For the record the two Ex BA 747-200's that came to Hong Kong for cargo conversion, G-BDXP and G-BDXM are still here.
G-BDXP arrived in February and is still parked all white at HAECO as TF-ATZ and G-BDXM arrived in June and is now all white with no reg or engines.
Have Air Atlanta changed their minds about getting these tow aircraft ??. Another BA 742 was due in about two months ago but at the last moment the flight was cancelled and we never heard about it again.
One question I have is who is paying for these two 747's to sit in Hong Kong ??
If any of you can give some answers then please do.
Ceilidh From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 1, posted (11 years 7 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3093 times:
Not only have Air Atlanta not changed their minds about the two aircraft at HKG but they are actually buying additional ex BA aircraft - one of my colleagues has been busy over the last few months writing their manuals. The reason that no work has progressed on the ones at HKG is that with the downturn in the cargo market, it's cheaper for them to park the aircraft 'as is' rather than park them after spending millions on the conversion.
Hkgspotter1 From Hong Kong, joined Nov 2005, 0 posts, RR: 1 Reply 2, posted (11 years 7 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3055 times:
For your info Hong Kong is a very bad place to store aircraft, its right next to the ocean, its very humid and bloody expensive. It would make far more sense to move these un wanted aircraft to the US for storage.
It may be `rather logical' for you but the rest of us are not aviation experts that have operated their own aircraft and plan to have a fleet of 767' !!!
Ceilidh From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (11 years 7 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2915 times:
Hkgspotter1 - indeed so; and that's why you're an aircraft spotter and I've run airlines. Still, logic is logic - and you'll be interested to know that they are paying zip for the parking (because the aircraft are in the care of Haeco and Haeco doesn't want to lose the work when CC finally press the 'go' button) and you'll have noticed that the aircraft have - as is shown in the list provided by ILS been deregisterd. This means that they cannot now be ferried without first having a CofA - which is slightly difficult to get when the aircraft is in bits.
As for using old aircraft - let me put it this way. If you were running an airline, would you prefer to have new aircraft that cost you gazillions whether or not you fly them; or old ones that are fully amortised? With the price of fuel sinking like a stone, the operational cost benefits outweigh the disadvantages as well.
FYI, the only reason BA and Virgin parked their Classics was because the lessors refused to take back the expensive new kit - and fleet cuts had to be made. The cheapest aircraft to park were those which had been fully amortised.
Once again, all rather logical really!
Oh, and Coyoteguy - get your facts straight. Although we'd have acquired the entire Delta L1011 package of some 30 aircraft, only 7 would have been returned to service immediately. And what's wrong with Prestwick? It's been Scotland's transatlantic gateway for decades longer than Glasgow - and has a substantially longer runway.
Incidentally, G-BJXN (certainly) plus I think G-BLVE, G-BLVF and G-BMGS - were all acquired by BA when they bought BCal.
Charliecossie From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 467 posts, RR: 10 Reply 12, posted (11 years 7 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2897 times:
Only JXN was ex-BCal. MGS (Must Go Sick) was the British Airtours heap. LVE/F I dunno but weren't BCal (or Gatwick based).
The list above also contains two a/c that BA never even saw, the two cargo a/c that went directly to MAS.
Ceilidh From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (11 years 7 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2881 times:
Hkgspotter1 - You mentioned 767s, not me.
Actually, through one of my colleagues that's doing some work for CC - as previously mentioned - I can confirm that they are indeed in bits. Might not seem like it to a reggie spotter like you, but you definitely can't just start up those aircraft and go!
Coyoteguy From Mexico, joined Oct 2001, 432 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (11 years 7 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 2855 times:
Can you believe Ceilidh: "That is why you are a spotter and I have run airlines"... what cloud does this guy live in?
As for Prestwick, I believe, using my very small amount of aviation knowledge, that the reason it was Scotland's transatlantic gateway for decades is because the government decreed that it would be; not because anyone actually wanted to fly from there. What is wrong with Prestwick? Like I said, it is in the middle of nowhere. Quite logical, actually!
As I am just a spotter and you have run airlines (ROTFLMAO), I'm sure I'm wrong... but I'll believe what you say the day I see even seven L1011s in Caledonian Wings liveries operating from the middle of nowhere. Until then, you are just so much hot air as far as I am concerned.
Ceilidh From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (11 years 7 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2835 times:
Coyoteguy - "very small amount" of aviation knowledge is about right. Sure, PIK was the mandated gateway; but it's also the only non-military airport in Scotland with a runway long enough to allow widebodies to operate at MTOW - permitting non stop services to the West Coast of North America. It's also the primary weather diversion airport for much of Western Europe - when the rest of Europe is fogged in, you can guarantee PIK will be open.
As for your claim it's in the middle of nowhere - actually, it's situated in Ayrshire, in the centre of the southwest of Scotland. Glasgow is a 40 minute rail ride away - and one heck of a lot easier and faster to get to from the centre of town than say MIA is from downtown Miami; I've done both many times. PIK is also readily accessible from Edinburgh.
Yes, I've run a number of airlines, with aircraft ranging in size from the Let 410 up to B707/DC8/CL44.
You certainly won't see any aircraft in Caledonian Wings livery - that was just a project name - but I'm pretty confident that you may well be eating your words shortly. And we all know how accurate journalists are when it comes to aviation matters!
David_itl From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 7168 posts, RR: 14 Reply 18, posted (11 years 7 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2825 times:
It's also the primary weather diversion airport for much of Western Europe
What planet are you on? So if weather clogs up VIE, all the little Tyrolean Cl65s ignore other Austrian and German airports and make a beeline for PIK?
Or do you mean the long-haul flights? If so, I reckon MAN has just as good a shout as PIK as the "home" of diverted aircraft with 8th Feb 92 being a classic example when 19 747s, 2 DC10s, 1 A310, 1 707 and 1 Tu154 came in from the London aiports (all the 747s being on the ground at the same time). I noted a total of 30 widebodied aircraft during the 90 minutes I was at MAN.
Skymonster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (11 years 7 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2798 times:
What amazes me about these forums is how many contributors who've never worked in the industry seem to think they know better than the airlines themselves, and the people who have or do work in the industry. The future for the industry must surely be bright, because there's so many people here who know how to run things there'll be no shortage of wisdom at the top of airlines globally in the coming years
In actual fact, if you've been "inside", it really doesn't take too long to figure out who's at least making a modicum of sense and who's obviously just shooting from the hip.
Its all too easy in the airline game to get a "bad" name (or to be perceived so) just because one or two plans don't fall into place - if the contributors here knew of every potential deal the was in the offing in the industry, a fair proportion of which don't come off, there'd be a huge number of well know industry names (respected and not so respected) who'd be being regarded with ridicule on this forum.
Coyoteguy From Mexico, joined Oct 2001, 432 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (11 years 7 months 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2780 times:
Sorry Ceilidh, I'm not familiar with your illustrious career to date, but since you have run a number of airlines, pray tell us what happened to them all?
So, Caledonian Wings was just a project name? Not according to your website, which is still trumpeting the commencement of operations early next year, using three L1011s. First rule of commerce nowadays; an accurate and up to date website.
Sure, I'll eat my words when I see it. I might even try eating one of your tristars!
Have a great day - let me know what airline you run today.
Coyoteguy From Mexico, joined Oct 2001, 432 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (11 years 7 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2754 times:
Not taking him on, as actually I don't give a **** about him or his inflated opinions... And I find his "I'm a big airline CEO and know everything" attitude to be quite laughable. Check his website. You will see what I mean!
25 Ceilidh: Actually, Coyoteguy - I most certainly do not have an "I'm a big airline CEO and know everything" attitude as you claim. Indeed, quite the opposite. G
26 David_itl: I wonder if "reggie spotter" Sir Michael Bishop is lurking on these forums! David/MAN. ps Yes, I'm a "reggie spotter" who has been to MAN precisely 3
27 Coyoteguy: Yes, Ceilidh, you are spot on. I am ridiculing you! Finally we agree on something! And any true "industry insider" should have better things to do tha
28 EGFF: Ok...If your on about the aircraft in Cardiff (EGFF) are in bits you are absolutely wrong! Hence the name, im a local spotter to Cardiff and i can tel
29 Ceilidh: EGFF - I'm talking about the ones at HKG destined for Air Atlanta. Not sure where you think anyone's talking about CWL in this context! Coyoteguy - so