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KLM To Launch 3 New Asian Destinations  
User currently offlineGEsubsea From United States of America, joined Jul 2012, 183 posts, RR: 1
Posted (1 year 7 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 13638 times:

French national carrier Air France-KLM will launch three new destinations in Asia this year, which will be served by its partner airline KLM Royal Dutch Airlines. Country manager for Malaysia Estee Ng said KLM will commence flights to Fukuoka, Japan, and two other destinations later this year. Anyone know who the other two cities might be?

http://themalaysianreserve.com/main/...to-launch-3-new-asian-destinations

19 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently onlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4504 posts, RR: 71
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 13275 times:

I would expect at least one of the two further destinations to be in China, where AF/KL already serves Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou, Chengdu, Xiamen, Hangzhou and Wuhan apart from Hongkong. KLM also serve Taipei. There are plenty of options left on the mainland, so even both additional destinations could be in China. Other than that, I believe that Busan and Surabaya are potential candidates.

User currently offlinehoons90 From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 3015 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 13125 times:
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My guess would be Tianjin, Nagoya or maybe even Dalian.

I'd love to see Busan. However, Busan may have operational limitations due to steep terrain in the vicinity of the airport, with wind patterns usually necessitating takeoffs to be in that direction. I've heard that's one of the issues holding LH back from going nonstop.



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User currently offlinesmoot4208 From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1307 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 12521 times:

Quoting hoons90 (Reply 2):
My guess would be Tianjin, Nagoya or maybe even Dalian.

Nagoya seems like a likely choice IMO


User currently offlinerwsea From Netherlands, joined Jan 2005, 3103 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 5 days ago) and read 12319 times:

SGN is an option given the Skyteam connection. KLM seems better suited to the route than AF given the higher density configuration (notwithstanding the historical connections between Vietnam and France).

User currently offlinefactsonly From Montserrat, joined Aug 2012, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 12076 times:

The newspaper article contains a number of inaccuracies, quite normal for today's journalism.

The article reports on the re-opening of AF's CDG-KUL route and calls this AF/KLM's 15th Asian destination.

'''The KL-Paris route, which is the 15th Asian destination for Air France-KLM'''.

In reality the re-opening of this AF route adds no additional destination to the AF/KLM network as KUL is already served by KLM.

''With the synergy of our sister airline KLM serving other destinations in Asia, we would see the KL-Paris route having a high passenger take-up rate,”

The logic behind this last quote is lost on me. Yes, KLM serves other Asian destinations, but so does AF. What the newspaper should have reported is that KLM is the largest European carrier in KUL and the airline supports AF's restart of the CDG route, as follows:

The new 3x/weekly AF service KUL-CDG starting in April 2013 in fact replaces 3x of 10x/weekly KLM departure KUL-AMS, the KLM flights will be withdrawn for the Summer. So AF's market entry is in fact support by the withdrawal of KLM capacity.

As for the additional KLM destinations in Asia, let me add to the guesses and rumors. Like FUK, we are looking for unique relatively low-yielding destinations, that are not yet served by any of the ME3 carriers:

- Surabaya - (would be a re-opening for KLM)
- Medan - (would be a re-opening of route, was GA)
- Nanjing
- Kunming
- Fuzhou

But it could also be:

- Nagoya - (would be a re-opening for KLM)
- Hanoi - to compete with AY, but strengthens SKYTEAM cooperation with VN

[Edited 2013-02-13 00:23:08]

User currently offlineRatypus From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 177 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 10982 times:

"SGN is an option given the Skyteam connection. KLM seems better suited to the route than AF given the higher density configuration (notwithstanding the historical connections between Vietnam and France)."

AF already fly to both Saigon and Hanoi though, don't they - so SGN on KLM wouldn't be a new destination for AF...?


User currently offlinesantos From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 741 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 9616 times:

What about Xi'an?
No one has mentioned it yet


User currently offlinerunway23 From US Minor Outlying Islands, joined Jan 2005, 2194 posts, RR: 35
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 9171 times:

I'd go with Tianjin as a likely destination, the business links are certainly there.

Wonder if KLM might not be tempted by RGN. Myanmar has seen a lot of new airlines in the past 12 months and presently no European airline serves the airport, the closest thing to Europe is the service on QR.


User currently offlinesankaps From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 2255 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 8554 times:

How about the possiblity of new Indian destinations? India is in Asia too.

User currently offlineSASMD82 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2007, 770 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7134 times:
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Quoting sankaps (Reply 9):

How about the possiblity of new Indian destinations? India is in Asia too.

No, they cancelled Hydrabad a couple of years ago. A very difficult market enforced them to serve only Delhi and Mumbai.
I put my money on extra destinations in China. They could have served Busan and Nagoya much earlier before. Surubaya is not likely -> Garuda is their partner in this region.

What about a seasonal service to Phuket? Or back to Colombo. Bagdad?


User currently offlineDIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1799 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7134 times:

Quoting sankaps (Reply 9):
How about the possiblity of new Indian destinations? India is in Asia too.

Quite impossible. The Indian market is now more or less completely saturated, yield wise.



Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
User currently offlineLJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4428 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 5469 times:

Any chance that Urumqi will be the lucky one? I've heard they want a service to Europe and have a growing horicultural industry (at least, that's what I've heard).

Quoting santos (Reply 7):
What about Xi'an?
No one has mentioned it yet

Not likely, Xi'an will be served by Finnair. I doubt that it can sustain two European airlines.

Quoting runway23 (Reply 8):
I'd go with Tianjin as a likely destination, the business links are certainly there.

Didn't LH serve TSN a few years ago?

Quoting sankaps (Reply 9):
How about the possiblity of new Indian destinations? India is in Asia too.

Not going to happen now they're linking up with EY.

Quoting factsonly (Reply 5):
- Nagoya - (would be a re-opening for KLM)

With FUK opening this year I don't think Nagoya will be on KLs list for this year.


User currently offlineokAY From Finland, joined Dec 2006, 663 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 5208 times:

Quoting GEsubsea (Thread starter):
French national carrier Air France-KLM

Is it just me that finds that a little odd? I know the companies are together but they still have two different brand identities AF and KL which are the respective national carriers of France and Holland, am I right?


User currently onlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4504 posts, RR: 71
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 5040 times:

I had earlier also considered NGO, but I incorrectly assumed that NGO CDG by JL still existed with an AF codeshare, which seems not to be the case, so NGO may be an option from Paris, although there is of course the new AMS FUK flight already to Japan. Would any future move of an existing NRT route to HND be considered a new destination? JL already operates CDG HND in codershare with AF.

In China, I believe Kunming makes a good chance for a Paris service. KMG is an MU hub and the cooperation between AF and MU seems to be quite strong. I also considered Chongqing, but AY already operates HEL CKG.


User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1049 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3576 times:

Once AZ becomes part of the AF/KL group do you guys see it serving all those Asian destinations from FCO to compliment AF/KL?

User currently offlinefactsonly From Montserrat, joined Aug 2012, 894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3467 times:

Quoting miaintl (Reply 15):
Once AZ becomes part of the AF/KL group do you guys see it serving all those Asian destinations from FCO to compliment AF/KL?


May be for the biggest destinations, but it is less likely, as the opposite is already happening.

Az codeshares extensively with AF/KLM already. In addition a lot of European regional destinations, AZ serves many long-haul destinations through codeshares with AF/KL/DL, here are some examples from Amsterdam :

- dep. 09:25 Cape Town AZ 2932 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on KLM)
- dep. 11:35 Panama City AZ 2940 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on KLM)
- dep. 12:25 Lima AZ 3770 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on KLM)
- dep. 14:30 Dubai AZ 2920 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on KLM)

...and from Paris CDG:

- dep. 10.25 Seattle AZ 3365 Alitalia B767 (codeshare on Delta)
- dep. 10.30 New York AZ 5911 Alitalia B767 (codeshare on Delta)
- dep. 11.10 Los Angeles AZ 3542 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on AF)
- dep. 10.45 Miami AZ 3650 Alitalia B747 (codeshare on AF)
- dep. 13.10 Hanoi AZ 3001 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on AF)
- dep. 13.50 Bangkok AZ 2894 Alitalia B777 (codeshare on AF)

etc.....


User currently offlinePW100 From Netherlands, joined Jan 2002, 2485 posts, RR: 11
Reply 17, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3343 times:

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 14):
Would any future move of an existing NRT route to HND be considered a new destination?

Interesting thought. I could swear that I've read somewhere that KLM (or actually, the Netherlands . . . ) hold 10 Tokyo slots, of which three may be transferred to HND at operators discretion. Seem unable to find that at the moment though.

I think KLM only operates a single daily NRT rotation at the moment.

Rgds,
PW100



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User currently offlineLJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4428 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3152 times:

Quoting PW100 (Reply 17):
I think KLM only operates a single daily NRT rotation at the moment.

Yes, but this Summer it will be 11 weekly. AFAIK KL is allowed to have 14 weekly flights to Tokyo, of which 7 are HND rights. However, AF/KL havbe opted not to fly to HND (and instead AF codeshares).


User currently offlinemiaintl From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1049 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 2891 times:

Quoting factsonly (Reply 16):

So long story short you just see AZ being a feeder carrier and nothing else?


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