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Is Lufthansa Bidding For Ansett Australia?  
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9221 posts, RR: 14
Posted (13 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 2096 times:

In the past, I have heard that Lufthansa is interested in taking a stake in Ansett Australia. Can anyone confirm this?

Also, did you submit their bid? If not, will they?

14 replies: All unread, jump to last
User currently offlineNdebele From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 2903 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (13 years 4 months 7 hours ago) and read 2042 times:

I would rather see LH bidding for SN!

Who needs an Australian partner airline with a hub at SYD, when LH doesn't even fly to Australia? LH used to fly to SYD, first with 747, later with 763, but even that was too large equipment. Traffic from Germany to Australia doesn't seem to be that much. Buying SN and creating a third middle-european hub (after FRA and MUC) seems more sensible to me. Anyways, thinking about the current situation, I don't think LH will buy either Ansett nore Sabena.

User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 30
Reply 2, posted (13 years 4 months 4 hours ago) and read 2018 times:

Good morning!
Where did you two read about Ansett and/or Sabena??
Sabena is highly unlikely, as Bruxelles is definitely not the place where LH would create a third hub, simply because it is not in Germany: No I am not trying to be nationalistic, but it there are several reasons:
1. It is a question of international aviation law, LH would not be protected by Belgian government authorities.
2. True, Sabena would be cheap to buy, probably not more than one symbolic Euro, but the real price would be existing debt and the cash needs of Sabena. That is a problem for LH, too currently, and German government has said on Sunday that it will not help to cover terrorist incident insurance in the long run, meaning the next fare increases are due before Christmas (just what we needed, goddammit)
3. Sabena is not and never was part of Star Alliance and as far as I know, never tried to be, so there would be no reason for LH to be Sabena's "white knight".
4. What other assets of Sabena wouzld be of interest for LH? None, at least none that I can think of.

Ansett: True, LH does not fly to Australia. There is no need, you can go there by Star Alliance companies. That has been LH's strategy since years: Code-sharing with partner carriers, not competition to the end (and it pays!!!), thereby leaving any vanities behind (as a "good" airline you have to go everywhere around the world: Sounds good, but Bullshit all the way).
Yet it is not impossible to bid for Ansett, (though certainly not alone) in order to help Ansett go on.
The reason would be to secure Star Alliance's grip on the pacific rim, if it is deemed necessary. LH has done that a few times (remember Air Canada's fight for Canadian Airlines, hostile takeover bids, by AA, if I remember correctly).
But remember: to buy shares in another carrier not coming from a German-speaking region (which is regarded by LH as its domestic market, remember Lauda, Austrian, Eurowings)is basically not LH's strategy, they prefer to go for alliances, and were much happier with that strategy in the 90s.


PS: If you have any official sources, please let me know a.s.a.p. Thanks!
PPS: Ndebele: When did LH fly the 767-300? I only remember Condor flying that aircraft.

I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineLH744 From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 302 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (13 years 4 months 4 hours ago) and read 2023 times:

Hi Andreas,

LH replaced the 747 with extra repainted B767-330ER registered D-ABUC on the route FRA-BKK-SYD from March 1994 until (I think) October 1994. After that services from Germany to Australia were stopped and passengers were booked on code-sharing flights of Thai International and United Airlines.


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User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 30
Reply 4, posted (13 years 4 months 3 hours ago) and read 2005 times:

Much appreciated!
The picture was obviously taken in Frankfurt Rhein-Main with the aircraft coming out of the B-Terminal Bay.

I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineNdebele From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 2903 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (13 years 4 months 1 hour ago) and read 1985 times:

Andreas, I never said LH would be interested in SN. All I said was, that I *personally* would prefer to see LH buying SN instead of AN. SN seems more sensible to *me*. Because SN is the best airline ever, *imho* of course.

User currently offlineKRP From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (13 years 4 months 1 hour ago) and read 1977 times:

LH now flies codeshare flights with SQ to OZ/NZ

When I last flew Sq SINAKL it was a codeshared SQ/NZ/LH flight

Home PERSIN it was codeshared SQANLH

God only knows why LH subjects their pax to the SQ substandard service (IMHO)?

User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 30
Reply 7, posted (13 years 4 months ago) and read 1967 times:

KRP: Are you sure you actually mean Singapore Airlines by SQ??? Must be, as SQ is short for SingAir. Substandard service???? What did they do to you? You must be the only person in this Universe that puts SingAir's service below that of LH *LLLoooLLL*
Cool, why not, just please please please tell me, why!?!

Ndebele: I did not imply you want LH to take over Sabena (who in his right mind would want to do that), I just wanted to point out, that it is not that easy to create a new hub in Belgium for the German Flag Carrier.
btw: How is the weather in Stuttgart? (My parents live close to the airport)

Best wishes!

I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineJohnnybgoode From Germany, joined Jan 2001, 2187 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1943 times:

about official sources regarding rumours that LH might be interested in AN, i´ve come across several news magazine articles on the net which indicated that LH might be among the parties interested in AN.
however, that is some days ago and i don´t have the links anymore, but i came across these via the airliners-net news section.

and by the way, about two months ago i also read a small article which indicated that LH could be possibly interested in SN. again, that´s quite some time ago and things have changed significantly (SR going down) since then.
i do agree that wouldn´t seem to make such sense, especially in such difficult times.


If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
User currently offlineVermeer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 447 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 1938 times:

Before code sharing with SQ on the Aussie Route they were booking apssengers on NG ( Lauda).
I flew several times on their 767's with a full LH ticket from Vienna first through Singapore and then through Kuala Lumpur, this before they started serving the route with the 777.


User currently offlineKRP From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 1930 times:

Yes I am fully aware that SQ means Singapore Airlines.
I had the distinct misfortune of flying them FRA Sin AKl and PER Sin FRA.
Being Scandinavian yourself you kmost likely know PremitiveAir (DK) - well they are miles better that SQ which says alot as Dk are the lowest of the lowest in the scandinavian market.
Anyway: SQ to me equates: misserable crew who litteraly throw food at you - officially you have a choice, but three rows along there service they "unfortunately only have the chicken left! (I dont mind chicken - but dont try to pretend there is a choise when there is none!) No choice of beer - one brand only. Scruffy looking stewards - female crew who obvoiusly were there for looks and nothing else - those dresses must be a hazard in a emergency! The planes were filthy inside and out (except a new 777 from Per) Caothic boarding at both FRa and SIN, no legroom due to the dammed PTV - that did not workson most channels and showed B-film on the ones that did.
Toilets that went US after 5 hours flight on a FULL flight from SIN to FRA. I felt sooooooo sorry for the pax that had to continue on that plane to NYC

Sorry Andreas but after 4 horrible flights I can only say NEVER EVER SQ AGAIN! I´d rather walk!

User currently offlineSkystar From Australia, joined Jan 2000, 1363 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 1915 times:


I suggest that you are quite an isolated case. Certainly in Y, there is no comparison between LH and SQ - anyone who thinks LH has good legroom in Y obviously has very short legs.

Your statement, " Scruffy looking stewards - female crew who obvoiusly were there for looks" is a bit odd? The crew are good looking ("for the looks") but looke "scruffy"?

SQ may not be perfect, but LH is hardly better.



User currently offlineThe Coachman From Australia, joined Apr 2001, 1434 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1907 times:


Please qualify your statement that traffic from Germany to Australia isn't much.

QF -

4 x weekly SYD-FRA
3 x weekly MEL-FRA

which constitutes daily Australia-Germany direct service
(stopovers are in BKK or SIN).


The Coachman

M88, 722, 732, 733, 734, 73G, 73H, 742, 743, 744, 752, 762, 763, 772, 773, 77W, 320, 332, 333, 345, 388, DH8, SF3 - want
User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 30
Reply 13, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 1867 times:

Sorry to hear that, it is just so that it doesn't sound like their usual self. I flew SQ on Inner-Asian services; it was ok, lovely girls but nothing unusual. I like their new Business Class(well not so new anymore), nice colours, but in the end I prefer a flight to be on time, it beats good service anytime. To judge SQ's punctuality, I am not qualified, but I didn't hear anything negative.

Your posting shows quite effectively, that any opinions on the good service of a Company should be read as opinions, nothing more. This goes to all the guys from the thread covering LH's service and the friendliness of their pilots.

Thanks for telling me!

btw: I am not Scandinavian, but German! Unfortunately I have never heard about PremitiveAir, but it sure sound great!

I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineGodbless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2753 posts, RR: 16
Reply 14, posted (13 years 3 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1860 times:

I guess LH doesn't care so much about what is going on "down under" now but they will probably take a closer look on europe now. As it has predicted many years ago that europe will be left with 3 big ones (LH, AF and BA) and now is the time where the 3 can take their picks since those are the ones that can survive longest since they have the cash... Unless they take SR as an example...

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