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LA Approves $5Bil LAX Airport Modernization  
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25056 posts, RR: 46
Posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 1 day ago) and read 16689 times:

Surely pending the arrival of multiple lawsuits, the Los Angeles City Council on Tuesday approved a politically divisive modernization plan for Los Angeles International Airport that is expected to cost nearly $5 billion.

The vote caps almost a decade of discussion about what to do with the northside airfield for which the FAA has sought to relocate the northernmost runway as a safety enhancement.

As part of the approved plan the 06L/24R runway would be shifted 260-feet to the north and a centerway taxiway running between the runways will be constructed similar to the southside configuration.

In addition the runway relocation the council also approved the airport to proceed with other improvements, including further phases of work at the TBIT international terminal, development of consolidated car rental facility, an elevated people mover and a transportation center with that will eventually link to local bus and light rail service.

Construction isn't expected to start for roughly five years, with the approved proposals still subject to local, state and federal environmental analysis, and mayoral approval. Its interesting as both candidates for the mayoral election next month, oppose the proposed plan.

Story:
Los Angeles Approves $5 Billion Airport Modernization
http://goo.gl/FYRoX

=

[Edited 2013-04-30 18:39:17]


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
92 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLDVAviation From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 1056 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 16429 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
Surely pending the arrival of multiple lawsuits, the Los Angeles City Council on Tuesday approved a politically divisive modernization plan for Los Angeles International Airport that is expected to cost nearly $5 billion.

One can only hope that the commercial interests that stand to make millions of dollars from the contracts to build the various elements of the modernization plan, from runways to terminal, overwhelm the NIMBY groups with their money and political influence.

In the process, I hope the commercial interests and their lobbyists can debunk once and for all the idea to "regionalize air traffic." Traffic at Ontario Airport has not fallen 40% because of some LAWA conspiracy to thwart efforts at regionalization. It has fallen because no one wants to fly out of Ontario, not the airlines or the passengers.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25056 posts, RR: 46
Reply 2, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 16364 times:

And here comes the first grenade

Angry Coalition of Airport Communities to Challenge Leadership over Lack of Accountability at LAX
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/angry-...mmunities-challenge-000300226.html

Community activist, mayoral candidates, city council members, CA state legislator, SEIU United Service Workers, LA Airport Police union, all united against the airport plans.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently onlineoc2dc From United States of America, joined Feb 2013, 364 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 16005 times:

The moving of the runway is a massive waste of money. LAX has a good safety record and doesn't suffer from delays. There is no need to spend this ridiculous amount of money on something so unnecessary.

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
In addition the runway relocation the council also approved the airport to proceed with other improvements, including further phases of work at the TBIT international terminal, development of consolidated car rental facility, an elevated people mover and a transportation center with that will eventually link to local bus and light rail service.

This portion of the project is desperately needed. I recently visited MIA and was incredibly impressed by the tram and the consolidated car rental facility. I imagine LAX's facility will be similar.

Also, I feel like the way LAX is now, its like 8 different airports on one lot. Barely any of the terminals are actually connected and it's cumbersome to transfer from terminal to terminal, especially when going from the north side terminals to the south side terminals. The new people mover will help greatly improve the transfer experience and unify the airport. Hopefully it will be a secured people mover. Do we know if it will be outside or inside security?

Exciting times for LAX...minus the runway project and the loss of our beloved in-n-out.



I'm not complaining, I'm critiquing...
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25056 posts, RR: 46
Reply 4, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 15733 times:

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
The moving of the runway is a massive waste of money. LAX has a good safety record and doesn't suffer from delays.

While I generally also agree its a huge financial pit, In fairness LAX does have its share of runway incursions, and also the current configuration on the north side does cause the FAA operational issues when VLAs are around.

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
I feel like the way LAX is now, its like 8 different airports on one lot. Barely any of the terminals are actually connected

Its like that by design.

The central terminal area was built as individual satellite terminals with the major carriers of the times each calling one home. There was very little need to connect, as they were essentially self sufficient exclusive islands.

The design focus was to get people from the curb to their flights and back with minimal hassle or distance.

Fast forward, the airport today still works that way. Being the worlds biggest O&D airport, only a small percentage of passengers transfer, and most do so on the same carrier under the same roof, so the primary focus is still to get people from their cars to flights and back as easily as possible.

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
Hopefully it will be a secured people mover. Do we know if it will be outside or inside security?

It will be outside - to connect to the proposed transit center off the airport.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinetimpdx From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 545 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 15652 times:

Is this the plan that includes the big arched bridge over the connecting taxiway?

User currently offlineLDVAviation From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 1056 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 15598 times:

Quoting timpdx (Reply 5):
Is this the plan that includes the big arched bridge over the connecting taxiway?

The bridge is more or less dead. The idea gaining favor now is a tunnel (with an APM) between TBIT and the Midfield concourse.


User currently offlineHNL From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 15536 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 2):
Community activist, mayoral candidates, city council members, CA state legislator, SEIU United Service Workers, LA Airport Police union, all united against the airport plans.

Why would the LA Police Union object to this plan? Let alone the unions. Makes no sense.



HNL - There's no place like it!
User currently offlineLDVAviation From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 1056 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 15471 times:

Quoting HNL (Reply 7):
Why would the LA Police Union object to this plan? Let alone the unions. Makes no sense.

Let's speculate.

First of all, it is the Airport Police Union. They are a distinct entity from the LA Police Dept. Union. If I remember correctly, there was some proposal a while back to turn their jobs over to the LA Police Department. Perhaps, they think by joining this coalition that they will gain some leverage.

Same with the other union. If I remember correctly again, the SEIU has been involved in some dispute with one of the contractors at LAX. So far, LAWA has not intervened.

[Edited 2013-04-30 22:24:05]

User currently offlineJoeCanuck From Canada, joined Dec 2005, 5416 posts, RR: 30
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 15385 times:

I did my first flying to and from LAX last week...and I was completely underwhelmed. I have a new least favourite airport. I can only guess that LA hates fat people because I have never had to walk so far in my life to make a connection.

An airport that spread out with no tram or moving walkways boggles the mind. The tunnels had a lovely third world patina...the missing ceiling panels and dust bunnies the size of rottweilers were especially rustic.

My guess an earthquake would cause billions of dollars of improvements.

LAS was such a treat in comparison.



What the...?
User currently offlineByrdluvs747 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2358 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 15158 times:

So does this plan mean that T1-T3 will remain in addition to the midfield concourse?

Quoting LDVAviation (Reply 1):
One can only hope that the commercial interests that stand to make millions of dollars from the contracts to build the various elements of the modernization plan, from runways to terminal, overwhelm the NIMBY groups with their money and political influence.

I normally don't like the idea of corporate cronyism, but these activists are purely obstructionist at this point. Their constant lawsuits are simply to protect the stupidity of those who bought property near an airport in one of the nation's largest cities.

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
The moving of the runway is a massive waste of money. LAX has a good safety record and doesn't suffer from delays. There is no need to spend this ridiculous amount of money on something so unnecessary.

Its always a waste until that one tragic incursion happens, and then every blowhard politician who objects to the runway expansion then will be calling for increased safety at LAX. I'd rather spend a couple billion on runway safety improvements than see (or be one of) charred bodies strewn across LAX's runway.

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
The new people mover will help greatly improve the transfer experience and unify the airport. Hopefully it will be a secured people mover.

You are totally misunderstanding the purpose of the people mover. Its purpose isn't to facilitate inter-terminal transfers, but to transport pax to/from rental, and parking/hotel transfers.

Quoting LDVAviation (Reply 6):
The bridge is more or less dead. The idea gaining favor now is a tunnel (with an APM) between TBIT and the Midfield concourse.

The question then becomes will the tunnel station be on the north or south of TBIT. Hopefully, AA will really lobby hard to build it on their side.

Quoting HNL (Reply 7):
Why would the LA Police Union object to this plan? Let alone the unions. Makes no sense.

I don't understand either. The airport workers should only benefit from the job security of additional infrastructure. The only thing I can think of is they want the money to be spent on wage increases.



The 747: The hands who designed it were guided by god.
User currently offlineboilerla From United States of America, joined Jul 2010, 360 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 14976 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
Fast forward, the airport today still works that way. Being the worlds biggest O&D airport, only a small percentage of passengers transfer, and most do so on the same carrier under the same roof, so the primary focus is still to get people from their cars to flights and back as easily as possible.

Although it's a stab in the dark, based on my experience I'd wager many of the transfers that do occur are: United (T7) to the Star Alliance partners in T2, and United to the Bradley. It's not that often, but it's a big pain.

Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 9):
An airport that spread out with no tram or moving walkways boggles the mind. The tunnels had a lovely third world patina...the missing ceiling panels and dust bunnies the size of rottweilers were especially rustic.

  

I'd vote that the money used for the runway move be put to use in modernizing the terminal interiors. Heck, the money that will invariably be spent fighting the barrage of lawsuits from Inglewood and Westchester on the runway move alone could be put to good use. Take it, and for the love of mercy do something about T2, T3 and T6 in that order. I realize T1 will be changing soon, otherwise I'd put it on my list, and I haven't been inside T4 since American got on the wrong side of a lost luggage dispute argument. But really, compared to the bradley terminal which is quite nice inside, everything else is a dump compared to SFO, ORD....well most airports really.


User currently offlinegoosebayguy From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2009, 394 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 14838 times:

Meanwhile DXB has the worlds largest baggage hall a train to whisk you away and an entire terminal catering for the A380. LAX is falling behined massively here.

User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4905 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 14758 times:

Great to see vast amount of investment in LAX by modernising the facilities but what about providing some relief during peak times? We stayed at the Sheraton & the trip had taken us about 25-30 minutes!

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineBHMNONREV From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1368 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 14625 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 13):
Great to see vast amount of investment in LAX by modernising the facilities but what about providing some relief during peak times? We stayed at the Sheraton & the trip had taken us about 25-30 minutes!

I have been thru LAX several times in the last few months, and the road gridlock is absolutely horrible. Half of the traffic seems to be rental car buses and shuttles of all kinds, getting these off the roads and into a proposed consolidated facility with a people mover seems to be a good first step.

Quoting boilerla (Reply 11):
and I haven't been inside T4 since American got on the wrong side of a lost luggage dispute argument.

T4 is actually not too bad from an aesthetics standpoint, I was in there a couple days ago on the way to Brisbane but the place is an absolute madhouse at 10pm. It is in much better shape than T7 IMHO.

As far as the runway I agree with the consensus here, it is just not necessary and certainly not worth the fight which will occur. Keep all the VLA's on the 7/25's and just make LAX a more efficient facility.


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 4905 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 14510 times:

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 14):
I have been thru LAX several times in the last few months, and the road gridlock is absolutely horrible. Half of the traffic seems to be rental car buses and shuttles of all kinds, getting these off the roads and into a proposed consolidated facility with a people mover seems to be a good first step.

Agreed & agreed! The gridlock was mind blowing & as you quoted one of the main contributors are the car rental shuttles.

EK413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinemodesto2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2791 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 13443 times:

I hope they put more thought into the north side's taxiways that separate the two runways. The configuration at the intersection of taxiways M and H6 on the south side creates confusion and was poorly designed as pilots often attempt to cut the corner. They should've eliminated H6, and just installed H8 and H4 for simple and easy-to-follow taxiway design.

User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12981 posts, RR: 100
Reply 17, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 13281 times:
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Finally! Past due! I still hold hopes of some more ground transportation expansion.

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
As part of the approved plan the 06L/24R runway would be shifted 260-feet to the north and a centerway taxiway running between the runways will be constructed similar to the southside configuration.

Excellent. This will smooth out VLA operations from the new T6.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
In fairness LAX does have its share of runway incursions

About half of the US total IIRC, so a wee bit more than 'its share.'

Quoting EK413 (Reply 15):
The gridlock was mind blowing & as you quoted one of the main contributors are the car rental shuttles.

  

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 4):
It will be outside - to connect to the proposed transit center off the airport.

I bet the airport grows enough within 3 years after the expansion the difference isn't noticeable. While I approve of the expansion, more is needed for the time frame we're discussing.

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinetwincessna340a From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 12846 times:

Quoting goosebayguy (Reply 12):

Meanwhile DXB has the worlds largest baggage hall a train to whisk you away and an entire terminal catering for the A380. LAX is falling behined massively here.

Yes LAX is falling behind....it is arguably the US equivalent of LHR. Comparing it to DXB, really? Not only is Dubai a massive desert, they have infinite money and people get relocated at the will of the government.


User currently offlinelightsaber From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 12981 posts, RR: 100
Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 12286 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting twincessna340a (Reply 18):
Comparing it to DXB, really?

How about SIN, HKG, PEK, PVG, or ICN? I wouldn't compare LAX to LHR. My experiences at LHR have been superior to LAX.

I swear, my beloved Los Angeles is becoming the next Detroit, unable to build and only explain why things cannot be done.

LAX is past due for expansion. I'm glad *something* is being done.


Now to see a new or massively expanded SAN...

Lightsaber



Societies that achieve a critical mass of ideas achieve self sustaining growth; others stagnate.
User currently offlinecosyr From United States of America, joined Jul 2012, 386 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 12286 times:

The article I just read on USAtoday, it said that terminals 1, 2, and 3 are being demolished as part of the project. I thought the just announced an expansion of terminal 1. Are they changing those plans now?

User currently offlineByrdluvs747 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 2358 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 12053 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 19):
I wouldn't compare LAX to LHR. My experiences at LHR

We're not talking about personal experiences. Comparing LAX to LHR is fairly valid as both airports suffer from political barriers to expansion.



The 747: The hands who designed it were guided by god.
User currently offlinerangercarp From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 143 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 12000 times:

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 19):
I swear, my beloved Los Angeles is becoming the next Detroit, unable to build and only explain why things cannot be done.

I assume you are making a comparison of the two cities in general, but considering we are talking about airport upgrades, comparing to Detroit is not a good idea. Unlike LAX, both terminals at DTW are late model and top-notch.



iwgbtp!
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25056 posts, RR: 46
Reply 23, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 12010 times:

Quoting cosyr (Reply 20):
The article I just read on USAtoday, it said that terminals 1, 2, and 3 are being demolished as part of the project. I thought the just announced an expansion of terminal 1. Are they changing those plans now?

USA Today got the story mixed up.

What was approved was the following below.






For Terminals - what was blessed was
1) TBIT northside concourse build out (current planned dog leg eliminated)
2) Northside portion of Midfield Satellite Concourse
3) T-3 is reconfigured
4) Option to build a T-0 connected to T-1

=



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21501 posts, RR: 60
Reply 24, posted (1 year 3 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 11823 times:

Quoting oc2dc (Reply 3):
The moving of the runway is a massive waste of money. LAX has a good safety record and doesn't suffer from delays. There is no need to spend this ridiculous amount of money on something so unnecessary.

As I've stated before, I agree completely.

Many major airports in the world make do with 2 parallel runways. LAX has the luxury of 4. Having all 4 spaced to A380 standards is a huge waste of money. No matter how popular LAX becomes, more than 70% of all departures and arrivals will be narrowbodies. And just as now, the only major danger those narrowbodies pose to the runways comes from pilots not listening to or understanding the instructions of the controllers. That won't change.

If it were just a matter of expanding into unoccupied land, that would be one thing. But the taxiway will require the moving/sinking of major roadways, the destruction of part of a neighborhood, and will take years to achieve, with a major disruption to the landside of LAX operations for years as well. This boondoggle also involves demolition of airport parking and off-site parking, the removal of a popular city park, encroach on 2 high schools and a golf course, and will absolutely cost 2 to 3 times what they claim once it's all said and done. Remember, the roadway portion will be paid for with state and federal funds, not just LAX funds, and the MO for these kinds of projects is to run out of money and go begging for more.

If LAX is worried about A380s and 748s (all 20 of them) and 77Xs transiting the midfield and not having enough room to maneuver to reach gates at T2, the simplest answer is to designate T1-T3 as 200 foot wingspan or less. It's cheaper to pay carriers like AF to move out of T2 into the modern TBIT than it is to move the runways. T-2 could become a nice home for AS and LATAM carriers who fly international on NBs. Not sure where this leaves HA if the A350-800 ever delivers, but that would only matter if they choose to fly it to LAX over the A330, and I'm not sure why they would...



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
25 LDVAviation : Your wager might be wrong. When we last discussed the topic, particularly with respect to the T4 connector, we learned that most of the passengers tr
26 Post contains images cschleic : Exactly, this isn't one of those things where everyone waits for a car crash before installing a traffic light. Now, my real beef with it is it'll me
27 oc2dc : Well that is slightly disappointing. But after looking at the plans, I can see that the people mover may not just be for transporting people to the i
28 Post contains images FlyingGoat : Nice to see the In-N-Out location will not be effected! The aircraft should fly right over In-N-Out.
29 HNL : So which is it? Is the In-N-Out safe or at risk?
30 LAXintl : Sure there are some transfers at LAX, but something like 90% of enplanement are O&D. And of that remaining 10%, the bulk is clearly ones under th
31 Post contains images FlyingGoat : Perhaps my enthusiasm was a bit premature, but it's nice to see at least one map that suggests the In-N-Out will remain. If I were a betting man, I'd
32 Viscount724 : There must be many connections between international and domestic carriers at LAX. That's never been convenient, even between members of the same all
33 LAXintl : Sure out of 64 odd million annual passengers a million or two might be transferring on international connections, but again the airports focus from d
34 JHwk : I think the hardest is from gate 60-63 on United to the upper 80's on United Express. It is quite a haul. The plan doesn't seem to address that. The
35 airplaneboy : Does building a terminal 0 seem like a realistic possibility? Would it be connected to Terminal 1 inside the secure area?
36 aklrno : The published maps show the land needed for construction purposes that needs to be bought. Somewhere in the planning documents it says that the FAA w
37 Post contains images 802flyguy : As long as the In-N-Out stays I'm okay! That said, I do have some concerns, most of which were very well covered in replies 24, 30 and,33. The congest
38 LAXintl : Well this approval give the airport the option to pursue it. Might be beneficial for domestic operators - ala SWA, and others depending on what size
39 JHwk : As nice as SFO's international terminal connection to BART is, it was a whole lot of money spent poorly. A better land-side people mover (read faster
40 Post contains links 802flyguy : Not only that but there are three changes of level from BART to the ticket counter (or bag claim). Not to mention that BART actually takes longer and
41 Braniff747SP : Excellent news... Now comes the legal fight which LAX has every right to win. Only downside is... Where does In N Out go?
42 ontime : While this might be a minor point in the context of such a large airport improvement project, I am very disappointed to see that the Automated People
43 StuckInCA : Exactly. Eight terrible airports on one lot. By bad design. I'm not sure what good solution exists for LAX. I'm guessing it'll get incremental improv
44 JHwk : Doh... I missed that part! Wow, talk about turning a great opportunity into an awful solution! Assuming an optimistic expansion of Metro, it would ta
45 aerowrench : It would probably be best to do some research before blabbing about a safety record. Up until the South Complex runway project, LAX was top dog for r
46 Boeing717200 : Rough math says it and the parking structure will be inside the RPZ... Not a good sign for burger fans...
47 N62NA : Perhaps in another decade they could detour the Crenshaw line so that it just doesn't go past the airport, but actually loops into the airport. But t
48 web500sjc : I wish they could ATL-ize it, have a big terminal on the east end, and then have a tunnel out to concourses. The airport is a mess to drive around an
49 Post contains images lightsaber : Touche'. Oh.... That would be a bonus. Add to that fantasy having the green line and bring down the Expo line... and I'm there. How can the airport *
50 legacyins : If you can figure how to get a heavy rail line across a major 8 lane highway and does not cost over a billion, I think you have a fine idea. BART goe
51 KD5MDK : For the people saying light rail should go into LAX, to which terminal? It's certainly not going to stop at all of them. APM to a single station makes
52 Byrdluvs747 : I'm not convinced all the airlines want a common terminal. DL is still playing their game of closing the tunnel between T4 and T5 in order to prevent
53 christao17 : Once or twice I year I fly into LAX from BKK and then make a domestic connection to United. The walk from TBIT to Terminal 7 isn't bad at all and pro
54 802flyguy : You're right, of course, that actually putting Caltrain into the airport would be insanely expensive. What I was thinking is keeping the tracks where
55 Post contains links and images lightsaber : Eight of the twelve US runway incursions occurred at LAX in 2009. http://articles.latimes.com/2009/oct/09/local/me-runways9 While that is *far* better
56 LAXintl : Why would it bad design when the airline community specifically requested the a design to have isolated islands, with individual private satellite te
57 mercure1 : So while maybe LAX might not be the prettiest or fanciest it certainly is rather practical and does a good job for the bulk of travelers. It is indeed
58 Deltal1011man : ....Not to start a political debate but uh... don't get your hopes up. CA seems perfectly happy handicapping industry and doesn't seem to care about
59 JHwk : I do love being able to "sneak out" from Terminal 8 right into the taxi queue. Drop-off for United works best as well. Yes, but... have you ever been
60 N62NA : I believe the Crenshaw line accomplishes this, unless you're saying start Crenshaw trains in downtown LA, run them over the expo to Crenshaw and then
61 mercure1 : What airport have you been to that has been pleasant during a bomb scare, or employee strike ? Sure LAX might not be that modern, fancy or spacious b
62 aklrno : T-2 at LAX is the fastest big city international airport experience I know of. Heading into NZ at T-2 I can go from the curb to the gate in 10 minutes
63 StuckInCA : I'll turn this back on you. Why does the fact that it's what the airline community asked for mean that it's not a bad design? Based on your username,
64 LDVAviation : You can't really compare LAX to any of those airports. The metro areas served by SEA and MSP are not world capitals. There was a lot more to overcome
65 Deltal1011man : pretty much nail on the head here. Nice post. Thats because SEA/MSP aren't on the same level. AA/DL/UA along have nearly 600 flights a day. With WN i
66 WALmsp : First off, I would say that the adage "the customer is always right" applies here with the airlines being the customers in the airport being the serv
67 aklrno : I I can't tell you how many times I have heard criticism of an engineering/design decision by someone who wasn't there but knows much better what shou
68 Beardown91737 : Same timeframe as O'Hare, but ORD scaled better. I really liked LAX before the 1984 Olympics. Back when LAX was in its original configuration, there
69 Post contains images lightsaber : And then they wonder why business goes to Nevada, Colorado, or Texas... Look at the empty office buildings, retail, and warehouses in the South bay p
70 ikramerica : The roadway has nothing to do with this. The roadway is for o&d and an inter terminal train does nothing to address how crowded the road gets. DF
71 Post contains links and images LAXintl : LAX was a unique opportunity for the industry. They had open land and a blank canvas to come up with what was to be the first facility built designed
72 mercure1 : Impressive photo. Amazing how vacant and empty the area looked. I also love the theme building. So unique and futuristic still. Yes agree, its still a
73 DocLightning : In the last decade, Detroit has opened not one but TWO brand-new, sparkling, gorgeous, modern terminals. I haven't used the North Terminal yet, but M
74 Post contains images lightsaber : I was referring the general transfer issues being discussed. But its not just buses. LAX does not have the terminal floor space for the quantity of p
75 LDVAviation : LAX has its own revenue sources, it does not draw revenues from the city. The Airport Board is spending a lot of money. Review the management reports
76 UALAX : Thank you LDVAviation for your insight. It seems to be a pastime on this forum to bash LAX without realizing the airport has taken significant steps
77 WA707atMSP : The midfield (NW, now DL) terminal was built in the late 1990s, at the height of popularity of SUVs like the Ford Excursion, when the "Detroit three"
78 StuckInCA : That's beside my point. And I'm not sure I'd classify LA as a world capital. Maybe. The point is that it's a terrible airport. It may have been a fin
79 LDVAviation : There was an article in Aviation Week when the Midfield Concourse opened that indicated that the Feds were involved in economic engineering. (I could
80 Post contains images LAXintl : Personally I cant wait for the time when airlines start complain LAX is too expensive. Might be the only true chance to discourage increased activity
81 Beardown91737 : Agreed that LAX is well designed for what the airlines wanted in 1961. The question still remains if $5 billion can fix it. Runway incursions have to
82 ADent : Where are they going to go? SNA and LGB are slot constrained. BUR has curfews and limited facilities. ONT is way out there, in an area economically d
83 Byrdluvs747 : The idea of a regionalized airport system in LA is a mythical pipe dream of community activists. It requires airlines to duplicate their efforts/cost
84 LAXintl : All LA airports operate under capacity. LGB was 17 commuter slots, SNA has no one on the waiting list and is about to expand its slots and passenger
85 LDVAviation : My understanding is that the MSC (northern portion) will be ready by the time the heavy construction on the runway realignment project begins. At tha
86 planesmart : As I've got older, and the airport has aged too, I like LA less and less. Hope the re-development happens. In less than a decade, there will probably
87 N62NA : Well everyone is entitled to their opinion. Personally, I think it's a very nice airport and runs very efficiently. Now, I can only vouch for my expe
88 Post contains links 802flyguy : Good, if brief, LAT article: http://www.latimes.com/business/mone...l-airport-20130503,0,1067083.story
89 r2rho : Good to see this going through. LAX is behind by at least 20 years - this plan won't fix LAX completely, but it's a welcome and necessary step in the
90 TheRedBaron : Man you always crack me up!..LOL
91 Beardown91737 : It would be 21st if NY were it's own nation. I wonder if NY has to include Irvine too. Yet people use those airports. Airports have enemies under the
92 JHwk : The O&D market demands direct flights; it is hard to imagine 380's will be the solution for LAX-ORD or LAX-JFK even, and I doubt very much we wil
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