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Australian Aviation Thread # 68  
User currently offlineallrite From Australia, joined Aug 2007, 2237 posts, RR: 5
Posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 21834 times:

Welcome to the Australia Aviation Thread #68 in the midst of some big announcements.

Previously we discussed:

* Predictions for Melbourne
* Royal Brunei to keep MEL over BNE putting politics ahead of logic
* Virgin Australia moves to Sabre, replaces DJ with VA
* CZ reinstates PER-CAN, announces BNE
* JQ breakdown in HNL
* Issues with PER redevelopment
* JQ, QF and the 787 issues
* Additional 5 717s for QantasLink
* Weather related diversions
* Could QF base aircraft in Dubai for flights EK is constrained from flying?
* QF loses NZ ground handling contract to Toll Dnata
* QF removes its code from JQ domestic flights between major capitals
* Discussion of Qantas special liveries
* MH adding flights to BNE
* TransAsia rumoured to fly to Australia and NZ
* QF announces changes to Asian network, to cease FRA in April.

Happy flying.


Applying insanity to normality
203 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 21763 times:

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 205):
So the new Asian strategy is deferred another 3 years and even that may be optimnistic given the 787-9s in 2016 are no certainty given the current dramas. Surely QF understands that SQ,CX and the Chinese carriers are not going to sit on their hands for 3 years. By 2016, there will be litlle of worth for QF to consider that is not already serviced.

Entirely agreed. If QF wants to resume services to India, Beijing and Seoul they'd better do it before 2016! It's also worthwhile noting that nowhere is there anything more ambitious for the 789. No resumption of SFO, FCO or a new service to a place like GRU. It's going to be really interesting to see what happens when;

- We know the outcome of the current Italy traffic rights. If QF loses 200 seats a week to Virgin the only way they can make it up is be commencing services. If they lose half of the remainder, 300 seats per week, again the only way to make it up is to actually fly it;
- The SAA codeshare finishes. The cynic in me thinks that QF will entirely abandon the PER-South Africa market and concentrate on SYD.

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 205):
Truly bizarre ceasing PER-HKG!!! You can still earn FF points on CX but CX must be wrapped, Likewise SQ will gladly accept the ADL pax heading to Asia.

The cynic in me is waiting for the Jetstar announcement.........


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25693 posts, RR: 85
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 21719 times:
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Quoting sydscott (Reply 1):
If QF wants to resume services to India, Beijing and Seoul they'd better do it before 2016!

Will they have the aircraft? I thought (could be wrong) the 787's weren't coming until 2016.

But I wonder if anything can be carved in granite with that aircraft and I'm wondering if there is a Plan B.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 21679 times:

[quote=mariner,reply=2]Will they have the aircraft? I thought (could be wrong) the 787's weren't coming until 2016.

But I wonder if anything can be carved in granite with that aircraft and I'm wondering if there is a Plan B.

I think the Plan B is already in place - instead of the A332's coming from JQ back to Domestic, they go to International instead. The A332 has plenty of range to do India, China, Korea and most of the rest of the region from Australia while the 767's, with the IPADS etc, are more than adequate for the domestic trunk network. It may be less efficient to keep them around but if QF wants to do it, they've got the capability.

Otherwise, and I actually think this is a good idea, QF could obtain some 737-900ER's and use them on the East Coast trunk routes while they split the A332's coming from Jetstar between International and Domestic. The 4 JQ A332's with the lighter floors could come back to Domestic along with a couple of others while the balance are upgraded to A380 style and go International. That kills two birds with 1 stone while allowing QF to keep a simplified domestic fleet and retiring the 767's.


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25693 posts, RR: 85
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 21665 times:
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Quoting sydscott (Reply 3):
I think the Plan B is already in place - instead of the A332's coming from JQ back to Domestic, they go to International instead.

Sounds good to me.

I actually meant a slightly broader Plan B - a few more A330's - but I'll go with your versions of it, for now.  

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 21550 times:

Quoting mariner (Reply 4):
I actually meant a slightly broader Plan B - a few more A330's - but I'll go with your versions of it, for now

I'm entirely with you Mariner! I think a few more A330's couldn't hurt given the problems with the 787 program.


User currently offlinetullamarine From Australia, joined Aug 1999, 1638 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 21527 times:

Quoting sydscott (Reply 5):
I think a few more A330's couldn't hurt given the problems with the 787 program.

Only problem is Airbus has no available slots on their A330 line in the short-term.

They could approach EK who is rumoured to be reducing their A332 fleet as new 77Ws arrive but these are RR powered, not GE powered like the existing QF fleet and VA's experience with the ex-EK A332s has not been a happy one!!



717,721/2,732/3/4/5/7/8/9,742/3/4,752/3,762/3,772,W,310,320/1,332/3,388,DC9,DC10,F28,F100,142,143,E90,CR2,D82/3/4,SF3,AT
User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25693 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 21508 times:
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Quoting sydscott (Reply 5):
I think a few more A330's couldn't hurt given the problems with the 787 program.

I think it is close to essential, but maybe I'm a tad more wary (cynical?) about the 787 deliveries than most.

Every time AJ sings the praises of the aircraft, I wonder when he'll wake up and smell the coffee. It can only change the game when it's flying - and it ain't.

I think the same of Air New Zealand and the only way I can explain it is with the analyst Richard Aboulafia's comment: "the drug-like rush of the 787."

It seems to be a tough addiction to break. As I said in the other thread, it is astonishing to me that the then management of Qantas, supposedly hard-headed business people, went doolalley and bet a large part of the farm on so much new technology - and didn't have a back-up plan.

mariner

[Edited 2013-02-03 22:28:26]


aeternum nauta
User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 21447 times:

Quoting mariner (Reply 7):
Every time AJ sings the praises of the aircraft, I wonder when he'll wake up and smell the coffee. It can only change the game when it's flying - and it ain't.

I have a friend who is constantly singing the praises of how wonderful her husband is. One of my less than tolerant friends, admittedly when he was drunk, asked her if she kept repeating herself to convince us or to try and convince herself. I see Alan Joyce's comments about the 787 in the same light.  
Quoting tullamarine (Reply 6):
Only problem is Airbus has no available slots on their A330 line in the short-term.

Given QF is a substantial Airbus operator, if they needed them I'll bet Airbus could find them. I'd go as far to say that QF should cancel a couple of the A380's they have deferred and convert them to A330's. That works well for Airbus, who has orders now, and for QF taking A380's deferred to 2020 off of their order book. I doubt QF would take second hand aircraft that don't have commonality with the existing fleet.


User currently online9MMPD From Australia, joined Oct 2005, 286 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 21445 times:

Quoting sydscott (Reply 8):
I doubt QF would take second hand aircraft that don't have commonality with the existing fleet.

VH-OEB, VH-OEC, VH-OED, VH-ZXA, VH-ZXB, VH-ZXC, VH-ZXD, VH-ZXE, VH-ZXF & VH-ZXG.

There is precedent.


User currently offlinesydscott From Australia, joined Oct 2003, 3189 posts, RR: 20
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 21392 times:

Quoting 9MMPD (Reply 9):
There is precedent.

Let me re-phrase to "I doubt they would do it again". Considering they are getting rid of the ex BA 767's and 2 of the first 744's to be retired were bought second hand, and were apparently problematic to maintain, I'd say it's not an experiment that QF will want to repeat!


User currently offlineFlyingsottsman From Australia, joined Oct 2010, 567 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 21296 times:

Quoting sydscott (Reply 1):
Quoting tullamarine (Reply 205):
Truly bizarre ceasing PER-HKG!!! You can still earn FF points on CX but CX must be wrapped, Likewise SQ will gladly accept the ADL pax heading to Asia.

The cynic in me is waiting for the Jetstar announcement.........

Yes I tend to agree JQ are just waiting in the wings to take over these routes. It does amaze me how QF can just give up citys in its own back yard to the competition. Perth is a city on its own with a large ex pat english population over there most of the mining HQ's are located over there you would think there would be enough buisness for QF out of Perth alone. I am sure both SQ and CX must be rubbing their hands together. Why hasnt QF created an Indian Ocean network out of Perth? Holiday places like the Seychelles, Mauritius, Madagascar. If the codeshare with SAA ends operate Perth/Joburg, even the Maldives all from Perth I am sure they could make money some how all from Perth make Perth a West Coast hub.


User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 21162 times:

Am I the only one who finds it absolutely hilarious that EK and SQ can manage to fill ginourmous Boeing 777 aircraft 3-4 x daily and offer 21-28 weekly flights to a single destination - while all QF will now offer PER passengers is a daily Singapore service? I thought we'd see an INCREASE in Asian flying, perhaps bringing DPS and CGK back to QF mainline, heck even the return of Tokyo to strengthen JQ Japan. Absolutely pathetic if you ask me. This is why I'm a proud Singapore Airlines frequent flier. Bright days ahead for all the Asian airlines flying into WA.

User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25693 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 21128 times:
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Quoting Ben175 (Reply 12):
This is why I'm a proud Singapore Airlines frequent flier. Bright days ahead for all the Asian airlines flying into WA.

Why should Qantas offer more flights if you're so determined to fly with Singapore?

It's true of any airline - use it or lose it. You can't have it both ways.

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5011 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 21103 times:

There are 4 phases to be announced, today's was phase 1...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineFlyingsottsman From Australia, joined Oct 2010, 567 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 21086 times:

Yeah well I bet the South Australians and West Australians dont think much of the 1st phase.

User currently offlineTN486 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 941 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 21063 times:

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 15):

LOL, well said sir.



remember the t shirt "I own an airline"on the front - "qantas" on the back
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5011 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 21047 times:

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 15):

No need to shoot the messenger!

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineFlyingsottsman From Australia, joined Oct 2010, 567 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 21018 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 17):
No need to shoot the messenger!

LoL No you are very safe my friend no bullets here EK413  


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5011 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 20992 times:

Quoting Flyingsottsman (Reply 18):

Quoting EK413 (Reply 17):
No need to shoot the messenger!

LoL No you are very safe my friend no bullets here EK413

Hopefully next 3 phases come with better news for South & West Australians...

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineSYDSpotter From Australia, joined Oct 2012, 259 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 20895 times:

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 12):
Am I the only one who finds it absolutely hilarious that EK and SQ can manage to fill ginourmous Boeing 777 aircraft 3-4 x daily and offer 21-28 weekly flights to a single destination - while all QF will now offer PER passengers is a daily Singapore service? I thought we'd see an INCREASE in Asian flying, perhaps bringing DPS and CGK back to QF mainline, heck even the return of Tokyo to strengthen JQ Japan. Absolutely pathetic if you ask me. This is why I'm a proud Singapore Airlines frequent flier. Bright days ahead for all the Asian airlines flying into WA

No, its called a different business model. SQ, EK, CX etc are 'hub carriers' whereas QF is effectively a point to point carrier.

Lets take PER as an example. SQ flying into PER not only carries those flying direct from PER-SIN (i.e. O&D) but also connecting/transit traffic (e.g. those flying from PER who want to fly into Paris,London, Beijing, Mumbai, Tokyo, Zurich etc but connect in Singapore).
Even with the previous QF 'mini-hub' in SIN, QF's PER-SIN flight was effectively comprised of 2 categories of passengers (those going to LHR/FRA and connecting on the QF LHR/FRA services and those flying just into Singapore). Compare that with SQ, who can connect the PER traffic with their entire network in Asia/Sub-continent and Europe.

In terms of DPS/CGK going back to QF mainline, ain't going to happen. They are tourist/VFR markets and will never be high yielding enough to support a QF service.



319_320_321_332_333_388 / 734_737_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W
User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 20858 times:

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 20):
No, its called a different business model. SQ, EK, CX etc are 'hub carriers' whereas QF is effectively a point to point carrier.


And QF is the national carrier of Australia - Australia is not Sydney.


User currently offlineSYDSpotter From Australia, joined Oct 2012, 259 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 20849 times:

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 21):
And QF is the national carrier of Australia - Australia is not Sydney.

It may be the national carrier but it's purpose is not to serve every city out of Australia, but it is to run an airline profitably. If that means certain markets/cities don't get served then so be it.

And let's not go down the route of QF is always so Sydney 'centric'. There's a good reason why Sydney gets most of the traffic, it's because that's where the greatest demand is. One only needs to look at the number and frequency (and size of airplane) of all the other airlines that fly into SYD vs MEL/BNE/ADL/PER and it's no coincidence that QF is not the only airline which focuses the majority of their ops at SYD.

If the other capital cities could support direct services (i.e. make money and generate a return), then QF would be operating those. QF not operating certain services is not because they're brain dead but rather the route isn't sustainable.

**Btw, Yes I am from Sydney and I'm not trying to turn this into a mine is bigger than your's contest.

[Edited 2013-02-04 05:26:44]


319_320_321_332_333_388 / 734_737_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W
User currently offlineBen175 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 719 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 20794 times:

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 22):
One only needs to look at the number and frequency (and size of airplane) of all the other airlines that fly into SYD vs MEL/BNE/ADL/PER and it's no coincidence that QF is not the only airline which focuses the majority of their ops at SYD.
SQ and EK's frequency to PER and SYD pretty much match, obviously SYD gets the A380's but, in EK's case, that's simply because PER's management is ludacris.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 22):
If the other capital cities could support direct services (i.e. make money and generate a return), then QF would be operating those. QF not operating certain services is not because they're brain dead but rather the route isn't sustainable.

The twice daily PER-SIN rotation has been profitable. Many occasions I have booked a PER-SIN flight only to find that both flights are sold out and QF wants to route me via Sydney (ha-ha). Sure, a generous amount of feed will be lost with SIN-LHR/FRA leaving, but if Alan Joyce knows how to run an airline and isn't talking smack (who am I kidding), new demand should be generated through an increase in cooperation with QF's Asian partners and a better schedule alignment. This proposed "Asian expansion" is complete BS for WA, like always. I highly doubt we'll see any new destinations added in the next "four phases" either. I'm not demanding QF operate flights to every Asian capital, but HKG three times a week is a vital route, unless they want to pass even more of their traffic to CX.

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 22):
**Btw, Yes I am from Sydney and I'm not trying to turn this into a mine is bigger than your's contest.

Oh don't worry, us in the West have Qatar!   

No disrespect to you, but I don't think you understand simply because you have the luxury of Qantas' extensive and expansive hub at your doorstep. Saying PER cannot sustain anything more than a flimsy A330 to Singapore makes no logical sense when almost every other established airline in PER has doubled or even tripled their capacity within the last 12-24 months. Yes, EK and SQ capture alot of connecting traffic, but there is significant O&D demand for Singapore (it's one of Australia's most travelled international routes) and Hong Kong. Qantas' cuts to the PER network have not gone unnoticed, many people over here believe QF is utterly useless and overpriced with their two (and in many cases, three) stop journies to anywhere in Europe but LHR. I used to be very patriotic about my flag carrier, but AJ seriously needs to go. Pronto.

[Edited 2013-02-04 08:08:23]

[Edited 2013-02-04 08:11:17]

User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25693 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 20750 times:
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Quoting Ben175 (Reply 23):
Saying PER cannot sustain anything more than a flimsy A330 to Singapore makes no logical sense when almost every other established airline in PER has doubled or even tripled their capacity within the last 12-24 months.

And there you have the answer - or a large part of it.

Australians have been flocking to the ME/Asian carriers (for whatever reason and price may be the biggest) but then complain if Qantas cuts service.

I'm not sure why "use it or lose it" is so hard to understand. If you want more Qantas at PER you have to use it.

All the airline can do is offer - it can't actually force people to part with their money.

mariner



aeternum nauta
25 gemuser : Would you like to prove that? QF ceased being the "National Carrier" in the 1990s when the government sold it. Its now just another profit driven com
26 Ben175 : You're pretty much saying you expect WA passengers to fork out hundreds of extra dollars and add ridiculous backtracking/valuable hours to an itinera
27 mariner : No, I am not saying anything like that. I'm saying that an airline can only offer - if people choose not to fly it, or fly others instead, there isn'
28 sydscott : The QF issue at PER is a couple of things as I see it; 1. The QF domestic situation in Perth has never been stronger. QF has a large share of transco
29 mariner : That may be part of the problem - perception. Jetstar has achieved what it set out to be, the brand does not carry national connotations. Too success
30 Post contains images tullamarine : Jetstar operating PER-CGK has had the perverse effect of making Garuda desirable.
31 Post contains images mariner : I've never had a problem on Garuda. I like the airline. Then again, I've never had a problem on Jetstar. You blokes must be really, really picky. mar
32 Ben175 : Exactly. I have no idea why JQ haven't looked into flights from PER to KUL, BKI, HKT, SUB or KCH. We've even got PR launching PER-DRW-MNL with an A32
33 sydscott : As much as I agree with Mariner, I think there is room for QF Mainline 737-800 service on CGK. That's what it used to be prior to Jetstar taking over
34 mariner : Maybe, even probably, but I assume there's a reason they switched it to Jetstar and - I'm guessing - the reason is yield. It's a curious problem. Ind
35 EK413 : Are you offering to step in, take charge of a well known icon & return it to profitability again without making the necessary changes which AJ ha
36 Ben175 : Why don't you have a scroll through the wall posts on Qantas' Facebook page... you might come to realise that to the people of WA and SA, Qantas is n
37 Post contains images AirNiugini : Garuda is bloody good these days mate, you should give them a go next time you head off to South East Asia or Europe... People on facebook say outrag
38 Flyingsottsman : Every time the subject of QF and routes comes up the "Sydney vs the rest of Australia" comes up, its been like that for decades and will continue to b
39 Post contains images SYDSpotter : I could list a number of carriers that fly into SYD and not PER, but I'll let you have your moment in the sun As per the previous post by the others
40 9MMPD : We are close the 2 million now (curently 1.9) thats alot of travellers to forsake. Just hope AJ can get QF International back on its feet and then us
41 Post contains images mariner : If you're trying to sell Perth and Western Australia, you lost me right there. If you want Qantas to be a "national carrier" you'd better push your m
42 EK413 : I never said "Australian icon"... I said "well known icon"... As for those comments on Facebook it comes from those which don't understand how the in
43 Post contains images Sydscott : Personally I doubt that. I think the reason has more to do with Jetstar being able to use the Australian beyond rights into Singapore to connect in w
44 mariner : Maybe. If aircraft use is the key to it, that that strikes me as entirely valid, too. It is all Qantas Group. mariner
45 RyanairGuru : I've always thought this, and still do. In fact I always wondered where the 757 went with QF. A 757 style aircraft (739MAX or 321NEO) would be perfec
46 fiscal : Unlike some I can understand the rationale behind the reduced services out of Perth, but I am personally more concerned with the redemption status for
47 airbusa322 : Tiger to launch: SYD-ASP SYD-CNS MEL-ASP MEL-MCY Pending Announcement from the company.
48 Sydscott : Personally, if I was travelling in business I'd go with CX over QF, and EK, anyday. But I do take your point and it does seem counter intuitive to re
49 Post contains links fiscal : Funny how this topic was talking about PER-CGK http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/...-june/story-e6frg2qc-1226571493812 Seems Garuda has beaten us to
50 Post contains images qf002 : The problem is that PER-HKG is really a spoke-spoke route for QF. They are almost entirely dependant on local market traffic to support their service
51 Sydscott : For Transcon I agree however for flights in the Golden Triangle and to Adelaide that are currently a 767, a 737-900ER or a 739MAX would seem perfect
52 Post contains images RyanairGuru : Me too Funny you should mention that. People in the USA said that when UA started using the 757 for PremiumService... and when DL chose the 757 when
53 Post contains images Ben175 : And the increase in PER flights from the Asian carriers begins. Garuda has been operating a triangular CGK-PER-DPS-CGK for years, and used to operate
54 AirNiugini : Wouldn't that be the same for the BNE to HKG route? I'm not very knowledgeable about QF's HKG aspirations, but what connections/ partners do QF now h
55 Ben175 : Garuda's PER-CGK schedule: GA0724 CGK-PER 1030 1550 738 GA0725 PER-CGK 1740 2115 738 The website is playing up a little, so not sure on frequency - I
56 ZKOKQ : I dont get why everyone is banging on about markets being pulled. The fact is QF was finding parts of its network unprofitable. So they done what is n
57 Post contains links and images EK413 : Very well said! Other news... Sydney Airport given more time for grand plan Date: February 05 2013 The federal Transport Minister, Anthony Albanese,
58 RyanairGuru : That sounds incredibly political, as though Albanese wanted to carry it into the election (with his electorate nearby) and also get to tinker with it
59 Sydscott : The reason we're "banging on about" it is because, realistically, QF never really gave these markets the chance they needed to be successful. They sa
60 RyanairGuru : This is where the decision to scrap PER-HKG makes the least sense. Even if the route is loss making on an absolute basis, it is surprising that no on
61 Post contains links Sydscott : Some Virgin news for a change - The ACCC is concerned that Virgin taking a majority stake in Tiger might be anti-competitive. http://www.businessday.c
62 Dan23 : Does anyone here know the status of 744 VH-OJT? She has been at Avalon (assumed to be for maintenance) since 7th December. This comes shortly after sp
63 6thfreedom : No real surprises there. 3 of the 4 routes are resumption of services. the only new flight is SYD-ASP which was not operated previously
64 EK413 : Some interesting flight news for Dubai... I'm curious if the move has anything to do with QF moving their hub from Singapore to Dubai...? I understand
65 Post contains links QF175 : It appears that Virgin Australia has almost completed the Business Class installation on its E190 fleet. According to Flightaware, VH-ZPM returned to
66 ZKOKQ : Just because the routes are pulled early, doesn't mean forward bookings were crash hot, once again, the service was there, but people using the servi
67 Post contains images EK413 : I've answered my own question not to worry KQ will still operate NBO-BKK daily... it's just that the flight will be reallocated to CAN to become a da
68 mariner : Out of interest, what happened to Air North's allocation for Indonesia? Are they dormant or did they go back into the pot? tia. mariner
69 QF762 : Interesting to note with the QF BNE-SIN changes, the daily service is still scheduled as a 744 up until at least July with the corrected times. (I wou
70 RyanairGuru : I agree, especially with PER going down to 1x meaning that there will be a spare 333 floating around the system. Is anyone aware of any 333 heavy mai
71 QF175 : The reason EK has amended their schedule from a 0230L to a 2330L departure ex-Brisbane is due to RWY01/19 resurfacing works taking place overnight du
72 QF762 : Oh, OK... That makes sense. And here I was thinking QF and EK were going all out with their co-operation! I didn't realise they marketed it as same d
73 QF175 : Looks to be a good year ahead for Brisbane and Melbourne Airports. BRISBANE Commenced or Announced - Daily Etihad BNE-SIN-AUH services - Daily Qantas
74 JQflightie : I think that is completely wrong, you try and get on a GA flight in J/C, further to that, the rtn price for a J/C ticket is nearly $2450 on all 3 fli
75 Ben175 : Following GA, CX and MH are also announcing increases in PER services.
76 EK413 : Sydney bound flights have been placed in holding patterns with SQ211, SQ7286 circling in the outer west... The QF44 was holding but has landed and so
77 TN486 : same happening in the south, the standard doughnuts on ac coming in from MEL, holding patterns to the west pf Canberra. Also note QF2904, Antarctic c
78 EK413 : Is MEL experiencing any thunderstorms too...? VA883, CX139, AC33 in holding patterns at the moment... EK413[Edited 2013-02-10 01:30:46]
79 TN486 : MEL weather is cool but fine. I thought the current delays into SYD were due to the normal sunday night "quagmire". Please send some of the rain south
80 SYDSpotter : A few thunderstorms around town tonight.
81 EK413 : We going to hear about it in the news tomorrow "Sydney Airport experienced lengthy delays due to thunderstorms, decision on 2nd airport top priority"
82 BHMNONREV : I have just recently relocated from the US to Darwin to work on the Ichthys LNG project. With the number of Filipinos who work here I'm sure this fli
83 gemuser : Most if not all of that demand will be met by charter flights on behalf of the mining companies, not regular scheduled services. QF, VA and various s
84 BHMNONREV : Certainly makes sense from a cost standpoint, as it looks like all return fares from DRW are astronomical..
85 Post contains links QF175 : JQ will commence 4x weekly SYD-AYQ services in JUN13, replacing the existing daily QF 737-800 service. Schedule: SYD/AYQ 1030/1335 JQ660 Tue/Thu/Fri/S
86 QF175 : Qantas will also reportedly cancel its thrice weekly CBR-DRW service later this year..
87 Post contains links VHVXB : As result of the impending EK-QF tie up, QF has changed it baggage policy from the piece concept to the weight concept. In addition both EK and QF hav
88 fiscal : Pay Plus Points and Any Flight award redemptions are available now, but us poor Classic Awards seekers must wait until after March 31 to see what add
89 NZ107 : QF's SYD-AYQ flight is going to be a JQ flight from June.. Oh well, I guess there's still a way to get there on QF via the 717s through PER or DRW.
90 bjwonline : There are no DRW-AYQ or PER-AYQ flights. CNS is the only other destination from AYQ which is serviced by QantasLink's B717.
91 NZ107 : Whoops, mixing myself up with ASP..
92 vheca : Can anyone shed some light on what I would deem to be a diversion last night? I am located at East Sale and we have a number of MEL-NZ flights fly ove
93 RyanairGuru : I know that this is not strictly Australian related, but with US-AA finally happening I was considering what it could mean for QF. The obvious answer
94 gemuser : One far less obvious area is personal relationships between QF & the merged AA. As I read it most of the new executive will be ex US rather than
95 RyanairGuru : Interesting point, and one I'd overlooked. While the senior management team seems to be coming from US, it is speculated on other threads that there
96 zkokq : Dixon had a tongue and cheek comment targeted at Alan Joyce and actually agreeing with him on something today, regarding the Aussie dollar high now be
97 TN486 : I did a historical search on Flightradar24. Around about the time you mentioned traffic around MEL was pretty hectic. Flights going north were depart
98 CXfirst : Hey, does anybody know the repaint schedule for Virgin? Are they just repainting during heavy maintenance? Of all VA aircraft, the only ones I can thi
99 TN486 : and also a 190 VH ZPQ. Repainted from the AFL livery.[Edited 2013-02-17 22:03:26]
100 QF175 : 777-300ER VH-VPD VH-VPH VH-VOZ (work in progress) 737-700 VH-VBY 737-800 (AU) VH-VOK VH-VOQ VH-VUF VH-VUG VH-VUY VH-VUZ 737-800 (NZ) ZK-PBA ZK-PBB ZK
101 QF175 : It appears Philippine Airlines may be about to announce their long-awaited flights to Brisbane, Darwin and Perth. There's reportedly been an ad runnin
102 Post contains images EK413 : EK413
103 vheca : Thank you, Sir. Have been looking skyward since to see if patterns had returned to normal (and they have). Cheers Vheca
104 Ben175 : Very interested to see the schedule for PR's new services!
105 QFBA : Does anyone know any new routes VA have on the rador from Brisbane? I was talking today to a rep who indicated they're about make an announcement and
106 Post contains links EK413 : Singapore Airlines May 2013 Australia Service Reduction As per 19FEB13 GDS timetable and inventory display, Singapore Airlines is reducing Australia o
107 Post contains links and images QF175 : I think it will perhaps be the announcement of new ATR routes or increased frequencies on existing routes (Emerald, Rockhampton et al - Virgin Austra
108 eaglefarm4 : Another AN 124F departed BNE again this morning.This is the 10th in the past 5 months . Alliance Airlines next Fokker 70 VH-QQW has commenced it's del
109 TN486 : Just an an observation - VH OJS (a 744) has just arrived at Avalon from Sydney - presume maintenance.
110 Post contains links QF175 : Air Canada - Future Australian Services Travel Today - News Article
111 Post contains links ZKOKQ : BAC's Managing director and CEO's retort today to the criticism they have faced over the funding for the new runway. http://www.couriermail.com.au/new
112 RyanairGuru : Honestly, I'm not surprised. MEL definitely has more traffic right now, but - from my understanding - that is mostly outbound from Australia. Between
113 Post contains links EK413 : She is about to head across the Pacific as the QF11 which was rescheduled as a 18:30 departure... http://fr24.com/QFA11 EK413[Edited 2013-02-21 00:13
114 Post contains links vhqpa : It's also notable that the current bilateral agreement between Australia and Canada restricts the designated Canadian airline to Sydney and one addit
115 gemuser : True, BUT Australia COULD allow extra bilateral flights to a third city. Cue the Victorian & Queensland pollies. Gemuser
116 Post contains links Ben175 : Interesting to see that now QF is reducing PER-SIN to daily, JQ/3K is increasing their daily PER-SIN with a variation of 11-13 weekly services from Ap
117 Post contains links mariner : I have a couple of questions about the Qantas/Emirates code share, both stemming from the list in this link. They may have been asked and answered her
118 gemuser : Mariner I think this means stopover ie a stop of more than 24 hours, are not allowed. I think you can do a same day connection to those cities, other
119 sydscott : LOL can you imagine Qantas letting them get away with that? If the Canadians want access beyond the current treaty, they'll have to trade for it. Cue
120 EK413 : Hopefully the decision is made in early March as opposed to late March therefore allowing QF/EK to make the necessary adjustments to the timetable...
121 gemuser : sorry Sydscott, despite what many people think the days when QF effectively controlled this are long gone. Yes they have influence, the Federal Treas
122 RyanairGuru : But - and let's be realistic here - would QF actually fly LAX-YYZ? I credit the Government to see straight through such a request, and consider the e
123 Post contains images mariner : Oh, sure - I assumed you can make a straight connection at DXB. I'm still scratching my head a wee bit about this and now see that I left CAI off tha
124 Zkpilot : another one I haven't seen on the list which EK does fly to is Malta. Despite its small size I would have thought QF would have put a code share on t
125 DavidByrne : Am I correct in recalling that QF itself flew to Malta for a brief period way, way back?
126 gemuser : I don't think so, at least as a scheduled service, but migrant charters on behalf of the Dept of Immigration ring a bell, certainly from Italy so may
127 sydscott : Not really. I suggest you look at what has happened between Hong Kong and Australia as a template for what Australia will ask for. Essentially CX &am
128 thegeek : Sounds like a deal that the Canadians couldn't say no to though - they get what they want in exchange for something we don't really want, but might w
129 mariner : As a non-stop? I can't imagine it would be a huge market. We know they had the bright idea to fly it through LAX - as YYZ-LAX-SYD - using a broadmind
130 flylonghaul : I just landed in SYD on QF865 after a 3 hour delay. 2 things that caught my attention when we landed. 1. There are 2 UA 747s parked overnight. One was
131 TN486 : Flt 840 arrived from MEL at 1435. It was due to dep for LAX at around 1600, however it was cancelled. That was the one, I suspect, that was in maint
132 EK413 : Just another day & another UA flight cancellation... A UA flight was cancelled on Friday too... EK413
133 sydscott : That got stomped on because LAX isn't a stopover point in the Canada/Australia bilateral, it's only SFO or HNL that is. Once AC figured out they coul
134 flylonghaul : So then I'm guessing that the cancelled UA flight from Friday is still sitting in SYD then. That would answer why there were 2 aircraft overnighting.
135 thegeek : SYD-SFO-YYZ isn't a huge deviation from SYD-LAX-YYZ. Only 12nm is the difference great circle. I'm sure the reason they didn't fly this is because of
136 Post contains images EK413 : Certainly would answer the question... Guess who picked up the loyal UA passengers... QF EK413
137 legacyins : The bilateral only allows SFO/HNL as a connection to Canada. AC has rights to SYD via SFO/HNL.
138 sydscott : At one point QF wanted to use LAX as a stopover point into Canada. The Canadians said no because the treaty says SFO or HNL. (Hence QF doing SYD-SFO-
139 EK413 : Anyone able to tell me how much time I should give myself for a connecting flight from JFK to IAH... I'm flying QF107 LAX to JFK & since the 2 car
140 eta unknown : JFK? Allow plenty of time- 2 hours at least. My only comment (not that I should judge) is LAX-JFK-IAH is not the greatest idea- a lot of unnecessary t
141 thegeek : Perhaps because they believe they could make money on it? Just because there is another *A carrier on the route doesn't mean they aren't allowed to c
142 EK413 : Cheers... I know my routing involves backtracking but its by choice as I want to fly QF... My connecting flight in JFK is on DL... EK413
143 Post contains links EK413 : This would answer your question concerning the QF B738 VH-VXG in the hangers sporting the "Bring it On" banner... http://www.rugby.com.au/News/NewsAr
144 RyanairGuru : If you are connecting QF-DL then I would allow at least 3 hours. QF won't through check you luggage, so you will have to pick it up and change termin
145 EK413 : The QF107 arrives into JFK 1635 & my connecting flight DL4127 departs 1955... I have a gutt feeling I'm really pushing it... EK413
146 RyanairGuru : At 3h20 you should be OK. Your best bet is to get the AirTrain from Terminal 7 to Terminal 2/3. It runs about every 5 minutes off the top of my head,
147 SYDSpotter : Could you have done SYD-DFW and then done a land transfer to IAH/Houston (if you wanted to fly QF)? Or was the LAX-JFK-IAH option still cheaper?
148 Post contains images EK413 : Thanks for scaring the crap outta me! Lol It came down to class I wanted to travel... J/C from SYD-LAX-JFK... To go via DFW it would've meant Y/C fro
149 Post contains images SYDSpotter : Gotcha, if you're flying J instead of Y, then understand the routing. Plus you're getting more airlines/airline types into your itinerary which I und
150 EK413 : You hit the nail in the head... It's just another day in an A.netters world... EK413
151 QF175 : Virgin Australia has just announced it will introduce the A330 on Brisbane-Perth flights from May, with double daily weekday services (0845 and 2015 d
152 RyanairGuru : Interesting route choice, clearly to do with mining. I was thinking that 3x daily sounded quite a high frequency, but then I saw that QF operate up t
153 eaglefarm4 : They now have to wait till the Transport authority deregulates Roma and there will be at least 2-3 flights a day on this route as well for Virgin.
154 CXfirst : Just trying to figure out how they'll do things. In May, the 08:45 flight arrives in PER at 12:25 pm, and the 20:15 flight arrives at 23:55. Around m
155 Post contains images TruemanQLD : Nothing? NOTHING? I would have thought given how quickly people post bad QF profit that this would already be up. Profit for the ever-conquering, fla
156 RyanairGuru : Wow, I had completely missed that announcement. I agree with your sentiment. While it is true that 1H FY11/12 isn't the best comparison given the iss
157 QFVHOQA : The domestic fare war seems to be hurting QF more so than VA at the moment. QF domestic profit was down $110m, but VA domestic profit was down $37m,
158 Zkpilot : A lot of VA's money is being invested in significant growth. QF is barely growing domestically and is shrinking internationally (except JQ et al). We
159 sydscott : What we're seeing is as a result of the capacity way. There has been quite alot of criticism of QF drawing a 65% marketshare line in the sand but for
160 EK413 : Appears Emirates are bumping capacity on the Sydney route with the QF/EK alliance kicking off in a few weeks... EK doubling A380 services to SYD effec
161 sydscott : The money invested in growth doesn't necessarily mean declining profits. he reverse should be the case in any normal business. Lets not also forget t
162 mariner : Capital expenditure is separate from the profit/loss account, although a company can rein in cap-ex to conserve capital. I think a lot of people unde
163 EK413 : Agreed and agreed! He certainly showed who's boss & who's running the show! EK413
164 tullamarine : I bet they wish they'd ordered the 787. Apparently it is great for the bottom line particularly if you're not flying it yet!!! I'm not a huge fan of
165 Post contains images mariner : The highest turnover rate of CEO's in the world. I'm not sure that it is something that Australia should skite about. mariner
166 sydscott : In relation to Qantas lets not forget a few things in terms of CEO's; - James Strong was CEO from 1993 to 2001 - roughly 7 years - Geoff Dixon was CE
167 mariner : I hope he does, or even longer. The problem with the fashion for revolving CEO's is that there can't be a long term vision, or scarcely a long term s
168 RyanairGuru : I see where you coming from, to take another example of Gordon Bethune who did 7 or 8 years at CO, turned it from a basket case to a fantastic airlin
169 qf002 : This is excellent. I'm a little surprised that they chose to upgauge this flight rather than the one via BKK though, as it seems to get pretty empty
170 EK413 : So am I... Emirates are well known for the minimal ground time for their aircraft... I would've thought EK418/ EK419 to be up gauged as you already m
171 Post contains links and images mariner : Mr, Bethune didn't actually "stand down" - I mean, he did, but it's more true to say that he was forced out. It involves another super-ego - David Bo
172 EK413 : Thank god that takeover failed! Who knows the shape QF would be in today OR perhaps the airline would be none existent... EK413
173 Post contains links and images EK413 : View Large View MediumPhoto © Andrew Coggan EK413
174 tullamarine : Though as a shareholder, I would've received 3 times what my shares are worth today. The one part of AJ's reign I dislike most is that he has oversee
175 SYDSpotter : But this is just the 6am departure out of SYD though isn't it. The inbound from DXB gets pretty full though doesn't it? Yup will be on the ground for
176 EK413 : That makes 2 of us... I was offered top dollar for my shares too BUT I wasn't a fan of the takeover bid... Takes no brainier what was planned... I'm
177 Post contains images zkojq : Anyone know what VH-VPE is doing in Victorville? What issues have they had?
178 EK413 : The product offerings on the ex-EK A332's is a mix match with NEW product offerings on the VH-XFC,D,XFE...? EK413
179 Ben175 : What happened to PAL's announcement about PER, DRW and BNE they have been advertising throughout local papers?
180 eaglefarm4 : Still awaiting approval for PER .Starting June now.
181 sydscott : That's kind of easy to answer surely? Qantas as we know it would be bankrupt, the fleet sold off and Jetstar and the FF business would have been floa
182 tullamarine : I don't think a CEO could claim success by running this argument. Over the past 5 years QF is in the bottom 20% of ASX listed stocks for shareholder
183 mariner : Qantas shareholders are far from alone in that - the last few years have decimated many airline share prices around the world. But a true argument. A
184 sydscott : I'd go further than that and say the last few years have wiped out quite a few airline shareholders, just look at the US airlines, while others have
185 Post contains links mariner : I was thinking of the US airlines in particular. But also the money printing airlines, like Southwest, which used to be considered a "widows and orph
186 flylonghaul : Thanks for posting. Looks good. Funny that I thought it had been blue writing. Must have been the lack of sleep!
187 Quokkas : Just in time for the Labour Day public holiday, Perth Airport’s new $120 million Domestic Terminal (Terminal 2) will open this Saturday (2 March 201
188 RyanairGuru : I have you an answer... As EK413 pointed out, there were two cancellations. I don't know what happened to the Friday flight. The one you saw at the m
189 Post contains links EK413 : Innaugural Sichuan service to MEL. http://www.flickr.com/photos/brandon...in/photostream EK413
190 TN486 : Some very interesting ac movement on the eastern seaboard right now because of congestion at SYD. QF494 MEL - SYD made it to west of CBR before turnba
191 thegeek : Well if the second airport has the same curfew, like Badgery's Creek presumably would, then why would there be any difference?
192 sydscott : Presumably the second airport will be a bigger facility with more runways and therefore more slots. That would alleviate virtually all of the congest
193 QFVHOQA : Has it been said that a second airport will have the same curfew? If it ends up at Badgery's Creek the number of people affected by aircraft noise is
194 sydscott : Even if it does, if you have a couple of sets of parallel runways, the congestion problem will go away.
195 Post contains links and images EK413 : Thought I'll post a link to the hot topic plus images... http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=100368878#post100368878 EK413[Edited 2013-02-2
196 flylonghaul : Thanks for the info. Will be interesting to see if any further info surfaces about the incident. As others have stated above, you would imagine that
197 EK413 : I recommend you follow the link and have a read of everyone's in put to the 2nd airport discussion... Personally I believe the current SYD airport ca
198 Post contains links TN486 : I think this backs up Mariners earlier thoughts on the war between Virgin and QANTAS i.e that they shall find a "balance". www.businessspectator.com.a
199 EK413 : Efficiently is the word... I hate predicted text... Interesting article... Isn't VA being optimistic forecasting a $100-$150 in 2014-15... He expects
200 Post contains links QF175 : Australian Aviation Thread # 69 is now up and running...
201 flylonghaul : I'll definitely have a read. Unfortunately was limited to small patches of browsing on my phone whilst pulling some overtime.
202 The Coachman : Does anyone know the VA SYD-PER rotations get aircraft allocations? I've been keeping track of the various regos that run VA555 (since I'll be on that
203 EK413 : Be careful with phone browsing I racked up a hefty phone bill a few months ago & when I contacted my network provider guess which site contribute
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