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Emirates At Manchester  
User currently offlineek-a380 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 164 posts, RR: 0
Posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 12362 times:

Hello

Does anybody have any information on further route development by EK at Manchester?

Aircraft upgrades?

Fourth daily flight?

Fifth freedom flights to additional destinations?

55 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlineoly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6674 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12185 times:

Reply 6 in

MAN News 49.. QR 787 Time (by david_itl May 16 2013 in Civil Aviation)

suggests that with pax numbers being the way they are, EK19/20 will go to an A380 and there'll be an EK23/24, so 2x A380/day and 4 daily(?) services.

I presume, should it happen, the 4th service will go at midnight and other timings will be rejigged so there'll be a flight every 6hrs or so.



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11607 posts, RR: 60
Reply 2, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12133 times:

To my knowledge the plan is for 2x A380 and 2x B77W. I forget the exact timescale, but it was not long.


Dan  



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlinecornishsimon From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2013, 101 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12131 times:

Is MAN operating under a night curfew or could a later flight take off at say 0100 ?


cs


User currently onlineoly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6674 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 12024 times:

Quoting cornishsimon (Reply 3):
Is MAN operating under a night curfew

No. For the most part there have never been scheduled pax flights departing between around 11pm and 6am, but there are a number of charter flights overnight, more often arriving than departing.

What the airport is doing is in this document. There is no curfew, but there are restrictions.

http://www.manchesterairport.co.uk/m...t+Night+Noise+Policy+2012-2017.pdf



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlinedavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7359 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 11565 times:
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EK23/24 is slated to be "shadowing" EK17/18 - the route's following the same kind of strategy that they did at LHR where EK29/30 was the 4th flight

User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19186 posts, RR: 52
Reply 6, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 11374 times:

Quoting cornishsimon (Reply 3):
Is MAN operating under a night curfew or could a later flight take off at say 0100 ?

Remember, it is about connectivity. If it departed MAN at 1am it'd be scheduled to arrive DXB at around 11am. While there are eastward departures in the 2pm-4pm period, there aren't many. This would give it little connectivity in Dubai. And as it'd likely arrive into MAN around 1130pm, it'd probably depart DXB about 650pm - with this flight not fed by many arrivals in DXB. Note that the 12pm-1259pm inbound bank are primarlily from the east.

Quoting david_itl (Reply 5):
EK23/24 is slated to be "shadowing" EK17/18 - the route's following the same kind of strategy that they did at LHR where EK29/30 was the 4th flight

This makes more sense and is logical for a fourth-daily.

===

For your interest, the following shows EK's arrivals and departures in DXB for the w/c 20th May 2013.




"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineCXfirst From Norway, joined Jan 2007, 3019 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 11374 times:

Quoting david_itl (Reply 5):

EK23/24 is slated to be "shadowing" EK17/18 - the route's following the same kind of strategy that they did at LHR where EK29/30 was the 4th flight

IMO, thats the way to go. Morning bank departures (from DXB) seem to be packed, so another service at that time would make sense.

-CXfirst



From Norway, live in Australia
User currently offlinebritannia25 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2006, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 11142 times:

Hi

2 A380s and 2 77Ws a day from Manchester? Really? Plus 2 77Ws down the road at Birmingham, not to mention all the flights out of London. Is that really sustainable? I am no expert and of course, do not work for Emirates management but how on earth do they make money on such a route and is that amount of frequency not going into over-kill.

Cheers

 


User currently offlineTheAviator380 From UK - England, joined Feb 2013, 370 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 10418 times:

Quoting britannia25 (Reply 8):

That's the way EK work I guess, everytime I have flown on this route or someone I know who has, every time Y class is almost full. EK will make it work, they know their business.

It is but natural to feel what you thinking but somehow EK make it work all the times.


User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11607 posts, RR: 60
Reply 10, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 10313 times:

Quoting britannia25 (Reply 8):
2 A380s and 2 77Ws a day from Manchester? Really? Plus 2 77Ws down the road at Birmingham, not to mention all the flights out of London. Is that really sustainable?

Try 3 77Ws from BHX by then - a third flight will be coming soon. Once the runway extension is complete at least one of those will go to an A388.

The Gulf carriers carry a huge amount of traffic between the Midlands/North West and Pakistan/Bangladesh/India. And that's just one market for them.


Dan  



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlineDaleaholic From UK - England, joined Oct 2005, 3206 posts, RR: 13
Reply 11, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 10089 times:

Think it will remain as it is for the foreseeable future, 2x773 1x380. If they were to introduce a 2nd A380, it would be seasonal and only replace one of the 777's. The high demand isn't all year round as some may think.

On the subject of curfew/restrictions. Airlines are allowed depart/land throughout the night, however between the hours of 2359-0600 (I think) any departures have to pay the airport extra, kind of like a fine, for not departing before midnight. (Mainly due to noise/compensation). There's quite a few airlines who have departures in the middle of the night, TCX to ZTH, KM to MLA, ZB and TOM to IBZ....



Religion is an illusion of childhood... Outgrown under proper education.
User currently offlinemagpie75 From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 10018 times:
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Now that QF has teamed up with EK, the Manchester route is the 2nd busiest route for QF behind LHR on EK metal of course to Europe . The QF/EK partnership is going to help Emirates really grow some of these secondary European markets.

[Edited 2013-05-25 03:49:55]

User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11607 posts, RR: 60
Reply 13, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 9555 times:

Quoting Daleaholic (Reply 11):
On the subject of curfew/restrictions. Airlines are allowed depart/land throughout the night, however between the hours of 2359-0600 (I think) any departures have to pay the airport extra, kind of like a fine, for not departing before midnight. (Mainly due to noise/compensation).

Between 23:30 and 05:59 only stage 3 compliant aircraft are allowed - although that is pretty much anything these days. Aircraft must also not exceed 96 PNdB between 23:00 and 06:59, if they do there is a £750 charge plus £150 for every dB over this limit.


Dan  



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlinegoosebayguy From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2009, 380 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 8824 times:

Quoting britannia25 (Reply 8):
2 A380s and 2 77Ws a day from Manchester? Really? Plus 2 77Ws down the road at Birmingham, not to mention all the flights out of London. Is that really sustainable? I

You're missing out the Newcastle and Glasgow flights too.

With MAN you also have to consider Qatar and Etihad. BA are missing out on a lot of business because they refuse to develop outside of LHR.


User currently offlineqf002 From Australia, joined Jul 2011, 2946 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7844 times:

Which flight do we expect to become the second daily A380? I've been on the afternoon flight several times over the past 18 months, which was full on two occasions and 90% full the third.

Quoting Daleaholic (Reply 11):
If they were to introduce a 2nd A380, it would be seasonal and only replace one of the 777's. The high demand isn't all year round as some may think.

That's generally not the way that EK does things. They'll either find a way to make it work as an A380 year round or leave it as a 77W.


User currently offlineGT4EZY From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 1778 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7814 times:

Quoting goosebayguy (Reply 14):
With MAN you also have to consider Qatar and Etihad. BA are missing out on a lot of business because they refuse to develop outside of LHR.

In the same way QR and EY refuse to develop outside of DOH and AUH. But that's the age old argument.



Proud to fly from Manchester!
User currently offlineek-a380 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 164 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 6199 times:

Does anybody have any idea of when they may introduce these changes?

User currently offlineXFSUgimpLB41X From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 4189 posts, RR: 37
Reply 18, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 6180 times:

How does EK support so many seats out of MAN? Is it a large arab population or connections beyond DXB?


Chicks dig winglets.
User currently offlineek-a380 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 164 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 6017 times:

There is a huge Indian Sub-Continent and Chinese population in and around MAN plus a large demand for travel to Australia which is where the majority of their passengers are heading to. Cargo is also another good area they tap into well and overall they do very well.

I remember the time when they flew from MAN to DXB twice a week via FRA and ZRH and today they have 3 x daily service. Absolutely phenomenal growth and they know their business, coupled with a big gap by the likes of BA and VS who have written off long haul from MAN.


User currently offlinedavid_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7359 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 5819 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting magpie75 (Reply 12):
The QF/EK partnership is going to help Emirates really grow some of these secondary European markets.

Really grow? So instead of 85% loads, it will be 90%+ loads in some months?!

Quoting Daleaholic (Reply 11):
The high demand isn't all year round as some may think.

Normally round Ramadan it tapers off, Affects other airports as well

Quoting GT4EZY (Reply 16):
In the same way QR and EY refuse to develop outside of DOH and AUH

Not really. So you really see QR wanting to operate out of AUH or DXB (part of the drawback being that they are not part of the UAE) and would Dubai really welcome EY - EY's not got half the network of EK and tends to follow EK's lead in route launches. Whereas as BA had the domestic/Euro routes that any one that possessed a braincell at BA could have tinkered around the long-haul routes that were there at the time. But braincells at BA and operating out of UK regional airports are mutually exclusive concepts


User currently offlineGT4EZY From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2007, 1778 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 5648 times:

David_itl read my comment again. I was inferring that QR and EY are only interested in DOH and AUH in the same way that BA are on LHR.

As for the EK market ex MAN, there is a large Pakistani, Indian and Chinese market but don't underestimate the disposable income of the white, British population (dispite the northern England stereotype) who like to travel to Asia aswell as our historic links to Oz!



Proud to fly from Manchester!
User currently offlineRyanairGuru From Australia, joined Oct 2006, 5167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 5568 times:

Quoting GT4EZY (Reply 21):
the EK market ex MAN, there is a large Pakistani, Indian and Chinese market

  

Quoting GT4EZY (Reply 21):
don't underestimate the disposable income of the white, British population

Oh so true, EK carry a very good number of people to MLE, MRU etc. plus a decent number pay for J.

Another market is the historically strong trade and investment between Manchester and Hong Kong. While going via DXB is a bit of a detour plenty of people do. My mother works for a Manchester-based company with their primary operations in HK/PRC, the UK executives fly EK F from MAN to HKG or PVG.

Quoting GT4EZY (Reply 21):
our historic links to Oz!

From when I lived near MAN, I got the sense that many passengers were "outbound". As someone said up thread, however, Manchester is the second largest destination in Europe for Australians flying to Europe. That's a pretty incredible statistic (although I 100% believe it) and it shows that there is a large inbound market, as well as outbound.

(for fairness, we should also mention New Zealand as well!)



Worked Hard, Flew Right
User currently offlinenickofatlanta From Australia, joined May 2000, 1485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 5329 times:

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 22):

I suspect a significant portion of that traffic from Australia is English ex pats living in Australia not Australian tourists.


User currently offlineskipness1E From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2007, 3176 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4966 times:

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 10):
Try 3 77Ws from BHX by then - a third flight will be coming soon. Once the runway extension is complete at least one of those will go to an A388.

Excpet growth at Birmingham has not come close to matching growth at MAN, there's little call for a third daily flight let alone an A388. What's the runway extension got to do with it btw? It's not an issue for EK to DXB.


25 Blueshamu330s : Runway extension has ZERO impact on Emirates' presence at BHX. Fact is, EK loads on the surface are declining at BHX. Scratch below the surface and th
26 Post contains images PlymSpotter : In the future they appear to think otherwise. I have no reason to doubt my source for this information. For the majority of the year no, but there ar
27 david_itl : Perhaps so, if we ignore the tens of thousands of passengers that fly MAN-LHR-HKG. Even VS said there was only (only!) 90,000 passengers who they cla
28 Post contains images PlymSpotter : So you are suggesting that overspill from the South East will be happy to drive/travel to the North West to fly out of MAN, instead of using the near
29 skipness1E : The available facts would seem to contradict him. Major capital investment in a recession generating savings how and when? It's not the same as gover
30 rutankrd : Personally I remain dubious of the growth projections and forecasts. They have always been overly optimistic ! It is true the South East (Well LHR on
31 Post contains images PlymSpotter : I would disagree. Yes TK entering the route with aggressive pricing has had an impact, but not that significantly. Put it this way, they have been ba
32 skipness1E : No the problem is a lack of hub capacity at Heathrow, there is a fair bit of runway capacity lying empty at STN, SEN and LCY off peak, even LGW is de
33 Post contains images PlymSpotter : STN yes, SEN would have to chuck the GA out and/or apply for a higher movements cap, LTN will have a bit more with the infrastructure alterations, an
34 gilesdavies : Manchester is supporting the current 3x daily EK services with just traffic from it's own region, and very much the same can be said for services out
35 Post contains images PlymSpotter : Overspill is going to happen in the future, so you may as well get used to it. It wouldn't, as the A388 carries less cargo than the 77W. Dan
36 qf002 : LHR is 5 A380s (plus the 2 daily QF A380s), while LGW is 3 77Ws. I imagine LHR will grow once BA returns their leased QF slots (2 pairs), while LGW w
37 SCQ83 : How many daily flights are there in the LON-UAE route? I am getting LHR-DXB 5 EK A380 2 QF A380 1 BA B777 1 BA B747 1 VS A340 1 BI B777 LGW-DXB 3 EK
38 RyanairGuru : No doubt, but it is still a decent number of people flying from Australia to Manchester regardless of the reason that they're going. Similarly the th
39 Boysteve : Many parts of Yorkshire are served by EK at MAN, not just it's own 'North West' region. Hmmm, surely it depends of F & J demand? Upgrading EK19/2
40 david_itl : First is available on all the MAN services. It's also available on GLA which is more of a surprise given that was started a bit after BHX,.
41 skipness1E : No but using a hub is "profitable" which beats sustainable. If you want sustainable, subsidise it rather than TAX it to death. Five daily, EK008 / 00
42 rutankrd : Agreed in every respect. The pressures at LHR will result in up-gauging and for the incumbent carriers can only lead to increased yield as fares can
43 Post contains links sandyb123 : Having recently flown out of MAN on the EK A380 in F I can say that this flight was very light in F (3pax / 14 seats) but almost full in J & Y. G
44 Post contains images PlymSpotter : I respectfully disagree, personally and professionally. And increased fares will lead to more price sensitive passengers using airports outside of th
45 rutankrd : Seriously ! You know how often the Oxford Tube Bus service operates 24/7, have you seen the cars including mine at times under the bridge at the Watl
46 Danfearn77 : EK upgraded the evening service to a three class 77W with F due to the continuing demand.
47 Post contains images PlymSpotter : Yes, as a matter of fact I use it often, but how is this relevant to reaching LHR from Oxford? The Tube serves London itself, and even though the fre
48 rutankrd : Agreed on this point yet most of that price sensitive traffic is likely to be short/medium haul rather than long haul. We constantly have these debat
49 Post contains images LuftyMatt : When did they refuse that? Besides those countries are a lot smaller than the UK, and a have a significantly smaller population. Not to mention only
50 skipness1E : It's not likely fares will rise actually, as the A380 is used more at LHR, through fares over DXB, BKK and KUL remain very competitive? Seriously Dan
51 Post contains images PlymSpotter : Alright for some routes, but that's not going to work on most from Heathrow is it, or all the other London/South East airports. You also need to cons
52 skipness1E : Some things never change though. OK let's approach this from the other end. Which airlines do you see "over spilling" in the medium term then? Errrrr
53 Post contains images PlymSpotter : It's not as simple as saying airline 'x' will over spill - airline 'x' could well be quite happy just maturing the yields on its existing services an
54 skipness1E : Can you elaborate please?
55 Post contains images PlymSpotter : I'm afraid not, not in a public forum. Dan
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