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Central American Aviation Thread. Part 54  
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 15561 times:



THE CENTRAL AMERICAN AVIATION THREAD
PART LIV
"Tribute to Varig in Central America"

The Brazilian airline VARIG which was acquired by Gol served the Central American skies in the past . It promoted the first jet-line flights heading to deep South America, disregarding the operations of Braniff in Panama City and others.
By the mid 80s, Lacsa, Ecuatoriana and Varig signed a sort of agreement operating a weekly flight routed in the northbound sector as Rio de Janeiro - Sao Paulo - Guayaquil - Quito - San Jose with Boeing 767-200 Extended Range. The airline Cruzeiro sometimes performed these flights on behalf of Varig with Airbus 300.
Varig also flew Sao Paulo - Manaos - Panama City with Boeing 737-300, discontinued by the mid 90s. I don’t manage if other regional routes or equipments were available before on Varig.
These flights became unattractive, once both Taca Peru and Copa Airlines incursioned in deep South America, almost 20 years ago.








Edited on July 04th, 2013.


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
212 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 15538 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Thread starter):
Varig also flew Sao Paulo - Manaos - Panama City with Boeing 737-300, discontinued by the mid 90s

Varig did fly from either GIG or SAO to PTY before they started the GRU (or CGH) - MAO - PTY route.
I don't remember if PTY was stop en-route to MIA or LAX.
After Varig left the Brazil - PTY market no other Brazilian airline has attempted to fly between our countries.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 15509 times:

Avianca reduces the MIA-SJO sector from 7x to 5x weekly with E90. No more flights on Tuesdays and Saturdays.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 1):
I don't remember if PTY was stop en-route to MIA or LAX

RG GRU-MAO-PTY 1x weekly with 733.
In those days, Varig operated dedicated flights heading to Florida as RG GIG-GRU-MIA with 747 and D10.
Los Angeles was served as RG GIG-GRU-LAX-NRT with 743, RG GIG-GRU-LAX-NGO with 743 and RG GIG-GRU-LIM-LAX with D10. Panama City wasn't part of that equation.

Source: Varig timetable, 1993

I have my doubts if Varig back in the 70s flew to Panama City with 707.


Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 15498 times:

Hello Guys!

Thank you so much! I confess I'm very happy to see someone still remembering my country's former flag carrier, I had my second international destination with them (AMS) when I was 16! and the first being with VASP to CCS when I was 9.

Those old days of aviation!  
Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 1):
After Varig left the Brazil - PTY market no other Brazilian airline has attempted to fly between our countries.

I'm sure JJ did a few charter flights to PTY, but this was 7 years ago or so, these days very unlikely CM owns the market and is tough to beat.


User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 15476 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 2):
Avianca reduces the MIA-SJO sector from 7x to 5x weekly with E90. No more flights on Tuesdays and Saturdays

Before you know it they'll be down to 3x weekly.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 15421 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 2):
Avianca reduces the MIA-SJO sector from 7x to 5x weekly with E90. No more flights on Tuesdays and Saturdays.

sorry, what's AV doing with the spare aircraft ? are they opening new routes in other places ?



On the run !!!
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 15384 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 4):
Before you know it they'll be down to 3x weekly.

I suspect before too long you will only see AV flights from SJO to BOG, LIM, MDE and SAL (maybe GUA) from SJO.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 15382 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 2):
I have my doubts if Varig back in the 70s flew to Panama City with 707.

I was referring just to that, Varig in PTY before the MAO-PTY.

Quote:
Avianca reduces the MIA-SJO sector from 7x to 5x weekly with E90. No more flights on Tuesdays and Saturdays.

AV showing its commitment to SJO.

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 3):
I'm sure JJ did a few charter flights to PTY, but this was 7 years ago or so, these days very unlikely CM owns the market and is tough to beat.

I've not heard of any JJ charters to PTY.
What I did hear is than CM wanted to code-share w/JJ GRU-GIG when it opened PTY-GRU and that JJ refused to talk and practically slammed the door at CM face.
CM shows some G3 code-share (at least in the map on their in-flight magazine). IMHO, G3 could do a good job of feeding CM hub from CGR-CGB and FOR-BEL; VCP-PTY who knows?



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlinecarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4757 posts, RR: 30
Reply 8, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 15379 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 4):
Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 2):
Avianca reduces the MIA-SJO sector from 7x to 5x weekly with E90. No more flights on Tuesdays and Saturdays

Before you know it they'll be down to 3x weekly.

You mean like what they're doing in GUA this September?  



What do I know, I'm just an 'immature troublemaker with only a passing interest in aviation' (or so they say)
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 15372 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 6):
I suspect before too long you will only see AV flights from SJO to BOG, LIM, MDE and SAL (maybe GUA) from SJO.

I still think AV wouldn't be foolish enough to drop SJO-CCS and that BOG-PTY-SJO may remain only because it's a flight from AV hub via an Star Alliance hub. A SAL-MGA-SJO w/ATR may remain too.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 15296 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 7):
I've not heard of any JJ charters to PTY.

I tried some google search didn't come up with anything, but these flights existed as charter, I even remember seeing the landing forms being eaten by insects on their office when I had access! I'd take a picture to show. The same foes SXM, AUA and PUJ I actually know a guy who worked for them at that time (as I said some 7 or 8 years ago or even more).

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 7):
What I did hear is than CM wanted to code-share w/JJ GRU-GIG when it opened PTY-GRU and that JJ refused to talk and practically slammed the door at CM face.

JJ somehow never saw themselves on central america/caribbean routes, maybe they're only concerned about CM because CM takes their US bound pax from them.


User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 15110 times:

Both Gol and Copa Airlines hold a comercial partnetship since 2006.
The commercial agreement comprises the connectivity between Rio de Janeiro and Sao Paulo, in some flights operated by G3.
On the other side, I've seen before one of the four daily flights on CM PTY-GRU bearing the G3 designator.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 14722 times:

Panama to tax jet fuel From www.prensa.com in Spanish
The Panamanian Economy and Finance Ministry presented the national legislative a proposal to tax USD0.10 per Jet-fuel gallon. A low ranking deputy minister said the tax is because the jet-fuel is exempt from taxes in Panama.
In the meanwhile nobody from the government ever informed the Panamanian Airline Association of any proposed jet-fuel tax.
This jet-fuel tax comes at no surprise as it's widely known that Panama's ruler has a personal vendetta against CM owners dating late 1980's.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 14638 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 11):
Both Gol and Copa Airlines hold a comercial partnetship since 2006.
The commercial agreement comprises the connectivity between Rio de Janeiro and Sao Paulo, in some flights operated by G3.
On the other side, I've seen before one of the four daily flights on CM PTY-GRU bearing the G3 designator.

Yes, G3 was also able to sell tickets for CM on their page, don't know if it's still the case after CM joined *A, JJ was able to transfer pax's from other brazilian cities to CM but were not able to sell their tickets as G3, for me the most strange thing was: even being on *A you couldn't get mileage plus points or vice-versa flying JJ, CM staff told me it was a agreement between the airlines, I think JJ knew they'd be leaving soon Star.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 12):
This jet-fuel tax comes at no surprise as it's widely known that Panama's ruler has a personal vendetta against CM owners dating late 1980's.

CM has being creating jobs for his country for the past what 6 decades?? I honestly hate politicians!


User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 14604 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 12):
a proposal to tax USD0.10 per Jet-fuel gallon

73Gs can hold some 6,900 gallons of jet fuel so we're talking US$690 more when flying out of Tocumen.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 14585 times:

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 13):
if it's still the case after CM joined *A

The CM website is not able to sell tickets to destinations served by their comercial affiliates and it disregards if CM is involved into Star Alliance or not.




.

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 5):
what's AV doing with the spare aircraft ? are they opening new routes in other places ?

I think nobody knows it.
I've been searching a clue analyzing their operations at SAL, BOG and LIM and their frequencies are running normally at this time.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 14470 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 15):
The CM website is not able to sell tickets to destinations served by their comercial affiliates and it disregards if CM is involved into Star Alliance or not.

well.. this is quite odd since AC does not show PTY on their web page   



On the run !!!
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 14465 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 14):
73Gs can hold some 6,900 gallons of jet fuel so we're talking US$690 more when flying out of Tocumen.

And the number of CM daily take-offs from PTY is:___ Add to those the other airlines departures., round-up extra because KL and IB wide-bodies.
Then multiply that figure times USD690 times 7 days per week and it's getting to be a large number.

Last week Panama's ruler travelled to Venezuela to lobby the government to ease payments restrictions to Colon Duty Free and allow CM more frequencies. Being CM owners not exactly his best friends and the ones who account for the largest individual % of that duty free zone trade, Isn't that new jet-fuel tax just a coincidence?



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 14414 times:

CM will just pass the cost along to the customer.


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 14392 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 18):
CM will just pass the cost along to the customer.

As corporations always do I'm afraid!  


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 14177 times:

I wonder if UA is going load those widebodies around xmas time to GUA and SAL this year?


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinejuanchito From Guatemala, joined Nov 2000, 1182 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 14153 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 20):
I wonder if UA is going load those widebodies around xmas time to GUA and SAL this year?

Over the last years on GUA they don't send them anymore.
They add extra flights.

Juanchito



Chapin de corazon.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 13995 times:

Looks like DL has extended there JFK/MSP/LAX- Central American weekend services at least thru April now....loads must be at least half decent.

Yay!



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 13930 times:

Quoting juanchito (Reply 21):
Over the last years on GUA they don't send them anymore.
They add extra flights.

Correct. United has already confirmed the following changes for the Christmas season:

UA ORD-LIR: 3x weekly
UA IAH-BZE: 21x weekly
UA IAH-GUA: 24x weekly
UA IAH-RTB: 7x weekly
UA IAH-SAP: 10x weekly
UA EWR-BZE: 4x weekly
UA EWR-GUA: 4x weekly
UA EWR-SAP: 4x weekly
UA EWR-SAL: 4x weekly
UA EWR-LIR: 5x weekly

Effective: December 19th.
All these flights will be operated with narrow-bodies.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 13922 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 23):
Correct. United has already confirmed the following changes for the Christmas season:

Extra EWR-PTY and IAH-PTY no-where to be seen, even if 2 UA aircraft R.O.N. in PTY.
And seasonal Xmas-New Year Saturday CLE-PTY, Sunday PTY-CLE to complement UA/CM PTY hub traffic, still a dream.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 25, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13971 times:

Spirit Airlines one more time has launched the extra red-eye flight, during the US summer beak into the [SJO-FLL] sector.
As a result, NK SJO-FLL is 10x weekly nowadays: 7x daylight plus 3x red-eyes.
This year, jetBlue started the SJO-FLL 7x weekly service since June 27th. Thus, NK SJO-FLL is not running as 14x weekly for the time being.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 26, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 13902 times:

It is just so hard for me to Belize that as of this Dec....UA will have more seats into Belize than AA. AA was the long time leader.

Also for the first time, will surpass AA in terms of pax movements at BZE......and their yields are rumored to be the best in the region.


Kudos to the UA staff and the old CO leadership that took a chance on BZE over 15 years ago.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 27, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 13840 times:

so its official?

CM to TPA?

http://tampatrib.com/news/business/a...nama-service-in-december-20130717/



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinegreenmow From Russia, joined Jun 2007, 22 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 1 month 2 weeks ago) and read 13825 times:

According to CM newsletter:

- x4 week service B737-700
- starting December 16
- PTY- TPA departure 6-34 PM arrival 9-53 PM Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun
- TPA - PTY departure 7-02 AM arrival 10-12 AM Mon, Tue, Thu, Sat


User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 29, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 13785 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 27):
so its official?

CM228 PTY1834 – 2153TPA 73G 1357
CM229 TPA0702 – 1012PTY 73G 1246



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 30, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 13767 times:

Dear CM,

I once again plead for service to BZE....cause i know you read this thread!  

Sincerely,

S America bound via MIA



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinecarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4757 posts, RR: 30
Reply 31, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 13730 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 29):
Quoting yellowtail (Reply 27):
so its official?

CM228 PTY1834 – 2153TPA 73G 1357
CM229 TPA0702 – 1012PTY 73G 1246

Go figure, I checked on Amadeus and the flights are only loaded on Sabre right now...



What do I know, I'm just an 'immature troublemaker with only a passing interest in aviation' (or so they say)
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 32, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 13695 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 29):
CM228 PTY1834 – 2153TPA 73G 1357
CM229 TPA0702 – 1012PTY 73G 1246

I'm happy for TPA but that schedule, what's it good for?
Does CM really need to fly those times and keep a B737 (and its crew) a good 9 hours in TPA?



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 33, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 13541 times:

Quoting greenmow (Reply 28):
- x4 week service B737-700
- starting December 16
- PTY- TPA departure 6-34 PM arrival 9-53 PM Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun
- TPA - PTY departure 7-02 AM arrival 10-12 AM Mon, Tue, Thu, Sat

CM is definitely aiming for the US stations, taking into account their good results in Chicago and Las Vegas.
Even the new CM PTY-BOS started to fly on a daily basis.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 32):
I'm happy for TPA but that schedule, what's it good for?

CM PTY-TPA 4x weekly may work as a back-up for CM PTY-MCO which is temporarily operating as 28x weekly during the US summer break.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 34, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 13495 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 30):
I once again plead for service to BZE....cause i know you read this thread!

Let me do some copying/pasting from the previous iteration of this thread series..

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 183):
Quoting yellowtail (Reply 180):
CM has been awfully quiet route announcement wise...they are long overdue

Expect one new destination —two at the most— added by year's end.

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 190):
Tampa's been actively trying to lure CM for over two years.. even threw in a sweet incentive package consisting of landing fee waivers and advertising money.. the Massachusetts Port Authority successfully used a similar approach (known as the Massport International Air Service Incentive Program) to reel them in.. all seems like it boils down to aircraft availability now.

BZE obviously remains part of Copa's short/medium–term route network planning strategy.. however TPA appears to be their wrap–up act for this year.. fingers crossed for the next round of announcements, possibly late Jan or mid Feb 2014.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 35, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 13365 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 34):
BZE obviously remains part of Copa's short/medium%u2013term route network planning strategy

I repeat my point posted earlier: based on the 2012 experience related to their new routes, Copa Airlines must be cautious analyzing the potential of new stations:

CM PTY-LIR 2x weekly
CM PTY-IQT 2x weekly
CM PTY-REC 4x weekly
CM PTY-CUR 4x weekly
CM PTY-LAS 7x weekly

Hypothesis: the stations placed in the US mainland provide a better demand of passengers for the Panamanian airline.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 36, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 13089 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 35):
CM PTY-CUR 4x weekly
CM PTY-LAS 7x weekly

CUR is doing fine. LAS is doing really well.


I would like to hypothezize that perhaps the flights aren't doing so well because of the low frequency offered. I know it goes against normal thinking but (being in the airline industry myself), sometimes the answer to a poorly performing flight is adding frequency....

Often pax will not change their flying patterns (move days) or loyalties even if a non-stop exists if that flight does not give them what they need.

The big question in launching a less than daily flight is will pax move? Will they change their travel patterns for us?

SQ IAH-DME-SIN flight is a good example of this....flight LF does much better as a daily than a less than daily.
TAs SAL-BZE is also a good example....flight does far better overall as a daily (even on off peak months) than as a less than daily.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineaer From Guatemala, joined Mar 2004, 1048 posts, RR: 3
Reply 37, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 13010 times:

According to the OAG thread, it looks like AV is axing GUA-ORD. The sad times for CentAm keep coming.


nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 38, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 12969 times:

from the other forum: Copa Airlines Doubles Down On Las Vegas (by LAXintl Jul 22 2013 in Civil Aviation)

Beginning December 13th Copa will increase its service to Las Vegas increasing to 11x weekly.

Added flights will operate 4x weekly (Tue/Thr/Sat/Sun) using 737-800s.

Copa only began service to Las Vegas in June 2012.

Story:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/todayi...doubles-down-on-las-vegas/2575621/

this is in top of the TPA announcement !!

what's next for CM ?
1- in US we heard about DEN, SFO ..
2- ideally an order for larger/wide aircrafts for destinations like EZE, GRU, MIA, LAX and Europe (unlikely)

  



On the run !!!
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 39, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 12946 times:

Quoting aer (Reply 37):
According to the OAG thread, it looks like AV is axing GUA-ORD. The sad times for CentAm keep coming.

They moved the flight to SAL.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 40, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 12941 times:

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 38):
what's next for CM ?
1- in US we heard about DEN, SFO ..
2- ideally an order for larger/wide aircrafts for destinations like EZE, GRU, MIA, LAX and Europe (unlikely)

Extra ORD and BOS flights may come before service to UA hubs DEN and SFO. Same with extra flights to POA, BSB and CNF.
Larger aircraft like B737-900ER?
CM surely can change its ordered B737 to those. 2 B737-800 cost the same as 1 B737-900ER and 1 B737-700, B737-900ER is great to add capacity to EZE and Sky-interior B737-700 to open SFO non-stop.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlinecarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4757 posts, RR: 30
Reply 41, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 12916 times:

Quoting aer (Reply 37):
The sad times for CentAm keep coming.

On the bright side, AM is starting GUA-TAP on August 27:

AM2776 TAP-GUA 09:41 - 09:26 / Tue, Thu, Sat
AM2777 GUA-TAP 10:26 - 12:11 / Tue, Thu, Sat



What do I know, I'm just an 'immature troublemaker with only a passing interest in aviation' (or so they say)
User currently offlinejuanchito From Guatemala, joined Nov 2000, 1182 posts, RR: 9
Reply 42, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 12893 times:

Great news a new flight.

Quoting carmenlu15 (Reply 41):
On the bright side, AM is starting GUA-TAP on August 27:

AM2776 TAP-GUA 09:41 - 09:26 / Tue, Thu, Sat
AM2777 GUA-TAP 10:26 - 12:11 / Tue, Thu, Sat

I think that GUA will benefit from Avianca axing some routes in Guatemala. You can see Delta and United have already increase their flights to LAX, IAH, ATL, JFK (new route), IAD (seasonal route)

Juanchito



Chapin de corazon.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 43, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 22 hours ago) and read 12797 times:

Quoting juanchito (Reply 42):
I think that GUA will benefit from Avianca axing some routes in Guatemala. You can see Delta and United have already increase their flights to LAX, IAH, ATL, JFK (new route), IAD (seasonal route)

and the same in SJO..ask AV axed, DL and other added.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineaer From Guatemala, joined Mar 2004, 1048 posts, RR: 3
Reply 44, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 12771 times:

Quoting juanchito (Reply 42):
I think that GUA will benefit from Avianca axing some routes in Guatemala. You can see Delta and United have already increase their flights to LAX, IAH, ATL, JFK (new route), IAD (seasonal route)

Yeah for that I'm glad, more frequencies and destinations from the others; hope it would spark the interest of the big ORD players to add a flight.



nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 45, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 12762 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 40):
B737-900ER is great to add capacity to EZE and Sky-interior B737-700 to open SFO non-stop.

though I like the idea I'm not sure 739 is capable to run PTY-EZE without penalties



On the run !!!
User currently offlinepoint2point From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 2757 posts, RR: 1
Reply 46, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 12766 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 40):
Extra ORD and BOS flights may come before service to UA hubs DEN and SFO.

DEN airport officials, as well as the local chamber of commerces/economic development committees, etc., have recently named PTY now as their now most sought after nonstop destination, and CM the airline to service the route. It'll be curious to watch CM officials reactions to priorities as the DEN $$$$$ start getting thrown at them......

 


User currently offlineSFJeff From El Salvador, joined Dec 2009, 83 posts, RR: 0
Reply 47, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 12636 times:

ELSALVADOR.COM is reporting that Avianca will increase capacity from SAL by 16% with 60 additional frequencies (frequencies over what period is not stated) in stages, starting September 15 with 28 additional flights, then 25 more on November 15 and the remaining 7 on December 6. Here is the link the article (in Spanish): http://www.elsalvador.com/mwedh/nota...leta.asp?idCat=47654&idArt=8060492


Jeff in San Salvador
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 48, posted (1 year 1 month 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 12577 times:

Quoting SFJeff (Reply 47):
Avianca will increase capacity from SAL by 16% with 60 additional frequencies

Wonder how much of that is real and how much is bluffing.. another piece from the same source claims there will be 90 more flights at that airport..

Avianca centralizará sus operaciones regionales en Comalapa, donde se calcula que habría 90 vuelos adicionales a los que actualmente transitan.

[Edited 2013-07-24 13:22:22]


Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlinecarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4757 posts, RR: 30
Reply 49, posted (1 year 1 month 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 12555 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 48):
Wonder how much of that is real and how much is bluffing..

Considering they are cancelling flights from everywhere else and moving them to SAL, it's not that farfetched...



What do I know, I'm just an 'immature troublemaker with only a passing interest in aviation' (or so they say)
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 50, posted (1 year 1 month 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 12258 times:

Did anyone notice in the OAG update AA increasing DFW PTY and giving a big increase to RTB

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA DFW-GUA DEC 1.0>1.1 JAN 1.0>1.1 FEB 1.0>1.1 MAR 1.0>1.2
AA DFW-LIR NOV 0.2>0.5 DEC 0.3>1.0 JAN 0.3>1.0 FEB 0.3>1.0 MAR 0.3>1.0
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA DFW-BZE DEC 1.0>1.1 JAN 1.0>1.1 FEB 1.0>1.1 MAR 1.0>1.2
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA DFW-PTY DEC 0.1>0.4 JAN 0.1>0.4 FEB 0.1>0.4 MAR 0.2>0.5
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA MIA-GUA NOV 3>4 DEC 3>4 JAN 3>4 FEB 3>4 MAR 3>4
AA MIA-LIR NOV 0.8>1.1 DEC 1.0>1.9 JAN 1.0>2 FEB 1.0>2 MAR 1.0>2.0
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
AA MIA-RTB DEC 0.1>0.4 JAN 0.1>0.4 FEB 0.1>0.4 MAR 0.2>0.5

Seasonal upgrades yes, but clear to me that AA is going to fight not to give an inch of turf up to UA or DL in the region. PTY is very interesting as they have always struggled on DFW PTY

[Edited 2013-07-29 13:37:03]


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 51, posted (1 year 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 12176 times:

Quoting aer (Reply 37):
it looks like AV is axing GUA-ORD. The sad times for CentAm keep coming.

No more TA SAL-GUA-ORD.
September 17: TA SAL-ORD 4x weekly, 319
November 15: TA SAL-ORD 7x weekly, 319.




.
Here's the comprehensive list about the dated changes on Avianca:

September 15: TA SAL-CLO. 5x to 7x weekly, E90
September 17: TA SAL-ORD. 4x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-CLO. 3x to 6x weekly, E90
November 15: TA LIM-POA. 3x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-GYE. 5x to 7x weekly, [4x with 320 + 3x with 319]
November 15: TA LIM-HAV. 4x to 5x weekly, [4x with 319 + 1x with 320]
November 15: TA LIM-MEX. 4x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-SDQ. 3x to 4x weekly. [3x with 320 + 1x with 319]
November 15: TA SAL-ORD. 4x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA SAL-LAX. 24x to 26x weekly, 319+320+321 mix
December 01: TA SAL-MEX. 7x to 11x weekly, 319
December 01: TA SAL-MIA. 7x to 14x weekly, 320
December 01: TA SAL-IAD. 17x to 21x weekly.

Highlights:

TA designator still remains over the AV one.
The new frequencies are being experimented at both LIM and SAL.
These changes are not even touching to AV mainline in Colombia.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineSHAQ From Panama, joined Jun 2007, 376 posts, RR: 0
Reply 52, posted (1 year 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 12192 times:

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 10):

I'm sure Copa is stealing that market from TAM
When I took CM831 from New York to PTY, there were a lot of portuguese-speaking passengers!

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 6):

It is very clear right now, that AV wants to centralize its operations at SAL.
SJO maybe will only be an O/D focus city. I would really like that CM picks up some of passengers that AV are leaving behind.



Studying hard, for flying right!
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 53, posted (1 year 1 month 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 12183 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 51):
September 15: TA SAL-CLO. 5x to 7x weekly, E90
September 17: TA SAL-ORD. 4x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-CLO. 3x to 6x weekly, E90
November 15: TA LIM-POA. 3x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-GYE. 5x to 7x weekly, [4x with 320 + 3x with 319]
November 15: TA LIM-HAV. 4x to 5x weekly, [4x with 319 + 1x with 320]
November 15: TA LIM-MEX. 4x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA LIM-SDQ. 3x to 4x weekly. [3x with 320 + 1x with 319]
November 15: TA SAL-ORD. 4x to 7x weekly, 319
November 15: TA SAL-LAX. 24x to 26x weekly, 319+320+321 mix
December 01: TA SAL-MEX. 7x to 11x weekly, 319
December 01: TA SAL-MIA. 7x to 14x weekly, 320
December 01: TA SAL-IAD. 17x to 21x weekly.
AV SAL-MDE. 7x weekly nowadays, 319
November 15: TA LIM-MDE. 3x to 7x weekly.




.

Quoting SHAQ (Reply 52):
I took CM831 from New York to PTY, there were a lot of portuguese-speaking passengers

It means that CM JFK-PTY and then CM PTY-Brazil is already stolen passengers from the dedicated flights called: JJ GRU-JFK, DL JFK-GRU, AA GRU-JFK and AA GIG-JFK among others...

Regards.

[Edited 2013-07-29 19:36:52]


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 54, posted (1 year 1 month 22 hours ago) and read 12052 times:

Quoting SHAQ (Reply 52):
I'm sure Copa is stealing that market from TAM
When I took CM831 from New York to PTY, there were a lot of portuguese-speaking passengers!

And now the "muambeiros" a slang word we use for brazilians who go to the US for shopping and re-selling the products here in BR, are saying customs are getting tougher on JJ's inbound pax, and they're choosing CM cause their flights are unlikely to be harassed by the same custom officers! may sound crazy but it does make sense indeed, whenever I came with CM it was hassle free, with JJ it was the hell on earth.


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 55, posted (1 year 1 month 20 hours ago) and read 12000 times:

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 54):
are saying customs are getting tougher on JJ's inbound pax, and they're choosing CM cause their flights are unlikely to be harassed by the same custom officers! may sound crazy but it does make sense indeed, whenever I came with CM it was hassle free, with JJ it was the hell on earth.

I have heard that too...even the stewardess getting arrested with cell phones in their underwear.

But we also assume that these Brazilian pax are headed to GIG and GRU on CM...why not REC et al.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 56, posted (1 year 1 month 19 hours ago) and read 11995 times:

I did a quick research at amadeus.net, in order to analyze the new Central American frequencies on American Airlines:

......Route.............July 2013........December 2013
AA DFW-PTY.......1x weekly...........3x weekly
AA MIA-GUA.......21x weekly.........28x weekly
AA MIA-RTB..........2x weekly..........3x weekly
AA DFW-LIR.........2x weekly...........7x weekly
AA MIA-LIR...........7x weekly..........13x weekly




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 55):
these Brazilian pax are headed to GIG and GRU on CM...why not REC

I see an interesting point here.
CNF, REC, POA, BSB, MAO are not currently getting direct flights to New York City and Copa Airlines is capable to funnel those in-transit passengers through PTY daily.
TAM can certainly move these travelers to the New York City area through either GIG or GRU on a daily basis as well. However, this sequence involves a complicated backtracking to say: JJ BSB-GIG and then JJ GIG-JFK. Panama City has a geographical advantage in this regard.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 57, posted (1 year 1 month 5 hours ago) and read 11876 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 56):
AA DFW-PTY.......1x weekly...........3x weekly

I'd think AA DFW-PTY loads would improve if both out-bound and in-bound were timed to allow immediate connections to/from AA NRT.
CM may be sort of expanding in the U.S.A. but CM PTY-DFW suely is way far in CM radar right-now.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 58, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 11779 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 57):
CM may be sort of expanding in the U.S.A. but CM PTY-DFW suely is way far in CM radar right-now.

Not so sure about that.....



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 59, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 11749 times:

I’m impressed about how AV SAL-IAD would improve their frequencies up to 21x weekly in December.
UA IAD-SAL 7x weekly already flies this segment, meaning 4x daily flights into the [SAL-IAD] route in the near future.
This segment looks like very consolidated and we can firmly post that the former [UA-TA] agreement would efficiently work in the short-term.
Chicago needs more time on AV. The dedicated AV SAL-ORD 7x weekly is the first step.




.
Both AA DFW-PTY and AA DFW-CCS are the poorest Latin American routes on the AA network, in terms of their weekly flights.
AA DFW-PTY is so far increasing their frequencies up to thrice a week and this pattern never happened since AA resumed the DFW-PTY sector.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 57):
I'd think AA DFW-PTY loads would improve if both out-bound and in-bound were timed to allow immediate connections to/from AA NRT.

How big is the dimension of the PTY-Asia market? Probably, it’s not too large.
The AA [DFW-Central America] service is basically centralized on attending the US Western coast, in order to avoid this flow of passengers on the healthy AA [MIA-Central America]. Thus, the yields on AA [MIA-Central America] are not being affected at all.
On the other hand, AA LIM-DFW and the coming AA BOG-DFW are timed to allow immediate connections on AA DFW-NRT.
However, I understood the point because ANA already asked for PTY in the past months.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 57):
CM may be sort of expanding in the U.S.A. but CM PTY-DFW suely is way far in CM radar right-now.

I concur there. CM has much fish to fry in other US stations and I don’t visualize why CM may enter on either DFW or ATL which are attended by AA and DL, respectively. Same with IAH and EWR which are flown by UA and bearing the CM designator.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 60, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 11727 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 58):
Not so sure about that.....

Would come after MSY and HOU in that order.   

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 59):
I’m impressed about how AV SAL-IAD would improve their frequencies up to 21x weekly in December.

There's a huge Salvadorean population in and around D.C., not like in L.A. but quite big.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 59):
Both AA DFW-PTY and AA DFW-CCS are the poorest Latin American routes on the AA network, in terms of their weekly flights.

We all probably know by now, that these days AA can't really increase frequencies on its DFW-CCS.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 61, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 11730 times:

New York City: UA at EWR + CM at JFK
Houston: UA at IAH + CM at HOU ?

 


Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 62, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11714 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 60):
Would come after MSY and HOU in that order.  

HOU is still 24 months out based on current airport projections for completion of the FIS facilities. I don't think CM is going to wait that long before announcing another US destination .



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 63, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 11630 times:

According to local daily La Nación a high–ranking Costa Rican government delegation met recently with the Civil Aviation Administration of China (CAAC) top brass, along with CA, MU and HU executives in Beijing..

Ambassador Ruiz says the possibility of developing new airports in Costa Rica was on the table, and is quoted as saying "Nos gustaría que nuestro país fuera un nodo de operaciones para las aerolíneas internacionales chinas." — loosely translated as: We would like our country to be an operational [hub–and–spoke network] node for international Chinese airlines.

In the meantime, the official claim is that with expanded codeshares in place the number of Chinese tourists could increase from the current 12K to 50K (annually) by 2016.

Costa Rica is the only country in CentAm that has diplomatic relations with the world's second–largest economy rather than with Taiwan.

[Edited 2013-08-01 08:57:03]


Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 64, posted (1 year 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 11520 times:

Since the former TA canceled massively many flights originated at SJO, their remaining planes are supporting their hubs at both SAL and LIM.
Some stations have been definitely closed: MTY and BSB [August 31] which allowed no more than 3x weekly flights out of SJO.
AV hasn’t opened new destinations this year and the goal is rather centralized in increasing selected routes on a daily basis: SAL-CLO, LIM-MDE, LIM-MEX, LIM-POA, SAL-ORD, SAL-MDE and so on.
This task is not completed yet due to the existence of some routes that won’t be running daily in 2013: LIM-SDQ, LIM-HAV and even more. In my view, this is a priority because this is the way how their direct competitors are doing now.
It’s better the current pattern called: [AV LIM-MDE 7x weekly + AV SAL-MDE 7x weekly] than the old [TA/LR SJO-MDE 3x weekly + TA/LR SJO-PTY-MDE 4x weekly + TA LIM-UIO-MDE 7x weekly + TA SAL-MDE 3x weekly, sometimes].
Based on this philosophy, three hubs on AV are better than four of them, especially when their former Central American hubs were negatively desegregating their weekly services as shown: TA SAL-HAV 4x weekly + TA/LR [SJO-HAV] 3x weekly.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinemingocr83 From Costa Rica, joined Dec 2007, 69 posts, RR: 0
Reply 65, posted (1 year 4 weeks ago) and read 11388 times:

Some flight deck and cabin crews that were let go in May in SJO are going to be rehired by AV soon. Seems that the massive personnel movements done in May left AV short handed in SAL. The crews will be based in SAL one week per month then, they can conmute from SJO...


A380, A320, A319, 757-200, 737-800, 737-700, E190
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 66, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 11170 times:

Comprehensive list about the brand new planes on TACA delivered in the past 18 months:

.....Type...........Registration..........Delivery date
Airbus 330..........N279AV..............22/10/2012
Airbus 319..........N522TA..............11/07/2012
Airbus 319..........N524TA..............06/09/2012
Airbus 320..........N685TA..............20/03/2012
Airbus 320..........N686TA..............09/08/2012
Airbus 320..........N688TA..............07/08/2012
Airbus 320..........N689TA..............06/11/2012




Comprehensive list about the brand new planes on COPA mainline delivered in the past 18 months:

.........Type..................Registration...........Delivery date
Boeing 737-800........HP-1726CMP..........08/02/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1826CMP..........26/09/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1730CMP..........05/04/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1827CMP..........23/10/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1828CMP..........22/10/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1829CMP..........28/02/2013
Boeing 737-800........HP-1823CMP..........30/05/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1824CMP..........27/06/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1728CMP..........21/03/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1727CMP..........09/03/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1822CMP..........16/05/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1825CMP..........19/09/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1830CMP..........28/03/2013
Boeing 737-800........HP-1831CMP..........03/04/2013
Boeing 737-800........HP-1729CMP..........27/03/2012
Boeing 737-800........HP-1821CMP..........20/04/2012

Regards.

[Edited 2013-08-03 21:10:19]


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3421 posts, RR: 2
Reply 67, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 11083 times:

Any chance of LIO getting jet service soon?


"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 68, posted (1 year 3 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 11034 times:

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 67):
Any chance of LIO getting jet service soon?

No.
Limon is not Liberia, in many ways: lack of hotel facilities, lack of proper paved roads and the demand of passengers from abroad doesn't seem to match any international airport like LIR.
Limon is about 170 kilometers driving from the capital city. Neither Nature Air or Sansa are flying to LIO regularly.
LIO by itself is getting a short runway for jetline operations and their associated services are quite limited or absent.
Notice that these sentences were written for someone who really love the Caribbean coast...  
The intended purposes for a new airport focused on leisure traffic are rather centralized in Península de Osa and we haven't heard any word in the last months.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 69, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 10779 times:

Confirmed new frequencies on Copa Airlines:


CM PTY-CUN: 35x to 42x weekly with 738 all the way. Effective: December 01.

CM PTY-MIA: 35x weekly to 40x weekly with 738. Effective: December 13 till February 01.

CM PTY-JFK: 14x to 21x weekly with 738. Effective: December 01. CM was forced to fly at JFK by the former CO. Ironically, their weekly frequencies are by far surpassing UA PTY-EWR.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 70, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10755 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 69):
CM PTY-CUN: 35x to 42x weekly with 738 all the way. Effective: December 01.

And that demand doesn't come from PTY. Not sure if CM(P5) would like to fly BOG/MDE-CUN when there're so many flights between PTY and CUN.

Quote:
CM PTY-MIA: 35x weekly to 40x weekly with 738. Effective: December 13 till February 01.

Amazing for CM @ MIA which most likely already have non-stop flights from almost all CM South American destinations. And MIA is no UA hub.

Quote:
CM PTY-JFK: 14x to 21x weekly with 738. Effective: December 01. CM was forced to fly at JFK by the former CO. Ironically, their weekly frequencies are by far surpassing UA PTY-EWR.

Not sure about the 3rd daily schedule, but CM could well make use of the B737-800 it keeps on JFK tarmac overnight with red-eyes both ways.
It's not all true that CM was forced to fly to JFK by Continental, but CM looked at a target market in the Panamanian diaspora in Brooklyn already keen to fly to/from JFK.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 71, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10732 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 70):
Not sure if CM(P5) would like to fly BOG/MDE-CUN when there're so many flights between PTY and CUN.

Copa Airlines Colombia already flies the [BOG-CUN] sector as 4x weekly. AV BOG-CUN is also active; both having limited weekly frequencies.
CM mainline is indeed doing a great job at both CUN and HAV, in connecting a huge number of passengers from abroad through PTY.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 72, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 10732 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 69):
CM PTY-CUN: 35x to 42x weekly with 738 all the way. Effective: December 01.

CM PTY-MIA: 35x weekly to 40x weekly with 738. Effective: December 13 till February 01.

CM PTY-JFK: 14x to 21x weekly with 738. Effective: December 01. CM was forced to fly at JFK by the former CO. Ironically, their weekly frequencies are by far surpassing UA PTY-EWR.

just amazing !!!

I keep thinking they need to get some 739 for most of these routes which will increase capacity by 15% to 20% depending on the final configuration   



On the run !!!
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 73, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10722 times:

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 72):
I keep thinking they need to get some 739 for most of these routes which will increase capacity by 15% to 20% depending on the final configuration

CM needs a couple of B737-900ER for PTY-EZE yesterday. And the B737-900 has the range for EZE-PTY.
On one side, CM (thru Panama Civil Aviation Authority), even if there has been negotiations, it doesn't know when Argentina will allow CM more frequencies or even let CM use the free ones, as their use is tied to CM dropping 3 PTY-EZE frequencies and those free frequencies plus ex-EZE could only be used outside EZE to add capacity to COR and/or open MDZ and/or open ROS and/or open SLA (some provincial lobby needed for that to happen).
On another side, CM hasn't shown interest in operating "scheduled charters" to Argentina as a way to add some capacity there.

CM situation with Canada is kind of similar, CM is tied to 4 per week to YYZ, can't add more frequencies to YYZ, or anywhere else in Canada for that matter, but surely will jump into flying PTY-YUL if Canada grants it frequencies to YUL and not to YYZ the days CM doesn't fly to YYZ.
As with Argentina, CM won't operate scheduled charters to Canada either.
CM also badly needs B737-900ER for the PTY-YYZ route.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineMSYtristar From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 6564 posts, RR: 51
Reply 74, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 10692 times:

Still patiently waiting for MSY-PTY (nonstop or direct) on CM or maybe the return of MSY-BZE-SAP-SAL or MSY-SAP-SAL service on the former Taca. There is still a market for "some" direct service to Central America from New Orleans, and I'm sure it will happen sooner or later. When it does, you better believe I'll be on the inaugural flight. Consider the following routes have been flown...at some point or another...from the early 1940's through 2005. I understand that Miami and Houston long ago took over the role that MSY used to have (ie, "Gateway to the Americas"), and there's no chance for New Orleans to reclaim that time ever again, but there are still quite a few cultural and economic ties between New Orleans and the region. Come on Copa...come on Avianca...make it happen!  

Taca: MSY-BZE-SAP-SAL, MSY-SAP-SAL, MSY-RTB-LCE
Lacsa: MSY-CUN-SAP-SJO
Sahsa: MSY-BZE-SAP, MSY-RTB
Aviateca: MSY-GUA, MSY-MID-GUA
Pan American: MSY-GUA-SAL, MSY-MID-GUA
Eastern: MSY-PTY
Braniff: MSY-PTY

(I did not include MEX service on the list but I included CUN and MID since they terminated in a Central American city)


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 75, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10680 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 69):
CM PTY-CUN: 35x to 42x weekly with 738 all the way. Effective: December 01.
Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 70):
And that demand doesn't come from PTY. Not sure if CM(P5) would like to fly BOG/MDE-CUN when there're so many flights between PTY and CUN.

Sitting in Playa del Carmen right now as I type...I can tell you the hotel I am in (medium size) is full of Colombians, Peruvians and Brazilians. ANd 5th St....Its all latin folks ...only about 10% of the people are what I would deem N. AMerican.

I did ask one of the colombians how he got here...CM via PTY.

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 74):
MSY-BZE-SAP-SAL

although the diasporas are still there...not going to happen anytime soon.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 76, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 10665 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 73):
CM needs a couple of B737-900ER for PTY-EZE yesterday

I don't know if the 739ER has the legs for PTY -EZE without restrictions but for sure it can be used on MIA, ORD, MEX, CCS, etc.

CM moved from the 737 to the 738.. they just need to keep growing and move to the next step: 739ER and wide boby for LAX and deep south America routes   



On the run !!!
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 77, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 10668 times:

Don't get exicited about the 739 on Copa Airlines...
The 738 is the only realistic brand new plane in the forthcoming years, based on previous press releases posted on this board. Even the 73G and E90 is out of that equation by now.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinejuanchito From Guatemala, joined Nov 2000, 1182 posts, RR: 9
Reply 78, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 10559 times:

Starting November 1.
Avianca will launch 4 weekly flights between BOG-GUA

http://www.elpais.com.co/elpais/colo...to-entre-ciudad-guatemala-y-bogota

Juanchito



Chapin de corazon.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 79, posted (1 year 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 10560 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 74):
Still patiently waiting for MSY-PTY (nonstop or direct) on CM or maybe the return of MSY-BZE-SAP-SAL or MSY-SAP-SAL service on the former Taca

MSY should learn a thing or two from TPA and how they got PTY-TPA. Maybe the 3 days CM won't be flying to TPA - as it looks from now - CM could fly PTY-MSY.
AV might know how big is the SAP-MSY market by now, too bad it seems it has focused on other things, neither SAL-MSY nor SAL-SAP-MSY are among them.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 77):
Don't get excited about the 739 on Copa Airlines...
The 738 is the only realistic brand new plane in the forthcoming years, based on previous press releases posted on this board. Even the 73G and E90 is out of that equation by now.

From a reliable source @ CM, if forced to keep the same current frequencies to selected destinations by the national governments, getting the B737-900ER instead of B737-800 is an option to add some capacity.
And if CM wants to fly PTY-SFO non-stop, it'll need a brand new B737-700 w/Sky interior.
By the way, 2 B737-800 cost the same as one B737-900ER and one B737-700.
Not sure if CM would want to replace its E190s, but if CM wants to go that way, there are still some pre-used B737-600/700 around which could replace the E190 and better fit into CM aircraft model commonality issues.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 80, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 10450 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 74):
CM or maybe the return of MSY-BZE-SAP-SAL or MSY-SAP-SAL service on the former Taca

It's a pity how the former TA didn't return to MSY, since the Katrina event. Only some isolated charter flights on TA SAP-MSY.
The traffic of passengers between Central America and New Orleans has been utilizing other ways of transportation like CO/UA [MSY-IAH] and then [IAH-Central America].
On the other hand, CM doesn't tend to fly tag-on segments, besides their Central American inner flights.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 81, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 10446 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 79):
From a reliable source @ CM, if forced to keep the same current frequencies to selected destinations by the national governments, getting the B737-900ER instead of B737-800 is an option to add some capacity

I heard the same from some pilots about CCS thought nothing confirmed yet. Now, as CM has several 738 on order they might still change some of them to 739 / 737 to have more flexibitily.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 79):
Not sure if CM would want to replace its E190s, but if CM wants to go that way, there are still some pre-used B737-600/700 around which could replace the E190 and better fit into CM aircraft model commonality issues

not sure why they will replace the E190 since they seem to be working well in Panama and Colombia. Combined (CM & P5) fleet has 26 aircraft so it has a very good scale.



On the run !!!
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 82, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 10453 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 80):
On the other hand, CM doesn't tend to fly tag-on segments, besides their Central American inner flights.

That and the fact CM doesn't have any aircraft suitable to land @ LPB is why CM hasn't started that destination.
Have doubts CM would like to tag-onto HAV, to SDQ or to POS in the Caribbean as it once had tag-on in that region.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 83, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 10400 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 80):
On the other hand, CM doesn't tend to fly tag-on segments, besides their Central American inner flights.

BUT, CM does have a RON at SAP that stays there just long enough to comfortably do a red eye tag to msy



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinebjorn14 From Norway, joined Feb 2010, 3421 posts, RR: 2
Reply 84, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 10322 times:

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 74):
"Gateway to the Americas"

I hope one day MSY can reclaim this title. If you look at a map of the Western Hemisphere it is almost prefectly positioned (maybe a tad too far north) to do just that. Her biggest rivals would be IAH and/or PTY. Not a fortress hub for anybody and a new 40+ gate terminal coming soon what more could an airline ask for?



"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 85, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 10281 times:

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 81):
I heard the same from some pilots about CCS thought nothing confirmed yet.

According to Panama's ruler, his last trip to Venezuela was to see ways to collect what Venezuelan clients owe Colon Duty Free Zone and get CM extra frequencies but that could come at a price.
I believe CCS capacity could be increased via BOG and/or MDE P5 or B737-900ER without need of Panama's ruler intervention.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 83):
BUT, CM does have a RON at SAP that stays there just long enough to comfortably do a red eye tag to msy

Same does CM at GUA, SJO for a red-eyes to MIA



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 86, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 10068 times:

Looks like AA will be adding DFW RTB this winter. Things are heating up in RTB! That RTB ramp will be awfully crowded on Saturdays!


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 87, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 10068 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 86):
Things are heating up in RTB! That RTB ramp will be awfully crowded on Saturdays!

And PTY-RTB may well be a better performer than PTY-LIR.
  



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlinescorp82 From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 78 posts, RR: 0
Reply 88, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 10063 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 79):
MSY should learn a thing or two from TPA and how they got PTY-TPA. Maybe the 3 days CM won't be flying to TPA - as it looks from now - CM could fly PTY-MSY.
AV might know how big is the SAP-MSY market by now, too bad it seems it has focused on other things, neither SAL-MSY nor SAL-SAP-MSY are among them.

Perhaps CM will operate to MSY sometime in the future. However I do see CM operating to MSY and not AV, but I could be wrong. For some reason I think AV is focusing on other ventures and as you stated, I don't think MSY is in their plans.

I read an article about how TPA was able to obtain CM service. A delegation from TPA visited CM in Panama and they were pretty much told by CM that as far as Florida service was concerned, they served MIA and MCO just fine. In other words, CM didn't seem too interested in serving TPA, but they most definitely changed their plans. CM did see opportunity in TPA and with the connecting flights and services in PTY, an interest was justified. Additionally the success of BOS and LAS is also prompting them to look at other cities in the US. I believe DEN is also in talks with CM to commence PTY-DEN flights.

TPA authorities have also tried to obtain AV flights from BOG as well, but we'll see if they come to fruition.

It seems AV is focusing on not only the completion of the integration of the brands, but on further strengthening BOG. I wonder what plans AV has for adding new destinations to and from SAL.

[Edited 2013-08-10 21:01:54]

User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 89, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 10047 times:

Quoting scorp82 (Reply 88):
I wonder what plans AV has for adding new destinations to and from SAL.

After what AV has seen CM do in LAS, I'd expect AV to be studying SAL-LAS, and there might be some SAL VFR O/D traffic on that route as Salvadoreans in California may be moving to Las Vegas for jobs.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 90, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9955 times:

Quoting scorp82 (Reply 88):
Additionally the success of BOS and LAS is also prompting them to look at other cities in the US

As a matter of fact, CM PTY-LAS goes from 7x to 11x weekly; starting on December 13th. All these flights served with 738, all the way.
Copa Airlines seems to be focused in the United States.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinegeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 580 posts, RR: 0
Reply 91, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 9958 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Just out of curiosity does anyone know how the PTY-BOS flights have been doing? How are the advanced bookings for this fall?

User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 92, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 9924 times:

based on Prensa's today:

http://www.prensa.com/impreso/economia/188-millones-utilidad/197891
La aerolínea panameña transportó hasta julio, 8.3 millones de pasajeros, un incremento de 19%, si se compara con el mismo período del año pasado. Copa Holdings, tenedora de las acciones de la aerolínea panameña Copa Airlines, acumuló una utilidad neta de 188 millones de dólares en el primer semestre del año. La empresa obtuvo una utilidad de 74.4 millones de dólares en el segundo trimestre, cifra que se suma a los 113 millones de dólares de los primeros tres meses del año. Por acción, la empresa obtuvo una utilidad de 1.66 dólar, lo que representa una disminución de 88 centésimos en comparación con los resultados del primer trimestre. La acción de la empresa que cotiza en la Bolsa de Nueva York desde 2005 cerró la semana con un precio de 139.18 dólares. En el informe enviado a sus accionistas, Copa Holdings, explicó que los ingresos totales de abril a junio alcanzaron los 592 millones de dólares, para totalizar mil 233 millones de dólares en el primer semestre. La compañía informó que hasta julio había transportado 8.3 millones de pasajeros, un incremento de 19% si se compara con el mismo período del año pasado. De mantener este ritmo la aerolínea superará la meta de 11 millones de personas que se había planteado para 2013.

CM increased load by 19% (8.3MM passgers) and net profits were $188MM in the first 2 quarters of the year.

sense as very good results, well done CM   



On the run !!!
User currently offlinescorp82 From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 78 posts, RR: 0
Reply 93, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 9892 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 89):
After what AV has seen CM do in LAS, I'd expect AV to be studying SAL-LAS, and there might be some SAL VFR O/D traffic on that route as Salvadoreans in California may be moving to Las Vegas for jobs.

I'm sure AV is indeed studying SAL-LAS to a degree.

And also now that AV will be shelving ORD-GUA and commencing ORD-SAL and also studying the success CM is having with added destinations in North America, I wonder if AV will reinstate the BOS-SAL flight in the near future.


User currently offlineCM767 From Panama, joined Dec 2004, 654 posts, RR: 1
Reply 94, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9878 times:

Air Panama has acquired up to two 737-300, the following link on Spanish covers the arrival of the first.

http://www.aeronautica.gob.pa/Notici...a.php?cg=noticia_09.08.2013.824411



But The Best Thing God Has Created Is A New Day
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 95, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 9839 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 87):
And PTY-RTB may well be a better performer than PTY-LIR.

S. Americans do love the beach (after all who needs the rainforest when you have biggest in your back yard)..and RTB does have beach



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineadamh8297 From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 890 posts, RR: 0
Reply 96, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 9798 times:

Quoting georgiabill (Reply 91):

Just out of curiosity does anyone know how the PTY-BOS flights have been doing?

Check here in a couple weeks to see how the first month (July) went loadwise. Since BOS-PTY is the only Central American flight you can do the math.

http://www.massport.com/logan-airpor...t-logan/pages/loganstatistics.aspx


User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 97, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 9776 times:

Quoting CM767 (Reply 94):

wow, I didn't see that coming!


User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 98, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9622 times:

What aircraft does CM have on their FB page? https://www.facebook.com/copaairlines

At first it seems like a A300, but then you see the winglets....also the slats are down......

someone didn't do a very good job of this....at least make it a 737!



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 99, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 9557 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 86):
Looks like AA will be adding DFW RTB this winter. Things are heating up in RTB! That RTB ramp will be awfully crowded on Saturdays!

Absolutely !   

American Airlines will start the Dallas/Ft. Worth - Roatan service as shown:

AA 331......DFW 10:50......RTB 14:00........Sa.........738
AA 336......RTB 15:05......DFW 18:35........Sa.........738
Effective: November 23

AA MIA-RTB will go from 1x to 3x weekly on November 23 as well.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 100, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9521 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 95):
S. Americans do love the beach (after all who needs the rainforest when you have biggest in your back yard)

No shortage of beaches in SouthAm either.. over two thousand along Brazil's coastline (7500km) alone.. so this reiterative logic might be a bit skewed.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlinecraviation From Costa Rica, joined Oct 2004, 48 posts, RR: 0
Reply 101, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 9399 times:

Quoting mingocr83 (Reply 65):
Some flight deck and cabin crews that were let go in May in SJO are going to be rehired by AV soon. Seems that the massive personnel movements done in May left AV short handed in SAL. The crews will be based in SAL one week per month then, they can conmute from SJO...

No they won't. It's true that a few crewmembers will probably be rehired, but it will be for the SJO base and for the Airbus fleet. LR is flying several wet-leases for TA and that's where the crews will go.
LR E90 will stop flying the TA SAL-BOG on Set 14. LR will be flying charters to KIN and MBJ in September, and the SJO-MIA flights will be flown by AV by November (on a BOG-MIA-SJO and back run).
Regards



-CostaRicaAviation-FotosAereasCR.com-
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 102, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 9439 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 100):
No shortage of beaches in SouthAm either.. over two thousand along Brazil's coastline (7500km) alone.. so this reiterative logic might be a bit skewed.

Not to bust your bubble....but the S. Atlantic is hardly the warm Caribbean Sea during the Southern winter travel period.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 103, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 9304 times:

Quoting craviation (Reply 101):
LR will be flying charters to KIN and MBJ in September

I have no doubts that the intention of these flights is to mobilize fans for the qualifying match of the 2014 World Cup: Jamaica - Costa Rica.




.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 102):
the S. Atlantic is hardly the warm Caribbean Sea during the Southern winter travel period.

I keep on repeating that neither Belize City, Roatan, Flores nor Liberia are attractive for passengers coming for South America yet. Their potential is by far mostly centralized from the United States, given all the 2013 announcements, in terms of new frequencies or city-pairs: AA DFW-RTB 1x weekly, AA MIA-LIR 13x weekly, DL LAX-LIR 1x weekly, DL JFK-LIR 1x weekly, DL LAX-BZE 1x weekly, UA ORD-LIR 3x weekly, UA IAH-BZE 21x weekly, UA IAH-RTB 7x weekly, UA EWR-BZE 4x weekly, UA EWR-LIR 5x weekly and AA DFW-LIR 7x weekly.
On the contrary, Copa Airlines is doing an excellent work on [CM PTY-CUN 42x weekly soon], CM PTY-HAV 35x weekly, CM PTY-SDQ 35x weekly, CM PTY-PUJ 25x weekly and so forth, where the South American component is extremely remarkable in order to sustain these flights profitably.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 104, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 9268 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 102):
the S. Atlantic is hardly the warm Caribbean Sea during the Southern winter

You really need to shake off this mental imagery of crazy british folks braving the frigid waters off the Islas Malvinas, and realize there are places along Brazil's Região Nordeste — such as Taipus de Fora, in Maraú peninsula (the 1100km coastline of Bahia is speckled with spectacular beaches) that actually have an equatorial climate (aka tropical rainforest climate) with relatively constant temperatures and mostly warm/humid weather conditions throughout the year.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0d/TAIPUS-DE-FORA-1.JPG



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 105, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 9107 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 104):
such as Taipus de Fora, in Maraú peninsula (the 1100km coastline of Bahia is speckled with spectacular beaches) that actually have an equatorial climate (aka tropical rainforest climate) with relatively constant temperatures and mostly warm/humid weather conditions throughout the year.

Where are the wealthier South American leisure-passengers traveling more: Florianopolis or Punta Cana? Buzios or Cancun? Have they ever heard something about either Liberia or Roatan? I ignore the accurate answers.
Based on our perspective, Copa Airlines is steadily loading planes with passengers linking deep South America and their Caribbean stations on the beach.
Nonetheless, the Central American landscape unfortunately is not even touching their senses in the healthy proportion that we'd like to see shortly.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 106, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 9025 times:

American Airlines has already loaded the schedule for the Miami - Roatan service.
AA MIA-RTB goes from 1x to 3x weekly:

AA 1517......MIA 11:20........RTB 12:30........Mo, We, Sa........738
AA 1518......RTB 13:35.......MIA 16:45.........Mo, We, Sa........738
Effective: November 23

We've just noticed how Roatan has experienced an increase, in terms of frequencies and new services from the United States this year: UA IAH-RTB 7x weekly, AA MIA-RTB 3x weekly and AA DFW-RTB 1x weekly.

Reagrds.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 107, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 8952 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 105):
Where are the wealthier South American leisure-passengers traveling more: Florianopolis or Punta Cana

Brazil is the fifth largest country in the world.. Canasvieiras, Mole, etc. are all near the 27th parallel south, and therefore have a humid subtropical climate (generally hot humid summers and mild to cool winters) which falls just short of a true tropical climate.

My point is that SouthAm leisure travelers are not drawn to sun–and–sand destinations along the Caribbean because of a shortage of attractive and more convenient destinations enroute, even during the southern hemisphere winter months.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 105):
Have they ever heard something about either Liberia

Suggesting those same travelers won't come to LIR because the beaches are sub par and besides, "who needs the rainforest when you have biggest in your back yard" is a joke.

Using that same (skewed) logic, culturally sensitive European tourists could care less about the Metropolitan Museum of Art simply because they have the Louvre in their own continent.

 



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 108, posted (1 year 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 8919 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 107):
Suggesting those same travelers won't come to LIR because the beaches are sub par and besides, "who needs the rainforest when you have biggest in your back yard" is a joke.

Its a great day when Viaggiare start quoting you. I feel special!
        



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 109, posted (1 year 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 8795 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 108):
I feel special

Coming from a marketing background, you might feel even more special by giving some thought to how people are lured by certain destinations and how it is that they form their perceptions.

Back in the late seventies, someone named John Crompton came up with a push–pull motive model in which he identified certain socio–psychological (push) motives which support the wish to travel: escape, self–exploratory, relaxation, prestige, regression, kinship–enhancement, and social interaction, plus two cultural (pull) motives related to the attributes of the destination: novelty and education.

Understanding the REAL motivational factors of SouthAm tourists choosing PUJ, CUN, SXM, etc. over LIR, BZE, PTY, etc. could have important marketing implications for CentAm as we attempt to meet the desired needs of individual travelers from different markets.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 110, posted (1 year 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 8752 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 109):
Understanding the REAL motivational factors of SouthAm tourists choosing PUJ, CUN, SXM, etc. over LIR, BZE, PTY, etc. could have important marketing implications for CentAm as we attempt to meet the desired needs of individual travelers from different markets.

I would need a marketing.net to explain the whole market positioning thing. my post would probably get deleted if i started typing those essays here.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 111, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8638 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 107):
Canasvieiras, Mole, etc. are all near the 27th parallel south, and therefore have a humid subtropical climate (generally hot humid summers and mild to cool winters) which falls just short of a true tropical climate.

Based on this philosophy, the deep South American travelers won’t come to the Central American sandy beaches only for the existence of places having a subtropical climate as well.
Salvador de Bahia is extensively promoting the nice village placed in Morro de Sao Paulo that makes a resemblance with Puerto Viejo, in my point of view: hot humid environment throughout the year. The last assertion says nothing for Brazilians, even though it may complement the "Musée du Louvre - Metropolitan Museum of Art" analogy.  
On the contrary, the Canadian and American citizens don’t have that geographical privilege and this fact could explain the flock of leisure travelers visiting Bahamas, St. Maarten, Dominican Republic and our most representative stations: Belize City, Roatan, Liberia, etc.
Nevertheless, this couldn’t be the sole explanation: North Americans visiting Liberia and those enjoying their timeshare plans, condos and other activities related to the real estate industry are presumably influenced by advertising and other facts. I don’t think the Central American authorities and private entities are promoting something like that in the same scale, in countries such as Brazil, Argentina, Chile and so on.
In the meanwhile, CM PTY-LIR 2x weekly won’t experience any progress soon and the lack of CM PTY-BZE and CM PTY-RTB are undoubtedly representing just how small is that market.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 112, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 8629 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 111):
In the meanwhile, CM PTY-LIR 2x weekly won’t experience any progress soon and the lack of CM PTY-BZE and CM PTY-RTB are undoubtedly representing just how small is that market.

The (lack of) success of PTY LIR is hardly and indicator of the success of PTY-BZE. LIR does not have the traffic to POS that BZE has for example. LIR does not have the free zone trade that the free zones of PTY and BZE do. And that is just two examples. PTY BZE will be much more business oriented route. Brazil is Belize's 3rd biggest trade partner now.

Travel2 can speak to the large number of legal firm based J class tickets that we should start to see soon too between BZE and PTY   

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 111):
I don’t think the Central American authorities and private entities are promoting something like that in the same scale, in countries such as Brazil, Argentina, Chile and so on.

CR is promoting alot in Brazil. Can't speak of the other countries you mention.

I will say again, that the lack of BZE-PTY on CM has nothing to do with route viability as those numbers are there. The real reason for the non-start should be fixed shortly.            



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 113, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8625 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 105):
Where are the wealthier South American leisure-passengers traveling more: Florianopolis or Punta Cana? Buzios or Cancun? Have they ever heard something about either Liberia or Roatan? I ignore the accurate answers.

You tell me, I'm almost going INSANE trying to book +- 10 tickets for my family, they want to go to CUR this december, flights got a good price on CM but to find a house there close to the beach, such a headache.

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 107):
My point is that SouthAm leisure travelers are not drawn to sun–and–sand destinations along the Caribbean because of a shortage of attractive and more convenient destinations enroute, even during the southern hemisphere winter months.

AND SAFETY, Brazil is now "De Facto" the world's murder capital (average 145 homicides A DAY) this was Globo news saying!!!!! yesterday close to my office (Vieiralves high class neighborhood) there were shootings, two men were shot dead by police for assaulting a bank, they killed one security officer, the country is going insane, government is unable to get its acts together, they say inflation is under control, at the supermarket everything missing or empty. Our mothers bless us whenever we go partying because we never know if we'll be back in one piece.

COSTA RICA, PANAMÁ PLEASE TAKE MY ASYLUM REQUEST! 


User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 114, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 8582 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 112):
The (lack of) success of PTY LIR is hardly and indicator of the success of PTY-BZE. LIR does not have the traffic to POS that BZE has for example. LIR does not have the free zone trade that the free zones of PTY and BZE do. And that is just two examples. PTY BZE will be much more business oriented route. Brazil is Belize's 3rd biggest trade partner now.

I respect your point, but I hold mine: BZE, RTB and LIR are mostly oriented for tourism and coming from the United States.
BZE is predominantly tourism. LIR is entirely tourism.
I don't dispute the business traffic involving BZE. What I highly doubt is the existence of a healthy demand of passengers to justify any CM PTY-BZE 7x weekly operating sustainibly and facing the daily AV BZE-SAL and connections.
Los Angeles is by far a bigger business center than Port of Spain and DL LAX-BZE 1x weekly will barely resume their flights in December.




.

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 113):
I'm almost going INSANE trying to book +- 10 tickets for my family, they want to go to CUR this december, flights got a good price on CM

You're cleary representing our former point related to the chosen of leisure destinations abroad.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 115, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8562 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 114):
I don't dispute the business traffic involving BZE. What I highly doubt is the existence of a healthy demand of passengers to justify any CM PTY-BZE 7x weekly operating sustainibly and facing the daily AV BZE-SAL and connections.

While I don't think the PTY-BZE traffic is enough demand for a daily yet, I do agree that there's a need of a link between PTY and BZE and taking as an example of what has happened to PTY-NAS, a big number of travellers won't be leisure passengers and those are the ones who would pay for the route.
Don't know what CM wanted from Costa Rica so it agree to fly to LIR as a token for that or if some resort(s) in LIR gave CM an incentive to start flying to LIR, but unless CM does something with LIR (still believe LIR as a stop en-route to GUA twice weekly may work), LIR may be CM 1st dropped destination in many years.
I see more chances of BZE and RTB attracting leisure traffic from South America than LIR.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2120 posts, RR: 8
Reply 116, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8540 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 111):
Quoting viaggiare (Reply 107):
Canasvieiras, Mole, etc. are all near the 27th parallel south, and therefore have a humid subtropical climate (generally hot humid summers and mild to cool winters) which falls just short of a true tropical climate.

Based on this philosophy, the deep South American travelers won’t come to the Central American sandy beaches only for the existence of places having a subtropical climate as well.

Not during the southern hemisphere winter. I was merely stating that, unlike those in Bahia, the beaches in southern Brazil near Florianópolis lie outside the equatorial climate zone. Cono Sur tourists flock there during the summer, though.

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 112):
the lack of BZE-PTY on CM has nothing to do with route viability as those numbers are there

And yet Copa keeps dragging its feet on BZE for some reason.. they must know something you don't.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 115):
LIR as a stop en-route to GUA twice weekly may work

Good thing you're not in the route planning business. 

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 115):
I see more chances of BZE and RTB attracting leisure traffic from South America than LIR

Talk about purely conjectural nonsense.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 117, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 8479 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 115):
I do agree that there's a need of a link between PTY and BZE and taking as an example of what has happened to PTY-NAS, a big number of travellers won't be leisure passengers and those are the ones who would pay for the route.

I concur BZE deserves more connectivity, but one wish is not enough to start a new flight. Business is mandatory in this industry and PTY-BZE, PTY-RTB and PTY-LIR don't guarantee any profitable venture yet.
For illustrative purposes, I could speak as a resident in Merida arguing that we desperately need new links to Central, South America and the Caribbean due to the lack of flights.
CM PTY-KIN and CM PTY-PAP have been struggling for years trying to consolidate their routes. Both TGU and SAP recently started their dedicated flights to Panama City.
Anyways, Copa Airlines is now heading to bigger markets such as PTY-NAS, PTY-BOS, PTY-LAS and PTY-TPA soon. Even the airline has stopped the possible CM PTY-SSA due to the slow progress on CM PTY-REC 4x weekly.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 115):
I see more chances of BZE and RTB attracting leisure traffic from South America than LIR.

It makes no sense.
PTY-BZE, PTY-RTB and PTY-LIR are now ranked in the same small scale related to the leisure component.




.

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 116):
LIR as a stop en-route to GUA twice weekly may work

Good thing you're not in the route planning business.

Agreed.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineadamh8297 From United States of America, joined Dec 2012, 890 posts, RR: 0
Reply 118, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 8464 times:

Quoting adamh8297 (Reply 96):

Quoting georgiabill (Reply 91):

Just out of curiosity does anyone know how the PTY-BOS flights have been doing?

Check here in a couple weeks to see how the first month (July) went loadwise. Since BOS-PTY is the only Central American flight you can do the math.

http://www.massport.com/logan-airpor....aspx

BOS just released July 2013 stats -

Boston Logan July 2013 Stats

Unfortunately it looks they counted the PTY flight as Caribbean and not Central America so we cannot get an idea on loads from this source right now.


User currently offlinegreenmow From Russia, joined Jun 2007, 22 posts, RR: 0
Reply 119, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8438 times:

Quoting adamh8297 (Reply 118):
Unfortunately it looks they counted the PTY flight as Caribbean and not Central America so we cannot get an idea on loads from this source right now.

Checking the availability on PTY-BOS for a few random dates in August the loads are close to 100%.


User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 120, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days ago) and read 8400 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 117):
Even the airline has stopped the possible CM PTY-SSA due to the slow progress on CM PTY-REC 4x weekly.

Wait until we know which teams make it to the Brazil World cup next year and where they're going to play for some CM in Brazil surprises.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 117):
For illustrative purposes, I could speak as a resident in Merida arguing that we desperately need new links to Central, South America and the Caribbean due to the lack of flights.

MID doesn't have links to Central, South America and Caribbean because the proximity to CUN. If people in MID don't take the advantage of flying in/out of CUN when their destination is not served from its airport, that's another subject.
Was that Merida or was the one in Venezuela?

Quoting adamh8297 (Reply 118):
Unfortunately it looks they counted the PTY flight as Caribbean and not Central America so we cannot get an idea on loads from this source right now.

Panama still has more in common with the Caribbean islands (Spanish and English-speaking) than with our Central/South American neighbours. I like BOS airport counting PTY as Caribbean.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 117):
Business is mandatory in this industry and PTY-BZE, PTY-RTB and PTY-LIR don't guarantee any profitable venture yet.

The business for PTY-BZE is there, both Yellowtail and I know it very well and we're on both ends of the possible route.

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 116):
Good thing you're not in the route planning business.

That same odd out-of-the-box route planning thinking is what has made CM hub what it's.
Too bad there're people on CM management who hasn't done that much for P5 P2P routes out of Colombia and happened to push that LIR service.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 121, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 8403 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 114):
CM PTY-BZE 7x weekly operating sustainibly and facing the daily AV BZE-SAL and connections.

CM via PTY and AV via SAL cater to two different markets. You can hardly even get to SJO nov from BZE via AV without an overnight. AV via SAL caters to N. Central America.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 114):
Los Angeles is by far a bigger business center than Port of Spain and DL LAX-BZE 1x weekly will barely resume their flights in December.

LAX gives zero business traffic to BZE. Its heavy ethnic with some tourism. The flights are resuming and they are filling in nicely. I bet DL will keep this one and expand it...

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 115):
PTY and BZE and taking as an example of what has happened to PTY-NAS,

PTY BZE will be a mirror image of PTY BZE about a 50/50 mix of business and tourism.

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 116):
And yet Copa keeps dragging its feet on BZE for some reason.. they must know something you don't.

No, we both know the same thing. Unfortunately, I cannot comment on it in a public forum like this. But it is being addressed.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 120):
The business for PTY-BZE is there, both Yellowtail and I know it very well and we're on both ends of the possible route.


  

Unfortunately it is never simple in Latin America!



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 122, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8172 times:

Quoting greenmow (Reply 119):
Checking the availability on PTY-BOS for a few random dates in August the loads are close to 100%

If that assertion is true as outlined above, the former hypothesis is now confirmed stating that the future of CM is centralized in the United States as it represents a lower level of risk than some of their 2012 additions: Recife, Iquitos and Liberia.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 120):
Was that Merida or was the one in Venezuela?

I was referring to Merida, Mexico.
Speaking about the Belize City situation on Copa Airlines, we can argue something similar indicating that many places such as San Francisco, Cleveland, Denver, Jacksonville, New Orleans, Merida, Barbados, Guyana, Belem, Salvador de Bahia, Fortaleza, Natal, Curitiba, Mendoza, Rosario, Antofagasta, La Paz and others are not properly connected yet to the rest of the continent through PTY and how their business seats would be totally loaded once the airline would dare to fly there.

Regards.

[Edited 2013-08-18 19:32:16]


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 123, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 8132 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 122):
If that assertion is true as outlined above, the former hypothesis is now confirmed stating that the future of CM is centralized in the United States as it represents a lower level of risk than some of their 2012 additions: Recife, Iquitos and Liberia.

CM saw an opportunity in REC, IMHO, that market will develop better loads as time goes by.
CM wanted and extra daily to LIM, PTY-IQT was what CM had to pay for that. If CM wants another, expect CM to open AQP (best) and/or CIX.
Enough has been written about LIR here now.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 122):
Speaking about the Belize City situation on Copa Airlines, we can argue something similar indicating that many places such as San Francisco, Cleveland, Denver, Jacksonville, New Orleans, Merida, Barbados, Guyana, Belem, Salvador de Bahia, Fortaleza, Natal, Curitiba, Mendoza, Rosario, Antofagasta, La Paz and others are not properly connected yet to the rest of the continent through PTY and how their business seats would be totally loaded once the airline would dare to fly there.

CM in CLE, MID, NAT, ANF... may not happen. BEL would be a big if. MDZ and ROS would have to wait until there are changes in the Panama-Argentina bilateral. CM doesn't have any plane on its fleet equipped to operate @ LPB.
Forgot about destinations like PHX - if US remain in Star Alliance, SEA (perhaps via GUA), MSP, DFW, ATL, RDU, YUL - if Canada allows new frequencies and airports, SCU, VRA (to get leisure seats off PTY-HAV), FDF, PMV and PZO - if Venezuela allows those, SLA - subject to improved Panama-Argentina bilateral, CBB, CCP...
And of course CM return to DAV.
  



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 124, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 8072 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 123):
IMHO, that market will develop better loads as time goes by.
CM wanted and extra daily to LIM, PTY-IQT was what CM had to pay for that.

I have heard it argued that technically PTY IQT does no lose money because its "losses" are part of the PTY-LIM expenses (i.e the airfare). flying IQT is the cost of making money in LIM.

Don't know how CM does its accounting but it would make sense. Whether it is so or not is another story.

Congrats to them on BOS. Full plane doesn't mean profit, but it is a promising start.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 125, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 7960 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 124):
Congrats to them on BOS. Full plane doesn't mean profit, but it is a promising start.

UA PTY-EWR + UA EWR-BOS: $ 600
CM PTY-BOS: $ 685
DL PTY-ATL + DL ATL-BOS: $722
AA PTY-MIA + AA MIA-BOS: $789




.
Chicago O’Hare has experienced some expansion in their services heading to Central America lately. Ten years ago, only TACA flew that route as SAL-GUA-ORD allowing limited weekly frequencies. UA SJO-ORD was also active for a while back.
Despite the fact that ORD is a UA base, their Cent Am operations seems rather to be focused in the O&D traffic, whilst both EWR primarily and IAD in a lower scale are attending a vast number of connections heading to Europe and the north-east region of Canada and the United States.
Here are their services by the end of the year:

CM PTY-ORD 7x weekly
AV SAL-ORD 4x weekly
UA ORD-LIR 3x weekly -seasonal-
UA ORD-SJO 1x weekly

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6124 posts, RR: 2
Reply 126, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 7838 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 125):
AA PTY-MIA + AA MIA-BOS: $789

Anything involving MIA has a yield advantage. Granted the costs at MIA are higher too.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 127, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 7805 times:

Hear comments that CM website isn't allowing bookings to/from Brazil for JUNE2014.
Maybe CM is getting ready for the FIFA World Cup Brazil 2014.
As for seasonal PTY service to some Brazilian airports not yet served by CM, pretty sure it'll depend which teams make it to Brazil and/or if Panama is one of them.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 128, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 7788 times:

AV SAL-YYZ has finally increased their services on a daily basis and deploying decent hours of operations as shown:

AV 6620.....SAL 14:50...... YYZ 21:55......Daily.....320
AV 6629.....YYZ 10:50.......SAL 14:00......Daily.....320


CM PTY-YYZ 4x weekly cannot rise their frequencies now due to the constraints imposed by the bilateral agreement between Canada and Panama.
Avianca never resumed the SAL-YUL service commented before.
Other services linking Canada and Central America year-round are: AC YYZ-SJO 2x weekly, AC YYZ-LIR 1x weekly and WS YYZ-LIR 1x weekly.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlinecarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4757 posts, RR: 30
Reply 129, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7677 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 127):
Hear comments that CM website isn't allowing bookings to/from Brazil for JUNE2014.

Flights are showing in the GDS, but every single one of them is full   
AV is showing availability in business... there are only a few flights that have availability in coach with the full Y fare.
My guess is that the seats are blocked by tour operators and such.



What do I know, I'm just an 'immature troublemaker with only a passing interest in aviation' (or so they say)
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 130, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7665 times:

3.7 million passengers passed PTY from www.prensa.com in Spanish
PTY airport traffic went up 12.9% during the first 6 months of this year.compared to same period last year.
It was reported 1.8 million of those were transit passengers (supposedly only immediate connections which didn't go thru immigration/customs because long connecting times).
It's expected this year 7.4 million passengers will use PTY.
44% of the routes are South American, 24% North American, 15% Caribbean, 13.9% Central American and the rest European. No African or Asian or Pacific routes in PTY yet.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineaer From Guatemala, joined Mar 2004, 1048 posts, RR: 3
Reply 131, posted (1 year 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 7595 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 128):
CM PTY-YYZ 4x weekly cannot rise their frequencies now due to the constraints imposed by the bilateral agreement between Canada and Panama.

CM is welcomed to use slots in the GUA-Canada bilateral hehehe



nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4482 posts, RR: 4
Reply 132, posted (1 year 1 week 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 7580 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 130):
No African or Asian or Pacific routes in PTY yet.

We haven’t read any update lately concerning to the possibility of ANA -All Nippon Airways- in Panama.




.
Let’s talk something about Nicaragua where Miami continues as the stellar destination out of MGA and offering up to 5x daily flights: AA MIA-MGA 21x weekly with 738 and AV SAL-MGA-MIA [7x weekly with 319 + 7x weekly with E90].
NK FLL-MGA 3x weekly also contributes mobilizing traffic to South Florida. No changes on this red-eye pattern since 2007.
Neither Managua nor Tegucigalpa are hubs for any mainline carrier and that fact could explain the lack of non-stop flights linking Nicaragua and Honduras. The magnitude of the traffic on TGU-MGA cannot be compared with other regional city-pairs: PTY-SJO, MGA-GUA, GUA-SJO, SAL-SJO, GUA-SAL, PTY-SAL, etc.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 133, posted (1 year 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 7539 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 127):
Hear comments that CM website isn't allowing bookings to/from Brazil for JUNE2014.
Maybe CM is getting ready for the FIFA World Cup Brazil 2014.
As for seasonal PTY service to some Brazilian airports not yet served by CM, pretty sure it'll depend which teams make it to Brazil and/or if Panama is one of them.

The Real's devaluation is hitting int'l airlines here, today people went mad, CM promoting RETURN tickets from ANY brazilian city to PTY for 330 USD! I almost shot myself I won't be able to visit PTY on the coming months  

But it may be FIFA's tricks as the hotels here in MAO have already blocked some rooms for them and their "paraphernalia", they're also dictating the prices.


User currently offlinecopa330200 From Panama, joined Jan 2011, 208 posts, RR: 0
Reply 134, posted (1 year 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 7488 times:

from today's prensa
http://www.prensa.com/impreso/econom...copa-operar-vuelos-internos/200443

this is quite interesting as Peru goverment has offered CM the option to operate local or internal flights within in Peru, now based on the article, CM PR manager sais that CM is looking to add more frequencies from PTY ..



On the run !!!
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 135, posted (1 year 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 7453 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 132):
We haven’t read any update lately concerning to the possibility of ANA -All Nippon Airways- in Panama.

Or BR return to PTY either.

Quoting andrefranca (Reply 133):
CM promoting RETURN tickets from ANY brazilian city to PTY for 330 USD!

Is that for REAL ?   
And still Panama major tourist attractions don't want to invest to have literature and videos in Portuguese.

Quoting copa330200 (Reply 134):
this is quite interesting as Peru government has offered CM the option to operate local or internal flights within in Peru, now based on the article, CM PR manager sais that CM is looking to add more frequencies from PTY ..

I'd guess if Peru can get Argentina to allow CM PTY-Peru-Argentina surely CM will study it.
There has been rumours about possible PTY-AQP and PTY-CIX some time soon.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 136, posted (1 year 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 7365 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 135):
Is that for REAL ?   
And still Panama major tourist attractions don't want to invest to have literature and videos in Portuguese.

We tend to be very sensitive to the US dollar these days, AF and AA also dropping their fares. While in Central America this january/february I was paying 1,90 to the dollar now it's 2,41!!!!!!
The portuguese thing would be a differential, but it's so close to spanish that many organizations don't feel like spending money on that, I did notice in PTY signs written in Portuguese.


User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2608 posts, RR: 1
Reply 137, posted (1 year 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 7035 times:

http://www.prensa.com/impreso/econom...podra-ascender-936-millones/201237
From www.prensa.com in Spanish

PTY North concourse (terminal) price-tag may go up to USD936million
However, it now includes the 3rd runway and its taxi-ways, which we don't know where it'll be located.
IMHO, that new concourse design may not be optimal for a hub operation but it's great for huge concession areas.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineCM767 From Panama, joined Dec 2004, 654 posts, RR: 1
Reply 138, posted (1 year 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6998 times:

Hello Travel

The article mentions the south terminal; the North Concourse was “completed” last year.

For the new runway, I believe that the most logical position will be to the east of the existing runways, there it would not have conflict with the other runways. The land to the west acquired from Panama´s National University, would be used to develop a commercial area.



But The Best Thing God Has Created Is A New Day
User currently offlineandrefranca From Brazil, joined May 2011, 605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 139, posted (1 year 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 6901 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 137):
Quoting CM767 (Reply 138):

Chicos, whenever I see it's a brazilian company taking care of the business I have that slight cold feeling going through my spine.


User currently offlinegreenmow From Russia, joined Jun 2007, 22 posts, RR: 0
Reply 140, posted (1 year 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 6722 times:

CM increasing frequencies to KIN, MBJ, PUJ and SXM starting mid December.

PTY-KIN 3 to 4 weekly

PTY-MBJ 3 to 5

PTY-PUJ 25 to 30 (to 32 in Feb, 14)

PTY-SXM 2 to 4.

http://airlineroute.net/2013/08/27/cm-carib-w13/