Flying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4137 posts, RR: 38 Posted (12 years 1 month 5 hours ago) and read 1854 times:
Lufthansa will add three weekly frequencies from Munich to Hong Kong to a total of 6, beginning effective Dec 3rd. In March they will add 3 more flights to Shanghai. They are currently awaiting approval for additional flights.
Seems that the German flag-carrier wants to expand heavily in Munich. any other flights to be added from there? What about long-hauls to India? Did they get approval for additional frequencies?
LH744 From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 302 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (12 years 1 month 4 hours ago) and read 1686 times:
These are old news. You only forgot the new MUC-JNB run 3 times a week effective September.
Hkgspotter1 is right, Hongkong goes daily effective December 2nd.
No additions planned on the Singapore run.
No additional traffic to India allowed as long as state carrier Air India doesn´t start a second destination and they even haven´t got one in Germany right now sending all pax on code-share flights!
Johnnybgoode From Germany, joined Jan 2001, 2187 posts, RR: 7 Reply 8, posted (12 years 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 1542 times:
afaik, there hasn´t been an official announcement that LH is definitively suspending MUC-SIN. however, they made it public that MUC-SIN is currently under consideration to be dropped.
regarding the flights to India:
Lufthansa was allowed to add three weekly frequencies this year which it did when it added Bangalore. i believe under the current arrangement with Air India/indian authorities Lufthansa will be given 3-4 additional frequencies this year or 2003.
if these frequencies will be used for flights from MUC remains to be seen, but according to some LH statements flights from MUC to india are on the agenda.
If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
OdiE From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1641 posts, RR: 1 Reply 9, posted (12 years 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 1537 times:
I know this is a bit off the topic, but is Lufthansa planning to reinstate their direct flights into Kuala Lumpur any time soon? Their Star Alliance partner, Lauda Air is doing pretty well on the Vienna-Kuala Lumpur-Sydney/Melbourne run. It's hard to get seats even in the low season! With Swissair suspending their flghts into Kuala Lumpur, there's only 2 European carriers operating into Kuala Lumpur, i.e. Lauda Air and KLM. So, I believe there's room for more. Any info, Lufthansa fans out there?
LH744 From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 302 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (12 years 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1494 times:
Kuala Lumpur was axed because it didn´t make profit. Nothing is planned yet but time will show if there´s an increasing demand now that Swissair´s gone. I heard that on Lauda´s planes the seats are full just because of the plane going on to Australia!!
There are definitely no flights planned to Montreal. LH doesn´t serve Montreal at all. They stopped operating into Montreal back in the Mid-nineties because they couldn´t make profit even using the really small A310-300 on that run. And nowadays the business is done by Star Alliance partner Air Canada!
Right at the moment nonstop flights on LH from MUC to SIN are still bookable throughout all the relevant systems until June. So no confirmation on that yet.
But past experiences show that cutting off flights out of the system and rebooking of the passengers via FRA is a quick job. Time will tell!!
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31778 posts, RR: 73 Reply 16, posted (12 years 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1444 times:
AC or LH will not be starting up YUL-MUC flights, especially considering YYZ-MUC is suspended (not discontinued). Assuming traffic builds up, I do think the resumption of MUC-LAX/EWR/YYZ/SFO flights will come in the summer, and MUC-MIA (assuming Austrian does not resume the flight), which was supposed to come pre-9/11 as a daily A340 during summer 2002.
FLYYUL From Italy, joined Jun 2000, 4949 posts, RR: 52 Reply 17, posted (12 years 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 1436 times:
Ok, I was well aware of the YUL-FRA and not YUL-MUC A330....At the montreal airport enthusiast chat, we have confirmation of a Montreal-Munich possibility...but this was two months for sept11th when none of these routes were cut, including YYZ-MUC!
Furthermore, a few users were saying how they read in german aviation jounrals about an AC/LH interest in starting Montreal-Munich flights given the substantial success of the YYZ-MUC flights....check the archives of this board, and you fill such a post!
But given the cuts, there are more important route to resume and add from MUC, no doubt!!
D-AIFB From Germany, joined Feb 2001, 121 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (12 years 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 1427 times:
All cancelled longhaul flights ex MUC are only temporary suspended flights until the current situation improves again. This was recently confirmed by J. Weber (LH CEO) and R. Teckentrup (LH route managment).
LH wants to keep all their remaining systemwide l/h destinations. It makes more sence to concentrate on one hub than to split operations between FRA and MUC. In MUC they have cut now all former three weekly services (SFO, LAX, GRU, SIN). The alternative would have been axing three flights from the FRA operation (to SFO, LAX, GRU, SIN), leaving e.g. three flights ex MUC and four ex FRA. This would be absolutely nonsense.
Furthermore LH´s FRA hub system is depending on longhaul flights, while the MUC hub is still mainly based on european flights. Axing much more longh. runs ex FRA would extremly weaken the hub&spoke system there. In FRA over 60% of LH pax are transfer pax (additional with a high percentage on intercontinental flights) while LH´s MUC operation has got only about 40% connecting passengers (mainly within Europe).
WINTER TIMETABLE 01/02
MUC-HKG from trice weekly to daily in December
MUC-JNB new trice weekly service from December
MUC-PVG new trice weekly service postponed until April02
MUC-SIN will be suspended January 15th until end of March (new summer timetable) so far. LH didn´t give an official statement about this, as they´ve already indicated the suspension few weeks ago.
already announced suspensions:
LAX, SFO, EWR and GRU (all LH), MIA(NG) and YYZ(AC, but will return in spring)
SUMMER TIMETABLE 2002
At this time, talking about the 2002 summer timetable is only spectulation, as it depends completely from increasing bookings and yields for the next summer.
The maximum(!) of longhaul ops in MUC next summer would be:
daily to EWR, ORD, SFO, LAX, HKG
new daily services to Tokyo NRT, BOS and MIA
3/week to GRU, SIN and new PVG
(2/week to TLV)
JNB is a winter-only service at the moment
alle flights with A343, exept SFO (B744)
In the above case, about 10 A343 would be based in MUC (compared with 5 last summer) plus one additional B744 (2 last summer), which will be operated on a combined FRA service (FRA-SFO-MUC-SFO-FRA).
But of course, there´s a good chance that we don´t see all of the above flights next summer. NRT and BOS as new destinations seem to be quite sure - but not confirmed (!), while both LAX and MIA don´t seem to be on the list at the moment. But that doesn´t mean to much at the moment, as the LH network is permanently unter review.
UA plans at least to put the 777 on IAD-MUC again next spring. AC will reinstate their YYZ-MUC route in April. AC also planned YUL-MUC for next summer - i doubt (but i don´t have new post-sep11-information at the moment) whether this service will be introduced in this situation. That would be a bit too optimistic - i would bet on summer 2003. I also didn´t notice even one single hint here about LH planning to fly MUC-YUL itself. If LH intends to fly this route, then they would introduce it from FRA first off all. But in my opinion this routes (YUL-FRA/MUC) will be AC´s job for the foreseeable future.
Finally i want to say, LH invests about 500 million Euros in the new 25mio pax Star Alliance Terminal 2 at Munich Airport (providing 24 a/c stands at the terminal and add. 50 on the tarmac), which will be completed in early or mid 2003. There are also planned some further expansions (2-3 satellites, each for 24-32 additional a/c stands) bringing capacity theoretically to much more than 50mio pax - only for LH and Star Alliance. So, if LH wants to see a return of its massive investment - and they definitely want to - , LH has to stick to MUC and the planned expansion there. It was actually a very smart move of MUC-airport CEO W. Hermsen to participate LH in the current airport expansion.
Another point is the lack of runway-capacity at FRA. Although there are few slots now available due to the traffic turndown, the possible growth beyond 2003 is tending towards zero in terms of a/c movements until the planned 4th runway will be opened in 2006 or later.
Despite the current crisis, we´ll see an impressive longhaul network out of MUC within the next years to come, flown mainly by LH and its Star partners, beside a huge and high-frequent european network. AC comes back, RG will also return again sometime from 2003 on, UA and TG will expand, SQ, Air China CA and All Nippon NH will be newcomers in the future.
No doubt, there´s a chance of delaying or slowing down the planned expansion for a half year or a year, but it´ll come sooner or later ... definitely!
Johnnybgoode From Germany, joined Jan 2001, 2187 posts, RR: 7 Reply 22, posted (12 years 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 1365 times:
i would kindly ask you to provide any sources for your repeated statement that LH is interested in going daily on MUC-MIA and using its own A340s?
i agree with your opinion which you repeatedly stated on so many other topics that the current market between MIA and Germany seems to be underserved, and that the daily FRA-MIA seems to little.
i would love to see LH add flights on this route, or NG keeping up this operation, but i think we can assume that we won´t see any OS-aircraft scheduled on this route (as substitution, yes).
except for official statements by LH regarding flights from MUC to India, Japan and BOS there has been zero word about the MIA services (except for the currently withdrawal). so perhaps you´re aware of some facts we don´t know of?????? please enlight us!!!
although i agree that it seems the current suspensions of LH´s north american services from MUC most probably resume next summer, i´m wondering why LH would only schedule the 744 on the SFO run, not also on LAX. is there a piece of information i obviously missed?
some LH officials have stated that LH is interested in BOS ("it would fit our future plans") and in Japanese destinations, however, i personally don´t believe we´ll see any new interconts from MUC next year, except for the re-instatements.
regarding future flights to Japan, and from MUC in particular, there is a small piece i came across last week, and it´s taken from the english edition of the Handelsblatt: "The paper added Lufthansa is planning to cut capacity in Japan, where it said only about 50% of capacity is utilised."
so for the time being, i´d be surprised if LH would increase its services.
i know that an increase in frequencies for NGO (going daily) was/is on the cards, but things seem a little wary now.
does anyone if LH will print an additional hardcopy edition of its current timetable???
the current ones rely on data from the 9th of Sept, needless to say it´s not up-to-date...
If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31778 posts, RR: 73 Reply 24, posted (12 years 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 1356 times:
Johnny, look at D-AFIB's post. He states the strong possibilities, and I think it will happen. Miami has 9 flights a week to Germany right now (daily MIA-FRA, Friday MIA-DUS, Saturday FLL-FRA), which is pretty pathetic considering the Germans flock to Miami in groves and when you look at some other countries (28 flights a week to UK, 21 to each France and Spain). LH has flown the MIA-MUC route in the past, and did codeshare with Lauda/Austrian on the MIA-MUC route that they recently suspended. If OS does not resume the route, I would be surprised if LH didn't. Trans-Atlantic traffic at MIA, is, luckily, not declining as much as other airports. Lufthansa 744s are still leaving MIA at near capacity everyday. Also, did LH officially state plans for MUC-BOS/NRT? If so, were?
25 RoyalDutch: I don't know about new flights out of MUC, but If I were LH, I would use that airport as much as I could...It's awesome! (I was really bummed that I g
26 Johnnybgoode: MAH, it seems that i didn´t make it clear enough that i don´t disagree with the fact that the MIA-Germany market seems a little underserved, but wit
27 MAH4546: Johnny, I'm sorry if I made it seem that way, but I know you see the MIA-Germany market as underserved. I will disagree with you on the leisure thing,
28 Andie007: Sure! Everytime I've flown Lauda on MUC-MIA route it was always full. BIZ and ECO sold out! At Munich they always searched passengers that fly via ORD
29 Flying-Tiger: This is what justplanes reports today: Lufthansa is considering a serious expansion of its Munich Hub for the coming summer season. The plan calls for
30 Johnnybgoode: i would love to see this happen!!!!! i´m just curious regarding the NRT and BOS services, if that´s also swapping the 2nd daily from FRA to MUC. i w
31 D-AIFB: If you compare the justplanes.com infos with my informations in the post above, you´ll see, that´s almost the same. Justplanes didn´t mention the n
32 Billy: I do not know if it was mentioned in the above posts, but the JNB will actually be operating six flights per week from December 15th of this year. The
33 Johnnybgoode: very interesting news D-AIFB, thanks a lot. i was also thinking about the LAX thing. afaik, except for LH there is no airline serving FRA-LAX? is this
34 D-AIFB: LH makes further adjustments in its current winter timetable: Japan / Singapore As already mentioned before, LH suspended 5 weekly flights from FRA to
35 Flying-Tiger: It is impressive to hear how LH wants to expand in the next months, especially from MUC. SR´s problems might have contributed a bit but obviously mos
36 Johnnybgoode: oh yes, how big MUC gets!!! in a very extensive topic this April we were already discussing MUC´s future growth and in it i quoted official LH statem
37 Andie007: Today I've read in the "Frankfurter Allegmeine" at Munich Airport (before my flight to Duesseldorf) that Lufthansa is investing $750 Millions DM in th