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First DL A330 In For Interior Mods  
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 13368 times:

According to a post at FT, DL has sent in its first A330 for interior mods. The aircraft is ship 3301, an A333.

For those who haven't been following DL's product updates, the A330s will be getting Zodiac/Weber Cirrus full-flat seats in BusinessElite and B/E Aerospace Pinnacle slimline seats with winged headrests in Y. The existing Panasonic 3000i IFE system will be replaced by the more advanced and lighter weight Panasonic eX2 system, with the Eco 9i Integrated Smart Monitors in Y. All A330s should be done in 2014.

[Edited 2013-02-04 20:22:28]


The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
61 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemesaflyguy From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 3031 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 13374 times:
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As per the IFE, I cannot understand a word you just said.   That's my idiocracy at work again.

Can you answer me this:

1. Are there currently screens in the headrests?
2. WILL there be screens in the headrests?

Thanks and once again I apologize for my stupidity.                



\________(---)________/ :) World's most beautiful aircraft: 757-200, MD-88/90, E-190, A321
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7396 posts, RR: 17
Reply 2, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 13324 times:

The IFE, IIRC, is what they're offering in the 77L and 74S cabins.

It's about time. I love the 330 but DL until now really didn't do any justice with it.



次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlinedeltairlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8897 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 13242 times:

Good news to hear - I flew on the 747 a couple of weeks ago and that was the best business class seat I've flown on - went to bed right after dinner right off the coast of Russia and then woke up 9 hours later over Minnesota en route to Kennedy. Slept a lot better than on the A330 I took going over to Japan with the angled-lie flat seats.

Also a much more comfortable seat than the 777 (I also took that on this trip) - a lot more space for everything on the 747.


User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5935 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 13143 times:

Quoting mesaflyguy (Reply 1):
1. Are there currently screens in the headrests?
2. WILL there be screens in the headrests?

Yes...and Yes



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlinemichman From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 13136 times:

Quoting mesaflyguy (Reply 1):

As per the IFE, I cannot understand a word you just said.   That's my idiocracy at work again.

Can you answer me this:

1. Are there currently screens in the headrests?
2. WILL there be screens in the headrests?

They are both personal AVOD systems (yes, there are monitors in the headrest currently). The 3000i is an early generation AVOD system with a hand-based controller (no touch-screen). The eX2 system with Eco9i monitor is the lastest generation and uses a touch-screen. It also has a USB charging port.

[Edited 2013-02-04 20:54:43]

User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 13112 times:

Quoting michman (Reply 5):
However, I thought the A330's were supposed the lastest generation Panasonic Eco 9i's.

The Eco 9i is not a specific type of IFE system, it is an advanced lightweight monitor integrated into either a Weber 5751 or B/E Aerospace Pinnacle seat, which is compatible with the eFX and eX2 systems. In Y, the A330s will be getting B/E Aerospace Pinnacle seats with the Eco 9i monitors.

[Edited 2013-02-04 20:57:47]


The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7396 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 13091 times:

The current IFE offering on the 330s are the ex-NW offerings, which were some early 2000s model and were quite outdated. The new offerings are going to be highly customizable by the airline and it should be a better and more enjoyable product by the customer  


次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlineklkla From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 932 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 13034 times:

This is good to hear.

They're converting 767's 6 at a time to the new product and now starting on A330's  

Delta will be the only US airline with lie-flats that have direct aisle access on all international planes as well as coach seats with IFE across the board in the very near future.


User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 12828 times:

Why would DL replace the economy seats in the ex-NW A330's? The earliest A330 they have is from 2003, so it is really not THAT outdated. There are already screens in the seat backs and in economy there are already winged headrests. Isn't this just a huge waste of money? There's absolutely nothing wrong with the IFE and seats the 330's have now.

[Edited 2013-02-04 22:29:55]

User currently offlineMSPNWA From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1933 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 12719 times:

Nice to see them finally hit mods, but in coach it will be tough to beat the product back in the NW days. That included the comfy cloth covers and great IFE selection (and I like handsets much better than touchscreens). Since DL took over the, leather covers (which didn't match the seat well) and DL programming was a downgrade. It's too bad that something nearly 10 years old will still be as good or better depending on your preference. If I get a chance to ride on a refurbished A330, it will be interesting to see how it compares to UA's 764s in coach. Now that is one nice ride.

User currently offlinepanamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4895 posts, RR: 25
Reply 11, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 12436 times:
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Quoting klkla (Reply 8):
They're converting 767's 6 at a time to the new product and now starting on A330's

There will only be one A333 and one A332 undergoing mods this spring, at least that's the last I heard. The rest of the fleet will only start in the fall though. The 767s will continue at the current pace until June. None will be done this summer, and then will restart in September.

Quoting klkla (Reply 8):
Delta will be the only US airline with lie-flats that have direct aisle access on all international planes

Unfortunately, the 75Es (which they do use on some internationals like ATL-BSB, JFK-SNN/KEF/DKR, CDG-PHL/PIT) will not have direct aisle access when the flat beds are installed - they will still be in the 2-2 config. This is because there is no economic way to have 1-1 on the 757 in the forward cabin...

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
great IFE selection

The new IFE selection (300+ movies, for example) will be better than whatever NWA used to have. But then again, you would probably complain that you have too many choices...

[Edited 2013-02-05 03:19:53]

User currently offlinerwsea From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3091 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 12265 times:

The A330s have generally been nicer than the rest of the DL international fleet, but this is changing fast. The new business class seats and expanded IFE offerings should make things even better.

User currently offlinefloridaflyboy From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 2010 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 11947 times:

What will be the breakdown in seat count between Biz Elite, Economy Comfort, and Economy?


Good goes around!
User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 14, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 11841 times:

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
but in coach it will be tough to beat the product back in the NW days. That included the comfy cloth covers and great IFE selection (and I like handsets much better than touchscreens). Since DL took over the, leather covers (which didn't match the seat well) and DL programming was a downgrade. It's too bad that something nearly 10 years old will still be as good or better depending on your preference.

Exactly!!! Total downgrade on DL's part.


User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11495 times:

Quoting CanadianDC10 (Reply 9):
Why would DL replace the economy seats in the ex-NW A330's? The earliest A330 they have is from 2003, so it is really not THAT outdated. There are already screens in the seat backs and in economy there are already winged headrests. Isn't this just a huge waste of money? There's absolutely nothing wrong with the IFE and seats the 330's have now.

The new IFE system has far more storage capacity and weighs much less. The Eco 9i Integrated Smart Monitors cannot simply be retrofitted onto any seat that can fit a monitor; the seats (B/E Aerospace Pinnacle in this case) are customized specifically for them.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2996 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11470 times:

Quoting panamair (Reply 11):
Unfortunately, the 75Es (which they do use on some internationals like ATL-BSB, JFK-SNN/KEF/DKR, CDG-PHL/PIT) will not have direct aisle access when the flat beds are installed - they will still be in the 2-2 config.

Are they using the same type of seats that UA uses on its 757s, or something else?



Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11455 times:

Quoting FoxBravo (Reply 16):
Are they using the same type of seats that UA uses on its 757s, or something else?

They will be a modified version of the B/E Aerospace Diamond designed specifically for DL.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlinedlflynhayn From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 424 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11421 times:

Quoting panamair (Reply 11):
The new IFE selection (300+ movies, for example) will be better than whatever NWA used to have. But then again, you would probably complain that you have too many choices...

  

Quoting rwsea (Reply 12):
The A330s have generally been nicer than the rest of the DL international fleet, but this is changing fast. The new business class seats and expanded IFE offerings should make things even better.

Huh?? I go to AMS often and lately i will wait to get on that last flight on the 777 out of DTW,and even sometimes i'll chose the new refurbished 767er's which is again better IMO...


User currently offlinefanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1607 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11387 times:

Aren't the newer seats much lighter and therefore pay for themselves in fuel savings?

Could they take the old panasonic systems out of the A330 and put them in the A320s? LOL.



"FLY DELTA JETS"
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11332 times:

Quoting fanoftristars (Reply 19):
Aren't the newer seats much lighter and therefore pay for themselves in fuel savings?

Not just the seats, but the IFE system as well.

Quoting fanoftristars (Reply 19):
Could they take the old panasonic systems out of the A330 and put them in the A320s? LOL.

No. The Panasonic 3000i is a widebody-only system.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlineMaddogJT8D From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 397 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 11333 times:

Quoting fanoftristars (Reply 19):
Could they take the old panasonic systems out of the A330 and put them in the A320s? LOL.

Oh if wishing made it so, LOL! I think the A319/320 & MD-90 are on missions that are too long not to have some form of IFE.


User currently offlineairtechy From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11281 times:

I am extremely glad to see the A330 business class seats go. Being trapped by those seats once they were reclined was the pits. I could usually avoid the seats except on NRT to BKK.

The new lie flats are fantastic ... especially on the 747.  

Jim


User currently offlineBCBHokie From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 119 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 10628 times:

Delta's been sending the 330s to AMS while mostly serving CDG with the newly refubished 767 fleet... creating a lower-yield and higher-yield differentiation between the two european hubs.

Now that DL will have a top quality business class product to AMS, they'll make KLM's disaster of a hard product look even worse in comparison. I wonder if KLM will begin any refurbishment to match? Their seats are really outdated - what they call an "angled lie flat" is barely better than DL's old 767-300 recliners.


User currently offlineUnited1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 5935 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 10598 times:

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 17):
Quoting FoxBravo (Reply 16):
Are they using the same type of seats that UA uses on its 757s, or something else?

They will be a modified version of the B/E Aerospace Diamond designed specifically for DL.

...which is the same seat that UA uses on the 752 fleet. AA is also using the Diamond seat as their J class on the 321 transcon fleet.

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
If I get a chance to ride on a refurbished A330, it will be interesting to see how it compares to UA's 764s in coach. Now that is one nice ride.

Should be the same seat and IFE monitor as on UAs 764/763 2-class...the differences would be the amount of movies onboard (depends on the amount of storage that DL purchases) and of course cloth vs leather.



Semper Fi - PowerPoint makes us stupid.
User currently offlineDTWPurserBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 1617 posts, RR: 7
Reply 25, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11020 times:

The A330 is a great airplane in its present state. These improvements will make it state of the art. Most complaints I ever had was about the WBC seats--short women tended to slide off the seat onto the floor because of the reclining seat angle. We used to refer to them as "the pod people" because the seats resembled a plastic pod. Now if they would only move that lav from directly behind the cockpit further aft. It always maade me nervous to have passengers hanging around there.

BTW--my personal preference is for the -200 version.



Qualified on Concorde/B707/B720/B727/B737/B747/B757/B767/B777/DC-8/DC-9/DC-10/A319/A320/A330/MD-88-90
User currently offlinemichman From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 26, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10751 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 7):

The current IFE offering on the 330s are the ex-NW offerings, which were some early 2000s model and were quite outdated.

The 330's recently had an upgrade on their IFE systems. Not sure if the 3000i hardware was upgraded, or if it was just a firmware upgrade. At any rate, the systems are now much more responsive than they were previously. The content selection seemed similar to what I've experienced on recent 777 flights.


User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2996 posts, RR: 4
Reply 27, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10846 times:

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 17):
They will be a modified version of the B/E Aerospace Diamond designed specifically for DL.
Quoting United1 (Reply 24):
...which is the same seat that UA uses on the 752 fleet. AA is also using the Diamond seat as their J class on the 321 transcon fleet.

Thanks, both. I've taken the UA version on 757s and 777s and find it very comfortable for sitting and sleeping. My only complaint is that it can be quite difficult to step out from a window seat, but that's not a big problem on 4-5 hour transcons, and in any event it's still a huge improvement over the current 757 seats.

Back to the main topic, can't wait to try the reconfigured A330s. Those Cirrus seats are great.



Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineSQ452 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1112 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10791 times:

Have interior mods been completed for all the 747's for DL?


SIN > CVG > BOS
User currently offlinemodesto2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2791 posts, RR: 5
Reply 29, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10631 times:

Quoting SQ452 (Reply 28):
Have interior mods been completed for all the 747's for DL?

Yes, all DL 747s have the cabin mods.


User currently offlineMSPNWA From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1933 posts, RR: 2
Reply 30, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10490 times:

Quoting United1 (Reply 24):
Should be the same seat and IFE monitor as on UAs 764/763 2-class...the differences would be the amount of movies onboard (depends on the amount of storage that DL purchases) and of course cloth vs leather.

That's a good sign then. I was quite impressed with the new seats and IFE system on the UA 764. I'm not a big fan of touchscreens since I like to play games and fiddle around, but it has a big, clear screen and a responsive touch system. It was right up there with how much I liked the NW A330 product.


User currently offlinenwa757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 31, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 10271 times:

Quoting floridaflyboy (Reply 13):

What will be the breakdown in seat count between Biz Elite, Economy Comfort, and Economy?

A330-200: 34 BE, 32 EC, 168 YC = 234 (loss of 11 seats)

A330-300: 34 BE, 32 EC, 227 YC = 293 (loss of 5 seats)

[Edited 2013-02-05 10:48:57]

User currently offlineSXDFC From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 2307 posts, RR: 21
Reply 32, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 10070 times:

I am a bit confused with regards to the DL mods.. Will the A330s feature the same product that is on the 767, or the 747? From the looks of it, the product on the 747 looks better than whats on the 777-200LRs..


ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 33, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 10035 times:

Quoting SXDFC (Reply 32):
I am a bit confused with regards to the DL mods.. Will the A330s feature the same product that is on the 767, or the 747? From the looks of it, the product on the 747 looks better than whats on the 777-200LRs..

The flat beds in BusinessElite will be the same product as on the 744s, the Zodiac/Weber Cirrus. However, in Y, the A330s will be the first to use the B/E Aerospace Pinnacle seats instead of the Weber 5751 like on the 744/763.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently onlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 779 posts, RR: 0
Reply 34, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 10018 times:

MSPNWA... This mod is light years ahead of what NWA ever had. Cloth or no cloth.

User currently offlineYULWinterSkies From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2178 posts, RR: 5
Reply 35, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 9608 times:

Quoting CanadianDC10 (Reply 9):
Why would DL replace the economy seats in the ex-NW A330's? The earliest A330 they have is from 2003, so it is really not THAT outdated. There are already screens in the seat backs and in economy there are already winged headrests. Isn't this just a huge waste of money? There's absolutely nothing wrong with the IFE and seats the 330's have now.

747s are done, 764 and 777s have the new system also, 767-300 being worked on... I let you guess that next on the list are the A330s.
There is indeed nothing wrong with the A330 as they are now in Y, but they can also get better. They are not getting any younger, and each seat and IFE handset will be tortured by yet another few hundreds of people before they are out of service for refurbishment...



When I doubt... go running!
User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 36, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 9533 times:

Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 35):
There is indeed nothing wrong with the A330 as they are now in Y, but they can also get better. They are not getting any younger, and each seat and IFE handset will be tortured by yet another few hundreds of people before they are out of service for refurbishment...

In addition, the new seats and IFE system weigh much less than the existing ones, thus saving DL some fuel.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently offlinerwsea From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3091 posts, RR: 2
Reply 37, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 9394 times:

Quoting BCBHokie (Reply 23):
Now that DL will have a top quality business class product to AMS, they'll make KLM's disaster of a hard product look even worse in comparison. I wonder if KLM will begin any refurbishment to match? Their seats are really outdated - what they call an "angled lie flat" is barely better than DL's old 767-300 recliners.

KL is supposedly starting the installation of lie-flat seats this summer. They haven't released the design yet but have said as much. The 747s are supposed to happen first. KL's hard product in WBC sucks, although the IFE options are decent. The soft product is often better than DL in my experience. Once the seats catch up, KL will be a standout among European carriers.


User currently offlineJAAlbert From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1573 posts, RR: 1
Reply 38, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 8915 times:

So what does an airline do with the thousands of seats its removes from an airplane? Are they recyclable or do they get tossed into the trash?

User currently offlinebizjet From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 39, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 8860 times:

I'm curious to see the LOPA for the A330-300. Will BusinessElite now have a small second cabin behind 2L/2R?

If I recall correctly, US Airways only fits 28 Envoy Suites (very similar to the product DL is installing) in the forward cabin (between 1L/1R and 2L/2R) of their A333s. However, perhaps DL could squeeze in 34 BE suites with a different galley/lav configuration.


User currently offlinebizjet From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 40, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 8826 times:

Actually, looking at the current DL seat map for the A333, it looks like they're holding BE and EC seat counts flat and reducing Y by 5 seats.

Based on that, I'm guessing they're keeping BE in the forward cabin but are pushing back the lavs/galleys at 2L/2R slightly. I'm still not sure how a reduction of 5 seats works, though. Would expect the Y seat reduction to be in multiples of 2.


User currently offlineMSPNWA From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1933 posts, RR: 2
Reply 41, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 8566 times:

Quoting toobz (Reply 34):
MSPNWA... This mod is light years ahead of what NWA ever had. Cloth or no cloth.

"Ahead" in this case is a matter of personal preference. The chance that I will like this product more than the original A330 product or even UA's new product is slim to none.


User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2996 posts, RR: 4
Reply 42, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 8127 times:

Quoting rwsea (Reply 37):

KL is supposedly starting the installation of lie-flat seats this summer. They haven't released the design yet but have said as much. The 747s are supposed to happen first. KL's hard product in WBC sucks, although the IFE options are decent. The soft product is often better than DL in my experience. Once the seats catch up, KL will be a standout among European carriers.

I'm very glad to hear that, and I agree with your assessment. I have generally had excellent service on KL, and I like flying through AMS--it's the hard product that has been the weakest link in recent years. KL service with true lie-flat seats would be a great combination. Supposedly AF has selected the Cirrus seats (like DL's 744s and A330s), so hopefully KL will do the same for a more uniform Skyteam experience.



Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlinenwa757300 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 299 posts, RR: 2
Reply 43, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 7823 times:

Quoting bizjet (Reply 39):
I'm curious to see the LOPA for the A330-300.

I have the LOPAs for the new configurations but I don't think I can post them without someone on here having a fit. The business class galley is being moved to door 2 and door 1 will only have 2 lavs, a closet, and a very small support galley, no more pilot crew rest.

Ok everyone, try to use your imagination. Here is a rough draft of the BE cabins:

A330-200

...LAV...LAV
1L ......closet......1R
closet ..X X...closet
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
2L.........GAL......2R
.GAL.....GAL...GAL
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X

A330-300

...LAV...LAV
1L ......closet......1R
closet ..X X...closet
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
...X....... X X ........X
2L.........GAL......2R
.GAL.....GAL...GAL


User currently offlinecokepopper From United States of America, joined May 2008, 1179 posts, RR: 10
Reply 44, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 7378 times:

The iphone/ipad app has the A330-200 layout displayed with lie flat seats.

User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7555 posts, RR: 28
Reply 45, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7307 times:

DL is proceeding now with the first mod of each an A330-200 & -300 as a pilot / proof of concept. As with any of the mods, the first aircraft always take significantly more time to complete than the subsequent frames.
They have a window now during the slower winter season to do this so then they can proceed full-speed starting next fall/winter.

The oldest A330s are turning 10 years old so it is time to enhance the on-board product and update with the rest of the international widebody fleet. This will standardize the product and enable greater flexibility to DL can match the proper aircraft from a capacity, route profile, and tail routing perspective but not have to make a trade-offs on product.


User currently offlineAlnicocunife From United States of America, joined Mar 2011, 163 posts, RR: 0
Reply 46, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7030 times:

Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 38):

So what does an airline do with the thousands of seats its removes from an airplane? Are they recyclable or do they get tossed into the trash?

Delta takes some of the used seats and donates them to the Delta museum. The Delta museum sells them to support its operation. Most of the seats are scrapped for materials or sold locally as surplus. Very few make it back into a Delta plane and not many other operators buy old used seats. Older seats must be scrapped because the seat requirements (g loading) have increased.


User currently offlinemodesto2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2791 posts, RR: 5
Reply 47, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 6880 times:

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 41):
"Ahead" in this case is a matter of personal preference.

I beg to differ. I'm confident that a product that is 10 years newer will be viewed by most as an improvement. More selections, bigger screens, and a better user interface. I've been thoroughly impressed with DL's new flat-beds, and I assure you that the 330 mods will be absolutely no different. However, you seem convinced of the new seat's inferiority, so don't bother with trying the new product.


User currently offlinejr From United States of America, joined May 1999, 968 posts, RR: 6
Reply 48, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6010 times:

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 10):
Nice to see them finally hit mods, but in coach it will be tough to beat the product back in the NW days. That included the comfy cloth covers and great IFE selection (and I like handsets much better than touchscreens). Since DL took over the, leather covers (which didn't match the seat well) and DL programming was a downgrade. It's too bad that something nearly 10 years old will still be as good or better depending on your preference. If I get a chance to ride on a refurbished A330, it will be interesting to see how it compares to UA's 764s in coach. Now that is one nice ride.

I know we all have preferences, but I fail to see the voice of reason in your constant gripes against anything delta does and fail to see your broad point if there is one, but okay...

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 41):
"Ahead" in this case is a matter of personal preference. The chance that I will like this product more than the original A330 product or even UA's new product is slim to none.

The chance that you'll have a lot of company on that point of view is slim to none.



I've flown on 9V-SPK.
User currently offlinen7371f From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 1715 posts, RR: 12
Reply 49, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 5447 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting DTWPurserBoy (Reply 25):
Now if they would only move that lav from directly behind the cockpit further aft. It always maade me nervous to have passengers hanging around there.

Right because only every airplane has a restroom right behind the cockpit.


User currently offlineaudidudi From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 445 posts, RR: 0
Reply 50, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 4653 times:

Quoting n7371f (Reply 50):

Actually the lavs on DL B764s are located behind BE, adjacent to doors 2L and 2R.


User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 51, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 4297 times:

Quoting jr (Reply 49):
The chance that you'll have a lot of company on that point of view is slim to none.

It doesn't matter how many people will agree with him or not - this isn't a popularity contest, and it doesn't make anyone any better than others to agree with the majority, which is what you most likely believe because your comment screams that. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. But since you brought it up, I, for one, am on his side. Go on and continue to be a follower and don't express your own UNIQUE views on things. There's nothing wrong with being DIFFERENT. Grow up and don't belittle others.

[Edited 2013-02-06 08:58:01]

User currently offlinedelimit From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 1508 posts, RR: 2
Reply 52, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 4154 times:

Everyone is entitled to an opinion if we're discussing something subjective. Everyone with an opinion should then be prepared to defend it, because otherwise you're going to be shown to have a bias, rather than just an opinion.

People need.to understand that saying something is "their opinion" doesn't somehow excuse them from having to justify it.

Reading a defense of a preference for an angled seat with limited selections on smaller monitors should at least be entertaining.


User currently onlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 779 posts, RR: 0
Reply 53, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4133 times:

Canadian...exactly what part of what of he said do you agree with? That NW interior is better than this? I think it's a bit too soon to tell...because NOBODY has been on it. But if what he's saying is true..that the UA 767-400 is a great ride in Y, and that's what DL is putting in this aircraft, I don't see the issue. And with no disrespect to MSP, he does seem to hate everything DL does. But this is a forum where everyone can speak their view, it's just "fishy" that everything DL does is crap. DL is investing a lot of money to better the PAX experience on board..they did a hell of a job on the 767 and 747 so far..I have no reason to believe the A330 will be any different.

User currently offlineMSPNWA From United States of America, joined Apr 2009, 1933 posts, RR: 2
Reply 54, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4035 times:

Look at what happens when people jump into a thread without reading the whole story. All we have are ignorant responses. I specifically stated "in coach" right off the bat. Maybe toobz didn't catch that.

I've never been up front on the A330, and although I would guess the new J product would be superior, I have no experience to make an opinion on that matter.

Here's the reasoning behind my comparison of the coach product. For me:

1) Cloth is far superior to leather. Cloth breathes. Leather doesn't. It's even more important on long-haul aircraft. I flew on the A330 before and after the DL leather cover change, and it significantly took away from the comfort of the seat.

2) Handsets are better than touchscreens. And this is for multiple reasons. No fingerprints, no one bothered by the tapping on their seat, much nicer to play games or navigate with your hands by your lap.

3) The old NW programming had a good selection of programming, and the old interactive moving map was awesome.

I know those advantages will not be in the refurbished economy cabin. Hopefully things like smaller entertainment boxes will happen and be a positive, but there's literally no chance for me to think of the new cabin as even an equal to what it once was.


User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 55, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4039 times:

I have nothing against DL, and said nothing negative about them. Being an hour away from DTW, I fly them frequently. I was just defending the opinion of another a.net member who was being put down because his opinion was different from the majority and he was being called out for that because "he wouldnt have much other company on his side". Like I said, it's not a popularity contest. People should have more respect for others' opinions, especially when they are defended and backed up with reasons. All I know is that I preferred NW's cloth seats (or any cloth seat) over any leather seat any day. And I was also simply mentioning that the 330 is already in a hell of some good shape and extremely comfortable, despite DL having already covered the seats in leather a while back.

User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 56, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4019 times:

And I also, off the bat, claimed I was talking about the economy seats only.

User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 57, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4011 times:

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 56):
1) Cloth is far superior to leather. Cloth breathes. Leather doesn't. It's even more important on long-haul aircraft. I flew on the A330 before and after the DL leather cover change, and it significantly took away from the comfort of the seat.

2) Handsets are better than touchscreens. And this is for multiple reasons. No fingerprints, no one bothered by the tapping on their seat, much nicer to play games or navigate with your hands by your lap.

3) The old NW programming had a good selection of programming, and the old interactive moving map was awesome.


I agree with all of the above. I miss the handsets. Unfortunately, Air Canada has touchscreen PTV's, but it's nice that they've had PTV's in their mainline economy cabins for a while now. They're ahead of the game! Great airline.

EDIT: I mention AC because we're talking about PTV's in all mainline economy and I fly them more than any airline.

[Edited 2013-02-06 10:50:43]

User currently online1337Delta764 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6474 posts, RR: 2
Reply 58, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3928 times:

Quoting CanadianDC10 (Reply 57):
I have nothing against DL, and said nothing negative about them. Being an hour away from DTW, I fly them frequently. I was just defending the opinion of another a.net member who was being put down because his opinion was different from the majority and he was being called out for that because "he wouldnt have much other company on his side". Like I said, it's not a popularity contest. People should have more respect for others' opinions, especially when they are defended and backed up with reasons. All I know is that I preferred NW's cloth seats (or any cloth seat) over any leather seat any day. And I was also simply mentioning that the 330 is already in a hell of some good shape and extremely comfortable, despite DL having already covered the seats in leather a while back.

One thing that I don't understand is that the new B/E Aerospace Pinnacle seats on UA have actually gotten pretty good reviews. However, as always, DL has to get the bad reviews for the same exact product. This is already the case with the Weber 5751 seats on many of DL's aircraft, where the bad reviews are isolated only to DL and not to any other carrier who uses the same model of seat.



The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
User currently onlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 779 posts, RR: 0
Reply 59, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3877 times:

I specifically brought up Y lol..REREAD my post. ok I get it..DL uses leather because they r a lot larger than NWA ever was and it's easier to maintain. 200 aircraft vs almost 800 (guessing)? ill agree with you on cloth is better..ok. But MSP..name one thing that DL has done right. They've spent 2billion dollars on making the experience better for the customer. I'm not taking anything away from NW. I think they were a great airline. I've seen Pan Am, NW and Delta. Delta is very commited to the PAX.

User currently onlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 779 posts, RR: 0
Reply 60, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3885 times:

And as far as PTV goes..can I get an Amen. DL is the only US airline that is commited to bringing that to every INTL aircraft. And as far as J goes, DLs new product is far superior to the old J product on the A330s (which i have flown numerous times..i will say its alot better than what DL had in the 767s). I did read both your comments very well. I guess we will just disagree.

[Edited 2013-02-06 12:07:39]

User currently offlineCanadianDC10 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 346 posts, RR: 6
Reply 61, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 3521 times:

Quoting toobz (Reply 60):
And as far as J goes, DLs new product is far superior to the old J product on the A330s (which i have flown numerous times..i will say its alot better than what DL had in the 767s). I did read both your comments very well. I guess we will just disagree.

Annnnnd I never said ANYTHING about their J product because I know those pod seats aren't all that great... So actually, you didn't read my comments well. Like I said, from my first post in this topic, I mention that I am talking exclusively about economy.


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