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787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 20  
User currently offlinejetblueguy22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 2844 posts, RR: 4
Posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 53465 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

Hi All,

The previous thread became long so Part 20 is being created. Part 19 can be found here 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 19 (by iowaman Aug 23 2013 in Civil Aviation)

Regards,
Pat


All of the opinions stated above are mine and do not represent Airliners.net or my employer unless otherwise stated.
265 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5854 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 53384 times:

Quoting 7673mech:
I asked about the 4-4 at the end of the year and it was explained to me that the three -9's went exclusively down the surge line - so there would be less airplanes for PAE to deliver until early next year. Obviously this would be supplemented by planes from the EMC and possibly Charleston will actually delivery some.

So the 4s would be exclusive of EMC aircraft as well as Charleston aircraft. Well... right now, from the EMC, we have two CZ birds that should be flying anytime (LN43 and LN36), and one JAL bird (LN20) that is also about ready. After that, guess who... Air India! LN32 is ready, LN30 is just about ready, and LN28, LN26, and LN25 will be the next three birds ready after that. So it's probably out of Boeing's control how many EMC birds will actually be delivered this year.

[Edited 2013-09-07 12:14:05]

User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 53314 times:

As always, thank you to All Things 787 (NYC777) and others for the information that is summarized here. For more specific information on the aircraft in production, I recommend going to http://nyc787.blogspot.com/

DELIVERED TO DATE: 84 Aircraft to 14 Airlines

DELIVERIES PRIOR TO SEPTEMBER
NH-22; JL-11; AI-8; QR-8; UA–7; ET-5; LO-5; BY-4; LA-3; BA-2; CZ-3; DY-2; HU-2; AM-1

SEPTEMBER DELIVERIES TO DATE
L/N 114 – G-ZBJC - 9/3/2013 - BA #3

AIRCRAFT THAT HAVE COMPLETED MAJOR ASSEMBLY & CHANGE INCORPORATION*
L/N 91 - VT-ANO – 9/xx/2013 - AI #9
L/N 109 - A7-BCF – 9/xx/2013 - QR #9
L/N 113 - CC-BBD - 9/xx/2013 - LA #5
L/N 100 - B-2736 – 9/xx/2013 – CZ #4
L/N 85 - B–2730 - 9/xx/2013 - HU #3
L/N 104 - B-2737 – x/xx/2013 – CZ #5
L/N 81 - B-2723 – x/xx/2013 - HU #4
L/N 43 - B-2727 – x/xx/2013 - CZ #6
L/N 107 - JA821A - 9/xx/2013 - NH #23 Awaiting first flight
L/N 118 - CC-BBE - 9/xx/2013 - LA #4 Awaiting first flight
L/N 121 – G-ZBJD – 9/xx/2013 - BA #4 Awaiting first flight
L/N 122 – N964AM - 9/xx/2013 - AM #2 (ILFC) Awaiting first flight
L/N 123 – VH-VKA – 9/xx/2013 – JQ #1 Awaiting first flight
L/N 127 – N965AM - 9/xx/2013 - AM #3 (ILFC) Awaiting first flight
L/N 124 - N27908 - 9/xx/2013 - UA #8 Awaiting first flight
L/N 128 – V8-DLA - x/xx/2013 – BI #1 Awaiting first flight
L/N 125 – JA833J - 9/xx/2013 - JL #12 Awaiting first flight
L/N 130 – V8-DLB - x/xx/2013 – BI #2 Awaiting first flight
L/N 32 - VT-ANG – x/xx/2013 - AI #10 Awaiting first flight
L/N 30 - VT-ANE – x/xx/2013 - AI #11 Awaiting first flight
L/N 36 - B-2726 – x/xx/2013 – CZ #7 Awaiting first flight
L/N 79 - B-27?? – x/xx/2014 - HU #5 Awaiting first flight (Storage)
L/N 119 - B-2738 – x/xx/2014 – CZ #8 Awaiting first flight

*Not including the delivered aircraft and test aircraft (ZA001-006 & ZB001)


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 3, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 53167 times:

The tail fin of Norwegian EI-LNB (LN112) has been painted at Dublin Airport.


EI-LNB Boeing 787-8Q8 Norwegian Long Haul by elevationair ✈, on Flickr

The man on the fin is Thor Heyerdahl, here's a close-up:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/38016434@N05/9626431056/

LN112 was delivered without any paint art on the tail fin.


Norwegian EI-LNB Boeing 787 by moonm, on Flickr



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offline7673mech From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 746 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 52514 times:
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Quoting seabosdca (Reply 1):
So the 4s would be exclusive of EMC aircraft

That's not what I said.
They won't be exclusive - 4 a month + EMC + CHS (if anything is ready).


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 5, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 52215 times:

Quoting 7673mech (Reply 4):

I think you might have misinterpreted what he said.

After looking I can see why Novemeber and December might be low. There really aren't that many that will be done at that point. 2-3 for Charleston or EMC per month would be a great rate.

tortugamon


User currently offlineAM777LR From Mexico, joined Sep 2013, 206 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 51862 times:

Quoting Tradewinds (Thread starter):

Noticed it as I drove by KOA today. I couldn't get close enough to catch the reg # but it was the Boeing white body/blue tail with "787" on it. Parked way down at the end of airport with all the private jets. Just curious if anyone knew what it was doing there. (Did a search of the forum but came up with nothing.)

This is in another forum, seen here: Boeing 787 In KOA? (by Tradewinds Sep 7 2013 in Civil Aviation) and I was wondering if anybody saw this plane leave BFI or arrive in KOA. Could Boeing be doing more testing on the 788? Or rather the engines? Just thought I'd ask.

EDIT: Already answered in this thread: Boeing 787 In KOA? (by Tradewinds Sep 7 2013 in Civil Aviation)

[Edited 2013-09-08 00:32:04]

User currently offlinevirginblue4 From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2008, 916 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 51356 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 3):

Any reason why it wasn't painted before delivery?



The amazing tale of flight.
User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2608 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 50561 times:

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 7):
Any reason why it wasn't painted before delivery?

Im not sure if its actually painted on, it might just be a decal.



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 50231 times:

Paint or decal, I believe virginblue4's question is why EI-LNB received the art in Dublin while EI-LNA received it before delivery in Everett. I don't know.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 49842 times:

ANA JA821A scheduled for a B1 flight today.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...4/history/20130908/1600Z/KPAE/KMWH



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 48642 times:

ZA243 (LN 91, VT-ANO) is at the Charleston Delivery Center. It looks like this one may deliver tomorrow. I hope.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 48274 times:

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 8):
Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 7):
Any reason why it wasn't painted before delivery?

Im not sure if its actually painted on, it might just be a decal.

Paint or decal, putting it on the vertical stab and rudder after production requires a rebalance...it seems it would be better to do this at the factory, as the rudder only needs to be balanced once  



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3871 posts, RR: 27
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 47696 times:
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Quoting KELPkid (Reply 12):
Paint or decal, putting it on the vertical stab and rudder after production requires a rebalance...it seems it would be better to do this at the factory, as the rudder only needs to be balanced once

if an equal sized decal is placed on each side, there is no need.. do the faces on both sides face forward? if so no difference.. if one faces aft, possibly a difference.


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 47425 times:

Quoting kanban (Reply 13):
if an equal sized decal is placed on each side, there is no need.. do the faces on both sides face forward? if so no difference.. if one faces aft, possibly a difference.

The rudder is perhaps the most sensitive control surface as far as balancing goes. The rule of thumb is that anything that changes the weight of a control surface (paint included) requires a mechanic to rebalance the affected surface. This is why vertical stabs and rudders are often seen painted before anything else is on new production aircraft.



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 47358 times:

ZA540 on tap for a B-1 today:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE540



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3871 posts, RR: 27
Reply 16, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 46947 times:
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Quoting KELPkid (Reply 14):
The rudder is perhaps the most sensitive control surface as far as balancing goes.

Not as sensitive as urban myth says..


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 46940 times:

Quoting kanban (Reply 16):
Not as sensitive as urban myth says..

So what, you're like a WWII fighter pilot and affix a wad of chewing gum to the rudder before a flight as a good luck charm? 



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 46742 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 15):
ZA540 on tap for a B-1 today:

Looks like the B-1 was not to be.



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5854 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 46650 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 11):
ZA243 (LN 91, VT-ANO) is at the Charleston Delivery Center

So no delivery today... I hope this one doesn't turn into another VT-ANN.


User currently offlineCX747 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 4467 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 46633 times:

Any idea on when BA will receive its 4th 787? I'm scheduled to fly on their newest fleet and wonder what registration will carry me on my journey.


"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 21, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 46238 times:

Air India LN28 (VT-ANC) was moved from the paint hangar to the EMC tonight. Change incorporation should almost be finished.

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/377307516448681984

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BTx3L9_CIAAtUTE.jpg:large



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 22, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 46142 times:

ZB002 is in paint and was moved to the 40-26 building.

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/377295100591607809

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BTxr5RYCEAAHzZj.jpg:large



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 23, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 45449 times:

ZA385 on a customer flight I believe:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE385



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 24, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 45206 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 23):
ZA385 on a customer flight I believe:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE385


Must have cancelled for today -- only shows the flight on the 7th (which was discussed in the previous thread).


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 25, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 45498 times:

Our beloved ArkeFly will get three 787s, first delivery in May 2014.

http://www.luchtvaartnieuws.nl/nl-NL...Dreamliners_is_genoeg_voor_ArkeFly



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineDeltaB717 From Australia, joined Jun 2012, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 26, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 45079 times:
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I think in the previous thread it was suggested the JQ #1 might have its first flight on 10 September... is there any firm word on whether that's the case (or has already happened)?

User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 27, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 45031 times:

It hasn't flown yet. It's a bit quiet in Everett.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 28, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 45020 times:

Meanwhile Hainan Airlines LN131 emerged from the final assembly line.


DSC_9691 by moonm, on Flickr


DSC_9564 by moonm, on Flickr

[Edited 2013-09-11 01:43:14]

[Edited 2013-09-11 01:52:34]


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 29, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 45030 times:

Does this picture look like the 4 787-8s? I thought there was at least one 787-9 on each FAL at this point.
http://paineairport.com/kpae6677.htm

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 30, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 44982 times:

Yes, but that picture dates from September 9 while ZB002 was moved to the 40-26 building on September 10 (after the roll out of HU LN131).

[Edited 2013-09-11 01:53:07]


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 31, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 44963 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 28):

Meanwhile Hainan Airlines LN131 emerged

Oh great. At least this one has engines. Something tells me it will be a couple months before we see this one make any serious moves.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 30):
Yes, but that picture dates from September 9 while ZB002 was moved to the 40-26 building on September 10

You must be right. The engines lines up with that thinking as well. Thanks.

tortugamon

[Edited 2013-09-11 02:00:27]

User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 32, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 44964 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 31):
At least this one has engines.

Oddly enough, the rudder is not fully painted like the previous HU birds. Here's LN79 for example:


ZA432 / LN79 for Hainan Airlines Boeing 787 by moonm, on Flickr



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 33, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 44823 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 21):
Air India LN28 (VT-ANC) was moved from the paint hangar to the EMC tonight.

Alright, an update on the EMC, based on nyc777's table.

Inside
> Transaero Airlines LN11: Bay D
> Japan Airlines LN20: Bay C (repainted in the new JAL livery)
> Air India LN25: Bay A
> Air India LN26: Bay B
> Air India LN30: Bay AW (seen with engines)

Outside
> Transaero Airlines:LN14: Position E3
> Transaero Airlines LN22: Position E8
> Air India LN28: Position E4 (repainted)

LN28 is now probably waiting for a bay to become available for the last touches (as we have seen with LN20 and LN21). I think LN20 should roll out soon and LN30 will move to the paint hangar later this month.

There is a nice picture of LN30 in Bay AW here but beware: a part of the registration "ANC" is painted on the front landing gear which suggests it's VT-ANC (LN28), but it's LN30. For some reason, both LN30 (VT-ANE) and LN28 (VT-ANC) were painted with "ANC" markings on the front landing gear.

[Edited 2013-09-11 04:12:02]


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinefrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1715 posts, RR: 1
Reply 34, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 44771 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 25):
Our beloved ArkeFly will get three 787s, first delivery in May 2014.

  Quicker than I thought, it feels they only just took over some of Thomsonfly's 763s... Good news though, I might even consider flying with Arkefly now. Hope they deploy them on the KTM route... Not very likely, I realise  



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlinefrigatebird From Netherlands, joined Jun 2008, 1715 posts, RR: 1
Reply 35, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 44719 times:

Trent-1000 package C engines for the 787-9 now certified by EASA: http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...roves-trent-1000-for-787-9-390415/
Hopefully, the 787-9 will start test runs soon...



146,318/19/20/21,AB6,332,343,345,388,722,732/3/4/5/G/8,9,742,74E,744,752,762,763,772,77E,773,77W,AT4/7,ATP,CRK,E90,F50/7
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 36, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 44698 times:

One would think the FAA would certify them first.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 37, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 44675 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 24):
Must have cancelled for today -- only shows the flight on the 7th (which was discussed in the previous thread).

Next try:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...5/history/20130911/1230Z/KCHS/KCHS



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 38, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 44583 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 37):
Next try:

ZA385 is in the air.

ZA539 (LAN) is also scheduled for a test flight:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...9/history/20130911/1315Z/KCHS/KMYR



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 39, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 44379 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 38):
ZA385 is in the air.


And back on the ground--that didn't last long.


User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 40, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 44210 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 39):
And back on the ground--that didn't last long.

Weird profile; especially altitude. Pressurization problem?



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently offlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3871 posts, RR: 27
Reply 41, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 43976 times:
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Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 32):
Oddly enough, the rudder is not fully painted like the previous HU birds. Here's LN79 for example:

I think this proves or at least points to the 787 rudder balance issues are not as complex as previous models and the painting of just the buried surfaces simplifies the work done in the paint hanger by reducing the amount of masking r.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 42, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 43853 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 40):
Weird profile; especially altitude. Pressurization problem?

It was supposed to be an hour flight.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 43, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 43776 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 42):
It was supposed to be an hour flight.

Still a weird profile with a lot of flight time at or below 10,000 feet.



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 44, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 43697 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 43):
Still a weird profile with a lot of flight time at or below 10,000 feet.

  
Might have just popped up to FL400 to check something from the previous flight and back down again but pressurization issues are a possibility. We'll have to wait for the next flight to get a better idea about whether these have been B or C flights.


User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 45, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 43309 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 44):
We'll have to wait for the next flight to get a better idea about whether these have been B or C flights.

Allthings787 has it listed as "Ready For Delivery" with 5 test flights, but I believe that includes two ferry flights to/from FTW for paint. Maybe today's flight was the final B flight that proved the plane ready for C flight(s).



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 46, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 43205 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 45):
Maybe today's flight was the final B flight that proved the plane ready for C flight(s).

We'll know in the next couple of days. My money says it's still got a flight (or two ) to go.


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 47, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 43064 times:

Looks like BAB ZA540 (118) is giving it another try at a B-1 this afternoon:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE540

And ANA ZA114 (107) is filed for an EWA flight:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE514


User currently offlinehkcanadaexpat From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2012, 657 posts, RR: 3
Reply 48, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 42475 times:

What do we make of this flight that happened yesterday?
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE543
Is it a typo in the flight number (ie should have been BOE453, G-ZBJD first flight for BA) or a typo in aircraft type?
A


User currently offlineclickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9668 posts, RR: 68
Reply 49, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 42509 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

It was G-ZBJD: http://www.flickr.com/photos/royalscottking/9726789521/

Here are:

JA821J: http://www.flickr.com/photos/royalscottking/9726768161/

and

CC-BBD: http://www.flickr.com/photos/royalscottking/9730047648/

Three 787's in 30 minutes   


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 50, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 42251 times:

The second one is JA821A instead of JA821J; A = ANA, J = JAL.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 51, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 42266 times:

ZB002 was moved to the surge line again for test equipment installation.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BT8GjfVCAAAwpJo.jpg:large

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/378028100648308736



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 52, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 42195 times:

The last day of summer is 10 days away and Boeing has consistently mentioned that ZB001 would fly 'later in the summer'.

Aviation week has an article about upcoming 787-9 testing. Nothing earth shattering but a couple of points:

>Boeing is closing in on the first flight of the stretched 787-9 by starting the first series of ‘gauntlet’ ground tests that simulate the operation of major systems.
>Boeing is expected to move into a final gauntlet test sequence later this week
>...the final gauntlet tests will be split into two primary blocks. In the 787-8 program, this began with simulation of a typical ‘B1’ first flight profile, the standard checkout of all aircraft systems as part of normal production testing.
>The second block was a more rigorous “first flight” final gauntlet which covered an expanded profile of tests and failure scenarios.
http://www.aviationweek.com/Article....p0-615500.xml#.UjGRmMwTRkE.twitter

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 51):
ZB002 was moved to the surge line

The move back to 40-24 seemed quicker than with ZB001. Not a lot of room on 40-26 or maybe they are getting a little a efficient.

It appears that ZB002 will be close to reaching the flightline when ZB001 has its first flight. Probably first flight in the first half of October.

Do we know if ZB021 has had the first 787-9 engines from GE installed?

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 53, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 42182 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 50):
JA821J

Speaking of the devil, LN20 finished change incorporation and was moved to the fuel dock.

http://paineairport.com/kpae6684.htm



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5854 posts, RR: 6
Reply 54, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 41718 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 53):
LN20 finished change incorporation and was moved to the fuel dock.

They better get that "20" off the nose!


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 55, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 41558 times:

Check out my latest blog update for news on the 787-9


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 56, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 41518 times:

Quoting clickhappy (Reply 49):
Three 787's in 30 minutes

But 3 months from roll out to first flight...  


User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2608 posts, RR: 2
Reply 57, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 41490 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 55):
Check out my latest blog update for news on the 787-9

14th of September for first flight. Of all the days... Guess im gonna miss it (assuming there will be a live webcast).



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 58, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 41324 times:

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 57):
14th of September for first flight. Of all the days... Guess im gonna miss it (assuming there will be a live webcast).

It is tentative so it may be pushed back to as late as mid next week.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4795 posts, RR: 3
Reply 59, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 41225 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 58):
Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 57):
14th of September for first flight. Of all the days... Guess im gonna miss it (assuming there will be a live webcast).

It is tentative so it may be pushed back to as late as mid next week.

Has there been any taxi tests of the bird yet?

Anything from Matt on the Gauntlet tests



Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 60, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 41136 times:

Quoting casinterest (Reply 59):
Anything from Matt on the Gauntlet tests

Gauntlet testing started this morning



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2608 posts, RR: 2
Reply 61, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 41123 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 58):
It is tentative so it may be pushed back to as late as mid next week.

Your right, especially since they haven't done taxi tests yet.



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 62, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 41006 times:

Let's see when ZB001 will receive its registration number.

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/378220541636653056

Quote:
ZB001 needs a registration number on the airplane before a taxi test happens



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 63, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 40796 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 60):
Gauntlet testing started this morning

It's currently simulating a flight over Idaho.

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/378237808252428290

Quote:
ZB001 is on a simulated flight, over Idaho at 1920z. Having some data link drop outs with the telemetry room



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 64, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 40571 times:

Royal Brunei will start 787 operation from December and the article also reveals the cabin configuration: 18 business class seats (2-2-2) and 236 economy class seats (3-3-3), for a total of 254 seats.

http://airlineroute.net/2013/09/12/bi-787-dec13/



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinegemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5828 posts, RR: 6
Reply 65, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 40102 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 62):

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/378220541636653056

Quote:
ZB001 needs a registration number on the airplane before a taxi test happens

That seems odd. Is this an FAA requirement? Is not the case here.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineDeltaB717 From Australia, joined Jun 2012, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 66, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 40038 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 62):
Let's see when ZB001 will receive its registration number.

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/...53056

Was it not already given N789EX?


User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2608 posts, RR: 2
Reply 67, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 40014 times:

Quoting DeltaB717 (Reply 66):
Was it not already given N789EX?

Yes, but its not on the aircraft at the moment.



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlineDeltaB717 From Australia, joined Jun 2012, 588 posts, RR: 1
Reply 68, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 40001 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Ahhhh OK, now I'm with ya!

User currently offlinedynamicsguy From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 887 posts, RR: 9
Reply 69, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 39629 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 58):
It is tentative so it may be pushed back to as late as mid next week.

Isn't the runway closed this weekend? My information suggests that the 14th wasn't the date anyway.


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 70, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 39625 times:

Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 69):

Reuters is saying mid to late next week.

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 71, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 38771 times:

17 September it is.

http://twitter.com/BoeingAirplanes/status/378634671824719872



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offline817Dreamliiner From Montserrat, joined Jul 2008, 2608 posts, RR: 2
Reply 72, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 38661 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 71):
17 September it is.

Guess I wont miss it after all   along with the Cseries on Monday



Reality be Rent. Synapse, break! Vanishment, This World!
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 73, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 38191 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 71):
17 September it is.

http://twitter.com/BoeingAirplanes/s...19872

And only a.nutters and airlines will take note. Unfortunately, John Q. Public will not take much notice of the first flight of a derivative type...   

And as Airbus themselves said, the -9 is the sweet spot of the 787 family. I'm suprised that with the number of orders for the -900's, Boeing isn't already producing them to meet demand (well, other than the three test articles). I'm guessing that certifying a derivative model won't be nearly as intensive as certifying the original type... but there is only one 787-9 in the firing order up to LN 180 that isn't a flight test article (and it's going to NZ, the launch customer).



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 74, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 38151 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 73):

The ANA 787-9 will be a production aircraft with a full interior. It will be used for testing but it isn't like ZB001,ZB002.

tortugamon


User currently offlineual747-600 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 595 posts, RR: 0
Reply 75, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 37732 times:

Another flight out of CHS

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE433. C-2?

UAL747-600


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 76, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 37606 times:

Quoting ual747-600 (Reply 75):
Another flight out of CHS

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE433. C-2?

My guess is it's a C-1



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 77, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 37361 times:

I found a recent picture of ZA001 and ZA002 in Palmdale.


DSC02804 by fourcher1, on Flickr

[Edited 2013-09-14 12:48:42]


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 78, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 37129 times:

The 1st 787 for QANTAS (Jetstar) is scheduled for a B-1 later this afternoon:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE215



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 79, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 36988 times:

ZA215 just did a couple of high speed taxi tests then went back to the ramp due to low ceilings. Maybe tomorrow will have better weather.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 80, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 36878 times:

Now it looks like ZA215 is going to try to make it out for a B-1. Also ZA445 for RBA did taxi tests but no B-1. I guess that will be done tomorrow.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 81, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 36825 times:

ZA215 is in the air. I think we can look forward to ZA445 (for Royal Brunei) to fly tomorrow.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineclickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9668 posts, RR: 68
Reply 82, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 36580 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

VH-VKA (ZA215) returning from its first flight

http://www.flickr.com/photos/royalscottking/9753876243/


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5015 posts, RR: 4
Reply 83, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 36360 times:

Quoting clickhappy (Reply 82):

Here she is returning to home base after her test flight

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7293/9753876243_af7faefb1a_b.jpg
Credit royalscottking on Flickr http://www.flickr.com/photos/royalsc...9753876243/sizes/l/in/photostream/

White engine cowlings scream mainline here I come 


EK8413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5015 posts, RR: 4
Reply 84, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 36193 times:

Another shot from Australian Business Traveller:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/wezza/Screenshot2013-09-15at33350PM_zps47a127c4.png

http://www.ausbt.com.au/jetstar-s-bo...pper&utm_campaign=home-flipper

EK8413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinehkcanadaexpat From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2012, 657 posts, RR: 3
Reply 85, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 36132 times:

A discussion with 7Boeing7 in a different thread had me looking back at the production stats of the 787.
So a bit of weekend statistical reading below on the 35 787s delivered thus far in 2013:

1) Number of Flights (excludes JA-818A, SP-LRC, B-2722 & VT-ANN which were used in various regulatory testing and/or trade shows)
> Minimum: 2 flights (G-TUIB)
> Maximum: 9 flights (G-TUIC)
> Average: 5 flights
> Median: 5 flights
> Trend (ie Median of last 10 delivered frames): 5 flights (trend is FLAT)

2) Number of Days between 1st Flight to Delivery Flight (excludes VT-ANJ, JA-818A, SP-LRC, VT-ANM, B-2722, VT-ANN & B-2728 which were impacted by 787 grounding and/or customer specific issues)
> Minimum: 14 days (EL-LNA & SP-LRE)
> Maximum: 39 days (B-2725)
> Average: 22.5 days
> Median: 21.5 days
> Trend (ie Median of last 10 delivered frames): 21.5 days (trend is FLAT)

3) Number of Days between Entering FAL to Delivery Flight (includes only PAE and frames entering FAL in 2013, ie 15 frames in total)
> Minimum: 104 days (G-ZBJB)
> Maximum: 183 days (G-TUID)
> Average: 146 days
> Median: 155 days
> Trend (ie Median of last 5 delivered frames): 158 days (trend is FLAT)

4) Days of the Month for Delivery Flights (60% of all deliveries occurred in the last week of the month)
> 1-5: 4 frames
> 6-10: 1 frame
> 11-15: 4 frames
> 16-20: 5 frames
> 21-25: 7 frames
> 26-31: 14 frames

I guess the major surprise to me was that the trend is FLAT for all metrics. One would have thought that as the program matures, it would need less test flights and frames would be delivered in quicker time frames. The counter argument to that is Boeing has been playing catch up since the grounding has been lifted so the stats probably don't yet reflect a more normalized timetable to deliveries.

Cheers
A


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 86, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 35888 times:

Quoting EK413 (Reply 84):
Another shot from Australian Business Traveller:

That picture is from Bernie Leighton http://www.flickr.com/photos/bernieleighton/9754297993/



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 87, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 35820 times:

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 85):

Nice work A.

tortugamon


User currently offlineual747-600 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 595 posts, RR: 0
Reply 88, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 35428 times:

Another ZA243 flight today out of KCHS.. I thought this plane was seen at the delivery center already. What flight would this be?

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE243

UAL747-600


User currently offlinehkcanadaexpat From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2012, 657 posts, RR: 3
Reply 89, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 35424 times:

Quoting ual747-600 (Reply 88):
What flight would this be?

Flight test #10 by my count!
A


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 90, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 35299 times:

Quoting ual747-600 (Reply 88):

Another ZA243 flight today out of KCHS.. I thought this plane was seen at the delivery center already. What flight would this be?

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE243

Flight lasted less than 10 minutes according to flightaware. either something is wrong or the aircraft passed whatever test it went up for within a few minutes of taking off.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 91, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 35292 times:

So a couple more flights popped up today:

ZA453 which is for BA looks like they'll be flying a B-2 flight:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE453

and ZA445 the first for Royal Brunei Air will be doing its B-1 after conducting taxi tests yesterday.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE445

I also expect that ZB001 should be doing taxi tests tomorrow in anticipation of its first flight on Tuesday.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 92, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 35288 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 90):
Flight lasted less than 10 minutes according to flightaware. either something is wrong or the aircraft passed whatever test it went up for within a few minutes of taking off.


Can't trust FA on this one, they have it climbing thru FL310 when its supposed to have landed. Probably another C flight looking for something at altitude as on the previous flights. Must have taken a really long time to fix.


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 93, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 35084 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 91):
ZA453 which is for BA looks like they'll be flying a B-2 flight:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE453


Finishing up the B-1 profile from the incomplete flight on the 11th (BOE543).


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 94, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 33851 times:

ANA ZA514 (107) filed for a C-1:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE514


User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 95, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 33760 times:

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 85):
A discussion with 7Boeing7 in a different thread had me looking back at the production stats of the 787.
So a bit of weekend statistical reading below on the 35 787s delivered thus far in 2013:


Awesome analysis and discussion! Agreed that one would expect improving, not flat trends. Especially as frames are supposedly leaving the FAL with fewer open items.

I wonder if the issues contributing to your points #1 and #2 are supplier quality/reliability related? Boeing could be well up the learning curve assembling the frames with very sound build quality only to experience issues with unreliable sub-assemblies and parts that don't show up until flight testing.

Thanks for the hard work....I hope we're paying you enough  



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 96, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 33462 times:

RBA ZA445 (128) filed for its B-1 about noon:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE445


User currently offlineJHwk From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 97, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 32928 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 95):
I wonder if...

My guess is the end-of-month factor weighs more heavily than some of the other expected deltas. I would have expected the median time from FAL to delivery to have improved though; that worries me a little.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 98, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 32940 times:

Looks like ZB001 was doing some taxi tests today.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 99, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 32816 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 98):

Looks like ZB001 was doing some taxi tests today.

I figured. Was hoping to get some pictures but we may have to wait to see what Matt posts.

tortugamon


User currently offlinedan23 From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 100, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 32633 times:

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 67):

ZB001 now with plastered on registration:

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3746/9779093461_7c84f56c20_c.jpg
DSC_0109-resize by moonm, on Flickr


User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 101, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 32429 times:

As always, thank you to All Things 787 (NYC777) and others for the information that is summarized here. For more specific information on the aircraft in production, I recommend going to http://nyc787.blogspot.com/

DELIVERED TO DATE: 84 Aircraft to 14 Airlines

DELIVERIES PRIOR TO SEPTEMBER
NH-22; JL-11; AI-8; QR-8; UA–7; ET-5; LO-5; BY-4; LA-3; BA-2; CZ-3; DY-2; HU-2; AM-1

SEPTEMBER DELIVERIES TO DATE
L/N 114 – G-ZBJC - 9/3/2013 - BA #3

AIRCRAFT THAT HAVE COMPLETED MAJOR ASSEMBLY & CHANGE INCORPORATION*
L/N 91 - VT-ANO – 9/xx/2013 - AI #9
L/N 109 - A7-BCF – 9/xx/2013 - QR #9
L/N 113 - CC-BBD - 9/xx/2013 - LA #4
L/N 107 - JA821A - 9/xx/2013 - NH #23
L/N 121 – G-ZBJD – 9/xx/2013 - BA #4
L/N 118 - CC-BBE - 9/xx/2013 - LA #5
L/N 123 – VH-VKA – 9/xx/2013 – JQ #1
L/N 100 - B-2736 – 9/xx/2013 – CZ #4
L/N 81 - B-2723 – 9/xx/2013 - HU #3
L/N 128 – V8-DLA - x/xx/2013 – BI #1
L/N 104 - B-2737 – x/xx/2013 – CZ #5
L/N 85 - B–2730 - x/xx/2013 - HU #4
L/N 43 - B-2727 – x/xx/2013 - CZ #6
L/N 122 – N964AM - 9/xx/2013 - AM #2 (ILFC) Awaiting first flight
L/N 127 – N965AM - 9/xx/2013 - AM #3 (ILFC) Awaiting first flight
L/N 124 - N27908 - 9/xx/2013 - UA #8 Awaiting first flight
L/N 125 – JA833J - 9/xx/2013 - JL #12 Awaiting first flight
L/N 130 – V8-DLB - x/xx/2013 – BI #2 Awaiting first flight
L/N 20 – JA821J – 10/xx/2013 - JL #13 Awaiting first flight
L/N 32 - VT-ANG – x/xx/2013 - AI #10 Awaiting first flight
L/N 30 - VT-ANE – x/xx/2013 - AI #11 Awaiting first flight
L/N 36 - B-2726 – x/xx/2013 – CZ #7 Awaiting first flight
L/N 79 - B-27?? – x/xx/2014 - HU #5 Awaiting first flight (Storage)
L/N 119 - B-2738 – x/xx/2014 – CZ #8 Awaiting first flight
L/N 131 - B-27?? – x/xx/2014 - HU #6 Awaiting first flight

*Not including the delivered aircraft and test aircraft (ZA001-006 & ZB001)


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 102, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 32193 times:

Quoting dan23 (Reply 100):
ZB001 now with plastered on registration:

First taxi test is done.


787-9 Taxi Test by The Boeing Company, on Flickr



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 103, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 32158 times:

Royal Brunei LN128 on a taxi test.


Royal Brunai V8-DLA Boeing 787 by moonm, on Flickr

More pictures are available at http://www.flickr.com/photos/moonm



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 104, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 32049 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 102):
First taxi test is done.

Another view:


Boeing 787-9 by Images In Light, on Flickr

And a video:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/-jplphoto/9779559671/



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinerotating14 From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 731 posts, RR: 0
Reply 105, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 31974 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 104):

By the looks of this gem, the -10 is gonna look immaculate. Seems as though the double bogie MLG might be a tad small for the -10 unless is strengthened.


User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5854 posts, RR: 6
Reply 106, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 31512 times:

Quoting rotating14 (Reply 105):
Seems as though the double bogie MLG might be a tad small for the -10 unless is strengthened.

The -9 and -10 have exactly the same max gross weights.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 107, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 31395 times:

ZB001 now up on Flightaware:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE1

[Edited 2013-09-17 08:00:49]


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 108, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 31355 times:

If today's flight actually takes place it will come exactly 3 years and 9 months (or exactly 196 weeks) of ZA001's first flight (1st 787-8) on December 15, 2009.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 109, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 31352 times:

And it looks like it will be a rainy day too  


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineStitch From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 31431 posts, RR: 85
Reply 110, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 31331 times:
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Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 109):
And it looks like it will be a rainy day too.   

Overcast at the moment. Forecast is for partly cloudy skies with occasional showers. Looks to be better than what ZA001 encountered during her first flight.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 111, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 31125 times:

Weather looks to be improving. Ceilings are certainly well above the minimums and looks to be real good visibility too.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 112, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 31075 times:

Boeing 540 is going on another test flight after ZB001 leaves. It's listed as BOE 450 on flightaware:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE450



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 113, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 31000 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 112):
Boeing 540 is going on another test flight after ZB001 leaves. It's listed as BOE 450 on flightaware:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE450


EWA flight.


User currently offlinerj777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1886 posts, RR: 2
Reply 114, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 30944 times:

OK. Live stream is still on that Blue Screen.

User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 115, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 30962 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 113):
Quoting NYC777 (Reply 112):Boeing 540 is going on another test flight after ZB001 leaves. It's listed as BOE 450 on flightaware: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE450 EWA flight.

It's now corrected:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE540



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 116, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 30844 times:

Take off now expected at 10:30AM.


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 117, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 30614 times:

Meanwhile ZA540 is in the air too.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...0/history/20130917/1708Z/KPAE/KMWH



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently onlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2776 posts, RR: 2
Reply 118, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 30605 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 117):
Meanwhile ZA540 is in the air too.

Seems to be following ZB001, currently. Any reason for this? Just the same flight profile or something?



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User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 119, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 30572 times:

It looks like both are following the normal test flight path to MWH indeed.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8862 posts, RR: 5
Reply 120, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 30535 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 119):
It looks like both are following the normal test flight path to MWH indeed.

CC-BBD flying alongside ZB001! Now that made my day!


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 121, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 30339 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 119):
It looks like both are following the normal test flight path to MWH indeed.

The normal flight path to MWH doesn't go over Glasgow, Montana.


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 122, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 29933 times:

Jon Ostrower posted this on his facebook:

"Boeing hasn't disclosed production plans for the Dash Nine. A person familiar with its planning says the Dash Nine quickly will dominate production, accounting for a quarter of the 200th to 300th Dreamliners the company builds, half of the next 50 planes and 70% of the 50 planes after that. Mr. Fancher declined to comment on the pace of the Dash Nine's introduction."

As LN146-LN180 only contain 2-787-9s it appears this will change pretty dramatically from there. I have a hard time seeing much more than a handful being delivered in the 2014 but it should really pick up in 2015 and the mix should swap to a majority 787-9 in 2016. LN350-400 at 70% 787-9s sounds like a big number. Might be expecting further conversions.

tortugamon


User currently offlinehkcanadaexpat From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2012, 657 posts, RR: 3
Reply 123, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 29561 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 122):
As LN146-LN180 only contain 2-787-9s it appears this will change pretty dramatically from there. I have a hard time seeing much more than a handful being delivered in the 2014 but it should really pick up in 2015 and the mix should swap to a majority 787-9 in 2016. LN350-400 at 70% 787-9s sounds like a big number. Might be expecting further conversions.

If you look at number of planes, rather than percentages, it looks about right.
It means that by LN400, the split will be 310 x 788 + 90 x 789 (incl. the 5 pre-LN200).
So for the 788, total orders of 498 minus 310 = 188 backlog after LN400
And for the 789, total orders of 388 minus 90 = 298 backlog after LN400
That means something like a 60/40 9-to-8 ratio of production post LN400 (without accounting for more orders, conversions or specific delivery schedules)
Cheers
A


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8862 posts, RR: 5
Reply 124, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 29584 times:

CC-BBD preforming a test flight right after ZB001 inaugural flight:

LAN CC-BBD Boeing 787-8 by moonm, on Flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/moonm/9791304026/


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 125, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 28929 times:

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 123):
nd for the 789, total orders of 388 minus 90 = 298 backlog after LN400
That means something like a 60/40 9-to-8 ratio of production post LN400

Correct assessment. However, I don't see them planning on going from 70% 787-9s in 2015 (LN350-400) to a lower percentage in 2016 (60%). Why plan on ramping up to that high of a ratio if they don't think they will need to going forward? I imagine they think they are going to want to produce 787s at a 7:3 ratio for 2016-2018 (throw in a handful of 787-10s in this last year) but I am sure that will change/update as they get closer.

The 787-8 really does not have much competition now, or planned in the future. The 787-9 is clearly a different story. The quicker they can whittle down that backlog the quicker they will get new orders, possibly at the expense of competition, in my opinion.

tortugamon


User currently offlinehkcanadaexpat From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2012, 657 posts, RR: 3
Reply 126, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 11 hours ago) and read 28849 times:

My projections show 10-13 789 deliveries in 2014 and another 37-42 789s in 2015 so we won't see a meaningful number in commercial service until 2016 unfortunately despite it becoming a growing percentage of production. 2016 should be the first year where 789s out deliver 788s.
A


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 127, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 28648 times:

BAB ZA453 (121) filed for a quick up and down B-3 this morning:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE453


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 128, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 4 hours ago) and read 28217 times:

18 days into the month and still only one delivery (which "really" happened the month before?). I thought this was supposed to be a record breaking month for deliveries  


Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 129, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 28114 times:

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 126):

10 787-9s in 2014 seems optimistic to me but we will see. I believe the test frames aren't due for delivery until 2015 and there are only 2 pre-LN180 in the lineup thus far. Hope you are right.

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 128):

Only one 787 had flown by September 1 and none had in 6-months. It was wrong to think of it as a big month. But it is salvageable.

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 130, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 2 hours ago) and read 27901 times:

The Jetstar 787 is on a second flight test:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...5/history/20130918/2300Z/KPAE/KPAE



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 131, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week ago) and read 27728 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 128):
18 days into the month and still only one delivery (which "really" happened the month before?). I thought this was supposed to be a record breaking month for deliveries

Flight testing in September seemed to get off to a slow start after a flurry of deliveries at the end of August. The activity has picked up this week and there's still time to make for a meaningful delivery count. See Reply 85 above by hkcanadaexpat that shows how most deliveries come toward the end of the month. Plus, there should be an incentive to finalize deliveries with the end of the 3rd quarter coming up. However, if a customer isn't ready or wants to do more testing then we may see some slide into next month.



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User currently offlinedan23 From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 141 posts, RR: 0
Reply 132, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week ago) and read 27647 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 130):

Looks like a B-2?


User currently offlineseabosdca From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 5854 posts, RR: 6
Reply 133, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week ago) and read 27702 times:

Four aircraft at Charleston have already made customer flights. Unfortunately three of them are for the customers who are known to be unpredictable about taking delivery.

User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 134, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 27500 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 128):

Well it looks like 6 are ready for delivery plus another 4-6 in active flight testing so the potential is there. 4 of the 6 that are ready are in Charleston, I am beginning to wonder if Charleston has a hard time closing the deal and getting them out the door... I know they have had the problem airlines as well. Also, maybe they have pulled some resources off the flight line to concentrate on getting the 789 off the ground, literally.


User currently offlinedynamicsguy From Australia, joined Jul 2008, 887 posts, RR: 9
Reply 135, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 27072 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 128):
18 days into the month and still only one delivery (which "really" happened the month before?). I thought this was supposed to be a record breaking month for deliveries

Deliveries are heavily weighted towards the end of the month (for all types, not just the 787) so deliveries at this point in the month aren't indicative of anything.

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 129):
10 787-9s in 2014 seems optimistic to me but we will see. I believe the test frames aren't due for delivery until 2015 and there are only 2 pre-LN180 in the lineup thus far.

LN 180 should start final assembly in January or February (based on LN 158 being the first at 10/month and therefore starting this year), so that leaves plenty of time for another ten 787-9s to be built and delivered through the year.


User currently offlineEK413 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5015 posts, RR: 4
Reply 136, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 26995 times:

The VH-VKA Jetstar made it's 2nd flight yesterday.

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2824/9810522163_ed41ccf632_o.jpg
Jetstar VH-VKA Boeing 787-8 by moonm, on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3794/9810524933_dc154bcd27_o.jpg
Jetstar VH-VKA Boeing 787-8 by moonm, on Flickr

EK8413



Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 137, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 26567 times:

Quoting dynamicsguy (Reply 135):
LN 180 should start final assembly in January or February (based on LN 158 being the first at 10/month and therefore starting this year), so that leaves plenty of time for another ten 787-9s to be built and delivered through the year.

Sure there is time but they will need to be loaded into the production plan at a more regular pace. They are clearly running at less than 10% 787-9s in November-January so that will have to fundamentally change. It certainly is possible.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 136):

That paint job does show some spots; it looks like you can see through it in the lower aft and see some of the ribs of the aircraft.

GECAS has firmed their order for 10 787-10. Coupled with Air Lease's order 33 787s firmed yesterday should get the order book to 983 (I think). The very impressive 1,000 mark is in site.

tortugamon


User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 138, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 26351 times:

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 133):
Four aircraft at Charleston have already made customer flights. Unfortunately three of them are for the customers who are known to be unpredictable about taking delivery.


I'm not sure any of these airplanes are done flying yet. One I think you're counting GUN ZA385 (100) flew a short flight today which maybe another "B" flight prior to customer flights or a cleanup "C" flight.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 139, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 26192 times:

Boeing not wasting any time in getting ZB001 back in the air:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE1

When ZA001 first flew it was almost two weeks between the 1st and 2nd flights.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently onlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2776 posts, RR: 2
Reply 140, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 26021 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 139):

Boeing not wasting any time in getting ZB001 back in the air:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE1

When ZA001 first flew it was almost two weeks between the 1st and 2nd flights.

ZB001 is taxiing out right now:

http://www.wasar.org/webcams/



[Edited 2013-09-19 12:08:23]


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User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 141, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 25910 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 127):
BAB ZA453 (121) filed for a quick up and down B-3 this morning:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE453


And again today for a B-4 (?), looks like a lot of 787's have an issue with something at altitude that for multiple airplanes there have been multiple flights up to FL390 then back down again.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE453


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 142, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 25856 times:

ZB001 appears to be heading to Montana before landing at MWH. 1h 36 minutes "planned" but there will undoubtedly be another flight from MWH to BFI. Looks like they are holding steady at 15kft and over 300kts. Exciting to see it up in the air again. ZB002 can't be more than two weeks behind her.

tortugamon


User currently offlinestarrion From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1131 posts, RR: 2
Reply 143, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 25706 times:

Do we want to do a separate thread for 789 flight testing?

I notice that a CZ jet has been at the Delivery Center for the last couple of days. Should we expect to see a departure soon?



Knowledge Replaces Fear
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 144, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 25686 times:

Quoting starrion (Reply 143):
I notice that a CZ jet has been at the Delivery Center for the last couple of days.

In CHS I assume? That must be LN100, it should deliver this month.

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 128):
18 days into the month and still only one delivery (which "really" happened the month before?). I thought this was supposed to be a record breaking month for deliveries  

Expect a rush at the end of the month.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 145, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 25645 times:

Quoting starrion (Reply 143):
I notice that a CZ jet has been at the Delivery Center for the last couple of days. Should we expect to see a departure soon?


It flew another flight today so it's not done yet -- the delivery center must be the only parking spot left down there.


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 146, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 25597 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 142):
1h 36 minutes "planned"

Clearly that is out the window. They don't seem to have any immediately plans to land at MWH. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually land back at BFI after another 4+ hour flight. Staying steady at 15kft and speed has bounced around a little.

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 147, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 25594 times:

Indeed. We have seen this before: Flightaware showed a flight duration of less than 2 hours on September 16 while ZB001 was in the air for over 4 hours.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 148, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 25423 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 146):
Clearly that is out the window. They don't seem to have any immediately plans to land at MWH. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually land back at BFI after another 4+ hour flight. Staying steady at 15kft and speed has bounced around a little
Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 147):
Indeed. We have seen this before: Flightaware showed a flight duration of less than 2 hours on September 16 while ZB001 was in the air for over 4 hours.


Guys, this is experimental flight test, you take a "wag" at how long you think it might take and very seldom does it work out that way. You just work through your test plan one point at a time, some times the "air" you're in isn't suitable, sometimes the data you get isn't any good and the point has to be redone -- that's life.

On another note it looks GUN ZA381 (36) is out on a B-1:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE381


User currently onlineKPDX From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2776 posts, RR: 2
Reply 149, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days ago) and read 25293 times:

ZB001 has just landed. That is another 5+ hour flight in the books.  

Got another webcam capture.




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User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 150, posted (1 year 3 months 6 days ago) and read 25255 times:

Great news.

tortugamon


User currently onlinetravelhound From Australia, joined May 2008, 1015 posts, RR: 12
Reply 151, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 24683 times:

I have just reviewed the production schedule on All Things 787 and have noted that for announced production the Everett lines have each been allocated 14 planes and Charleston 10 planes.

On my numbers and using a production rate of 7 aircraft a month the Everett lines are producing aircraft at 2.58 aircraft a month. I thought the original line was producing above this rate before the surge line started producing.

If this is correct it just goes to show how much out of kilter Boeing were with their original rate of 10 aircraft on one line.


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 152, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 24552 times:

Quoting travelhound (Reply 151):
I have just reviewed the production schedule on All Things 787 and have noted that for announced production the Everett lines have each been allocated 14 planes and Charleston 10 planes.

On my numbers and using a production rate of 7 aircraft a month the Everett lines are producing aircraft at 2.58 aircraft a month. I thought the original line was producing above this rate before the surge line started producing.

If this is correct it just goes to show how much out of kilter Boeing were with their original rate of 10 aircraft on one line.

They never said that they were going to produce 10/month on one line. They have 3 lines to support 10/month and that is the plan. They slowed things down because of the 787-9 test aircraft assembly and should be going back to 5.5/month soon.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3871 posts, RR: 27
Reply 153, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 24412 times:
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Why do people think that aircraft production and delivery is as simple as a fully automated automobile line that loads directly to a transporter for dealer delivery? And then express negative posts when reality is different without reading the background posts?

User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 154, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 24347 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 152):
They have 3 lines to support 10/month and that is the plan.

Despite speculation to the contrary, isn't the plan to have the Surge Line wind down at some point so that 2 lines are producing at least 10/month (maybe more)?

Speaking of wonky production plans. This reminded me of how very early on, well before N. Charleston and the Surge Line, Boeing said that they would be able to essentially "snap" together completed sub-assemblies and to integrate systems into a complete airframe in 3 days. If you think the flight line has been crowded lately.... 



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User currently offlineJHwk From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 247 posts, RR: 0
Reply 155, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 24301 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 154):
Boeing said that they would be able to essentially "snap" together completed sub-assemblies and to integrate systems into a complete airframe in 3 days.

...which equates to 10/month on a single line!

Nothing says this was expected to happen by now, but they do have a pretty long way to go.


User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 156, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 24265 times:

Quoting JHwk (Reply 155):
...which equates to 10/month on a single line!

sort of, only if weekends are included. I believe conventional wisdom is that a production month is about 20-23 days depending on the month and that does not include holidays.



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5803 posts, RR: 47
Reply 157, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 24257 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 154):
Despite speculation to the contrary, isn't the plan to have the Surge Line wind down at some point so that 2 lines are producing at least 10/month (maybe more)?

Yes the surge line is to wind down probably a year from now. CHS will take up the slack.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 158, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 24228 times:

LAN ZA540 (118) filed for a C-1:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE540

AMX ZA562 (122) filed for a B-1:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE562

GUN ZA385 (100) filed for a C-1 finally:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE385

[Edited 2013-09-20 09:58:36]

User currently offlineHamlet69 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 2754 posts, RR: 58
Reply 159, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 24188 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 158):
AMX ZA562 (122) filed for a B-1:

On the runway right now, just performed an RTO.

Hamlet69



Honor the warriors, not the war.
User currently offlineHamlet69 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 2754 posts, RR: 58
Reply 160, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 24183 times:

BTW - N787FT took off right before ZA562 took the runway. Anyone know why she was at PAE?

Hamlet69



Honor the warriors, not the war.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 13204 posts, RR: 36
Reply 161, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 24193 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 154):
Despite speculation to the contrary, isn't the plan to have the Surge Line wind down at some point so that 2 lines are producing at least 10/month (maybe more)?

If the 777 line can produce 8 aircraft per month, so can the 787. Eventually. The surge line was in the first place created to assist a smooth ramp-up of 787-9, Boeing could assembly the larger jet without the risk of delaying the -8 production.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 162, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 24151 times:

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 160):
N787FT

It is trying to get the GENx PIP 2 certified I believe. The Trent 1000 package C has been certified by Europe at this point and I assume the FAA isn't far behind as ZA004 has not flown in a while but ZA005 has flown a bunch.

tortugamon


User currently offlinePW100 From Netherlands, joined Jan 2002, 2591 posts, RR: 13
Reply 163, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 23981 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 154):
Why
Quoting kanban (Reply 153):
Why do people think that aircraft production and delivery is as simple as a fully automated automobile line that loads directly to a transporter for dealer delivery? And then express negative posts when reality is different without reading the background posts?

Perhaps because that was exactly what Boeing was telling the world from 787 launch right until the program went into FUBAR. When making big claims, the Original mud tends to stick for quote soms time.

PW100



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User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 164, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 23750 times:

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 159):
On the runway right now, just performed an RTO.

Hamlet69

Planned or unplanned?   Just wondering if that is a part of the testing...



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 165, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 23728 times:

BAB ZA453 (121) about to land on a B-4 (?) flight:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...3/history/20130920/1915Z/KPAE/KPAE

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 164):
Planned or unplanned? Just wondering if that is a part of the testing...


The RTO check is performed at the end of the flight in most cases. Before a B-1 flight a run down the runway up to about 70-80kts (below RTO speed) is preformed to check engines at full thrust for the first time since the test stand at the manufacturers and airspeed indications functioning normally.


User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3728 posts, RR: 3
Reply 166, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 23661 times:

Quoting WarpSpeed (Reply 154):
Boeing said that they would be able to essentially "snap" together completed sub-assemblies and to integrate systems into a complete airframe in 3 days.

That is not what they said. They said they planned to produce one plane every 3 days.


User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6428 posts, RR: 3
Reply 167, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 23615 times:

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 165):

The RTO check is performed at the end of the flight in most cases. Before a B-1 flight a run down the runway up to about 70-80kts (below RTO speed) is preformed to check engines at full thrust for the first time since the test stand at the manufacturers and airspeed indications functioning normally.

How close to V1 is it performed? I'm assuming you don't do it at V1, as that would be rather rough on the plane, and you'd probably be towing it off the runway after a wheel change (because the fuse plugs would probably melt!).



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently onlinetravelhound From Australia, joined May 2008, 1015 posts, RR: 12
Reply 168, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 23593 times:

Quoting kanban (Reply 153):
Why do people think that aircraft production and delivery is as simple as a fully automated automobile line that loads directly to a transporter for dealer delivery? And then express negative posts when reality is different without reading the background posts?

I didn't intend to write the post to be negative. I was just stating an observation and was looking for clarification.

If (and the whole premise of the question is based around this) the original line was producing 787's at a rate higher than the 2.58 units being produced today than why have Boeing reduced the rate on this line.


User currently offlineWarpSpeed From United States of America, joined Feb 2010, 595 posts, RR: 3
Reply 169, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 23343 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 166):
That is not what they said. They said they planned to produce one plane every 3 days.

At a media briefing in June 2007, right before the infamous 7/8/07 roll-out, Mike Bair, 787 GM and VP for Boeing, touted how the new way of building the 787 would enable Boeing to complete final assembly of a 787 in as few as six days by the 100th plane, with the ultimate goal of three days in final assembly.



DaHjaj jaj QaQ Daghajjaj !!!!
User currently online7BOEING7 From United States of America, joined Oct 2012, 1764 posts, RR: 16
Reply 170, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days ago) and read 23159 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 167):
How close to V1 is it performed? I'm assuming you don't do it at V1, as that would be rather rough on the plane, and you'd probably be towing it off the runway after a wheel change (because the fuse plugs would probably melt!).


Production RTO checks are about 90kts ground speed, so well below V1 and at a fairly light weight -- it's still fairly rough on the airplane but not so bad on the tires. It's done at the end of the flight just so that there are no delays due to a popped tire (not very often) or a brake energy issue on the subsequent takeoff if you really do have to abort.


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 171, posted (1 year 3 months 5 days ago) and read 23148 times:

Looks like ZB001 flew for another 3:43 minutes today. I think that adds up to 14h 27m so far. Getting up three times in four days has to be a good sign as well.

Does anyone have any guess as to how many flight hours it will take for certification? I figure a new program is about 2,500h. Maybe a clean derivative would be about 1,000-1,250 hours? Tough to say for sure I know but I don't think Boeing has revealed a plan. 1000 hours would be 166/month (6 months) would be 55/hours/aircraft(3)/month. It will obviously take a while for all three to be flying and for the fourth (ANA 787-9) to join them and I imagine ZB001 and ZB002 will get the biggest workout.

tortugamon


User currently offlineHamlet69 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 2754 posts, RR: 58
Reply 172, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 23044 times:

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 164):
Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 159):
On the runway right now, just performed an RTO.

Hamlet69

Planned or unplanned? Just wondering if that is a part of the testing...

I apologize for not being more clear. I was on my phone, doing a bit of spotting before work. This was not 'real' RTO, as 7BOEING7 has quite nicely explained. Just a run up to full power, then stop. It was actually interesting to watch (hadn't seen one in a while). ZA562 actually performed 2 of these back-to-back, sat on the taxiway for about 5 minutes or so, did one more, then went back to the ramp. No B-1 (unless it got off later).

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 162):
It is trying to get the GENx PIP 2 certified I believe.

Sorry, I should have been more specific. I know she's doing PIP certification, but was curious if anyone knew what she was doing at PAE this morning. AFAIK, almost all the certification flying has been done down in California and environs, not up here. . .

Regards,

Hamlet69



Honor the warriors, not the war.
User currently offlinestarrion From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1131 posts, RR: 2
Reply 173, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 23022 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 157):

NYC777

Why would Boeing close the line..? They have enough orders to keep them busy for a long time. Is the unit cost that much higher?



Knowledge Replaces Fear
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3451 posts, RR: 11
Reply 174, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 23003 times:

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 172):
AFAIK, almost all the certification flying has been done down in California and environs, not up here. . .

I believe much of the flights were indeed down in VCV but they also went to Hawaii and Daytona Beach and many other places. As far as I can remember they have been based out of PAE for the last month or so.

Quoting starrion (Reply 173):
Why would Boeing close the line..?

The surge line was put in place to aid in the ramp up and in the 787-9 initial production. That responsibility will end soon and the other two lines (Charleston primarily) should be able to pick up the slack. Theoretically the 787s should be coming together quicker over less real estate thereby driving down the unit costs and driving up margins.

The surge line has been ear marked for 777 and 777x production and will need to begin the transition before too long. They will need to produce both aircraft for a certain period of time and they will need the space to be able to do that.

tortugamon


User currently offlineseahawks7757 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 160 posts, RR: 0
Reply 175, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 22600 times:

Wow, didn't take Boeing long to get the 787-9 flying again, was out on a 3rd flight already yesterday-

http://www.flickr.com/photos/seahawks7757/9850666303/in/photostream/

Including testing of the R.A.T.-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/seahawks7757/9850891223/in/photostream/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/seahawks7757/9849613766/in/photostream/


User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2780 posts, RR: 2
Reply 176, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 22258 times:

Quoting starrion (Reply 143):
Do we want to do a separate thread for 789 flight testing?

I think we do. This thread is for production and delivery of 788 and 789. I think the 789 testing program is a different topic requiring a different thread.

Moderators, I hope you agree!