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NFL London Charters - Wembley Stadium Sept 29  
User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3081 posts, RR: 0
Posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 8708 times:

The first of two regular season NFL games is set for Sept 29 at Wembley.

The Minnesota Vikings will host the Pittsburgh Steelers and will travel to London on two Virgin Atlantic aircraft departing MSP on Monday evening, Sept 23. The aircraft should ferry into MSP sometime probably Sunday to begin loading the gear for the week long stay. Not sure what aircraft they will use. Normally it is the 747-400 but last year they sent a 346-600 to pick up the Rams in STL. After the game on Sunday evening, the Vikings will return to the hotel and depart for MSP Monday morning, Sept 30.

Not sure what airport they will use either, they have used both Gatwick and Heathrow before; last year they used Heathrow for both teams.

The Pittsburgh Steelers will leave PIT on Thursday evening, Sept 26. Only one aircraft will be needed to carry them and their gear and they are scheduled to depart for home immediately after the game on Sunday night.

We will do this all again on October 27 when the Jacksonville Jaguars host the San Francisco 49ers at Wembley.

Virgin Atlantic is an Associate Sponsor and the Official Airline of the NFL International Series.


The good old days: Delta L-1011s at MSY
56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinethomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3943 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 8690 times:

A little off topic, but just how popular is US football in the UK and Europe overall on a continent obsessed with "traditional" football (soccer)?


"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlinemkt3000 From Puerto Rico, joined Jul 2008, 3 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 8620 times:

Quoting thomasphoto60 (Reply 1):

Not very.


User currently offlineIflymidwexprss From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 160 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 8370 times:

I would say it has a small but loyal and growing following. I live in London and have been to each of the last four NFL London games at Wembley, and they are packed. You also get a lot of people flying in from points around Europe for the game. It'll never come anywhere close to the passion for "soccer", but as a niche market it's growing by leaps and bounds- enough to expand the London series from one to two games this year.

User currently offlineATCtower From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 542 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 8366 times:

Also off topic but how do they determine who hosts who when the game is 4000 miles away from either team? Who is the home team? The one who looks most like a rugby team?


By reading the above post you waive all rights to be offended. If you do not like what you read, forget it.
User currently onlineStTim From UK - England, joined Aug 2013, 749 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 8308 times:

I am gobsmacked that a sports team requires two widebody jets to cart all their gear, players, management, support players and hangers on (oh and cheerleaders).

User currently offlineafterburner33 From New Zealand, joined Aug 2012, 70 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8229 times:

Quoting Iflymidwexprss (Reply 3):

I would say it has a small but loyal and growing following. I live in London and have been to each of the last four NFL London games at Wembley, and they are packed. You also get a lot of people flying in from points around Europe for the game. It'll never come anywhere close to the passion for "soccer", but as a niche market it's growing by leaps and bounds- enough to expand the London series from one to two games this year.

I agree with this - I have also been to the last few games at Wembley, and I am always amazed at the number of quite hard core fans who come out for these games. They also hold quite well attended fan rallies in Trafalgar Square prior to the games. I myself always watch the Sunday evening games.

It will only ever be a minority sport here, but it does have its supporters.

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 4):

Also off topic but how do they determine who hosts who when the game is 4000 miles away from either team? Who is the home team? The one who looks most like a rugby team?

Usually the organisation which runs the games here negotiates with one of the NFL franchises who are willing to give up one of their home games and agree to play at Wembley. They then become the home team. In recent years these have typically (but not always) been teams who are not doing very well and who are struggling to fill their stadiums - these teams can get an income boost by playing at Wembley which has a capacity of 85,000 and which is normally full for NFL games. The Jacksonville Jaguars h ave signed a deal to play a home game at Wembley every year until 2016.


User currently offlineBSRadar From UK - England, joined Jan 2013, 30 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (11 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 7944 times:

I was at the first of these US footie games at Wembley (Minneapolis Vikings v. St Louis Cardinals in 1981(?) - I have the programme, somewhere. World Airways provided the flights (indeed, I think they were the main sponsor) - by DC-10. I was a curious local, and my unscientific guess then was that the crowd was probably 2:1 or more in favour of US ex-pats, many of whom had travelled in from various European locations. The game was getting a fairly aggressive Channel 4 push at the time which was maintained for a few years. TV coverage has been spasmodic since then, but has continued as there is a small but devoted following. The UK has a fairly catholic appreciation of sport, and US footie has a following with the natives pretty much akin to basketball, ice hockey - all claiming to be on the verge of a breakthrough, but never actually achieve it. The truth is that living in the UK you can go months on end without actually hearing a mention of any of these sports. Soccer is the opium for most of the UK population, and other team sports, cricket, rugby (both RU & RL), field hockey will be seen on the playing fields by the visitor. Hurling is a sport which is establishing itself, which is not surprising given the numbers of Irish in the UK. FWIW, having lived in other parts of the UK I have never "stumbled" across a game of US footie being played since back then. As a spectator event the Wembley games would be non-starters without the US ex-pats.

User currently offlinesteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9197 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 7571 times:

Go figure...

The Pittsburgh Steelers finally get to go to Europe, and they look like shit (pardon my French).  

The Vikings will chew them up...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlineMillwallSean From Singapore, joined Apr 2008, 1243 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 7345 times:

Virgin probably does this to gain more brand awareness in the US. There is little to gain from doing it thinking of the UK market.

Of the US sports, American football and Baseball are virtually non existant in Europe. American expats, military etc made up over 50% of the people at the only Wembley game i have taken in. The rest were mostly curious people like me.
As said above, American football might get a few mentions when its Superbowl time, like 20 seconds on the sports roundup. But I have never seen anyone play American football in the UK or seen a real fan nor have I seen an American football game shown live in a pub. American football might exist but its an extremelly marginalised sport and i doubt it could even be called a niche.
Same goes for baseball.

I guess they want to build a more international footprint but doing it in Europe is a hard sell. Id say it would require changes to the game itself, stopping the endless breaks and reducing times between play. I wish them luck though.

Basketball has it following all over Europe and especially in Southern Europe. Icehockey is large in parts of Northern Europe.



No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
User currently offlinejetblue1058 From United States of America, joined Mar 2013, 122 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 7227 times:

sorry,
but do you have any more info on the PIT charter?
Would love to spot it!!!!



JetBlue E190 seats, 5D and 16A= no better place in the world
User currently offlinechrisnh From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4113 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7173 times:

Quoting StTim (Reply 5):
I am gobsmacked that a sports team requires two widebody jets to cart all their gear, players, management, support players and hangers on (oh and cheerleaders).

No less 'gobsmacked' than we are when 'soccer' teams and F1 teams jet around with equal (or more) extravagance.


User currently offlinetjh8402 From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7128 times:

Quoting chrisnh (Reply 11):
No less 'gobsmacked' than we are when 'soccer' teams and F1 teams jet around with equal (or more) extravagance.

I can't speak for soccer, but Formula 1 teams don't charter A330's or 747's to fly themselves around.


User currently offlinesrqkef From Iceland, joined Jun 2011, 884 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7106 times:

Quoting chrisnh (Reply 11):

Football teams (or soccer as you call it) usually only need a BBJ at most. It are the fans that charter the widebody jets.

Not sure with F1 teams, but I think them chartering large jets is understandable considering they're moving cars. Still, I think they use narrowbodies. Don't quote me on that though.

I would say the only "American" sport which is popular in Europe is basketball and the NBA. At least in Iceland that's the case.

Regards
Sveinn  



Flights flown: 280 - Airlines: 40 - Airports: 64 - Next flights: KEF-BOS-EWR-PBI-TPA/SFB-KEF
User currently offlinechrisnh From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4113 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7096 times:

Quoting tjh8402 (Reply 12):
Formula 1 teams don't charter A330's or 747's to fly themselves around.

Well, the cars don't walk to their races...check and see the planes that flew into Montreal for the F1 race there...as but one example. And while the cars are on CargoLux 747s, the teams are on G5s or similar. 'Extravagance' comes in big and small sizes.

And AirEuropa flew a 777 into Boston just last week carrying a rather inconsequential 'soccer' team for a rather inconsequential 'friendly.'


User currently offlinesteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9197 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7072 times:

Quoting jetblue1058 (Reply 10):
sorry,
but do you have any more info on the PIT charter?
Would love to spot it!!!!

I'd like to know this as well...

If I had to guess -- I'd say a FX MD11 since they'd likely be hauling manure...

Yeah, I know. I'm mean. :P

Ok, now in all seriousness. I wonder if US would still deploy a 757 for this city pair...



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offlinetjh8402 From United States of America, joined Jan 2013, 188 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 7031 times:

Quoting chrisnh (Reply 14):
Well, the cars don't walk to their races...check and see the planes that flew into Montreal for the F1 race there...as but one example. And while the cars are on CargoLux 747s, the teams are on G5s or similar. 'Extravagance' comes in big and small sizes.

Its apples and oranges. I don't see why you would be gobsmacked by the "extravagance" of an international motorsports series needing to transport cars and car parts. Guess what, NFL team owners love their Gulfstreams just as much as F1 team owners do. Any single grand prix will look more extravagant by virtue of the fact that the entire sport is in one location, not spread out all over a continent like the NFL on any given weekend. To my knowledge, no single F1 team needs a widebody jet to transport their personnel to a race.


User currently onlinewn676 From Djibouti, joined Jun 2005, 1034 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 6913 times:

Quoting jetblue1058 (Reply 10):

sorry,
but do you have any more info on the PIT charter?
Would love to spot it!!!!

US is sending a 767 to LGW on the 26th returning the next day.

[Edited 2013-09-20 22:07:34]


Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
User currently offlinenkops From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2663 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 6678 times:

Of all teams to go.... the Jags, seriously??


I have no association with Spirit Airlines
User currently offlinebrilondon From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 4221 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 6653 times:

Quoting nkops (Reply 18):
Of all teams to go.... the Jags, seriously?

Yes, if you had read the other post that explains that it is a team that is not doing well generally at home in terms of attendance because to a home team to lose an eighth of their gate and ancillary revenues surrounding the game, there are not that many teams that would give that up.



Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3081 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6514 times:

Quoting jetblue1058 (Reply 10):
sorry,
but do you have any more info on the PIT charter?
Would love to spot it!!!!

Wish I could find some info, all I can say is watch this link late 25th or early on the 26th for a VS 744 or 346 ferrying to PIT
http://flightaware.com/live/findflight/ZLN/KPIT/
I think they will depart PIT approx. 7:00pm Thursday evening.
Can't really find any information on this, mostly going on past procedure.


Quoting wn676 (Reply 17):
US is sending a 767 to LGW on the 26th returning the next day.

That must be an extra aircraft for the wives and other staff or friends. The Steelers will be flying VS. The Saints did something similar when they went, the team flew over on a NW 742 then a few days later a DL 763 brought the wives and others, then they all flew back together on the 742.



The good old days: Delta L-1011s at MSY
User currently offlinepliersinsight From United States of America, joined May 2008, 490 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6464 times:

Quoting StTim (Reply 5):

I am gobsmacked that a sports team requires two widebody jets to cart all their gear, players, management, support players and hangers on (oh and cheerleaders).

The Pittsburgh Steelers do not have cheerleaders.


User currently offlinesteeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 9197 posts, RR: 20
Reply 22, posted (11 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6359 times:

Quoting pliersinsight (Reply 21):
The Pittsburgh Steelers do not have cheerleaders.

Yeah they do actually. Apparently new this year. Why else would they be 0-2?    

So if I'm look at this right, the team is taking either a VS 747 or an A346 while the family members fly a US 767. Interesting...

Didn't the Steelers go to Tokyo some 20 years ago on a JAL 742?



Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
User currently offline71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3081 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (11 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 5823 times:

The Vikings team VS aircraft is ferrying enroute now to MSP.

Doesn't show an aircraft type however just yet, guess FA will pick that up when it gets a little closer.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/V...3/history/20130923/1018Z/EGLL/KMSP

Due in about 1:00pm or so MSP local time.

http://min.scout.com/2/1307114.html

This says the Vikes will fly over today on two VS aircraft but I'm wondering if they will just use the one plane today and then take a DL 763 over later in the week (usually Thursday) for the wives and rest of staff.

DAL 8867

[Edited 2013-09-23 05:42:03]


The good old days: Delta L-1011s at MSY
User currently offlinemsp747 From United States of America, joined May 2010, 317 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (11 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 5731 times:

It's more than just the players flying over for this. I know the Vikings decided to go all out for the occasion, and are taking just about the entire organization with them on this trip. That includes a lot of staff members who work at the team's headquarters. Not sure if their families are coming too, but I imagine some employees are bringing families with. Still surprised that they need 2 A346's for this, but maybe they are limiting one just to the players, coaching staff, and the usual group that travels to road games here in the states.

Quoting afterburner33 (Reply 6):
In recent years these have typically (but not always) been teams who are not doing very well and who are struggling to fill their stadiums - these teams can get an income boost by playing at Wembley which has a capacity of 85,000 and which is normally full for NFL games.

Attendance may be a factor with the Jags, but it's not why the Vikings agreed to be the "home" team this time around. They do play in one of the league's lower money making stadiums, so it was probably a chance to 'cash in' ahead of their new stadium being built. My guess is they might agree to it again over the next 2 years while their fancy new building is constructed. Once it's open though, I doubt they'd give up the home game to do it.


25 GCT64 : Looks to be G-VFIZ A346 as VIR963P
26 Post contains links BoeingMerica : Both are winless teams, and you think the Vikings will chew them up? Christian Ponder plays week in and week out like a division III college team bac
27 Post contains images Highflier92660 : The only mildly interesting aspect of this NFL game is the type of A/C Virgin Atlantic will be using, the routing, altitudes and the enroute times. Ev
28 Post contains links and images 71Zulu : View Large View MediumPhoto © Mark Kwiatkowski I got the two VS planes idea from this: http://min.scout.com/2/1307114.html but I'm now thinking it wi
29 Post contains images steeler83 : Wow, that's this week already. For some reason I thought it was later in the season. Well, should be interesting to see what lands at PIT.
30 mikesairways : Any charter info on the 49ers? Will they be out of SJC or SFO?
31 par13del : Which is the reason why the NFL owners can be as silly as anyone else. If you want to promote the game in Europe where the startup league failed you
32 roseflyer : Soccer players are slender. They only need one seat. Have you seen how humongous NFL players are? They do not fit in single economy seats. Usually ch
33 par13del : One can also look at the equipment - pads for example - and how much training equipment must be available to ensure that on the day of the game the p
34 Post contains images SelseyBill : Popular enough to sell out both Wembley games inside the first few days. Popular enough for the Jacksonville Jaguars and Minnesota Vikings ownership
35 SelseyBill : SRB is good buddies with Robert Kraft, the owner of the New England Patriots, and probably got the inside line on the deal. He has been seen a number
36 Post contains links 71Zulu : http://flightaware.com/live/flight/V...3/history/20130923/2355Z/KMSP/EGKK Going to Gatwick 49ers will be the "visitors" for that game so they should l
37 SelseyBill : Thanx for the reply '71Zulu' Still puzzling how a British company could out-bid a US company for this 'American ended' work. Must be an inventive 'ma
38 mikesairways : SJC has no runway operational requirements. They took DL 744 from SJC-MSY last year for Superbowl.
39 Post contains images MKENut : I think it's curiosity more than anything. I had no interest in hockey for the longest time until a co-worker invited me to watch a Hawks game. As a
40 Post contains images 71Zulu : I didn't realize the runways at SJC were 11,000 feet, so no worries there, should be able to make it to LGW no problem. I saw it land.
41 as739x : VS operates all the charters for these game. The 49ers will leave most likely from SFO purely due to VS already having operations here.
42 71Zulu : Yes VS flies the teams, I meant an additional aircraft like the Steelers will be doing Thursday (US 762) and the Saints did when they went, they took
43 Post contains links 71Zulu : Steelers' aircraft ferrying to PIT http://flightaware.com/live/flight/V...5/history/20130926/1225Z/EGLL/KPIT
44 Post contains links 71Zulu : Looks like the Vikings used a North American 763 as their second aircraft to London, left last night at 10pm http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N...0/
45 WALmsp : Agreed. Just sing the anthem; it's not supposed to be a "listen to my trills and high notes" moment. Of course, considering the futility of my Viking
46 CargoIT : Rumor has it that Minnesota based arena rock band Hairball traveled to London with the Vikings.
47 777STL : One plane is for the team, the other is probably for front office team staff and families, and maybe a few season ticket holders as well. It's ultima
48 msp747 : The schedule is released long before the season begins. How was the NFL supposed to know both of these teams would be terrible this year? The Vikings
49 evomutant : The MLB CBA has a whole section devoted to transport. It's online. I imagine the NFL one is similar. The MLB one mandates two seats per player if they
50 Post contains links PITrules : Interesting take on this here: http://triblive.com/sports/steelers/.../london-nfl-steelers#axzz2gIN0xLIv Look for 3 London games as early as next yea
51 Viscount724 : Roughly 200,000 residents of the U.K. were born in the U.S. I expect most live in the LON area.
52 afterburner33 : There must also be a decent number in East Anglia, specifically around RAF Lakenheath and RAF Mildenhall. They are around 80 miles north east of Londo
53 Byrdluvs747 : Clearly you know nothing about US football. As mentioned previously, these guys are not built like a typical soccer player. Many are taller, heavier
54 Post contains links 71Zulu : Steelers heading back home... http://flightaware.com/live/flight/V...6/history/20130930/0006Z/EGKK/KPIT Vikes flying back in the morning.
55 777STL : Jesus, that's a long day.
56 Post contains links 71Zulu : Vikings return, due in MSP about 3:00pm http://flightaware.com/live/flight/V...4/history/20130930/1150Z/EGKK/KMSP
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