IndianGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1885 times:
Not to flame anyone here, but on last nights news, it was mentioned in passing that pieces of the 752 that crashed in Pittsburgh were found 12 miles from the crash site. The rest of the wreckage was found in a concentrated area.
Just a thought: is it possible that pieces of the aircraft fell off because security agencies shot it down, and the crippled aircraft later crashed? By then it was pretty clear that it was headed towards Washington (so either the Senate bldg or the White House were the targets).
If the pax/crew grappled with the pilots, how could a part of the aircraft have separated 12 miles away?
Zbeeblebrox74 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1797 times:
Yep, that's a tough one to answer.
Look at another possibility. Could it be, that during a struggle on the flight deck a very abrupt flight-control movement was made at high speed, exceeding the design load limits of the airframe. (pure speculation, I do apologize) Partial structural failure may have been the result, maybe lost an engine, piece of the tail or part of a wing, flew for another 12 miles before impacting terrain out of control and near vertical. Again, I'm speculating and a proper investigation will bring better insight.
In the meantime, God rest the souls of all who perished on Tuesday.
Alpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 1698 times:
When I first heard of the plane going down in Pennsylvania, in the middle of nowhere, I thought it might have been shot down as well. I don't think it was now. I think the U.S. military wouldn't have had any assets in place that quickly to shoot down a plane relatively inland. I think there was a titanic struggle onboard between the passengers and these bastards who took over the aircraft.
Sotomayor From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1633 times:
The FBI agent in charge at the sight of the crash is now explicitely denying that this plane was shot down. The 2 other debris fields found were downwind from the crash site and contained light material. The inference is that this material blew off to those spots.
Lewis From Greece, joined Jul 1999, 3721 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1590 times:
It seems as if it was shot down. The debris that was found was small pieces scattered all ver the place. The air force had orders to shoot down al suspicious aircraft and at this time they would rather deny it in order to cause less pain. It is difficult for them to admit that they shot down an american aircraft.
N202PA From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1563 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1576 times:
I seriously doubt that it was shot down, although I think we have to consider all possibilities at this point.
The reason I don't think it was shot down is that if the government did so, why didn't they shoot down AA 77 before it hit the Pentagon? Certainly they must have had enough lead time between the WTC bombings and the news that a plane had deviated from its flight path and was turning back around to Washington. It was chaos that morning, and I don't think there was enough time or forethought that gave government officials the ability to make the decision to shoot down UA 93.
I'd believe this conspiracy theory more if the plane crashed closer to Washington, such as in Leesburg, Brunswick, Rockville, etc. But this was way out in the Pennsylvania countryside. If the thought of shooting it down as a dangerous target had come to the minds of government officials, surely they would have allowed it to get closer to Washington to determine its intentions. Southern Pennsylvania and Western Maryland are lightly populated areas. There was still time to make a shoot/no shoot decision.
I find it more likely that the terrorist pilot lost control of the aircraft at low altitude after a struggle between the passengers (already convinced that they were going to die) and the hijackers led to chaos in the cabin and flight deck. We have evidence to suggest this. Was there a bomb? We'll have to see what the investigation turns up.
Greg From United Kingdom, joined May 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1565 times:
The US gov't would not shoot down an airliner without exhausting all other resources. The (the gov't) did not have a clue that the aircraft was hijacked at that point (remember...no transponder...).
If you all want to be alarmist, go ahead. But it sounds pretty ridiculous.
LMML 14/32 From Malta, joined Jan 2001, 2565 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1541 times:
Transponder or not, the blip is always there unless you are flying at tree top level. You might add that there are hundreds of light planes in the US skies that appear like that, but not at those speeds ! What about the nerve centre deep inside the Cheyenne mountain? The question is: Why were a B757 and B767 allowed to for 40 minutes perpendicular to their filed flight plan seemingly without drawing anybody's attention? The first impact on WTC should have alerted someone about the second plane approaching - 18 minutes later !
LoneStarMike From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4021 posts, RR: 31
Reply 18, posted (13 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1487 times:
To be honest, I don't know if the plane was shot down or not, but for all of you who insist that it wasn't, would you mind explaining this news report from yesterday?This may be why IndianGuy asked the question in the first place
FBI Cannot Rule Out Shootdown of Penn. Plane 09/13/2001
SHANKSVILLE, Pa. (Reuters) - Federal investigators said on Thursday that they have not ruled out the possibility that United Airlines Flight 93 was shot down over Pennsylvania, after three other hijacked airliners crashed into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon (news - web sites).
As speculation about what happened aboard the Boeing 757 intensified, FBI (news - web sites) agent Bill Crowley told a news conference that it was too early in the crash investigation to rule out any possibility.
He declined to say whether evidence actually pointed to an explosion before the San Francisco-bound jetliner crashed 80 miles southeast of Pittsburgh on Tuesday, killing 45 passengers and crew on board.
``We have not ruled out that. We haven´t ruled out anything yet,´´ Crowley said when asked about reports that a U.S. fighter jet may have fired on the hijacked airliner to prevent it from reaching a target, possibly in Washington.
His remark prompted deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz to say he would look into the matter. ``I have no information on it at all. In fact, that´s the first I heard, and I´m going to look into it,´´ Wolfowitz, the No. 2 Pentagon official, told a briefing.
Much of the mystery could be settled if investigators locate the plane's so-called black boxes, which could provide a tape-recorded account of what occurred inside the cockpit.
The plane had been en route to San Francisco from Newark, New Jersey, when it veered off course over northeastern Ohio and headed back southeast toward Pittsburgh. Crash investigators said it appeared to be moving in an ``easterly´´ direction when it plunged to earth.
The fact that Flight 93 was the only hijacked plane not to hit a U.S. landmark has brought growing speculation about how the aircraft and its occupants met their fate. The speculation has ranged from a struggle between passengers and hijackers to a bomb explosion.
PLAN TO OVERPOWER HIJACKERSSeveral passengers managed to telephone people on the ground to report the hijacking. Accounts described three hijackers claiming to have a bomb and a plan by passengers to overpower them. There were also reports that one man heard an explosion.
``If they are going to take the plane down, then we are going to have to do something,´´ Deena Burnett of San Ramon, California, quoted her husband as saying during a cellular phone conversation moments before the crash.
The Pennsylvania state police said debris from the crash has shown up about 8 miles away in a residential area where local media quoted some residents as seeing flaming debris from the sky.
But investigators were unwilling to say whether the presence of debris in two separate places evinced an explosion. State Police Major Lyle Szupinka said debris found in the residential area seemed small enough to have been carried by air currents after impact.
Meanwhile, scores of searchers in white or yellow protective overalls collected human remains for storage in a makeshift morgue and set aside piece of the shredded fuselage for forensic analysis as part of an on-site probe expected to take three to five weeks.
Much of the debris is said to be in small pieces, none larger than a briefcase so far.
A team of archeologists were also at work digging for evidence in a huge crater left by the plane's impact.
But officials said the main object of the investigation was to find the flight's voice and flight data recorders, which could prove instrumental to agents trying to unearth the identity of those behind Tuesday's the horrific attacks.
``We´re confident that we´re going to keep working on it and that we will account for it,´´ Crowley said. ``That´s the investigative priority right now.´´
Families of the victims were expected to begin arriving at the crash site outside tiny Shanksville, Pennsylvania, as early as Wednesday afternoon.