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Boeing Books Orders For 30 777  
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11247 posts, RR: 33
Posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 27678 times:

Tweeded by Jon Ostrower:

- WSJ: Boeing Books Orders For 30 777 Jets And 15 737s
- WSJ: New Boeing Orders From Unidentified Customers
- WSJ: New Boeing 777 Order Worth $9.5 Billion, Before Discounts

http://twitter.com/jonostrower

So, let's start guessing.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
78 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 27720 times:

Philippine Airlines...  Wink

[Edited 2012-12-20 10:07:20]

User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1762 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 27681 times:
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This sounds different from a Memo of Understanding (which isn't that firm). To narrow it down, which airlines or regions historically conceal firm orders?

Edit: I think this order is too big for PL. EK would've disclosed it as would the other gulf carriers. My supposition is its a China order.

[Edited 2012-12-20 10:08:20]

User currently offlinejtdieffen From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 179 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 27416 times:

I'm guessing it's the two China orders that were mentioned earlier this year:

China Eastern 20
China Southern 10



Regards! JDief
User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3735 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 27109 times:

Or maybe it's UA to replace the 744 fleet. Seems like the right amount.


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User currently offlineredrooster3 From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 229 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 27073 times:

From the latest O&D spreadsheet, it looks like the same customer ordered both 777s and 737s together. Seen here:
http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm

Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 2):
This sounds different from a Memo of Understanding (which isn't that firm).

Its usually firm when Boeing updates it on their spreadsheet. For example, Thats why you don't see Turkish's 15 77W order on the O&D spreadsheet immediately, The order was announced 2 months ago, but was only updated last week onto the spreadsheet. Its because they wait until the airline firms the deal, then they update.



The only thing you should change about a woman is her last name.
User currently offlineThe777Man From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 6550 posts, RR: 55
Reply 6, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 26909 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 4):
Or maybe it's UA to replace the 744 fleet. Seems like the right amount.

I wish!

United said before that the A350 would replace the 744s so UA is not so likely to order 77Ws, unfortunately.

It's probably China Eastern and another Chinese carrier.

The777Man



Need a Boeing 777 Firing Order....Further to fly....CI, MU, LX and LH 777s
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30886 posts, RR: 87
Reply 7, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 26714 times:
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Quoting jtdieffen (Reply 3):
I'm guessing it's the two China orders that were mentioned earlier this year:

China Eastern 20
China Southern 10

Normally these deals are firmed during State Visits, but since it is end of year, China might be giving the US an early XMAS present.  

China Eastern converted their 787s to 45 737s this year, so the 15 737s might be for China Southern or for another customer.


User currently offlineAV8AJET From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1343 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26544 times:

Maybe AA or DL for some 777-300's?


"To fly or not to fly there is no question!"
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 30886 posts, RR: 87
Reply 9, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26475 times:
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Quoting AV8AJET (Reply 8):
Maybe AA or DL for some 777-300's?

AA adds them one at a time.

And no way is DL ordering 3 777-300ERs, much less 30. Remember, they're saving cash and buying used.


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11247 posts, RR: 33
Reply 10, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26386 times:

Quoting PRFLYER (Reply 1):
Philippine Airlines...

Nah, not so many. I think this order goes to the Chinese carriers: 20 for China Eastern and 10 for China Southern.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3735 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26374 times:

Quoting The777Man (Reply 6):
United said before that the A350 would replace the 744s so UA is not so likely to order 77Ws, unfortunately.

That was under Tilton.

Smisek has stated that they are looking at the A350-1000, 77W, 748I, and A380 for their 744 replacement. And don't forget about the Boeing video a while back showing a 77W in UA Dreamliner livery.



Primary Airport: FWA/Alternate Airport: DTW/Not employed by the FWACAA or their partners
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8326 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26270 times:
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Quoting AV8AJET (Reply 8):
Maybe AA or DL for some 777-300's?
Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 4):
Or maybe it's UA to replace the 744 fleet. Seems like the right amount.

Probably a US based airline since they do need 777-300ER range and capacity. 30 is right for Delta and UA with their 744 fleets only getting older. Some of these 777 could be for 777-200ER replacements since United has some over 15 years old. AA could use more then the 10 77W they ordered since GRU, EZE, NRT and LHR all need more capacity. Interesting to speculate who it is, but its not from Asia as those airlines already have big 77W fleets and in Cathay's case A350-1000 on order.

Could be BA. No way its Lufthansa or AF group.


User currently offlineVCy From Cyprus, joined Dec 2012, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 26240 times:
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According to wikipedia (i know) , China Eastern has ordered 20 777-300 ER to replace their 5 340-600

User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5393 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25952 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 10):
I think this order goes to the Chinese carriers: 20 for China Eastern and 10 for China Southern.

  

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 12):
Probably a US based airline since they do need 777-300ER range and capacity. 30 is right for Delta and UA with their 744 fleets only getting older.

777-300ER orders from either one would be plausible, but not for 30 units. UA could use about 12-16 and DL could use 8 or so. Both have more 744s than they need. And if I were a betting man, I'd bet on both carriers waiting for the 777-9X, unless it slips quite a bit further...


User currently offlineUPS757Pilot From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 102 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25902 times:

Don't forget they could be freighters...There have been on and off again rumors of 5X looking at the 777. Possibly them or FX. 30 would be a significant order for any freight operator, but the article doesn't state a breakdown, so who knows?

User currently offlinePRFLYER From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 305 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 25730 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 10):
Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 10):
Quoting PRFLYER (Reply 1):
Philippine Airlines...

Nah, not so many. I think this order goes to the Chinese carriers: 20 for China Eastern and 10 for China Southern.

I'm basing my guess on this statement by PAL President Ramon Ang.

http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/371334...craft-worth-7-billion#.UNNvh8WHKSo

PAL will consider where to source the remaining 46 of its 100 aircraft requirement, but 26 of the new fleet will be long-bodied planes good for 17 hours travel, from Manila to New York and Manila to Paris, according to Ang.

’The good Boeing planes we are looking at are the 777-300 ER and the upcoming 777-X. We’re also interested in the Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner,’’ President Ramon Ang told reporters.


User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1617 posts, RR: 7
Reply 17, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 24590 times:

Too early for DL to replace the 744 fleet after just spending so much money to update them. There are only 16 744's and DL has publicly stated they intend to fly them until about 2020. They certainly have no need for 30.


Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8326 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 22744 times:
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Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 17):
Too early for DL to replace the 744 fleet after just spending so much money to update them. There are only 16 744's and DL has publicly stated they intend to fly them until about 2020. They certainly have no need for 30.

Delta does not have that many pacific worthy airplanes, A330, need not apply here. With Delta's 777LR flying to all corners of South Africa, Dubai and Sydney the 777-300ER could just be what is called for. DL could also use 77W to Brazil, their new JV with Virgin could also use a better plane then a 767 from ATL and JFK to LHR. Flights to CDG and AMS could also use bigger planes, hey if they work for AF and KLM why not Delta ?


User currently offlineAA94 From United States of America, joined Aug 2011, 583 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 21774 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 18):
Delta does not have that many pacific worthy airplanes, A330, need not apply here. With Delta's 777LR flying to all corners of South Africa, Dubai and Sydney the 777-300ER could just be what is called for. DL could also use 77W to Brazil, their new JV with Virgin could also use a better plane then a 767 from ATL and JFK to LHR. Flights to CDG and AMS could also use bigger planes, hey if they work for AF and KLM why not Delta ?

DL has said that they are refraining from purchasing new aircraft as they are enjoying great success with the used aircraft market. It seems out of character that they would then place such a large order for planes that don't really fit into their aircraft demand, especially not in that quantity. None of what you've described above requires 30 77Ws.



Choose a challenge over competence / Eleanor Roosevelt
User currently offlinenrt1011 From Canada, joined Jan 2005, 104 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 21349 times:

Good for Delta, it is nice to see an airline effectively using used aircraft for some of their business. Sometimes it is a shame that more airlines do not effectively use A330 much as some are still using that great workhorse the 767. From a customer perspective, if an airline does up these older planes with good seating and services, then I don't really care what plane I fly (as long as it is a wide body)

User currently offlineDFWHeavy From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 560 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 20964 times:

I can't wait to find out who this order is from. I'd love for it to be a US carrier, but I'm not confident that it is.


Christopher W Slovacek
User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2301 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 20883 times:

I think this order is from the Chinese, Cant see anyone else who would order that much 777s right now, Well EK would come to mind but they already have loads of them on order. Doubt they would need more now.


Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlinegigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 23, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 20440 times:

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 11):
Smisek has stated that they are looking at the A350-1000, 77W, 748I, and A380 for their 744 replacement.

But is committed to the order of -900s.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 12):
Probably a US based airline since they do need 777-300ER range and capacity.

Exactly one US carrier has them.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 18):
Delta does not have that many pacific worthy airplanes, A330, need not apply here.

They seem to do just fine with them now.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 18):
their new JV with Virgin could also use a better plane then a 767 from ATL and JFK to LHR.

Could it? Lets see some numbers.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 18):
Flights to CDG and AMS could also use bigger planes, hey if they work for AF and KLM why not Delta ?

Why Delta?

NS


User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9321 posts, RR: 14
Reply 24, posted (1 year 8 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 20316 times:

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 18):
hey if they work for AF and KLM why not Delta ?

So your going to tell a company that is about to make nearly 2B this year that they aren't doing things right? Really?



yep.
25 ER757 : I concur that it's probably for China, that would be my guess also. I don't know who they are for but I can say they are not for EK this time around.
26 cosmofly : It is politically correct for China to do even the slightest bit to help the growing trade imbalance for this year.
27 as739x : Isn't that the truth! Pre-merger UA said this, yes. Now not that I think this will be a UA order or there is one coming, they haven't said they are l
28 gigneil : They do it all the time internally. The A350s are a done deal. NS
29 as739x : Then again is was wishful thinking.
30 SonomaFlyer : UA took on the 359 order to replace the 744's. Recall, Airbus let them roll over deposits/contractual liability from an earlier Airbus order to the 35
31 Post contains images A36001 : Qantas? please..
32 seabosdca : They are most surely coming. But is it certain that they will replace 744s? If UA decided it wanted more capacity, it could easily use A350s to repla
33 SonomaFlyer : The 350-1000 is shaping up to be a great a/c. The interesting question is why order the 77W if you have 350-1000's on the way? The 772s are in good sh
34 warren747sp : Why not SAA? About time!
35 FWAERJ : SAA said back in the day that a 4-engine plane like the A346 was better for South Africa's hot conditions than a twin. Don't think that holds water t
36 BlueSky1976 : Nope. United went on the record saying they wanted "next generation" aircraft to replace their 747. I also think that if it is for US-based carrier,
37 Post contains links ord : Here's what Smisek said back over the summer: http://www.nycaviation.com/2012/07/u...onsidering-big-boeing-airbus-jets/ United is considering the A350
38 krisyyz : Could it be Swiss? I know their A333s are new, but there was talk of them looking at the 777 to replace the A343 fleet and expand. I think some of the
39 seabosdca : That was the plan before the merger. The merger considerably changed the situation for their Asia network, and they haven't said anything meaningful
40 Post contains links STT757 : From the Aviation Week article: and; Now maybe I'm cutting hairs but the article says "among the aircraft" when refering the A350-1000, 747-8I and 77
41 jfk777 : 1011 Man, Yes, why not. Delta has always been conservative. NW flew big planes to Asia for decades, DL should learn from the folks in MSP, those peop
42 Post contains links mffoda : Perhaps, China Airlines is part of this order? I just saw this published. "TAIPEI: Taiwan's leading carrier China Airlines said Friday it will buy six
43 sweair : Will SK ever get a big aircraft again? Above the A343? They did fly DC10s and one 747 back in the good days. A 77W would be a big step for SK though,
44 Post contains images Deltal1011man : 2 billion dollars. say it a few times, think about it. uh, and Delta still has the same fleet(with 18 more 777s) than NW had. oh and NW was but a sma
45 Stitch : One of the reasons DL have that $2 billion is because they're not ordering $9 billion worth of new widebody airplanes. They saved over $1 billion taki
46 AA777223 : Unfortunately, the order books for the two aircraft in the last few years wouldn't seem to agree with you.
47 SonomaFlyer : The 350-1000 didn't garner many orders at first because the specs were a moving target. They took their time to finalize the specs due to input from
48 columba : Yes I remember the talk but 30 777s might be too much as they only need them for 4 routes or so.
49 fun2fly : Back on point, who ordered the units? So far, seems like PAL has the best story based on what we read above. UA and DL are a no b/c of the 15 737's ad
50 KC135TopBoom : we don't yet know fully what the A-310 will be, so how can you say that? The A-3510 won't be available until close to 2020 with an EIS at 2017. Anyon
51 columba : LH is very pleased with the 747-8I, they decided against the 77W in favor for the 747-8 and doubt that they change their mind again.
52 7BOEING7 : I don't see anything anywhere that links the 777 and 737 orders to the same customer. Even the Boeing literature says customer(s) which is Boeing's s
53 flightsimer : British Airways anyone?
54 vin2basketball : DL can barely find enough flying for 16 744s - how in the world will they fill 30 77Ws Now if there is a split order - maybe DL takes like 10 of thes
55 Stitch : BA is not going to order the 737NG and while they evidently really like the 777-300ER, considering they've updating their 747-400 fleet makes me incl
56 DFWHeavy : I really can't wait to find out who ordered these.. 30 copies of any 777 model is an impressive order (assuming all these are for one customer, which
57 phxa340 : Highly suspect this is China firming up their deal with Boeing. They ordered 10 and 20 which low and behold totals 30.
58 Post contains links KarelXWB : China Airlines is not a part of this deal. http://twitter.com/jonostrower/status/282186689735184386
59 SonomaFlyer : I think PHX was referring to the nation of China which makes the calls regarding ordering for their airlines. Not to be confused with China Airlines w
60 as739x : Thought the same thing. Is this a joint order, or 2 orders made the same day? If it were a joint order then it really narrows down the airlines. This
61 PSU.DTW.SCE : It is absolutely positively 100% not DL. New widebody international aircraft is not in their short/medium term plans. With all of the past aircraft ac
62 strfyr51 : Up until Last WEEK Glenn Tilton was STILL Chairman of the BOARD, I doubt that Smisek could have changed that order for the fact that the 42 A320's st
63 SavannahMark : Regardless of who purchases these frames, the B777 continues to be a monster in the sales department. Just a ridiculously good aircraft for anyone wit
64 Prost : Wouldn't the best bet of a customer ordering this many aircraft be a leasing firm?
65 Post contains links Gunsontheroof : They're for CI, folks. Deliveries start in 2014. http://seattletimes.com/html/busines.../2019953199_boeing777orderxml.html
66 SavannahMark : CI is purchasing these aircraft to replace their aging 747-400 fleet. And there remains any speculation as to why the 747-8i isn't selling? Boeing is
67 Stitch : CI's order is only for 6 and it's a separate order from these 30, which are shown as UFOs.
68 Polot : Except CI ordered 6, not 30, 777s. The article you posted also makes it clear that this is an addition to the 30 airplane order, not part of- althoug
69 ER757 : Not that your assessment of the 77W isn't correct - it certainly is - 6 of them don't replace CI's 747 fleet. The article says they;re to replace its
70 DTWPurserBoy : Northwest, and now Delta, have used the A330-200 very effectively from SFO-NRT and SEA-NRT. Excellent loads with few (if any) empty seats. DL is cons
71 7BOEING7 : Except for the 4 GE powered 744's delivered in 2004/2005 the other 9 are P&W powered and were delivered between 1997 and 1999, so by the time the
72 jfk777 : Advocating Delta buy 77W is not being a "launch customer", its well established airplane. DL already operates its twin the 777-200LR. What is the alt
73 DTWPurserBoy : My apologies....I was thinking in terms of the 787. DL is always looking at the aircraft market and you never know what they are going to do until it
74 airlinebuilder : any idea as to when these 30 frames orderd will be disclosed? any connections from the inside anyone?
75 Stitch : Assuming they are for Chinese carriers, they will likely be revealed at the next high-level meetings between the US and Chinese government.
76 The777Man : There were rumors before that of the 30, 20 were 77Ws for China Eastern and 10 77Ws for China Southern. The777Man
77 Post contains links Polot : Makes sense. Earlier this year they announced they were committing to ordering 20 but it they were waiting for government approval before Boeing woul
78 Post contains images rwy04lga : Yeah, SkyTeam! I'll have to get a Chinese visa!
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