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RUMOR: AS Q400 To ANC  
User currently offlinelono From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1335 posts, RR: 1
Posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 11419 times:

Hearing AS is committed to bring 3 Q400's to ANC.
These Q400's will initially service ANC -ADQ and ANC-FAI.
Apparently these A/C will not service the SE Alaska market due to lack of bad WX capabilities.
Which I find interesting since ADQ has been known to have some bad WX.


Wally Bird Ruled the Skys!
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5638 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 11258 times:

All of Alaska has been known to have bad WX. Except Anchorage, I suppose, and we just get ridiculous turbulence.

I've been hearing this rumor for nearly a year... I wonder if it will come to fruition. I suspect it will be good for AS; they can reduce costs on some of their marginal routes, hopefully. I doubt they'll be kind enough to pass those cost savings onto their customers (ahem), but one can always hope!


User currently offlineRWA380 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 2876 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 11237 times:

It has been rumored by several people here on A.net that AS would bring the Q to Alaska one day. One would consider your source before going wild with the thought, you have presented.

From what I understand QX is already stretched thin with their 400's, and unless they will reduce flying elsewhere, I'm not sure where the available frames would come from, but who am I to doubt the top minds at AS?

I wonder how well the Q400 will do in the harsh Alaska winters? Likely well, I'd suspect.



Rule number One, NEVER underestimate the other guys greed
User currently offlinebobloblaw From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 1446 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 11053 times:

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 2):

Is Skywest increasing their CR7 flying for AS? That could free up some Q400s


User currently offlinerampbro From Canada, joined Nov 2012, 153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10529 times:

Quoting lono (Thread starter):
rently these A/C will not service the SE Alaska market due to lack of bad WX capabilities

Aren't the QX birds equipped with a super nice HUD for low-viz conditions? I wonder if the bad WX in question is more about wind/ice and less about fog/low ceiling.


User currently offlinedoug_Or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3378 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 10514 times:

Quoting rampbro (Reply 4):
Aren't the QX birds equipped with a super nice HUD for low-viz conditions? I wonder if the bad WX in question is more about wind/ice and less about fog/low ceiling.

I believe that AS has some special RNP/GPS/RNAV (not sure the correct term) approaches which they developed and only they are certified for in SE Alaska. This may be what the OPs source was referring to.



When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5638 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 9786 times:

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 2):

I wonder how well the Q400 will do in the harsh Alaska winters? Likely well, I'd suspect.
Quoting rampbro (Reply 4):
I wonder if the bad WX in question is more about wind/ice and less about fog/low ceiling.

I don't know, but ERAAlaska seems to do okay with their Dash-8-200's.
That said, their airborne stall incident from last September was, in fact, a Dash-8. But that presumably could have been avoided by proper piloting.


User currently offlineSANFan From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 5223 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 9095 times:

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 2):
From what I understand QX is already stretched thin with their 400's, and unless they will reduce flying elsewhere, I'm not sure where the available frames would come from, but who am I to doubt the top minds at AS?

This is what I wonder, B. AS is not overloaded with the Qs and AFAIK, for the last couple of years anyway, they pretty much have had to cancel service somewhere in the system to free up a/c availability for new routes/capacity elsewhere. (There used to be some slack necessary in the schedules due to fleet mx/reliability issues but I believe that has lessened lately.) However, I also think I remember hearing that they do have some options for additional new Qs and maybe the used market has a few frames in it as well.

Quoting bobloblaw (Reply 3):
Is Skywest increasing their CR7 flying for AS? That could free up some Q400s.

Possible but AS does seem pretty tight about increasing the OO arrangement for additional CRJ flying.

We'll have to keep an eye on the existing Q routes to see if flights start disappearing...

bb


User currently offlinelono From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 8884 times:

Yes I have been hearing this for a while and coming from an airline career myself I often disregard.
However this time maybe different since the rumor is union generated.
The WX issue has to do with advanced guidance equipment on the jets that is not available n the Q400's.

[Edited 2013-04-04 15:16:30]


Wally Bird Ruled the Skys!
User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13254 posts, RR: 62
Reply 9, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8548 times:
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Alaska Air Group has made no secret of the fact that Q400 service will eventually occur within the state of Alaska, however the intent is to supplement existing service, not replace it.


"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently onlineKaphias From United States of America, joined Nov 2010, 289 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8025 times:

Quoting lono (Reply 8):
The WX issue has to do with advanced guidance equipment on the jets that is not available n the Q400's.

Not quite sure what this unavailable equipment might be, considering that everything I can find says that their Q400s are RNP capable.



Flown on: C150, C172, C206, Beaver, Otter, Jetstream 32, Q400, CRJ7/9, E135/40/45, A320, B732/4/7/8/9, B744, B752, B763
User currently offlinelono From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 7743 times:

Kaphias.....Could be special RNP training into SE Alaska? Or perhaps the EAS agreement stipulates 737 equipment?


Wally Bird Ruled the Skys!
User currently offlineSVA402 From United States of America, joined Sep 2012, 63 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6932 times:

Everything at Alaska points to this long-term. If you read their financials on their website, the plan over the next 5 years is to get rid of 737-400 combis, and eventually all -400s. There has been no announcement of a replacement plan. Perhaps they will use -700s up there, but as of now -700s have been used almost exclusively for lower load factor SEA-California markets. Investor telephone conferences have also played towards Alaska wanting to get rid of -700s long term. So what's going to happen eventually? I think we'll see Alaska pull out of several of the markets and outsource them to Era/PenAir, and I think we'll see some go to Horizon. Long-term I think that we'll see Alaska serving markets such as ANC, FAI, SIT, JNU, etc with -800s and -900s, and the rest will go to turboprops or outsourcing. While it's not what I'd personally like to see, I understand their desire to make as much money as possible per airplane, and they've stated numerous times that larger airplanes are the way to do that.

User currently offlineASFlyer From United States of America, joined May 2005, 1044 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6811 times:

Quoting lono (Thread starter):
Hearing AS is committed to bring 3 Q400's to ANC.
These Q400's will initially service ANC -ADQ and ANC-FAI.
Apparently these A/C will not service the SE Alaska market due to lack of bad WX capabilities.
Which I find interesting since ADQ has been known to have some bad WX.

This is exactly what I've heard as well. I heard it directly from the mouth of a senior VP though. I have no idea where the 3 frames will come from but I'm pretty sure they've already figured that part out. It sounds like this plan is in motion.

As far as the harsh winters in Alaska go, Air Canada uses the Q up in Canada, where winters are harsh as well. Penair uses the Saab in the Aleutians and Era, the Q200 in the same markets Alaska is considering. I don't think Horizon is going to have any problem flying within Alaska using the Q's.


User currently offlinedashman From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days ago) and read 6331 times:

Horizon has 3 CRJ's coming back from lease. My money is on Skywest will get them, fly longer existing Q400 routes and there are your 3 Q400's to Alaska.

User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 2880 posts, RR: 7
Reply 15, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6108 times:

Quoting dashman (Reply 14):
Horizon has 3 CRJ's coming back from lease. My money is on Skywest will get them, fly longer existing Q400 routes and there are your 3 Q400's to Alaska.

I think some current Q400 routes that would be candidates to go to the the Skywest CR7s would be the SJC-PDX QX flights, the second SEA-FAT flight and SEA-YEG, LAX-LTO and SEA-YYC. Those were all CR7 routes in the past, as were a few Montana routes like SEA-BIL.


User currently offlinedoug_Or From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3378 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 5934 times:

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 15):
I think some current Q400 routes that would be candidates to go to the the Skywest CR7s would be the SJC-PDX QX flights, the second SEA-FAT flight and SEA-YEG, LAX-LTO and SEA-YYC. Those were all CR7 routes in the past, as were a few Montana routes like SEA-BIL.

I agree with all as possibilities except LAX-LTO since it would require a bridge city to get the RJs to LAX.



When in doubt, one B pump off
User currently offlineatct From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2223 posts, RR: 39
Reply 17, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 5490 times:

This has been a rumor for as long as the Q400's have been on property at Horizon. Until it happens its all rumors and speculation.

atct



"The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing." - Walt Disney
User currently offlinechrisjw From United States of America, joined Jan 2009, 123 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5383 times:

The problem with Q400 operating in SE Alaska isn't the WX itself, but the possibility of a diversion. When SE AK get's socked in, it generally affects the whole region, and the Q400 just doesn't have the range to be profitably operate a route AND be able to divert to a suitable airport not in the SE region.

Everything I've heard is that unless there are some snags, you should see a QX Q400 in Alaska around Q4 of this year.


User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 2880 posts, RR: 7
Reply 19, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 5353 times:

Quoting chrisjw (Reply 18):
The problem with Q400 operating in AS Air Limited (Kenya)">SE Alaska isn't the WX itself, but the possibility of a diversion. When AS Air Limited (Kenya)">SE AK get's socked in, it generally affects the whole region, and the Q400 just doesn't have the range to be profitably operate a route AND be able to divert to a suitable airport not in the AS Air Limited (Kenya)">SE region.

Yeah, I saw where an AS 734 went to Whitehorse a few years ago when JNU and the other nearby suitable diversion points were socked in. Sounds like he got to JNU and and FMC failed and couldn't meet the RNP requirements.


User currently offlineB6WNQX From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 243 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 5156 times:

Didn't AS/QX have options for a few more Q400's? I thought I read on a.net awhile back that they were in discussions for a few more. If so, that is where they could come from too.

Edit: It looks like from the 2012 Annual Report is that they have 10 options for the Q400 with delivery dates from 2013 - 2015 if exercised.

[Edited 2013-04-05 14:43:49]

User currently offlinePassedV1 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 217 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 4732 times:

Quoting Kaphias (Reply 10):
Not quite sure what this unavailable equipment might be, considering that everything I can find says that their Q400s are RNP capable.

There are different levels of RNP. The basic level that almost everyone has is .3, which is also what Horizon has right now. Horizon is expected to get .1 by the summer. Depends on the surrounding terrain, but at least in AS Air Limited (Kenya)">SE Alaska, you need to get down to about a .12/.15 RNP capability in order to get basic CAT I minimums.

AS Air Limited (Kenya)">SE Alaska's system of interlnked RNP Approaches and Departure/Arrival procedures require a .12 authorization to be able to take advantage of them to their fullest.

FAI is basically a big midwest airport with plenty of room for long straight-ins required for CATIII landings. No reason Horizon couldn't operate there.

ADQ - Ironically the conditions around Kodiak are so bad that even RNP doesn't currently really help you. QX will have no harder time getting in then AS does.

So, although I have no idea of the validity of the OP's statement, it does at least ring true from an operational practicality point of view.


User currently offlineroadrunner165 From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 866 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 4447 times:

My recent and first Q400 experience left me thoroughly impressed. I would have no problem flying on one from Anchorage to Nome. The issue I see is the lack of cargo space. Nome has 3 737 combis per day presently. I think 3 Q400 flights and one 737 Freighter could do the trick. The challenge I see is that as a passegner I bring a lot of luggage with me. Alaska presently offers three free bags each 50lbs on intra-alaska flights. I wonder if the Q's have enough space to accomoadte that much luggage. Or if they would have to change their luggage policy - which would be very unpopular.

User currently offlineHiFlyerAS From United States of America, joined Jul 2011, 829 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4388 times:

Talk is ANC-FAI and ANC-ADQ....looking into removing a row of seats to allow for more checked bags/cargo. QX flights would operate in support of AS flights (mid-day, extra flight) as opposed to replacing all mainline service. Latest I heard was the -700's might be sticking around after all for thinner markets. Maybe the reason being that it will replace some QX flying out of PDX...freeing Q400's to go north. All will become clear soon if the fall start is a reality.

User currently offlineBoeingGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2010, 2880 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4374 times:

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 23):
Latest I heard was the -700's might be sticking around after all for thinner markets. Maybe the reason being that it will replace some QX flying out of PDX..

So that would be PDX-ONT, PDX-BUR and PDX-SMF probably. Aren't the 737-700s mostly used at SNA also? I know AS does sometimes send the -800s to SNA, but aren't the -700s more optimized for that mission?

What about QX Q400s allowing AS to directly serve markets like Dutch Harbor, Valdez, Kenai and Homer?


25 woodsboy : We (FAI) get 738s and 739s now, everyday have for years ever since those types evtered service, not sure if you meant that we were going to get them
26 AA737-823 : I think he meant that he expects the -700 and -400 to disappear, with the -8/-9 and Q400 filling in the gaps. Well, perhaps, but rest assured: if the
27 CRJ900 : I think Bombardier Capital have a few pre-owned Q400s available for lease, they might get three from them - but they better hurry, the aircraft have
28 snowzilla : The word is that Alaska is converting (probably, as opposed to buying) 4 700's to freighters, so it doesn't look like they are gonna be giving up any
29 atct : I believe AS has their own approach into ADQ with lower minimums than what the FAA/Jepp publishes. (I'll see what I can dig up at work today). So at
30 Post contains images PassedV1 : They basically have two. The ILS 25 let's you down to a 300'DH with 1 3/8 vis requirement and the RNP 36 lets you down to a 330'DH with a 1 mile vis
31 n7371f : My understanding is the 734 Combi fleet runs up against its HMV's starting next year and with no replacement in sight, AS plan is to put the 3 Q400's
32 roadrunner165 : Yes NAC does have 732’s and 733’s in service but was that not a direct replacment of the 727’s and DC-6s? Everts DC-6s are being replaced by a D
33 woodsboy : Yes, NAC retired the DC-6s and 727 and brought on line 737s but with the number of 737s they did not by any stretch of the imagination replace all the
34 EIPremier : I, too, wonder where these ANC-based Q400s will come from? QX has gotten rid of 2 Q400s from its fleet, and is now actually stretched rather thin in t
35 EA CO AS : Last I'd heard the plan was to eliminate the combis and replace them with extra dedicated freighters, along with keeping the existing freighter. I be
36 atct : Ive been told these will not be operated in Alaska.
37 Post contains links PassedV1 : But the 400's are slated to be gone by 2017...Do you really believe that Alaska will run 3 400's in there fleet of 130 NG's? Boeing actually offers t
38 L-188 : Pretty much correct.......The FAA got a burr in their butt about ten-fifteen years ago about cargo fires on combi aircraft so they have pretty much r
39 yeelep : Yes, it would be no different than when they had a small subfleet of -200's. Boeing offers a new build plane, it is not a conversion. I don't know of
40 BoeingGuy : My understanding is that it's not combi aircraft that's the concern. The FAA doesn't allow moveable bulkheads anymore.
41 atct : First aircraft has left the fleet, the 2nd will not be far behind.
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