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Any Chance SLC Becomes The Next CVG Or MEM?  
User currently offlineflaps30 From United States of America, joined May 2009, 287 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12200 times:

With SLC being my home airport and an important part of the local economy, I was wondering if Delta has any plans to downsize this hub as they have done with CVG and MEM. Now I know each of these cities serves a different purpose in the grand scheme of Delta world, but is SLC safe as an important hub for DL? They do have a loyal following here (even though I usually fly WN) from the business community so are the yields playing a big factor here or could SLC still thrive for DL with average yields?


every day is a good day to fly
128 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineflyasaguy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12199 times:

Short answer...not a chance. DL likes to be top dog. See ATL, (SLC), MSP, DTW. SLC serves a very important role in the Delta network that cannot be accomplished by way of LAX or even a lesser extent, MSP. O/D is very healthy considering it's the only major airport...anywhere in the area. SLC held its own through the tough times and at one point was the only hub except for ATL that saw significant growth (32% over a 1 or 2 year period IIRC).


What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2005 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 12160 times:

CVG and MEM were more victims of geography than anything. They were too close to DTW and ATL respectively. SLC is kind of geogrpahically unique. You don't have a lot of options unless you want to move the hub to DEN, PHX, LAS or something like that... and those options just aren't feasible.

User currently onlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 781 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11999 times:

Short answer No Way. SLC is DLs turf on the west coast ( as west coast as can be for DL). DL has a huge FF base there and it has been noted that it is "strong" there.

User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5654 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11993 times:

Like everyone else has been saying, SLC is one of the last fortress hubs, especially out west, and a proftable one at that. DL is growing it instead of downsizing it. I do hope some of the RJ flying will be replaced by the incoming 717's though....*crosses fingers and toes*


Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineslcdeltarumd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3435 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11937 times:

I am biased on this answer but.......No chance the city is hubless and extremely unlikely Delta leaves or shrinks alot . If Delta ever left Frontier would fly into town so fast it would be ridiculous.

The new terminals will be built to actually get Delta an improved operation and was designed to meet Deltas top need of more mainline sized gates. The airport will get better for Delta soon and at low costs the airport has actual cash in the bank to invest unlike most of the airports considering these projects so it wont have some huge costs increase being thrown on Delta. Delta is totally in on the new terminals and wants it to happen. It has enough gates but just too many RJ only gates and too few maineline or large RJs. Delta has been consistently profitable in both the bad times and the high oil times in SLC. It has proven successful for years and Delta values the city they wont leave something so consistent and valuable.


User currently offlineWesternA318 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 5654 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11884 times:

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 5):

I am biased on this answer but.......No chance the city is hubless and extremely unlikely Delta leaves or shrinks alot . If Delta ever left Frontier would fly into town so fast it would be ridiculous.

Hehe, if Frontier even survives to that point. But youre right, SLC and DL have almost the same relationship DL has with ATL. They arent going anywhere.



Next trip: SLC-DEN-SLC-PHX-JFK-LAX-SLC with my wife and oldest daughter. F9 to and from DEN, US to JFK, AA 321 and CR7
User currently offlineslcdeltarumd11 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 3435 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 11562 times:

I would think SLC is likely to see alot of skywest ordered Mitsubishi 90s down the road? The 717s might be perfect on the East Coast and replace alot of the 88s in ATL?

User currently onlinebobloblaw From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 1711 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 11540 times:
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Quoting flaps30 (Thread starter):

I think your airport is safe. SLC is a great place. Enjoy it.


User currently offlinebomber996 From United States of America, joined exactly 9 years ago today! , 391 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 11467 times:

SLC is to DL in the Mountian West as CLT is to US in the South East... a.k.a. not going away any time soon.

Peace   



AVIATION - A Vacation In Any Town, I Own Nothing
User currently offlinePHXFlyer16 From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 11432 times:

As others have said, every major needs a West/Mountain West hub. LAX is simply not doable as a major hub.

UA has DEN, US/AA has PHX, SW has multiple (PHX, DEN, LAS), and DL has SLC.


User currently offlineSevensixtyseven From United States of America, joined May 2011, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 11235 times:

Could we theoretically see Delta make a move into PHX should certain other airlines reduce their presence there? From multiple times flying to, from, and through PHX, T-4 is an excellent facility to use for connecting passengers.


Will that ex-HP 752 get delayed...again?
User currently offlineLV From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 2005 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 11203 times:

Quoting Sevensixtyseven (Reply 11):
Could we theoretically see Delta make a move into PHX should certain other airlines reduce their presence there? From multiple times flying to, from, and through PHX, T-4 is an excellent facility to use for connecting passengers.

I think SLC is more premium/ business oriented whereas PHX is more leisure oriented. I think yields would be lower at PHX vs. SLC. There is a massive presence of financial services around SLC and you can not discount how much traffic the LDS church generates.


User currently onlinebobloblaw From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 1711 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 11071 times:
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Quoting LV (Reply 12):

LDS is not high yield nor is the ski traffic. On the plus side, SLC has a big high tech sector.

Quoting Sevensixtyseven (Reply 11):

Why would that happen. So you're saying the Delta can make PHX work when AA/US can't. Explain that.


User currently offlineMIflyer12 From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 999 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days ago) and read 11003 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 12):
There is a massive presence of financial services around SLC and you can not discount how much traffic the LDS church generates.

Actually, one can and should. DEN and PHX (serving much larger metro areas) also have far larger domestic O&D passenger volumes. DEN ranks #4; PHX # 11, SLC #32.

http://apps.bts.gov/programs/economi...vel_price_index/html/table_07.html

That's not to say that a few airports can't thrive on connecting traffic (CLT punches way above its weight), but it's geography as much as demographics that makes it work.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7445 posts, RR: 17
Reply 15, posted (1 year 4 months 4 days ago) and read 10985 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 2):
CVG and MEM were more victims of geography than anything.
Quoting flyasaguy2005 (Reply 1):
Short answer...not a chance. DL likes to be top dog.
Quoting PHXFlyer16 (Reply 10):
As others have said, every major needs a West/Mountain West hub. LAX is simply not doable as a major hub.

All of this. Some may see DL's buildup at SEA as threatening to SLC's existence but essentially that's not going to do anything to SLC. As others have said, LAX is too far out of the way to be a major hub and SLC is serving quite fine as a mountain west hub.



次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlinePHXFlyer16 From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 10833 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 15):
All of this. Some may see DL's buildup at SEA as threatening to SLC's existence but essentially that's not going to do anything to SLC. As others have said, LAX is too far out of the way to be a major hub and SLC is serving quite fine as a mountain west hub.

I wouldn't see SEA as a threat. Similarly, SFO is not a threat to DEN for UA and LAX is not a threat to PHX for US/AA.


User currently offlineEricR From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 1904 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 10769 times:

Quoting LV (Reply 12):

I think SLC is more premium/ business oriented whereas PHX is more leisure oriented. I think yields would be lower at PHX vs. SLC.

I wouldn't necessarily conclude SLC has more premium traffic than PHX. Most of DL's ops out of SLC are on RJs with either no premium class or very small premium class. SLC definitely has an overall higher average airfare than PHX mostly due to the heavy WN competition in PHX.


User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 61
Reply 18, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 10251 times:

Quoting flaps30 (Thread starter):
but is SLC safe as an important hub for DL?

Yes, I believe SLC is very safe as a DL hub. I don't know why DL would ever want to mess up the good thing they've got going there - DL seems to be doing quite well in SLC, and I don't see anything on the horizon that would change that.

And it's easy to see why: it's a great hub in many important ways: SLC benefits from its relatively good location, relatively good climate, relatively low costs, relative lack of other hub competition (only one other network hub in the Rocky Mountain region), and the fact that DL itself has no other hub that can replicate the traffic flows SLC handles.

Quoting PHXFlyer16 (Reply 10):
every major needs a West/Mountain West hub.

No they don't. Economically and demographically, it's the least important region of the continental U.S., and the least critical one to have a hub in. There are only two true air hubs in the Mountain West region - DEN first and foremost, and SLC second. Both are spoken for, and I don't see that changing.

Quoting Sevensixtyseven (Reply 11):
Could we theoretically see Delta make a move into PHX should certain other airlines reduce their presence there?

That seems highly doubtful. SLC has two critically important things going for it that PHX doesn't: (1) SLC is in a better geographic location, and (2) SLC is less competitive.

PHX is too far south to serve as a meaningfully competitive connecting point for just about anything except its immediate surrounding region (CO, AZ, NM) and Hawaii, and it's also among the largest hubs for the nation's largest low-fare airline, meaning it's not a particularly high-yielding market, either. SLC, by contrast, is in a fine geographic position to serve as a connecting point to/from the Rocky Mountain region, and also to serve as a viable connecting point between the entire western U.S. and the east, and it's a market that DL handily dominates with little meaningful competition from Southwest or any other major carrier.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 15):
Some may see DL's buildup at SEA as threatening to SLC's existence but essentially that's not going to do anything to SLC.

Agree - SEA and SLC serve to very different purposes for DL as if anything compliment each other within the broader DL network, not compete with each other.

In my mind, DL's buildup in SEA is about one thing and one thing only: NRT. I suspect that in the last 12-18 months, DL has taken a holistic, strategic look at their Pacific network and come to the conclusion (correctly, I believe) that DL's exposure to, and reliance on, NRT as a hub for accessing the Pacific Rim is a major vulnerability. The long-term viability of NRT as a hub in its current form for DL is tenuous, in my view, and as such DL is trying to build a mainland U.S. hub that, in the long-run, can replace many of the traffic flows NRT now handles. And that's where SEA comes in.

Since SLC was never going to serve as DL's (or any airline's) major gateway to Asia, anyway, I don't see SEA detracting from SLC in this regard.


User currently onlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4209 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9769 times:

Quoting Sevensixtyseven (Reply 11):
Could we theoretically see Delta make a move into PHX should certain other airlines reduce their presence there? From multiple times flying to, from, and through PHX, T-4 is an excellent facility to use for connecting passengers.

Why would DL try to cut out a niche where there are WN and AA/US are going to be the dominant players and they would have to establish themselves. They have hubs in ATL and SLC, which is the subject of this thread and not PHX, why would they need to establish another hub. Most of the airlines now are consolidating and trying to reduce their offerings to help increase fares to make more money. Adding PHX would add nothing to DL.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2920 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9698 times:

Quoting commavia (Reply 18):
There are only two true air hubs in the Mountain West region - DEN first and foremost, and SLC second. Both are spoken for, and I don't see that changing.

Agreed. Interesting to think that Denver, given it's market and geography, sustains 3 airline hubs: United, Frontier and Southwest. Any other similar sized market couldn't have the same level of hub operation. DL has this advantage - Salt Lake is right sized for one hub and DL has a good lock on it. It is probably the most developed, and successful, asset from the Western Airlines merger (other than their people) to date.


User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 61
Reply 21, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9661 times:

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 20):
Interesting to think that Denver, given it's market and geography, sustains 3 airline hubs: United, Frontier and Southwest.

True, although remember that while DEN does sustain hubs for three airlines, it really only has 1 true network hub that functions as a major hub operation specifically for the Rocky Mountain region. Frontier's coverage of the Rocky Mountain region is pretty sparse, and Southwest's is largely nonexistent. United's hub, on the other hand, serves essentially every single population center of consequence in the entire region, and - critically - connects it into a massive nationwide and global network (something else neither Frontier nor Southwest can offer).

But, in general, yes - DEN will always be top dog as hubs (airline, economic, demographic, political, cultural, etc.) go in the Rocky Mountain region. DEN is by far the largest and best-situated market in the region to handle connecting traffic flows going in all directions. Thus why it will always be the "gold medal" of hubs in the region, with SLC the "silver." The DEN-SLC dynamic in that region is similar to the ATL-CLT dynamic in the Atlantic Southeast.

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 20):
DL has this advantage - Salt Lake is right sized for one hub and DL has a good lock on it.

Agreed. Considering how small and geographically isolated the SLC market actually is as a population center (relative to other hubs in the U.S.), the hub DL has built there really is pretty impressive. But - again - that is driven largely by the systemic advantages SLC has as a hub.


User currently offlineSevensixtyseven From United States of America, joined May 2011, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9401 times:

Quoting brilondon (Reply 19):

I'm certainly not advocating a "move" of the SLC hub (by any stretch of the imagination), but perhaps an small expansion into PHX to take advantage of a few routes that might make them money.



Will that ex-HP 752 get delayed...again?
User currently offlinecommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11559 posts, RR: 61
Reply 23, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9393 times:

Quoting Sevensixtyseven (Reply 22):
I'm certainly not advocating a "move" of the SLC hub (by any stretch of the imagination), but perhaps an small expansion into PHX to take advantage of a few routes that might make them money.

It's highly doubtful. Airlines are concentrating more and more of their capacity in strong hubs for a reason - that's how to make money. Thus why today, across the networks of the major U.S. network carriers, there is a very small portion of their capacity that does not touch one of their major hubs or focus cities. Besides, again, PHX is such a low-yielding market that I doubt it would be worth it for DL to fight for any of that local traffic, anyway - better to let the airline(s) with hub(s) there cater to it, and focus on their strong SLC hub.


User currently offlinemariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25142 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (1 year 4 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 9261 times:
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Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 5):
If Delta ever left Frontier would fly into town so fast it would be ridiculous.

That might have been true once - I don't think it is so true now.

I can't imagine Delta will ever pull down SLC, but IF it did I assume Southwest would be in like Flynn.

Frontier might add a couple of routes, but it has other fish to fry these days and why replicate DEN?

mariner



aeternum nauta
25 PHX787 : I do agree here, in some aspects. DL has been known for random upgauges into PHX and are the only US operator into PHX with "scheduled" (albeit seaso
26 Post contains images BD338 : they don't like it enough to maintain the 6am departure to SLC, that was a sweet flight for me on a Monday. Pretty much rules DL out for me on that r
27 flyasaguy2005 : I think the whole thing of it would be to VACATE DEN and let UA/WN duke it out and set up shop in SLC. This is not my personal opinion but just tryin
28 BigGSFO : Don't hold your breath for anything other than Seattle, if that.
29 slcdeltarumd11 : Exactly. They would get much higher fares being top dog in SLC then duking it out with WN and UA. Delta wont leave or give them the opportunity but t
30 mariner : I can't imagine that ever happening and I see no upside to it. Since it is all based on Delta leaving SLC, I can't imagine Southwest - or other airli
31 questions : How is SLC used? Its seems like a lot of west coast to east flows through MSP, DTW, and ATL.
32 PHXFlyer16 : *sigh* here we go again... Not sure if you fly on the west coast or not, but those of us who live here need a way to get from pout A to point B withi
33 bobloblaw : Intrawest flying plus smaller cities that cant support service to MSP, the closest hub.
34 bobloblaw : Its not clear that it can. Are WN and UA making money there? Will F9 survive? It is likely that WN and UA are both losing money and subsidizing their
35 flaps30 : Not sure how true that is when speaking of WN at Denver. If they were losing money at Denver than how could one explain how Denver has risen all the
36 Post contains images commavia : "Sigh" indeed. Fine. But with respect specifically to intra-west trafic flows, PHX is only good for connecting a very specific set of "Point As" to a
37 flyguy89 : He's not talking about the West Coast, he's talking about the Mountain West, reread his post and what he was responding to. No, AA was not competitiv
38 LHCVG : This good to point out -- US may have a rather large number of backtracking itineraries, but they do manage to make it work and make money doing it.
39 WesternA318 : Looking through my travel agency bookings, I have quite a lot of pax going through SLC from the Pacific NW to SOCal and throughout the west. They don
40 commavia : Again - there's no question that such connections certainly exist. People fly BOS-MIA-MSY, too. The point I was making is that such connections are i
41 mayor : How does the 717 do in the "hot and high" scenarios, like SLC in the summer? When I worked at SLC, there was a rumor floating around for years, after
42 WesternA318 : You know, Im not sure. Back in my TWA days, we didnt send them anywhere west of COS and DEN, neither of which actually saw the 717's before AA bought
43 Deltal1011man : Not going anywhere. IIRC this summer it will see the most mainline it has a long time. 320/319 to *most* major cities. (ie IAH is getting a airbus th
44 PHXFlyer16 : Funny how you brought PHX into this, and I didn't even mention it in my post. My post was an argument that AA needs a hub west of DFW. WIthout a hub
45 WesternA318 : Thats what I was thinking...and what I said. We might get one in SLC as an equipment swap, but that would be highly unlikely...thats also why DL took
46 Post contains images commavia : And my post was an argument that no viable hub exists west of DFW for AA, or west of SLC for DL. So essentially no net change from now, where AA reli
47 mariner : People have been saying that for seven years, but as an abstract concept, without regard to what is happening on the ground - where something has giv
48 Deltal1011man : LCC is doing something to make money, IMO....PHX is a part of this. (and proof of this is the fact that is has one of the highest mainline %s in the
49 commavia : PHX is part of it - no question. But again, in my view, it's part of it for two reasons: (1) US has the lowest costs of the legacy carriers, and (2) U
50 PHXFlyer16 : What? Anything west of DFW to any other destination west of DFW is better connected through PHX. We get it, PHX is south, but it's better than going
51 LHCVG : And especially with the partner AS hub there. At best any DL-to-DL connectivity would be similar to UA at FLL where they connect some very specific p
52 commavia : Nobody is suggesting DFW is a viable connecting point for intra-west connections. My point was that PHX really isn't much of one, either. I again com
53 SLCUT2777 : A DL Acquisition of AS via a merger would change this and SEA along with MSP and what DL can do at LAX would make SLC redundant however This actually
54 SLCUT2777 : WN would expand VERY quickly in SLC and would own it faster than they've destroyed F9 in DEN. I also might add that DEN wanted Western, and this was
55 mariner : Certainly Southwest would expand dramatically and quickly at SLC, as I've already said. I am not sure how they have "destroyed" Frontier at DEN, sinc
56 mayor : The rumor was pretty hot and heavy around the time that DL was trying to decide which hub to downsize, SLC or DFW. There always seemed to be a factio
57 commavia : I don't see how you figure. Even if - big if - DL and AS were to merge, and SEA and SLC were to be united within the same network, the fundamental pu
58 Post contains images flyguy89 : Then every other major carrier that declared bankruptcy must have the same story, why you think that's unique to AA I'll never know. The point he was
59 brilondon : PHX is not a great connection city as the airline that flies there is not a great one to fly. I prefer to fly from SLC or SEA if I have to connect an
60 Deltal1011man : Well I would have agreed with you till I saw US had a 60%+ mainline % at PHX. Why is that a big deal to me? generally when the legacies run into WN t
61 commavia : Thus my point - US mainline is the lowest-cost network carrier there is! That is why they are able to hold their own against WN in PHX. But post-merg
62 Deltal1011man : lower cost than RJ flying? While the CASM of say a CR9 is fairly high, I would still think that YV or OO would beat US mainline cost. now, your key p
63 mayor : Well, WE certainly cared, not that it mattered much what we thought.
64 Deltal1011man : and I'm betting you, like the rest of the employees would have given his worthless ass the boot looooong before the BOD did. (and I'd say Ronny would
65 mayor : I always thought that Grinstein, when he was on the Executive hiring committee, always felt bad about hiring Leo, and that's why he did such a good j
66 Post contains images Deltal1011man : Grinstein is just a people person. He did all the same things Horton and Tilton did, he just did it the right way. Employees take a pay cut, Gerry, J
67 EricR : Well there is a simple reason for this. Contrary to what it may appear at first glance, there are a large number of destinations out of PHX where US
68 mayor : I really doubt that, because, even though he was on the BOD, Grinstein left DL and went to Burlington Northern. On top of that, that would be more th
69 SLCUT2777 : By 2002-2003 DEN came back into the mix "IF" UA ended up going completely into a Chapter 7 liquidation. In that scenario SLC & DFW would have bee
70 bobloblaw : No it wouldnt, it would actually strengthen SLC, just as DEN is helped by SFO and LAX.
71 mayor : And THAT, considering all other factors staying the same at DEN, may have been a monumental mistake, in my eyes. Would the same thing happen to DL if
72 Post contains images PHX787 : Ok from here on out, instead of drawing out these long threads to unneccessary lengths about who deserves/gets what, why don't we all agree to disagr
73 SLCUT2777 : DEN is much further east in realtion to SFO & LAX as well as substantially larger a market than SLC is from LAX or SEA in that scenario.
74 WesternA318 : On some of these cities, US trumps WN also by offering their biggest narrowbodies (A321, and 757's on select flights) in addition to the Express flyi
75 EricR : I don't see any 757's on those routes. I do see some with A321's, but in those few ocassions (ie. SNA, SLC) PHX is the only hub connected to those sp
76 N766UA : Short answer: absolutely. Despite what others say, every hub has to prove itself every day in today's climate. SLC ain't ATL.
77 SLCUT2777 : It also ain't DEN, PHX or LAS in the more immediate region.
78 mayor : Shorter answer: slim and none. What is?
79 WesternA318 : They have been operated in the past (PHX-SAN, PHX-SNA, PHX-LAX), not sure about the schedules now, aside from a bunch of A319/320/321's and CRJ's thr
80 SLCUT2777 : Interestingly it is the WN loyalists so to say that don't like the idea of rebuilding the terminals, concourses & parking structures at SLC.
81 mayor : Well, it isn't the extra traffic that WN has brought to SLC that has made it necessary, for sure.
82 mplsjefe : SLC ain't DTW or MSP either as both are cash cow hubs for DL (MSP often listed as the most profitable, while AL largest margins overall) and print $
83 WesternA318 : Havent they drawn down SLC in the last decade or so in favor of DEN, PHX, and LAS?
84 EricR : With respect to PHX, WN is actually down over the last decade from 200+ daily flights to 167 daily flights.
85 WesternA318 : Still, thats not as bad a hit as from what SLC was in the 90's to what it is now...
86 SLCUT2777 : The big catch with SLC is it is a substantially growing O&D market, with roughly only half the passenger load being connecting DL passengers, a s
87 mayor : The population of the state of Utah has almost doubled since the 90s with most of that along the Wasatch Front.
88 WesternA318 : and the new masterplan looks good! Just out of curiosity, how much bigger would the FIS be, and how many gates would be connected to it?
89 SLCUT2777 : Which is why DL won't walk away from SLC despite the perception that it'll never have the O&D that DEN, PHX or LAS offer. I'm only concerned abou
90 WesternA318 : Also, you wouldnt believe just how many major Utah corporations and religions have massive corporate travel contracts with DL exclusively. There's al
91 slcdeltarumd11 : LAS has shown it has the o&d to be a hub for multiple airlines but does not have the last minute business travel or high enough fares to sustain a
92 WesternA318 : Thanks to Frontier's lackadaisiacal management and shrinking! I remember right after the Morris Air merger there were rumours WN was trying to take o
93 SLCUT2777 : IF AF/KL have an LHR slot to give up, how well would SLC compete in the DL network to potentially land it?
94 WesternA318 : I'm pretty sure one of the other hubs that are screaming for another daytime flight would have toppriority, but as far as a new destination from LHR,
95 mayor : In the same time period when AA got the RDU-LHR and BNA-LHR routes, we thought SLC-London had a chance instead of one of those AA city pairs but poli
96 slcdeltarumd11 : Things could change but as of right now Delta has said its priority is SEA, a 2nd to DTW, then SLC. Could take some time but i would hope Summer 2014
97 BoeingGuy : Didn't DL apply for SLC-London around the 2000 time frame? I seem to recall that. AA applied for SJC-LGW also.
98 WesternA318 : I seem to recall that too. Didnt pan out, BUT, hopefully soon SLC will see an LHR link...maybe even AMS *wishful thinking*
99 mayor : I don't recall when it was. Those on A.net can probably recall better than I. All I remember is that the DOT was going to grant TWO gateways and sinc
100 slcdeltarumd11 : I thought Delta Applied for SLC-LHR and AA got RDU both and BNA first? I do think SLC-LHR will happen. I thought years ago the CEO of Delta said in a
101 SLCUT2777 : Those were to LGW. DL wanted SLC-LGW since only AA, CO & UA had LHR rights at the time. MSP is also a potential LHR frequency, but I think DL wou
102 Deltal1011man : Should be the next city to get a LHR slot And already has the slots for SEA and DTW. AMS will be a while. LHR will happen first. Delta said in the JV
103 SLCUT2777 : It was 1993 when DL applied for SLC-LGW, but the frequency went to AA RDU-LGW since USDOT Sec' Federico Pena had a bone to pick with DL for not pullin
104 Post contains images WesternA318 : Oh I know that...just wishful thinking on my part, lol. I know it'd be too much to ask, but Im crossing my fingers for an A330 on the route, lol. As
105 mayor : Wouldn't surprise me, but I remember the other scenario, too..........AA got RDU-LHR AND BNA-LHR, even tho the DOT's own rules stated that one carrie
106 SLCUT2777 : Probably a 763ER during the less volume winter months but during the summer months I wouldn't rule out a 772ER...availability of equipment being the
107 SLCUT2777 : As mayor of Denver, Pena planned and moved ahead with the DIA plan assuming that Western would jump at moving the SLC operation to DEN with an airfie
108 mayor : Well, by that time, DL was pretty well established in SLC, including having already built the hangar and the res building. Doesn't seem very realisti
109 DocLightning : Not just O&D to SLC, but transfers to the surrounding mountain resorts. SLC is to DL what DEN is to UA. It is essential and irreplaceable in the
110 cschleic : I could be wrong, but would think that SLC has lower operating costs than DEN. It certainly has better weather which probably reduces delays and relat
111 PSU.DTW.SCE : I highly, highly doubt DL would but a 77E on SLC-LHR. No way. It would be 763/764 or A330-200. Most likely 763ER to start. DL doesn't fly 777s to LHR
112 Post contains images WesternA318 : I could see a mix of 332/333 equipment in the summer, and 763 to round out the fall and winter and most of spring. a 772ER (in DL's current fleet) wo
113 SLCUT2777 : My caveat on the 772ER would be that equipment would be down the road for DL out of SLC for LHR. I’m not sure even if any of the concourse D gates
114 mayor : Well, D2 can certainly accomodate a 777, I've seen it done.....of course, D4 isn't usable then. D-1 was DL's gate when D concourse was built and it w
115 Post contains images WesternA318 : The 772 can fit, it opts as a substitution when a 763 is out of commision on the morning ATL flight (or even the 130PM departure). I've seen it done,
116 mayor : Yes, for a short time after the merger, DL was using the DC-8-71s. We even had one or two as an equipment substitution before the merger. I can recal
117 WesternA318 : That and, I assume here, no one wants to playa distant 2nd fiddle to AA's dominance at DFW? How many flights did we have at DFW at its peak?
118 Post contains links and images point2point : Per Denver WIngtips March 2013 http://business.flydenver.com/info/n...tions/wingtips/2013MarchLarge.html Sometime around 2025, DEN will have paid off
119 WesternA318 : Probably not lower than SLC, then the only barrier for anyone wanting to hub DEN would be trying to go up against WN and UA. Still though, 2025 s a w
120 Post contains images point2point : Yeah, 2025 is a bit of a ways off...... so if any a.netters want to be kicking DEN around as a high cost airport........ you only have some 11+ years
121 SLCUT2777 : I think however SLC Airport financial planners have taught DEN and other airports around North America a valuable financial lesson in recent years.
122 mayor : Not sure how other airports, in the U.S., of this size or larger, do it, but I do remember that SLC was self funded by landing fees, rents, etc. As f
123 Post contains images point2point : Maybe....... I have to wonder though..... that the initial costs for the new DEN were to be $3.5B, and then the automated baggage fiasco pushed the a
124 slcdeltarumd11 : Extremely well managed airport. Stash cash while you are running near full capacity then rebuild exactly taking requests to keep your hub carrier happ
125 SLCUT2777 : In Canada some of the larger airports YYZ, YVR, YUL even YYC must actually pay rent to Transport Canada which is why domestic airfares comparatively
126 WesternA318 : I believe they have. Like they have been since 1994 or so? LOL, I wonder just how much pressure WN puts on DL in SLC (if any at all).
127 SLCUT2777 : Mostly fare pricing on the thicker O&D routes, but yes, DL has chased WN from SLC city pairs and they are significantly less than they were under
128 WesternA318 : That much I remember, fares were insane out of SLC in the early 90's...
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