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Airbus And Boeing Orders - 2014 - Part 1  
User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3431 posts, RR: 25
Posted (8 months 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 48669 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

In order to accommodate Boeing and Airbus orders for 2014, a new thread is now open for discussion. Part 3 of the 2013 is available here:

Airbus And Boeing Orders - 2013 - Part 3 (by SA7700 Dec 5 2013 in Civil Aviation)?nocache

Enjoy the forums!  

Regards,

SA7700


When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
265 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineredrooster3 From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 229 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (8 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 48229 times:

To kick off this thread, here is the first announced order for 2014. Reuters - Air Algerie signs deals to buy Airbus, Boeing jets

Quote:

* Deals to strengthen domestic, international routes

* Boeing purchase for 737-800 jets, $724 million cost

* Air Algerie facing rivalries on foreign routes

- The order is also for 3 three A330-200s. They will finance with the Algerian state banks.
- Deliveries starting September 2014 through end of 2016.



The only thing you should change about a woman is her last name.
User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 2, posted (8 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 48202 times:

The Airbus order might be booked in 2013, we have to wait until next Monday.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineracercoup From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 months 2 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 47747 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 2):

The Airbus order might be booked in 2013, we have to wait until next Monday.

Boeing listed this Air Algerie order under 2013 today.


User currently offlineAAplat4life From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 189 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 47415 times:

Just noticed that the EK 777 order was not booked for 2013, and so that should give Boeing a good head-start into 2014.

User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 5, posted (8 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 46823 times:

Singapore Airlines-Tata joint venture orders 20x A320 aircraft.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...s-sources/articleshow/28579582.cms

[Edited 2014-01-09 00:53:44]


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently onlineindia1 From India, joined Aug 2011, 181 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 46795 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

@ Karel - the article says they're going to be leased, so it won't be a new order as such, methinks

User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 7, posted (8 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 46776 times:

Quoting india1 (Reply 6):
so it won't be a new order as such, methinks

We don't know, perhaps we will see a new order from a lessor.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinechiad From Norway, joined May 2006, 1153 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 46473 times:

With the current activity and commitments to be firmed up 2014 seems to be very promising order-wise for Airbus and Boeing.
I wouldn't be surprised if we'll see another year with 1000 with both manufactures.

Deliveries should reach record levels as well.
Does anyone know if Airbus or Boeing has published their goals for deliveries?


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 9, posted (8 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 46436 times:

Quoting chiad (Reply 8):
Does anyone know if Airbus or Boeing has published their goals for deliveries?

Boeing will publish those numbers at the end of the month, Airbus will do it next Monday.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinescbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12569 posts, RR: 46
Reply 10, posted (8 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 46363 times:
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Quoting chiad (Reply 8):
Does anyone know if Airbus or Boeing has published their goals for deliveries?

I would expect Airbus's target to be around 660, Boeing's should be somewhat higher if they can smooth out 787 deliveries.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlinetravelhound From Australia, joined May 2008, 938 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (8 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 46043 times:

Boeing Numbers (at a guess) on current production rates

737 - 504 (42/month)
747 - 18 (1.5/month)
767 - 21 (1.75/month)
777 - 100 (8.33/month)
787 - 100 (10/month - uncertainty)

Total - 743 Aircraft.

included in this total are military aircraft.


User currently offlinekanban From United States of America, joined Jan 2008, 3564 posts, RR: 27
Reply 12, posted (8 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 45880 times:
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Dang.. the thread is about new orders, and it took 11 posts to clutter it up with leases, 2013 data and production forecasters..
Let's just keep this on for announced sales by the manufacturers.. otherwise it wanders into rumor and wishing.


User currently offlineN14AZ From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2715 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (8 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 45346 times:

From the previous thread, quoting Flood:

Quote:
Per Airbus' order spreadsheet QR has apparently converted its order for six A319neo to five A320neo.
Initially reported by flightglobal pro which I don't subscribe to, so I'm not aware of any other details.

A German aviation magazine is now reporting that QR has converted all of their 19 A 319NEO orders into 320NEO orders, meaning the launch customer for this version is not interested any longer in this version. Out of all NEO orders just 1% is for 319NEOs.


User currently offlineracercoup From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 44820 times:

Quoting scbriml (Reply 10):
would expect Airbus's target to be around 660, Boeing's should be somewhat higher if they can smooth out 787 deliveries.

I put Airbus at under 640 and Boeing conservatively at 730. By value the picture tilts heavier towards Boeing as 78% of Airbus deliveries are single aisle compared to 68% at Boeing. Boeing's deliveries will be worth about 25% more in dollar volume than Airbus this year. I don't see this changing until the A350 gets up to speed in several years time.


User currently offlineist2014 From Turkey, joined Jan 2014, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 44793 times:

i think there will be increase in propotion of NB at both of B&A when we have max and neo deliveries

User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 16, posted (8 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 44297 times:

Quoting travelhound (Reply 11):
Boeing Numbers (at a guess) on current production rates

737 - 504 (42/month)

B737 production rate will hit 42 per month in the coming months, current rate is 38.



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3446 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (8 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 43895 times:

I just noticed 8 unidentified 777 orders that appeared for the first time on the December report. Anyone have an idea on who these are for?

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 18, posted (8 months 1 week 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 43842 times:

Weren't those for Air China?


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3446 posts, RR: 10
Reply 19, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 43479 times:

Undisclosed 100-aircraft order comprises 15 A319, 65 A320 and 20 A321, a mix of both current and re-engined versions. #airbus
http://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/422679891293650945

tortugamon


User currently offlineKarelXWB From Netherlands, joined Jul 2012, 11691 posts, RR: 33
Reply 20, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 43460 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 19):
15 A319, 65 A320 and 20 A321

I have seen those numbers before, Air China and Shenzen?



Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe.
User currently offlineAustrianZRH From Austria, joined Aug 2007, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 43446 times:

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 19):
Undisclosed 100-aircraft order comprises 15 A319, 65 A320 and 20 A321, a mix of both current and re-engined versions. #airbus

I think this could also refer to the 100 UFOs booked still in December 2013 which JL referred to in his press statement!



WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3446 posts, RR: 10
Reply 22, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 43432 times:

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 18):
Weren't those for Air China?

Those are already disclosed on the O&D report:

http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm

Incidentally I thought that order was for 7 77Fs and 1 77W but Boeing has them all going to Air China cargo.

tortugamon


User currently offlinetortugamon From United States of America, joined Apr 2013, 3446 posts, RR: 10
Reply 23, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 43416 times:

Interesting news: "Airbus reached 1,619 gross orders, 11 more than in the previous record year of 2011 and 88 more than Boeing received in 2013. Net orders (1,503) were also above the previous high mark."
http://www.aviationweek.com/Article....e-xml/awx_01_13_2014_p0-653903.xml

So by Boeing not firming the EK order Airbus won the order race in a battle that I am not sure they are really fighting. Very close year. Unbelievable numbers.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 20):
I have seen those numbers before, Air China and Shenzen?

Could be. It would make sense as that is how China orders come up at Airbus.

Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 21):
I think this could also refer to the 100 UFOs booked still in December 2013 which JL referred to in his press statement!

It is the very same.  

tortugamon


User currently offlineN14AZ From Germany, joined Feb 2007, 2715 posts, RR: 25
Reply 24, posted (8 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 43228 times:

Airbus deleted the Kingfisher A 350 and A 380 orders from their list of orders. It was for 5 A 380, don't remember the number of A 350s.

25 Post contains images EPA001 : Almost unbelievable indeed. And very good for both OEM's. . Since the EK B777-X order was not finalised in 2013 Boeing will have a huge head start fo
26 Stitch : 5 x A350-800
27 Post contains images KarelXWB : Challenge accepted
28 Post contains images EPA001 : Not sure that I am challenging you. I like to see as many orders for all OEM's, though I have a bit softer spot for Airbus and RR. I'll admit that.
29 Post contains links kanban : OK first Boeing sale of 2014 per Yahoo Finance Boeing and Alaska Airlines (ALK) complete Boeing's first firm airplane order of 2014 for two additional
30 Post contains links KarelXWB : Boeing adds 10 new orders to the book: 8x Air Algerie (737) and 2x Alaska Airlines (737). http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
31 Post contains links Kengo : Per Reuters, GECAS may order mix of 40 737MAXs and 737-800s. http://finance.yahoo.com/news/gecas-may-order-40-boeing-110052138.html
32 Post contains links phxa340 : Confirmed. http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireS...g-confirm-order-40-planes-21602492
33 Kengo : My apology...looks as if this order was booked last year but announced today.
34 Post contains links KarelXWB : That order was booked in 2013 as "unidentified customer", so it seems. http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2014-01-...7-MAXs-and-20-Next-Generation-737s
35 Post contains links Finn350 : According to Reuters, Doric expects to complete Airbus A380 order "soon". http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...inance-doric-idUSL5N0KU38E20140120
36 kanban : From the Boeing orders and deliveries page "Changes since last update: 23 new orders (Unidentified Customer(s) 20 737s and Jackson Square Aviation thr
37 tortugamon : In December 2012 and August 2013 there were 77W unidentified orders for 30 and 7 units respectively. I assume the 30 units are for Chinese carriers to
38 KarelXWB : I recall reading both orders are for the Chinese market.
39 Hamlet69 : Yes. Should be MU for 20 and CZ for 10 (though I might have that reversed). In fact, CZ's first frame just rolled out at PAE. The other order for 7 s
40 KarelXWB : Those 7 are for Air China I believe.
41 Post contains links tortugamon : CAPA has 20 going to China Eastern and 10 going to China Southern and they don't show up and Boeing's O&D report so I suspect we have the answer o
42 Hamlet69 : Sure you're not thinking of the 8 F's they got from CX? When Boeing booked that order, it was listed as UFO for a while, and only 'disclosed' them la
43 Post contains links KarelXWB : Lion Air converts 787 order into narrow-bodies. http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...onair-boeing-idUSBREA0Q0AM20140127 I must have been confused, a
44 PlanesNTrains : Does it say how many 737's or what variants they'll be getting? Any suggestion on what type of widebody they'll go for next? I'm guessing A333. -Dave
45 KarelXWB : I have updated my post with a link which does not require a subscription.
46 tortugamon : 9 abreast A330 Regionals do make sense. I wonder which is cheaper. Cebu's 436 seat A330 may get a run for its money. tortugamon
47 KarelXWB : If they want something bigger, they could convert the order into -9s. That said, I guess it would push deliveries into the 2020s due to the large 787
48 scbriml : I would have thought -10s would be better for them, but then the wait would be even longer as well. I can see them ordering A333s now and then 787-10
49 PM : Boeing are going to have to try again to find homes for those early sometime ANA planes...
50 Stitch : The 5 787s were going to Batik Air and they supposedly have 2 A330-200s and 3 A330-300s on order.
51 tim73 : 20 years ago Airbus and Boeing sold only 125 planes each. Quite a growth since that. In 1993 Airbus sold only 38 planes!
52 Post contains links india1 : Boeing's first WB orders of the year: 4 T7s and a 787... http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
53 Someone83 : A BBJ. Could it be one of the early built?
54 Post contains links KarelXWB : Linhas Aereas de Mocambique (LAM) announced an order today for three 737-700 NG airplanes (+ three purchase rights). http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2014-
55 Post contains links KarelXWB : Airbus booked 10 orders in January (7x A321ceo, 2x A350) and noted 5 cancellations (1x A319ceo, 4x A320ceo). http://www.airbus.com/company/market/orde
56 india1 : AB also showed conversions of the ILFC and Libyan Air 358s to 359s, more significantly.
57 wimdemeester : Did I miss something that might have happened earlier but the order list for the 358 now shows only 46 orders which indicates that ILFC and Libyan app
58 Post contains links KarelXWB : Airbus is switching A350-800 customers to the larger -900 model. It seems the A330neo will now replace the A350-800. A330 NEO Becoming More Likely Pa
59 Post contains images EPA001 : All the signs are pointing in that direction at this time. The last conversions from ILFC and Libyan Air underline this clearly.
60 Karan69 : What's nice is AA has placed a repeat order for the 321 CEO , obviously they must have been happy with their current deliveries Fron the news brief "
61 scouseflyer : Isn't there something a bit of about the AA orders as in they're getting converted to orders with lessors as they're about to be delivered but the ori
62 scbriml : No, not at all. AA ordered 130 A321neo directly from Airbus. They also ordered 130 A319/321ceo from leasing companies (which is where they're listed
63 sirtoby : The questtion is how many of the 130 A319/A321ceo's are covered by leases as of today. maybe AA found it cheaper to buy these 7 A321 than to lease th
64 StTim : But from an Airbus perspective they would be additional under that scenario as the ones under the lease will go elsewhere not be cancelled.
65 scbriml : Unless you know all the allocations of all the outstanding lessor orders, I'd say you won't know until AA stops taking ceos. They are clearly new ord
66 tortugamon : Looks like Asiana is buying about 14 A380s and 8 A350s. Though it isn't very obvious what portion of the 14 A380s will be new orders vs the 6? that th
67 Stitch : The article seems a bit unclear, at least to me. It starts with "Asiana Airlines will buy at least 14 superjumbo and other airliners from Airbus Grou
68 ZKCIF : Are we sure that it is not the case of a journalist mixing up orders and deliveries. You could read the way that they "purchase" i.e. get produced fr
69 MaxiAir : Sounds like 14 in total or 14 additional to me, as well as 8 A350, what leaves between 8 and 14 others to the as well mentioned 30, so maybe some more
70 scbriml : The numbers are too coincidental for me. I think he's talking about deliveries.
71 tortugamon : There is a lesson in journalism (and careful reading) some where in here. I read the same paragraph and found 14 new A380s being purchased and now tha
72 Post contains links india1 : The Airbus Viet jet deal has been signed... It was originally meant for 62 firm 32Xs and options https://twitter.com/Airbus/status/433144637155336192/
73 Post contains links and images Heavierthanair : G´day Seems the Doric A 380 order is close http://www.4-traders.com/AIRBUS-GROU...r-changes-name-to-Amedeo-17927682/ Cheers Peter
74 chiad : Yalla. Excellent! Thanks for the update. But the Doric doesn't seems to be ready though. Quote: "Airbus is putting the finishing touches on an order w
75 Post contains links JerseyFlyer : No it doesn't. http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...s-deal-for-up-to-100-a320s-395775/ "The deal, which covers A320ceo and A320neo family aircraft,
76 Post contains links india1 : Shouldn't the 7 leased frames also be incl as firmed? The Airbus press release certainly seems to indicate that - http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/ne
77 StTim : That depends if they are existing orders that the Lessors have already made or new ones.
78 Post contains images Ab345 : If...and I again stress "if"...the OZ article includes new 388 orders I can just see some peoples' heads exploding here Good start for the 320neo fami
79 Post contains images chiad : You think? More than 2 frames ordered in average everyday since launch.
80 Post contains links sirtoby : Air Finance reports about a possible A320neo order with PW1100G forthcoming: http://www.aviationnews-online.com/ PW has an annoucement planned for tom
81 india1 : OK, so on Day II of Singapore, Doric / Amadeo is now a done deal! It's all over the press and Airbus are also confirming it.
82 Post contains images Ab345 : Finally done I m sure a L O T of people wrote this off as a dead deal
83 Post contains links EK413 : Hello All, Airbus have secured an order at the SIN Air show for 20 A380's worth $8.3 billion. Any ideas as to whom would be ordering 20 frames? Certai
84 fcogafa : Flightglobal also says that there are no customers for the Doric A380s yet, it says it is a speculative order Additionally, the headine in FG is that
85 StTim : But they must be a long way along with customers or I cannot see them having firmed up the order.
86 Post contains links india1 : I cant see that : http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...e-amedeo-firms-up-20-a380s-395828/
87 bobdino : No, it's not. Flightglobal have used a somewhat confusing turn of phrase. To "firm up" means to "confirm" an order. You could rewrite the headline as
88 Post contains images AustrianZRH : He probably just misread "firmed up" for "firmed up to" - almost happened to me as well .
89 Post contains links scbriml : Airbus are pretty clear it's a firm order for 20: http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/new...medeo-firms-up-order-for-20-a380s/
90 Heavierthanair : G´day The original text in FlightGöobal was "up to" Since obviously they also read the A´net they must have realized the error and corrected it Che
91 fcogafa : Thanks - glad I'm not seeing things!
92 Ab345 : So what besides the two hits for Airbus (Vietjet and AmEdeo) what do we have on the Boeing corner?![Edited 2014-02-12 12:41:02]
93 Post contains images EPA001 : AmEdeo.
94 Post contains images Ab345 : Already corrected. Besides that was is the "score" up to now ?
95 Post contains images EPA001 : Tha capital E was my way of trying to make clear that the new name of Doric is Amedeo. But it is understandable that people easily think it is change
96 Post contains links MaxiAir : http://www.aviationnews-online.com/e...order-pw-powered-a320neo-aircraft/ Has anything new occured concerning this suspicious A320-order? Would love t
97 fcogafa : Nok Air ordering 15 B737s, eight 737-800s and seven 737 Max
98 Post contains images Ab345 : Last two days I have taken quite a beating about spelling on this site I feel like I'm in school again lol! Joking aside, I also read about the Amede
99 EPA001 : I think they do. Last year they signed a MoU, but that is no firm order yet. As of today, the 20 A380's signed for by Amedeo are firm on order.[Edite
100 Post contains links tortugamon : I believe this is a new order for 4 789s for DY. http://www.aviationweek.com/Article....e-xml/awx_02_13_2014_p0-663750.xml tortugamon
101 Stitch : That link is to an OP-ED by Richard Aboulafia on how Airbus is doomed. Google News doesn't have anything on a new DY order, just the reference to the
102 Post contains links tortugamon : My bad. Here is the link: http://www.mynewsdesk.com/uk/norwegi...-four-new-787-9-dreamliners-960737 Are these new orders? New leases? tortugamon
103 Stitch : Per the article, they are new leases placed with ILFC. ILFC has 41 787-9s on order, so these are likely going to be delivered to DY from "dealer stoc
104 Post contains links Heavierthanair : G´day http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/new...s-places-order-for-four-a330-200s/ Aerolineas argentinas 4 x A 330-200 order just announced. Been rumore
105 art : How not to choose a new brand name?
106 StTim : Is that now 14 A330's this year? So for the 200 target we need another 186. I have just read Richard Aboulafia's piece. It is very one sided and slant
107 Post contains images Ab345 : An order for the 332! That's interesting news today And here we were seeing how unwanted and obsolete the 200 variant was. Although I have to admit it
108 Post contains links chiad : It's difficult for me to see how anyone can take Richard Aboulafia seriously, especially since that the (healthy) A330 backlog is the only one "shrin
109 Post contains images Stitch : I am sure they are replacements for their four A340-200s. As such, the decision may have been driven by matching capacity, the need for more range th
110 Post contains images Ab345 : Totally agree Stitch. My comment was about the D.O.A. status of the 332 frame. Four frames don't make that much of a difference but again it's someth
111 Post contains images CrimsonChin : New Member here So the P&W link posted above, said "signing with a new customer" and press briefing, does anyone know who the new customer was?
112 Stitch : As the A330-300 comes closer to the performance of the early A330-200, customers who were buying the smaller plane because it alone had the range the
113 india1 : These 330s I posit are not new orders as such but a revealing of the Dec order for 4 units of the -200 version. At the time, I had linked a news repor
114 Post contains links queb : BOC Aviation http://www.pw.utc.com/Press/Story/20140212-0000/2014/All%20Categories
115 CrimsonChin : Thanks! Suspected it wasn't a new Airbus order as I've never heard of a situation where the engine OEM schedules the press conference.
116 Post contains links Heavierthanair : G´day Spring Airlines to order 30 A 320´ies, not yet a firm order but...... http://www.4-traders.com/KOREAN-AIR-...yes-3-billion-A320-order-17967317
117 Post contains links Heavierthanair : G´day Boeings turn now for a 737 order from Turkish / German Sun Express http://www.4-traders.com/THE-BOEING-...r-for-50-Boeing-aircraft-17967946/ Ch
118 Post contains links KarelXWB : The order includes 40 firm orders and 10 options and comprises 25 737-800 NG and 15 737-8 Max aircraft. Deliveries between 2015 and 2021. http://boei
119 StTim : Do we know if either of these orders are really new - or just declarations of the unnamed orders from last year?
120 Post contains links KarelXWB : It looks like a new order. There are no undisclosed customers listed with 15 737 Max on order. http://www.pdxlight.com/neomax.htm
121 Post contains links Heavierthanair : G´day A busy day today, Now its Kuwait Airlines firming 10 A350-900 and 15 A320neos http://www.4-traders.com/AIRBUS-GROU...ct-to-buy-25-Airbus-jets-1
122 KarelXWB : That was quick, only MoU-ed last December and now firmed already? You would expect it to take a bit longer due to government involvement.
123 Post contains images EPA001 : Maybe the government in Kuwait is highly efficient? . But this is good news indeed. .
124 Post contains links KarelXWB : Also worth noting the deal includes a second contract for the lease of seven A320s and five A330s. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...-lease-12/ar
125 Post contains images Ab345 : Karel what is the final number for A350 orders by model? I don't really trust wikipedia
126 KarelXWB : > A350-800: 46 > A350-900: 589 > A350-1000: 189 Total: 824
127 Post contains images Ab345 : Thank you very much for the immediate answer Would love to see them hitting 4 digits by the end of 2014
128 chiad : Me too! But I think it's a stretch, especially since I believe that the A330NEO will be launched and might nibble on the A350-800 backlog.
129 someone83 : Any info whether they be used or new builds?
130 Post contains images Ab345 : I believe some repeats will follow especially after EIS. For some reason I m holding out for NH. They have of course shown interest in the 777X but I
131 ZKCIF : How does Karel know the FINAL number? God online?
132 Post contains images Ab345 : From what I have seen from his posts he is always up-to-date and really knows his 'stuff' Anyone who knows best may correct any of us I presume also
133 Post contains images Stitch : Consider it the final number as of today, not of the program's life.
134 Post contains images Ab345 : Very properly stated Stitch So where are we up to now with Airbus and Boeing?
135 ZKCIF : don't be too serious. this just sounded so funny i could not resist
136 Post contains images Ab345 : Well you never know in here Anyway so where are we on orders numbers? I guess the Singapore show was a hit for Airbus? Boeing secured some MAX orders
137 KarelXWB : I don't expect the A350 backlog to shrink much, most operators will switch to the larger -900 instead. The A330-200 has less seats while the A330-300
138 Post contains images chiad : I dont expect the A350 backlog to shrink at all. I just dont expect it to grow by some 175 frames to hit 4 digits. But I would love if it did as well
139 Post contains links and images KarelXWB : Airbus officially confirms the Kuwait Airways order: http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pr...commitment-for-25-airbus-aircraft/ I still cannot believe
140 Post contains images EPA001 : Well, more proof than this is impossible I would say?
141 someone83 : Boeing's weekly update is showing the following as firmed this week Cargolux: 1 747-8F SunExpress: 25 737-800 & 15 737-8MAX Unidentified: 9 737s
142 Post contains links KarelXWB : Boeing changes since last update: 50 new orders (Cargolux Airlines one 747, SunExpress Airlines 40 737s and Unidentified Customer(s) nine 737s). In th
143 Post contains images Maersk737 : Someone seems to be quicker Cheers Peter
144 someone83 : Sounds like a NG to MAX conversion
145 Post contains links KarelXWB : Related to sales (and I don't think we should start a new thread for this), Airbus will increase A320 production to 46 per month in Q2 2016. http://ww
146 p201055r : If I recall correctly too, there was a pre-Singapore announcement by Boeing, reported on FG I think, of a substantial Indian sub-continent order (for
147 Post contains links KarelXWB : There was only 1 Boeing order announcement (an 737 commitment from Nok Air) during the air show: http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2014-02-...rder-737-MAXs
148 Post contains links mffoda : I believe you mean the Bloomberg article for SpiceJet? http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-0...-9-billion-of-boeing-max-jets.html
149 chiad : This might be an upcoming sale. As for now it's not an order, not even a commitment!
150 Post contains images astuteman : A Big MAX order eh? With fries, I trust Rgds
151 Hamlet69 : I believe we'll find that this IS, in fact, a firm order. But booked last year as Unidentified. Hamlet69
152 mffoda : Did I say or imply anywhere that it was an order or commitment? p201055r was asking about a "pre-Singapore announcement". I just pointed to the annou
153 Post contains links india1 : The 16 x USN P8s have been shown as booked by Boeing this week http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
154 astuteman : Perhaps I should restrict light hearted attempts at humour to the to the posts of posters more likely to find it humorous? If we've got any. I know i
155 Asiaflyer : Reuters reports China Eastern Airlines to order 70 A320neo. BEIJING, Feb 28 (Reuters) - China Eastern Airlines Corp Ltd 600115.SS 0670.HK said on Frid
156 Post contains images KarelXWB : It seems that production rate increase might have played a role here
157 Asiaflyer : Airbus have earlier stated that they are aiming for 60% of the NB market, counting only A320 and 737 sales. With Boeing planning for 45(?) per month,
158 Post contains links KarelXWB : The China Eastern order is most likely part of the 100 commitments announced in September last year. http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...airbus-chi
159 India1 : The Hyderabad Airshow is coming up & WSJ says Astuteman's "Big Max with fries" is going to be served with Indian Spice.
160 KarelXWB : It might be the revelation of one of the undisclosed orders Boeing booked last year. They still have lots of undisclosed orders in the order book.
161 India1 : Yes, likely. The article mentions Jet & Indigo orders as well, although the latter may not quite be ready in time
162 Post contains images chiad : Prah ha ha ha I must be just like your kids. Hmmm .. I sounded just like my wife. Maybe she's right after all?
163 Post contains images starbucks : Just been informed... KLM will receive 23 787-9 in a 276 seat config (9 less than the MD11 and right between the A332 & A333s) and (only ) 7 A350'
164 Post contains links KarelXWB : Yes, 15 are from the AF/KLM order of 25 + 8 lease from ILFC. It seems the cabin configuration has changed since last year, there was initially no men
165 frigatebird : Hmm, this was already known for a couple of weeks already. And don't worry, there will be more A350s for KL. When it will be time to decide on 772 re
166 DTW2HYD : I think Jet Airways will order 50 MAX next week. SpiceJet is still a wildcard, they are incurring huge losses, have large dues to airports and recent
167 Post contains images EPA001 : Though not a new order, that is my expectation as well. Will make a nice combination to see the B787 and the A350 operating side by side from AMS.
168 Post contains links KarelXWB : GECAS ordered 5 more 737 aircraft. http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm
169 Post contains images starbucks : Okay... Just heard today.. Hadn't read about it over here either..
170 Post contains links Ab345 : Regarging the A330 MRTT, I don't know if this belongs in this thread (even if it just a tweet confirmation) but it seems to be official: http://www.fl
171 Post contains links KarelXWB : Airbus February figures: > 20x A380 > 10x A350 > 78x A320 > 33 narrowbody cancellations Gross: 108 Net: 75 http://www.airbus.com/company/m
172 someone83 : Wasn't that booked in 2013 an UFO? Who is behind the cancellation?[Edited 2014-03-07 01:42:46]
173 India1 : Yes, their spreadsheet had a 4 frame -200 Undisclosed order booked on 19th Dec
174 KarelXWB : Ah yes, I forgot that one. According to Reuters, the cancellations are linked to airline restructurings in Indonesia and Serbia.
175 someone83 : In addition it was 8 737 UFOs this week as well
176 sirtoby : Mandala -25 A320 Air Serbia -8 A319
177 StTim : were these ceo's or neo's?
178 Post contains links and images KarelXWB : Airbus Defense confirmed the A330 order: http://www.airbusmilitary.com/PressC...T-Multi-Role-Tanker-Transport.aspx Thanks CEO's[Edited 2014-03-07 02:
179 JerseyFlyer : The statement says: "The aircraft will be delivered under the terms of a firm contract which has already been signed" Is this already booked as undis
180 Post contains links KarelXWB : There are undisclosed orders for a total of 7 unknown aircraft types in the military order book, I assume this Singapore order is included. http://ww
181 StTim : Do Airbus add these MRTT frames to the counts on the A330 family?
182 Stitch : I'm guessing 70 of those are A320-200neos for China Eastern.
183 astuteman : Kuwait with 15 and Vietjet with 63. China Eastern isn't in there yet Rgds
184 Stitch : The media announcements of the order were on 28 February so they should have been part of Airbus' February totals if the order was firmed then. Maybe
185 KarelXWB : There was also 1 conversion last month: Intrepid Aviation Group switched its last A330-200F on order to the passenger variant, bringing the A330-200F
186 Post contains links DTW2HYD : Apparently Airbus has a scheduled press meet at India Aviation 2014 on 3/13/14. http://www.india-aviation.in/ Haven't seen any official announcement o
187 KarelXWB : Most likely the A330 tanker contract.
188 Post contains links Stitch : Is that a done deal? This article from last month notes Airbus extended the bid deadline to July to allow for the upcoming Indian general election.
189 Post contains links KarelXWB : Airbus today said they are in final talks with India for 6 tankers. http://twitter.com/ReutersAero/status/441882446922268672 Of course, I could be wr
190 India1 : There have been afew recent press reports here that this will only be signed by the new Govt (ie post May), which is why, I think, Airbus have also e
191 JerseyFlyer : it will be interesting to see if RR receive an invitation to bid in view of bribery investigations in India
192 Post contains links KarelXWB : There will be several announcements during the show. http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pr...ntre-stage-at-india-aviation-2014/ What could it be, anot
193 India1 : Let's see, now - only Indigo & Go Air operate 32Xs. I can't imagine Jet or Spice ditching 737s and switching. Indigo has a boatload on order, so
194 Post contains links KarelXWB : Boeing reveals Spice Jet as customer behind one of the unidentified 737 Max orders last year. http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2014-03-...t-Announce-Order-
195 Post contains links KarelXWB : And it seems Jet Airways is behind the unidentified order for 50 737 Max aircraft. http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...boeing-india-idUSBREA2C0C120
196 Asiaflyer : According to Reuters, Saudi Gulf, which is a new Saudi Arabian airline, has placed a form order for 4 Airbus A320ceo aircrafts. PARIS, March 17 (Reute
197 Post contains links KarelXWB : Confirmed. http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/new...ders-four-airbus-a320ceo-aircraft/
198 Post contains links KarelXWB : South Africa's Comair orders eight 737 Max jets. http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...frica-boeing-idUSL6N0MG25320140319
199 sirtoby : The order was booked as "Unidentified" in December.
200 Post contains links and images KarelXWB : It also means Airbus lost its 100% market share in Africa http://www.pdxlight.com/neomax.htm
201 StTim : Africa actually becomes the second region based on this to favour the Max over the NEO.
202 Post contains images frigatebird : Even worse, it has been reduced by nearly 73%...
203 Post contains links KarelXWB : Boeing booked 71 new orders for the 737 family, including 40 for the MAX. http://active.boeing.com/commercial/orders/index.cfm http://twitter.com/Boei
204 Post contains links Stitch : And 8 of the 737 MAX 8 booked in December 2013 are going to Comair of South Africa. (Link courtesy of the Aircraft-Orders Google Group).
205 Post contains links and images KarelXWB : Boeing also issued a press release about it: http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2014-03-...-Announce-Order-for-Eight-737-MAXs [Edited 2014-03-20 11:57:07]
206 Post contains links starbucks : Haven't been following it, but I guess easyJet firmed their 135 Airbus order today...? http://www.atn.aero/article.pl?mcate...6D7C323434337C323031342D
207 KarelXWB : Odd, that easyJet order was firmed in July last year.
208 StTim : I know an awful lot of people who post here do not have English as a first language. The article uses the term commemorate which to me is obviously no
209 rotating14 : Any idea why a BA 737 MAX is in the press release?
210 Stitch : As StTim notes, it's just a PR event because Carolyn McCall was in France so they could schedule the Minister of Transport and CEO of Airbus to also b
211 Hamlet69 : My hunch is this is the Xiamen Air order. Because Comair operates as a BA franchise in South Africa. Regards, Hamlet69
212 Post contains links MaxiAir : Comair is operating for BA in South Africa, they fly in BA-colors for several years now, since some months the -800's as well. e.g.: http://www.airli
213 Post contains images scbriml : Because Comair is a BA franchise airline, they've operated planes in BA colours for years.
214 Post contains images EPA001 : Ah, I did not know that. Thanks for the info.
215 Post contains links KarelXWB : Tigerair orders 37 A320neo aircraft. http://www.tigerair.com/news/TH_2014...rm_Fleet_Renewal_And_Expansion.pdf
216 Post contains images EPA001 : Very nice news for Airbus and P&W.
217 Post contains links KarelXWB : Apparently it's a MoU, not a firm order yet. http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pr...igerair-to-order-up-to-50-a320neo/
218 Post contains links KarelXWB : China Aviation Supplies Holding Company orders 27 A330s and 43 A320s. http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/new...their-partnership-into-the-future/ I wond
219 sirtoby : No, they orderes 70 A320neo.
220 Post contains links KarelXWB : > ANA Holdings orders 20 777-9X, 6 777-300ER, 14 787-9, 7 A320neo and 23 A321neo aircraft > Japan Transocean Air orders 12 737-800 NG aircraft h
221 Post contains links LTH : Air Canada finalized their order for 61 Boeing 737MAX. They've selected 33 MAX 8 and 28 MAX 9 plus 18 options and 30 rights to purchase. Now over 1,90
222 Post contains images KarelXWB : That's a significant amount for the -9, something this model could use
223 LTH : Is the Air Canada order the one Boeing booked as "unidentified customer" on May, 21st for 61 Boeing 737MAX?
224 chiad : 1908 if I've counted correct. As there is another 2.5 year before EIS could there be another 1000 frames added to the backlog before that? Passing 25
225 Post contains links travelhound : http://www.boeingblogs.com/randy/ Has Randy made a mistake here? Looks like he is only counting the A320NEO
226 KarelXWB : It's a marketing twist I presume.[Edited 2014-04-02 01:01:00]
227 moo : Note his use of very selective weasel words "since its first order" - basically he's discounting any NEO ordered before the MAX came on the market, b
228 StTim : Very marketing and very misleading from Randy. Typical salesman.
229 travelhound : That doesn't work either. Boeing's first order was in Dec 2011. Airbus had already sold 1000 NEO's by that time.
230 Post contains links KarelXWB : The aeroturbopower blog made an article about it: http://aeroturbopower.blogspot.com/2014/04/everyones-winner-baby.html
231 StTim : If you look at the sales rate per day since first order then the neo programme is still comfortably ahead of the MAX.
232 Post contains images chiad : The Average firm orders per day since launch: NEO: 2.24 vs MAX: 1.89 That being said ... what awesome backlogs. IMHO when backlogs become so large th
233 StTim : I agree - the backlogs are so huge that normal business practice would be to build more delivery capability. BUT in this industry that is very expensi
234 PW100 : Gotta love this quote . . . : PW100
235 mffoda : Randy also mentions a total 281 MAX 9's orders. According to the "PDXlight" website, there are 212 -9's listed. While everyone knows that Lion Air an
236 Post contains links KarelXWB : Boeing launches BBJ MAX with an order for a MAX 8 private jet from an unidentified existing BBJ customer. http://twitter.com/ReutersAero/status/451374
237 LTH : Boeings O&D site lists 1,934 Boeing 737 MAX orders in total through March 2014. 86 of them just last week. -> https://twitter.com/BoeingAirplan
238 Someone83 : In addition to the Air Canada Max order, Boeing also list 25 737 Ufo orders, and 28 cancellations. Are these more NG to Max conversions?
239 KarelXWB : It seems that way.
240 Post contains images mffoda : For anyone that's following neo/MAX race... The recent MAX orders bring's the Boeing total to 2010 for Firm and MoU A/C. Behind Airbus by 885 A/C. A b
241 chiad : I cannot ever recall that anyone suggested that the MAX wouldn't be highly successful. Seriously... Maybe it wasn't foreseen that it would have 2000
242 astuteman : I'd be surprised if there wasn't. You mean like those that posited that Airbus might not be capable of re-engining the A320 because they'd never done
243 Ab345 : I prefer to count all of the possible scenarios for both frames. Adding Firm+MoU+Options for both the number is 3975 (57%) A320neo 2927 (43%) 737Max (
244 Post contains images travelhound : This is a very good point. For Boeing to equal Airbus's NEO sales with the MAX, Boeing would have to be selling slots two years beyond where Airbus a
245 CrimsonChin : Ah I remember those days when people would balk at the idea of counting firm orders and MOUs together, seems to be more accepted now though, since Boe
246 Post contains links KarelXWB : Airbus booked 40 gross orders in March, including 28 A330, 8 A321neo and 4 A320ceo aircraft. http://www.airbus.com/company/market/orders-deliveries/ A
247 StTim : The long lingering death of the -800 continues. Good bookings for the 330 though!
248 KarelXWB : This cascading effect for the last 6 months cannot be a coincidence.
249 India1 : It's APF (Aircraft Purchase Fleet) which cancelled their 358 orders. Someone here had identified them as being next on the cancellation list... so we'
250 StTim : It is getting to the tipping point where it is obviously uneconomic to create the sub type. I suspect Farnborough will see the creation of the 330NEO
251 KarelXWB : I do not believe airlines are suddenly converting or canceling their orders because others are doing the same. Obviously Airbus is pushing their custo
252 Someone83 : Was these the one destined or planend for Alitalia?
253 KarelXWB : Correct.
254 StTim : Oh - I agree Airbus is behind this. Obviously they are happier if all convert to the -900 but some cancellations could come back as 330NEO orders - on
255 Ab345 : It's basically a "best case scenario" for both frames. MoU are more or less going to be fulfilled I think and the options that are in big numbers are
256 Stitch : They were on my list of customers who would not take the plane. That point has already been met considering AWAS is believed to have already converte
257 Post contains links KarelXWB : Yes the airline is struggling. http://www.aerotelegraph.com/flugzeu...von-yemenia-in-paris-beschlagnahmt ILFC seized one of their A330s due to financ
258 JerseyFlyer : Assuming these were for Alitalia the impending sale to Etihad may be of relevance. But irrespective of the reason it all points to the demise of the
259 KarelXWB : A few more changes in the order book: > Philippine Airlines canceled 5 A330s (probably converted them in to those 8 A321neo's) > Hong Kong Airl
260 goosebayguy : One of the current problems is the supply chain which is working flat out to meet demand. Its at breaking point and desperate to invest further but g
261 KarelXWB : And still, Boeing and Airbus will push the output even further. In just a few years from today, output will rise to 46/47 jets per month (up from 42
262 mffoda : This is a very interesting point. Airbus has had a higher monthly production rate on the A320 then the 737 for some time now. Recently Airbus officia
263 travelhound : If we have a look at what is happening in SE Asia at the moment and the amount of orders the LCC's have for both the NEO and MAX, at some point of ti
264 KarelXWB : Transition to the new generation aircraft will take several years. Deliveries for the current generation A320 will continue until late 2018 while Boe
265 Post contains links and images wilco737 : Part 2 now available. Link again to part 1: Airbus And Boeing Orders - 2014 - Part 2 (by wilco737 Apr 6 2014 in Civil Aviation) Thanks. wilco737
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