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IST Plans The World's Biggest Airport: 150 Mio Pax  
User currently offlinelaolao From Laos, joined May 2008, 26 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23871 times:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/tr...-plans-worlds-biggest-airport.html

If this materializes, the impact on European aviation can be immense.
Facilitated by the extended range of the MAX and the NEO, TK can connect nearly every secondary airports in Europe with all cities in Africa, Middle East and Asia using narrow bodies on a one-stop basis. Growth opportunities for TK are huge.
Let's see if IST or BER opens first. IST should open 2017!

[Edited 2013-01-28 00:41:16]

[Edited 2013-01-28 00:41:50]

101 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4420 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23861 times:

Link not working.

IST or BER, hmmmm. Though one but I would go with BER on this one.
Also; if it opens by 2017 the new Istanbul airport will have a capacity of 90mil pax a year. Future plans to grow all the way up to 150M pax a year with 6 runways. That might take another decade or longer.
By then I am sure UAE or China will have lot bigger airports.


User currently offlineLoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 3811 posts, RR: 34
Reply 2, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23803 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 1):
Link not working.

Try this link

LoneStarMike


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23785 times:

We have this (rather blurry) animation of how it might look eventually:

http://zaman.com.tr/multimedia_getGa...onId=1&type=video&galleryId=133116


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4905 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23691 times:

The rate BER continue to delay the opening I'll put my money on IST...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinelaolao From Laos, joined May 2008, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 23680 times:

looks great!
Is there already a location for that behemoth?


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 23554 times:

Yup.. Very controversial location (the top left one):

http://img.haberler.com/haber/165/is...ak-3-havalimani-4270165_2744_o.jpg


User currently offlineRWA380 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3179 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 23377 times:

For thousands of years this place has been the crossroads of the world, why should that change? Geography was the reason it started being that crossroads, and that is why it works today still. IST has always been amazing, still is.  


AA-AC-AQ-AS-BN-BD-CO-CS-DL-EA-EZ-HA-HP-KL-KN-MP-MW-NK-NW-OO-OZ-PA-PS-QX-RC-RH-RW-SA-TG-TW-UA-US-VS-WA-WC-WN
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9269 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 23317 times:

Very ambitious, in 4 years time. if they get the first stage with one runway and terminals for 30 mio pax completed in that time would be good already.

Also, road and rail a ccess needs a bridge on the eastern part of the Bosporous. What will happen to the 2 present airport?

As to the famous BER question, OK, I gamble and put me money on BER



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineflylonghaul From Australia, joined Feb 2010, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 23193 times:

The design looks great! And that will really give TK the room to expand dramatically.

2017 does seem a little on the ambitious side though.



Flying for Pleasure
User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 23188 times:

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 8):
Also, road and rail a ccess needs a bridge on the eastern part of the Bosporous. What will happen to the 2 present airport?

The 3rd bridge is already in preliminary works - will probably be completed before the airport itself. As for the other airports, IST will close for scheduled commercial traffic and become a charter / GA airport, SAW will remain.


User currently offline1400mph From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2013, 831 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 23111 times:
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The mind boggles.

Will IST and DXB and therefore TK and EK become future bitter rivals ?

Is the market big enough to support projected expansion plans of both airlines ?


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4905 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 23064 times:

I've stumbled across the details of the construction phases...

1st phase: 70,00,000 PAX
-2 parallel runways + 1 cross runway
-distance between both parallel runways will be 2,300m
-Terminal: 1,000,000 m²
-car parks: 25,140
-~2019

2nd phase: 90,000,000 (+20,000,000)
-~2021
-3rd parallel runway
-new terminal with a capacity of 20,000,000
-underground connection between both terminals

3rd phase: 120,000,000 (+30,000,000)
-~2023
-new terminal with a capacity of 30,000,000
-4th parallel runway

4thh phase: 150,0000,000 (+30,000,000)
-~ 2025
-new terminal with a capacity of 30,000,000
-5th parallel runway

The city prefered the Silivri region (south of Istanbul. Marmara Sea), butt the Architects etc prefered the northern part / black sea.

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinePanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 9269 posts, RR: 29
Reply 13, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 22915 times:

Over ambitious

adding 20/30/30 Mio capacity in leaps of only 2 years is by far exceeding realistic potential traffic growth. From a financial point of view, this would be a waste of money as these terminals and runways would need to be financed without the yield from the traffic volume they are designed for. Plus maintenance and whatever goes along with having buildings that needs servicing.



E's passed on! That parrot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker!
User currently offlineEPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4721 posts, RR: 39
Reply 14, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 22567 times:
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Quoting 1400mph (Reply 12):
Will IST and DXB and therefore TK and EK become future bitter rivals ?

That is what I am thinking as well. This new airport is aiming not only at the traditional large Western-European hubs, but is also aiming at winning passengers from Dubai, Abu Dhabi and Qatar.

That competition will be interesting. But contrary to those airports IST is already a very large, and still rapidly expanding metropolis. And the Turkish economy and population are also on the rise. That they would need a new airport soon is no news to anybody. Now the question is, will they also buy a large fleet of A380's as EK had done?  .

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 14):
Over ambitious

Maybe, but that is what we (or almost all of us) were thinking when we heard about the upcoming carriers out of the Middle East. And 20 years before them SQ did the same, so I am cautious to qualify their plans as over ambitious. They might be, but could just as easy imho become reality in the 2020-2030 time-frame.


User currently offlineVinniewinnie From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 789 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 22339 times:

Quoting EPA001 (Reply 15):
That is what I am thinking as well. This new airport is aiming not only at the traditional large Western-European hubs, but is also aiming at winning passengers from Dubai, Abu Dhabi and Qatar.

IST is a much better connection point from Europe not only to Africa but also Asia from the whole of Europe and the United-States/Canada.

Apart from Asia-Africa i'm struggling to see where DXB is more competitive than IST!


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 22288 times:

Quoting Vinniewinnie (Reply 17):
Apart from Asia-Africa i'm struggling to see where DXB is more competitive than IST!

In fact, China to West Africa is shorter via IST.

via DXB
PEK-ABJ 6770 nm
PEK-DKR 7280 nm

via IST
PEK-ABJ 6596 nm
PEK-DKR 6701 nm


User currently offlinecloudyapple From Hong Kong, joined Jul 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 22093 times:

There's a ~100mppa "limit" for single airports, beyond which ATC, pax flow, baggage, APM, CIQ and other support services all become very difficult. The MCT will start to drift up beyond what'll be required for a hub airport. I'm very sceptical about achieving 150mppa with a reasonable level of service.


A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
User currently offlinerampart From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 3123 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 22032 times:

Istanbul is still bidding for the 2020 Summer Olympics. I think they have a good shot at getting it, and this airport would be a boon. But they'd need to start soon.

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):
We have this (rather blurry) animation of how it might look eventually:

I dig the music!  

The place is CAVERNOUS, if the illustrations are accurate. I know it wants to be able to handle huge volumes of passengers, but the over-ample spaces are unmanageable for walking. The entry sidewalk alone is as wide a runway. Why?

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 6):
Yup.. Very controversial location (the top left one):

Can you go into details as to why? I'm curious, and know next to nothing about Istanbul.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7):

For thousands of years this place has been the crossroads of the world, why should that change? Geography was the reason it started being that crossroads, and that is why it works today still. IST has always been amazing, still is.

Definitely. I was once playing with Great Circle Mapper. Given an 8000nm range, the only thing IST misses, just barely, is eastern Australia and New Zealand. On the same 8000nm range, DXB only misses western South America. And for good measure, TLV gets everything except New Zealand, but that's a different can of worms.

-Rampart


User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 21947 times:

Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 19):
There's a ~100mppa "limit" for single airports, beyond which ATC, pax flow, baggage, APM, CIQ and other support services all become very difficult.

What makes it so much more difficult at that point? To me it seems about planning for it from the beginning. Terminals between runways. Good communication between terminals.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25042 posts, RR: 46
Reply 20, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 22289 times:

This has been covered in the Turkish Aviation threads for a few months now as the lead up the the tender.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7):
For thousands of years this place has been the crossroads of the world, why should that change? Geography was the reason it started being that crossroads, and that is why it works today still. IST has always been amazing, still is.

  .

As they say, location, location, location.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 8):
What will happen to the 2 present airport?

IST will be limited to charter, cargo and training flights, along with GA traffic and the maintenance facilities.
The municipality is looking to redevelop property including establishment of fair grounds, and convention center facilities.

SAW on the Asian side continues to grow on its own setting records each year. Work on the added runway will begin there soon also.

Quoting flylonghaul (Reply 10):
And that will really give TK the room to expand dramatically.

THY will have exclusive use of a terminal to operate under a single roof to facilititate transfers.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 13):
I've stumbled across the details of the construction phases...

Dont know what your source is, however the tender documents call for

o Deadline for bids May 3rd.
o Airport project conducted under a BOT model (build, operate, transfer) running for 25-years.
o Airport would occupy 90,000 million square-meter land area of which 77 million square-meters will be developed
o Four-stage project
o First stage 90mil capacity and 3 runways by 2017
o Eventual up to 150mil with 6 runways
o Construction window - 42 months
o Will provide 120,000 jobs
o Estimated €7Bil investment
o Winning builders will be required to arrange commercial equity financing which will not be guaranteed by the Turkish Treasury


Winning tender will be selected based on 1) Meeting technical qualifications 2) Construction pricing, 3) Operating price through the 25-year lease period.

Already FRAport and Schiphol Group say they is interested in bidding.

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 14):
Over ambitious

adding 20/30/30 Mio capacity in leaps of only 2 years is by far exceeding realistic potential traffic growth. From a financial point of view, this would be a waste of money as these terminals and runways would need to be financed without the yield from the traffic volume they are designed for.

Not really. Istanbul today already has traffic volume of 59 million, so opening an airport with 90mil capacity in 4-5 years seems reasonable.
At very moderate 5% growth by 2017 the count would be up to 72mil, but in reality TK is planning almost 50% growth in 5-year, so the 80mil+ range could easily be reached by the time the airport opens.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTupolev160 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 22367 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 26):

I definitely don't see the need for a whole new mega-airport in Istanbul. Instead of that SAW should be dramatically expanded and IST improved. That will be enough for the next 50 years at least. Same goes for the 3rd Bosphorus bridge in Istanbul but again its all about numbers and show-off more than the rational need. What are the limitations of expanding SAW, besides TK managers not wanting their airline's headquarters to be somewhere in Asia? Cause as far as i understand, the new projected airport will be even further to Taksim than SAW - not even talking about Silivri which is damn far.


User currently offlineTupolev160 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 22256 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):

At least the music is nice. If they eventually decide to go for it, they should not just make a big Otogar like in this movie but do something original, similar to the PEK newest terminal which is the most pleasant mega-airport i've been at.

leftyboarder (still trying to figure out your nickname, very intriguing) don't take me wrong, i'm even far more critical of my own country but i just can't stand stupidity, greed and vanity in general.

As Einstein said: “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.” A Turkish writer made a similar comment.

Think about it.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25042 posts, RR: 46
Reply 23, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 22150 times:

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 27):
Instead of that SAW should be dramatically expanded

It is. Few years back got its new terminal and new runway is on the way.

But ultimately the airport is located on the Asian side, a more residential area and far away from central Istanbul, commerce areas, tourist sites, and where most people want to go.

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 27):
and IST improved.

Can't happen. Its land locked and in the middle of the growing metropolis.

No matter what a 3rd airport was needed. IST simply did not have a long term future.

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 27):
Same goes for the 3rd Bosphorus bridge in Istanbul but again its all about numbers and show-off more than the rational need.

Have you seen the volume of vehicle traffic across the continents daily?

330,000 cars cross daily, on the two current bridges designed for 180,000.

Plans for a third bridge (capacity 120,000/day) over the Bosphorus have circulated since the early 1990s. Matter of fact they identified the need for 5-bridges to carry the volume, and also have the tunnel on the way as well.

One need to remember Istanbul has gone from a population of 2.5mil 40 years ago when the first Japanese bridge opened to 14mil+ today.

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 27):
What are the limitations of expanding SAW, besides TK managers not wanting their airline's headquarters to be somewhere in Asia?

Again, the bulk of demand is on the European side, so yes SAW can and will expand on its own, but it certainly cant carry the weight for the entire metro area.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12981 posts, RR: 100
Reply 24, posted (1 year 6 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 21528 times:
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DEN will keep the title or 'world's biggest' once it is built out.   

and the new Beijing will be quite a rival...

Quoting 1400mph (Reply 12):
Will IST and DXB and therefore TK and EK become future bitter rivals ?

Bitter? I don't know. rivals?   

Besides, there has to be some port of entry to fortress Europe.  
Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 19):
There's a ~100mppa "limit" for single airports, beyond which ATC, pax flow, baggage, APM, CIQ and other support services all become very difficult.

Huh? There is no limit as you want to imply. The issue with current airports is none prior to the new Beijing airport were designed for > 100million passengers per year. I'm trying to think of *one* current airport that is at a limit designed for over 45 million passengers per year!

ATC will be handled by spacing the runways. Far superior than say ATL or ORD.

Passenger flow needs to be done as a super DEN; Broad hallways with horizontal escalators with better means to get from concourse to concourse.

For baggage, hire the company that set up MUC.

The other services could be distributed.

DEN, DWC, the new Beijing, ICN, and HKG will all break 100 million.
ATL has been handicapped by terminal space, runway spacing, and a lack of O&D traffic.
ORD has been hampered by terminal and airside capacity.
LHR has been held up by lack of new runways and needs more land for rapid terminal expansion.


Seriously, if a 2-runway airport with a curfew can hit 70 million passengers per year, why couldn't a 5 runway airport double that? I'd like to know the limit. As far as I know, economies of scale will only improve.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
25 stylo777 : I like the idea of moving PC with their new order of NEOs also to the new airport. Just a quick calculation: IST 45mio and SAW 15mio adds up to 60mio
26 TK787 : As always thank you, for simply explaining in detail. I guess they don't find the project over ambitious. I have a feeling they will be bidding to ma
27 Post contains images airbazar : LHR T5 alone cost 5 Bil and they expect to build a brand new mega airport from scratch for a mere 7 Bil? Right
28 tommytoyz : I think DXB is going to have a serious competitor. This would have a few things going for it that DXB does not: - Traffic supported by larger O&D
29 umit : Would that be because of much lower labor cost ? lower cost of land comparing to London ?
30 Post contains links TK787 : Hello all, Just to remind everyone that we have been talking this to death over the years and it is not going anywhere; Yes the 3rd airport will be bu
31 Post contains images airbazar : I'm saying I don'tbelieve it will cost only 7 Billion. T5 didn't require much land acquisition, certainly not in the scale that this new airport will
32 rwy04lga : Seems like there's going to be a lot of walking! Why are all of those people outside on the sidewalk? What IATA code will it have or will they transfe
33 leftyboarder : well, the current terminal at IST cost a fraction of that... granted that was just a terminal but in Turkey construction costs are nowhere nesr that
34 Turkish350XWB : True, and a very very smart philosopher once said "Stupid people, shut up". Think about it.
35 TurkishWings : Don't bother really... The more you reply to his posts, the more he will post.. Let him have his fun...
36 Post contains images lightsaber : But they are not good examples. ATL needs more terminals and O&D traffic to expand. IST will have the O&D. Ground transportation is the issue
37 Post contains links Tupolev160 : Istanbul, 3rd Airport? LHR, IST.. Pics. Compared (by TK787 Jan 29 2007 in Civil Aviation) This post reflects exactly my opinion and it was posted by o
38 Post contains links and images r2rho : This idea has been floating around for years now, so I'd like to at least see a detailed airport layout, not just articles with empty words. I do not
39 LAXintl : That thread is 6 years old. In 2006, Istanbul market enplanements were 24 million total. In 2012 it was 59mil !! THY in 2006 celebrated the arrival o
40 DocLightning : Because it's no longer about roads? It is true that IST's geographical location is pretty ideal for Europe-ME connections, though. Perhaps even bette
41 justloveplanes : Looks like IST will be a narrow body hub and DXB a wide body hub. IST will take away some business from DXB a la Southwest using secondary airports to
42 TK787 : Here it is one more time; IST hit 45mil pax in 2012!!!! 50M will be reached easily before the end of 2013.
43 Post contains images rwy04lga : Good one!
44 Post contains links incitatus : Why do you say this? IST needs more range to reach SE Asia while DOH does not. The other difference is the trade-off of two bits of Africa. DOH is be
45 Post contains images point2point : The article states that the new airport will be 77M square meters. I’m hoping that my arithmetic is correct here, but I do believe that this 77M sq
46 LAXintl : Noted in Reply 26 Airport would occupy 90,000 million square-meter land area of which 77 million square-meters will be developed. Wow is right, but c
47 UA787DEN : Is it just me or are all the new airports being planned and master plans being updated for a new "busiest airport"? I think many major US airports, mo
48 ely747 : Not sure if this has already been pointed (far too many posts to read) however Istanbul or Turkey itself has competitive advantage over the Gulf and t
49 leftyboarder : airport land area and actual built up airport acreage are teo different things. DMM is indeed the largest in total land as it streches out into the d
50 rwy04lga : Then why are you here? 58 posts is NOTHING! Would you want us to skip over your posts? Read the posts, they're very insightful and you might learn so
51 Turkish350XWB : TK widebody fllet will also be of decent size (approx the size if BA, LH, AF). But the situation is also not comparable as TK is not dependent on lon
52 Post contains images TK739ER : Why so many parallel runways? What happens when the winds change direction? At least two should be another direction like DEN, or not??
53 ASA : The prevailing / dominating wind flow pattern must be North-South and rarely East-West ... does anyone have a Wind Rose diagram of the area?
54 brilondon : It is an artists rendition and not a photograph. Most artists renditions are not really what it looks like once it is built.
55 JoeCanuck : The beauty of staging the expansion is that it the schedules can be changed for each level of expansion. 150m may be the best case scenario but there
56 Post contains images LAXintl : I posted this in one of the Turkish Av thread many months back, but yes dominant wind direction are virtually always off shore with only about a 8% va
57 Post contains images lightsaber : ditto. Eventually one will break 100M passengers per year. But as noted, they have the growth and with Europe's hubs being so congested, they have an
58 stylo777 : yesterday the official population of Turkey has been updated with 75.6 mio. this alone creates a "mini-hub" the size of some European airports, becaus
59 Post contains links Darksnowynight : I'd add DFW to that list too. Having worked there a good deal, I have to say it is probably 2nd only to DEN in terms of ease of expandability. As it
60 Post contains links rampart : I found the thread from a couple years ago discussing this. Insane 1970s DFW Expansion Plans (with Map) (by rolypolyman Aug 3 2010 in Civil Aviation)
61 Post contains images lightsaber : I'm liking how this is turning into a thread on how airports could break 100M pax/year. Agreed. But they will need a runway-realignment. Not the lates
62 rampart : I would imagine that, at DFW, is partially due to the conversion away from the ultimately distributed drive-to-the-gate plan: 1 small ticket counter
63 Post contains images lightsaber : And size... which was a function of location. Istanbul definitely needs a new airport built far larger than the current IST. Serious question, will I
64 LAXintl : see...
65 Post contains links EK413 : My source has been reliable in the past http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1394048&page=4 EK413
66 Post contains images lightsaber : err... thank you for your patience. While I'm not in favor of split hubs, having the secondary airport a 2-runway airport is impressive. That puts Is
67 denverdanny : What impact might political and regional issues have on this airport? I guess I'm thinking about instability in the region, as well as a potential swi
68 Post contains images TK739ER : The existing airport is landlocked and there is really not much room to grow, say they want to completely redesign and rearrange the entire airport,
69 ytz : As someone who has followed Turkey for a while, I get the concern. That said, disaster has happened since the Islamists came to power. And they know
70 Post contains images RWA380 : You are correct, it is about geography....
71 TK787 : So far 12 companies have filed applications with a $55K fee. The number is expected to go up to 20 companies.
72 RyanairGuru : Eastern Australia and New Zealand are the only two markets which are not able to be served via IST. For me this raises an interesting question in whe
73 SurfandSnow : I used IST back in the summer of 2008 (as O&D, as well as a transit pax) , and even then it was bursting at the seams. All of my flights arrived a
74 boeing773ER : Am I the only person who is not amazed by TK's growth? People are always saying how they are growing at such an incredible rate, but how? They don't h
75 trent1000 : I'm not on the Olympic Committee, but in my opinion, they'll choose a city with existing transport infrastructure - of all kinds - rather than awardi
76 LAXintl : So much for all those skeptics. While I doubt only half of the companies will place serious bids, the opportunity presented by the new airport is sim
77 trent1000 : Madrid has not been a host city of the summer Olympics. The 1992 summer games were in Barcelona. May the best proposal win!
78 r2rho : Furthermore the Gulf carriers are limited in frequencies and number of destinations by the various bilaterals. TK AFAIK either has no such limitation
79 boeing773ER : Thanks LAX those were the exact numbers I was looking for.
80 TK787 : Air traffic numbers are up for January 2013 compared to Jan2012. (slow winter traffic month for IST) From Turkish Aviation thread; from "Leftyboarder"
81 LAXintl : General Directorate of State Airports Authority (DHMI) announced that it has received applications from 16 firms wishing to participate in the new air
82 lightsaber : I think overtaking MAD is a given with the IB strikes. AMS? While I'm impressed with IST's growth (mainly TK), I think that is more likely in 2014. L
83 TK787 : February numbers up and IST pax traffic up 27% compared to 2012.
84 LAXintl : As part of last Fridays THY annual earnings release, they indicated they would likely carry about 46 million passengers in 2013. That is 18% growth ve
85 Post contains images lightsaber : Wow... That is a trivial fraction. What is the overall connecting fraction (including domestic Turkey connections)? Might indeed. Due to tightening i
86 leftyboarder : Int'l-Dom connections are a further 16% of total traffic. All conx make up 39% of TK traffic. 61% is O&D.
87 PanHAM : If half of that 61% O&D and 39% connex traffic is medium to high yield than it is overall a healthy split.
88 LAXintl : Keep in mind however that Intl-Dom connects are not only made in IST but also at stations like ESB, SAW for example. So that 16% is not indicative of
89 Turkish350XWB : MAD has been overtaken in January already. For overtaking AMS in 2013, a 20% growth should be enough. So if growth continues like in jan and feb, IST
90 lightsaber : Yes, very healthy. No wonder TK is able to expand quickly. Thank you for the numbers leftyboarder. Due to lagging data, I hadn't seen that. Do you ha
91 Turkish350XWB : Well it is my calculation based on the very important assumption that MAD has not grown in jan. I think this is true. MAD pax for 2012 is 45,195,014.
92 Post contains images lightsaber : Out of curiosity, where did these numbers come from? That was the link I was looking for. I think your assumption MAD did not grow is quite safe. Lig
93 toxtethogrady : "I'd add DFW to that list too." And IAH. A lot is going to depend on who the winning consortium is. TAV, in addition to being local, probably has the
94 Post contains links Turkish350XWB : http://www.dhmiata.gov.tr >Istatistikler on the left side...
95 tkfan : Your assumptions were right, MAD even lost quite some pax. MAD Jan 2.909.725 -13.0% Feb 2.636.544 -16.2% IST Jan 3.570.582 +21.2% Feb 3.530.981 +25.4
96 Post contains images lightsaber : That is quite a quick 'leap ahead.' I assume a set of slow months as otherwise, how did they do over 47million pax in 2012 Jan-Nov per Wikipedia? Whi
97 tkfan : Its not easy to overtake AMS so soon. Amstertam has a nice infrastructure and plenty room for more volumes. you are right, it seems its a seasonal th
98 turkishsky : Assuming that IST will grow a massive 20% to 25% each month of this year, figures should be between: JUN 4,852,538 and 5,054,727 JUL 5,201,566 and 5,
99 tkfan : Its not a given, that IST can sustain 20-25% grow rate in summer... Atatürk Airport suffered a lot last summer. and I doubt although if any enlargem
100 Post contains links JoKeR : That is one big airport! But TK needs it if it is to continue growing at the current pace. But airport alone will not solve the other major problem -
101 Post contains links leftyboarder : Don't .know if they did any rework as that is pretty much how I've heard it for decades.. After all it is a Turkish folk song as well...: http://en.w
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