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Piedmont Yak-40? It Might Have Been...  
User currently offline802flyguy From United States of America, joined May 2012, 209 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8331 times:

Some years ago. I head a rumor that PI had considered the Yakolev Yak-40 back in the 70s. Since, in the airline biz, a rumor and three dollars will get you coffee at Starbucks, I did not think there was much to it. Something brought it to mind recently; it turns that there actually was something to the rumor after all! In 1974, PI Vice president William Magruder sought State Dept assistance in going to the Soviet Union to evaluate the type.

http://aad.archives.gov/aad/createpdf?rid=69161&dt=2474&dl=1345

It would be interesting to know how close it came to taking place. Imagine seeing Yak-40s in GSO!

Fire up the Photoshop.  

[Edited 2013-01-04 02:32:24]

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7710 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8240 times:

That would have been so cool! However, I can see how a lot of people may well have strongly objected to flying a Soviet type at the time - potentially commercial suicide?


✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineFlyingsottsman From Australia, joined Oct 2010, 556 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8234 times:

Well I supose nobody in the 70s or 80s could ever imagine seeing an Aeroflot Boeing or Airbus jet, I doubt he would have got very far and the 70s being at the height of the cold war, but would have made for some interesting photos.

User currently offlineGCT64 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2007, 1408 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8203 times:

It would have been an early commuter / regional jet, so that would have been very forward looking and in service 10/15 years before the CRJ. It would have been replacing / operating alongside YS-11s (if I have got the timelines right) and pax may well have preferred the "commie jet" to the turboprop alternative.

Thanks, an interesting post - and a lot better than the usual AvB fare we see here  Smile

[Edited 2013-01-04 03:05:12]


Flown in: A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A388,BA11,BU31,B190, B461,B462,(..51 types..),VC10,WESX
User currently offlineFlyingsottsman From Australia, joined Oct 2010, 556 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8147 times:

How many Yak 42's were made and I wounder how many are still flying?

User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5712 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8133 times:

In the early 1970s the USSR Export Agency launched a push to export Russian aircraft to the West. In this time frame at least one major tour to South East Asia, Australia & New Zealand was undertaken by a Yak-42. The aircraft was shown to major airlines in the area including AN, TN, East West as well as DCA Airworthiness & Operational officials. The only comment from a colleague I remember was "scarey".

Gemuser

[Edited 2013-01-04 03:32:41]


DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offline802flyguy From United States of America, joined May 2012, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8101 times:

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 4):
Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 4):

How many Yak 42's were made and I wounder how many are still flying?

The Yak 42 is still alive and well, may I gently point out that the thread refers to the earlier (and smaller) -40? I would think that the economics of the Yak-40 - three engines and only 32 seats - would be rather poor (even though it can operate out of very short runways).

You can get your very own for USD 150K!  http://www.buyplanesforsale.com/aircraft/airplanes/1974-yak-40/1730/


User currently offlinerutankrd From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 3016 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8101 times:
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Was also demos in the UK to British Caledonian, and BIA at Gatwick.

Several sales were completed with a few in West Germany and Italy !


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7710 posts, RR: 21
Reply 8, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8024 times:

Quoting 802flyguy (Reply 6):
You can get your very own for USD 150K!

Me wanty! That's cheaper than a one-bedroom flat where I live.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlinedrgmobile From Canada, joined Aug 2006, 657 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 7915 times:

Sounds more like Mr. Magruder was offered an all expenses paid junket so he "considered" the aircraft.

User currently offlineItalianFlyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1099 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7675 times:

As cool as the PI livery on a Redjet would have been....I can not see this making any sense. Even in the 2013 one of the primary factors that preclude large scale Russian frame market penetration is the lack of aircraft support and part stores in the west. I can only imagine that in the 1970s, with cold war trade restrictions in place, aircraft support systems would be nonexistent.

User currently offlineSIBILLE From Belgium, joined Jun 2005, 483 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7621 times:

I remember a Yak-40 visited Liege airport (Belgium) in the seventies or eighties. I had an article in a local newspaper (will try to find it). A new airlines based in Liege airport was looking to buy new planes but this airlines never borned.............

User currently onlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5724 posts, RR: 19
Reply 12, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7490 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 1):
I can see how a lot of people may well have strongly objected to flying a Soviet type at the time - potentially commercial suicide?

It would have been a suicide without any politics involved. Yaks 40 had a terrible fuel economy even by COMECON standards of mid-1970s which were based on non-market prices of fuel.


User currently offlineenilria From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 7320 posts, RR: 14
Reply 13, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 7422 times:

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 4):
How many Yak 42's were made and I wounder how many are still flying?

Somehow, I think more have crashed than were made. :p


User currently offlineDevilfish From Philippines, joined Jan 2006, 4876 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 6617 times:

Quoting 802flyguy (Reply 6):
I would think that the economics of the Yak-40 - three engines and only 32 seats - would be rather poor
Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 12):
Yaks 40 had a terrible fuel economy even by COMECON standards of mid-1970s which were based on non-market prices of fuel.

Perhaps its much depreciated acquisition costs after stints with previous owners allowed three frames to make it to the local registry for profitable(?) operation around the islands.....

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Photo © Richard Vandervord
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Photo © Jaime M. Unson

Quoting 802flyguy (Reply 6):
(even though it can operate out of very short runways).

Alas, this one flew into MPH...it just didn't fly out anymore.....

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Photo © He Junxian


Quoting enilria (Reply 13):

Somehow, I think more have crashed than were made.

Well, at least this lives on to greet visitors at Caticlan.....

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Photo © Axel Bjoerk


.....even though the message is a bit contrary.  

Too bad...the new livery made it look like some poor guy's Falcon 900EX    .....

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Photo © Heinz Rentmeister



[Edited 2013-01-04 13:05:40]


"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
User currently offlinepliersinsight From United States of America, joined May 2008, 496 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 6010 times:

Might it have been a CIA espionage operation disguised as a commercial visit? Instead of sneaking around you just boldly come right in through the front door with a good story behind you...........?

User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7710 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5917 times:

Quoting pliersinsight (Reply 15):
Might it have been a CIA espionage operation disguised as a commercial visit? Instead of sneaking around you just boldly come right in through the front door with a good story behind you...........?

I'm pretty sure that the KGB would have been all over any such visit, and then some.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlinewoodsboy From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 1031 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5900 times:

Hmm, pretty interesting stuff but seems so unlikely to have even been considered. At the time I imagine that low cost BAC-111s were available as well as new Fokker F-28s, both similar in size yet a little bigger than the YAK-40 but with established western customers and technical support. I guess the DC-9-10/15 would have been a bit too big if something along the lines of a 35 seat jet was what they were looking for. I dont imagine that a purchase of a Soviet commercial jet would ever have been allowed anyway, no matter what!

User currently offlineFI642 From Monaco, joined Mar 2005, 1079 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5722 times:

When EA ordered A300's there was universal outrage that they ordered Airbus.
Wisely, EA said "The engines are made here in America, and that's the expensive
part."

No way would the Yak-40 have worked. Support for it would have been difficult,
and the American perception of Soviet equipment would have kept passengers
from wanting to fly it.



737MAX, Cool Planes for the Worlds Coolest Airline.
User currently offline802flyguy From United States of America, joined May 2012, 209 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 4961 times:

Given Mr Magruder's background listed in the State Dept document, it appears that is the pilot who took a DC-8 test flight past Mach One!

http://www.airspacemag.com/history-o...here-Boeing-Will-Never-Try-It.html

"On August 21, 1961, pilot William Magruder, copilot Paul Patten, flight engineer Joseph Tomich, and flight test engineer Richard H. Edwards took Douglas DC-8-43 no. N9604Z for a test flight at Edwards Air Force Base in California. The aircraft exceeded Mach 1—the only intentional supersonic flight by an airliner other than the Concorde and the Tu-144. Bill Wasserzieher interviewed Richard Edwards in May 2007."


User currently offlineCairnterriAIR From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 405 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2821 times:

Like what another poster above stated.....it could have been a very forward way of thinking, as well as a possible way to provide jet service to smaller stations during the pre- deregulation era. While the YAK in all honesty would not have been the most efficient aircraft, perhaps the airline was interested in a jet that could be marketed as such that could wisk people in and out of small cities such as Newport News VA or Parkersburg WV...cities that could not support a 727 but where a jet could be turned around quickly (airstairs etc) and fly faster to bigger cities than the YS-11 or Allegheny's props. Back in pre-deregulation days airlines marketed service over price....and what a way to attract passengers in small communities than a fast flight on a "jet" airplane. No need to say where the plane was made, but with a YAK-40 parked next to a Nord 262 or an FH-227....guess which one would have probably gotten the attention? Could full flights have made up for the shortcomings?

[Edited 2013-01-06 20:19:36]

[Edited 2013-01-06 20:20:29]

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