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EK Wants To Extend QF Agreement  
User currently offlineIrishpower From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 385 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7359 times:

I don't know if this has been discussed yet but this is an interesting article. I wonder if QF would go for it.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...for-pacific-routes.html?cmpid=yhoo

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineQANTASvJet From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2012, 78 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7263 times:

My Grandma, what long teeth you have!
Of course EK wants to extend the deal, but I would have thought that QF are not yet sufficiently dependent on them to have to say yes. Give it time though.


User currently offlineSYDSpotter From Australia, joined Oct 2012, 153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7244 times:

They'll probably want to see how their venture with EK for Europe works out first. QF will probably want an even more extensive/comprehensive deal with EK for Europe/Africe/Asia (i.e. revenue sharing JV) before they consider sharing their 'cash cow'.

A QF-EK + AA tie-up (if AA ever manage to strike a deal with EK) would be a pretty formidable combo to/from the North America.



319_320_321_332_333_388 / 734_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W
User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7219 times:

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 2):
A QF-EK + AA tie-up (if AA ever manage to strike a deal with EK) would be a pretty formidable combo to/from the North America.

I till don't get this. QF might have had to bow to the 800lb gorilla that has been eating at its market to Europe, but why would AA skip BA and new OW member QR and go for EK? That would be totally against the logic of the JV BA and AA have right now.


User currently offlineSYDSpotter From Australia, joined Oct 2012, 153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7088 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):
I till don't get this. QF might have had to bow to the 800lb gorilla that has been eating at its market to Europe, but why would AA skip BA and new OW member QR and go for EK? That would be totally against the logic of the JV BA and AA have right now.

I thought the BA/AA tie-up was geared towards the Nth America-UK-Europe Market. Any potential AA-EK tie-up would be more geared to towards US-->Middle East-->Africa, not sure the AA-EK would overlap with AA/BA as I'm not sure many passengers would want to fly Nth America-DXB and then backtrack to a European destination. The tie-up with AA is more geared to utilising the significant AA feed in the US isn't it?



319_320_321_332_333_388 / 734_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4865 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7037 times:

It's just amazing how my comments on another forum received criticism suggesting QF time the SYD-LAX/DFW flights to meet up with EK services allowing passengers to connect to DXB services giving a choice to fly both East bound and West bound... Now Mr Clark has the exact same idea up his sleeve! Straight from the horses mouth...

“If the timing is right and the two aircraft meet, with Qantas and Emirates you could go around the world with A380s,” he said yesterday. “I’m sure we could do trans-Pacific business on Qantas metal as part of this overall deal.”

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8286 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6767 times:
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Quoting EK413 (Reply 5):
“If the timing is right and the two aircraft meet, with Qantas and Emirates you could go around the world with A380s,” he said yesterday. “I’m sure we could do trans-Pacific business on Qantas metal as part of this overall deal.”

Has Qantas let too much of the Emirates Camel into its tent ? Its one thing for EK to fly to LAX with A380( will happen one day) but to include EK into all Qantas flights is another. Emirates would love to fly around the world with its own A380, including LAX to Sydney.


User currently offlineflyingalex From Germany, joined Jul 2010, 1016 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6502 times:

Here's one thing I don't get:

What would be the point?

Why would anyone fly DXB-SYD-LAX when you could fly DXB-LAX nonstop or any number of far more direct routings via Europe or other gateways in the US?

There is only one Qantas trans-Pacific route that would be helpful for EK passengers, and that's SYD-SCL. However, even that is a massive detour which would be better served via different routings.

The only reason EK wants in on the trans-Pacific business is because this is where QF makes massive amounts of money. It's the same reason why SQ applied for trans-Pacific rights from Australia a few years ago.

I see zero - zero - incentive for QF to let EK anywhere near its trans-Pacific flights, and even Alan Joyce isn't dumb enough to make that mistake.

[Edited 2013-01-08 05:34:53]


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User currently offlineSKAirbus From Norway, joined Oct 2007, 1671 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6474 times:

It seems that global alliances are becoming less and less relevant when the big players are making their own bespoke deals.


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User currently offlineHB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4498 posts, RR: 72
Reply 9, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6200 times:

Quoting flyingalex (Reply 7):
What would be the point?

There is no point of course. Very few people would ever connect between EK and QF flights in LAX or DFW. The only relevant point I could possibly see is that EK would have equipment suitable to fly DFW SYD nonstop and thus eliminate the BNE stopover. EK may also have equipment that is better suited for South America to Australia traffic. Other than that, EK seems to be after a piece of the lucrative Transpacific pie.


User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2949 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 6086 times:

Quoting flyingalex (Reply 7):
I see zero - zero - incentive for QF to let EK anywhere near its trans-Pacific flights, and even Alan Joyce isn't dumb enough to make that mistake.

Completely agree -- anything but a very basic EK codeshare agreement makes little sense from QF's perspective.

QF won't be changing their flights to meet EK's afternoon departures (which would mean moving to a 7-8pm departure from Australia) -- it goes against everything they are trying to do for the corporate market and connections to AA, and would screw up the extension to JFK. Perhaps EK could add a morning departure ex-LAX (the timings would feed into the afternoon wave of departures) to tie into QF's existing ops.


User currently onlinemigair54 From Spain, joined Jun 2007, 1659 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6053 times:

After reading this post and the one about EK and AA, my question is:

What´s the poing of OneWorld?? Emirates is not a member but wants to make an extense agreement with AA and more with QF and Qatar is just going to join OneWorld and BA is far from a friends from EK but one of the main partners of OneWorld....


User currently offlineLofty From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2008, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 5768 times:

Could it be EK fears OW! the best way to weaken OW is to remove main players, one at a time.

User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12902 posts, RR: 100
Reply 13, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 5387 times:
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Quoting flyingalex (Reply 7):
The only reason EK wants in on the trans-Pacific business is because this is where QF makes massive amounts of money.

Are they? When it was QF vs. UA, I believe that. Now that it is QF vs. DL vs. UA vs. VA the yield is down.

Quoting Lofty (Reply 12):

Could it be EK fears OW! the best way to weaken OW is to remove main players, one at a time.

Not fears, but is rather taking partners that will expand EK's reach. OW is not a threatening network to EK.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinetullamarine From Australia, joined Aug 1999, 1515 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4647 times:

We are only talking about an EK codeshare on QF's trans-Pacific services. There was nothing said about EK using its own planes across the Pacific and they don't have rights to do this anyway.

Direct connections are probably not a big deal because no-one would fly non-stop from DXB to LAX to connect to a flight to Australia given there are nonstops from DXB to all Australian ports already.

The advantage for EK would be that they could sell an around-the-world ticket using its own codes entirely though such a ticket would currently mean no stops in Europe unless the rumoured tie-up with AA comes into being on similar terms also.

SQ theoretically already has rights due to open-skies agreements between Singapore and Australia and Singapore and US but Australia's IASC has historically refused to allow them access in definance of its own agreement. Whether SQ still want access is another question given Australia - US is no longer the gold-mine it once was and SQ have access to it via its VA shareholding anyway.



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User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25009 posts, RR: 85
Reply 15, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 4458 times:
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Quoting flyingalex (Reply 7):
Here's one thing I don't get:

What would be the point?

It isn't designed for people whop want to fly SYD-DXB - it designed for those who want to stop in LAX (or environs) on the way.

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 14):
We are only talking about an EK codeshare on QF's trans-Pacific services. There was nothing said about EK using its own planes across the Pacific and they don't have rights to do this anyway.

  

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineIrishpower From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 1840 times:

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 14):
We are only talking about an EK codeshare on QF's trans-Pacific services. There was nothing said about EK using its own planes across the Pacific and they don't have rights to do this anyway.

You're right but I think the concern is that this is the first step in EK eventually pushing for trans-pac. service.


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