AirT85 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1041 times:
If Boeing does indeed close down the Boeing 717-200 line, will we see AirTran shopping around at airplanes like the Embraer 170/190 family or moving on up into the 737-700 family? I wouldnt mind seeing the Embraer 190s flying around but i sure will miss those 717s.
I doubt AirTran would buy the CRJ-900 but you never know....
Flying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4137 posts, RR: 38 Reply 1, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 992 times:
If Boeing shuts down - what I think they will do - AirTran will get all 30 ex-TWA/AA B717-200. I think it is unlikely that MidWest will want them, they want 20 firm and 30 optional aircraft, the maximum Boeing could provide (given the case that Boeing does not want to fullfil to MidWest order with new planes) is 30 ex-AA B712.
For AirTran I think it is unlikely that they will retire the B712. More likely that they will try to get as many frames as possible, either from Bavaria Leasing and Pembroke or out of current orders. Only when they will need additional capactiy which can´t be provided with more B712s aquired elswhere they will look on other planes.
Ndebele From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 2897 posts, RR: 24 Reply 2, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 979 times:
It was just the same when Fokker went out of business, with only ~30 Fokker 70 built, but many orders for that type. Airlines like Alitalia or Silkair, who had only few aircraft delivered, sold those few aircraft to airlines like KLM or Malev, enabling them to operate as many F70 as they planned to buy. If every airline had kept their 2 or 3 F70's, that wouldn't have been economical sensible, and I'm sure KLM payed good money for those rare aircraft.
But as for the 717: Boeing would be stupid to drop the 717 as long as there are still orders. But on the other hand, we have already seen how stupid and childish Boeing can act when they dropped the MD-11 with the magic number of (I think) 200 MD-11s produced. Of course, there were not *many* more possible orders, but I remember e.g. LH Cargo wanted some more. How stupid, just to make sure the 777 does not have a rival.
Do they really expect Airtran to buy the 736, just because there are no more 717s???
Flying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4137 posts, RR: 38 Reply 4, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 935 times:
I thought the decision to cut down the prodution rate of the B712 was announced when Boeing stated that they would cut production by half for all models, from 48 per month to 24?!? To my best knowledge the decision about the B717´s future is only due earliest by next week?
Flying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4137 posts, RR: 38 Reply 6, posted (11 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 924 times:
An article at aeroworldnet states that the production of the B717-200 has been scaled down but no decision about the projects future has been made to date. Here it is (I know to which WSJ article you refer; could you please give a link to the USAtoday article, I haven´t found it):
Future of Boeing's 717 Jetliner Remains Unknown
Knight Ridder/Tribune - December 8, 2001
Dec. 7--LONG BEACH, Calif.--Aviation analysts say it's a done deal. Union engineers fear the final airframe rivets will soon be driven. Jittery white- and blue-collar workers privately fear their jobs are history, yet hope for the best.
But until top executives with Boeing Co. finish a review of the Boeing 717 program and officially say so -- and the decision could come as early as next week -- the beleaguered Boeing 717 passenger jetliner is still alive.
Meanwhile, scaled-down production schedules are being drawn up and put into place at the Boeing 717 plant in Long Beach, the largest employer in the city, so that the plane's production speed matches the smaller number of orders for the jetliner.
It means dispersing factory assembly workers more efficiently and slowing down the production line rate. Already what was once a virtual around-the-clock schedule of three working shifts has been reduced to one primary work shift.
The smaller than anticipated market for the 106-seat, midrange jetliners -- some analysts say it's a virtually nonexistent market -- coupled with hard economic times and the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks are what have put the 717 on the brink of extinction.
All this comes as union representatives and workers fight to keep the 717 production alive, staging an old-fashioned pep rally at the Long Beach Boeing plant to boost sagging spirits and tell Boeing executives to do the right thing.
On Thursday, about 150 Boeing workers rallied around the argument that there is a market for the plane, that it's a dependable plane -- beloved by passengers, pilots and airline companies -- but that Boeing is saving money by shifting production of similar midrange jetliners to production facilities in Russia.
It is the last passenger plane built in the state.
Boeing said the 717 is not being stopped to develop a similar plane in Russia. Also it said jobs are not being exported from Long Beach to Russia. And it said a contract between the company and that country was not signed in June.
"It has nothing to do with the Russian venture," Boeing spokesman John Thom said. "It will be based on program economics and our assessment of the marketplace."
In Long Beach, Thom and Jim Phillips, vice president & general manager of the Boeing 717 program, earlier this week said an announcement would come within two weeks.
Phillips has been in Seattle the last two weeks as the 717 program and the fate of its 4,500 workers are reviewed. The focus has been on determining whether or when airlines can get back into financial health and begin ordering airplanes.
In October, Boeing executives said a decision on the money-losing line would be made before the end of this year, and with Boeing shuttering all its plants and offices for the holidays beginning Dec. 21 and continuing through Jan. 2, tensions are rising because an announcement is imminent.
Eyes will focus on Chicago on Monday as the Boeing Co. board of directors convenes.
One analyst, though, said there's nothing left to study. The fate of the 717 was decided by the marketplace long ago.
"It's a superb plane, but it's completely not what the market wants," said Richard Aboulafia, director of aviation consulting for The Teal Group in Fairfax, Va.
Smaller regional airlines that likely would be the buyers for the plane simply cannot afford the $35 million price tag.
"I just can't imagine it surviving," Aboulafia said.