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Central American Aviation Thread. Part 55  
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4586 posts, RR: 4
Posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 16399 times:



THE CENTRAL AMERICAN AVIATION THREAD
PART LV
"Tribute to Braniff in Central America"


Welcome again to all the posters, readers and followers on this series !
I don’t get information about other Central American destination besides Panama City, speaking about the defunct Braniff International Airways from the United States. So, this edition could have been rather named as: Tribute to Braniff in Panama City...
The flying colors operated from Miami and New Orleans as non-stops to Panama City. Dallas/Ft. Worth also launched direct services there.
Their flights originated in Miami used to continue to South America, starting a legacy that is still in place nowadays. By the end of the 70s and allowing limited weekly frequencies, their jets flew out of Panama City to Bogota, Cali, Guayaquil, Quito, Lima and La Paz. They usually continued to their far stations placed in deep South America.
I guess the 727 was the usual plane in Panama City, in those days.
Most of this information was taken from Braniff Schedule. Summer 1978.



Edited on September 16th 2013.


"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
200 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAzure From France, joined Dec 2012, 629 posts, RR: 16
Reply 1, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 16297 times:

Great thread, I've enjoyed reading the previous part !

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 210):
BZE's BA turf, same as PTY is IB

I do not know what you mean for IB.
Between Europe and PTY, KL is the #1 carrier (2,500 seats weekly vs 1,600 seats weekly for IB). Source : http://centreforaviation.com/analysi...ir-france-will-not-be-alone-118493
KL flies 7x a week to PTY, IB 5x.
In addition AF will start a 3x weekly service from CDG as from Nov 25.

Maybe IB dominated this market but that was long ago.

Actually it is nice to see PTY getting more attraction !



I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things - A. de Saint Exupery
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6298 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 16258 times:

thanks for starting the new thread


When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 16236 times:

Quoting Azure (Reply 1):
I do not know what you mean for IB.

BA and IB belong to the same airline group.
BA focus in flying between LON and English-Speaking Caribbean destinations, IB focus between MAD and Spanish-Speaking Caribbean/Central America.
Recently Panama Tourism Authority was after BA to start LGW-PTY, answer they got from BA was something like "IB wouldn't like it since IB flies from MAD".
And while PTY is desperate for a LON non-stop, chances PTY/CM can woo VS to fly the route - even from LGW - are quite low, at least for now.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 16129 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Thread starter):
I don’t get information about other Central American destination besides Panama City

Well if Eastern got its Latin American routes from Braniff.. and Eastern was flying to SJO.. Does that mean that Braniff was already flying to SJO when Eastern took the routes?
I could be mistaken (specially if I my memory is playing tricks on me) but I had the feeling Braniff did fly to SJO.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4586 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 16068 times:

Quoting Azure (Reply 1):
KL flies 7x a week to PTY, IB 5x.
In addition AF will start a 3x weekly service from CDG as from Nov 25.

Maybe IB dominated this market but that was long ago.

Actually it is nice to see PTY getting more attraction !

KL AMS-PTY 3x weekly with MD-11 resumed their regional services in 2008, when CM was a SkyTeam associated airline. Both KL and CM rapidly started a mutual commercial agreement which is still in service.
The triangular IB MAD-GUA-PTY-MAD [3x-4x] weekly was active in those days. However, SkyTeam and KL AMS-PTY played better their charts, increasing their frequencies up to 7x weekly progressively.
The equipment was changed by the modern 777 later and AF CDG-PTY 3x weekly is due to start on November 25th.
None of the European Star Alliance carriers are still flying to PTY.




.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 4):
Braniff was already flying to SJO when Eastern took the routes?

I don't remember Braniff flying to San Jose.
I collected their timetables dated in 1978 and 1980 and SJO is out of that equation.
EA MIA-SJO began their flights in the early 80s where Pan Am and Air Florida attended that market.
Eastern also flew to GUA and SAL. Nonetheless, Braniff International never served these airports.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 15976 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 5):
I don't remember Braniff flying to San Jose

Although connecting third–party (LR?) flights via Panamá were available back in 1965 as shown below.

http://airchive.com/galleries/6387.jpg

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 5):
I collected their timetables dated in 1978 and 1980

Click on the links to see what their route map looked like back in 1973, 1975, and 1981.

[Edited 2013-09-18 08:44:38]


Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 15911 times:

It may seem like a pipe dream, reminiscent of the Aero Costa Rica fiasco ridden with mismanagement and inefficiency, but there is a new Costa Rican airline in the making.

Ticos Air has submitted all required documentation to the local DGAC for approval, and hopes to start SJOMEXSJO in December.

According to founder/president Gino Renzi, a publicist who worked 20 years for Coke, their next destinations will be EWR, LAX, MIA, and CCS.

Renzi also sits on the board of Hotel & Villas La Condesa in Heredia province.. hopefully not an indication of things to come, but the hotel owes CCSS (public healthcare system) and FODESAF (social welfare fund) over US$745K to date.

With undisclosed foreign backers (my sources point to Venezuela), the airline plans to operate a fleet of 5 leased 319s.

Línea aérea Ticos Air solicita autorización para operar vuelo internacional (in Spanish)

Ticos Air se diferenciará de Avianca por ser 100% nacional (in Spanish)



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 15871 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 7):
here is a new Costa Rican airline in the making.

So no room for a COPA Costa Rica flying out of SJO to MEX (TLC), MIA (FLL) and where currently CM as Panamanian airline can't add frequencies: CCS, EZE, YYZ...



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 15836 times:

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 8):
So no room for a COPA Costa Rica flying out of SJO

Not necessarily.. and if this experiment goes belly–up then perhaps the Mottas et al. will snatch it, a la AeroRepública.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 8):
MEX (TLC)

Copa and other carriers in the region must be looking forward to seeing the planned México–Toluca high–speed rail (aka Tren Interurbano México–Toluca), and the Naucalpan–Toluca freeway (aka Autopista Interlomas–Aeropuerto) become a reality.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 8):
where currently CM as Panamanian airline can't add frequencies: CCS, EZE, YYZ

There are plenty of scenarios where a Costa Rican subsidiary might come in handy for Copa.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6298 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 15801 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 9):
Not necessarily.. and if this experiment goes belly–up then perhaps the Mottas et al. will snatch it, a la AeroRepública.

actually a very plausible scenario



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4586 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 15773 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 6):
Although connecting third–party (LR?) flights via Panamá were available back in 1965 as shown below

Alliances and code-shares are inventions merely consolidated in the 90s. Perhaps any sort of mutual cooperation existed in those days between Braniff and other carrier.
The route map also displays the Houston - Panama City sector in the 60s.
The significance of Panama City consisted in the first stop for most of their South American routes. The US canal zone in those days could have influenced in more flights to Panama compared to the remaining Central American countries.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineSkyBird77 From United States of America, joined Sep 2013, 92 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 15765 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 7):
there is a new Costa Rican airline in the making


This is good news para los Ticos! Competition is always good and I hope it spreads in the region. I wish them success and I hope they don't go the way of Sol Air / AeroHonduras (2003-2005).


User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4586 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 15727 times:

Quoting SkyBird77 (Reply 12):
they don't go the way of Sol Air / AeroHonduras

Ten years ago, Sol Air in Miami was hurt by their competitors who matched their fares linking Honduras and South Florida.
As a result, Sol Air left that market.


Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 15716 times:

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 11):
The US canal zone in those days could have influenced in more flights to Panama compared to the remaining Central American countries

Aside from ideal geographic and topographic conditions, being a stone's throw away from unincorporated U.S. territory obviously added to the charm of Panamá City back then.

Quoting SkyBird77 (Reply 12):
This is good news para los Ticos! Competition is always good and I hope it spreads in the region

What is most significant here is that this would have been unthinkable just five years ago. The neighborhood bully that for many years thwarted competition, bled captive markets, short–changed customers, manipuled accident investigations, etc. has gradually lost its grip on CentAm.

Sort of like when the cat's away, the mice will play — only in this case the cat is moribund and the mice no longer feel threatened by the looming specter of his return.

Gotta give Copa and the Tocumen hub some credit for pummeling the beast into submission.

Now perhaps there's hope, in the not–so–distant future, for a well–run ULCC startup that makes intra–CentAm air travel affordable for the masses.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineSJOtoLIR From Costa Rica, joined Jul 2007, 4586 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 15702 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 6):
Although connecting third–party (LR?) flights via Panamá

If I remember correctly, Lacsa didn't fly to Guatemala City during the BAC 1-11 era: 60s and 70s.




.

Quoting SkyBird77 (Reply 12):
Competition is always good and I hope it spreads in the region

Panama City has the advantage over other regional cities due to the existence of Balboa Airport which might work for low-cost carriers, resulting in lower operational costs compared to PTY.
Comayagua as back-up for Tegucigalpa is still in doubt. It didn't experience a good time when TGU was temporarily closed due to the accident on May 30th 2008.

Regards.



"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
User currently offline2travel2know2 From Panama, joined Apr 2010, 2681 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 15623 times:

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 14):
Aside from ideal geographic and topographic conditions, being a stone's throw away from unincorporated U.S. territory obviously added to the charm of Panamá City back then.

Those were the days AA could have flown RDU-PTY or US CLT-PTY plus UA IAD-PTY and made some money just out of U.S. government/military related traffic.
Having such a huge U.S. presence here didn't really mean that much for PTY when BLB U.S. MAC flights would move lots of the traffic which could have been using PTY.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 15):
Panama City has the advantage over other regional cities due to the existence of Balboa Airport which might work for low-cost carriers, resulting in lower operational costs compared to PTY.

Not only BLB, but new ONX and MPRH too.



I'm not on CM's payroll.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6298 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 15547 times:

Anyone notice the CMAirlines and TAG ad on their FB pages

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=590994217632259&set=a.157673334297685.39062.100001650593441&type=1&theater

Anyone notice small at the bottom Alianza Airways?



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 15500 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 17):
Anyone notice small at the bottom Alianza Airways?

It seems that mice are springing up all over the place now. Interesting times ahead for CentAm aviation.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineviaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2139 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 7 hours ago) and read 15494 times:

AA1204 SJOMIA (757) diverted to ADZ this morning after crew noticed smoke in the cabin.. flight did eventually resume and is expected to arrive in MIA at 2024EDT (0024UTC)

Esta mañana (19 de septiembre), el vuelo 1204 de American Airlines, volando de San José, Costa Rica (SJO) a Miami (MIA), fue desviado a San Andrés, Colombia (ADZ) debido a un problema mecánico. El vuelo, una aeronave Boeing 757 con 172 pasajeros y seis tripulantes a bordo, aterrizó sin incidente en San Andrés a las 9:45 a.m. Los pasajeros han desembarcado y mantenimiento está evaluando la aeronave. — AA press release



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineaer From Guatemala, joined Mar 2004, 1048 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 7 hours ago) and read 15475 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 17):
Anyone notice small at the bottom Alianza Airways?

that's nice, but looks like flights will be operated by CMAirlines and not TAG...

Quoting viaggiare (Reply 18):
It seems that mice are springing up all over the place now

"cuando el gato duerme..."



nice and spacious airports in need of new airlines and flights... GUA or FRS anyone?... anyone at all?
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6298 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 6 hours ago) and read 15459 times:

Quoting aer (Reply 20):
that's nice, but looks like flights will be operated by CMAirlines and not TAG...

Maybe the other way round....TAG has more spare capacity than CMAirlines...



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlinejuanchito From Guatemala, joined Nov 2000, 1206 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 15437 times:

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 21):

I have heard that flights will start on november 5 weekly GUA-SAP-TGU-GUA
They will use Saab340 on that route.

Juanchito



Chapin de corazon.
User currently offlineyellowtail From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6298 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 15434 times:

Quoting juanchito (Reply 22):
They will use Saab340 on that route.

Then it must be TAGs aircraft.



When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
User currently offlineSkyBird77 From United States of America, joined Sep 2013, 92 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (1 year 2 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 15431 times:

Who is behind CM Airlines? I saw their ticket counter at TGU last month (really hadn't paid much attention to them in my previous trips to TGU, might have seen one of their LET's on the tarmac. Usually I would see Sosa - anybody know how are they doing?).

25 Post contains images juanchito : Yes CM have been leasing the SAAB340 and EMB110 from TAG. ARMSA another airline in Guatemala also leases two Emb110 to CM Airlines Juanchito[Edited 2
26 SJOtoLIR : Some local travel agencies are promoting Colon for cruise ships heading to the Caribbean and other regions. Is this the primary goal that justifies t
27 mingocr83 : Heard that the investors were from Mexico, Slim included....
28 Azure : Thanks for the clarification, I do get your point now. I do not want to start a IB/BA war here, but if what you write is true, and I have no reason n
29 2travel2know2 : The government and Colon Duty Free Zone also want some cargo flights operating at ONX. Also, Airport duty free concessions are quite attractive and l
30 Post contains images andrefranca : with the current context of Central American airlines, I wish what was being discussed on a separated thread a LCC airlines comes true otherwise I'll
31 yellowtail : patience my friends, patience......
32 viaggiare : Good.. the deeper the pockets, the better. Prophesy, brother.. prophesy..
33 Post contains links viaggiare : La Nación today reports 7.5K sq ft of concession space will be added at SJO as part of a planned 10.8K sq ft expansion adjacent to (west of) the exis
34 carmenlu15 : Do you guys think a model similar to what Volaris and Interjet are doing within Mexico (taking away customers from the bus lines) would work in Centr
35 2travel2know2 : Re: Panama 7P got a B737 and Air Panama currently flies PAC Albrook - DAV-SJO. If 7P would hat aircraft to use on PAC-DAV and DAV-SJO with fares to t
36 Post contains images andrefranca : I think Tica bus should do what G3 did in Brazil, they were first a bus company that bought planes! LMFAO.
37 Post contains links adamh8297 : Good news - Massport (government agency running BOS) has separated the CM as a Central American flight so we can a handle on how its doing load wise.
38 yellowtail : LF is not a measure of success.....but if we assume CM is not underpricing their tickets then yes, initial loads look decent.
39 adamh8297 : They definitely had underpriced some of their tickets (example they had sub-$700 flights to Brazil from BOS) during sale periods but on the flipside
40 SJOtoLIR : I disagree in this regard. The fictitious Central American shuttle service would hardly boost any intended flight as most travelers are basically con
41 2travel2know2 : There are several deserving South American and Caribbean destinations with very poor non-US or non-regional connectivity which CM should venture befo
42 adamh8297 : The next three months do have cheap fares. With the exception of holiday weeks (Thanksgiving and Christmas/New Years) there is wide availability of $
43 carmenlu15 : I was thinking more on the lines of GUA-SAL and the like... I agree that it wouldn't work for domestic services.
44 Post contains links viaggiare : Telenoticias today reports the best location for a proposed new airport serving the northern plains area of the country (proyecto de Ley 17937, para l
45 viaggiare : That would be great, and should work provided it is not only AFFORDABLE but also CONVENIENT. If you need to be in SJO three hours before your flight
46 MGASJO : I-ve done that MGA-SJO-MGA on Ticabus/transnica and similars for about 30 years. Never in less than 9 hours. And when semana santa and new year appro
47 Post contains images carmenlu15 : Definitely. Though I think asking passengers to be at the airport three hours before departure is a bit unnecessary, IMO. When I traveled to SJO in 2
48 viaggiare : More like giant sinkholes.. the 10–foot diameter culverts installed some twenty–five years ago under that highway on which 50K+ cars and trucks p
49 MGASJO : great! don't ever do it near xmas!
50 viaggiare : Because of the long lines on both sides of the border you mean? Been told to avoid the week before Easter also.
51 2travel2know2 : I've done San Salvador - Guatemala on a car and let me tell you getting into Guatemala city could take as long as the drive from San Salvador. LCC Shu
52 andrefranca : Rumors in MAO, CM is cancelling some flights due to low demand, US dollars is hurting int'l travel in Brazil right now. I remember almost 1 year ago C
53 2travel2know2 : I don't think CM will drop MAO, however, I can foresee CM downgrading MAO to thrice weekly E190 until early December.
54 SJOtoLIR : Well, Iquitos could be categorized within this assertion. However, CM PTY-IQT 2x weekly looks like very different compared to the new CM PTY-BOS 7x w
55 MGASJO : Exactly! About 4 hours just standing in line!
56 2travel2know2 : Routes is going on in Las Vegas these days. Don't have the link but seems that LAS is using this event to try to woo new (or return) service to LAS. N
57 Post contains links yellowtail : Starts tomorrow (sat). I'm heading on out today. Routes Americas is in SAL in Feb. Here is the link http://www.routesonline.com/events/160/world-rout
58 MGASJO : FYI, La Costeña will soon start flying MGA-TGU-MGA on Caravans. Nobody else flies that route. Some years ago La Costeña flew that route too, also At
59 skybird77 : Maybe with Caravans and a reasonable fare the route will be successful this time around? I guess the route is not as popular as it once was (remember
60 MGASJO : No, Atlantic flew Let 410 here
61 SJOtoLIR : The 727-200 crashed in 1989 into a hill during the final approach at TGU was scheduled as SJO-MGA-TGU. Regards.
62 skybird77 : But did Atlantic operate any FH-227's or is my mind playing tricks on me? I could have sworn seeing one at TGU a few years back (and no, I'm not thin
63 Post contains links greenmow : Did not see if someone mentioned it. Copa orders Split Scimitar Winglets, up to 100 systems. Link: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/copa-a...ders-split-s
64 Post contains links viaggiare : La Nación reports 30% of U.S. tourists and 49% of Canadians that flew in to Costa Rica during the first six months of 2013 chose LIR as their point o
65 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : http://www.prensa.com/uhora/locales/...iones-aeropuerto-tocumen/215715?en Heavy rains close PTY this morning. From www.prensa.com - in English Airport
66 yellowtail : anyone else think VX might try its hand at some SFO/LAX - Central America routes......SFO-SJO would be just doable with a 319
67 Post contains links and images copa330200 : http://www.prensa.com/impreso/econom...a/tocumen-adjudica-contrato/215524 Odebrecht received 15% from PTY related to the new terminal construction. ht
68 avi8 : I don't think so. That's just waaay off their current strategy. Mexico would come first.
69 Post contains images yellowtail : Lets see if I am mentally channeling their route planning dept!
70 skybird77 : I have to agree. They have other issues they need to contend with right now. It would be nice to see them in Central American skies someday. With suc
71 yellowtail : IMHO, the odds are better than we all think. THey have to grow somewhere....and Mexico is not that attractive right now
72 aer : If they were to come, I would assume that they would go SJO and LIR. I'm still waiting for B6 and AC to come to GUA.
73 SJOtoLIR : Speaking about a new US airline, we haven't heard any word related to the possible services of Alaska Airlines in Central America again. They had ope
74 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : CM flights grounded due to tech issue From www.prensa.com in English Today CM Network Centre suffered a technical mishap. According to CM with that te
75 Post contains links viaggiare : Among the many stranded travelers this evening, Costa Rican president Laura Chinchilla (who flies commercial for lack of a presidential aircraft) on
76 yellowtail : IMHO it is only a matter of time. They are probably watching the success of new DL routes such as LAX-LIR before making decision. IF DL can make it w
77 Post contains images 2travel2know2 : PTY CM check-in counters this morning from Twitter @CriticaPa Haven't heard if National Police is inside the terminal. But it's an awful situation ove
78 avi8 : My guess is that AS's first routes will be LAX-GUA/SAL, as they are the Central American cities with the highest O/D to LAX. SEA-Central America is hi
79 Post contains images SJOtoLIR : You have a good point here. The coming services of DL out of Los Angeles are likely hurting any incursion of AS in Central America. . A nice view dep
80 SkyBird77 : Thank you for the post! I love seeing photos of my homeland! For ATC clearances out of TGU, they still call it "La Mesa"
81 SJOtoLIR : Something like: "El Coco" for Juan Santamaría International Airport [SJO]. Regards
82 yellowtail : Reported in the Mexican press that 9N will announce BZE-MID service this Nov for March start. That will have them serving FRS, SAP, RTB, CUN, GUA (wit
83 Post contains images 2travel2know2 : Sounds like it's time for BZE-GCM, BZE-HAV and BZE-SAL
84 SJOtoLIR : How's the current dimension of the O&D market, in order to justify this intended route? Is the [BZE-MID] sector different compared to the [BZE-CU
85 yellowtail : Actually BZE MID has more O&D than BZE CUN. CUN is strictly price sensitive traffic trying to connect to an LCC or wanting to avoid the USA. Mid
86 avi8 : I wonder if we will see Volaris or Vivaerobus start flights to Central America soon. I'm also hoping for a Jetblue expansion in the area too.
87 Post contains images juanchito : Runway numerations in La Aurora will change Runway 01 will change to runway 02 and runway 19 will change to runway 20
88 Post contains links viaggiare : • Costa Rica's Prosecutor's Office and agents from the Judicial Investigation Police raided DGAC headquarters in San José yesterday, as part of an
89 Post contains links mt99 : "Air Chavez" - Any one? Replacing one "monopoly" with another entity that does not follow free market rules either is not the solution. "Vuelos Econó
90 viaggiare : It's a start.. things are changing quickly ever since the Kriete empire imploded.. market dynamics will dictate how things evolve.. in the meantime,
91 andrefranca : Not a "latino chavez pro social" bull%%$ myself, but hope it works, don't want to pay 360 USD on a SJO-PTY flight anymore.
92 Post contains links and images copa330200 : from La Prensa in Panama: TP will start flights to PTY in 2014 second half !!! http://www.prensa.com/impreso/econom...-acerca-al-viejo-continente/2177
93 yellowtail : Wow TP in PTY. What kinda buisness justification is there for LIS PTY? Somebody is going to take a bath. Either TP or the Panamanian taxpayer
94 viaggiare : The article reveals actual figures negotiated by Panamá with European carriers in terms of revenue guarantees.. AF: US$4.5M IB: US$4M KL: US$4M TP:
95 Post contains images yellowtail : So does this mean BA can't be bought? Lol
96 2travel2know2 : If TP is smart, they'd launch PTY as a tag-on from CCS or if there's some kind of demand for a Europe-MAR flight, then as a LIS (FNC) - MAR - PTY. Ei
97 Post contains images copa330200 : that's a clever idea since there is a strong demand between Venezuela and Panama. I understand Venezuela -Portugal is pretty well covered . now, as T
98 Summa767 : I understand that LH wants US$10m, and not that such a figure is a thus a negotiating starting point rather than an agreement. Indeed, I don't see ho
99 mt99 : Market Dynamics? my *ss.. Alba has an unlimited funds from the Venezuelan Government. How is that market dynamics?
100 2travel2know2 : And neither VS. Looks like both TP and LH most likely both will operate in PTY. What could BOG bring TP other than BOG O/D?
101 yellowtail : cargo?
102 Post contains links andrefranca : COME ON GUYS! Just what I said on the TAP Portugal Almost Ready To Launch Manaus & Belem (by santos Sep 5 2013 in Civil Aviation) MEX and PTY hav
103 Summa767 : O&D would be a significant addition, and better connections to many cities in Colombia. You mentioned a tag from Venezuela as a help to the new p
104 andrefranca : I forgot to mention this, colonization ties keep the spanish america well connected to Spain. It is not a big issue but it's something that doesn't h
105 SJOtoLIR : So LH is charging a lot of money due to the benefit offered by the Panamanian Government. It doubles the coming AF CDG-PTY 3x weekly which would begi
106 yellowtail : All this EU service IMHO only serves to make the CM hub at PTY stronger. PTY is rapidly turning into the DXB of the Americas. BA and a Asian carriers
107 SJOtoLIR : I fully agreed with. The intended services of TP LIS-PTY would probably bear the CM designator as well. Regards.
108 2travel2know2 : I'd have thought of a B767 AKL-RAR-LIM but not some NZ ETOPS aircraft AKL-somewhere or non-stop-PTY. CM wouldn't like another airline (even an Star A
109 Post contains links juanchito : Flight from AKL to LIM or PTY will need aircraft with ETOPS 240 http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=NZAA-SP...PTO&MS=wls&DU=nm&E=120&E=180&a
110 yellowtail : And with Salo & Co tossing out all the money..if it were my money....I wouldn't spend it on any more EU carriers, you have enough....I would maybe
111 RCS763AV : You make it sound like BOG's O/D is insignificant, for a metro area of 8.5 million that is the capital and produces 25% of latin america's third larg
112 juanchito : I hope they go daily. AV will start flying with A318 that route. They planned it before with a A319. Juanchito
113 juanchito : Boeing goal is 330 Juanchito
114 juanchito : New flights from TAG Flights will operate with Saab 340 and from Monday to Friday. GUA-TGU 06:00AM - Llega 07:20 TGU-GUA 08:00AM - Llega 09:20 GUA-SAP
115 2travel2know2 : If talking about EK, I'd rather ask them to fly DXB.-STN-PTY instead. EK wants to serve a 3rd LON airport and PTY is desperate for a LON non-stop fli
116 Post contains links and images viaggiare : Relief seems to be on the way.. not two, but three start–ups on the horizon.. Vuelos Económicos Centroamericanos (VECA), Ticos Air, and now Ticas
117 RCS763AV : No one is denying that PTY is a much more efficient hub operation than BOG, but: - Even though it serves more destinations, those extra destinations
118 Post contains links mt99 : I guess that your world.. two wrongs make a right. Must be nice.. while there is no toilet paper in Venezuela to drop $100M.. i guess that that was t
119 yellowtail : Don't forget Alianza
120 juanchito : Today Avianca started nonstop flights between BOG and GUA. On Monday Aeromexico will start 3 weekly (Monday-Wednesday-Friday) flight between TAP and G
121 SJOtoLIR : Avianca is changing operations on San Jose Costa Rica - Miami service as shown: LR 688.........SJO 07:50..........MIA 11:40.............Daily.........
122 viaggiare : TAP is México's southernmost airport.. what type of aircraft will be used?
123 SJOtoLIR : AeroMexico Connect: ERJ-145. They deploy the same plane on AM MEX-GUA 21x weekly. Regards.
124 avi8 : That is incorrect. MEX-GUA is flown with E-190 aircraft.
125 Summa767 : Interesting. So MIA-SJO will be a continuation of AV's BOG-MIA flight AV004, and similarly the return leg is SJO-MIA-BOG. I guess that is good aircra
126 Post contains images viaggiare : Advertising on tray tables, overhead bins, seatback inserts and bulkheads must be right around the corner.
127 bjorn14 : Ouch 2am arrival in MIA from SJO. Some Ticos won't be happy.
128 SkyBird77 : I'm sure AA has better arrival options.
129 Post contains images juanchito : Aerolineas Sosa will also start flights between SAP, TGU and GUA. Flights will start on December 9 Juanchito[Edited 2013-11-04 20:02:43]
130 SkyBird77 : Great to see some activity by a Honduran airline! I know Sosa had a CRJ-200 at some point, but a 900 on the advertisement?
131 avi8 : Will it be cheap? I truly hope they are competitive. I think AV will just pull the plug on GUA-SAP and GUA-TGU give their lack of interest on P2P
132 aer : Lots of activity on the Guatemala-Honduras front; let's see how they act.
133 yellowtail : More to come....
134 aer : Honduras or Guate?
135 bjorn14 : Does it require special training to fly into/out of TGU like JNU?
136 yellowtail : I know the crews from AA, DL and UA do...can't speak for the others.
137 SkyBird77 : Training and guts! A lot of guts prior to the runway improvements (e.g. the shaving of the hill on the approach path to and extension of runway 02).
138 SJOtoLIR : Grupo Taca lost the game into the MIA-SJO sector many years ago. In the past 10 years, the former LR SJO-MIA reduced their 14x weekly frequencies to
139 2travel2know2 : MIA-SJO times make a lot of sense, specially if MIA departure moves 2 hours later. Those SJO-MIA times don't.. Best choices for SJO departure would b
140 bjorn14 : I read on Flight Global that CM's CEO says the MAX is CM's 'next logical step'.
141 Post contains images yellowtail : Well since boeing won't be making the 73NG once the Max is in full swing, and it is safe to say that CM will need to replace aircraft / grow, I would
142 yellowtail : 9N commences BZE-RTB on Wednesday (plane will RON)…..first flight looks to be full so that ought to be a good sign. Since 9N started BZE-SAP fares o
143 SkyBird77 : Is this route marketed more for tourist divers visiting Belize? Is 9N experiencing good yields on this route?
144 yellowtail : IMHO its more VFR…Roatan has more ties to Belize historically than mainland Honduras….and those ties remain strong….many of the big RTB familie
145 aer : Quick question, are CM Airlines SAAB a/c TAG's but just leased?
146 yellowtail : I believe so.
147 aer : Odd that they don't want to fly under their own name
148 viaggiare : Saw two IB 346s simultaneously at SJO yesterday (Nov 17) late afternoon. Quite a rare sight, and within feet of each other. EC-JPU had spent the night
149 Post contains images yellowtail : Is there even enough space of the SJO ramp for two of those long beasts? Seriously, SJO is one IB route that would be a perfect fit for a 789….if t
150 SJOtoLIR : Perhaps SJO was utilized as a diversion plan on any IB MAD-LIM, IB MAD-GUA-SAL-MAD, IB MAD-BOG or so. Speaking about IB MAD-SJO, the airline has defi
151 Post contains links and images viaggiare : Not much room to spare, though.
152 viaggiare : I know the aircraft on the left (see image above) was parked in that same spot for at least thirteen hours.
153 Post contains images yellowtail : Yeah, barely enough for the Viaggiare water mark
154 SJOtoLIR : The United Airlines App displays the seat map configuration in all their flights. During the last seven days, both UA EWR-SJO and UA IAH-SJO show a lo
155 yellowtail : Thats not unusual. actually 90 is a bit low for this time of year.
156 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : Panama to negotiate new aviation bilaterals from www.prensa.com in Spanish According to La Prensa today Panama has bilaterals with 26 countries and av
157 viaggiare : Copa would jump at the chance to further develop its busiest route in CentAm (existing daily 0600, 0810, 0828, 1138, 1433, 1520, 1736 and 1804 depart
158 2travel2know2 : What I'd like to see is 2 extra PTY-SJO-PTY routed both ways via DAV. This to allow DAV international passengers to connect @ CM PTY hub or @ SJO.
159 viaggiare : How about PTY–DAV–SJO–MIA/FLL with fifth freedom rights? Following the May 17th Avianca–TACA fiasco (that's when they dropped SJO–LAX/JFK/H
160 bjorn14 : Does anyone have any update on the proposed airport at La Union in Guatemala?
161 bjorn14 : Just curious why there is no DAV-PTY service? I realize 7P flies to that other airport in town.
162 adamh8297 : Update on BOS-PTY loads- a bit of a dip but not a surprise Sep 2013 - 70.8% Oct 2013 - 65.6% Since service started 76.8% December will be better but
163 SJOtoLIR : PAC: Albrook Airport. I think PTY is not oriented for 50 seater turbo-prop operations. . These are only their departures heading to Panama City. Furt
164 viaggiare : Chiriquí province lacks any high–end developments that could put up some of their own money as revenue guarantee to persuade Copa.
165 2travel2know2 : That's only on PTY-BOC Bocas del Toro and mainly for South American passengers. 7P DAV-SJO-DAV is mostly O/D and 7P is still sort of unknown in Costa
166 viaggiare : The locals must step aside. What is needed is more people with the vision and determination of the late Sam Taliaferro, a pioneer of sorts and develo
167 yellowtail : Well the cash would be from Salo and Co.
168 SJOtoLIR : Update: Like the EC-JPU, one 346 was parked on November 24th and registered as EC-LCZ. I saw her this morning on my way to Alajuela. Today the source
169 viaggiare : Saw her myself at 0330 local — was still there at 1811 when sister ship EC–JCZ took off.
170 juanchito : Now we have in GUA a A340-300 stuck waiting for a new engine. Juanchito
171 viaggiare : EC–LCZ has not moved as of 1315 local (1915Z) today, so it must be something like that going on down here as well.
172 2travel2know2 : This past Monday, It seems Panama's ruler tried to poke CM during his speech at AF inaugural flight arrival only to hear words from AF chairperson say
173 Post contains images juanchito : It was because of a bird strike. And the strange things is that the plane departed from SAL to MAD and diverted to GUA. Juanchito
174 yellowtail : IB having a rough few weeks in Central America. I would have thought that there would have been more Airbus Engineering resources in SAL than in GUA w
175 MGASJO : There are some rumours here in MGA about an new airline starting up, with some participation of TAG. Recently a Learjet from TAG was seen in all major
176 2travel2know2 : And moreover, SAL has Aeroman which supposedly is an Airbus certified M.R.O. My wild guess as why that A340 diverted to GUA is that IB crew wasn't ke
177 yellowtail : I doubt that……must be something dictated by ops/dispatch…sometimes it can be something simple as where they have their maintenance contract.
178 yellowtail : Actually lots of rumors about various levels of cooperation between the different regional carriers and moving onto something bigger….perhaps this
179 yellowtail : Anyone heard some rumours about a SAL startup named "Veca"
180 juanchito : What I know is that they lease two A319 from ILFC, the airplanes are in Miami. They will start "next year" flights Juanchito
181 MGASJO : No rumour. They are training and they have a A319 already in SAL!
182 yellowtail : We need pics! Hope people don't mistakingly call it VACA
183 SJOtoLIR : Copa Airlines has rather increased their frequencies lately on selected routes compared to its limited expansion in 2013: CM PTY-BOS 7x weekly and th
184 SJOtoLIR : AM CUN-SJO 7x weekly is not in service anymore. That route was inaugurated last year. Cayman Airways still operates in La Ceiba and Panama City. Spiri
185 yellowtail : LCE is doing horribly and PTY is seasonal. IF rumors are to be believed KX is thinking about moving LCE to RTB. you forgot 9N BZE-RTB which started N
186 juanchito : Also forget the GUA-SAP and GUA-TGU from TAG/CM joint venture. Both started Nov.11 Juanchito
187 bjorn14 : Anybody know anyrhing know about a start up called Air Costa in SJO?
188 Post contains links 2travel2know2 : Panama talks extra frequencies with IB In Spanish from www.prensa.con The Panama Tourism Authority is talking to IB to encourage the Spanish airline t
189 Post contains links viaggiare : Earlier this morning the mayor of Liberia (provincial capital and Guanacaste's largest city) has confirmed rumors that a Disney theme park will be bui
190 2travel2know2 : Several years ago, some Panamanian official also said something similar about a Disney-theme park close to Rio Hato Airport. Seems any-time a develop
191 Post contains links viaggiare : Another local newspaper now dismisses the Liberia announcement, citing a senior Disney public relations official.. Disney desmiente que va a abrir pa
192 Post contains links viaggiare : La Nación has subsequently retracted much of its earlier story.. Corporación Disney desmiente su llegada a Costa Rica — link in Spanish. It now qu
193 SJOtoLIR : I think so. KL AMS-PTY is operating on a daily basis and offering a remarkable product named Boeing 777. That fact adds more pressure on IB MAD-PTY 5
194 SJOtoLIR : The Copa Airlines website reports no free seats heading to their destinations in Brazil during the first days of the 2014 FIFA World Cup. The message
195 aer : Does this mean that AV is pulling out of GUA on all US flights? AA and DL will have a monopoly on those routes now. Info from the OAG thread. *LR LAX-
196 juanchito : The MIA-GUA will be transfering to a AV code. The LAX-GUA is still bookable in avianca maybe the same thing like de MIA route. Juanchito
197 SJOtoLIR : Conviasa to Managua and Panama City. Effective: December 05th Caracas - Panama City - Managua V0 7200......CCS 11:00........PTY 12:50.......Sa........
198 Post contains images carmenlu15 : Everything is switching over to AV on March 1st.
199 aer : Ok, I misunderstood it as a pull out. Hehe, sorry.
200 Post contains links SJOtoLIR : Thank you to all the posters and readers for this edition. It's time to start a new thread ! Follow up ! Central American Aviation Thread. Part 56 (by
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