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UA 787 Aircraft / Schedule Changes  
User currently offlinefun2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1024 posts, RR: 1
Posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8927 times:

What will UA do to adjust its schedule w/the 6 788's being grounded?

United Flight 32 LAX>NRT
Status: Cancelled

IAH > DEN subbed w/a 753.

One IAH>LAX subbed w/a 764.

What are the short term/long term implications? Will it affect retirements/planned maintenance/refurbishments?

31 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 8874 times:
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The question is complicated by the fact the pilot's contract will enable cross-fleeting to be fully implemented. UA's fleet is so large that they should have enough flexibility to cover the 788 routes in the short term.

Whether they will start new routes such as DEN-NRT is another matter. I'd expect it to be postponed if I had to guess.

The 762s are leaving the fleet, I don't think that will change. The two class 763s are done and available for international service.

We may see a delay in switching 752 TATL routes to 763 and/or increasing frequency if the grounding of the 787 is lengthy.


User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5721 posts, RR: 11
Reply 2, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 8600 times:

Quoting fun2fly (Thread starter):
What are the short term/long term implications? Will it affect retirements/planned maintenance/refurbishments?

As Sonoma touched on, it all really depends on how long the birds are on the ground. If this is a one-week issue, then I would expect minimal changes to any forward planning; if this turns out to be a longer-term major redesign of systems, then there will, obviously, have to be bigger changes made.
I, for one, would expect the few 762's that remain to stick around a bit longer.

Hopefully, this can be resolved completely AND quickly. Time will tell- I (sadly) have no inside information as to what must be done to convince 787 lithium batteries to charge without entering into thermal runaway.


User currently offlinetravelin man From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3458 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8500 times:

I am shocked that UA 32 (LAX-NRT) has been cancelled with no aircraft substitutions. I just looked on united.com, and the status is "cancelled" for at least the next few days.

They don't have a spare 777 or something sitting around? Forcing people to connect via SFO is not a very good solution, but perhaps they are just shuffling people onto other star carriers from LAX -- SQ and NH.


User currently offlinewarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 707 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8396 times:

UA has loaded replacement flights for UA32 and UA33

18 JAN UA1760 LAX-NRT, operated by N787UA (PMUA)
19 JAN UA1761 NRT-LAX, operated by N787UA (PMUA)

N787UA was in VCV for paint. Scheduled to exit VCV-LAX on 17 JAN as UA6863

Beginning on 19 JAN, the LAX-NRT remains as UA32. However the equipment has changed to a PMCO 772. On 19 JAN, it is operated by N76010

Beginning on 20 JAN, the NRT-LAX remains as UA33. However the equipment has changed to a PMCO 772. On 20 JAN, it is operated by N76010

[Edited 2013-01-17 13:39:48]

User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8376 times:
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travelin - I think the order to ground the 787s caught UA a bit off guard. This is the "slow" time of year when airlines like UA catch up on maintenance of a/c and for UA finishing off painting the last of the sUA frames. Going forward, UA will cover the lfight with a 777 as they did before.

User currently offlinetravelin man From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3458 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8330 times:

Quoting warreng24 (Reply 4):
UA has loaded replacement flights for UA32 and UA33

18 JAN UA1760 LAX-NRT, operated by N787UA
19 JAN UA1761 NRT-LAX, operated by N787UA

N787UA was in VCV for paint. Scheduled to exit VCV-LAX on 17 JAN as UA6863

OK I guess that makes sense that they'll use a 777 to cover the flight (as they did prior to the arrival of the 787) -- Of course the reg number on this particular 777 is quite ironic.  
Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 5):
travelin - I think the order to ground the 787s caught UA a bit off guard. This is the "slow" time of year when airlines like UA catch up on maintenance of a/c and for UA finishing off painting the last of the sUA frames. Going forward, UA will cover the lfight with a 777 as they did before.

Yeah -- I guess they are replacing it with a different flight number (the info above from warreng). That's why I was surprised that UA would not cover LAX-NRT, which is still an important route for them. I wonder why they changed flight numbers though? Why wouldn't they just do an equipment replacement for flight 32?


User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8261 times:
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That flight number was used on second flights between LAX and NRT in the past. For whatever reason, they decided to just plug that one in. Its odd though because the flight departure times are the same as UA 32 which is the 787 flight.

User currently offline73G From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 128 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 8189 times:

Quoting travelin man (Reply 6):
Yeah -- I guess they are replacing it with a different flight number (the info above from warreng). That's why I was surprised that UA would not cover LAX-NRT, which is still an important route for them. I wonder why they changed flight numbers though? Why wouldn't they just do an equipment replacement for flight 32?

As the crew scheduling functionality for the two subsidiaries has not yet been merged, any inter-subisdiary equipment subsitutions require a new section to be built to properly determine crew legality and pay. Since PMCO equipment takes over on 1/19, the flight numbers remain 32/33.

Today's LAX-NRT customers appear to have been protected via the following:

1758 LAX-SEA (extra section using PMUA 757)
875 SEA-NRT

as well as

876 NRT-SEA
1759 SEA-LAX (extra section using PMUA 757)

It appears a couple of IAH-LAX turns and one IAH-ORD turn were subbed down to 739 equipment today as well.


User currently offlineBthebest From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2008, 506 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 8082 times:

Quoting warreng24 (Reply 4):
UA has loaded replacement flights for UA32 and UA33

18 JAN UA1760 LAX-NRT, operated by N787UA (PMUA)
19 JAN UA1761 NRT-LAX, operated by N787UA (PMUA)

Anyone else catch the irony with the registration  

ediy: didn't read post after fully

[Edited 2013-01-17 14:58:12]

User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4104 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 7998 times:

Quoting travelin man (Reply 6):
Of course the reg number on this particular 777 is quite ironic.

Hopefully none of the passengers see the reg and refuse to board...   


User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9464 posts, RR: 52
Reply 11, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 7826 times:

Quoting 73G (Reply 8):
Today's LAX-NRT customers appear to have been protected via the following:

1758 LAX-SEA (extra section using PMUA 757)
875 SEA-NRT

as well as

876 NRT-SEA
1759 SEA-LAX (extra section using PMUA 757)

That is interesting to see the extra section SEA-LAX since now the route is only CRJs. I guess UA took priority for its own passengers on NRT-LAX by putting them through SEA and they could have put any extras on ANA's NRT-SEA since it had been upgraded to a 77W.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7114 posts, RR: 17
Reply 12, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 7558 times:

Quoting Bthebest (Reply 9):
Anyone else catch the irony with the registration

Hahaha that is classic.

So was the UA that landed in NRT ferried back or going to just stay there?



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5929 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 7418 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 12):
So was the UA that landed in NRT ferried back or going to just stay there?

3904 is still in NRT



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineNorcal773 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 1446 posts, RR: 12
Reply 14, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 5606 times:

Quoting United1 (Reply 13):
3904 is still in NRT

How about the ship operating UA33 that returned to the gate after the grounding?



If you're going through hell, keep going
User currently offlinetommy767 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 6584 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 5469 times:

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 11):
I guess UA took priority for its own passengers on NRT-LAX by putting them through SEA a

I'd imagine that F cabin on the 757 would be filled to the brim with elites getting back from the NRT flight.



"Folks that's the news and I'm outta here!" -- Dennis Miller
User currently offlinesuseJ772 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 806 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 4316 times:

Quoting Bthebest (Reply 9):
Anyone else catch the irony with the registration  

I saw that too. Crazy.

I am super bummed about all this. I booked an ATL-DEN flight via IAH for next Friday specifically to fly on the 787... (and to see my family?) Anyways... I understand. These things happen. But I was really looking forward to this.

Even my mother called me and was like are you still coming? Weren't you suppose to be flying on the Dreamliner (I was really proud she knew all that).

Anyways... before the grounding I still had the highest confidence in the plane and was very much looking forward to my flight. Guess I'll settle for a boring old 757 now   



Currently at PIE, requesting FWA >> >>
User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 4316 times:
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1 787 is at NRT.
1 787 is at LAX.
4 are at IAH.


User currently offlinecytz_pilot From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 568 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3960 times:

Quoting suseJ772 (Reply 16):
I am super bummed about all this. I booked an ATL-DEN flight via IAH for next Friday specifically to fly on the 787... (and to see my family?) Anyways... I understand. These things happen. But I was really looking forward to this.

I know that feel, bro. I'm also booked on a 787 (IAH-LAX) next Friday. It's the main reason I was traveling, although if they substitute a 764 it won't be so bad since I haven't flown in one of those either. And I'll get a full day of southern California warmth, so I guess it won't be a total loss...


User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9464 posts, RR: 52
Reply 19, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3784 times:

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 15):
Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 11):
I guess UA took priority for its own passengers on NRT-LAX by putting them through SEA a

I'd imagine that F cabin on the 757 would be filled to the brim with elites getting back from the NRT flight.

The 787 has 36 business class seats. Not everyone would have gone via SEA to get to LAX. Some might have flown to SFO, ORD, IAH, EWR, or IAD on nonstops from NRT. Also some might have taken other connections from SEA. UA could have put them on flights to different cities on different airlines. 24F seats likely would have been enough to cover the 787's rather small business class cabin.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineNorcal773 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 1446 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3592 times:

Quoting cytz_pilot (Reply 18):
I know that feel, bro. I'm also booked on a 787 (IAH-LAX) next Friday. It's the main reason I was traveling, although if they substitute a 764 it won't be so bad since I haven't flown in one of those either. And I'll get a full day of southern California warmth, so I guess it won't be a total loss...

You'll love the 764. My 787 flight back in Nov got subbed to the 764 and it was my first 764 flight EWR-IAH which I absolutely loved. It's an awesome aircraft and the interior rocks.



If you're going through hell, keep going
User currently offlinefun2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1024 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3542 times:

I know some of this has changed, but were does an airline come up w/4-6 $200mm a/c to fill in for a grounding? Amazing the slack in the system if they can do this long term.

CHICAGO, Aug. 23, 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- United Airlines today announced the first international routes for the airline's newest addition to its fleet, the Boeing 787 Dreamliner. In addition to the previously-announced service from its Denver hub to Tokyo Narita, starting March 31, 2013, the airline will operate nonstop 787 service five days a week between its Houston hub and Lagos, Nigeria, beginning Jan. 7, 2013. United will also operate daily, nonstop 787 service between its Los Angeles hub and its Narita hub, beginning Jan. 3, 2013, and Los Angeles to Shanghai, beginning March 30, 2013.

United will also operate daily, nonstop 787 service from its Houston hub to Amsterdam and London Heathrow on a temporary basis. Houston to Amsterdam service begins Dec. 4, 2012, and Houston to London Heathrow service begins Feb. 4, 2013.


User currently offlineUALWN From Andorra, joined Jun 2009, 2730 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3513 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 20):
You'll love the 764. My 787 flight back in Nov got subbed to the 764 and it was my first 764 flight EWR-IAH which I absolutely loved. It's an awesome aircraft and the interior rocks.

Same thing happened to me in early December. My would-be first 787 flight, EWR-IAH, got subbed by a 764. It was my third 764 flight and the first since the new interior, and I absolutely loved it.



AT7/111/146/Avro/CRJ/CR9/EMB/ERJ/E75/F50/100/L15/DC9/D10/M8X/717/727/737/747/757/767/777/AB6/310/319/320/321/330/340/380
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4098 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3499 times:

Eh? I really don't care what aircraft I fly, as long as it gets me to where I want to go either on a 787 or what ever they use, I don't have any illusions and now a days I would wish I did not have to fly at all. The experience sucks no matter what you do, I have not liked flying since the middle of the last decade.


Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5929 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3462 times:

Quoting fun2fly (Reply 21):
I know some of this has changed, but were does an airline come up w/4-6 $200mm a/c to fill in for a grounding? Amazing the slack in the system if they can do this long term.

Winter is the slow season so generally there is allot of excess capacity in the system. Usually that excess is pulled down and non critical overhauls are performed (painting, IPTE/interiors ect.) As long as the 787 is back up by the middle of March you probably won't see much change to UAs operations.

Quoting UALWN (Reply 22):
It was my third 764 flight and the first since the new interior, and I absolutely loved it.

The 764s and 763s with the new interiors are an absolutely awesome ride.



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineNorcal773 From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 1446 posts, RR: 12
Reply 25, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 3591 times:

Quoting brilondon (Reply 23):
Eh? I really don't care what aircraft I fly, as long as it gets me to where I want to go either on a 787 or what ever they use, I don't have any illusions and now a days I would wish I did not have to fly at all. The experience sucks no matter what you do, I have not liked flying since the middle of the last decade.

Eeh, have you considered joining a Trains enthusiasts forum then and ditching A.net?

  

Quoting UALWN (Reply 22):
Same thing happened to me in early December. My would-be first 787 flight, EWR-IAH, got subbed by a 764. It was my third 764 flight and the first since the new interior, and I absolutely loved it.

It's a great aircraft indeed. I am a big 777 fan and I'd rather fly on UA's 764 than the 772s.



If you're going through hell, keep going
User currently offlinefun2fly From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 1024 posts, RR: 1
Reply 26, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 2887 times:

Looks like the 787 issues will be longer than we thought.

I saw the 747 UA Charter plane at ORD B Concourse on Wed. Do they have that unit (24th unit not listed in their active fleet) running scheduled runs?

Schedulers are earning their $.

Any other a/c updates?


User currently offlinepoint2point From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 2738 posts, RR: 1
Reply 27, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 2836 times:

Quoting fun2fly (Reply 26):
Looks like the 787 issues will be longer than we thought.
Quoting SonomaFlyer (Reply 1):
Whether they will start new routes such as DEN-NRT is another matter. I'd expect it to be postponed if I had to guess.

Is there another bird UA could use to start DEN-NRT if the 787 issues aren't resolved by then? Maybe a 777 would be too much here, and a 767 may have to make an ANC fuel-stop or something along the way, but I would imagine that there are already quite a number of seats booked here, so would any other aircraft in the UA fleet be able to substitute here?


 


User currently offlineSonomaFlyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1669 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 2791 times:
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Quoting point2point (Reply 27):
Is there another bird UA could use to start DEN-NRT if the 787 issues aren't resolved by then? Maybe a 777 would be too much here, and a 767 may have to make an ANC fuel-stop or something along the way, but I would imagine that there are already quite a number of seats booked here, so would any other aircraft in the UA fleet be able to substitute here?

I don't think it would make economic sense to run a 767 with a tech stop enroute and I don't think they have the slack for it anyway (except possibly with the 762?).

I'd think the 777 is too much a/c for the route but they could run it with a two class 777 if there is slack in the schedule to make it work.


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20322 posts, RR: 63
Reply 29, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 2656 times:

Quoting fun2fly (Reply 26):
Any other a/c updates?

These changes were presumably taken from the United Hub page, but I can't see it there:

LAXNRT will fly using a S-UA B777.
IAHHNL will change from a S-UA B777 to fly using a S-CO B767-400.
IAHLOS will fly as a S-CO B777.
IAHGIG will change from S-CO B777 to fly as a S-CO B767-400.
EWRFRA will change from S-CO B767-400 to fly as a S-CO B767-200.
• Domestic segments scheduled with the B787 will instead be operated by a variety of S-CO aircraft.

Source: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/20118029-post1.html



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4098 posts, RR: 1
Reply 30, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2262 times:

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 25):
Eeh, have you considered joining a Trains enthusiasts forum then and ditching A.net?

No. I am part of a Railway group, we skype on Sundays. We also get together and trade pictures and stories a couple of times a year. I still like to watch aircraft but I have lost my enthusiasm for flying. I feel like it is like taking a bus and treated similarly. BTW, do you really care?



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlinecosyr From United States of America, joined Jul 2012, 366 posts, RR: 0
Reply 31, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 2186 times:

Since they were planning to retire the 5 762's this quarter, I would hope they can make some adjustments to schedules and just replace 762's in for 787's on any routes that allow it (Probably not LAX-NRT). Then when the 787's are allowed back up, they can swap them back within 24 hours, and retire the 762's as planned.

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