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Google's G-V/550 From U.S To Pyongyang Non-stop?  
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 1017 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 14427 times:
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I was reading about Google's CEO planning to visit North Korea's capital Pyongyang. Google operates a flight department which includes a 757, a G-V and a G-550... A flight from Google's headquarters in San Jose California to Pyongyang would be about 13 hours.... The G-V and G-550 can to do that flight non-stop with ease.

Is it possible to go non-stop from the U.S to North Korea (and vice-versa) since the two countries have no diplomatic ties?? or would they have to stop somehwere else like South Korea or Japan for customs purposes??


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43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 953 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 4 weeks ago) and read 13912 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
? or would they have to stop somehwere else like South Korea or Japan for customs purposes??

I don't think there's any requirement that an aircraft stop in an intermediate country before going to FNJ. Funny though...you named to 2 countries that would probably the least likely places an flight would stop between the US and the DPRK! (DPRK does not have diplomatic relations with Japan as the DPRK thinks Japan as an aggressor imperialist nation).



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7859 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 13760 times:

FNJ has customs facilities and American citizens have been processed there in the past with no (known) issues.


我思うゆえに我あり。(Jap. 'I think, therefore I am.')
User currently offlineajd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 13759 times:

Quoting tymnbalewne (Reply 1):
I don't think there's any requirement that an aircraft stop in an intermediate country before going to FNJ. Funny though...you named to 2 countries that would probably the least likely places an flight would stop between the US and the DPRK! (DPRK does not have diplomatic relations with Japan as the DPRK thinks Japan as an aggressor imperialist nation).

Like the US, interestingly enough... 


User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 1017 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 13518 times:
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Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
FNJ has customs facilities and American citizens have been processed there in the past with no (known) issues

direct flight from the U.S??


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25871 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 13433 times:

As long as passengers and crew have the required visas there shouldn't be a problem operating nonstop, except according to the U.S. State Department page on North Korea, visas are only issued by the North Korean embassy in Beijing, so a stop there en route may be needed, unless the visitors have plenty of time and make the visa arrangements early.

Excerpt:

Where to Obtain a North Korean Visa: There is no North Korean embassy in the United States. U.S. citizens and residents planning travel to North Korea may obtain DPRK visas only at the DPRK Embassy in Beijing, China, which will issue visas upon authorization from the DPRK Foreign Ministry in Pyongyang.

Before departing for China, you may wish to confirm that the Embassy of the DPRK in Beijing has received authorization from Pyongyang to issue you a visa.

The Embassy of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea in Beijing
No. 11, Ritan Bei Lu,
Jianguomen Wai,
Chaoyang District
Beijing, China 100600
Telephone: (86-10) 6532-6639 (Visa Office)
Telephone: (86-10) 65312-1186
Facsimile: (86-10) 6532-6056

If you wish to ask the DPRK whether your application for a visa would be approved, you can address your inquiry to the Permanent Representative of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea to the United Nations in New York.

The Permanent Representative of the Democratic
People’s Republic of Korea to the United Nations
820 Second Avenue
New York, NY 10017
Telephone: (212) 972-3105
Facsimile: (212) 972-3154

If you are living abroad in a country with a DPRK embassy, you can ask there whether you would be issued a visa.


U.S. tour groups visiting North Korea normally spend at least a day in PEK en route to pick up their visa.


User currently offlinegreenwichsud From United States of America, joined May 2008, 62 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 13265 times:

Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 3):
Like the US, interestingly enough...

and the UK, for much of the past 400 years...

  


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7859 posts, RR: 19
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 12928 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 4):
direct flight from the U.S??

Well when Bill Clinton went over there to free those journalists he had to go through customs albeit it was different with his diplomatic status.

At the same time, I don't think arrivals matter so much, as long as the aircraft is cleared to land and they go through the proper quarantining/scanning/checking, then they should be allowed to go there directly.



我思うゆえに我あり。(Jap. 'I think, therefore I am.')
User currently offlinechrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2170 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12781 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 5):
U.S. tour groups visiting North Korea normally spend at least a day in PEK en route to pick up their visa.

I think it's a little different with Mr. Google and Bill Richardson (the former governor of New Mexico) than the average American. I suspect they have visas in hand before leaving the US.


User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1643 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 12728 times:

On that trip they used MSJ with is a USA Airbase and a civilian airport much like HNL/HIK

User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1331 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 9757 times:

Have a read of this, it goes into a little more detail about Bill Clinton's trip to North Korea on Shangri-La Entertainment's Boeing 737-700 BBJ (registered N2121, for those interested  ).

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...n-shines-on-freedom-flight-330651/



Air New Zealand; first to fly the Boeing 787-9. ZK-NZE, NZ103 AKL-SYD, 2014/08/09. I was 83rd to board.
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 1017 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8539 times:
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The U.S State Department is encouraging Google's CEO NOT to go, so even if he goes, I sincerely doubt they'd go and come back non-stop

I'm guessing the U.S will not accept a direct flight from North Korea. That G-550 better stop in Seoul or Tokyo "for fuel"


User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9676 posts, RR: 31
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8022 times:

The 2 gentlemen, Mr. "Google" and Mr. Richardson will be received as guests of honor by NK and I doubt that they require a visa. They won't even see a regular NK customs and immigration officer, instead will be hauled from the airport directly in the usual black Mercedes S class.

Quoting g500 (Reply 11):
I'm guessing the U.S will not accept a direct flight from North Korea. That G-550 better stop in Seoul or Tokyo "for fuel"

A safe bet would be an airport in northeastern China to top off the fuel. But what could the US do against letting an N registered aircraft with US citizens on board land at ANC or SJC? AFAIK, and someone told me recebtly, there is no law restricting travel to NK. The State Department can express a wish not to go, that#s all.

Actually, the US government should use that visit to establish indirect links and listen what the new Mr. Kim has in mind. He went to school in Switzerland for a couple of years, speaks languages and was not brought up as isolated as his dad was.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7522 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 7880 times:

Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?


'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlineflyglobal From Germany, joined Mar 2008, 596 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7783 times:

The best thing they should do is to make a fuel stop in China.

Regards
Flyglobal


User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9676 posts, RR: 31
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7765 times:

As a normal traveller, you have to surrender your cellphone and computer when entering NK and they give it back to you when leaving. They politely tell you that you do not need it while staying there.

There is however an infrastructure available.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 1017 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 7616 times:
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"Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?"

I don't think this is a business trip, nor is it political... I'm guessing is a humanitarian mission maybe


User currently offlinemptpa From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 7506 times:

Eric Schmidt is NOT Google's CEO. He is Executive Chairman, and ex-CEO. Larry Page, one of the co-founders, is the current CEO

User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 953 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 7325 times:

Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?

Yes to both. Certainly a very, very tiny segment of the population has access to the internet but it does exist. JS even have a website now. When I was in the DPRK last year there were cell phones being used. The Egyptian company Orascom got the contract to install the cell phone infrastructure...as part of the deal Orascom is completing the Ryugyong Hotel (aka "The Hotel of Doom")



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7522 posts, RR: 7
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 7309 times:

Quoting tymnbalewne (Reply 18):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?

Yes to both. Certainly a very, very tiny segment of the population has access to the internet but it does exist. JS even have a website now. When I was in the DPRK last year there were cell phones being used. The Egyptian company Orascom got the contract to install the cell phone infrastructure...as part of the deal Orascom is completing the Ryugyong Hotel (aka "The Hotel of Doom")

Thank you . I did not know this . I would not be surprised if the internet is 'filtered' in NK,either.



'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5950 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 7244 times:
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I've heard from people up here in the Seattle Korean community that Kim Jong Un is wanting to be friends with South Korea and the "West." Not confirmed. But the Google flight to North Korea seems to support that.

User currently offline777STL From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3746 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7145 times:

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):

I've heard from people up here in the Seattle Korean community that Kim Jong Un is wanting to be friends with South Korea and the "West." Not confirmed.

Yet, he's still testing ballistic missiles in the meantime.



PHX based
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 7033 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 12):
But what could the US do against letting an N registered aircraft with US citizens on board land at ANC or SJC?

Have the feds waiting there for you on arrival for an export violation. They wouldn't stop you from landing but they'd stop you from going anywhere else.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 12):
AFAIK, and someone told me recebtly, there is no law restricting travel to NK.

True, but there are a huge array of objects (many of them present on modern aircraft) that aren't allowed to be exported to NK. If you carry one there the US has plenty of laws to nab you as soon as you return, even if only to check that you had all the right licenses before you left.

Tom.


User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9676 posts, RR: 31
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6872 times:

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 22):
Have the feds waiting there for you on arrival for an export violation

What did they "export"?

If you mean the Gulfstram, you are wrng. Technically, for an export violation, the exported good has to remain in the country of destination. Not only that, it would have to be taken off the N register and re-registered in NK.

The Gulfstream is a mode of transport, as long as it keeps its N registration it is not exported. As it is not exported, there cannot be an export violation.

The feds cannot even bust them for violating the embargo., Assuming they spent not a cent in NK as guests of the government.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6809 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 23):
What did they "export"?

Laptops, cell phones, corporate IDs (which are usually encryption enabled smart cards), probably encrypting SATCOM (it's a biz jet), technical material relating to the jet and to the various electronic gizmos they're carrying...all controlled by EAR/ITAR in the US.

Tom.


25 Viscount724 : Yes to both, although internet access is quite limited and apparently mainly for government use. Cell phones are much more common. One item says that
26 Post contains links 26point2 : Some more info about the reason for the trip to NK and Obama Administration's not-too-happy reaction to it. http://www.contracostatimes.com/brea...ati
27 Post contains images tymnbalewne : Re: Internet When I was in Pyongyang I sent an email from the hotel's computer. I wrote the email and hit > but nothing happened. The lady manning
28 PanHAM : Nothing of that is exported. Laptops and cellphones are working materials which come back into the country. Taking these items on a biz trip is techn
29 L410Turbolet : AFAIK, there is no access to internet for general population, only inner circle of aparatchiks on various levels of the hierarchy. Perhaps Dear Leade
30 tymnbalewne : Wow! I've never heard about this! Frightening, really.
31 g500 : "Speaking of aviation and politics, there still is hijacked KAL YS-11, its crew and some of the passengers held captive in North Korea... since Decemb
32 tdscanuck : It is from a US standpoint (it's considered a temporary export). Germany may be different. It's a temporary export...still needs a license if you're
33 PanHAM : You know what the procedures for a temporary export are? I mentioned that with the examples where it is wiser to use a carnet ATA. There are other pro
34 tdscanuck : Yes. I have to do them about 3-4 times per year. I've done both. ATA carnet is cleanest through customs but a pain to generate (and I'm not sure if N
35 Post contains images lightsaber : As already noted very restricted and starting to become common among the elite. Which leaves the question is that to keep himself in power or... I th
36 26point2 : If you know there will be trouble why not leave the laptop in the plane then? We are are still talking about a corporate jet aren't we? Leave your co
37 Acheron : China, Russia and the US are all "friendly" to each other, but have they stopped making nuclear missiles. Besides, technically, North Korea and South
38 tdscanuck : Doesn't work. On landing, the airplane, passengers, and cargo are all cleared into the country (albeit temporarily in most cases). From the point of
39 OlafW : As mentioned above, yes to both, but with limitations. As far as I was told, there is some kind of 'nation-wide intranet' for access from North Korea
40 Post contains links tb727 : It seems he flew commercially over on Air China via Beijing. http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wir...rives-nkorea-18147968#.UOrqy4njmi8
41 mandala499 : I thought this only applies to overnight stays? Now here's a question... would you violate export restrictions if you fly a non-US registered but US
42 blueflyer : I think rules have relaxed a little bit. We were early adopters of AES, especially for VPN on laptops, and my previous laptop had a big red sticker t
43 tdscanuck : As far as I know, you would not. When the US aircraft was exported to wherever it was registered, appropriate export paperwork would have had to happ
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