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Google's G-V/550 From U.S To Pyongyang Non-stop?  
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 894 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 14072 times:
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I was reading about Google's CEO planning to visit North Korea's capital Pyongyang. Google operates a flight department which includes a 757, a G-V and a G-550... A flight from Google's headquarters in San Jose California to Pyongyang would be about 13 hours.... The G-V and G-550 can to do that flight non-stop with ease.

Is it possible to go non-stop from the U.S to North Korea (and vice-versa) since the two countries have no diplomatic ties?? or would they have to stop somehwere else like South Korea or Japan for customs purposes??


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43 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 935 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 13557 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
? or would they have to stop somehwere else like South Korea or Japan for customs purposes??

I don't think there's any requirement that an aircraft stop in an intermediate country before going to FNJ. Funny though...you named to 2 countries that would probably the least likely places an flight would stop between the US and the DPRK! (DPRK does not have diplomatic relations with Japan as the DPRK thinks Japan as an aggressor imperialist nation).



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 6940 posts, RR: 18
Reply 2, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 13405 times:

FNJ has customs facilities and American citizens have been processed there in the past with no (known) issues.


One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineajd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 13404 times:

Quoting tymnbalewne (Reply 1):
I don't think there's any requirement that an aircraft stop in an intermediate country before going to FNJ. Funny though...you named to 2 countries that would probably the least likely places an flight would stop between the US and the DPRK! (DPRK does not have diplomatic relations with Japan as the DPRK thinks Japan as an aggressor imperialist nation).

Like the US, interestingly enough... 


User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 13163 times:
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Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
FNJ has customs facilities and American citizens have been processed there in the past with no (known) issues

direct flight from the U.S??


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24061 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 13078 times:

As long as passengers and crew have the required visas there shouldn't be a problem operating nonstop, except according to the U.S. State Department page on North Korea, visas are only issued by the North Korean embassy in Beijing, so a stop there en route may be needed, unless the visitors have plenty of time and make the visa arrangements early.

Excerpt:

Where to Obtain a North Korean Visa: There is no North Korean embassy in the United States. U.S. citizens and residents planning travel to North Korea may obtain DPRK visas only at the DPRK Embassy in Beijing, China, which will issue visas upon authorization from the DPRK Foreign Ministry in Pyongyang.

Before departing for China, you may wish to confirm that the Embassy of the DPRK in Beijing has received authorization from Pyongyang to issue you a visa.

The Embassy of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea in Beijing
No. 11, Ritan Bei Lu,
Jianguomen Wai,
Chaoyang District
Beijing, China 100600
Telephone: (86-10) 6532-6639 (Visa Office)
Telephone: (86-10) 65312-1186
Facsimile: (86-10) 6532-6056

If you wish to ask the DPRK whether your application for a visa would be approved, you can address your inquiry to the Permanent Representative of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea to the United Nations in New York.

The Permanent Representative of the Democratic
People’s Republic of Korea to the United Nations
820 Second Avenue
New York, NY 10017
Telephone: (212) 972-3105
Facsimile: (212) 972-3154

If you are living abroad in a country with a DPRK embassy, you can ask there whether you would be issued a visa.


U.S. tour groups visiting North Korea normally spend at least a day in PEK en route to pick up their visa.


User currently offlinegreenwichsud From United States of America, joined May 2008, 60 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 12910 times:

Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 3):
Like the US, interestingly enough...

and the UK, for much of the past 400 years...

  


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 6940 posts, RR: 18
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 12573 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 4):
direct flight from the U.S??

Well when Bill Clinton went over there to free those journalists he had to go through customs albeit it was different with his diplomatic status.

At the same time, I don't think arrivals matter so much, as long as the aircraft is cleared to land and they go through the proper quarantining/scanning/checking, then they should be allowed to go there directly.



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlinechrisair From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 2001 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12426 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 5):
U.S. tour groups visiting North Korea normally spend at least a day in PEK en route to pick up their visa.

I think it's a little different with Mr. Google and Bill Richardson (the former governor of New Mexico) than the average American. I suspect they have visas in hand before leaving the US.


User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1602 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 12373 times:

On that trip they used MSJ with is a USA Airbase and a civilian airport much like HNL/HIK

User currently onlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1059 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9402 times:

Have a read of this, it goes into a little more detail about Bill Clinton's trip to North Korea on Shangri-La Entertainment's Boeing 737-700 BBJ (registered N2121, for those interested  ).

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...n-shines-on-freedom-flight-330651/



repaint ZK-PBG!
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8184 times:
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The U.S State Department is encouraging Google's CEO NOT to go, so even if he goes, I sincerely doubt they'd go and come back non-stop

I'm guessing the U.S will not accept a direct flight from North Korea. That G-550 better stop in Seoul or Tokyo "for fuel"


User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8739 posts, RR: 28
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 7667 times:

The 2 gentlemen, Mr. "Google" and Mr. Richardson will be received as guests of honor by NK and I doubt that they require a visa. They won't even see a regular NK customs and immigration officer, instead will be hauled from the airport directly in the usual black Mercedes S class.

Quoting g500 (Reply 11):
I'm guessing the U.S will not accept a direct flight from North Korea. That G-550 better stop in Seoul or Tokyo "for fuel"

A safe bet would be an airport in northeastern China to top off the fuel. But what could the US do against letting an N registered aircraft with US citizens on board land at ANC or SJC? AFAIK, and someone told me recebtly, there is no law restricting travel to NK. The State Department can express a wish not to go, that#s all.

Actually, the US government should use that visit to establish indirect links and listen what the new Mr. Kim has in mind. He went to school in Switzerland for a couple of years, speaks languages and was not brought up as isolated as his dad was.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7383 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 7525 times:

Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?


'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlineflyglobal From Germany, joined Mar 2008, 558 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 7428 times:

The best thing they should do is to make a fuel stop in China.

Regards
Flyglobal


User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8739 posts, RR: 28
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 7410 times:

As a normal traveller, you have to surrender your cellphone and computer when entering NK and they give it back to you when leaving. They politely tell you that you do not need it while staying there.

There is however an infrastructure available.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 7261 times:
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"Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?"

I don't think this is a business trip, nor is it political... I'm guessing is a humanitarian mission maybe


User currently offlinemptpa From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 541 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 7151 times:

Eric Schmidt is NOT Google's CEO. He is Executive Chairman, and ex-CEO. Larry Page, one of the co-founders, is the current CEO

User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 935 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6970 times:

Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?

Yes to both. Certainly a very, very tiny segment of the population has access to the internet but it does exist. JS even have a website now. When I was in the DPRK last year there were cell phones being used. The Egyptian company Orascom got the contract to install the cell phone infrastructure...as part of the deal Orascom is completing the Ryugyong Hotel (aka "The Hotel of Doom")



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7383 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6954 times:

Quoting tymnbalewne (Reply 18):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ? Is google trying to start some form of internet there ?

Yes to both. Certainly a very, very tiny segment of the population has access to the internet but it does exist. JS even have a website now. When I was in the DPRK last year there were cell phones being used. The Egyptian company Orascom got the contract to install the cell phone infrastructure...as part of the deal Orascom is completing the Ryugyong Hotel (aka "The Hotel of Doom")

Thank you . I did not know this . I would not be surprised if the internet is 'filtered' in NK,either.



'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlinewedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5830 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 6889 times:
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I've heard from people up here in the Seattle Korean community that Kim Jong Un is wanting to be friends with South Korea and the "West." Not confirmed. But the Google flight to North Korea seems to support that.

User currently offline777STL From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3366 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6790 times:

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):

I've heard from people up here in the Seattle Korean community that Kim Jong Un is wanting to be friends with South Korea and the "West." Not confirmed.

Yet, he's still testing ballistic missiles in the meantime.



PHX based
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 22, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 6678 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 12):
But what could the US do against letting an N registered aircraft with US citizens on board land at ANC or SJC?

Have the feds waiting there for you on arrival for an export violation. They wouldn't stop you from landing but they'd stop you from going anywhere else.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 12):
AFAIK, and someone told me recebtly, there is no law restricting travel to NK.

True, but there are a huge array of objects (many of them present on modern aircraft) that aren't allowed to be exported to NK. If you carry one there the US has plenty of laws to nab you as soon as you return, even if only to check that you had all the right licenses before you left.

Tom.


User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8739 posts, RR: 28
Reply 23, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6517 times:

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 22):
Have the feds waiting there for you on arrival for an export violation

What did they "export"?

If you mean the Gulfstram, you are wrng. Technically, for an export violation, the exported good has to remain in the country of destination. Not only that, it would have to be taken off the N register and re-registered in NK.

The Gulfstream is a mode of transport, as long as it keeps its N registration it is not exported. As it is not exported, there cannot be an export violation.

The feds cannot even bust them for violating the embargo., Assuming they spent not a cent in NK as guests of the government.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 24, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 6454 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 23):
What did they "export"?

Laptops, cell phones, corporate IDs (which are usually encryption enabled smart cards), probably encrypting SATCOM (it's a biz jet), technical material relating to the jet and to the various electronic gizmos they're carrying...all controlled by EAR/ITAR in the US.

Tom.


User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 24061 posts, RR: 22
Reply 25, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 6659 times:

Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ?

Yes to both, although internet access is quite limited and apparently mainly for government use. Cell phones are much more common. One item says that more than 1 million were in use as of early last year.


User currently offline26point2 From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 786 posts, RR: 0
Reply 26, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 6543 times:

Some more info about the reason for the trip to NK and Obama Administration's not-too-happy reaction to it.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/brea...ation-irked-by-google-chiefs-north


User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 935 posts, RR: 1
Reply 27, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6428 times:

Re: Internet

Quoting United_fan (Reply 19):
Thank you . I did not know this . I would not be surprised if the internet is 'filtered' in NK,either.

When I was in Pyongyang I sent an email from the hotel's computer. I wrote the email and hit > but nothing happened. The lady manning the computer (she also doubled as a postal clerk) came over, logged in and the email went. I'm sure the recipient is now on a watchlist somewhere! 



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8739 posts, RR: 28
Reply 28, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6308 times:

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 24):
Laptops, cell phones, corporate IDs (which are usually encryption enabled smart cards), probably encrypting SATCOM

Nothing of that is exported. Laptops and cellphones are working materials which come back into the country. Taking these items on a biz trip is technically not an export. If you buy a new laptop in Germany and take it to the US next day and come back next week, it would be wise to carry the invoice, just in case the customs officer asks.

Items which fall not under this category may need speciaql customs procedures for temporary export/import, siuch as a Carnet A.T.,A.. Stage equipment, musical instruments, all the material for the F1 circus. The F1 for instance travels around the world each year. All the material flown is carried under temporary import/export documentation. Technically, this is never an import, never an export since the material comes back to the base after the 18ths run in November each year.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5597 posts, RR: 19
Reply 29, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 6151 times:

Quoting United_fan (Reply 19):
I would not be surprised if the internet is 'filtered' in NK,either.

AFAIK, there is no access to internet for general population, only inner circle of aparatchiks on various levels of the hierarchy. Perhaps Dear Leader wants to pretend to be a nice guy and allow wider access while still keeping the population on tight leash at the same time. I am sure Google would be delighted to assist in such effort, their credentials from China when it comes to internet censorship are well known.
Pecunia non olet as always when it comes to big business...

Speaking of aviation and politics, there still is hijacked KAL YS-11, its crew and some of the passengers held captive in North Korea... since December 1969!


User currently offlinetymnbalewne From Bermuda, joined Mar 2005, 935 posts, RR: 1
Reply 30, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5982 times:

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 29):
Speaking of aviation and politics, there still is hijacked KAL YS-11, its crew and some of the passengers held captive in North Korea... since December 196

Wow! I've never heard about this! Frightening, really.



Dewmanair...begins with Dew
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 31, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 5962 times:
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"Speaking of aviation and politics, there still is hijacked KAL YS-11, its crew and some of the passengers held captive in North Korea... since December 1996"

I bet those Google Gulfstream pilots are eager to go then

This sounds like a trip for the most junior pilots


User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 32, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5845 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 28):
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 24):
Laptops, cell phones, corporate IDs (which are usually encryption enabled smart cards), probably encrypting SATCOM

Nothing of that is exported.

It is from a US standpoint (it's considered a temporary export). Germany may be different.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 28):
Laptops and cellphones are working materials which come back into the country. Taking these items on a biz trip is technically not an export.

It's a temporary export...still needs a license if you're doing it out of the US.

Tom.


User currently onlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8739 posts, RR: 28
Reply 33, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 5795 times:

You know what the procedures for a temporary export are? I mentioned that with the examples where it is wiser to use a carnet ATA. There are other procedures as well.

If every businessman travelling overseas would have to register his laptop and cellphone for a temporary export, which would equire the same procedure for an import, they'd need to double airport capacities.

Besides, what's the purpose anyhow? Many German businessmen travelling to the US have nothing on their laptops, due to the nosyness of US customs. Log into the server at home when needed but never carry any files on the computer.



I'm not fishing for compliments
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 34, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5413 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 33):
You know what the procedures for a temporary export are?

Yes. I have to do them about 3-4 times per year.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 33):
I mentioned that with the examples where it is wiser to use a carnet ATA. There are other procedures as well.

I've done both. ATA carnet is cleanest through customs but a pain to generate (and I'm not sure if NK uses carnets). Commercial invoice with export licence numbers is much quicker to generate but more likely to be questioned.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 33):
If every businessman travelling overseas would have to register his laptop and cellphone for a temporary export, which would equire the same procedure for an import, they'd need to double airport capacities.

A bog standard laptop or cellphone doesn't typically have export controlled technology, at least in the US. But a high level corporate one, like one would think the Google guys have, almost certainly has controlled encryption technology on it. Many US corporate ID badges do too, if they're used for laptop login. In addition, many biz jets carry their own manuals with them and some parts of aircraft manuals are export controlled data.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 33):
Many German businessmen travelling to the US have nothing on their laptops, due to the nosyness of US customs. Log into the server at home when needed but never carry any files on the computer.

This is, absolutely, the cleanest way to do it. But the question that triggered this was how the US could prevent them returning...and my point was that they could stop the aircraft and passengers at the first point of US entry to check export compliance. Even if they've done it all absolutely correctly (which you'd hope they had), CBP would be entitled to stop the aircraft for inspection until they were satisfied that all was legimitate.

Tom.


User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12413 posts, RR: 100
Reply 35, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 5319 times:
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Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ?

As already noted very restricted and starting to become common among the elite.

Quoting 777STL (Reply 21):
Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 20):

I've heard from people up here in the Seattle Korean community that Kim Jong Un is wanting to be friends with South Korea and the "West." Not confirmed.

Yet, he's still testing ballistic missiles in the meantime.

Which leaves the question is that to keep himself in power or... I think he more realizes that without more trade and technology, North Korea is getting left behind so quickly that its a joke. North Korea could be the more prosperous Korean area due to the huge available resources. Its a question of education, trade, communication, and the freedoms required to conduct business.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 23):
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 22):
Have the feds waiting there for you on arrival for an export violation

What did they "export"?

The proof is that you didn't export.

Quoting g500 (Reply 31):
This sounds like a trip for the most junior pilots

   If the G500 does go to NK, yep...

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 32):
It is from a US standpoint (it's considered a temporary export). Germany may be different.

   As a (once) licensed export authority for aviation technology, there must be a license in place for certain items to enter certain nations. Boeing has a license that allows their commercial aircraft to go to all NATO countries, etc. I really doubt the Google execs are used to traveling without stuff. Best to fly to North China and catch another flight.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 33):
If every businessman travelling overseas would have to register his laptop and cellphone for a temporary export,

If I went oversees with my laptop, I would be arrested. I had to gain a special letter to even consider taking it to Europe! (trip cancelled last minute). Those that handle export controlled items (like myself and tdscanuck) get to have fun dealing with getting export permission. Note: I didn't bother with licenses as there were *large* standing licences I worked under that a large team secured annually. (Large as in so many hundreds of millions per year in value and tens of thousands of engineering hours of 'defense support services.') But even complying to an existing license is a pain.

Lightsaber



I've posted how many times?!?
User currently offline26point2 From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 786 posts, RR: 0
Reply 36, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 5129 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 35):
If I went oversees with my laptop, I would be arrested.

If you know there will be trouble why not leave the laptop in the plane then? We are are still talking about a corporate jet aren't we? Leave your contraband in the plane...seems like a no-brainer.

[Edited 2013-01-06 16:22:54]

User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1529 posts, RR: 2
Reply 37, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 5006 times:

Quoting 777STL (Reply 21):
Yet, he's still testing ballistic missiles in the meantime.

China, Russia and the US are all "friendly" to each other, but have they stopped making nuclear missiles.
Besides, technically, North Korea and South Korea are still at war.


User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 38, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4767 times:

Quoting 26point2 (Reply 36):
If you know there will be trouble why not leave the laptop in the plane then?

Doesn't work. On landing, the airplane, passengers, and cargo are all cleared into the country (albeit temporarily in most cases). From the point of view of the US government, rightly or wrongly, you've temporarily exported it all.

There are some export licences that will allow you to take normally controlled technology into another country where it's not normally allowed if you agree to maintain appropriate controls to make sure an information export doesn't actually take place (e.g. keep the stuff on the airplane and don't allow any foreign nationals onboard) but you can only do that if you already have an export license stipulating those conditions.

If you take controlled material into the country on your laptop without a license, then come back and say "It's OK, we left it on the airplane" you could get nailed under EAR/ITAR regulations.

Tom.


User currently offlineOlafW From Germany, joined Jul 2009, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 39, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4508 times:

Quoting United_fan (Reply 13):
Does NK even have 'the internet' . Do they even have cell-phone service ?

As mentioned above, yes to both, but with limitations. As far as I was told, there is some kind of 'nation-wide intranet' for access from North Korea, and the Grand People's Study Hall features a small number of computers which are connected to the internet as we know it - of course with not all pages available. Plus all screens are visible from a central place, so they have both visual and technical control over what is looked up.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 15):
They politely tell you that you do not need it [cell phone] while staying there.

Which is the truth (considering what I was told to really be the truth...). The cell phone system of North Korea is not compatible with GSM standards. So technically, the collection of cell phones is a useless measure as even if you could carry your phone around, you wouldn't be able to use it.


User currently offlinetb727 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1546 posts, RR: 8
Reply 40, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4225 times:

It seems he flew commercially over on Air China via Beijing.

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wir...rives-nkorea-18147968#.UOrqy4njmi8



Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
User currently offlinemandala499 From Indonesia, joined Aug 2001, 6590 posts, RR: 75
Reply 41, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4061 times:

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 38):
Doesn't work. On landing, the airplane, passengers, and cargo are all cleared into the country (albeit temporarily in most cases). From the point of view of the US government, rightly or wrongly, you've temporarily exported it all.

I thought this only applies to overnight stays?
Now here's a question... would you violate export restrictions if you fly a non-US registered but US made aircraft to North Korea and back?



When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
User currently offlineblueflyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 3696 posts, RR: 2
Reply 42, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3934 times:
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Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 34):
A bog standard laptop or cellphone doesn't typically have export controlled technology, at least in the US. But a high level corporate one, like one would think the Google guys have, almost certainly has controlled encryption technology on it.

I think rules have relaxed a little bit. We were early adopters of AES, especially for VPN on laptops, and my previous laptop had a big red sticker that was supposed to remind me to swap it out for a less secure one when traveling to certain countries.

My current laptop, issued last year, has no such sticker so I presumably am free to take it wherever now.



I've got $h*t to do
User currently offlinetdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 43, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3725 times:

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 41):
Now here's a question... would you violate export restrictions if you fly a non-US registered but US made aircraft to North Korea and back?

As far as I know, you would not. When the US aircraft was exported to wherever it was registered, appropriate export paperwork would have had to happen at that time. After that, as far as I know, it's out of US jurisdiction. This is how some US-embargoed countries get their spares...they order them through some neutral third country.

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 42):
I think rules have relaxed a little bit. We were early adopters of AES, especially for VPN on laptops, and my previous laptop had a big red sticker that was supposed to remind me to swap it out for a less secure one when traveling to certain countries.

My current laptop, issued last year, has no such sticker so I presumably am free to take it wherever now.

True, the proliferation of the internet has driven the encryption export standards down. It depends, quite a lot, on which country you're going to. Technical data is the one that really screws you...I'm not very up on export controlled IT technology but Google, being at the forefront of the industry in multiple fields, would presumably have exposure on that front.

Tom.


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