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EK- Mulling LAX, SFO, IAH As Next A380 Upgrades  
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 971 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 11681 times:
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Emirates chief says he needs 30 more A380s to open routes. He says landing slots and space at Dubai, plus landing slots and curfews at destinations are preventing further expansion.

I'm completely mesmerized and dumbfounded as to where the money and passengers are coming from to fill all these large airplanes. We're talking about a city state with a population of 2.1 mil


http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...rjumbos-for-network-expansion.html

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2396 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 11666 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
I'm completely mesmerized and dumbfounded as to where the money and passengers are coming from to fill all these large airplanes. We're talking about a city state with a population of 2.1 mil

You need to remember that EK doesn't rely only on pax from DXB but from other places as well...



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlinewarden145 From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 522 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 11537 times:

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 1):
You need to remember that EK doesn't rely only on pax from DXB but from other places as well...

   IIRC most of EK's traffic is connecting as opposed to originating in or ending at DXB.

I thought that the only reason EK wasn't already using the A380 on LAX and SFO was that the current ones would be payload-restricted on these two routes? I recall hearing on here that EK was waiting until a higher-MTOW variant was in their fleet before upgauging these routes. I could be completely off, of course, but that's what I recall hearing/reading...



ETOPS = Engine Turns Off, Passengers Swim
User currently offlinescouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 3390 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 11498 times:

I wonder if this is the "significant" MoU that JL has been talkign about - will make people on here grumpy - not that exciting but a $10B order notheless.


to add to 817Dreamlifter's point - EK are tryign to make DXB the centre of the world as far as connecting flights between West and East and it's very compelling - I can get a 1 change flight to 6 (I think!) destinations in Australia from my local large airport (MCR), before EK there was likely 1 or maybe 2 one-stop flights from there to Aus otherwise I'd need to connect via LHR, AMS or CDG to a 1 stopper.

If they keep adding destinations they will kill most of the legacy cariers that rely on West to East traffic - witnes QF's capitulation on the Kangeroo route. Their growth is remarkable - they have 31 A380s now and within 2 years they will have more A380s than BA has 744s


User currently offlinemusapapaya From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 1091 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 11451 times:

in a way, im happy to see EK seems to be growing and growing and their momentum is so strong. I used them to go to SYD from MAN for xmas and literally just got off EK017, operated by A6-EEC, delivered in November 2012. About 50% of the handle on the window shades observed were broken, I am disappointed that a 2 month old aircraft is worn out like this already.

But this is a different matter.... i still prefer to go via other european airports compared to DXB, DXB is just a hectic place.....



Lufthansa Group of Airlines
User currently onlinemal787 From Australia, joined Jul 2007, 694 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11406 times:
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Quoting musapapaya (Reply 4):
i still prefer to go via other european airports compared to DXB, DXB is just a hectic place.....

Same here, I am doing Sydney> London in May and I am doing QF5 to Frankfurt onward to London, returning on QF6 . The lure of Dubai is nothing for me

mal787



Flying cant get enough of it
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 971 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11176 times:
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"You need to remember that EK doesn't rely only on pax from DXB but from other places as well..."

I remember that. Actually Emirates relies on connecting passengers, O&D traffic from Dubai is the icing on the cake.


User currently offlinemusapapaya From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 1091 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11161 times:

Quoting mal787 (Reply 5):
Same here, I am doing Sydney> London in May and I am doing QF5 to Frankfurt onward to London, returning on QF6 . The lure of Dubai is nothing for me

Why not do QF1 and 2 on the A380? Just curious....



Lufthansa Group of Airlines
User currently onlinemal787 From Australia, joined Jul 2007, 694 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11108 times:
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Quoting musapapaya (Reply 7):
Why not do QF1 and 2 on the A380? Just curious....Lufthansa Group of Airlines

From April 1 both route via Dubai , and as I said above the Dubai link does nothing for me arriving in a bank of 20 380's and all the associated transit pax , no thanks . I am going in J both ways but from what I have been told from friends who do EK it will still be a nightmare

mal787



Flying cant get enough of it
User currently offlinecipango From Ireland, joined Jul 2009, 613 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 11069 times:

Quoting musapapaya (Reply 4):
i still prefer to go via other european airports compared to DXB, DXB is just a hectic place.....

Im starting to agree. I flew with EK for many years and back in 2008 when I flew them MAN-DXB-SYD and return it was a great airport to fly through, however I don't think Terminal 3 is anywhere near what EK needs to fulfil their expansion.

It is becoming the LHR of the Middle East. Immigration in DXB is the slowest I have ever come across (have been in quite a short queue for over an hour many times) and when you pass security you enter into the real life definition of "Hustle and Bustle".

DXB has recently opened a dedicated A380 terminal, however this will only ease the crowds for so long. I remember laughing at the idiocy of the New World Airport in Jebel Ali, Dubai at their ambition and the size being "unnecessary". I think I may have to retract my comments. It will indeed be needed very soon.


User currently offlinebthebest From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2008, 507 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 10799 times:

Quoting mal787 (Reply 5):
Same here, I am doing Sydney> London in May and I am doing QF5 to Frankfurt onward to London, returning on QF6 . The lure of Dubai is nothing for me

I was confused by your logic at first as I was under the impression that all QF European flights were routing through DXB with the new alliance, but despite that being reported in most news articles, it is only LHR flights that are routing through DXB?

I looked at QF flights in May to FRA on their website and weirdly it doesn't even give QF5/6 as an option, instead just routing on BA flights!?


User currently offlinestlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9375 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 10616 times:

Bloomberg reporting Emirates would like 30 more A380's for expansion.

SFO, IAH, and LAX mentioned, of course.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...rjumbos-for-network-expansion.html



if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
User currently offliner2rho From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2634 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 10613 times:

Quoting warden145 (Reply 2):

I thought that the only reason EK wasn't already using the A380 on LAX and SFO was that the current ones would be payload-restricted on these two routes? I recall hearing on here that EK was waiting until a higher-MTOW variant was in their fleet before upgauging these routes.

You are entirely correct. And the new higher MTOW A380's with new wing twist that will start to be delivered from BA #001 onwards may likely enable EK to fly these routes with the payload they require.


User currently offlinesolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 852 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 10497 times:

Tim Clark :

"Emirates A380s flying today are already three or four tons lighter than when the carrier took its first planes, and other improvements from Toulouse"

Woow had no idea

Better if EK stop "shower room" in first imo

Cheers 



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2987 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 10235 times:

Would it not make more sense for EK to look at increasing frequency to the west coast before looking at flying in larger planes? An 8-9am departure should arrive in DXB to meet the afternoon departure wave.

Now to go a little off topic:

Quoting mal787 (Reply 8):
From April 1 both route via Dubai , and as I said above the Dubai link does nothing for me arriving in a bank of 20 380's and all the associated transit pax , no thanks . I am going in J both ways but from what I have been told from friends who do EK it will still be a nightmare

QF's timings mean that through passengers miss the worst of the rush (especially outbound), which should be pretty bearable for the next year or so anyway given how much space is being added with the new concourse.

Personally I'd be concerned about going through FRA, but each to their own.

Quoting bthebest (Reply 10):
I was confused by your logic at first as I was under the impression that all QF European flights were routing through DXB with the new alliance, but despite that being reported in most news articles, it is only LHR flights that are routing through DXB?

I looked at QF flights in May to FRA on their website and weirdly it doesn't even give QF5/6 as an option, instead just routing on BA flights!?

FRA continues until October, and will retain the SIN stop.

Try different dates -- there are a few random dates when there is no service scheduled (outbound on the 6th, 8th and 17th are the only ones from what I can see). All other dates are showing QF5/6.


User currently offlineUnited885 From Germany, joined Apr 2011, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9750 times:

Quoting solnabo (Reply 13):
Tim Clark :

"Emirates A380s flying today are already three or four tons lighter than when the carrier took its first planes, and other improvements from Toulouse"

But that´s usually the way. Remember, EK´s first A380, A6-EDF was MSN no. 7....
Normaly, all aircrafts until MSN 50 i guess, have a bigger weight than stated. After a few years, the builded units adjust themself to given speciality.

Quoting warden145 (Reply 2):
I recall hearing on here that EK was waiting until a higher-MTOW variant was in their fleet before upgauging these routes

That´s right. There where even roumors to build a A380-800R with enhanced range on the base of the higher MTOW-aircrafts. But i´m not sure if there were already talkings with Emirates or other Airlines.



I haven´t been everywhere, but it´s on my list.
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25431 posts, RR: 49
Reply 16, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 9666 times:

Well LAX is no surprise.

EK for years not has been describing their needed A380 range yard-stick as being able reaching LAX with a full payload.

Even during the 2008 LAX launch festivities (which they brought an A380 in to show travel agents) they mentioned their desire to utilize the A380 as soon as they could eek out the needed range.

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 1):
You need to remember that EK doesn't rely only on pax from DXB but from other places as well...

  

As I posted in another thread, the EK network has transfer traffic account for about 70 percent of total enplanements these days.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineDFWHeavy From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 560 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 9599 times:

My bet is that IAH soon gets the 380. Will they have to re-time their flight since Lufthansa also flies the 380 to IAH and there is only 1 gate capable of handling the 380?


Christopher W Slovacek
User currently offlineflyingalex From Germany, joined Jul 2010, 1016 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 9130 times:

Quoting qf002 (Reply 14):
Personally I'd be concerned about going through FRA, but each to their own.

A connection within FRA T2 (where both QF and BA are) is incredibly easy. This is the terminal where the vast majority of traffic is O&D. It's T1 (with LH and all its partners) that can get really messy.



Public service announcement: "It's" = "it is". To indicate posession, write "its." Looks wrong, but it's correct grammar
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17066 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8841 times:

Why not add a second rotation to LAX as they had a year or two ago?


Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineN14AZ From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2715 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8774 times:

Quoting United885 (Reply 15):
EK´s first A380, A6-EDF was MSN no. 7....

Sorry for nitpicking (klugscheissing   ) but EK's first A 380 was MSN 011, A6-EDA.


User currently offlineUnited885 From Germany, joined Apr 2011, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8453 times:

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 20):

Sorry for nitpicking (klugscheissing ) but EK's first A 380 was MSN 011, A6-EDA.

You´re totaly right, sorry 
but i meant A6-EDF is the "oldest". Delivered after A6-EDA but builded before it  



I haven´t been everywhere, but it´s on my list.
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25431 posts, RR: 49
Reply 22, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8365 times:

Quoting B747forever (Reply 19):
Why not add a second rotation to LAX as they had a year or two ago?

The 2nd flight operated until last August.

EK is short aircraft so it had to cut some frequencies including the 2nd LAX flight to fund growth.

Anyhow, the A380 all along was EK's intended aircraft for the West Coast. It had to run the 777s instead due to range shortfall with the whale.

The added A380 capacity would be well used as LAX is running up in the 90% load factor range now with only a single flight on the route.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineUnited885 From Germany, joined Apr 2011, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 8185 times:

Wasn´t the IAD flight recently new introduced?
I guess the loadfactor of IAD - DXB musst be terrific!

[Edited 2013-01-07 12:41:11]


I haven´t been everywhere, but it´s on my list.
User currently offlineL0VE2FLY From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 1576 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 8088 times:

With 90 A380s on order, I think that any airport that could handle an A380 will see one from EK! It's just a matter of time.

Quoting solnabo (Reply 13):
Better if EK stop "shower room" in first imo

Good idea, F pax have access to airport lounge showers, if you take a shower right before take off and use a deodorant why would you need to shower mid-flight?! Maybe they'll do away with this gimmicky feature once they hit a nasty CAT with a couple of pax in the showers!


25 Post contains images N14AZ : Well, I could answer this question. Problem is it would be deleted immediately... beeep .... beeep .... beeeep ....
26 Viscount724 : The population of DXB is irrelevant. DXB's success as a hub is based on its geographical location which can serve markets connecting a significant pe
27 DolphinAir747 : Wasn't IAH already a A380 route, or was that only temporary? Also, will EK serve EWR soon, maybe by moving their 77W from JFK to EWR? There is a huuuu
28 mesaflyguy : I don't ever remember IAH being an a380 route, except for LH. Did IAH even have an a380-capable gate before this summer?
29 drerx7 : NO EK has at its peak been 2x daily 77L now it is 1x77W No we didn't. LH is the only 380 and D12 is the only 380 specific gate i.e. upper level board
30 seahawks7757 : Talking to an airport ops official here at SeaTac, I learned that EK has tossed the Idea out to the Port of Seattle however the Port is not going to p
31 thomasphoto60 : Yeah, I suspect that EK would not be too wild about these options. I also believe that EK might be a bit hard nosed on option #2 about keeping their
32 drerx7 : I agree. The thing is, a second 380 gate would eat up the space for one or two of the other widebodies on the ground at that time. Of course I suppos
33 LAXdude1023 : Im not so sure. I cant imagine them being able to seriously use DFW as a way to force IAH to do something. Im sure they will come to some consensus a
34 Post contains images astuteman : Clark has always said that his 2012 A380's, being some 4 tonnes lighter, and having some 2% better fuel burn than the early ones, would be able to ec
35 migair54 : Second frequency is not always the best option, adding seat with a bigger plane is safer way to upgrade a destination, also adding a flight sometimes
36 aznmadsci : EK already has been flying to DFW with an 77L while IAH went from 2x daily 77L to daily 77W. Also, there is also 1 A380 gate at IAH for LH's daily IA
37 LAXintl : In the long run, frequency is key for EK. Its with frequency they are able to build a effective power house DXB hub with lots of connection timing op
38 as739x : Really??? Considering it's been mentioned that Seattle is the worst performing N. American market.
39 migair54 : Volume is the key for EK, that´s why they are ordering so many A380´s and not B787´s to offer multiple freqs. LAX problem was the lack of planes a
40 LAXintl : If you review the EK network, they work to build frequency. Look at the current front page thread about EK going 5x daily to BKK, 4x to KUL, 3x to MN
41 migair54 : Of course they add freqs to markets when they can, but many of the markets they serve could be serve more frequently with smaller planes but they sen
42 gemuser : True, but it is limited. EK is looking for 4 daily flights to everywhere, to match the 4 banks operating/planned at DXB (see HB-IWC excellent posts o
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