rfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 6140 posts, RR: 25 Reply 1, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9218 times:
JFK is pretty tight at any time, and when an aircraft is partially pushed back, as the first article seems to indicate - but I could be wrong - the clearances are reduced.
Air India apparently flies a B777 into KJFK and there is not way for pilots to see the wing tips while taxiing.
ltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 12328 posts, RR: 12 Reply 3, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9139 times:
I think someone did a post earlier, but as it didn't have a link to a media source, per house rules, it was deleted by the mods.
From some pictures on the news here in NYC, the rudder was damaged on the JB plane. I believe it was a/c N630JB, an A320, Flight # 145 to West Palm Beach. All I know of the AI a/c is that it had just arrived from New Delhi. The wingtip of the AI a/c was slightly damaged. I suspect this is easily fixed although it may take a few days to repair. The JB pax (about 150) were transferred to another a/c.
There is a debate as to if the JB was still parked at the gate or pushing back. As to the AI pilots, I have to wonder if having just completed a long flight (or shift of it) and just before dawn, they just made a misjudgment due to time difference and other fatigue. Especially with JFK a tight fit for all ops there, all it takes is literally less than a meter or a second for 2 a/c to clip each other as we have seen several times in the last year.
B6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2767 posts, RR: 7 Reply 8, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 8805 times:
Quoting gr8circle (Reply 6): Isn't this so similar to the AF A380 incident at JFK last year?
Hardly, considering the AF A380 was on a taxiway, and the DL CRJ was entering a ramp and had its tail sticking out of the ramp a bit waiting to pull into its parking spot. If the B6 plane was at the gate (as reported by one of the links above) or encountered a problem while pushing back from the gate (as it states in the other link....which makes it sound like the shear pins on the towbar may have snapped during the pushback), that means that the incident was completely on the ramp as the AI flight would be on the T4 ramp, most likely in the alley between T4 and T5. I'm not at work today so I don't know any details yet (although I wouldn't be able to release any anyway LOL), but it is not really the same thing operationally. The similarity would be a big plane with a big wing clipped the tail of a smaller plane....isn't the first time it has happened to us at JFK, won't be the last
Quoting ltbewr (Reply 3): I believe it was a/c N630JB
I think it was 603
[Edited 2013-03-09 09:25:26]
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
rwy04lga From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2139 posts, RR: 7 Reply 10, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 8679 times:
Quoting gr8circle (Reply 5): The Globalpost link above shows a plane that is neither B6 nor AI......looks like a 787 to me, with a Star Alliance logo on it....any guesses?
Looks like accuracy in media reporting got banged up a bit, too.
The early bird gets the worm, BUT...the second mouse gets the cheese!
KC135TopBoom From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 11705 posts, RR: 52 Reply 14, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 7268 times:
Quoting gr8circle (Reply 6): Isn't this so similar to the AF A380 incident at JFK last year? Who ultimately got balmed for that incident...?
AF was blamed, IIRC.
Quoting indcwby (Thread starter): Looks like AI bumped a B6 jet near a gate. I wonder who will get the blame on this.
AI will blame Boeing and demand more compensation for the B-787 problems.
BN747dfwhnl From United States of America, joined May 2005, 32 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 6527 times:
Quoting moose135 (Reply 7): Local TV news report, including video of the damage...
Illustrating the "accuracy" of local TV news reporting, the anchorman,
setting up the story for his reporter, dramatically relays that two planes
collided on the runway. Should we be surprised? No.
JOYA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 425 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 6237 times:
All News reports have vague descriptions based on biased data from spokespersons of either airlines. So I guess no one will know who's actually to blame. Maybe AI veered off from the taxi lines, maybe B6 was pushing back. But can't the ATC confirm wether an aircraft was pushing back or not or are they also bribed?
If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
spacecadet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3246 posts, RR: 14 Reply 18, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 6123 times:
Who pays for repairs (and any lost revenue) when this happens? I assume it's paid by insurance, but who's insurance? Is it just like a car fender bender and the at-fault airline's liability insurance pays for the whole thing?
Do the at-fault airline's premiums then go up?
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
flyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1919 posts, RR: 11 Reply 19, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5804 times:
Quoting spacecadet (Reply 18): Who pays for repairs (and any lost revenue) when this happens? I assume it's paid by insurance, but who's insurance? Is it just like a car fender bender and the at-fault airline's liability insurance pays for the whole thing?
Do the at-fault airline's premiums then go up?
Typically you'll see a $500k or $1M hull deductible. Looking at these pictures, doesn't look like it will pierce that deductible. In the case of the AF/OH incident, that was a couple million and the insurer for OH paid for the claim and subrogated against the AF insurance carrier. In this case, I'm sure jetBlue can (and will) bill AI for their damage and it should be paid out of the liability portion of the policy (usually no deductibles apply).
With aviation insurance, there generally is no loss of revenue clause so the airlines would be sol, unless they have business interruption coverage elsewhere for commercial operations.
Some of us can only hope the premiums will go up...but most likely little, if any.
rfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 6140 posts, RR: 25 Reply 21, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5684 times:
Quoting JOYA380B747 (Reply 17): But can't the ATC confirm wether an aircraft was pushing back or not or are they also bribed?
There are many areas on large airports where the tower ATC cannot see the aircraft while they are moving. They cannot see clearances between aircraft on many areas of the airport.
In the US we have what are called non-movement areas. Which is really a poor name - it is an area where movement of aircraft is controlled by the airline or the individual pilots, not the tower / ATC.
The area between Terminals 4 and 5 where this likely occurred is an area under control of the ramp coordinators, not the ATC.
mesaflyguy From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 704 posts, RR: 1 Reply 22, posted (2 months 1 week 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5591 times:
Quoting gr8circle (Reply 5): The Globalpost link above shows a plane that is neither B6 nor AI......looks like a 787 to me, with a Star Alliance logo on it....any guesses?
HAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31201 posts, RR: 58 Reply 24, posted (2 months 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 2914 times:
Wingtip can be replaced fast with not much delay ...Aldo it can be deffered too.
Was the JetBlue Aircraft not parked properly OR was AI not on the line.....
Think of the brighter side!
25 DTW2HYD: Quite possible, In general AI has all women crew on International Women's Day. If I recall correctly AI even had a all women crew on a 787 route betw
26 aeroblogger: If it was, media relations sure won't be publicizing it Imagine the headlines: "Women Pilots Crash Air India Jet," or "Forget Cars, Women Can't Drive
27 DTW2HYD: All women crew news is all over Indian media. It appears all women crew were on BOM-EWR not to JFK. http://www.hindustantimes.com/News-F...s-on-Thurs
28 mmedford: Saw the B6 aircraft yesterday; doesn't look to bad. New rudder and some repairs to the vertical stab; she'll be back to normal.
29 aeroblogger: And they did it on 07MAR, not 09MAR for some reason. Strange. Regardless, all women crews cockpit crews aren't uncommon at AI, even when there is no
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