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Aeromexico Announces 787 Initial Routes  
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 2 months 4 days ago) and read 15403 times:
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Operations begin on October 2013

After domestic training flights, the 787 will be operated on:

MEX-JFK
MEX-EZE
MEX-CDG
MEX-(TIJ)-NRT

looks like MAD, GRU, PVG will remain 777 for now, I assume they want to keep the larger capacity on these routes?

also as you guys can see, MEX-NRT will NOT be possbile non-stop with the 787. MEX's altitude is just to much even for the mighty 787

http://airlineroute.net/2013/05/08/am-787-update1/

[Edited 2013-05-08 02:04:37]

28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineVCy From Cyprus, joined Dec 2012, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 15228 times:
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Dont they fly to London?

User currently offlineba319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8465 posts, RR: 55
Reply 2, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 15228 times:
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Quoting VCy (Reply 1):

- Yes with 762's, perhaps these changes will allow the -200 to be replaced with a -300.



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333,342
User currently offlineDexSwart From South Africa, joined Aug 2012, 380 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 15211 times:

MEX - JFK seems like an odd route for the 787.
It's not really long enough to warrant a long range aircraft, and don't AM have 767s that they could use on this route and use the 787s for expansion?

That said, everyone on a.net seems to be an expert on fleet utilisation.,,



Durban. Melbourne. Denver.
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 15182 times:
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Quoting DexSwart (Reply 3):
MEX - JFK seems like an odd route for the 787.
It's not really long enough to warrant a long range aircraft, and don't AM have 767s that they could use on this route and use the 787s for expansion?

That said, everyone on a.net seems to be an expert on fleet utilisation.,,

They used to fly 767s on MEX-JFK and they filled them up

Quoting VCy (Reply 1):
Dont they fly to London?

Yes

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 2):
Yes with 762's, perhaps these changes will allow the -200 to be replaced with a -300.

Or re-launch Barcelona


User currently offlineVCy From Cyprus, joined Dec 2012, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 15144 times:
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Isnt the LHR route going to be upgraded (in terms of product)? It would be nice to see te 787 there  

User currently offlinecarpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2938 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 14655 times:

Another stinking airline with 9-abreast seating.
It appears AM will have two or three 788s when services commence in October.


User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 14399 times:
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Quoting carpethead (Reply 6):

Is all about making money, you squeeze in as many passengers as humanly possible, is the world we live in.

9 abreast in a 787 does seem a bit too much though


User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12270 posts, RR: 25
Reply 8, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 14356 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
also as you guys can see, MEX-NRT will NOT be possbile non-stop with the 787. MEX's altitude is just to much even for the mighty 787

Seems then that they could have been an A333 customer but in any case they should be happy with the 787.

Quoting carpethead (Reply 6):
Another stinking airline with 9-abreast seating.

My recent trip to Mexico showed me that there are a fair number of fairly large/wide Mexican people.

Hope the 9wide works for them.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7114 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 14241 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
MEX-(TIJ)-NRT

This ain't a surprise. NRT seems to love the 787  

Gonna be a fun plane to spot too!



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7558 posts, RR: 43
Reply 10, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 14007 times:

Thanks g500!

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
After domestic training flights, the 787 will be operated on:

MEX-JFK
MEX-EZE
MEX-CDG
MEX-(TIJ)-NRT

Cannot wait to fly on an AM 788! Woohoo! Paris anyone?

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
looks like MAD, GRU, PVG will remain 777 for now, I assume they want to keep the larger capacity on these routes?

MAD and GRU definitely warrant a plane bigger than the 763ER and the 788 most of the time due to the strong demand. I think it is a good idea not to mess with the aircraft choice for those routes until the 789s arrive. I suppose demand to PVG is healthy too, otherwise it would have been an obvious choice for the 788s... I would love to see AM adding more frequencies to PVG though. In any case, the 77Es have a good product, with 34 inches of pitch and 9-abreast seating in Y, and AVOD throughout the cabin.

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
lso as you guys can see, MEX-NRT will NOT be possbile non-stop with the 787. MEX's altitude is just to much even for the mighty 787

I think (or actually I hope) the 789 might just be able to do it, but who knows. It is a matter of waiting a few more years in order for AM to receive its 789s in order to see. It'd be great if AM could get rid of the technical stop at TIJ once the 789s arrive.

Quoting DexSwart (Reply 3):
MEX - JFK seems like an odd route for the 787.

I agree that AM should send 767s for the time being, but JFK is not an odd route for the 787. Even though the range is not needed at all, the demand can definitely sustain 787 service. Moreover, MEX-JFK is the only North American route that AM considers "premium", so they offer slightly (emphasis on slightly) better catering in J vis-à-vis the rest of its North American network for example. In this sense, sending a state-of-the-art widebody to JFK from MEX is not odd in my opinion. I am quite sure I will plan my trips to NY around the 788 schedules hehe.

Quoting VCy (Reply 5):

Isnt the LHR route going to be upgraded (in terms of product)?

I was a bit surprised not to see MEX-LHR as one of the first 788 routes. I recall AM mentioned at the time of the launch of MEX-LHR months ago that they would look at upgrading it to 788 service as soon as they started receiving Dreamliners. I doubt AM will upgrade the interiors of the 767s, so I hope LHR stays a 767 destination for only a short period of time.

Quoting carpethead (Reply 6):
Another stinking airline with 9-abreast seating.

Indeed. And apparently we will not see on the 787s the generous 34 inches of pitch that the 77Es are configured with. I think I heard that AM will offer 31 to 33 inches of pitch depending on the row. Ugh. That said, a friend flew a UA 788 before the grounding, and he told me that 9-abreast is not too bad... of course this was a domestic flight, so his perception may not apply to long-haul.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 8):
Seems then that they could have been an A333 customer but in any case they should be happy with the 787.

Airbus tried to sell A343Es to AM when AM was looking at the 77Es, but AM, who had already become a good Boeing customer following its MD80 to 737NG refleeting, opted for the more efficient twins by the Seattle company. I suppose Boeing was also keen to grab that order and therefore offered good discounts and conditions to AM for its loyalty. I do not recall reading anything about an R.F.P. and/or competing proposals when AM ordered the 788s, so they may not have considered Airbus products at all at that time. AM did however have Boeing and Airbus compete last year when they ordered 737MAXs and 789s... the A320NEO and the A350WXB were also considered by AM, and negotiations with both manufacturers took place.

Anyway, the A332 and A333 with the latest round of enhancements are really great planes (I am a huge fan), but MEX is so high above the sea level that I am not sure if with all their enhancements they are the right planes for AM's flights to Asia. The 789 and the A350XWB are a different story. As I said earlier, I hope that AM will be able to fly the 789s nonstop to NRT and PVG in a few years! Fingers crossed.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 8):
here are a fair number of fairly large/wide Mexican people.

Mexico is sadly one of the countries with the largest number of obese adults and children in the world. However, you don't see so many obese Mexicans flying long-haul, but that is just my opinion.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinewingedtaurus From Mexico, joined Mar 2007, 117 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13464 times:

Quoting g500 (Thread starter):
After domestic training flights, the 787 will be operated on:

MEX-JFK
MEX-EZE
MEX-CDG
MEX-(TIJ)-NRT

Aleluya! MEX-CDG desperatley needed the upgrade, now time to work with the rude/lazy flight attendants. I heard rumours in the past that they wanted to use the new birds to fly MEX-FCO, but maybe the range is still not there?


User currently offlinenyc777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5730 posts, RR: 48
Reply 12, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 13338 times:

The first 787 for Aeromexico whould be out around next Sunday/Monday, a few days to finish off any small assembly activities and then a few more days for paint and then back out on the flightline.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6023 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 12995 times:

Quoting DexSwart (Reply 3):
MEX - JFK seems like an odd route for the 787.
It's not really long enough to warrant a long range aircraft, and don't AM have 767s that they could use on this route and use the 787s for expansion?

Its about utilization too....airlines often throw long haul aircraft on short routes to use them during down time ....better it flying than sitting.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 12397 times:
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Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
MAD and GRU definitely warrant a plane bigger than the 763ER and the 788 most of the time due to the strong demand. I think it is a good idea not to mess with the aircraft choice for those routes until the 789s arrive. I suppose demand to PVG is healthy too, otherwise it would have been an obvious choice for the 788s...

I'm actually surprised PVG warrants a 777 and not a 787? Aeromexico must be experiencing healthy loads there to leave a 777 on the route

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 13):
Its about utilization too....airlines often throw long haul aircraft on short routes to use them during down time ....better it flying than sitting.

that's probably what it is. That 787 will do a MEX-JFK-MEX turn, then head to EZE or CDG


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7558 posts, RR: 43
Reply 15, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 12018 times:

Quoting wingedtaurus (Reply 11):
now time to work with the rude/lazy flight attendants. I heard rumours in the past that they wanted to use the new birds to fly MEX-FCO, but maybe the range is still not there?

I agree. However, on my latest flights to ORD and back last week, I had very good flight attendants. The outbound was on Y and the attendants were proactive, kind, and smiling all the time. They were eager to assist passengers who were assigned seats at the counter at the last minute so as to reunite kids with their adult relatives; they were also very keen to move minors from emergency exit seats, explain the responsibilities involved in having an emergency seat, and to accommodate passengers who were for any reason in need of switching seats. During the meal, they were efficient and friendly. Nothing to fault. The return was in J and the flight attendants were very professional and friendly too. My glass of sparkling wine was topped up a few times during and after the meal, and courtesy was always the norm. Now, the catering was a nightmare, but that is a different story.

Hopefully this is not just a random occurrence but rather a trend.

Regarding your comment re: FCO, I think AM will eventually launch MEX-FCO nonstop and reinstate MEX-BCN. No urgency though. Both cities have been hard by the European fiscal crisis, so DL, AF and UX can connect AM's pax for the time being. I would assume the 788 can do MEX-FCO without a problem... if not, the 789 definitely will.

Quoting nyc777 (Reply 12):
The first 787 for Aeromexico whould be out around next Sunday/Monday, a few days to finish off any small assembly activities and then a few more days for paint and then back out on the flightline.

Wow! Hope someone can take a pic at the Boeing assembly plant!!!



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineedelag From Mexico, joined Dec 2005, 331 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 10665 times:

Any idea for destinations of the domestic training routes? My guess would be MTY GDL CUN TIJ ??

Saludos,
Edelag



It's not just the destination, it's the journey.
User currently offlinemiami From United States of America, joined Sep 2012, 860 posts, RR: 42
Reply 17, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 10316 times:
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Is a AM 787 necessary or a possibility for MIA?


Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
User currently offlinelaca773 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 4002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9662 times:
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Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
I agree that AM should send 767s for the time being, but JFK is not an odd route for the 787. Even though the range is not needed at all, the demand can definitely sustain 787 service. Moreover, MEX-JFK is the only North American route that AM considers "premium", so they offer slightly (emphasis on slightly) better catering in J vis-à-vis the rest of its North American network for example. In this sense, sending a state-of-the-art widebody to JFK from MEX is not odd in my opinion. I am quite sure I will plan my trips to NY around the 788 schedules hehe.
Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
I was a bit surprised not to see MEX-LHR as one of the first 788 routes. I recall AM mentioned at the time of the launch of MEX-LHR months ago that they would look at upgrading it to 788 service as soon as they started receiving Dreamliners. I doubt AM will upgrade the interiors of the 767s, so I hope LHR stays a 767 destination for only a short period of time.

As you know Eddie, JFK and LAX used to see the 757 and 762ERs frequently (JFK more so than LAX). It makes sense for them to start out with JFK as one of their first international destinations with the 787, if not, for just crew training and familiarization with these new heavies. If anything, I see Heathrow becoming the next 787 destination. Perhaps once they pull a 762 from trans-atlantic service, they will upgauge JFK to a 762. I don't see the 787 staying in this market for very long.

AM did order a few 739MAX correct?


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6023 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9510 times:

Quoting edelag (Reply 16):
Any idea for destinations of the domestic training routes? My guess would be MTY GDL CUN TIJ ??

For sure we will see it on MEX-CUN. CUN will already see the 788 with Thompson so support for teething issues will be there.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinepzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1392 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 9121 times:

Quoting edelag (Reply 16):
Any idea for destinations of the domestic training routes? My guess would be MTY GDL CUN TIJ ??

According to the quoted article, it will be MTY and the next day TIJ. Two days later the first flight to NYC.



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7558 posts, RR: 43
Reply 21, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 8198 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 14):
I'm actually surprised PVG warrants a 777 and not a 787? Aeromexico must be experiencing healthy loads there to leave a 777 on the route

I know. PVG was an obvious destination. Now, who knows? Maybe it will eventually see 787 service as more birds begin to arrive.

Quoting miami (Reply 17):
Is a AM 787 necessary or a possibility for MIA?

Hmmmm. Interesting that just a few hours ago I was reminiscing when MIA-MEX had an A300 from AA as one of its several rotations. It would sure be good to see 787 service to MIA, but I think it is a market fought on schedules/frequencies, not on premium offerings and widebody service.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 19):
For sure we will see it on MEX-CUN. CUN will already see the 788 with Thompson so support for teething issues will be there.

I agree that would be a quite obvious route.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineLatinPlane From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2709 posts, RR: 14
Reply 22, posted (1 year 2 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 7514 times:

Just purchased a ticket for Mexico City – Tijuana AM176/177 01OCT13 (Second Inaugural flight). The fares are super cheap right now allowing me to book it on Premier Class. I'm hoping to catch the 772 inbound from TIJ to MEX and spend a nice weekend in Mexico City.

Can't wait!

http://flyawaysimulation.com/media/images1/images/aeromexico-boeing-787-8-fsx2.jpg


User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 2 months 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 6410 times:
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Just read AM is increasing Tokyo to 4X weekly


Kudos

http://airlineroute.net/2013/05/09/am-nrt-s14/


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7114 posts, RR: 17
Reply 24, posted (1 year 2 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 6255 times:

Quoting g500 (Reply 23):

This is probably due to increased investment by Japanese firms into the Latin American market



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7558 posts, RR: 43
Reply 25, posted (1 year 2 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5745 times:

Congrats to AM! It is great to see it thriving in Asia.

LatinPlane, where can I see which flights in October and onwards will be operated with the 787??



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineLatinPlane From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 2709 posts, RR: 14
Reply 26, posted (1 year 2 months 13 hours ago) and read 5287 times:

Eddie:

I got the info from the link posted on the initial thread. Then I went to aeromexico.com's reservation system which shows the equipment for those flight as: AIRCRAFTNAMES:788. I guess they're still working out the kinks on the seating because it wasn't allowing me to choose my seats.

http://airlineroute.net/2013/05/08/am-787-update1/

Today I decided to book myself on the inaugural flight as well. Why not, you only live once. The fare on economy at this time is only $150.00 per trip; a bargain, might as well go for it. As outlined on the website, 787 services start on Oct 1 from MEX to MTY. This plane turns around heads back to MEX and gets prepared to run the second inaugural flight to TIJ. These will be promotional flights mostly held for the media as well for testing and crew familiarization . During the first two weeks of operation the plane is hardly scheduled for any type of service it seems.

I hope to see more a.netters sign up for the inaugural service. Should be a fun experience.

[Edited 2013-05-11 12:10:26]

User currently offlinesunrisevalley From Canada, joined Jul 2004, 4806 posts, RR: 5
Reply 27, posted (1 year 2 months 6 hours ago) and read 5047 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 10):
I think (or actually I hope) the 789 might just be able to do it, but who knows. It is a matter of waiting a few more years in order for AM to receive its 789s in order to see

Assuming you are allowed to use 12500ft of the available 12900, according to PIANO-X the 788 is limited to about 215t MTOW which allows a 32t payload over 6000nm. Takeoff speed is ~175k so that does not get close to max tire speed. Other range/payload points are 43t at 4900nm and 38.5t at ~5400nm. The 789 looks as if it would do better at something like 36t over 6600nm.Same proviso on runway length.


User currently offlineg500 From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 934 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 2 months 2 hours ago) and read 4830 times:
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No I don't think we're going to see an airplane that can do MEX-Asia non-stop in the near future, not even the 787-9

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