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United May Expand A350 Order  
User currently offlineap305 From India, joined Jan 2000, 507 posts, RR: 0
Posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 26828 times:

From Reuters

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...rance-airbus-idUSBRE95D06520130614

"Evrard said that Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say that United Airlines (UAL.N) is negotiating to upgrade and expand an existing order to 35 jets."

104 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 26839 times:

10 A350-1000s for a partial 744 replacement, with the other replacements being 777-9X?


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineikramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21417 posts, RR: 60
Reply 2, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 26688 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 1):

I don't see UA committing to use or type. 35 would be useful no matter what they end up "replacing"



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 26572 times:

Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineN14AZ From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2607 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 26390 times:

How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save! I think it'll be 10 minutes more time to play with our children or having the your after-work-beer 10 minutes earlier!  

User currently offlineual777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1519 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 26205 times:

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 4):


How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save! I think it'll be 10 minutes more time to play with our children or having the your after-work-beer 10 minutes earlier!

Anybody that says that is a fool. I have talked to people who are as about as "in the know" as you can get and the 350 is coming to UA.



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlineORDBOSEWR From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 399 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 25973 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

Pretty much can't disagree with this, except that it will take a quite a long time before this becomes the reality (maybe a decade or longer). I mean only 2 of those types are even flying (only 1 up until today).

UA is such a large airline that even a fleet of 20-30 of a type can be supported. They do not need to scale within a type like other airlines do. They have scale. So they could realistically have a fleets of 75- 787's, 75-A350's and still add another type.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16694 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 25823 times:

Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 6):
Pretty much can't disagree with this, except that it will take a quite a long time before this becomes the reality (maybe a decade or longer).

Absolutely, the sCO GE Powered 777s, sCO 764s and sUA two class 763s will be flying with UA for a long time.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineatnight From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 605 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 25600 times:

I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35. So this means that besides United, there will be another customer in the USA. I can only think of Delta, because AA will already have the ones coming from US Airways, unless they count AA still as separate and before their merge, AA orders the type.

Of course, maybe the article is written wrong and they are simply saying they will have an US customer add more frames.

Anyways, Paris is around the corner, I'm sure there will be many surprises.

Btw, the A350 is a awesome looking aircraft.



B707 B727 B733/5/7/8/9 B742/4 B752/3 B763/4 B772 A310 A318/319/320 A332 A343 MD80 DC9/10 CRJ200 ERJ145 ERJ-170 Be1900 Da
User currently offlineap305 From India, joined Jan 2000, 507 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 25392 times:

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35

Perhaps Evrard means a new customer in the U.S for the -1000 which United will be if it orders the variant. Delta would be a coup for Airbus but weren't they looking for 330s/777s?

[Edited 2013-06-14 10:39:08]

User currently offlineRoseflyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9378 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 25365 times:

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
I am happy to hear this... However if you look at the quote in the article, it is saying actually two things... that Airbus will add a customer in the US (United is an existing customer already, so they couldn't be adding a customer), and that people close to United are saying United will expand their order to 35. So this means that besides United, there will be another customer in the USA. I can only think of Delta, because AA will already have the ones coming from US Airways, unless they count AA still as separate and before their merge, AA orders the type.

That might just be some confusion in wording chosen by the author. The only one left in the US to order the A350 would be Delta or AA via merger, and you'd think that the author would mention that. I think the key point is that UA may be expanding the A350 order, which is great news. The previous A350 order did not factor in network growth since the CO merger which now justifies more widebodies.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineatnight From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 605 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 25199 times:

Well, like I said, it could just be wrong wording,,, but knowing fully well that United is already a customer with orders already in place, it makes you wonder why he said "add a customer in the USA. Anyways, I have a feeling we are in for a surprise.


B707 B727 B733/5/7/8/9 B742/4 B752/3 B763/4 B772 A310 A318/319/320 A332 A343 MD80 DC9/10 CRJ200 ERJ145 ERJ-170 Be1900 Da
User currently offlineJAAlbert From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1491 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 24751 times:

Quoting atnight (Reply 8):
Btw, the A350 is a awesome looking aircraft.

If only it's windows were a scooch larger! Come on Airbus, stop being stingy!


User currently offlinefcogafa From United Kingdom, joined May 2008, 738 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 24602 times:

Quoting ap305 (Thread starter):
"Evrard said that Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say that United Airlines (UAL.N) is negotiating to upgrade and expand an existing order to 35 jets."

The article doesn't say that, it (now) says :

=============
Evrard said Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say United Airlines is negotiating to expand an order for 25 jets.
=============

[Edited 2013-06-14 11:59:21]

User currently offlineatnight From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 605 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 24523 times:

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 13):

Well, that's why I said that it seems as Airbus is going to add a new customer which is not United, since they are a customer already of the A350. It could mean that it's a US leasing company, but I think is possible that AA or Delta (would be a huge surprise) would be it.

Anyways, we will find out soon enough.



B707 B727 B733/5/7/8/9 B742/4 B752/3 B763/4 B772 A310 A318/319/320 A332 A343 MD80 DC9/10 CRJ200 ERJ145 ERJ-170 Be1900 Da
User currently offlineap305 From India, joined Jan 2000, 507 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 24500 times:

Quoting fcogafa (Reply 13):
The article doesn't say that, it (now) says :

=============
Evrard said Airbus would soon add a customer in the United States, where industry sources say United Airlines is negotiating to expand an order for 25 jets.
=============

They have edited it for some reason I guess. Perhaps that number was not supposed to be in the public domain.


User currently offlinefxramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7128 posts, RR: 87
Reply 16, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 24281 times:

I know it's early in the planning, but being a GS flyer on UA, I'd like to know if any A350 routes for UA have been discussed.

User currently offlineEPA001 From Netherlands, joined Sep 2006, 4593 posts, RR: 38
Reply 17, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 24281 times:
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Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):

Combining this news with the 787-10 news it seems pretty clear where UA's longhaul fleet is heading:

787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000

And that would be a perfect line-up imho.  .

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 4):
How I wish this will come true and UA will order some more aiframes. Not because of my nationality and the fact that some jobs here are linked to the A350-programme or that I have Airbus shares but simply because this would end all theses "UA-will-cancel-their-A-350s-posts". Imagine how much time we all would save!

  

Quoting ual777 (Reply 5):
Anybody that says that is a fool. I have talked to people who are as about as "in the know" as you can get and the 350 is coming to UA.

  

And so it should. They will nit throw away deposits and delivery slots just because some posters here would like to have them and keep them the all Boeing wide body fleet. They have selected the A350 for its qualities. And these have not changed since the merger with CO.


User currently offlineual777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 1519 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 23998 times:

Quoting fxramper (Reply 16):
I know it's early in the planning, but being a GS flyer on UA, I'd like to know if any A350 routes for UA have been discussed.

Not really sure to be honest. I deal more with flight ops. If I was to throw a dart at a board, I would expect to see them going to Asia primarily with some long-range Europe thrown in to boot.

This is purely my own speculation, but since the merger, you can see that UA has really shifted around where the 777s fly. MUC, AMS, CDG, and FCO are all gone from the 777 schedule in IAD. They have been replaced by the 767s and 757s. Why? The 767-3/4 is better optimised for Europe, whereas the 777 has longer range and can carry more cargo to Asia/ME. With the exception of LHR, BRU, and FRA, the 777 out of IAD is all but gone from Europe. The 767-400s and -300s are taking its' place.

I would guess the A350 would go on routes to the mid-east, India, EWR-HKG, SFO/LAX-Australia, and other real "leg strechers" that push the 777 too hard range-wise. Anything you see a 747 on now will be gone, and the additional 10 aircraft will probably add to that some. There is a total of 25 potential options and I am of the opinion that if the aircraft performs as promised or better, we will see more of those options solidified, and may even see some -10s.



It is always darkest before the sun comes up.
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11572 posts, RR: 61
Reply 19, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 23879 times:

Quoting atnight (Reply 14):
Well, that's why I said that it seems as Airbus is going to add a new customer which is not United, since they are a customer already of the A350. It could mean that it's a US leasing company, but I think is possible that AA or Delta (would be a huge surprise) would be it.

An order by Delta would not surprise me one bit.


Dan  



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlinefxramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7128 posts, RR: 87
Reply 20, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 23843 times:

Quoting ual777 (Reply 18):

India replacing a 777 with 350? Why? Guessing with United places their planes on certain routes would give anyone a headache. They clearly don't want to do anything consistent. Flying EWR-SFO often for work I've been on 10 different a/c. At least AA is consistent with the 762.

UA plans on using the 350 for a 777 replacement? As much as I want to like the 350 this seems insufficient. I'd love to see it go to IST, FRA, HNL, FCO, ZRH, AMS & CDG out of EWR.

I get a worn out 767 to AMS on Monday...


User currently offlineNoise From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1735 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 23715 times:

The A350 is the most beautiful aircraft since the 757!

User currently offlinetitus95 From France, joined Feb 2009, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 23246 times:
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I will not rule out the A380 in the future United fleet.

User currently offlinetitus95 From France, joined Feb 2009, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 22966 times:
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Reading another time , the Reuters article , i come to the conclusion , that if United is negociating for more A350s , a NEW US CUSTOMER will see the light , probably next week at Le Bourget. WHO ?

User currently offlineN62NA From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4256 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (10 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 22886 times:

Quoting titus95 (Reply 22):
I will not rule out the A380 in the future United fleet.

I don't think so - too big for them. But the A350, yes, a lot of them in UAs future.

Quoting Noise (Reply 21):
The A350 is the most beautiful aircraft since the 757!

Perhaps! Anyway, I'm just glad the A350 doesn't continue the Airbus tradition of the A300 / 330 / 340 with the rear coach cabin rising upwards. That always looked so weird to me.


25 jayunited : I think one of the first places you will see the A350 deployed is on UA's routes to HKG and other routes where they need to get the 744 off the route
26 ual777 : You probably wont see the A350 on any of those. It will go on really long-haul routes. Why? Full pax load and full cargo load. The bigger engines bur
27 ual777 : They selected it because they put the screws to airbus and got a really good deal. That aside, it is a very capable airplane and will fit UA's fleet
28 VC10er : So what will United be in 10 years? An absolute giant airline with a staggering amount of long legged widebody aircraft doing 12 to 20 hour missions (
29 ual777 : Who is to say there won't be? I for one am cautiously optimistic about UA's future. Things service/operations wise are trending in the right directio
30 Post contains links tortugamon : Bloomberg is announcing that UA will shift the A359 orders to the A351 and will convert options to the 787-10 and presumably some of the A350 options
31 Post contains links jayunited : I just found this article on Yahoo news that also claims that United is in talks with both Airbus and Boeing they claim sources are telling them that
32 jfk777 : Here goes another 777 airline getting A350-1000's. Hoping the Paris Air Show gets two Boeing newbies launched, the 787-10 & 777-9X. The best news
33 Post contains images ual777 : I feel like Nostradamus today
34 tortugamon : This quote is a little vague about how the A350 options will be used. IMO 25 orders of the 351 should be enough for an initial order to replace the 24
35 Post contains images UnitedTristar : What would this mean for the A350 delivery slots? When is the first A351 flight suppose to happen? Will they make the same in service dates? -m
36 jayunited : I think it is more than just replacing sUA 744 fleet with this merger I think the combined UA is looking probably at up gauging some sCO routes as we
37 tortugamon : That appears to be the only answer if they are indeed converting a decent amount of options for the 351 in addition to the 25 changed orders. I would
38 RayChuang : I would not be surprised that United converted the 25-plane A350XWB-900 order to A350XWB-1000. With the A35J, United can quickly retire the well-worn
39 AA77W : And here I was thinking it would be WN or AS! Oh the disappointment! (tongue firmly planted in cheek) :-P
40 onebadlt123 : Sometimes it can be a problem when the payloads reach the upper 80's to 90's+ and weather...etc. For the most part though, it isn't a real problem. O
41 Max Q : Well, it probably all makes sense but as an enthusiast of 4 engine types it's very boring !
42 Post contains images scbriml : You should be getting used to it by now! FWIW, I think you'll see plenty of others as well. However, it should not be forgotten that UA doesn't opera
43 awacsooner : Dream on...until UA signs on the dotted line, the posts will continue. IBTD...I think it's their ugliest plane yet...the entire tail section looks li
44 DocLightning : It will fly on any route, long or short, on which it can be filled with passengers and cargo. UA even uses domestic 744s from time to time. If the ai
45 Post contains links KarelXWB : According to Bloomberg, UA will convert the existing order of 25 A350 aircraft to the larger A350-1000. If true, the fleet will become > 787-8 >
46 scbriml : Er, they have already signed on the dotted line. From reports, they're about to sign on another Airbus dotted line.
47 JerseyFlyer : I see this being similar to the expansion order by CX, i.e. take the first 15 359s for which they have early slots, convert 10 to 3510, and add 10 351
48 fxramper : I'd love to see a 350 out of EWR to Asia. I got back from TLV today and they were chatting about 747 being run on that route. Any truth? I wish. Haha.
49 OH-LGA : They would love the capacity to TLV I'm sure, and it's *very* unlikely. With the dispatch reliability of UA's 747s being as poor as it's been lately,
50 ual777 : FRA is the exception because of the LH hub, and running a 744 once in a while doesn't count. We are talking scheduled, consistant service. If you loo
51 Post contains images ual777 : 2016 I believe. The 787 WILL come to Newark. Be patient, there are only 6 so far
52 Post contains images tortugamon : True. With 60+ customers purchasing over 1,400 777s it would be hard to find an intercontinental airline that doesn't have a 777 . Not sure if this i
53 STT757 : So to summarize it appears that UA is converting all of their 25 A350-900s to 1000s, and possibly adding an additional 10 to their firm orders. That w
54 Post contains images neutrino : Nope, that will be easy and a major one at that. Hint: starts with Q.
55 kgaiflyer : The problem is the 380 requires custom boarding facilities that exist only at four of UA's hubs and focus cities -- thus limiting its dispatch utilit
56 TP313 : Maybe not for long: the 777X seems taylor made for them.
57 na : The A350-900 makes a great replacement for UAs aging 777 fleet.
58 Post contains images tortugamon : You're right. Not sure that worked out well for them . tortugamon
59 AeroWesty : I was thinking: L
60 UALWN : Would that be LH, LX or LA? None of them operate any passenger 777, for now.
61 sancho99504 : I may be naive or misinformed, but aren't the A350-900 and 787-10 in the same size class? Please correct me if I am wrong. Thanks
62 Post contains images AeroWesty : That would be the one which came to mind.
63 scbriml : Then there's L and I and even a V.
64 motorhussy : With both aircraft in a similar three class configuration, with 9-abreast in Y, the Boeing will seat 25 more in Y. The 78J will also be able to carry
65 tommy767 : I hope so. The A350 is a sexy plane. Dare I even say better looking than the 787.
66 sancho99504 : I think for now, UA will keep 8 abreast on the 787 and 9 on the A350 which as long as they give a better product in Y, can command a higher fare, alt
67 tortugamon : Some may say that UA does configure their 787s with 9 abreast in Y. tortugamon
68 sancho99504 : My bad, I had thought I read they were going to be 8 abreast. Its a shame that they still think they have to cram someone into every nook and cranny
69 gemuser : PLEASE, lets NOT start another "Why didn't Qantas order the B777" discussion!!! There must be dozens on this site. Interestingly enough I can not rem
70 VC10er : I am now very confused by reading all this as it pertains to United: Please can someone help clarify as much as possible for me? Please! What is UA re
71 Post contains images EPA001 : Ferpe has done some interesting modelling on this. I do not have the data at hand but I guess one could say the A35J is like a B77W, only (supposed t
72 Stitch : Higher fares and cheaper fuel. I assume nothing for the moment. They have enough 757s in the fleet to keep them on those missions. Down the road, Air
73 tortugamon : Here is my crack at it: Those are relatively new frames and won't need a replacement for a while. The Max 9 and Max 8 HGW may be the replacement down
74 Post contains images mffoda : This is fascinating... So 84.6% of the Worlds Alphabet Airline's fly the 777. And 34.6% of the Worlds Alphabet Airline's fly the A380... Lovely...
75 VC10er : So NO 777's in United's future beyond using up / replacing what they have now? Is this a good theory or has United been specific on this? Is the A350
76 United1 : UA said a while ago that they were not interested in the current generation of 777s (ie 77W/77L.) 350-1000 (744) 350-900 (77E) 787-10 (77A) 787-9 (76
77 VC10er : What does that one foot mean in terms of Y? I think United has 9 abreast, should they keep that for the A350 ? It is ironic how not long ago people th
78 Stitch : UA will be 9-abreast on the A350 and comfort should be close to that found on their 9-abreast 777s. Their 787's at 9-abreast will be close to their 1
79 STT757 : Someone in another thread within the last month or two put up a graphic that displayed the size of the 787-8, 787-9, 787-10, A350-900, A350-1000, 747-
80 Stitch : In terms of cabin length, the A350-1000 and 777-300ER are about the same and so is there seating counts. zeke has noted that CX's four-class configur
81 RyanairGuru : I got the Q, V and all the various Ls But who is I?
82 Polot : I think he was referring to IB.
83 RyanairGuru : Ahh, gotcha. I guess there are also: F S and T
84 UALWN : And U.
85 jayunited : In the 90's crude oil was only $25-30 dollars a barrel, not the $119 dollars a barrel it is today. In the 90's a gallon of regular 87 octane gasoline
86 Post contains images Deltal1011man : been to a gas station lately? fuel is $2+ higher than it was in the 90s. (plus, higher fares, 9/11 and the economy all factor into it) prove it. IIRC
87 STT757 : So now that the 787-10 order is official when might we hear about their A350s, and whether they are indeed expanding their order and converting to the
88 Stitch : Airbus was quiet at PAS today, so perhaps tomorrow?
89 Post contains images frigatebird : Not much news from the A350 indeed at PAS, but I expect an A350 day still to come
90 KarelXWB : Do they announce orders only during the business days? If not, they might hold the A350 orders back until the A350 makes its appearance. I read the A
91 Stitch : I would speculate that answer depends on how much of the media stays after the Business Days and whether or not the A350 is ready for a PAS fly-by.
92 Post contains images astuteman : Anyone flying the 748i or A380 Rgds
93 Post contains links STT757 : It's now official, 35 A350-1000 for UA. They converted their previous order for 25 A350-900s and added an additional 10. The 35 A350-1000s will enable
94 Stitch : And with those 777-200s not replaced with the A350-1000 being replaced by the 787-10 per comments by UA, that should leave the future UA fleet at 35 A
95 Post contains links and images STT757 : The A350-1000 looks like it will be a gorgeous aircraft, cannot wait to see it flying for UA.
96 scbriml : Do they not have options as well? Final tally could easily be higher.
97 Post contains images UnitedTristar : I wonder if they are excersizing 10 options or keeping all 25 options? -m
98 jayunited : Don't take this question the wrong way I'm just picking your brain. Your post seems to suggest that you still expect UA to place yet another order fo
99 Post contains images kgaiflyer : Here's more from the UA Facebook page. "Today we announced an order with Airbus for new A350-1000 aircraft. The agreement converts our existing order
100 Stitch : No. I always believed the A350-1000 will replace the 747-400 and UA have now confirmed that. So I do not believe UA will order the 777-8 or the 777-9
101 jayunited : The people at Airbus must be extremely happy converting the order to the A351 plus adding 10 more to that order probably means that UA largest aircraf
102 Tankereng : Congrats to Airbus on the additional A350-1000 orders. Should fit well into United's fleet. So United will no longer has the A350-900 on order. Will t
103 Stitch : I believe the A350-1000 will be the largest plane in UA's future fleet and the sole Airbus widebody. The rest of the widebody fleet will be a mix of
104 EPA001 : UA also holds options for more A350's. So I can see them ordering more A350's as well. The majority of the WB-fleet will be B787's. I agree with you
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