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Turkish Aviation September 2013  
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 13457 times:

Hello there everyone,
Welcome to another Turkish Aviation thread;


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mark Mahu



Forgive me if I start this thread a bit cloudy, I got off TK3 about 6 hours ago and still trying to stay awake... 
This was my first TK A330-300 trip, first TK 3 trip also.
Let me tell you, it is not the easiest to get up at 4:45am to catch this 7:25 leave IST-JFK flight.
Again this is my first Y experience on TK for a long time. I have been flying Comfort but this time, last minute ticket and some other budgetary issues, I had to fly Y on TK3 for work, hopefully for the last time.

TC-JNM "Samsun" had a full load today. It was a lot of firsts for me on this flight.
-I have never seen specialty meals delivered through the same door the pax were boarding, very unprofessional.
-FA asking the gate agents to check some luggage (gate check), they had no idea how to deal with it.
-I have never seen giant garbage bags piled up at the doors during the flight, no place to store it???
-I have never seen this many infants on a flight, never seen people changing diapers in the cabin???
-Never seen one of the chefs coming off from his rest in a t-shirt, carrying his uniform in his hand???
-An FA eating a piece of cheese with her hands 15 minutes before touch down and complaining that she is starving

Alll and all it was chaotic, the whole flight, constant shuttling of food, trays, bags, drinks back and forth...Slow, unattractive service. The whole plane looked like a war zone when we landed. Good luck to the cleaning crew to turn it around on time.

On the plus side, most of the front lavs were larger than what I'm used to, I even came across a handicapped lav in the Y section, very generously spaced.
Also thanks to the in flight entertainment, iphone and my noise cancelling headphones, I was happy.
The Y seats on the A333 is not comfortable for me for 10:40 hrs flight. I hope I never have to do that again.

Besides my personal blah blah, here is some questions from last month;
- From new member; Turkish777X (Welcome to a.net!!)
"In the last and days and weeks I was able to witness that the night departures to Shanghai and Peking were seriously delayed by more than 5-6 hours and waiting for the other south east asian arrivals to depart with the arriving metal. Is TK short of aircraft or what is the reason for such delays?

Does anybody have further information on the three ex-Gulfair A332? When are they arriving and is there any information on the final cabin layout?

In the past days more and more expanded bilateral rights were granted to turkey. However, there is still a huge difference compared to Emirates' rights. What are they doing better than the turkish officials? For instance, TK has desperately trying to gain further access to China and was not really that successful compared to Emirates."

-From OA260;
"Turkey’s competition board has decided to launch an investigation into Turkish Airlines, following a previous complaint filed by rival Pegasus."


Also last month I flew 4 TK, 2 Pegasus domestic flights, all on time, all full.. IST is becoming really crowded, SAW is not that far behind either. Also this is affecting the traffic to and fro from those airports, even the HAVAS busses are having a hard time keeping up.

Welcome, and please continue here with your views, news, photos, rumors, suggestions and good old sense of humor,
TK787

96 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineHB-IWC From Indonesia, joined Sep 2000, 4505 posts, RR: 72
Reply 1, posted (1 year 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 13316 times:

Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
In the last and days and weeks I was able to witness that the night departures to Shanghai and Peking were seriously delayed by more than 5-6 hours and waiting for the other south east asian arrivals to depart with the arriving metal. Is TK short of aircraft or what is the reason for such delays?

These delays with TK020 and TK026 have been happening quite often indeed. Again on Friday night (early Saturday morning), TK delayed the TK020 to PEK until 7 am, waiting for some inbound equipment to arrive from one of the overnight longhauls. TK020 and TK026 are of course the ideal targets for such a delay as they have 9 and 7 hours on the ground in PEK and PVG respectively anyway, so these delays can immediately be made up.

The TK B77W fleet is scheduled very tightly and any more or less extensive maintenance requirement will often result in operational issues with this subfleet.


User currently offlineSteelyman From Andorra, joined Feb 2007, 119 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (1 year 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 13159 times:

Recently flew QR and EK on J, and have been quite disappointed about their lounges after having experienced TK's one in IST.

Moreover, the J product on both EK and QR is not better than TK's one, when comparing 777/333 hard products of each airline.



BRGDS, Mike
User currently offlineMeCe From Turkey, joined Oct 2009, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 13129 times:

Hi 787 thanks again for a proper tread  

As you mention early morning widebody departures always chaotic, beauce as always there no sufficent ground time, staff and equipment. Most probably your plane was one of the early arrival which has not more than 2 hrs ground time. Cleaning maintenance loading off loading all made this short time with including a ground crew shift change. TK management should not squeze timetable so much. 777 fleet alsa suffers this, in event a minimal accident, mx issuse or something else whole timetable collapses.

Last month a member asked about leased 330's; as far as I heard from a friend they sitting on a hangar in US, waiting incoming inspections. Unfortunatelly work is going very very slow; we have a plenty of time to see them.


User currently offlineboun From Turkey, joined Nov 2012, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 13111 times:

I was just looking for travel options for the upcoming bayram, and I came across a tour package to Bangkok which includes Atlas Jet flights both ways. Sure they are charters but can they fly non-stop with their Airbuses? Or will they go for wide bodies again?
Here are the details of the flights for those interested:
KK301 SAW 23h BKK 12h00
KK302 BKK 22h SAW 03h00


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 5, posted (1 year 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 12899 times:

Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
This was my first TK A330-300 trip, first TK 3 trip also.
Let me tell you, it is not the easiest to get up at 4:45am to catch this 7:25 leave IST-JFK flight.

Welcome home.

Personally I actually love that flight. Minimal traffic to get to IST. The airport is not too crowded, breakfast in the lounge is good, and you arrive at JFK where customs is quiet also before the big afternoon rush. Also I can catch onward domestic US flights pretty easy.

Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
In the past days more and more expanded bilateral rights were granted to turkey. However, there is still a huge difference compared to Emirates' rights. What are they doing better than the turkish officials? For instance, TK has desperately trying to gain further access to China and was not really that successful compared to Emirates."

Turkey and China only few years ago got a new bilateral. TK can run 21-weekly flights, plus cargo. That is pretty good. TK is however trying to work out a deal with Air China to allow double daily PEK services.

Its not a matter of what Turkish or UAE government are going, but they have different advantages. For example to Europe, TK can run circles around what EK can do. EK cant add more service to Germany or France, while TK can come and go as it wants. Same in Africa and most MidEast counties. Even in Asia, Turkey just signed the new bilateral with Japan that will see service more than double. Also Turkey got a new bilateral with Russia which allow further increase in the massive market.

Quoting boun (Reply 4):
I was just looking for travel options for the upcoming bayram, and I came across a tour package to Bangkok which includes Atlas Jet flights both ways.

Are these via its Kyrgyzstan venture?
I heard they would also have service to Seoul, Beijing, Colombo and Phuket in the Far East eventually via Bishkek.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineNorthstar80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 12629 times:

How many daily flights do Emirates have to IST? What aircraft?

A couple of years ago, I remember an Emirates executive saying that EK would start A380 service to IST soon and also start a flight to AYT form Dubai.

Do you guys see EK upgrading IST to A380 anytime soon? Is IST A380 ready?

Is AYT a dream for EK?



You have to have your heart in the business and the business in your heart. -Thomas J Watson
User currently offlineumit From Turkey, joined May 2009, 130 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 12519 times:

I used PGS and Atlas for my short Dalaman trip last week and I have couple of notes for those trips
1) Whenever I use PGS to Dalaman , flight always made a right turn after the take off at SWA and landed thru land whereas when I take Anadolu or TK they always make a big tour over Istanbul (left turn) ,passes over Atatürk airport and lands over the see at Dalaman . Is it coincided or ??
2) Both Pegasus and Atlas cabin crew looked like they were just called from their house to help airlines out . I indeed salute for TK cabin crews after seeing PGS and Atlas crews .However, seat pitch is very good on Atlas and their 320 looked very new .


User currently offlineTK773 From Turkey, joined Apr 2013, 22 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 12471 times:

EK used to use 332/343 equipment, but these have been upgraded to 773 in the past couple of years. There are eleven weekly flights.

Personally, I cannot see EK upgrading to 388's yet. There needs to be more frequency before increasing capacity.

TK773


User currently offlinethaiflyer From Thailand, joined Oct 2007, 123 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 12358 times:

Quoting umit (Reply 7):
Do you guys see EK upgrading IST to A380 anytime soon? Is IST A380 ready?

I don't think that IST is A380 ready, not for aircraft wise (air bridge) and not for transit wise.


User currently offlineTK105 From Turkey, joined Mar 2013, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 12295 times:

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 6):
Is AYT a dream for EK?

Yes it is, for the time being!

Last time I visited AUH back in Feb13, I met with the Turkish Trade Attaché. He said that UAE proposed to lift all visa restrictions for Turkish Citizens in exchange for unlimited EK flight rights to any Turkish Airport. But Turkey refused this proposal.

Sometimes I wonder how cheap are these visa restrictions.  

If I'm not mistaken, EK used to fly 14 weekly with a daily 773 and 773/772/332 mixture, which is now reduced. On the other hand for the last 1-2 years, TK has increased frequency to double daily and upgauged the metal.


User currently offlineMeCe From Turkey, joined Oct 2009, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 12222 times:

Quoting thaiflyer (Reply 9):




There are two gates which can accomodate A380, but I am not sure about taxiways and runways.


User currently offlineankaraflyjet From Turkey, joined Mar 2007, 267 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 12076 times:

QR is adding one more weekly flight to its DOH ESB sector as of September 18th and making DOH ESB DOH 4 weekly overall.

User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 12033 times:

SHGM signs civil aviatiıon agreement with Cambodia, including 5th freedom from BKK and DAC to points in Cambodia. We might be seeing IST-DAC-PNH soon I guess.

Source (in Turkish): http://www.airporthaber.com/havacili...-154-ulkeyle-anlasma-imzaladi.html


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 11970 times:

Regarding the A380, DHMI said in 2011 or so they would make 7 airports capable of handling ADG VI (A380 & B748) category aircraft.
So whether IST is ready today or not I dont know, but the plan is certainly to be able to handle it.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 11829 times:

Quoting ankaraflyjet (Reply 12):
SHGM signs civil aviatiıon agreement with Cambodia, including 5th freedom from BKK and DAC to points in Cambodia. We might be seeing IST-DAC-PNH soon I guess.

Oooh ... I like that! DAC-PNH or DAC-SGN would be interesting links to have!  

In last years schedule, the TK used to sit about 9 hours in DAC ... and I hoped for a SGN route then. Looks like TK thought something along the lines - but for PNH. I know some people who travels this route (DAC-PNH) for business and currently go via BKK - they'd love this route if it happens!


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 3 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 11747 times:

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 1):
These delays with TK020 and TK026 have been happening quite often indeed. Again on Friday night (early Saturday morning), TK delayed the TK020 to PEK until 7 am, waiting for some inbound equipment to arrive from one of the overnight longhauls. TK020 and TK026 are of course the ideal targets for such a delay as they have 9 and 7 hours on the ground in PEK and PVG respectively anyway, so these delays can immediately be made up.

Today TK1985/6 flights were swapped from the regular leased 9W 777 to 2 737 Boeing aircrafts.
Is it simply possible to send two 737 instead of a 777 with respect to slot restrictions at LHR?

Moreover, TK is increasing its tringular IST - KGL - EBB route to six weekly.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (1 year 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 11521 times:

And TK sponsors another team. This time Aston Villa for the 2013/2014 season.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinePbb152 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 617 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 11517 times:

Does anyone have insight as to how the IAH flight is doing? It has been a few months since it started and is 6x weekly now. Any news on potentially going to a daily flight?

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 11494 times:

IAH Load factors -

Apr - 75.4
May - 88.3
Jun - 92.2
Jul - 91.3

It should be daily with the S14 schedule, but I've also heard rumors of switch to A340 however. 77Ws are needed more in the Far-East.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinePbb152 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 617 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (1 year 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 11483 times:

Wow, those loads are great. Not sure of the yield, but I would assume it is strong as well. Can't say as I would mind seeing another A340 at IAH. It has been a while since we have had a regular A340 flight. I love 777W's, but we have quite a few of those from our international carriers right now. The A340 would add a little flair to the IAH lineup. Bring it on TK.

[Edited 2013-09-05 20:05:36]

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 21, posted (1 year 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 11445 times:

Yields are pretty trashy. Much of the summer loads were filled with introductory fares trying to gain marketshare.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (1 year 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 11184 times:

I see that the TK used a 77W to take the Olympics committee to Argentina non stop. LED to EZE.
Any idea if it will stay there till the return? How can the very busy TK 77W fleet afford to take one frame off rotation?


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (1 year 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 10816 times:

A little story about Turkish Airlines "TK 1933" fragrance.

Creation of the scent was multi-year endeavour, with the finalist selections enduring a 15-month period of extensive research and testing involving customers.

The winning scent evoked feelings of trust, peace, happiness, serenity and pleasure amongst the test group.


Turkish Airlines new brand smell brings a sense of relaxation and happiness
http://www.airlinequality.com/news/tk1933.htm

=



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (1 year 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 10750 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 23):

Oh no!! I was going to reply "Can't wait to smell the roses.."
Then I read the article, "...created by the international perfume company, MG Gulcicek...."
Please say it isn't...rosewater.


User currently offlineTK105 From Turkey, joined Mar 2013, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (1 year 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10626 times:

DHMI Passanger Numbers for August 2013 has been published on its web site.

- IST keeps the pace with 15% growth
- ESB is increasing its performance with 17% growth (20% domestic)
- SAW is exploding with 21% growth (30% international, waww !)
- ADB, AYT and other major cities in Anatolia also keeps the pace

I think Pegasus' unique hub&spoke LCC strategy proves to be very successful as reflected to SAW numbers. After TK, I trust that now we have another emerging carrier on global scale.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 26, posted (1 year 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10616 times:

TK to start SAW-TLV, bringing up the number of TK flights between Istanbul and Telaviv to 46 weekly.
http://airlineroute.net/2013/09/09/tk-tlv-w13/

I think this is going to be more and more of the case until the new airport opens. No more room left for growth at IST, TK has to move more flights to SAW. Let's see how Pegasus deals with that.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 27, posted (1 year 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10747 times:

This is cool!
TK to open up stores at airports where you can shop with M&S miles;
http://kokpit.aero/ugur-cebeci-thy-magazasi-aciliyor (in Turkish)


User currently offlineTurkishSky From Turkey, joined Mar 2004, 243 posts, RR: 0
Reply 28, posted (1 year 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 10722 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 26):
TK flights between Istanbul and Telaviv to 46 weekly.

53 with the new SAW flights. Up to 8 daily between 2 cities...



Flown 4I 9U AA AB AF AZ BA BD BR CA CU CX EI FR HV JK JP JU KK KL KM LH LX MA ME MS NG OA OK QR OS RJ RO SA SK SQ SR SU
User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 29, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 10305 times:

I was looking at some US DOT reports and noticed the JFK-IST has become the largest US-Africa/Middle East airport pair in 2012.
Previously this title was held by JFK-TLV alternating with JFK-DXB in recent years.

For fun here is the breakdown and ranking of US-Turkey market.

Ranking - Airports - Passengers - Growth - Load factor
1. JFK-IST - 891,759 - +26.0% - 81.3%
7. LAX-IST - 392,450 - +78.1% - 85.1%
19. ORD-IST - 162,703 - +1.0% - 78.9%
21. IAD-IST - 152,925 - +34.8% - 80.0%
36. EWR-IST - 52,314 - new - 81.7%

=



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 30, posted (1 year 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 10284 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 29):
7. LAX-IST - 392,450 - +78.1% - 85.1%

The growth rate is probably not very meaningful as the flight frequency probably changed between the comparison periods. But even then, with just weekly flights ... LAX seems to be doing great for TK ... 7th place is VERY GOOD ... almost half of JFK volumes. Time for a second daily?  


User currently offlineTK105 From Turkey, joined Mar 2013, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 31, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 10220 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 29):
1. JFK-IST - 891,759 - +26.0% - 81.3%

I'm surprised as EK "now" has 2 daily A388 and 1 daily 77W (via MXP) to JFK. I'd have expected DXB-JFK to be on top of the list. Can you share us top 10 of the list?


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 32, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 10098 times:

It is still hard to believe DL and UA can't make this route work.

User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 33, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 10078 times:

Here were the Top-10 routes in 2012 between USA and Africa/Middle East.

Ranking - Airports - Passengers - Growth - Load factor
1. JFK-IST - 891,759 - +26.0% - 81.3%
2. JFK-DXB - 686,452 - +6.8% - 86.7%
3. JFK-TLV - 646,501 - (-0.8%) - 87.8%
4. ORD-AUH - 518,528 - +61.7% - 80.6%
6. LAX-DXB - 407,926 - (-14.5%) - 91.0%
7. LAX-IST - 392,450 - +78.1% - 85.1%
8. JFK-DOH - 359,197 - +11.4% - 82.9%
9. IAD-DOH - 355,389 - +11.0% - 82.0%
10.SFO-DXB - 351,836 - (-9.9%) - 80.4%

Quoting TK105 (Reply 31):
I'm surprised as EK "now" has 2 daily A388 and 1 daily 77W (via MXP) to JFK. I'd have expected DXB-JFK to be on top of the list.

Keep in mind, only nonstops would get counted. A JFK-MXP flight would get counted as a US-Italy flight.

Quoting ASA (Reply 30):
Time for a second daily?

Insallah



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineemrecan From Turkey, joined Feb 2000, 940 posts, RR: 7
Reply 34, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 10038 times:

IST in Africa/Middle East ?

User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5738 posts, RR: 4
Reply 35, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 10005 times:

Quoting emrecan (Reply 34):

According to CNN's 'Inside the Middle East' and 'Middle East Business Report' shows, yes, they recent showed Istanbul as the culinary capital of....the Middle East!


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 36, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 9995 times:

The US DOT classifies the world into 3 geographic areas. Atlantic, Latin and Pacific.

Then the Atlantic is further divided into smaller sections including Africa/Middle East where Turkey is categorized as.
I agree Turkey should today be counted in Europe, but many of these regional classifications go back to before I was born....

Anyhow, for fun, if Turkey was to be considered a Europe market by the DOT, JFK-IST would the 10th largest airport pair in 2012.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 37, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9887 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 33):

Here were the Top-10 routes in 2012 between USA and Africa/Middle East.

Ranking - Airports - Passengers - Growth - Load factor
1. JFK-IST - 891,759 - +26.0% - 81.3%
2. JFK-DXB - 686,452 - +6.8% - 86.7%
3. JFK-TLV - 646,501 - (-0.8%) - 87.8%
4. ORD-AUH - 518,528 - +61.7% - 80.6%
6. LAX-DXB - 407,926 - (-14.5%) - 91.0%
7. LAX-IST - 392,450 - +78.1% - 85.1%
8. JFK-DOH - 359,197 - +11.4% - 82.9%
9. IAD-DOH - 355,389 - +11.0% - 82.0%
10.SFO-DXB - 351,836 - (-9.9%) - 80.4%

Number 5 missing? or typo?  


User currently offlineOA260 From Ireland, joined Nov 2006, 27027 posts, RR: 58
Reply 38, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 9883 times:

Turkish Airlines privatization not on the agenda, authority says

Claims that the sale of 49 percent of Turkish Airlines shares would be finalized this month were not confirmed by the Privatization Authority in a written statement Sept.11.

“No such operation to privatize shares of the company has been initiated. Such claims should not be considered true, until the Privatization Authority announces it to be the case,” the statement said, contradicted a story on the issue published on website Mergermarket.com

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tur...pageID=238&nID=54277&NewsCatID=345

---

In an interview in the Greek Press head of Pegasus said they intend to build up the ATH route with more frequencies and also next year maybe add a few more destinations i.e.: Islands.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 39, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 9834 times:

Quoting OA260 (Reply 38):
Turkish Airlines privatization not on the agenda, authority says

The news that it might happen moved the stock price 10% in the morning, but ended the day 0.6% lower.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 40, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 9788 times:

Whoops...

5. EWR-TLV - 499,979 - (-1.5%) - 87.6%



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 41, posted (1 year 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 9681 times:

wow ... NYC-TLV is really a big market. Is TK getting a piece of this pie as well?

So ... the airline wise ranking is something like:

1. TK
2. EK
3. LY
4. EY
5. LY
6. EK
7. TK
8. QR
9. QR
10. EK

So (according to the Top 10 only) TK and EK are dominating USA's connections with Middle East and beyond ... with QR following a bit behind. LY is not providing much connections, I presume.

[Edited 2013-09-11 17:49:20]

User currently offlinetozbek From Turkey, joined Jul 2005, 121 posts, RR: 1
Reply 42, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 9479 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

By the way. Turkish Cargo starting to fly Istanbul Ataturk-Singapore Changi airport with Airbus A330-200F's:
http://kokpit.aero/turkish-cargo-singapura-ucacak


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 43, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 9421 times:

Quoting tozbek (Reply 42):

Great news.
What is the number of 332Fs up to now? 4 owned (1 more arriving next year) and 2 leased?


User currently offlineboun From Turkey, joined Nov 2012, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 44, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 9361 times:

Atlas Jet leases CS-TRI from Hifly for Hadj operations. Maybe we can see the aircraft on scheduled services or ETS charters before that.

User currently offlineNorthstar80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 45, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 9332 times:

Quoting boun (Reply 44):
CS-TRI

what is it??



You have to have your heart in the business and the business in your heart. -Thomas J Watson
User currently offlineboun From Turkey, joined Nov 2012, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 46, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 9292 times:

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 45):
what is it??

An A330-300


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 47, posted (1 year 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 9295 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 43):
Great news.
What is the number of 332Fs up to now? 4 owned (1 more arriving next year) and 2 leased?

They have 5 owned frames in their fleet. The latest one just arrived a few days ago. Moreover, they have two leased ones from MNG Cargo and MASKargo.
On top of that you have 3 A310s, all in all a fleet of 10 cargo planes.

Quite big in my opinion. There are constantly rumors that they will be buying some 777F too, but nothing official yet.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 48, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 9110 times:

TK plans to introduce a new menu on their international flights from next months on.
Some key facts: more options available will be available and passenger may create their own menus 24h prior to departure.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 49, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 8917 times:

TK have appointed a new global add agency. Miami based Crispin Porter + Bogusky replaces Turkish agency Alametifarika.


Also last week TK opened its premium arrivals lounge at IST. The lounge that will be open between 0500-1300 will permit inbound customers opportunity to refresh after their flight.
Besides shower and food facilities, the lounge will offer things like clothes ironing and business meeting area.
The lounge was designed by Turkish Do & Co and is of similar motif to the international premium departure lounge.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineNorthstar80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 50, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 8802 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 49):
replaces Turkish agency Alametifarika.

It was expected, Alametifarika took part in the Gezi demonstrations and THY is very pro-government. During the Gezi demonstrations, after Alametifarika was seen in Gezi, the corporate scene in Istanbul was talking about THY management getting angry at Alametifarika.



You have to have your heart in the business and the business in your heart. -Thomas J Watson
User currently offlineboun From Turkey, joined Nov 2012, 26 posts, RR: 0
Reply 51, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 8770 times:

According to airporhaber, TK has made a KAP announcement about opening 8 new routes.
2 in Russia, 1 in Italy, 4 in Algiers and 1 in Turkey. Link to follow: http://www.airporthaber.com/havacili...eri/thy-8-noktaya-daha-ucacak.html


User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5738 posts, RR: 4
Reply 52, posted (1 year 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 8758 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 47):
On top of that you have 3 A310s,

wasn't one phased out?


User currently offlineMeCe From Turkey, joined Oct 2009, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 53, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 8655 times:

Hi all,

Heard that wet leased Jet's 777 will be converted to dry lease soon. It means that we can see them every route -most probably on gru-eze.


User currently offlineNorthstar80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 54, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 8531 times:

Quoting MeCe (Reply 53):

Once again bringing in more inconsistency to the already chaotic fleet



You have to have your heart in the business and the business in your heart. -Thomas J Watson
User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 55, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 8431 times:

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 54):
Once again bringing in more inconsistency to the already chaotic fleet

Why further inconsistency? They already are in the fleet, but just with JET pilots flying the birds.
I think its a good move and will improve flexibility.


User currently offlineTK105 From Turkey, joined Mar 2013, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 56, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 8319 times:

Some short notes from my recent trip to GYD with J2 on A320:

- On week days, ESB-GYD flights are mostly sold out including J. It was the case for my flight as well, 100% full. J2 enjoys the lack of competition from TK.
- J2 and Azerbaycan in general is closely connected to Turkey. There are 4 daily flights to IST/SAW, 1 daily flight to BJV, 4 weekly flight to ESB and 2 weekly flight to AYT by J2.
- A320 has a nice J class section with modern 2x2 business seats similar to ones on TK new NB planes.
- There is no personal AVOD but GSM service is available at level flight.
- Celebi provides an excellent service at ESB. However check-in at GYD is terrible, quite similar to my experiences at TAS or ASB. Hopefully with the new terminal which is under construction, this will get better.
- It is sometimes difficult to understand each other with older persons in Turkish, however younger generations understand and speak very well Turkish (Istanbul Dialect). Comparing the early independence of country from USSR back in 1990s, improvement is remarkable. I think, by another 25 years language difference will be minimal.
- When landing, I was looking forward for F/A announcement "Baku Havalimanina dusuyoruz" ("We are falling to Baku Airport" as in Turkish Dialect), but this did not happen and she properly said "iniyoruz" ("landing"). So this turned out to be another nailed urban legend.  


Quoting emrecan (Reply 34):
IST in Africa/Middle East ?

I would have opposed this strongly 5 years back. But for now I don't know really!


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 57, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 8268 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 55):
Why further inconsistency? They already are in the fleet, but just with JET pilots flying the birds.
I think its a good move and will improve flexibility.

At the moment the aircraft are basically fenced off on specific routes.

If they are converted to dry-leases then they are subject to show up anywhere creating a customer mess as the aircraft have different configuration and service levels.

TK already has too many cabin versions and what you consider 'flexibility' can be a major headache for employees at the airport and customers onboard when equipment types show up other than what was listed in the reservation system.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5738 posts, RR: 4
Reply 58, posted (1 year 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 8215 times:

Air Serbia are moving ops to SAW reports airlineroute.

Quoting TK105 (Reply 56):

first pic on net of new livery A320.


User currently offlineNorthstar80 From United States of America, joined Nov 2009, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 59, posted (1 year 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 8072 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 55):
Why further inconsistency? They already are in the fleet, but just with JET pilots flying the birds.

Cabin wise, there is no CC on these, but there is FC. They used to fly specific routes, now as per MeCe's post, they will fly everywhere.



You have to have your heart in the business and the business in your heart. -Thomas J Watson
User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 60, posted (1 year 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 8037 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 57):
If they are converted to dry-leases then they are subject to show up anywhere creating a customer mess as the aircraft have different configuration and service levels.

This is true, however the JET birds have a better hard product for business and economy passengers than most of the TK birds (except their new 330s and 777s).

I wonder how their new 777s to be delivered next year will be configured.


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 61, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 7715 times:

Does anyone have any idea about the new TK uniform that was to be announced? My gut says that they came up with a much more acceptable uniform but this was rebuffed by the gov't somehow and that is why it is stalling. I hope I am wrong.

User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 62, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 7509 times:

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 61):

You are right, I was expecting by now. I have a feeling soon we will see the "more acceptable uniform" soon. There were news that they have decided on the look but still trying to find the right materials.
By the way, I just took two longish DL flights in the US and their uniforms looks great, even on women averaging 50-60 years old. By the way, amazed with how often the FA's went around with water service and picked up garbage. Very impressive.


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 63, posted (1 year 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7400 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 62):

You are right, although people complain about service in the US compared to Asian carriers, it still is true that the US is a service oriented country. And of course it is amazing how 60 year old FAs run up and down the aisle more enthusiastically than TK youngsters.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 64, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 7201 times:

I wonder whether TK would change the timing of its flights & banks to europe and asia once the new airport becomes available.

Atm, there are two very close banks to asia, namely around 8 pm and 00:30am. There is also a lot of downtime for their long haul flights, can these possibly be reduced by a couple of hours in the future?
Especially their flights to asia seem to be sitting on the ground very long.

Would appreciate any suggestions.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 65, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 7058 times:

Russia and Kyrgyzstan agree to new bilateral expanding services between them.
Why do I post this here? Its good news for Pegasus and its subsidiary as it will be allowed to utilize such traffic rights to expand its Bishkek base.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5738 posts, RR: 4
Reply 66, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 6994 times:

More flights between Pakistan and Turkey allowed, no details out yet, I think PM is in Ankara visiting..

User currently offlinetk1244 From Netherlands, joined May 2007, 330 posts, RR: 0
Reply 67, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 6969 times:

Quoting 777way (Reply 66):
More flights between Pakistan and Turkey allowed

Hope that it is more than only increase in frequency.



"The future is in the skies. For any nation that cannot defend its skies will never be confident of its future." Atatürk
User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 68, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 6880 times:

Quoting 777way (Reply 66):
More flights between Pakistan and Turkey allowed, no details out yet, I think PM is in Ankara visiting..

That's more than overdue. TK has been waiting for so long to go for at least double daily on their KHI & ISB services.
This would give quite some push to their operations out of the US and the UK.
Hope it materializes soon.


User currently offline777way From Pakistan, joined Dec 2005, 5738 posts, RR: 4
Reply 69, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 6861 times:

Quoting 777way (Reply 58):
Air Serbia are moving ops to SAW reports airlineroute.

Apparently temporary according to a blog site, due to not getting rights at IST, why? its the same airline rebranded or is the larger aircraft an issue?


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 70, posted (1 year 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 6836 times:

Probably slots. IST is very busy, and virtually no free daytime slots. Go ask LH, even they have been unable to change frequencies around.


From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineYakamoz From Switzerland, joined Nov 2012, 79 posts, RR: 0
Reply 71, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 6679 times:

Hello everyone

Two questions;

1) Does TK fly to Sebha (Libya) or is it still suspended?

2) Does anybody have details about number of destinations by region? I've put all in a list and count 238 destinations (included Sebha). TK announced last also 238 destinations but they write something about 41 domestic; I count 42 domestic destinations. Where is my mistake?

Region / Countries / Destionations

Domestic / 1 / 42
Europe / 41 / 94
Asia / 34 / 60
Africa / 24 / 34
North America / 2 / 6
South America / 2 / 2

Total / 104 / 238

Thanks. Best Regards.
Omer


User currently offlineleftyboarder From Turkey, joined Apr 2008, 693 posts, RR: 1
Reply 72, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 6637 times:

Quoting Yakamoz (Reply 71):

Check their quarterly presentations (e.g. the 6th page of http://www.turkishairlines.com/downl...esentations/sunum_haziran_2013.pdf shows the breakdown, or the 12th page of http://www.turkishairlines.com/downl...faaliyet_raporu_haziran_2013.pdf).

About 42 vs 41, maybe you are mixing up destinations with airports (SAW is in Istanbul so it is an airport flown to but not another destination)?


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 73, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 6575 times:

Quoting 777way (Reply 66):
More flights between Pakistan and Turkey allowed, no details out yet, I think PM is in Ankara visiting..

It is offical now, really good news for TK.

Up to 14 frequencies that can be divided among Karachi Islamabad and Lahore.
I hope TK simply goes daily on Karachi and Islamabad.

http://web.shgm.gov.tr/kurumsal.php?page=haberler&id=1&haber_id=3090


User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 74, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 6502 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 73):
Up to 14 frequencies that can be divided among Karachi Islamabad and Lahore.
I hope TK simply goes daily on Karachi and Islamabad.

Anyone knows how many frequencies are allowed between Bangladesh and Turkey bilaterals? Where can I find that out? I'm guessing, soon, there will be similar changes between Bangladesh and Turkey too. TK has been very successful with the loads in the DAC sector so far. Not much yield, i'm sure - so far, most of the business fliers are using EK and QR ... thanks to their 3x and 2x daily frequencies. But if TK increases to 2x daily ... and improved aircraft (no more of the Meridiana 332s please!) ... i'm sure they'll be able to get a bigger market share - especially to secondary European cities and North America.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 75, posted (1 year 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6442 times:

Quoting ASA (Reply 74):
thanks to their 3x and 2x daily frequencies. But if TK increases to 2x daily ... and improved aircraft (no more of the Meridiana 332s please!) ... i'm sure they'll be able to get a bigger market share - especially to secondary European cities and North America.

The bilateral of 2010 says up to 14 frequencies for carriers on each side. However, the increase in frequency to double daily is unrealistic in my opinion, since there are so many other much more higher yielding markets for TK (LAX, Seoul...) that are still just 1x daily.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 76, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 6191 times:

Pegasus chief commercial officer says the company is looking at adding flights to London Gatwick (currently operate at STN), plus additional destinations in Italy and France. Another 3-4 European cities could be added in 2014.

The European growth would come while the carrier awaits traffic rights in the Middle East and Africa. He says "focus for growth is on the Middle East, Africa and the CIS, it’s more difficult to obtain traffic rights in those regions than for Europe."

New traffic rights will allow carrier to utilize Moscow DME starting next month 3x weekly, while carrier is looking to increase frequencies to Tel Aviv and Dubai also.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...n-middle-eastern-route-delays.html

=



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlinebahadir From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1794 posts, RR: 10
Reply 77, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 6200 times:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 21):
Yields are pretty trashy. Much of the summer loads were filled with introductory fares trying to gain marketshare.

Therefore I think TK is dilluting the US market for themselves. I think you can see this route to go to A330-200 if the yields will support it.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 76):
The European growth would come while the carrier awaits traffic rights in the Middle East and Africa.

No matter how hard they try the playing field has a 80% angle against them. I feel for those people.


Well, looks like I will be flying Economy from LAX to IST next week. I cannot justify paying $500 extra for the Comfort Class. At 12 hours I am planning to take a long nice nap to Istanbul  

Those of you that are aware of, I will be hosting a booth at the first International Flight Training Exhibition in Istanbul on 27th and 28th. Those of you that are interested can visit the AcuWings booth.



Earthbound misfit I
User currently offlineASA From Bangladesh, joined Dec 2010, 734 posts, RR: 1
Reply 78, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 6166 times:

EK calls in at BOS ... starting 2 months before TK  

Emirates Announces Boston (by behramjee Sep 19 2013 in Civil Aviation)

Is this going to intensify competition - and drive yields to a pit?

Or can these two coexist at BOS with complementary routes?


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 79, posted (1 year 1 week 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 6112 times:

Quoting bahadir (Reply 77):
$500 extra for the Comfort

I just paid $330 at JFK last month. I guess they adjust it according to demand.
Bon Voyage.

Quoting ASA (Reply 78):
Is this going to intensify competition

Probably, but TK serves all these secondary markets and probably flying a smaller aircraft.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 80, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 5916 times:

Nihat Özdemir the of CEO Limak Holding said during a summit that they will start with construction works of the 3rd airport in Istanbul around May 2014 and envisage the opening for January 2019.

Wow, that is much later than many of us hoped, at least we have an official date now that seems quite realistic in my opinion.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 81, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 5770 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 80):
start with construction

Let's hope so. I will start the thread on May 2014 with this in mind.


User currently offlineTK105 From Turkey, joined Mar 2013, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 82, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 5735 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 80):
they will start with construction works of the 3rd airport in Istanbul around May 2014 and envisage the opening for January 2019.

Another 6 years to go ?!?

How will TK and IST sustain this magical growth ? If missed, some other player will capitalize this opportunity. We have to find ways to continue growth in IST. Probably just addition of military area for parking lots will not be enough: A parallel runway is necessary.


User currently offlinecuban8 From Kiribati, joined Sep 2009, 270 posts, RR: 0
Reply 83, posted (1 year 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 5663 times:

Quoting TK105 (Reply 82):
How will TK and IST sustain this magical growth ? If missed, some other player will capitalize this opportunity. We have to find ways to continue growth in IST. Probably just addition of military area for parking lots will not be enough: A parallel runway is necessary.

I'd love to see IST get a fourth runway and will be very sad when/if the authorities decide to shut down the airport in a decade or so. The approach over Istanbul for runway 23 remains one of my favorite approaches worldwide. I guess TK will expand its operation in SAW until 2019, or let us hope for an A380 order soon. 

I haven't followed Turkish aviation for a while. Any news on the A(KP) 330 for the government? As far as I know, the hangar is ready in Ankara. When is it expected to be delivered?


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 84, posted (1 year 1 week 15 hours ago) and read 5319 times:

Quoting cuban8 (Reply 83):
Any news on the A(KP) 330 for the government?

Still in the US being retrofitted, almost two years now.

By the way, I just wanted to share a personal story with DL (my home airline)
DL has been taking care of me for many many years.
Since I started flying to Istanbul on TK, I am having a harder time qualifying for medallion status with DL.
(If I did, I would be Platinum or even Diamond next year)

So I took a mileage run with DL last week to ANC.
I earned a total of 9259 miles flying from NYC to ANC at a cost of $373. That is like flying JFK-IST round trip for $404.
As usual the best part, out of the 4 legs, I got upgraded to Business Elite, twice. and was sitting at exit rows the other two.
Last leg, SEA-JFK on a 23 year old 767-300ER with brand new sleeper seats. 1-2-1 config up front with full flat bedding.
Great service, pretty good food, nice champagne.
Seriously I can't find many things to complain about Delta. Only problem was the 2.5 hour delay at SEA, since the plane left Beijing late. But we got apologies all the way to JFK.


User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 85, posted (1 year 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 5014 times:

Quoting TK105 (Reply 82):

Another 6 years to go ?!?

I do not believe that 6 years will be enough. From what i read i have the impression that there are some planning mistakes regarding the location (birds, mines, difficult topography). I doubt that the airport can be opened as planned.

Quoting TK105 (Reply 82):
How will TK and IST sustain this magical growth ?

TK is planning to increase the use of SAW to consolidate IST and SAW ops in the new airport as soon as it opens.

BTW: I checked the document for the new airport. They calculate with an average of 300pax/plane. They consider that smaller aircrafts are more frequently used than bigger aircraft (A380), but 300 pax still is too much. particularly with regard to the possible order of regional aircraft (e.g. Bombardier) for shuttle service to small/close destinations like SOF or SKG.


User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 86, posted (1 year 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 4875 times:

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 85):
They calculate with an average of 300pax/plane.

This is my post from April 13th, 2013;
Some crazy numbers....

I read part of the CED report ( Cevresel Etki Degerlendirme) on the 3rd. Istanbul report from airporthaber; http://www.airporthaber.com/havacili...alimani-ced-raporu-yayimlandi.html
and very detailed report and I will point out some interesting stuff;
-1. Phase will have 2 pax and 1 Cargo runways with the main terminal and even though it is expected to be finished in 42 months, it shows to be in operation in late 2017, more likely in 2018.
2.Phase will include the 4th runway and another terminal by 2024
3.Phase will include the 5th runway and another terminal by 2031
4.Phase will include the 6th runway and another terminal by 2038

-5 of the runways will be North South direction, 1 runway in the East West direction.
-1 runway to be 4100m. x 60m, 4 runways to be 3750m x 60m and the last one to be 3500m x 60m.

Here is some crazy math: when calculating landings per runway... they use an average of 300pax a plane (they average it from A380 (850pax??) and 737 (150pax), but they take into account more 737s than 380s. Still 300 pax/plane??

150million pax divided by 365 days= 410,000 pax daily
410,000 pax/day divided by 300pax/plane = 1370 planes/day
1370 planes/day divided by 24 hours = 57 landings/hour (not taking into account rush hour)
Planning on 3 simultaneous runway operations and that means 19planes/hour/per runway.
Which means, 3mile separation or 100second separation; one landing every 3.15minutes.

Some other numbers;
-The new airport will be built at 105m. elevation. Right now the land elevation is somewhere between 160m and -37m.
Which means 2,500,000,000m3 of land fill. How many truck loads/trips is that?
-During construction they are planning on having 2000 trucks, 500 cars, 600 medium trucks. That will add to the traffic nearby.
-When completed they are expecting 100,000 cars to travel to the new airport daily and they are expecting a total of 850,000kg of garbage daily.


My first question;
-How do you calculate 150M pax/annualy? The above math says 150M pax landing only, not take offs?
-If that is the case, they should have used an average number like, 190 pax/plane. (more realistic)
If they did, you end up with 90 landings/hour which means three planes landing every 2 minutes on 3 active runways operating simultaneously.
-And also, they just divide the number of flights by 24 hours, as if same amount of pax will travel between 1am-6am and 4pm-9pm. In reality, there will be departure banks and there will be very minimal traffic past midnight.

Still, they are building one of the largest airports in the world and I'm sure they know what they are doing.


User currently offlinecuban8 From Kiribati, joined Sep 2009, 270 posts, RR: 0
Reply 87, posted (1 year 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4212 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 86):
-5 of the runways will be North South direction, 1 runway in the East West direction.
-1 runway to be 4100m. x 60m, 4 runways to be 3750m x 60m and the last one to be 3500m x 60m.

North South direction makes a lot of sense since most of the winds over Istanbul come from the Black Sea or the Marmara. But why would they use a non standard 60m width for the runways instead of 45m? More margin doesn't hurt, but from a pilots point of view the "picture" for flare is very different when used to the standard 45m.


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25512 posts, RR: 50
Reply 88, posted (1 year 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4077 times:

Quoting cuban8 (Reply 87):
But why would they use a non standard 60m width for the runways instead of 45m?

60m is really the standard these days. Look at FRA, DXB, ZRH, SIN, HKG, MUC, NRT, JNB, JFK, etc..

45m is considered the minimum allowed under ICAO 4C guidance.

Also if you plan to employ VLA's (or other code-F aicraft) unless you have 60m runways, you need special procedures.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 89, posted (1 year 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4055 times:

Friends, Turkey has decided to award a huge military contract worth 3 bn dollards to China.
This could mean, as it was in the case with Japan after awarding them to build a nuclear power plant, more traffic rights to China.

Fingers crossed!


User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 90, posted (1 year 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 3980 times:

Quoting TK787 (Reply 86):
This is my post from April 13th, 2013;
Some crazy numbers....

Thanks for reposting. Some numbers seem to be mistakes...

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 89):
Friends, Turkey has decided to award a huge military contract worth 3 bn dollards to China.
This could mean, as it was in the case with Japan after awarding them to build a nuclear power plant, more traffic rights to China.

Would be nice!! Besides PEK, PVG and CAN,
AF has Wuhan in its network, KL has Chengdu, Hangzhou and Xiamen.

After the bilateral with Pakistan has signed, TK has decided to add Lahore. I am curious how the total weekly allowance of 14 flights will be spread along the three destinations KHI, ISB and LHE.


User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 91, posted (1 year 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 3979 times:

Ah and LH in addition has Nanjing, Qingdao and Shengyang.
Let's see what will come for TK if it realizes.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 92, posted (1 year 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 3905 times:

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 90):
After the bilateral with Pakistan has signed, TK has decided to add Lahore. I am curious how the total weekly allowance of 14 flights will be spread along the three destinations KHI, ISB and LHE.

I hope they only stick to Islamabad and Karachi. Daily service to these two would be better in order to attract more passengers than having 7 weekly Karachi 4 weekly ISB and 3 weekly Lahore. Somehow I expect TK to add another 3-4 weekly destination, which really puzzles me about the economics of such destinations.


User currently offlineTurkish350XWB From Switzerland, joined Jan 2009, 493 posts, RR: 0
Reply 93, posted (1 year 21 hours ago) and read 3706 times:

Quoting Turkish777X (Reply 92):
I hope they only stick to Islamabad and Karachi.

They won't. They will launch LHE according to aircraft availability.


User currently offlinemercure1 From French Polynesia, joined Jul 2008, 1545 posts, RR: 2
Reply 94, posted (1 year 11 hours ago) and read 3518 times:

Story in French media that TK service to Luxembourg which commenced in June is seeing great success.

Already flights have load factor of excess 80%, so TK will increase from 4x to daily next spring. According to story, TK expected to carry 28,000 annual passengers to LUX, but already in 3 months they carry almost 10,000 which drive demand to increase frequency quickly.

Story also say that due strong demand in Benelux markets, TK will maintain BRU frequency at 4x daily during even winter period.


User currently offlineTurkish777X From Germany, joined Aug 2013, 196 posts, RR: 0
Reply 95, posted (12 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3209 times:

Quoting mercure1 (Reply 94):
Already flights have load factor of excess 80%, so TK will increase from 4x to daily next spring. According to story, TK expected to carry 28,000 annual passengers to LUX, but already in 3 months they carry almost 10,000 which drive demand to increase frequency quickly.

Awesome news!!!

I really wonder what TK thinks about their JET 777s. One again needed to turn back right after take off, I hope it was not again due to technical issues.

It was en route from Istanbul to Mumbai.

[Edited 2013-09-30 10:51:45]

User currently offlineTK787 From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 4441 posts, RR: 12
Reply 96, posted (12 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3092 times:

Please continue here:
Turkish Aviation October 2013 (by TK787 Sep 30 2013 in Civil Aviation)


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