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DL DC-9 & MD-90 Question  
User currently offlinebigbird From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 183 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 21488 times:
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With the beginning of 2013 how many DC-9s are currently in service? Will they begin the withdrawal before the beginning of deliveries of the717? Also of the currently known nunmber of 65 MD-90s planned for the fleet, how many are still remaining to actually put in service? I know that there are a few still in service with JAL but I think they are supposed to be withdrawn by the end of March. Is this correct?


bigbird from georgia
112 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineUA787DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 21508 times:

IIRC, there are 17 or 18 (I think 17) DC-9s left in service, all to be retired this year.

I was surprised to learn of their retirement plans. After all, these are the old NWA birds that have been doing powerbacks for 40 years! An a.net eternal question has been answered: When will the NWA 9s be retired?


User currently offlinerwy04lga From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 3176 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 21377 times:

An updated question would read: 'When will the Delta DC-9s be retired?'


Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 4 weeks ago) and read 21341 times:

The D95s will remain active into 2014. Several 752s will be retired before their replacements are online. The D95s and MD-90s will temporarily cover this capacity. The D95 will also provide DL some insurance until a successful 717 on-boarding has been established. By successful, I mean more than 10 frames with limited issues.


There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineairtechy From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 21188 times:

They will keep a DC-9 active at Mojave to bring back the Airbus ferry pilots.   

User currently offlineTan Flyr From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 1906 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 21024 times:

Quoting airtechy (Reply 4):
They will keep a DC-9 active at Mojave to bring back the Airbus ferry pilots.

The B717 (MD95) will still be flying ! they will just drop in and pick'em up and haul'em back to Atlanta.

So a Testament to the engineers at Long Beach in the early 60's.,first delivery in 65..still the BASIC design, and the same airframe will be in service probably until 2025..maybe a few more beyond that...who knows. So if my math is correct that would be 60 years.

I'd say that is a darn good run. The only aircraft I can forsee overtaking that is the 737. In service in 1968 (maybe late 67??)and no doubt deliveries of the MAX will go to at least 2030 (my estimate) and in service another 20..so to 2050 ish or so..
you are looking a Boeing design, while refined numerous times, the basic shape, etc remains the same and in the skies for close to 80 years.


User currently offlineUA787DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 20980 times:

But these are indeed the ex-NW DC-9s. They will be here longer than the 717s :p But seriously, knowing the longevity of MDs, these 717s will be here for another 30 years.

DL is planning on replacing the DC-9s in the next couple of years. The 737 will indeed have a longer production run than the -9/80/717, but it remains to be seen which one will be in service last :p


User currently offlinemichman From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 504 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 20890 times:

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 1):
I was surprised to learn of their retirement plans. After all, these are the old NWA birds that have been doing powerbacks for 40 years! An a.net eternal question has been answered: When will the NWA 9s be retired?

Well, not exactly correct. All the DC9's remaining are -50 series which are all less than 40 years old.


User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3081 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 20848 times:

A DC9 even flew a charter out of MSY yesterday!

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/D...4/history/20130103/1400Z/KMSY/KGNV

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 1):
After all, these are the old NWA birds that have been doing powerbacks for 40 years!

Sadly, powerbacks ended at NW in 2006.



The good old days: Delta L-1011s at MSY
User currently offlinekrsw757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 109 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 20759 times:

I worked one running MLB-ATL today and asked the pilot. He said one more is leaving tomorrow and he thought that would bring it to 14-15 left.

User currently offlineUA787DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 20659 times:

Quoting michman (Reply 7):
Quoting 71Zulu (Reply 8):

Yeah. It was a joke.


User currently offlineTheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3570 posts, RR: 29
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 19987 times:

Quoting Tan Flyr (Reply 5):
The only aircraft I can forsee overtaking that is the 737

I guess some B52s, while not in commercial service and with much less flying time, will live on even longer.

LH is still flying some A320s from 1988. Not so bad either if you ask me.


User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 19150 times:

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 1):
there are 17 or 18 (I think 17) DC-9s left in service, all to be retired this year.

Correct! According to aerotransport.org, DL began 2013 with 18 in service. 1 was sked to be removed from service yesterday (Jan 4) leaving 17 in service. Looks like N401EA was the tail retired yday.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently onlineB727FA From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 758 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 19030 times:

I just flew on that bird a month ago! I took some pics and posted them on FB...and a buddy of mine from a former carrier said that his father had actually flown that bird years ago! Wild, eh?


My comments/opinions are my own and are not to be construed as the opinion(s) of my employer.
User currently offlinewale03 From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 36 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 18942 times:

Well, it seems one is heading to the desert at the moment.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL9931


User currently offlineUA787DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 18856 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 12):

Long live N401EA. 1975 built DC-9-51, cn 47682, JT8D-9s, Allegheny to Eastern to NWA to DL. Sad that 3/4 of its operators no longer exist.

And Yahoo! I'm correct!


User currently offlinemayor From United States of America, joined Mar 2008, 10397 posts, RR: 14
Reply 16, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 17543 times:

Quoting Tan Flyr (Reply 5):

So a Testament to the engineers at Long Beach in the early 60's.,first delivery in 65..still the BASIC design, and the same airframe will be in service probably until 2025..maybe a few more beyond that...who knows. So if my math is correct that would be 60 years.

I wonder if my uncle had anything to do with the DC-9 program. I know he was involved with the DC-8.



"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
User currently offlinebigbird From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 183 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 17534 times:
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Hey Guys! I appreciate the answer to my DC-9 question but nobody as yet has addressed my MD-90 question.


bigbird from georgia
User currently offlineSPREE34 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 2248 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 17509 times:

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 15):
Long live N401EA. 1975 built DC-9-51, cn 47682, JT8D-9s

Dash 9s? I thought they came with -15s, and an option for -17s.



I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25170 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 17471 times:

Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 18):
Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 15):
Long live N401EA. 1975 built DC-9-51, cn 47682, JT8D-9s

Dash 9s? I thought they came with -15s, and an option for -17s.

No DC-9-51s had the JT8D-9 as far as I can tell. Even the -41 series didn't use the -9.


User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 17468 times:

Quoting bigbird (Thread starter):
Also of the currently known nunmber of 65 MD-90s planned for the fleet, how many are still remaining to actually put in service? I know that there are a few still in service with JAL but I think they are supposed to be withdrawn by the end of March. Is this correct?

Delta has 54 MD-90's in service. Jal's last MD-90 service is in March of this year, so yes you are correct.


User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 21, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 17426 times:

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 19):
No DC-9-51s had the JT8D-9 as far as I can tell.

Correct. The DL DC-9-51's all had JT8D-17.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineViscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 25170 posts, RR: 22
Reply 22, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 17420 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 20):
JAL's last MD-90 service is in March of this year,

Blog item on a "retirement tour" of the MD-90 early last year. It used the only MD-90 in the new JAL livery.
http://jal-pak.blogspot.ch/2012/11/jal-md-90-retirement-tour.html

And related JAL website page (in Japanese only, but includes some photos).
http://www.jal.co.jp/domtour/md90fnl_charter/

The page above using the Google translate tool.
http://translate.google.com/translat...mtour%2Fmd90fnl_charter%2F&act=url


User currently offlinedalmd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2545 posts, RR: 14
Reply 23, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 17300 times:

Quoting bigbird (Reply 17):
Hey Guys! I appreciate the answer to my DC-9 question but nobody as yet has addressed my MD-90 question.

I think there are two or three of the first wave of JAL MD-90 that are currently in heavy check before they go into service.


User currently offlineUA787DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 420 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 17266 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 21):

You are correct. I had a JT8 info page up in another tab, and last I saw before writing the reply was JT8D-9. I meant to say just JT8D. The DL 9-51s are all JT8D-17.


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 25, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 17229 times:

The latest update is that the ex-JT frames will be coming to DL. Yes, you read correctly.  


There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 26, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 17171 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 25):
The latest update is that the ex-JT frames will be coming to DL. Yes, you read correctly

Surprised to see they let the reservation for reg numbers N966DN-N980DN expire


User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 27, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 17598 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 25):
The latest update is that the ex-JT frames will be coming to DL. Yes, you read correctly

Woah, seriously? I have been suggesting this for over a year but was deemed crazy because Delta supposedly wouldn't touch the ex-Lion Air birds with a ten foot pole since JT had beaten the heck out of them and the maintenance was supposedly questionable. I guess Boeing Capital either is leasing or selling these aircraft to Delta for dirt cheap or Boeing agreed to overhaul these planes at their expense before they go to Delta.

Are all four ex-JT frames coming over? I know one was damaged in a landing gear accident but looking at the post incident pictures it looked like it could be repaird. It was still in Batam the last I heard.

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 26):
Surprised to see they let the reservation for reg numbers N966DN-N980DN expire

Have any of these reg numbers been taken up by another operator?

[Edited 2013-01-16 21:10:39]

User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3081 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 17517 times:

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 27):
Have any of these reg numbers been taken up by another operator?

They all show as available except for N971DN which already shows reserved for DL and N975DN which is deregistered from a 2010 Cessna export and may or may not be available now.



The good old days: Delta L-1011s at MSY
User currently offlineNWAROOSTER From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 29, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 17338 times:
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Quoting akelley728 (Reply 27):

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 25):
The latest update is that the ex-JT frames will be coming to DL. Yes, you read correctly

Woah, seriously? I have been suggesting this for over a year but was deemed crazy because Delta supposedly wouldn't touch the ex-Lion Air birds with a ten foot pole since JT had beaten the heck out of them and the maintenance was supposedly questionable. I guess Boeing Capital either is leasing or selling these aircraft to Delta for dirt cheap or Boeing agreed to overhaul these planes at their expense before they go to Delta.

Northwest Airlines bought a number of Eastern Airlines DC-9-30s that had the you know what beat out of them.
They got them so cheap, they could not pass them up and still brought them up to the required standards.   


User currently offlineAASTEW From Dominican Republic, joined Oct 2001, 447 posts, RR: 1
Reply 30, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 16961 times:

I think its also interesting that NWA never placed an actual order for DC-9's they were all acquired through mergers or second hand!

AASTEW


User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1622 posts, RR: 7
Reply 31, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 16802 times:

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 6):
But these are indeed the ex-NW DC-9s. They will be here longer than the 717s :p But seriously, knowing the longevity of MDs, these 717s will be here for another 30 years.

To be exact, they are former North Central/Repulic airplanes with on Eastern and one other "generic" thrown in for good mesure.



Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlineNWAROOSTER From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 32, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 16482 times:
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Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 31):
Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 6):
But these are indeed the ex-NW DC-9s. They will be here longer than the 717s :p But seriously, knowing the longevity of MDs, these 717s will be here for another 30 years.

To be exact, they are former North Central/Repulic airplanes with one Eastern and one other "generic" thrown in for good measure.

Four of the DC-9-51 aircraft besides N401EA never came from Republic Airlines. Three were flown by Swiss Airlines and and one was operated by Austrian Airlines. Then all four went to Muse Airlines, then to Transtar Airlines, followed by Eastern Airlines and the then Continental Airlines got them. These four have N numbers that end in MC as a result of flying for Muse Airlines. When Continental was done using them, Northwest Airlines picked them up and good old Delta got them as a result of the "merger" with Northwest Airlines.   

[Edited 2013-01-17 21:10:48]

User currently offlineMountainFlyer From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 476 posts, RR: 0
Reply 33, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 16104 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 20):
Jal's last MD-90 service is in March of this year

I'm assuming you're referring to N937DN. I flew on her from GEG-MSP on New Year's day; very nice bird.



SA-227; B1900; Q200; Q400; CRJ-2,7,9; 717; 727-2; 737-3,4,5,7,8,9; 747-2; 757-2,3; 767-3,4; MD-90; A319, 320; DC-9; DC-1
User currently offlineUnited_fan From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 7485 posts, RR: 7
Reply 34, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 16114 times:

I sure am glad DL scheduled them into ROC this past Summer . Those things are LOUD at take off !! I got some nice shots,too! Hopefully they'll schedule them back,but I doubt it. Maybe a sub for an -88.


'Empathy was yesterday...Today, you're wasting my Mother-F'ing time' - Heat.
User currently offlineMaddogJT8D From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 397 posts, RR: 1
Reply 35, posted (1 year 7 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 16159 times:

Friends, I fear that our old friend N401EA has been put out to pasture. According to Flightaware, the ship hasn't flown since January 4th.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N401EA

It would be a sad day if this is true, one of the few remaining remnants left of Eastern finally gone.

I flew N401EA a little over a year ago on EWR-ATL, sat in 23A right next to the engines. What a fantastic flight and a great bird, even after all these years.


User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1622 posts, RR: 7
Reply 36, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 15652 times:

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 32):
Four of the DC-9-51 aircraft besides N401EA never came from Republic Airlines. Three were flown by Swiss Airlines and and one was operated by Austrian Airlines. Then all four went to Muse Airlines, then to Transtar Airlines, followed by Eastern Airlines and the then Continental Airlines got them. These four have N numbers that end in MC as a result of flying for Muse Airlines. When Continental was done using them, Northwest Airlines picked them up and good old Delta got them as a result of the "merger" with Northwest Airlines.

You are quite correct--NW inherited those former MUSE/Transtar airplanes after a swap with WN. They originially never planned to fly them and left them parked in the desert for several years before deciding to invest in their renovation. I had totally forgotten about that. Your memory is better than mine! Thanks for the clarification.



Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 37, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 14939 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 25):
The latest update is that the ex-JT frames will be coming to DL. Yes, you read correctly.

N459BC recently flew KGYR-KBYH. Seems to me that means part-out and not entry into service. I haven't seen one Delta MD-90 transit BYH for reconfiguration. The MD-80's recently purchased from SAS are also in BYH for part-out. I guess further information is needed here in regards to the Ex-Lion MD-90's and their future status with Delta.


User currently offlineB757forever From United States of America, joined May 2010, 401 posts, RR: 3
Reply 38, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 14569 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
I guess further information is needed here in regards to the Ex-Lion MD-90's and their future status with Delta.

I recently heard from a reliable source that DL had acquired some MD90 frames for part-out. My first assumption was Saudi frames but perhaps these Lion Air derelicts are the ones being parted-out. Interesting if that is the case, probably quite affordable!


User currently offlineNWAROOSTER From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 39, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 14373 times:
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I have heard in the past that Dealt ahas bought all of Saudi's MD-90 spare parts and is acquiring some of the Saudi MD-90 aircraft for parts also.
  


User currently offlinecornutt From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 338 posts, RR: 1
Reply 40, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 14272 times:

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 11):

I guess some B52s, while not in commercial service and with much less flying time, will live on even longer.

The U.S. military E-3 Sentrys and E-6 Mercurys are built on the 707-320 fuselage and wings. They are among the last few 707 fuselages made (1989-1992), but as we know, the basic design goes back to the early 1950s.

I was surprised to learn last week that the Rolls-Royce Avon is still being manufactured. They are sold now as turboshaft engines and gas generators for stationary applications.


User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9349 posts, RR: 14
Reply 41, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 14129 times:

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 39):

don't know about aircraft for part out, but Delta did buy spare parts from Saudi



yep.
User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 42, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 14026 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
N459BC recently flew KGYR-KBYH. Seems to me that means part-out and not entry into service.

At least one ex-Lion Air MD-90 is being considered for active service.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 43, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 13541 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 42):
At least one ex-Lion Air MD-90 is being considered for active service.

Any guess as to which one? Also are all four ex-Lion Air frames part of this deal (whether in whole or for parts)?


User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 44, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 13489 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
The MD-80's recently purchased from SAS are also in BYH for part-out.

DL has bought 9 ex-SAS M80's for part-out so far.

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
I guess further information is needed here in regards to the Ex-Lion MD-90's and their future status with Delta.
Quoting akelley728 (Reply 43):
Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 42):
At least one ex-Lion Air MD-90 is being considered for active service.

Any guess as to which one? Also are all four ex-Lion Air frames part of this deal (whether in whole or for parts)?

I can't see any purchases yet of ex-Lion M90's. Will post here if I see an update.

DL has 52 M90's in service. 13 more are in storage and/or being prepared for service. These 13 are ex-JAL, China Southern and China Eastern. All 13 are intended to enter service which will bring the fleet to 65.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 45, posted (1 year 7 months 4 hours ago) and read 12756 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 44):
I can't see any purchases yet of ex-Lion M90's. Will post here if I see an update.

Any update on this?


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2923 posts, RR: 1
Reply 46, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 12347 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
N459BC recently flew KGYR-KBYH. Seems to me that means part-out and not entry into service. I haven't seen one Delta MD-90 transit BYH for reconfiguration.

Quite right. The ones that have been put into service fly to ATL for paint and VQQ for interiors. One just flew in today: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/D...3/history/20130201/1900Z/KMZJ/KVQQ



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlinetype-rated From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 4992 posts, RR: 19
Reply 47, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 12147 times:

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 32):
hese four have N numbers that end in MC as a result of flying for Muse Airlines.

Those MC birds came from Muse Air rather than Muse Airlines.



Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
User currently offlineSQ22 From Germany, joined Feb 2012, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 48, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 11984 times:

Quoting cornutt (Reply 40):
The U.S. military E-3 Sentrys and E-6 Mercurys are built on the 707-320 fuselage and wings. They are among the last few 707 fuselages made (1989-1992), but as we know, the basic design goes back to the early 1950s.

I was surprised to learn last week that the Rolls-Royce Avon is still being manufactured. They are sold now as turboshaft engines and gas generators for stationary applications.

Interesting hint, do you have alonk regarding the Avon? On which line did they built the E-6's?

Sorry for being off-topic


User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 49, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11799 times:

Quoting SQ22 (Reply 48):
Interesting hint, do you have alonk regarding the Avon?

"The current version of the Avon, the Avon 200, is an industrial gas generator that is rated at 21-22,000shp. As of 2011, 1,200 Industrial Avons have been sold, and the type has established a 60,000,000 hour class record for its class."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolls_Royce_Avon

http://www.rolls-royce.com/energy/en...gy_products/gas_turbines/avon_200/


User currently offlinebhmdiversion From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 459 posts, RR: 0
Reply 50, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 11799 times:

Wait N401EA is parked now? Sad.

User currently offlinecornutt From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 338 posts, RR: 1
Reply 51, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 11702 times:

Quoting SQ22 (Reply 48):
On which line did they built the E-6's?

The airframes were built in Renton; I don't know which line. Of course, Renton has been completely revised since then. The fitting of the E-6 specific equipment, including the external antenna structure, was done in Wichita.


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2923 posts, RR: 1
Reply 52, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 11661 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 37):
N459BC recently flew KGYR-KBYH. Seems to me that means part-out and not entry into service. I haven't seen one Delta MD-90 transit BYH for reconfiguration.

It looks like N458BC has followed on Feb 1. Ex- PK-LIM



The last of the famous international playboys
User currently offlineCandid76 From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 734 posts, RR: 4
Reply 53, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 11539 times:

If it helps at all the following DC9-51s were noted in service at ATL on 18 or 30 January:-

N600TR, N675MC, N762/64/66/67/70/73/74/75/77/79/80/82/84/86/87NC

Meanwhile these DC9-51s were all stored in one long line at Marana on 24 January:-

N401EA, N670/71/76/77MC, N760/63/65/68/69/71/72/76/78/85/87NC

That must account for most if not all of the fleet (33 frames)!

Also at Marana were ex. JAL N946/48/52DN, just these three.

Candid76


User currently offlineselmer40 From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 54, posted (1 year 6 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 11527 times:

Today's Airwaysmag.com Fleet Update (excellent Saturday reading) shows MD90-30 N495BC now N501DN as parts plane. Delta has 502DN and 503DN reserved. KBYH is about 1.5 hours north of me-must plan a visit.

[Edited 2013-02-02 14:02:16]


Teaching this old dog a new trick
User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 55, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 10962 times:

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 45):
Quoting yyz717 (Reply 44):
I can't see any purchases yet of ex-Lion M90's. Will post here if I see an update.

Any update on this?

Looks like DL purchased an ex-Lion M90 in late January. MSN 53570 Curr reg N459BC in storage at BYH. To be re-reg N501DN.

The planned re-reg suggests this tail will enter service as the 66th M90 for DL (as opposed to partout). Current active DL M90 is 55 with 11 more planned (including 53570).



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 56, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 10922 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 55):
The planned re-reg suggests this tail will enter service as the 66th M90 for DL (as opposed to partout). Current active DL M90 is 55 with 11 more planned (including 53570).

Nope. This ones for partout. Delta re-reg'ed the SAS MD-80's too.


User currently offlineB757forever From United States of America, joined May 2010, 401 posts, RR: 3
Reply 57, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 10887 times:

Sadly the trip into BYH is generally the last ride for these frames.

User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 58, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 10882 times:

502DN and 503DN are also reserved for MD-90's for partout. I will say this, N971DN is reserved for the EVA/UNI fleet. 971DN is the middle reg of the 11 aircraft Delta is looking to acquire.

[Edited 2013-02-09 12:39:41]

User currently offlineyyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16248 posts, RR: 56
Reply 59, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 10792 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 56):
Nope. This ones for partout. Delta re-reg'ed the SAS MD-80's too.
Quoting dtw9 (Reply 56):
Sadly the trip into BYH is generally the last ride for these frames.
Quoting B757forever (Reply 57):
Sadly the trip into BYH is generally the last ride for these frames.

Okay thanks! So the DL fleet will remain at the planned 65.



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineB757forever From United States of America, joined May 2010, 401 posts, RR: 3
Reply 60, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10709 times:

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 59):
Okay thanks! So the DL fleet will remain at the planned 65.

Not necessarily. The EVA and UNI frames, if acquired, will likely go into service with DL.


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 61, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10727 times:

Slightly off topic, but DL is finalizing agreements to acquire additional MD-80s, as they are retired from the AA fleet. These aircraft will be used for parts as well, to maintain the MD-88/90 fleets for the years ahead.

[Edited 2013-02-09 14:46:07]


There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9349 posts, RR: 14
Reply 62, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10680 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 61):
Slightly off topic, but DL is finalizing agreements to acquire additional MD-80s, as they are retired from the AA fleet. These aircraft will be used for parts as well, to maintain the MD-88/90 fleets for the years ahead.

What engines do the 83s have? Are they 219s? IIRC the 82s have 207s.



yep.
User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 63, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 10676 times:

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 62):
What engines do the 83s have? Are they 219s? IIRC the 82s have 207s.

The MD-83s have the -219s, which is what DL have signed for. These are not the later build ex-TW MD-83s from the late '90s. Rather, they are some of the oldest in AA's fleet and will not fly again.

Separately, the MD-82s have a mixture of -217Cs and -219s.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 64, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 9983 times:

Funding has been approved for the cockpit update for the MD-88's and also the MD-90's. All mods will be complete by 2015. HSI and ADI only,center stack stays as is. 88's are going to be around for a long time.

User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 65, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 9757 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 64):

Funding has been approved for the cockpit update for the MD-88's and also the MD-90's.

         Indeed... Don't say I didn't tell you so.  



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlinesmilinjack From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 9 posts, RR: 2
Reply 66, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 9710 times:

I flew the DC-9 for Ozark as F/O in 1969....started flying it as capt. in 1978....flew the MD80 from 1983 thru 1992 (TWA). What a great airplane.

User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 67, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 9643 times:

Quoting smilinjack (Reply 66):

I flew the DC-9 for Ozark as F/O in 1969....started flying it as capt. in 1978....flew the MD80 from 1983 thru 1992 (TWA). What a great airplane.

As someone involved as a third party on the business side for the MD-80, I salute your service, smilinjack.

Off memory, I recall that TW did not not receive their first EFIS MD-83 from MDC until 1993. Can you confirm that your tenure was exclusive to the earlier analog standard flightdeck? Or had the EFIS equipped frames begun to arrive prior to 1993?



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 68, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 9632 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 64):

Funding has been approved for the cockpit update for the MD-88's and also the MD-90's. All mods will be complete by 2015. HSI and ADI only,center stack stays as is. 88's are going to be around for a long time.

Hmm, with this "limited" updated that would preclude the possibility of the Saudi MD-90s joining Delta, correct?


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 69, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 9625 times:

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 68):
Hmm, with this "limited" updated that would preclude the possibility of the Saudi MD-90s joining Delta, correct?

The upgrade is significant enough. It would make the EFD feature (Enhanced Flightdeck) of the ex-SV MD-90s irrelevant and a moot point. Presumably, the SV M90s would receive the same flightdeck mod, if acquired for active service.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineMax Q From United States of America, joined May 2001, 4463 posts, RR: 19
Reply 70, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 9556 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 64):
Funding has been approved for the cockpit update for the MD-88's and also the MD-90's. All mods will be complete by 2015. HSI and ADI only,center stack stays as is. 88's are going to be around for a long time.

Interesting, do you have a picture ?



The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 71, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 9482 times:

Quoting Max Q (Reply 70):
Interesting, do you have a picture ?

Very close to the 737 cockpit upgrade.

http://www.innovative-ss.com/platfor...asp?ID=54&L1=2&L2=2&L3=0&display=1


User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 72, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9312 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 69):
The upgrade is significant enough. It would make the EFD feature (Enhanced Flightdeck) of the ex-SV MD-90s irrelevant and a moot point. Presumably, the SV M90s would receive the same flightdeck mod, if acquired for active service.

Does this upgrade touch the overhead panel? That's where the major difference between the SV and "classic" MD-90 cockpits are, right?


User currently offlinesmilinjack From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 9 posts, RR: 2
Reply 73, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 9247 times:

"Off memory, I recall that TW did not not receive their first EFIS MD-83 from MDC until 1993. Can you confirm that your tenure was exclusive to the earlier analog standard flightdeck? Or had the EFIS equipped frames begun to arrive prior to 1993?"

I don't know....I flew the 727/757/767 until I retired with AA. I just flew the analog -80s as I recall.....I am getting old!


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 74, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9005 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 61):
DL is finalizing agreements to acquire additional MD-80s, as they are retired from the AA fleet.

Update: Officially, DL have now acquired two ex-AA MD-83s, to date.

http://www.planespotters.net/Product...0/49528,N9302B-Delta-Air-Lines.php

http://www.planespotters.net/Product...0/49530,N9304C-Delta-Air-Lines.php

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 72):
Does this upgrade touch the overhead panel? That's where the major difference between the SV and "classic" MD-90 cockpits are, right?

For the standard MD-90, the cockpit differs more with the 717 than the -90 EFD.

Also, the flightdeck mod is expected to have future updates along the way. That's why fleetwide completion has been pushed back a few months - to give the updates time to develop.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9349 posts, RR: 14
Reply 75, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 8597 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 74):

so this makes what? 25 ish M80s for Delta? wasn't the SAS number 23?



yep.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 76, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 8550 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 74):
For the standard MD-90, the cockpit differs more with the 717 than the -90 EFD.

I get that, but I'm not asking about the 717. The point I'm asking is would the SV MD-90 and standard MD-90 (post-mod) have the same pilot rating? There finally allowing Delta, if they so chose, to pick up some of the ex-SV birds?


User currently offlinemilesrich From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1995 posts, RR: 6
Reply 77, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 8367 times:

Quoting Tan Flyr (Reply 5):
I'd say that is a darn good run. The only aircraft I can forsee overtaking that is the 737. In service in 1968 (maybe late 67??)and no doubt deliveries of the MAX will go to at least 2030 (my estimate) and in service another 20..so to 2050 ish or so..
you are looking a Boeing design, while refined numerous times, the basic shape, etc remains the same and in the skies for close to 80 years.

LH received their first 737-130 on December 28, 1967, and put the aircraft in service on February 10, 1968. United put their 737-222s into service on April 28, 1968 on the GRR-ORD-MLI route among others. Delta inaugurated DC-9-14 service on November 29, 1965 on the ATL-MEM-MKC route, as an equipment sub for a DC-7, but didn't start regularly daily service until two weeks later on December 8, 1965, according to Delta's website, showing the first flight on 11/29/65 was flight 791, and at that time, all 700 Delta Flights were scheduled as DC-7/7B's.

It is therefore fitting that Delta will operate the last DC-9-50 flight and will operate the 717 and MD-90's for the next 15 or so years.


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 78, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 8140 times:

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 76):
I get that, but I'm not asking about the 717. The point I'm asking is would the SV MD-90 and standard MD-90 (post-mod) have the same pilot rating?

Allow me to be more clear. The overhead panel of the 717 resembles the MD-11. The overhead panel of an ex-SV MD-90 resembles... an MD-90.  

Also, any DC-9 derivative technically has the same pilot rating. What you are thinking is pilot category, which again, will be a non-issue, given the flightdeck mod noted earlier.

Quoting milesrich (Reply 77):
It is therefore fitting that Delta will operate the last DC-9-50 flight and will operate the 717 and MD-90's for the next 15 or so years.

   Agreed.

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 75):
so this makes what? 25 ish M80s for Delta? wasn't the SAS number 23?

Officially, yes.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 79, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 8048 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 78):
What you are thinking is pilot category, which again, will be a non-issue, given the flightdeck mod noted earlier.

So a modded "classic" MD-90 and a ex-SV MD-90 would be part of the same pilot category if Delta were to pick up the ex-SV MD-90s and mods them also?? There would be zero differences flying between the two? No "differences" training required?

[Edited 2013-02-19 15:31:50]

User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 80, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 7968 times:

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 79):

Provided the ex-SV received the mod too.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineIllinoisMan From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 159 posts, RR: 0
Reply 81, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 7631 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 3):
The D95s will remain active into 2014.

It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.


User currently offlinen7371f From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1721 posts, RR: 12
Reply 82, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 7475 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.

Really? Safety? Absurd post. For some time after the NW merger, the DC-9 fleet had better dispatch reliability than the A319/320 fleet.

Hopefully someone with direct hands-on experience maintaining the -50's will chime in here and remind everyone how well built the -50's are. The word 'tank' is often used.


User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 83, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 7411 times:

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):

Oh please.

My 753 doing MSP-ATL a couple weeks ago had to be layed down for the day due to MTC causing a 3.5 hour delay and equipment downgrade to a 752 (thank God I was positive space and not regular standby). In fact, all my delays due to MTC over the past 6 months has been on either 57s or 738s should they retire those too?

Nevermind the fact that DL's completion factor has been a steady 99.6% showing testament that a relatively old fleet continues to hum along. As a good friend of mine at TechOps said the other day, the 9s can easily do another 5 years with the right parts support.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 84, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 7342 times:

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):

Bitterness leads to ignorance... Never mind historical significance, eh? What is most humorous about your post is how EASY it is to avoid a D95 in DL's network... Even on DTW-ORD.   

Forget the DC-9. Going forward, let's saddle up for some CR2s!  

FWIW, I've had 40-50 flights on DL in the past 3 years. About 80% have been D95/MD-88/90 - never a single delay. Of the 3 MX legs in that duration, 2 were A320s and 1 a 752.

Quoting n7371f (Reply 82):
For some time after the NW merger, the DC-9 fleet had better dispatch reliability than the A319/320 fleet.

   Well done. This fact is the checkmate in the "rust-bucket" DC-9 argument.

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 83):
In fact, all my delays due to MTC over the past 6 months has been on either 57s or 738s should they retire those too?

Interesting bit of info. For way of comparison: Of the non-757/738 portion of your trips, which types do you fly the most? (mainline)

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 83):
As a good friend of mine at TechOps said the other day, the 9s can easily do another 5 years with the right parts support.

   It's true. In fact, D95 reliability and MX costs have remained flat over the past two years. The MD-88 even more so. This factors in on why the MD-88's will remain active for some time to come - years after the 2018 phaseout rumored in the past.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineDeltal1011man From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 9349 posts, RR: 14
Reply 85, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 7240 times:

Quoting n7371f (Reply 82):
The word 'tank' is often used.

ha. Look the DC-9 is what an M1A2 wants to be when it grows up. Its the airplane version of Chunk Norris.   

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay

may come as a shock but i have seen 737s come right off the line and take a MX delay....

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 84):
This factors in on why the MD-88's will remain active for some time to come - years after the 2018 phaseout rumored in the past.

Outside of a crazy spike in fuel it is very likely that both the 757 and M88 aircraft will get parked basically as they cycle out.



yep.
User currently offlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6465 posts, RR: 9
Reply 86, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 7219 times:

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 85):
may come as a shock but i have seen 737s come right off the line and take a MX delay....

Please supply the details of that sighting. Doubt it ever happened. But it makes for a fairly goog story

[Edited 2013-02-21 04:42:35]

User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1622 posts, RR: 7
Reply 87, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 7235 times:

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.

The DC-9-50 is definitely NOT a "rust bucket." As has been said on here many times before the age of the airframe is not the issue it is the number of pressurization cycles that determines when an airplane flies south. The DC-9, like the DC-8, DC-10 and many fine McDonnel-Douglas aircraft are overbuilt, strong and reliable. There are many DC-3's, -4's and -6's still flying as workhorse aircraft decades after they were built.

If I had a choice between riding in a 1965 Mustang or a 2013 Mustang, give me the '65 anytime! The -50's aren't that old--they were built in the 70's and early 80's. Don't slam a remarkably safe and solid airplane.



Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlinerbgso From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 590 posts, RR: 0
Reply 88, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7051 times:

I wonder if the Dugan Kinetics thrust reverser can be STCed for the MD90....

User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 89, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7047 times:

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.

You're basing this on one flight you took six months ago? I have taken 70+ flights on Delta in the same timeframe, with half being on the DC9/MD88/MD90. Of those I have one MX delay, and that was on a MD-90, which was 15-20 years newer that the 'rust-buckets' you describe.

Oh, this past Monday I had MX delay on DL A319, I guess they need to go to MZJ as well!


User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 90, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7005 times:

Quoting rbgso (Reply 88):
I wonder if the Dugan Kinetics thrust reverser can be STCed for the MD90....

For what? They were found not to work as advertised on the MD-80 and the fuel burn on the MD-90 is just as good as the A320 with V2500's. Also, the MD-90 is already stage 4

[Edited 2013-02-21 09:08:14]

User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 91, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 7003 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 84):

I seem to be on the 88 and 90 most often nowadays due to the types basically being shuttled between Atlanta and Minneapolis for various onward trips. I do a lot of ATL-CLT trips which are non business related and I always book on one of the DC9s. Either the 2ish departure or the 1730



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlinedtw9 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 92, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 6839 times:

Seems the Aersale listing on Boeing's website for MD-90's for sale or lease has disappeared, they've been listed for months.I can't find them listed anywhere other than an old speednews ad from last year. Makes one wonder where they are going.

User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 93, posted (1 year 6 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 6664 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 92):
Makes one wonder where they are going.

Is it really any wonder? They being flown to Miami for freighter conversion, of course.   



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 94, posted (1 year 6 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 6286 times:

Quoting dtw9 (Reply 92):
Seems the Aersale listing on Boeing's website for MD-90's for sale or lease has disappeared, they've been listed for months.

Did Aersale wind up taking all of the ex-SV frames?


User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 95, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 5857 times:

So how many MD-90s are still in mod status at Delta?

User currently offlineNWAROOSTER From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 96, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5811 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting akelley728 (Reply 89):
Oh, this past Monday I had MX delay on DL A319, I guess they need to go to MZJ as well!

There is NO A319 that will ever fly as long with as many cycles as the DC-9. And I mean any model of the DC-9.
The DC-9 is a very rugged, well built aircraft that can take much abuse and keep on flying.
The A319 through A321 don't hold a candle to the DC-9 in durability, reliability and longevity.   


User currently offlineredtailsforever From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 97, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 5702 times:

I just saw an all white MD-90 fly into MSP yesterday and park at Signature. I could make out n949dn between the buildings. Flightaware showed it had flown through Russia and Anchorage. Airfleets showed ex JAL. It looks like one of the last couple to be delivered If Delta only bought nine. It looks like one of the few that didn't fly direct to the desert from Anchorage. Are they buying the rest of JAL' s MD-90 fleet?

User currently offlineSELMER40 From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 98 posts, RR: 0
Reply 98, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 5593 times:

Most of the JAL MD90s are already here. There are now only three more to come over. They will complete the fleet at 65 frames. FlightAware now shows 949DN going on to KVQQ where the mods are done.


Teaching this old dog a new trick
User currently offlineSPREE34 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 2248 posts, RR: 9
Reply 99, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 5508 times:

Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.


Thank you for providing the great entertainment, in the form of replies you received. I'm sure you can have your seat surgically reattached.

An a.net search (maybe other sites too) will reveal numerous sources on the life cycle, and life cycle updates that have been approved on the 9. It's probably the last of the over-engineered beasts out there. Ever wonder why it and the 8 flew well beyond later build As and Bs? Not that A and B don't build great aircraft, they do. Later manufacturing methods are leaner, and create a more fuel efficient craft. back in the day of the 8 and 9, fuel cost weren't much of a consideration, so the extra weight that made it tough, wasn't cut out.

I suspect if the 727 had been a twin, vs tri, (engines and crew) more of them would still be in service, for many of the same reasons.



I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 100, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5357 times:

Quoting redtailsforever (Reply 97):
Quoting SELMER40 (Reply 98):

JL will complete their MD-90 fleet phaseout later month, with final retirement to take place on 3/30/13.

Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 99):

I suspect if the 727 had been a twin, vs tri, (engines and crew) more of them would still be in service, for many of the same reasons.

Sadly, most 727-200/ADVs were retired much younger than the MD-82/83/88s at AA and DL.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlinemilesrich From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1995 posts, RR: 6
Reply 101, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 5107 times:

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 100):
Sadly, most 727-200/ADVs were retired much younger than the MD-82/83/88s at AA and DL.

One must remember that the development of new and/or improved aircraft revolves around engines and fuel economy. The MD-80 was really designed to replace the 727-200 as the JT-8D engine series was improved, and refined. American initially was offered a small number of MD-82's on lease with performance guarantees and the right to terminate the leases with little if any penalty. The airplane fit their needs so well, they eventually had the largest fleet of any one type of airplane of any airline in history. And only the third oil price shock from $40 to $100 oil really spelled the end decline of their use. When American received their first MD-82 in 1983, the 727-200A was a dead issue. They were in the process of building the last frames for freight carriers. The first MD-83 did not fly until after the 727 line was shut down. Delta did not place their first MD-88 into service until 1988, four years after 727 production stopped.


User currently offlineTrijetsRMissed From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 2350 posts, RR: 7
Reply 102, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4822 times:

Quoting milesrich (Reply 101):

Miles, you are preaching to the choir...

I worked as a third party overlay with MDC during the MD-80's lifecycle, including on the aforementioned AA deal, which involved 20 leased aircraft at zero risk in 1983. Did you know it was the preceding AZ MD-82 order, (at the time the largest dollar amount in Douglas history), which gave Sales the leverage to be creative with the lease arrangement for AA?

In terms of technology, it's all relative. The 727 was to the mid '90s what the MD-80 is now.



There's nothing quite like a tri-jet.
User currently offlinesankaps From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2255 posts, RR: 2
Reply 103, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4785 times:

NWA flew around 175 DC9s at the peak, and never lost one in its history! It did lose an MD80 in Detroit due to pilot error, but its DC9s had a perfect safety record. And that is quite an amazing testimony to how well they were designed and built!

User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7565 posts, RR: 28
Reply 104, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 4715 times:

Quoting sankaps (Reply 103):
NWA flew around 175 DC9s at the peak, and never lost one in its history! It did lose an MD80 in Detroit due to pilot error, but its DC9s had a perfect safety record. And that is quite an amazing testimony to how well they were designed and built!

The DC-9 fleet peaked at 172 in the late 90's.

There were a few accidents thought:

In Dec 1990 there was a ground collision when a NW DC-9 taxied on to an active runway in dense fog and was clipped by a NW 727 on take-off roll. The resulting fire led to 8 deaths. The aircraft was destroyed, however the accident itself was attributed to pilot error and not to the design of the aircraft.

There was also a ground collision in MSP in 2005 when a DC-9-50 lost hydraulic power to the brakes and collided with an A319. Only a few injuries resulted, but the aircraft was a write-off (actually currently in use as the fire-trainer at MSP)

There may have been one other ground collision in the MSP that led to the write-off of 2 DC-9-30s, but I can't remember that specific incident.


User currently offlineNWAROOSTER From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1082 posts, RR: 3
Reply 105, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4658 times:
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Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 104):
There may have been one other ground collision in the MSP that led to the write-off of 2 DC-9-30s, but I can't remember that specific incident.

One was when the tow bar snapped and the tug ran into the aircraft. They decided to scrap the aircraft rather than repair it.   


User currently offlinen7371f From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1721 posts, RR: 12
Reply 106, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4619 times:
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Quoting redtailsforever (Reply 97):

I just saw an all white MD-90 fly into MSP yesterday and park at Signature. I could make out n949dn between the buildings. Flightaware showed it had flown through Russia and Anchorage. Airfleets showed ex JAL. It looks like one of the last couple to be delivered If Delta only bought nine. It looks like one of the few that didn't fly direct to the desert from Anchorage. Are they buying the rest of JAL' s MD-90 fleet?

It was 9249. It then flew down to Cecil Field in Jacksonville where the 90's are getting overhauled. This may be the only 90 to go straight from service in Japan to refurbishing - as the others have been routed to Marana for storage until induction.


User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7565 posts, RR: 28
Reply 107, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4548 times:

Quoting NWAROOSTER (Reply 105):
One was when the tow bar snapped and the tug ran into the aircraft. They decided to scrap the aircraft rather than repair it.

Yep, thats the one I'm thinking of, I think it happened right after the other DC-9 ground collision incident at MSP.

Which DC-9 is being used as the ARFF trainer in MSP? It might be the DC-9 from the tow-bar incident, as the one that hit the A319 sustained a significant amount of damage.


User currently offlinesankaps From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2255 posts, RR: 2
Reply 108, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4524 times:

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 104):
There were a few accidents thought:

In Dec 1990 there was a ground collision when a NW DC-9 taxied on to an active runway in dense fog and was clipped by a NW 727 on take-off roll. The resulting fire led to 8 deaths. The aircraft was destroyed, however the accident itself was attributed to pilot error and not to the design of the aircraft.

There was also a ground collision in MSP in 2005 when a DC-9-50 lost hydraulic power to the brakes and collided with an A319. Only a few injuries resulted, but the aircraft was a write-off (actually currently in use as the fire-trainer at MSP)

There may have been one other ground collision in the MSP that led to the write-off of 2 DC-9-30s, but I can't remember that specific incident.

You are right, I forgot the DTW runway incursion. I amend my original statement to state "NWA never lost a DC9 in the air and had zero DC9 fatalities despite operating upto 172 examples and flying the aircraft type for three decades other than the runway incursion where the DC9 itself was not to blame".


User currently offlinemichman From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 504 posts, RR: 0
Reply 109, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4434 times:

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 104):
There may have been one other ground collision in the MSP that led to the write-off of 2 DC-9-30s, but I can't remember that specific incident.

There was the fuel truck incident in MSP on May 11, 2005.

http://www.myaviation.net/search/photo_search.php?id=00414871

According to a.net, this is the fire trainer.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 110, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4421 times:
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Quoting IllinoisMan (Reply 81):
It might be time to send the rest of these rust-buckets down to MZJ. My last flight on one was in August from DTW to ORD and it went mechanical on me, ending up being a two hour delay. Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if safety might start to become an issue given the age of some of these frames.

I heard that some newish plane called the 787 has been taking some maintenance cancellations lately also.

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 107):
Which DC-9 is being used as the ARFF trainer in MSP? It might be the DC-9 from the tow-bar incident, as the one that hit the A319 sustained a significant amount of damage.
Quoting michman (Reply 109):
According to a.net, this is the fire trainer.

Correct.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Kai Engstroem



Sorry to post my own pic, but I have the only two photos of it in it's current service



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlinen7371f From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1721 posts, RR: 12
Reply 111, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4400 times:
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Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 110):
Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 107):
Which DC-9 is being used as the ARFF trainer in MSP? It might be the DC-9 from the tow-bar incident, as the one that hit the A319 sustained a significant amount of damage.
Quoting michman (Reply 109):
According to a.net, this is the fire trainer.

Correct.

The one that hit the A319 was a -50 that had just landed and lost hydraulics or something like that. The -50 was towed over behind the SOC and parted out.


User currently offlineakelley728 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2191 posts, RR: 5
Reply 112, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 4120 times:

Quoting n7371f (Reply 106):
as the others have been routed to Marana for storage until induction.

How many are still in Marana?


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