in general head for Hawaii and connect through SFO. This is of course after they tried the Canary Islands, Azores and
142 warden145 : I've seen that quite a bit...also, I wonder if people on the Pacific Northwest (PDX, SEA, etc) would go through SFO if they're loyal to Star? Granted
143 legacyins : What will be interesting to see is when SK starts service into SFO. When they flew into SEA, they had connecting traffic on AS from the bay Area. I a
144 DolphinAir747 : Speaking of India, did EY serve SFO in the past?
145 legacyins : No, not EY. The only Indian Carrier to serve SFO in the past was 9W. They had high ambitions but it never worked out.
146 DolphinAir747 : Is QR a strong possibility?
147 gigneil : I've been hearing tell for 2 years that India and Tel Aviv are on the radar from UA... I'd think with 50 787s on the way, they can indeed make both wo
148 Post contains images Schweigend : I have heard the same thing. Particularly exciting is the fact that SFO-DEL or -BOM service would allow pax to fly UA RTW, say: SFO-DEL-EWR-SFO Which
149 DolphinAir747 : I doubt the yields to India would be good enough...
150 rickabone : I think a better place would be the DHL and Asiana Cargo Ramp areas and the parking structure in between. Tear that down, extend Terminal F (that now
151 rickabone : I don't... It is my understanding that a large number of passengers that fly out of SFO on both Emirates and Lufthansa are connecting through to Indi
152 rickabone : Actually the times at GRU are pretty good, LIM is in the middle of the night, but from my experience on the flight, I would say well over half of the
153 legacyins : This would be an interesting proposal. Unfortunately, the Asiana Building is relatively new, within the last five years, and I believe there a few lo
154 rickabone : As far as fog & low ceiling related delays at SFO, they should be reduced significantly by the end of this year as a system called CASPRS is insti
155 rickabone : Yeah, I know it would be a difficult proposal with the cargo ramp leases and the money they make off of the parking structure, but given the Terminal
156 DolphinAir747 : At what cost? Load factors do not equal profitability if one fills the plane with cheap fares. Also remember that passengers are flying from SFO to m
157 legacyins : With the development of the 787, city pairs have opened up that may not have been viable using a larger aircraft. ANA will soon start SJC and JL has o
158 rickabone : I would think India would be one of the first choices. Sao Paulo would be a good second choice to compete with LAN, Madrid in Southern Europe might w
159 gigneil : I am uncertain. Well, I am thinking certainly this: A 777 from the Bay Area to really any Indian destination would be low in yield. A 787-8 from the
160 legacyins : With UA having 50 787 on order, they would be a natural choice to offer service from their hub at SFO. As I do not care for one carrier to have such a
161 legacyins : Singapore Airlines will be flying in their A380 into SFO tomorrow for a short three month period. They will be using gate 101 at the G-terminal but th
162 DolphinAir747 : Maybe DEL or BOM could work on a 788, but EWR-BLR still seems like a better new 788 route to India for UA. Will UA launch CAN or is that too low-yield
163 Post contains links rwy04lga : Another thread has this GREAT video of a LH 388 approaching and landing SFO 28R,,,, Check it! (VIDEO) Landing @ SFO OnBoard LH Airbus A380 (by werdywe
164 UA787DEN : SFO-CAN might start. Most major Chinese Airports aren't that low yielding. UA already has well established PEK and PVG service. The issue is that CAN
165 flySFO : Once terminal 3-E is reopened, will the new tenants be US, AC, and UA? Will UA still need to use the 5 or so gates it is using as overflow in 1-B righ
166 legacyins : When Pier E reopens, it will have a total of 10 Gates. It is my understand that AC and US will move over and I am sure UA will be in there also. What
167 Post contains images legacyins : The BAT did a nice story on SQ A380 arrival into SFO. Pictures and story provided by BAT. Last Friday (Dec 28), a giant double-decker Singapore Airlin
168 UA787DEN : Is there any special reason SQ is flying the 380 to SFO? Or just because they can and maybe testing the waters for future service?
169 Nimish : For UA - a SFO-BLR route would probably be highly yielding from the start (no data to back this up, just anecdotal experience on this route). Of cour
170 Post contains images warden145 : SFO's a major Star hub, would be my guess...coupled with downgauging the JFK route for the winter. I'm hoping there's also an element of testing the
171 legacyins : Yes, the A380 came from JFK and the 77W went to JFK from SFO. They had some pretty cheap fares from SFO to HKG and I can imagine this is the reason f
172 DolphinAir747 : Even if there is some business traffic between the Silicon Valley and Bangalore, is the market large enough? it seems strange to operate that route w
173 irishair98 : would EI ever restart SFO is the demand there ??
174 Post contains links legacyins : I do not believe EI will restart SFO or the West Coast in the foreseeable future. There was talk that they were looking at the route last year but th
175 irishair98 : EI have stated they are looking to expand on there long haul in the coming years and in my opinion SFO and YYZ would be first on EI 's list.
176 legacyins : I agree. It would be nice to see the green shamrock at SFO again.
177 irishair98 : likewise i was in SFO last month returning to DUB and it was th ebiggest pain ever connecting in ORD and nearly missing my flight back. It would have
178 Nimish : Market is certainly large enough - again based on anecdotal inputs only. SFO-DEL would work well as well, but then they already have EWR-DEL. Hence p
179 legacyins : Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't UA have an around the World Flight a few years ago that connected through HKG to DEL and onto LHR? I may be off o
180 warden145 : IIRC 9W pulled out right about the time the recession hit...I don't know how the route did throughout its short lifespan, but could the recession hav
181 AADC10 : That was the old RTW flights 1/2. The last time it operated I believe it was IAD-LHR-DEL-HKG-LAX-IAD (the other flight went the other direction) most
182 hereandthere41 : If I'm not mistaken, UA 1/2 operated JFK-LHR-DEL-HKG-LAX-JFK, not via IAD. I believe the LAX-JFK-LHR-DEL portion was flown on a 762/763 while DEL-HKG
183 DolphinAir747 : American carriers have had lots of trouble with India in the past. In the past U.S. carriers served India from ORD, JFK, and ATL, but these routes wer
184 hereandthere41 : Times have changed drastically. Much of the flying is done with feed from alliance partners. On the daily SFO-FRA flight, the majority of the plane i
185 AirCalSNA : Interesting maneuver of a United 747 over Pacific/Presidio Heights at about noon today. It was much lower than normal and turned from about 360 degree
186 gigneil : In the eveningtime, that's a fairly common procedure. I can hear them directly over my house often. I used to have a chart of the arrivals and departu
187 legacyins : Being an aviation enthusiast , low flying and possibly noisy commercial aviation aircraft does not bother me. My neighbor, however, hates it and alwa
188 AirCalSNA : Yep, you can practically set your watch by the various Europe-bound afternoon departures. But this was extra low and a bit early in the day.
189 Post contains links legacyins : As part of a Federal mandated program to extend runways for a safety barrier, SFO will shut down various runways on the weekends. This will impact ope
190 DolphinAir747 : With the global expansion of the Middle Eastern carriers, I am very doubtful of a new India-U.S. nonstop service anytime soon, period. If UA hasn't la
191 gigneil : Because they haven't yet had the right plane, first off. Second off, SFO-BLR would cater to a very, very specific market that is extremely high in yie
192 sfoa380 : What is the demand from NYC-BLR vs. Bay Area-BLR?
193 AADC10 : Yes, it did go through JFK at one time but my recollection of the last time it operated, it was through IAD. I recall taking the LAX-IAD segment seve
194 DolphinAir747 : If you have any actual numerical data on yields, I would be very interested. SFO-DEL already pushes the limits of the 788, so would SFO-BLR even be d
195 LAXintl : Greetings from SoCal. Let me add a bit more color to various comments here. TK as its required to do for regulatory reasons announces a "wish list" of
196 DolphinAir747 : Bingo. Again, BLR is even further than DEL. Out of the 97 daily passengers, I doubt that too many of them would be ready to pay a huge premium to fly
197 DolphinAir747 : What are the PDEW numbers for SFO-DEL and SFO-BOM?
198 questions : When is the remodel and reconstruction work on Terminal 1 scheduled to begin/end?
199 Post contains links legacyins : The Terminal 1 remodel is a long term plan and is in line to start after the pier E remodel going on now. Here is a link to the proposal. http://www.
200 Post contains links legacyins : Nice piece in The Chronicle about ANA starting service to NRT this coming Friday. They do mention SFO and the contrasts between the two airports. http
201 LAXintl : SFO - DEL = 208 SFO - BOM = 117 Kinda interesting how much more demand skews for Delhi in the Bay Area. In comparison from LA basin, both Delhi and M
202 DolphinAir747 : That's ineteresting. So even if Bangalore-Silicon Valley is a market with lots of business demand, planes can't be filled on it. SFO-DEL would be an
203 LAXintl : The NRT-DEL route was launched as part of the UA/NH JV (similar to how NRT-MNL). Nearly 50% of the enplanements are transpac feed at the moment. Not
204 DolphinAir747 : I checked and NH has short connection times on SFO-NRT-DEL. NH should launch BLR and time it to connect with the SJC flight.
205 gigneil : Is that in order? That doesn't surprise me, and if you match it with United's connecting traffic, SFO-DEL probably has the traffic to drive a 787. NS
206 DolphinAir747 : Don't overestimate the connecting traffic—LAX is the only reasonably sized market to India which would make sense for connections. The flight would
207 BoeingGuy : Does anybody know what gate NH is going to use at SJC? 15 or 16? Will check-in be in Terminal A, or Terminal B (the latter of which is much nicer)? Ho
208 laca773 : Second off, SFO-BLR would cater to a very, very specific market that is extremely high in yield. NS[/quote] The India based airlines are such a mess f
209 gigneil : I am not so sure. I'd think Phoenix, Seattle, Portland, and the like make sense as connecting markets. NS
210 DolphinAir747 : Is SEA-SFO-DEL much shorter than SEA-DXB-DEL (to speak nothing of pax going to BOM, BLR, HYD, etc?) And I mean, how many PDEW is PHX-DEL? Probably no
211 legacyins : Since the new lounge is located across from Gate 15, the flight can use either gate. I believe Volaris has a flight certain days of the week that ove
212 questions : Thanks for the link. Any word on which airlines will be going into the new T1 Boarding Area B? Will DL and its Sky Club move from Boarding Area C int
213 gigneil : I ain't gonna fight on that topic, but lets say they contribute amongst all of them to 25 pax a day. That's a full flight for DEL. NS
214 Nimish : Ideally to the wider UA/NH trans pacific bank (if one exists) - that way they can feed the NRT-BLR flight with traffic not just from SJC, but from al
215 LAXintl : Yes About 7 per day. Need to keep in mind just because SFO-DEL might be 200'ish PDEW, even a nonstop would likely capture at best about 50% of that.
216 MarcoPoloWorld : Can somebody explain why there wouldn't be sufficient demand between San Francisco and Montréal (metro areas of about 8 and 4 million population, re
217 Post contains images point2point : This is a puzzle to me as well. Besides having about 122 PDEW, (and how seasonal could this be?) these are really both major *A hubs...........YUL ge
218 LAXintl : Well Air Canada does not have much between YUL and LA either - a market of 17+ million. Only a single A319 flight. But regarding SF - Montreal, its on
219 DolphinAir747 : Spot-on. Plus, with both LH and UA increasing their flights to India, *A doesn't want to flood the market and kill yields.
220 BoeingGuy : Is anybody going to be at SJC tomorrow to get photos of the first NH 787 there? That will be great!
221 Post contains images Tomassjc : Hopefully I'll get a shot! I'll be working. AS's GDL inbound aircraft will come into Gate 16 as usual, but will tow over to the B gates for the 10am
222 BoeingGuy : Sure it makes sense. So only one of the international gates can handle anything bigger than a 737? That seems like poor planning. What if eventually
223 BoeingGuy : Do you guys still plan that SFO A.net plane watching session at El Torito in Burlingame, as was discussed early in this long-running thread? I'll be i
224 Tomassjc : Indeed it was! Tomas SJC
225 legacyins : Does anyone know when LH will restart their A380 service from SFO? I believe they are using a 744 at this time.
226 gigneil : You can easily get to SFO from the Millbrae Caltrain station - its about a $2 ride on BART, but they are generally well timed to provide connecting o
227 legacyins : It is doable. I live in Milbrae on Murchison drive. Once in a while I will take a walk over to the Bay Park. Just walk over to Millbrae avenue and wa
228 Post contains images warden145 : That's an option...he could also call a car service. I happen to know a very good one...
229 Post contains images BoeingGuy : I grew up on Frontera Drive as a child, between Loyola and Sebastian. My grandparents sold the house in 1979. Guess how I got my passion for airplane
230 gigneil : I'm more a big picture kind of guy. NS
231 mikeology : Preferably the weekend but yeah those dates would be fine
232 legacyins : I often admire the photos taken from the Bay Park area showing aircraft departing from the 28s. What type of lens would be appropriate? Would a 80-400
233 AirCalSNA : I would have to do it on the weekend as well, but it sounds like it would be a cool thing to do.
234 Post contains links legacyins : This kind of came out of the blue. San Francisco Supervisor proposes adding Harvey Milk into the Airport name. http://news.yahoo.com/san-francisco-...
235 Post contains links legacyins : Looks like the proposal to rename the airport is getting a luke warm response from the airport commission. http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2013...out-
236 legacyins : Cathay Pacific is winding down their 744 operations into SFO for W13. They will be offering 744 service only three days per week but will keep frequen
237 Post contains links legacyins : United recently announced a new club design that opened at ORD. The International Red Carpet at SFO has been open for approximately 12 years now and I
238 Post contains links iowaman : This thread is getting quite lengthy so please continue the discussion here: SFO Aviation Thread #2 (by iowaman Jan 19 2013 in Civil Aviation)
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