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US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.  
User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2360 posts, RR: 26
Posted (1 year 6 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 4140 times:

Good news to all parties involved. With this, a combined AA/US FA integration will be expedited, and smoother.

The tentative agreement was passed with 80% in favor. Here's to a new American!

http://afausairways.org/Eline/feb28_13.htm


"The low fares airline."
26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6465 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (1 year 6 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3967 times:

Quoting AA767400 (Thread starter):
Good news to all parties involved. With this, a combined AA/US FA integration will be expedited, and smoother.

Does thia vote men 80% of the combined AA/US/HP flights voted? I would guess not!


User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4590 posts, RR: 23
Reply 2, posted (1 year 6 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3913 times:

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 1):
Does thia vote men 80% of the combined AA/US/HP flights voted? I would guess not!

All your answers are in the first post, unless you are just trying to stir the pot.

Good news though to hear them getting this moved along pretty quickly.

Here is the breakdown by base:

http://ourafa.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Voting-Results.jpg

[Edited 2013-02-28 12:15:31]

User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 13026 posts, RR: 100
Reply 3, posted (1 year 6 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3856 times:
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Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 2):

Here is the breakdown by base:

First, good news. However, I'm surprised by the CLT response...

Now for the merger with AA...


Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinebobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6465 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3625 times:

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 2):
All your answers are in the first post, unless you are just trying to stir the pot.

I was serious in my question about the particpants in the vote about whether the HP FAnd the US FA were currently in the same union, since the pilots are not


User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3531 times:

I sm surprised with CLT as well, they failed they TA last time by a wide margin. Many in the base are ex Piedmont and not happy with the whole no co-pairing thing. I guess the merger, the VEOP and the signing bonus turned them around this time.


Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineHPRamper From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4057 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3415 times:

This is a huge step for US and bodes well for labor relations going forward.

User currently offlineouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4590 posts, RR: 23
Reply 7, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3124 times:

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 4):
I was serious in my question about the particpants in the vote about whether the HP FAnd the US FA were currently in the same union, since the pilots are not

I believe the pilots are the only ones in a split union.


User currently onlineTW870 From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 232 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 2975 times:
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Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 7):
I believe the pilots are the only ones in a split union.

The flight attendants for America West and pre-merger USAirways were both in AFA. The constitution of AFA guarantees date-of-hire seniority. So the outstanding contractual issues have been about aligning wages, benefits, and work rules across the two carriers - which have now been completely solved.

The pilots for America West and USAirways were also in the same union - ALPA. But ALPA's constitution does not have language that guarantees date of hire seniority. Thus, if the individual groups from the two merging carriers can't agree on an integration plan, they must go to arbitration. If that fails, they go to court. The seniority dispute is what has made the integration particularly troublesome at HP-US.

Overall, being in the same union does not guarantee a quick integration - though the AFA date-of-hire seniority policy absolutely helps. And though the McCaskill-Bond law - which came out of the American-TWA fiasco - guarantees that seniority integrations must be "fair and equitable" (citing the old language from the Allegheny-Mohawk LPPs), there can still be extremely arduous wrangling amid defining "fair and equitable" - a la the USAirways pilots.


User currently offlineYYZbound From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2751 times:

Quoting chepos (Reply 5):
Many in the base are ex Piedmont and not happy with the whole no co-pairing thing

Can you elaborate on the "no-copairing" thing? At AA I believe that term means something different than at US


User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2658 times:

Co-pairing at US means, same crew in the front and in the back from the beginning all through your trip. PHX base does not have co-pairing. AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.


Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12103 posts, RR: 49
Reply 11, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2643 times:
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Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
Co-pairing at US means, same crew in the front and in the back from the beginning all through your trip. PHX base does not have co-pairing. AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

I thought the co-paring was US and HP FA's did not work together on the same flights as crews? Has that been resolved.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

People can start transfering from an "east" base to PHX and vice versa starting in May, but integration per se will not happen until a couple of months. Co pairing does not mean west and east f/a's flying together, it has to do with the flight deck crew and cabin crew flying together all throughout the trip, this was only in effect in the "east" bases.

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:03:19]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:04:30]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:05:04]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:05:21]


Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12103 posts, RR: 49
Reply 13, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2610 times:
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So can East and West FA's now fly together?


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2583 times:

Not yet, an "east" F/A can transfer to PHX, however, he/she will become part of the PHX base. However, for the time being you will not see PHX based and CLT based f/a's working the same flight. If you transfer to PHX you will become PHX based and can only fly west metal, the same goes for a west person who chooses to transfer to an east base. If today you are PHX based and choose to transfer to CLT you will become part of the CLT base and will only fly east metal operated flights. A tad bit confusing to explain. Co-pairing btw flight deck and cabin crew is expected to end in October, I believe. As mentioned above base transfers will start taking place in May.

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:12:15]


Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4218 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2547 times:

What real choice do they have if they did not accept the TA?


Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12103 posts, RR: 49
Reply 16, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 2514 times:
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Quoting chepos (Reply 14):
Not yet, an "east" F/A can transfer to PHX, however, he/she will become part of the PHX base. However, for the time being you will not see PHX based and CLT based f/a's working the same flight. If you transfer to PHX you will become PHX based and can only fly west metal, the same goes for a west person who chooses to transfer to an east base. If today you are PHX based and choose to transfer to CLT you will become part of the CLT base and will only fly east metal operated flights. A tad bit confusing to explain. Co-pairing btw flight deck and cabin crew is expected to end in October, I believe. As mentioned above base transfers will start taking place in May.

Hasn't this created conflict between East and West. I mean East has more International to pick from where West has short hops like Mexico.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineYYZbound From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2485 times:

Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

At the LGA base at AA you will see a co-pairing occasionally on some 3-day trips still with the Super-80. It's rare but it still happens


User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12103 posts, RR: 49
Reply 18, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2463 times:
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Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

AA's South American based FA's don't ever fly with the USA based ones and they can only operate flights into and out of MIA.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineAA767400 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 2360 posts, RR: 26
Reply 19, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2374 times:

Quoting luv2fly (Reply 18):
AA's South American based FA's don't ever fly with the USA based ones and they can only operate flights into and out of MIA.

He meant co-pairing pilots and flight attendants on the same trip.

Piedmont had a rather antiquated rule in their contract that stated they had to fly with each other throughout an entire flight sequence. This lives on today at their CLT base. Many senior FAs didn't like the idea of change, and one of those changes was separating from the pilots, hence keeping co-paring in their contract. That will be gone with this new tentative agreement.

Frankly, most FAs today would rather not see the same pilot every flight leg. I would even go as far to say that most FAs don't really want to interact much with them. Especially if it's a male FA. So the whole co-pairing rule seems rather bizarre to many.

Now let the retirement flood gates open, and let these people move on to a quiet garden, and in turn bring in new faces. It's been too long!



"The low fares airline."
User currently offlineYYZbound From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 2320 times:

chepos, are there a lot of US west f/a's that want to transfer to the east bases?

User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 21, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2185 times:

Quoting YYZbound (Reply 20):

chepos, are there a lot of US west f/a's that want to transfer to the east bases?

Some do, the ones who commute from the east to the west or want to fly TATL, however, many in this base live here so I do not expect many PHX based to transfer to CLT/DCA/PHL. That being said, we have many ex-PSA "current east" who either live here or commute from California to the east coast, you will see some of them transfer to PHX. Some ex-Psa are very senior and hold TLV/FRA/FCO and other desirable trips out of PHL, those will stay put in PHL. But many/most from the PHX base will stay put.



Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineYYZbound From Canada, joined Nov 2007, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 2172 times:

Quoting chepos (Reply 21):
Some do, the ones who commute from the east to the west or want to fly TATL, however, many in this base live here so I do not expect many PHX based to transfer to CLT/DCA/PHL. That being said, we have many ex-PSA "current east" who either live here or commute from California to the east coast, you will see some of them transfer to PHX. Some ex-Psa are very senior and hold TLV/FRA/FCO and other desirable trips out of PHL, those will stay put in PHL. But many/most from the PHX base will stay put.

Interesting. USAir was actually my first airline....and to give you an idea of how long ago that was....I worked the BAE-146!


User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (1 year 6 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2067 times:

Oh wow, those were retirred in the early 90's (ex-PSA birds). Full circle, I guess. We have a few ex-HP who were once with AA.


Fly the Flag!!!!
User currently offlineB727FA From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 758 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 6 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 1695 times:

Quoting TW870 (Reply 8):
And though the McCaskill-Bond law - which came out of the American-TWA fiasco - guarantees that seniority integrations must be "fair and equitable" (citing the old language from the Allegheny-Mohawk LPPs), there can still be extremely arduous wrangling amid defining "fair and equitable" -

We even had a huge go around with F&E using strict Date of Hire...Training credit, adjusted date, DOS, etc. But at least no folded skinny pieces of metal piercing through two sheets of paper here...  



My comments/opinions are my own and are not to be construed as the opinion(s) of my employer.
User currently offlineGEN2STEW From United States of America, joined Dec 2011, 95 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (1 year 6 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1322 times:

Was a "buy out or paid separation" offered? If so, are there quite a few who would want to take it?


I don't know why blessings wear disguises. If I were a blessing, I'd run around nude!
User currently offlinechepos From Puerto Rico, joined Dec 2000, 6216 posts, RR: 11
Reply 26, posted (1 year 6 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1297 times:

Quoting GEN2STEW (Reply 25):
Was a "buy out or paid separation" offered? If so, are there quite a few who would want to take it?

Yes, who knows how many will take it. Many say they will, at the end of the day only time will tell. I am sure many of the very senior mamas voted for it just because of the VEOP.



Fly the Flag!!!!
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