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AA/US Merger Impact: Routes  
User currently offlineModerators From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 511 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 26254 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Dear All,

in order to consolidate the AA/US merger threads (and after input from users, which we highly appreciate) the moderators decided to start separate threads each discussing one aspect of the AA/US merger and its impact to both the industry and the two airlines involved.

Please continue discussing this hot news in their individual official threads:

AA/US Merger Impact: Fleet
AA/US Merger Impact: Hubs
AA/US Merger Impact: Employees
AA/US Merger Impact: HQ
A/US Merger Impact: Livery
AA/US Merger Impact: Unions
AA/US Merger Impact: Routes (THIS THREAD ONLY)
AA/US Merger Impact: Inflight Service

Enjoy & have a nice weekend!

The Airliners.net Moderator crew


Please use moderators@airliners.net to contact us.
252 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineapjung From United States of America, joined Aug 2002, 116 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 26266 times:

I hope AA would have the foresight to add the PHX-MSY route that HP abruptly canceled just before Hurricane Katrina made landfall and never resumed when they merged with US.


Andy P. Jung
User currently offlinejfk787nyc From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 812 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 26092 times:

What will happen to PHL-TLV if American Airlines takes over as owner of US Airways? Any idea if American Airlines would be able to fly there and if American Airlines would launch MIA-TLV after.

User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20514 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 25871 times:

Okay, let's try this one again.


Does anyone have any opinion or historical facts to share on what impact the AA/US merger will have on the DCA beyond perimeter routes? Both airlines have flights which take advantage of exemptions to the rule.

Will whichever airline is regarded as the acquiring airline matter?

What are the odds that any of these flights will be an issue in the release of DCA slots which is expected in order for the merger to gain regulatory approval?



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlinePHLJJS From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 417 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 25566 times:

Quoting jfk787nyc (Reply 2):
What will happen to PHL-TLV if American Airlines takes over as owner of US Airways? Any idea if American Airlines would be able to fly there and if American Airlines would launch MIA-TLV after.

I think PHL-TLV is very safe. It does very well.

The PHL-Asia flights that the Philadelphia Mayor, airport officials, etc have been begging US to start for the last few years likely won't happen though. I see those going to JFK.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16858 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 25422 times:

Quoting jfk787nyc (Reply 2):
What will happen to PHL-TLV if American Airlines takes over as owner of US Airways? Any idea if American Airlines would be able to fly there and if American Airlines would launch MIA-TLV after.

AA is the surving company, they still have the judgement against them in Israel. So unless they back track and pay the judgement, something AA hasn't done in the past 13 years, they're not going to fly to TLV. They pay the judgement or cut the route, we had a thread about a year or two ago discussing the former TWA employee's judgement against AA. With interest it's been mentioned to be upwards of $20 million, perhaps $30 million.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlinethorntot From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 52 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 25298 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 8):
AA is the surving company

My money is on "American Airways" being the name for the combined carrier, leaving no "surviving" carrier so to speak. A holding company will be created (American Airways) with subsidiary-American Airlines and subsidiary-US Airways operating under the umbrella of American Airways. Much like Continental taking over United, the stronger brand-name will be kept (American), and we will have many discussion of "sub-AA this" and "sub-US that" until the final bits of the airlines are finally combined years down the road.



Work Hard. Fly Right. Fly United.
User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11529 posts, RR: 61
Reply 7, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 25181 times:

Since we're treating this as if it's already happened, and because I put my domestic predictions primarily with the hub discussion, here are my predictions on the international network ...

Atlantic: some shifting and optimization among hubs/gateways; 1 daily FRA and seasonal GLA flights shifted from PHL to JFK (as 757s), and JFK also picks up 1 daily flight to TLV; CLT-FCO shifted to MIA-MXP and seasonal CLT-DUB ended entirely; PHL/CLT-FRA each lose 1 daily and PHL-MUC/ZRH exited entirely (due to dependence on Star connections); seasonal PHL-ATH market exited entirely (due to poor economy) while PHL-BCN and CLT-MAD upgraded from seasonal to year-round

Pacific: little direct impact from merger, beyond US bringing feed and connectivity from US hubs and strength markets to AA Asia-bound flights instead of onto United codeshare flights; may provide marginal boost to NRT/China flying; longer-term, AA/JL JV adds daily JL 787 on PHL-NRT

Latin America: little change beyond CLT losing GIG and likely GRU flying and some Caribbean weekend flying with that capacity shifted to MIA, although CLT retains substantial capacity to major markets (e.g., CUN, AUA, PUJ, SJU, STT, MBJ, etc.)

[Edited 2013-02-08 05:10:27]

User currently offlineairbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8287 posts, RR: 10
Reply 8, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 25114 times:

I can't see PHL-LIS surviving. At best it will be shifted to JFK-LIS. I would love to see them try something out of the box like BOS-LIS.

User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6214 posts, RR: 11
Reply 9, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 25085 times:

PHL/CLT- FRA is currently at one daily flight (it's only twice daily in the summer). If this merger goes through it would be interesting to see if BA returns to CLT, I would expect LH to exit CLT. I just don't see the CLT-MAD as going year round, maybe I'm wrong.
I



Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7556 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 24859 times:

Quoting PHLJJS (Reply 4):

I see PHL being one of the first new Asia routes of the combined airline, if not the first.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineCubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 22876 posts, RR: 20
Reply 11, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 24864 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
Latin America: little change beyond CLT losing GIG and likely GRU flying and some Caribbean weekend flying with that capacity shifted to MIA,

I think CLT-GRU can work with more appropriate timing; I view it as similar to DTW-GRU or ORD-GRU. It's likely a smaller local market than either, but it's much better positioned for connections and AA is much stronger with Brasil point of sale traffic than either UA or DL.



I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
User currently offlineAVLAirlineFreq From United States of America, joined Jun 2008, 1035 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 24476 times:

I'd love to see an analysis by someone of...

How many airports are served by both US and AA?
How many are served by only US or only AA?
How many are likely to pick up new hub connections?
How many are likely to lose hub connections through consolidation?


User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4204 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 24430 times:

Quoting thorntot (Reply 6):
My money is on "American Airways" being the name for the combined carrier, leaving no "surviving" carrier so to speak. A holding company will be created (American Airways) with subsidiary-American Airlines and subsidiary-US Airways operating under the umbrella of American Airways. Much like Continental taking over United, the stronger brand-name will be kept (American), and we will have many discussion of "sub-AA this" and "sub-US that" until the final bits of the airlines are finally combined years down the road.

No, I think it will be known as American and the Airlines/Airways will only be in the official name, but will become "American" as the marketing name like most people refer to most of the airlines now anyways. Hence the "American" and no mention of AA on the new livery.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineusairways85 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3401 posts, RR: 7
Reply 14, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 24346 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
Atlantic: some shifting and optimization among hubs/gateways; 1 daily FRA and seasonal GLA flights shifted from PHL to JFK (as 757s), and JFK also picks up 1 daily flight to TLV; CLT-FCO shifted to MIA-MXP and seasonal CLT-DUB ended entirely; PHL/CLT-FRA each lose 1 daily and PHL-MUC/ZRH exited entirely (due to dependence on Star connections); seasonal PHL-ATH market exited entirely (due to poor economy) while PHL-BCN and CLT-MAD upgraded from seasonal to year-round

I think the dependence on PHL-FRA is shifted to PHL-LHR with at least 3 daily not sure how it would play out between AA/US and BA.
Possibly double daily PHL-MAD.
PHL-ATH is definitely gone.
I think PHL-NRT and HKG are definitely in the cards

AA may be the suriving "name" but isn't the leadership supposed to be predominantly US? They may make the case to put an end to the TLV issue because they see the $$. I suspect PHL-TLV is upgraded to 772 rather than double daily and then JFK-TLV added.


User currently offlinesimairlinenet From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 912 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 24153 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
PHL-MUC/ZRH exited entirely (due to dependence on Star connections)

Really? US Airways has been in MUC since the late '90s. Yes, it was helped by an odd codeshare with Deutsche BA, but they kept it through the downturn, Deutsche BA's changes, and before they joined Star Alliance.

ZRH, maybe. AA flies JFK-ZRH right now.


User currently offlinedtfg From China, joined Jan 2013, 75 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 23993 times:

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 10):
I see PHL being one of the first new Asia routes of the combined airline, if not the first.

PHL-PEK ? I remember US got green light on this route years ago but for whatever reason they abandoned it.


User currently offlineLAXdude1023 From India, joined Sep 2006, 7556 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 23842 times:

Quoting usairways85 (Reply 14):
I think PHL-NRT and HKG are definitely in the cards

I agree PHL-NRT is a distinct possibility.

PHL-HKG is a nonstarter. The market isnt there.

Quoting dtfg (Reply 16):
PHL-PEK ? I remember US got green light on this route years ago but for whatever reason they abandoned it.

They didnt have the plane for it. It probably was a blessing in disguise. I dont think that flight would have been a success.



Stewed...Lewd...Crude...Irreverent...Belligerent
User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4581 posts, RR: 23
Reply 18, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 23588 times:

A lot of the focus seems to be on specific international points, but very little on domestic points. I would almost expect that the new AA will go through an add a second hub option to every airport that is currently served by only one.

User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20514 posts, RR: 62
Reply 19, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 23568 times:

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 18):
I would almost expect that the new AA will go through an add a second hub option to every airport that is currently served by only one.

I'd happily exchange a few PDX-PHX flights for the return of PDX-ORD and the PDX-DFW red-eye.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineFreshSide3 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 23448 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
PHL-AND OLD: Munich - Riem (MUC / EDDM) (closed), Germany">MUC/ZRH exited entirely (due to dependence on Star connections)
Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 15):
Really? US Airways has been in AND OLD: Munich - Riem (MUC / EDDM) (closed), Germany">MUC since the late '90s. Yes, it was helped by an odd codeshare with Deutsche BA, but they kept it through the downturn, Deutsche BA's changes, and before they joined Star Alliance.ZRH, maybe. AA flies JFK-ZRH right now.

I think PHL-AND OLD: Munich - Riem (MUC / EDDM) (closed), Germany">MUC will stay, but PHL-ZRH is going to go. Better to use the plane for Budapest(from either ORD or JFK) since there is no DL or MA.

Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
seasonal PHL-AND CURRENT: Athens - Eleftherios Venizelos (Spata) (ATH / LGAV), Greece">ATH market exited entirely (due to poor economy)

Much will depend on what Qatar Airways does. For those of you who don't know already, QR is planning to put on JFK-AND CURRENT: Athens - Eleftherios Venizelos (Spata) (ATH / LGAV), Greece">ATH, which is a bit of an amomoly, since neither city is a hub for them. However, they have been dragging their feet on this. Right now should be the time to start loading the flight into inventory, to start selling for the peak summer season. Yet they haven't. With this in mind, it's highly likely they will turn around and decide NOT do it.

If QR is on, then it's likely AA/US will give up on AND CURRENT: Athens - Eleftherios Venizelos (Spata) (ATH / LGAV), Greece">ATH forever, just like UA did last year. If they are off, then AA/US should keep the service----but out of another hub. PHL is OK, but synergy too weak compared to JFK(or ORD)-AND CURRENT: Athens - Eleftherios Venizelos (Spata) (ATH / LGAV), Greece">ATH.

Quoting airbazar (Reply 8):
I can't see PHL-LIS surviving. At best it will be shifted to JFK-LIS. I would love to see them try something out of the box like BOS-LIS.

Philly is also weak here, too. Even more so. New York is do-able, but then you are directly competing against existing TP/UA flights. BOS-LIS is good. Or perhaps even service to Terceira, Azores Islands(TER). Many people that go to LIS are connecting there, and then turning around, and going west. They get the people to where they need to be AND burn less fuel on BOS(or JFK) to TER.


User currently offlineFreshSide3 From United States of America, joined Nov 2012, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 23276 times:

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 17):
I agree PHL-NRT is a distinct possibility. PHL-HKG is a nonstarter. The market isnt there.

True........there is enough Asia(as a continent) demand, but not any one strong city from PHL. But if you have to have any Asian hub to represent PHL traffic, NRT is the one........lots of connection options on AA partner JAL.

Quoting usairways85 (Reply 14):
Possibly double daily PHL-MAD.

Sounds like a good idea.....but we need to see how the Iberia situation plays out, before adding the second flight. We can get a better gauge on it once IB figures out which inter-Europe flights they will have.

Also:
(1) Making the JFK-MAN trip a thru trip from AUS.
(2) More Puerto Rico in the winter
(3) One seasonal summer Europe trip out of STL, perhaps 4x/week to LHR. Good feeder to BA's hub.


User currently offlineFWAERJ From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 3735 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 22889 times:

First, a little history of AA and US at my hometown airport: With service dating back to the PI DAY hub in the mid-1980s, US left FWA and many other small Midwestern airports in 2004 as part of the broader PIT dehubbing. However, after over 30 years serving FWA (first with 727s, then F100s and ATRs, and now ERJs), AA/Eagle remains strong at FWA with service to ORD and DFW (the FWA-DFW route turns 13 this year).

I see this as the chance where the merged AA/US finally launches FWA-PHL, FWA-CLT, and potentially FWA-DCA as American Eagle (or whatever they want to call the regional arm) routes. All three cities have close ties to FWA: Wells Fargo and Lincoln Financial have large presences in FWA, PHL, and CLT, along with many other companies. There are also a lot of people from the PHL area that live in FWA now, likely due in part to Lincoln Financial. As for FWA-DCA, there is a huge untapped O&D market with many local ties (even moreso than NYC) that currently has to connect at ORD or DTW or use another airport with nonstop DC-area service.

From FWA, I could see AA/US adding one daily flight each to CLT and either DCA or PHL (initially a CR2 or ER4 for PHL and DCA; 70-seaters for CLT to compete with the likely upgrade of DL's FWA-ATL to larger aircraft) to start to complement the 3-4 daily ORD and 2 daily DFW flights. If successful initially (and I think it would be), FWA-PHL/CLT could go double-daily, though DCA would get larger aircraft in lieu of higher frequency due to slot controls. As for the existing Eagle routes from FWA, I see a bright future for them as well. I could see DFW being upgraded to larger aircraft for sure (either MQ CR7s moved from ORD as RW takes over 70-seat ORD flying or CR7s/CR9s/E-Jets from the pre-merger US regional partners) and potentially an ORD flight or two.

And I think that it's not just FWA that will get tapped into the PMUS (is it too early to start using that term?) network: Many other cities abandoned by US in the wake of the PIT dehubbing that still have a strong Eagle presence like GRR, PIA, and EVV will likely see service to PMUS hubs, but mostly to CLT as PHL has capacity issues and DCA is slot-controlled. With DL adding ATL back to PMNW cities like GRB and PIA, the merged AA/US needs to add CLT service to smaller Midwestern cities to compete with the world's single largest airline hub. And I wouldn't be surprised to see cities not currently served by either AA or US, like SBN, YNG, and LAN, added to a mix of PMAA and PMUS hubs.



Primary Airport: FWA/Alternate Airport: DTW/Not employed by the FWACAA or their partners
User currently offlinepvd757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3412 posts, RR: 17
Reply 23, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 22863 times:

PVD-DFW could come back in a US-AA merger. Not sure PVD-ORD or PVD-MIA would make the cut, but DFW seems like a solid candidate. US has plenty of gates and ticket counter space at PVD, so any new flights could easily operate without increasing overhead.

User currently offlinejfk777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 8326 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (1 year 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 22838 times:
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Quoting commavia (Reply 7):
Latin America: little change beyond CLT losing GIG and likely GRU flying and some Caribbean weekend flying with that capacity shifted to MIA, although CLT retains substantial capacity to major markets (e.g., CUN, AUA, PUJ, SJU, STT, MBJ, etc.)

If CLT looses GIG then is DFW loosing GRU ? No way, CLT can be a complement to Miami, JFK and DFW asn an additional gateway to Brazil. AA would be wise to use CLT the way Delta uses Atlanta for international flights. AA needs to own Brazil the way Cathay owns Hong Kong. ORD to GRU needs to happen too why should United fly to Sao Paulo and not AA from ORD ?


25 commavia : Huh? What does one have at all to do with the other?
26 LHCVG : Going point by point, in no particular order of importance: 1. My guess is the SAN and LAS flights are safe, as is the legacy AA LAX. The question to
27 United_fan : I'm hoping ROC gets mainline back . All we have now is 1 A319 to/from CLT . A n/s to DFW again would be nice. Our MQ CR7 flight ended a few years back
28 af086 : CLT-GIG already works. Why would they axe that? It is consolidated and got upgraded during the summer season to the 332 for the first time given the
29 PHX787 : Lets not forget PHX-Asia route that the locals here are trying to get!
30 mah4546 : What about it? It's even more unlikely to happen under an AA/US merger than if US remains alone.
31 AirDance : GRR currently has six flights a day to ORD on American Connection and three flights a day to DFW on American Eagle. Could we see capacity on these cu
32 FWAERJ : PHL is capacity-constrained, so the merged AA/US would have to choose PHL routes wisely (and DCA even more, as it's slot-controlled). CLT has no such
33 bobloblaw : Finally an A.netter who sees CLT opportunities. Most here can't wait to close CLT leaving ATL as the only hub in a catchment area of over 35m people.
34 jfk777 : Because USairways had the vision to start its own servie to Brazil and NOT wait until AA did it for them. Why would any one think killing a profitabl
35 Post contains images FWAERJ : Thanks... but you forgot to make that "35 million people and growing". Growth is the key word here, and the word that will keep CLT a viable and thri
36 flyinryan99 : There are plenty of opportunities that could come to CLT for increased destinations (maybe not increased flights though). I think there are a few des
37 crAAzy : I can see a combined AA/US keeping a few select Caribbean or Central American flying out of CLT but I doubt we'll see deep S. America remain when AA
38 LAXdude1023 : No, I dont think anyone credible actually believes the hub is going to be shut down outright. What were questioning is whether there is a need for a
39 AeroWesty : Thanks very much for your insightful reply. I realize that the DCA beyond perimeter route authorities have come about over time via various means, an
40 usairways85 : These work because the ton of capacity US routes through CLT. If US/AA axe any of that GIG/GRU become tougher to turn a profit. Not really. US choose
41 bobloblaw : I agree that the GIG frequencies could be better used for more MIA-Northern Brazil. Why Europe? What does AA bring that makes AA want to move Europe
42 Cubsrule : Doesn't non-GRU Brasil have available frequencies? True, but US doesn't need 7 daily CLT-PIT flights to be a viable option for PIT-GRU traffic. Four
43 LAXdude1023 : I never said that CLT-Caribbean will cease to exist, Ive always said that CLT-Caribbean will be the major markets only (SJU, MBJ, CUN, PUJ, AUA, etc.
44 crAAzy : I don't think it's a question of giving up the Southeast/Midwest markets to DL at ATL. They certainly don't want to do that at all. It's a question o
45 RyanairGuru : The big check mark for CLT here is airport costs. If we assume that a lot of the connecting leisure traffic to the Caribbean is relatively low yieldi
46 LHCVG : Absolutely! I don't think they necessarily have to remain as-is either, where say a DCA-PHX just switches colors to another carrier. So it could be g
47 yellowtail : As there is no AA/US Merger Impact: Pax thread, i shall post it here. Does wither carrier loose some pax by merging? For example, a AA adverse pax who
48 c172akula : I'm hearing quite a few rumours about AA pulling the plug on DFW-YYC (as early as September). WS has announced that this will be one of their new rout
49 shamrock604 : I dont see why CLT-DUB is such an obvious one to scrap. Essentially, the Dublin route was a way to get extra utilisation out of a domestic 757 that w
50 LHCVG : You win some, you lose some. Take DCA-ORD for example: there will be more here because of the US fliers who previously had to take UA to ORD. Then yo
51 bobloblaw : From who? I bet there is a lot of oil related traffic. Does AA codeshare with WS? Actually yeah, it is. I bet US is highly profitable from CLT to Car
52 mah4546 : No need. There is an abundance of unused non-GIG/GRU frequencies already, both unavailable currently and opening up this year. AA will be applying fo
53 yellowtail : Also, quite a bit of the YYC-DFW traffic goes on to places like SJO, GUA, BZE etc
54 af086 : Yes. AA can start new services from anywhere in the US to anywhere in Brazil (but GRU) immediately if they feel like. US´ service to GIG does not ne
55 c172akula : Internal folks, and I do believe that WS and AA have started some codeshares on certain flights. I don't know if the DFW-YYC flight is one of them cu
56 commavia : Let's forget it. At least for years. Not going to happen. Huh??? What's profitable now very well may not be post-merger. Shuttling cheap fares betwee
57 mah4546 : AA is not ending DFWYYC; but WS, which does codeshare with AA, will join it on DFWYYC in the late spring. Annoucement Monday. No, there isn't whatsoe
58 LAXdude1023 : Part of me is a bit confused on this one. Dont get me wrong, Im thrilled to see a new airline here. That said DFW-YYC is about 75 PDEW and is smaller
59 crAAzy : ORF-MIA has been a solid route at AA for years and is a route that is heavily utilized by military/government traffic into Miami and onwards into Sou
60 RyanairGuru : I agree. In 2013 AA would be stupid to launch a host of RJ flying into small South East/Mid Atlantic markets, as you say it would be a fast way to lo
61 bobloblaw : Cost. Longer stage length on a RJ is a recipe for losing money. Rationalization means not overflying your own hubs. Well not DFW. I am not interested
62 MCOflyer : I see routes to and from MCO growing as MCO has a lot of traffic to offer to hubs. As for CLT, I see: Growth. I see more routes cut from PHL with them
63 N908AW : But even then, wouldn't most of those "unique connections" be either demanded enough to warrant a flight from CLT (which has far more western connect
64 mah4546 : They are all good local markets, and they are good feeders for the MIA Caribbean market. ORF, RIC, and SDF are high fare local markets from Miami wit
65 crAAzy : Unless that flying is contracted out at a cheaper price. Not true when you have multiple hubs servicing the same catchment areas with different missi
66 SANFan : I needless to say am curious (and a bit concerned) about the current SAN-DCA flight on US. This route, like the AA LAX-DCA one, were part of last yea
67 Post contains images AeroWesty : 'fan, you were in the back of my mind whilst typing up my original post. I'm going to have to do some research on how each series of exemptions came a
68 strfyr51 : I SERIOUSLY doubt PHL-Asia at all, what I would bet is PHL-LAX-NRT, OR PHL-LAX -HKG/ mainland China. I do not see an overfly of a west coast Hub as I
69 mah4546 : Traffic statistics proove otherwise. Philadelphia-Asia is absolutely large enough for a daily non-stop.
70 WAC : CLT will become the MEM of AA/US...slowly de-hubbed...no real reason for it with JFK-PHL-DCA
71 capitalflyer : I would say the odds are really good that we will have a feeding frenzy in a few months with a bunch of slots available. On another thread a poster c
72 mah4546 : Yeah, that's pretty much never going to happen. Why do people love to forget that Dulles serves northern Virginia - one of the most densely populated
73 capitalflyer : And DCA is located in Arlington, the densest part of NOVA. The combined airline will fly to just DFW, CLT, MIA, and LAX. I hardly see this as any kin
74 AeroWesty : And as we know, a.net loves the smell of blood swirling in the Jet-A in the morning! I don't think AA's IAD station is in danger of closing. AA has a
75 southwest737500 : They'll be a reduction but come on think for a second that will most likely NOT happen
76 crAAzy : I'm not sure ... it's got to be a combination of not knowing the area and thinking no one wants/can compete against UA there. A US/AA merger is going
77 EricR : Surprised no one has brought up the return of AA to DME via either ORD, JFK, MIA.
78 PHX787 : Why? BA 288/289 is not about US (BA is not Starr Alliance); it's about the fact that this flight is posting awesome load factors every day. There's a
79 FreshSide3 : Especially since UA gave up on DME. My guess is ORD would be the best, since you already have service on Russian carriers at JFK/MIA to MOW airports
80 mah4546 : So? How is that relevant? There is good demand between Phoenix and the UK, as well as Germany. It makes sense the flight fills. The local market is s
81 commavia : I think that is highly, highly unlikely. IAD serves a market distinct and different from DCA. There is still a compelling business reason to serve th
82 ABQopsHP : Exactly! That would be a stupid move, to dehub CLT. AA has had a large hole in the route structure ever since they shuttered the BNA and RDU hubs. CL
83 KBUF : This is as good a chance as any for BUF to get AA mainline back. They'd probably have to bring back BUF-DFW and/or start BUF-MIA, though (currently, B
84 SANFan : Interesting post. I'm curious why you say, "I think SAN is toast." And yes, I'm sure someone else would love to fly it -- particularly a certain airl
85 CIDFlyer : if anyone seriously believes this then they need to look at a map. JFK-PHL-DCA are nowhere near CLT, and for that matter neither is MIA, ORD or DFW.
86 PHX787 : It's growing but slowly. The demand itself is growing. I ran into a contact of mine who actually asked me to sign something to give to the Japanese c
87 CIDFlyer : I also see CLT gaining some flights to some stronger AA stations in the great lakes/midwest area. Places like PIA/CID/CMI/FWA etc and also places like
88 ckfred : Has the judgment been at all addressed in the bankruptcy proceedings? Considering that AA backed off trying to add Latin American service out of ORD,
89 mah4546 : Except it is not. Miami and Philadelphia will have service to two or three cities in Asia before Phoenix has service to one. Miami has the benefit of
90 FreshSide3 : It would be interesting to hear what would justify having STL-PVG service......it doesn't appear that it would be a viable route, at least on the sur
91 Post contains images AeroWesty : He forgot to use the sarcasm font.
92 LAXdude1023 : Ive read talk of Africa throughout some of these thread, so I thought I would chime in with some data. Below are the largest Africa markets from the A
93 southwest737500 : I expect to get ripped on this post I think it would be cool if the new AA and AS worked together on CLT-SEA. The reason I say this is AS is a great a
94 LAXdude1023 : But its apples and oranges. I cant say, DFW-GRU is one of the most profitable routes in AA's networks so therefore, DFW-JNB would print money. On the
95 LHCVG : If the demand were that good, or growing by any substantial amount, there would either be a flight today or serious talk from the airline(s) about op
96 PHX787 : Well look at this: That's enough for a daily low-densidty JL or NH int'l 787, is it not? Well see above here: I don't know why he said it's not growin
97 LHCVG : Depends on the yield. That's enough to fill a single daily widebody, but just barely, so yields would have to be pretty good. Edit: As noted below, P
98 B747forever : You are quoting the wrong number. 26 PDEW is more like it. That doesnt even fill a turboprop!
99 mah4546 : But Miami bleeds significantly to MCO, too. Another thing to note is that the traffic figures are 2011, when Japan traffic was hit hard due to the ea
100 AeroWesty : And even then you have to slice that number in half to get the flow in each direction.
101 Post contains images B747forever : People Daily Each Way
102 Post contains links and images AeroWesty : Check reply #1: How To Find Pdew And Yeilds On Routes? (by jonathanxxxx Jul 24 2011 in Civil Aviation)
103 IrishAyes : No kidding. The bottleneck here is that AA/OW lacks a decent partner in Africa. ST has KQ and Star has ET. I'm still hoping for that MIAJNB flight to
104 B747forever : Yeah, I know, but why would you divide the 26 PDEW? It is already stated in people each way.
105 caliatenza : Will AA start flying to India again? I remember they canceled DEL.
106 AeroWesty : People misquote the numbers without dividing them in half all of the time. The numbers were stated without provenance.
107 LAXdude1023 : I already did it for you. 26 is the number per direction. No doubt, MCO and MIA bleed to each other. I've always said that a MIA-NRT flight needs to
108 crAAzy : Does anyone think AA could make DFW-MNL work?
109 adamh8297 : A lot of folks may not fly that non-stop flight 1) You have to factor in those price sensitive customers who may do bizarre things like fly PHX-ATL-N
110 LAXdude1023 : Not in a million years. A route with 25 PDEW and trash yields?
111 PHX787 : That's direct to NRT as a destination; the 212 or so I was quoting would be continuing on from NRT to other asian destinations, as NRT is an Asian ga
112 willzzz88 : Regarding MNL btw, I'm surprised AA isn't codesharing on JL's NRT-MNL flight? When you search for MNL on AA.com you need to select "AA, American Eagle
113 AAIL86 : Well I think probably all of us a-nuters have our pet routes that we would love to see operated. When I lived in Dallas my pet route was DFW-HEL. But
114 B747forever : But that is my point. You cannot quote the PDEW for all of PHX-Asia and use it as case for a PHX-NRT flight. There is no way that all of those PAX wo
115 LAXdude1023 : My thoughts on a PHX-NRT flight boil down to this: Can you fill a plane from PHX-NRT with hubs on both sides? Absolutely. Can you make a profit on a
116 crAAzy : Re: DFW-MNL I was just wondering if a higher density 772 with J,W,Y might work at AA's largest hub considering possible military traffic, the number o
117 mah4546 : AA will absolutely return to India. It's a given, and I bet it happens in the 2015-16 timeframe. Until Air India and its governmemt backing came, ORD
118 9w748capt : No you have it all wrong - AA withdrew from ORD-DEL because their product was just so much more inferior to AI's remember? How could you forget - hah
119 LHCVG : Of course you don't have to name all contacts used to source a story--and I'll be the first one to defend the right of a journalist to use unnamed so
120 FreshSide3 : I'm also surprised that nobody is flying to St. Petersburg, either, not even Aeroflot. Keep in mind that SFO, who should have a seasonal/non-daily DU
121 AAIL86 : They could no doubt fill the plane with $1200 round trips. But at that level of return they would do just as well to have a big bonfire of $100s on t
122 sonomaflyer : AA could very well return to India flying when they take delivery of 787s. It is challenging to make money given the distances involved (fuel costs) p
123 mah4546 : SA would love to operate via FLL/MIA, like it has in the past. Instead of DKR, but new rules instituted after 9/11 put an end to that. And let's be r
124 nutsaboutplanes : I see MIA as static, I don't think much will change post merger so I don't see it as a "big win" at all for MIA.
125 mesaflyguy : If this merger does go through, what does it spell for the ISP flights? They are consistently full, with US adding a third daily frequency on ISP-DCA
126 Post contains images IrishAyes : Aaw, how could I forget??! Stupid me. Where is that inane bully right now? Mark, I often agree with your posts and rational, but I'm not sure I am on
127 commavia : I don't. AA has been growing consistently for years, and I don't see that slowing down anytime soon. I think AA's MIA hub has more "runway" left to g
128 Post contains images dtwlax : Airlines will not start routes based on written petitions. Even if the entire population of PHX signed the petition, ANA/JL will not start PHX servic
129 Vctony : PHX isn't going to get any new routes folks. By 2017 I predict the following routes from PHX. PHX - CLT, DCA, DFW, JFK, LAX, MIA, ORD, and PHL. My wil
130 PHX787 : Why? Again I question each and every one of you who doubt PHX's future existence. You contradicted yourself when you added LAX to your list and said
131 Vctony : First, I corrected my mistake with LAX twice. I meant LAS and not LAX. PHX is going to be cut because the market just will not work for a "major" air
132 adamh8297 : Could the PHX-Canada routes remain? Though you do have competition with WS and I'm sure most of the traffic is leisure, the largest O&D market fr
133 PHX787 : WS and AC are seasonal and leisure, except I think some AC routes to YYZ carry on to Europe sometimes. Same with Vancouver to Asia (someone I knew fl
134 LAXdude1023 : Well to be fair, DFW-GDL and PHX-GDL are about the same size. DFW-MEX is, however, is over 3x larger than PHX-MEX. The markets in Mexico (and all of
135 EricR : PHX isn't going to get any new routes folks. By 2017 I predict the following routes from PHX. PHX - CLT, DCA, DFW, JFK, LAX, MIA, ORD, and PHL. My wil
136 Post contains images nutsaboutplanes : You said it better than I did That is exactly what I "tried" to say...........I dont see the merger impacting MIA in any significant way, however, MI
137 AllegiantFlyer : I think if AA want to be the dominant international carrier that they are going for than they REALLY need to step it up in Africa and the Fastly growi
138 BlueLine : I don't know why AA or UA don't have at least a regional partner on this route. I flew it twice a year on AA until '96 (my family started driving fro
139 mesaflyguy : I hope it will starrt again too. I know WN just moved the flight over to LGA.
140 Vctony : I didn't include PHX - DEN or PHX - SLC on my list as both routes are heavily dominated by WN and both also have another fortress hub at the other en
141 B377 : What I haven't seen in this tread are two major route issues: Will the new AA operate with the present AA scheduling policy. Currently all flights fro
142 PHX787 : WN isn't going to be able to fill the whole void SHOULD AA choose to end the hub here. NK and G4 would never be able to operate here either. AZA is p
143 LHCVG : No doubt PHX will see a net reduction, possibly a large one, in flights, but PHX still has a viable reduced role as a reliever for LAX for connecting
144 Post contains images Caryjack : Not sure where you got the $1200. My trip to Nicaruagua (SEA, MIA, MGA, MIA, DFW, SEA) in Y looks like about $700 on AA. I've done it many times and
145 Beardown91737 : US flies to 70+ destinations, which is more than the entire WN network before FL. WN, with FL flies to about 45 places from PHX, and that is a lot fo
146 Post contains images commavia : So AA should shift flying away from one of the largest, strongest, best-located hubs in the country and instead shift them to what is almost certainl
147 MastaHanky : I was looking at the international O&D numbers for PHX, and it surprised me how little demand there is to both Asia and deep South America. To put
148 FreshSide3 : Yes, there is one route that would work for PHX and MIA, which is, well, PHX-MIA. Spring training for Major League Baseball is split up between Florid
149 FreshSide3 : A lot of money in freight on this route, which can offset the low passenger ticket prices. But really and truly, DFW?? I can see a China flight out o
150 AeroWesty : From PDX, US, with few exceptions here and there, is usually one of the more expensive connecting options. Their nonstops to PHX are usually the chea
151 hausauflennon : I believe, from the Barbadian perspective, that should these two merge, that we will lose AA's JFK-BGI (as is the trend in many other Caribbean destin
152 LAXdude1023 : Well, considering DFW-MNL is much larger than ORF/PHL-MNL and is also larger than MCO-MNL by a smaller margin, your comparrison makes no sense. That
153 mah4546 : But SLC is an anomaly for cities it's size, because it has missionary traffic. And a lot of that traffic doesn't neccesarily "originate" in SLC, but
154 bobloblaw : Not sure why that would be. AA can cancel that now. US has no bearing on JFK-BGI.
155 IrishAyes : Yes, but SA is a disaster right now. The real gold mine lies in ET at the moment which is keen on creating a "mini-DXB" hub over ADD to connect East-
156 BigGSFO : Larger local traffic.
157 BigGSFO : Also something I haven't seen discussed yet is the LGA-BOS, LGA-DCA shuttle product AA will be branding under the combined carrier. I know they tried
158 apodino : There is still a small market for the shuttles, but you are right, the Acela...the Door to Door Limo services, and even the Bus lines have taken a hu
159 commavia : I think where the Shuttle will help AA is with corporate customers - in all three markets, but particularly in New York. I agree it is certainly no c
160 usairways85 : I think there are 13 FIS gates in PHL A-west. There are also I think 5 FIS gates in PHL A-east. With a merger US/AA would pretty much own all of A an
161 Beardown91737 : Not at all. AA as we know it today does not have the capability. When the new management gets to Ft. Worth, they have the opportunity to tune the net
162 commavia : With respect, I think that is completely divorced from economic reality. If there is to be shifting of capacity between PHX and DFW, it will almost c
163 cjpmaestro : I live in the PHX area. The merger is going to be awful for PHX because unlike other cities that lost their hub carrier, fares at PHX weren't astronom
164 AeroWesty : Are you suggesting something along the lines of a scaled down regional hub for PHX, so that a passenger traveling say between SAN and OMA could conti
165 flyguy89 : I'm not quite understanding how you think PHX is a viable intra-west or mountain west connecting point. SEA-MCI, SFO-COS or BIL-RNO are not economica
166 Vctony : I live in the PHX area as well. This merger is horrible for the local market. The only positives I can think of is that it could potentially open the
167 peanuts : Good grief, these threads are getting long. I may have missed some posts but any speculation on AMS? Finally AA in AMS right? In what form? PHL as is?
168 LAXdude1023 : Ill bite. The only route I see that potentially being an issue with are PSP and FAT. Pretty much every other route (including ONT) can full multiple
169 Post contains images Pellegrine : I for one will be incredibly unhappy to see Star Alliance lose a significant presence in DCA. My Star domestic flying will be disemboweled. I'm not tr
170 AAIL86 : The shuttle does currently have some value – but its future prospects look pretty bleak. Amtrak is far more convenient, reliable, less prone to wea
171 Cubsrule : It's going to take billions of dollars in infrastructure improvements in Rhode Island and eastern Connecticut to appreciably increase speeds between
172 FreshSide3 : HNL/SFO/LAX connections work just fine. No real need for SLC-NRT. Likewise, some of the so-called "SYD" traffic are actually headed for Samoa or Tong
173 ckfred : One question to consider is flying between an AA hub and a former US hub. On ORD-PHL, AA flies 5 times a day (1 MD-80, 4 CRJs) and US flies 7 times a
174 9w748capt : Also curious what those of you in the know feel will happen to places like my current homebase OKC - will we stay about the same or get a few adds? I'
175 N737AA : Way to close to DFW and ORD for that matter to think PHX or PHL service is even on the radar. But you do have that odd sequence to LAX which is going
176 Cubsrule : One of the problems for US in a market like OKC (or TUL, OMA or DSM) is that the merger really didn't help things much because neither HP nor US was
177 IrishAyes : What about the return of the mAAck (ha ha) to BUR and OAK? Very possible. Noticeably, the UA/CO merger brought a lot more mainline to routes like ORD
178 commavia : I think the point being made - which I agree with - is that even with the existing infrastructure of the allegedly "high speed" Acela, it is still fa
179 Cubsrule : My point is somewhat different. It's not correct to look at "the Shuttle" as a monolithic entity. LGA-DCA is already pretty wasteful, as the train is
180 Beardown91737 : Yes, It seems to be working for US and WN now. I get what you are saying about PHX being too far south, but DFW isn't the ideal alternative. To begin
181 Post contains images commavia : What mountain west hub? Neither AA nor US has a mountain west hub now, nor would they after a merger. Again - why on earth would they "rationalize" D
182 southwest737500 : I believe CLT will get OKC and maybe TUL
183 bobloblaw : Definitely. All the conduit traffic will require increases in gauge and frequency. Not only that but it will force UA do downgauge in those markets l
184 LHCVG : They might even end up dropping down to E75's or 70's, but I'd think it could be sustainable at one of those levels for a while. DL's Shuttle might d
185 HPRamper : I believe at one point several years ago US was thinking about PHL-DME. Didn't happen. A combined airline could easily make DME work. So you are pred
186 ripcordd : PHX will be pulled down greatly over the years..It will be a hub but they are going to funnel most east coast traffic thru DFW & ORD I see LAX pic
187 HPRamper : One thing seems certain to me - AA will still need the AS codeshare to stay relevant in the Northwest and Upper Rockies regions, unless a lot of long
188 flyguy89 : DFW is farther South by a degree or two perhaps, but for sake of argument there's no difference between the two in how far South they are. As far as
189 BigGSFO : Agreed. I was thinking about this too. AS is probably glad to see this merger happen (assuming the codeshare stays intact post, which I can't see why
190 ELAL 744 : I don’t mean to go off subject but: American assumed responsibility for TWA’s station in Tel Aviv including some whopping severance and pension pa
191 hausauflennon : That is the conventional school of thought, but AA has been seeing quite the unflattering performance on the JFK-BGI route recently. B6 gives them a
192 blue100 : While this question will certainly be influenced by whichever alliance the merged company will stick with, what is going to happen to all of the US fl
193 mah4546 : JFKBGI is one of AA's absolute top performing Caribbean routes, FYI. It does so well for AA, that is is scheduled on a long-haul 757 so they can serv
194 FlyingSicilian : So what are the odds of IAH getting a Term A Adm. Club now? Combined the carrier should have 25-30 daily flights I presume.
195 usairways85 : Well yes that is it but PHL/CLT-FRA are seasonally double daily and you also have LH on PHL-FRA. Since they will leave Star it is almost a given ther
196 FreshSide3 : Could it perhaps be the JFK hub? Maybe moving it to SJU or DFW or ORD or somewhere else have a better feed-in? A different set of connections may be
197 FreshSide3 : SFO and SEA have to be part of the equation. These are two big markets for Russia, in fact, Aeroflot use to fly to both...and had to drop them becaus
198 mke717spotter : Well I doubt that TUS-PHX is still going to be flown with 10x daily CR9s.
199 Post contains images commavia : Perhaps, although if that were to happen I suspect that one would make the most sense from JFK, not PHL, with perhaps a 5-7x weekly 767 in the winter
200 PHX787 : It will be flown still. It's quite a necessary route, until some sort of train is built between the two cities. Simply driving this far isn't much of
201 SANFan : That's a pretty definitive statement, PHX'. I personally agree with mke717'. With a US hub at Sky Harbor, frequent PHX-TUS makes sense and the presen
202 mah4546 : 7 local passengers fly per day between Tucson and Phoeniz, on average. So either people are happy driving, or 7 people represents a lot of Arizonans.
203 SANFan : I'm sure this market is just the same as SAN-LAX which averages about 40 PDEW in O&D traffic. But there are about 25 r/t per day split between 3
204 Post contains links realsim : AA/US have released the combined route maps: - Domestic: http://newamericanarriving.com/image...COMBINED_DOMESTIC_MAP_112712sm.pdf - International: ht
205 micstatic : Wonder what the prognosis is for HVN-PHL?
206 LH422 : I'm wondering if the LH CLT will move to FRA. CLT is one of the few LH longhaul destinations that only operate out of MUC, the reason most likely bei
207 LY777 : Do you think that the MIA-YUL route will survive after the merger? I must fly this route this summer, and I begin to worry...
208 usairways85 : I think there is actually some business traffic between CLT-MUC which is why I suggested LH "may" keep it but downgrade the equipment. You can't just
209 realsim : Don't know why it shouldn't survive. It has 3 daily 738s for a long time now, so it won't be axed.
210 Flytravel : I just hope another carrier launches PHL-DFW/DAL. Maybe WN, but maybe B6. I just do not think the 1x daily by Spirit launching next month will count
211 flyguy89 : Why? Who would they fill the plane up with after losing the connecting feed at CLT as well as the frequent fliers from CLT? Why do you think they'd w
212 foppishbum : I would love to do BUR-DFW-LGA for my near-weekly commute. I do hope AA brings back BUR-DFW sooner rather than later. Hopefully they will do a late de
213 jumpjets : There seems to be a consensus that of the merger happens I notice Seoul is not shown - is that because the map excludes all proposed but not yet start
214 mah4546 : Miami-Montreal has about 1,300 daily passengers. It is the fourth busiest air route between Canada and the United States; the second busiest internat
215 realsim : It is not a perfect route map. The new routes aren't showed (ORD-DUS, JFK-DUB or DFW-LIM), and also others are missing like MIA-LIM. ICN is still pla
216 Cubsrule : That's really hard to measure. We know, I think, that two big drivers of CLT-Germany (Daimler Trucks/Freightliner and BMW) are nowhere near FRA, and
217 usairways85 : I suspect they simply overlayed the current AA & US route maps and said "Here is our Route Map!!!"
218 flyguy89 : I'm just quoting the stats as of 2011, CLT-MUC had ~29.5 PDEW while CLT-FRA had 43 PDEW. Whether or not the connecting flows of traffic from CLT to G
219 Cubsrule : My point is a little bit different. Some of the traffic that shows in the statistics as CLT-FRA (because they are taking the train to STR or other Ge
220 flyb : Going to be interesting to see the effects in Western Canada. One world has been pretty weak since Canadian disappeared. Lately we've seen WS expand t
221 flyguy89 : Well that doesn't really affect the size of the CLT-Germany market, but it may reduce the size CLT-FRA/MUC if people do indeed start connecting to th
222 Post contains images AVLAirlineFreq : Some of the cities on these maps are quite humorous, and appear to refer to the community closest to the airport. For instance, Joplin appears as Web
223 aacun : That map is soooo wrong. Its missing cities altogether on the American side.
224 RyanairGuru : Call me cynical, but to me that sounds more like optimizing aircraft utilization than providing a premium product, however they might sugar coat it.
225 HPRamper : Maybe this will be a blessing in disguise. With the downsizing of PHX it's quite plausible that TUS will lose many of those flights, and that might b
226 IllinoisMan : While this merger may be good for Doug Parker and, perhaps (jury is out), the shareholders, is a big blow to PHX because its smack dab between two gia
227 bobloblaw : What is your source. That PDEW is way way too big. I'd bet it is 1/4 that amount. With lot of connecting pax on AA i'd bet AA's MIA-YUL flight is 50%
228 Post contains links Cubsrule : Umm . . . http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BAW268 BA's PHX service should work better with whatever level of online feed will be newly available at
229 Post contains images LY777 : OK, thanks. But 1300 daily passengers with only 3 738s Am I missing something? It is a shame that AC doesn't fly anymore YUL-MIA, I would have liked
230 jonathanxxxx : If he combined MIA/FLL/PBI I'd say that's about right. The fact is there are a lot of Canadians in South Florida. Not to mention the huge amounts tha
231 RyanairGuru : + US FF base in PHX. I've heard that this is a route that does very well for BA. I'm sure that I will get flamed for saying this, but 2x 772 wouldn't
232 LAXdude1023 : 1300 would be the total market size. To get the PDEW, cut that number in half. MIA's largest international market has traditionally been CCS and it i
233 flyguy89 : He didn't say say that was passengers daily each way, cut it in half to get PDEW. They could but that would harm pre-merger US's market share in YUL.
234 LAXdude1023 : Correction. YYZ is the largest market from MIA. It's 915 PDEW. CCS is the second largest.
235 mah4546 : MIDT. It's market pair, not airport pair. And it's 650 PDEW. But considering how insanely seasonal it is, it's probably close to 1,000 PDEW in the wi
236 Post contains links and images SANFan : I agree with both of you. But I have to admit that when I first looked at it, I was just a tad disappointed that I didn't see a line between SAN and
237 RyanairGuru : Thanks for sharing! I wasn't aware of that. I see that in November PHX carried 3 more people than SAN - so maybe I was prematurely popping champagne
238 Philly65 : I am amazed at the amount of PHL bashing and pontificating as though everyone has some inside knowledge of what changes will occur once the two airlin
239 BigGSFO : Any thoughts on whether the new AA will keep both Charlotte and Raleigh-London? The two routes coexist today (albeit separate airlines) and unless Ral
240 jfk777 : Will we see PHX to London, can a 777 take off from Skyharbor's 11,439 foot runway on a hot summer Arizona Day. Its been far too long for Usairways to
241 wn676 : BA operated a 777 to PHX for a few years with no issues. Kirby had mentioned their desire to operate PHX-LHR on their own metal, with or without a me
242 jonathanxxxx : Considering that RDU works fine thanks to the help of the corporate contracts I don't see why it should be canceled as it is a purely O&D route.
243 capitalflyer : What about Asia? Surely the merger frees up some metal to start more service to the far east. United and Delta are crushing them to Asia. If they don'
244 usairways85 : ORD isn't going anywhere. AA didn't have the right size aircraft in the past 5-10 years to optimize ORD. Remember ORD was a huge base for the F100. W
245 BDL757 : I'm hoping that they start some flights to Africa. MIA seems like a good hub to launch flights to Africa. Is there any market from DFW to Africa?
246 jmc1975 : Probably MIA-JNB would be more realistic and within the range envelope of the 777/787
247 rj777 : Ok, here's an interesting situation at MKE. US just moved from C (where AA is now) to D (taking over the former WN gates). There are 3 possibilities I
248 LJ : I wouldn't be surpised if PHL-AMS got axed as of W13 (and nothing in return). It's already a B757 yearround and oneworld is the smallest in the Dutch
249 bobloblaw : Yes, the E175s are tailor made for ORD Why? Why does AA merging with US make PHL-AMS/BRU all of a sudden something to drop?
250 bobloblaw : US has but AA hasnt 650 PDEW still sounds too large. Even for 1Q. I could see FLLYUL being larger than MIAYUL Neither is an appropriate replacement f
251 Post contains links moderators : A second thread has been started to continue the discussion. It can be found here AA/US Merger Impact: Routes Part 2 (by moderators Feb 22 2013 in Civ
252 Post contains links crAAzy : Some discussion taking place on this topic under this other thread - specific to airside ops instead of routes: AA/US Merger Impact: Airside Ops (non
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